* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.
          [00:00:05]
          GOOD AFTERNOON. 
          THIS IS JEREMY MCDONALD, DEVELOPMENT SERVICES DEPARTMENT, CITY OF SAN ANTONIO. 
          THANK YOU FOR JOINING US TODAY. 
          THIS WILL BE OUR FIRST MEETING OF THE MAN MECHANICAL CODE COMMITTEE, UH, STARTING OF THE ADOPTION OF THE 2021 I CODES FOR THE CITY OF SAN ANTONIO. 
          MY CLICKER ON, ARE WE, UH, TO START OFF WITH, WE'LL, UH, DO THE INTERPRETATION VIDEO REAL FAST FOR ANYBODY ONLINE OR IN IN PERSON THAT NEEDS A SPANISH INTERPRETER, ANTONIO. 
          THANK YOU. 
          OKAY. 
          GOOD. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          [
Roll Call
 ]
UH, SO NEXT WE'LL DO A ROLL CALL FOR THE COMMITTEE. 
          GREG MCFARLAND. 
          PRESENT. 
          SCOTT BERGER. 
          PRESENT. 
          MICHAEL RUST PRESENT. 
          RON CESE PRESENT. 
          JOHN MARTIN. 
          WE HAVE FOUR OF THE FOUR PRIMARIES. 
          WE HAVE A QUORUM FOR THE COMMITTEE MEETING. 
          UH, DO 
          [
Public Comments
 ]
WE HAVE ANY OPEN PUBLIC COMMENTS? I KNOW NOBODY SIGNED IN FOR THAT, BUT WE HAVE A SMALL GROUP HERE. 
          SO AT THIS POINT, DOES ANYBODY HAVE ANYTHING THEY'D LIKE TO SAY TO THE COMMITTEE? OKAY. 
          NO OPEN COMMENTS. 
          UH, WHAT I THINK, YOU KNOW, I'LL LEAVE IT UP ONCE Y'ALL DO CREATE A CHAIR, UH, WHICH IS ITEM NUMBER ONE. 
          UH, IF THERE IS ANY OPEN COMMENTS FOR SPECIFIC ITEMS, YOU KNOW, I'LL LEAVE IT UP TO THE CHAIR ON HOW THEY WANNA ADDRESS THAT IF THEY WANNA WAIT TILL THE END AS WE'RE DISCUSSING. 
          UH, SO THAT'D BE UP TO THE, THE BOARD AND THE COMMITTEE AS A WHOLE. 
          OKAY. 
          UH, SO AGENDA 
          [
Briefing and Possible Action on the following items
 ]
ITEM NUMBER ONE FOR TODAY IS FOR THE COMMITTEE TO VOTE TO APPOINT A COMMITTEE CHAIR AND CO-CHAIR. 
          I'D LIKE TO NOMINATE MR. RUSK FOR CHAIRMAN. 
          SECOND. 
          OKAY. 
          WELL, UH, IT LOOKS LIKE WE HAVE AN A, A NOMINATION AND A SECOND. 
          UH, ALL IN FAVOR? AYE. 
          OKAY. 
          AND IF YOU , IF YOU WANNA TAKE OVER FOR THE CO-CHAIR, SIR. 
          UM, ANY VOLUNTEERS FOR THE CO-CHAIR? THANKS, RON. 
          NOMINATE OUR I'D ASK FOR A MOTION TO MAKE RON THE CO-CHAIR. 
          I'LL SECOND BY ACCLAMATION. 
          HE'S THE CO-CHAIR. 
          OKAY, PERFECT. 
          ALL RIGHT, SO THAT GETS US THROUGH AGENDA ITEM NUMBER ONE, UH, WHICH MOVES US INTO, UH, THE HEART OF WHAT WE'RE HERE TO DO TODAY. 
          I'LL TURN IT OVER TO OUR ASSISTANT DIRECTOR OF CRYSTAL GONZALEZ TO, UH, DISCUSS THE 2021 AND NATIONAL MECHANICAL CODES AND PROPOSED CHANGES TO THE CURRENT AMENDMENTS, UH, FOR FINAL ADOPTION OF THE CODE. 
          THANK YOU. 
          GOOD AFTERNOON. 
          UM, AS JEREMY MENTIONED, I'M CRYSTAL GONZALEZ, ASSISTANT DIRECTOR OF OUR PLAN REVIEW DIVISION. 
          AND I WILL BE, UH, LEADING, UM, LEADING THE CHARGE ON GOING THROUGH THE SIGNIFICANT CHANGES THAT STAFF IDENTIFIED OUR CURRENT AMENDMENTS, UM, AND ANY POTENTIAL AMENDMENTS OR, UM, ACTION TO REMOVE AMENDMENTS. 
          UH, THIS IS JASMINE WELLING. 
          SHE'LL BE HELPING ME, UM, NAVIGATE THROUGH THE CHANGES AND OUR CHAPTER 10. 
          UM, AND THEN ANY, UH, ANY RESOURCES WE NEED TO BRING UP TO REVIEW, UH, WE CAN DO THAT ON THE SCREEN. 
          SO YOU GUYS SHOULD HAVE CRYSTAL, CAN I JUST ASK YOU JUST TO CLARIFY REAL FAST. 
          SO WHERE IT SAYS, UH, CSA AMENDMENT, THAT'S JUST A AMENDMENT FROM THE PRIOR CYCLE THAT'S IN CHAPTER 10 NOW, AND THEN WHERE IT SAYS ADOPT AS WRITTEN, THOSE ARE CHANGES THAT WERE WRITTEN INTO THE, TO THE, THIS VERSION OF THE I CODE THAT WE'LL BE REVIEWING. 
          ARE ALL OF THE CHANGES IN THE I CODE IN THIS SPREADSHEET OR JUST HIGHLIGHTED ONES? GREAT QUESTION. 
          MY, NOT ALL OF THE CHANGES ARE IDENTIFIED IN HERE. 
          WE CONSIDERED SIGNIFICANT CHANGES, UH, ANY CHANGE THAT WOULD IMPACT REVIEW, INSPECTION, DESIGN, OR CONSTRUCTION. 
          SO WE TOOK TIME AS STAFF, UH, WITH PLAN REVIEW AND INSPECTIONS TO IDENTIFY WHAT WE THOUGHT WERE THOSE SIGNIFICANT CODE CHANGES. 
          UM, ACROSS ALL OF THE CODES, WE HAVE NOTICED THAT, UH, THERE WERE A LOT OF EDITORIAL CHANGES. 
          SO IF THERE WAS A LIST IN, UM, IN THE SECTION SEPARATED BY COMMAS, THEY MOVED THAT LIST TO LIKE A 1, 2, 3 LIST. 
          SO WE DID NOT IDENTIFY THAT AS A CHANGE. 
          UM, EVEN THOUGH THE CODE WOULD, UH, DID HIGHLIGHT IT AS A CHANGE, WE DIDN'T CONSIDER 
          [00:05:01]
THAT A CHANGE THAT WE WOULD WANNA BRING FORWARD TO YOU GUYS. 
          UM, BUT OBVIOUSLY IF THERE ARE ANY CHANGES, UM, OUTSIDE OF THIS LIST THAT WE WANNA DISCUSS, UH, WE'LL DEFINITELY DO THAT. 
          UM, WE'LL ALSO DISCUSS, UM, ENERGY, UH, REQUIREMENTS. 
          UH, WE'LL PROBABLY DO THAT AT THE NEXT MEETING. 
          AND THEN, UM, OUR, UH, LICENSING REQUIREMENTS, SO THOSE OTHER ITEMS THAT ARE, UH, IN CHAPTER 10. 
          SO AS YOU IDENTIFIED MIKE, YES, THOSE ARE CURRENT, UM, AMENDMENTS THAT WE HAVE IN CHAPTER 10. 
          UH, AND WE CAN BRING THOSE UP. 
          UH, WE CAN TOGGLE, UH, TO CHAPTER 10 TO SHOW YOU WHERE THOSE ARE STARTING ON PAGE 95. 
          AND REALLY, UM, OUR, OUR GOAL IS TO, UM, REDUCE OUR AMENDMENTS, REALLY, THAT THAT'S WHAT WE ARE LOOKING TO DO, UM, BY ADOPTING, UM, THE STRAIGHT CODE. 
          THAT DOESN'T ALWAYS SENSE. 
          UM, BUT WE ARE, THAT'S OUR MAIN GOAL IS TO REDUCE AMENDMENTS, UM, AND ALSO LOOK AT, AT THE 2021 CHANGES HOW THEY IMPACT THE COST OF CONSTRUCTION. 
          IS THERE ANY WAY THAT WE COULD HELP, UH, REDUCE COST OF CONSTRUCTION TO MAKE CONSTRUCTION MORE AFFORDABLE? UM, AND THAT'S REALLY, YEAH, THAT'S REALLY WHAT WE'RE LOOKING TO DO IN THIS PROCESS. 
          SO AGAIN, UM, WE WANT TO MAKE SURE ON THESE ITEMS THAT WE'VE IDENTIFIED AS SIGNIFICANT CHANGES, IF YOU GUYS, UM, ARE GOOD WITH MOVING FORWARD WITH THE RECOMMENDATION, WHICH STAFF HAS IDENTIFIED AS KEEP THE AMENDMENT, UM, REVISE OUR AMENDMENT, UH, OR ADOPT AS WRITTEN, ARE MOST OF THE, UM, MOST OF THE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT WE'VE FOLLOWED. 
          SO THROUGH THE COMMITTEE, IF WE JUST, WHEN WE GO LINE BY LINE, IF YOU HAVE SOMETHING THAT YOU WANT TO CHANGE, IF YOU'RE, YOU KNOW, IF YOU'RE OKAY WITH IT, WE'LL JUST MOVE ON. 
          BUT I DON'T WANNA DO 'EM ALL AT THE END. 
          IF WE JUST DO ONE LINE BY ONE LINE AND KIND OF GO FROM THAT, IF THAT WORKS. 
          AND TWO VISITORS IN THE CROWD. 
          IF, I MEAN, I WANT THIS TO BE AN OPEN FORUM, SO JUST PIPE UP OR INDICATE THAT YOU WANT TO HAVE A COMMENT ABOUT SOMETHING SO WE CAN GIVE YOU A CHANCE TO SPEAK. 
          THIS IS, UH, JEREMY. 
          SORRY, JEREMY MCDONALD DEVELOPMENT SERVICE. 
          IF WE DO HAVE ANYBODY COME UP, THE ONLY THING, UH, WE DO WANNA MAKE SURE THEY COME TO THE DAAS, UH, NAME AND ADDRESS IS ALL WE ASK FOR FOR THAT. 
          THANK YOU. 
          OKAY. 
          SO THE FIRST ITEM WAS A COAST AMENDMENT, AND, AND THIS AMENDMENT WE JUST DEFINE, UM, WHAT N F P A 70 IS. 
          SO THE NATIONAL ELECTRICAL CODE. 
          MIKE, DO YOU WANT TO, ARE WE, ARE WE GONNA DISCUSS THAT? YES, WE'RE GOOD WITH IT, OR, WELL, I DON'T WANNA OVER BUREAUCRATIZE IT. 
          I'LL JUST, I DON'T THINK WE'RE GONNA DO A MOTION EVERY TIME, JUST KIND OF A NOD, LIKE, THAT'S FINE, OR WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT IT. 
          DOES THAT SEEM REASONABLE? YEAH, I THINK THAT'S GOOD. 
          AND THEN AT THE END, YOU WOULD MAKE THE MOTION TO YEAH, AS LONG AS YOU, AS LONG AS AT THE END, WE COLLECTIVELY GET A MOTION FOR EVERYTHING THAT WAS AGREED UPON. 
          SO THE SECOND, SECOND ITEM IS THE COSA AMENDMENT THAT SPECIFIES THAT ALL WIRING EXPOSED TO WEATHER SHALL BE INSTALLED IN A RACEWAY APPROVED FOR THE ENVIRONMENT. 
          AGAIN, THESE ARE IN OUR MECHANICAL SECTION OF THE CODE. 
          UH, BUT JUST AS A, AS AN AWARENESS, WE'VE INCLUDED THESE ITEMS, UM, IN THIS SECTION, EVEN THOUGH THEY'RE NOT SPECIFICALLY MECHANICAL ITEMS, DO WE NOT FEEL THAT THAT THE REFERENCE N F P A 70 ADDRESSES THAT APPROPRIATELY? I, I WOULDN'T DISAGREE WITH THAT. 
          THE, THE OTHER THING I'M CONCERNED WITH IS IT LISTS 3 0 1 0.1, AND THAT'S UNDER SCOPE. 
          SO IF WE HAD THE SECTION CORRECT, IT WOULD LOOK LIKE IT WOULD NEED TO BE 3 0 1 POINT 10. 
          BUT I WOULD AGREE THAT SIMPLE FACT THAT IT REFERS TO, TO N F P A 70, THAT THAT WOULD BE SUFFICIENT. 
          THAT IS, UH, AN EXCEL ERROR IN OUR AMENDMENTS. 
          ACTUALLY, IT DOES REFERENCE 3 0 1 POINT 10, SO GOOD, GOOD POINT. 
          SO THAT ENTIRE SECTION, UH, IN, IN M THE MECHANICAL CODE 3 0 1 10 REFERENCES, ELECTRICAL WIRING CONTROLS AND CONNECTIONS TO EQUIPMENT AND APPLIANCES REGULATED BY THIS CODE SHALL BE IN ACCORDANCE WITH N F P A 70. 
          SO, SO THE FIRST AMENDMENT THAT WE REFERENCED HERE JUST DEFINES NFPA A 70. 
          IS THERE ALREADY A A, UH, BESIDES DEFINING IT, IS IT JUST SAY THAT WE WERE GONNA REFERENCE THAT. 
          IS THERE, IS THERE A CONNECTION THERE? I MEAN, I'M ASSUMING WE DID TWO AMENDMENTS IN THE PAST FOR A REASON, AND THAT'S NOT A REASON TO KEEP BOTH AMENDMENTS. 
          I JUST, I WONDER IF, IF, UH, IF IT'S STILL NECESSARY. 
          YEAH, I, I APPRECIATE THE FIRST ONE BE SINCE, 
          [00:10:01]
UH, THE I M C DOES REFERENCE N F P A 70, BUT DOES NOT PROVIDE A DEFINITION FOR 70. 
          BUT THAT'S A GOOD AND RIGHT THING TO DO. 
          BUT WHEN YOU START ADDING ADDITIONAL CLARIFICATION TO WHAT 70 DOES AT THIS STAGE, AT AT 3 0 1 POINT 10, I'M A, WHAT MY CONCERN WOULD BE IS IT OPENS THE DOOR FOR ADDITIONAL INTERPRETATION THAT'S NOT NECESSARY REFERENCING THE, THE DOCUMENT, THE APPROPRIATE DOCUMENT. 
          AND THEN F P A SEVENTIES TO ME IS, IS SUFFICIENT LANGUAGE. 
          SO I WAS ACTUALLY BACK TO, TO THE FIRST AMENDMENT. 
          IF YOU GO TO, UH, SECTION, UH, THE I M C 15 DASH 10, IT DOES HAVE N F P A AS A REFERENCED, UH, STANDARD, AND IT DEFINES N F P A 70 IN THERE AS NATIONAL ELECTRIC CODE. 
          AND, AND THEN IT HAS REFERENCES TO WHERE IT'S REFERRED TO IN THE CODE. 
          SO IT'S, I THINK THAT'S ALREADY IN THERE TOO, TO, THIS IS, UH, JOE FRI, I'M THE CHIEF MECHANICAL. 
          UM, THE, THE REASON THAT IS ON THE, THE, THE REASON THAT PART'S IN THERE WE'RE, WE'RE JUST TALKING ABOUT THE CONTROL WIRE, WHICH IS THE 24 VOLTS. 
          AND I'M NOT SURE ON THE N F B A IT ACTUALLY READS OR STATES, YOU KNOW, THAT TYPE OF WIRING. 
          SO I THINK THAT'S THE REASON WHY THAT IS IN THERE. 
          JUST TO KINDA, UH, CLARIFY, YOU KNOW, 'CAUSE SOME OF THE ME MECHANICAL CONTRACTORS DON'T HAVE A AN N F P A AND SO THAT WE JUST PUT THAT THERE TO KIND OF CLARIFY THAT WHY WE, WHY THE INTENT IS, IS TO PUT THE 24 VOLTS, YOU KNOW, IN CONDUIT ON SEAL TYPE JUST TO PROTECT THE WIRING FROM THE WEATHER. 
          AND THAT'S THE REASON WHY THAT AMENDMENT TWO IS THERE. 
          YEAH, I THINK ONE OF THE THINGS WE NEED TO BE CAUTIOUS OF IS, YOU KNOW, IN REAL LIFE APPLICATION, IF WE'RE RUNNING INTO ISSUES OUT IN THE FIELD THAT THE CITY HAS IDENTIFIED AS POTENTIAL CONCERNS, THEN WE NEED TO BE SENSITIVE TO THOSE CONCERNS AS WELL. 
          KEEP IT IN THERE. 
          IS THAT WHAT YOU WERE RECOMMENDING? YEAH, SIMPLY CORRECT. 
          THE REFERENCE TO DOT 10 AS, AS WE'VE ALREADY SEEN WAS DONE AND, AND RETAINED THE LANGUAGE. 
          OKAY. 
          THE NEXT ITEM, UH, 3 0 4 POINT 11 FOR GUARDS. 
          SO THIS SECTION, THE, THE SUMMARY OF THE CHANGES, UM, THE GUARDS ARE NOW REQUIRED FOR AROUND ROOF HATCHES. 
          THEY WERE PREVIOUSLY REQUIRED WITH, FOR EQUIPMENT WITHIN, UH, 10 FEET OF THE ROOF'S EDGE. 
          AND NOW WE'VE ADDED, OR THE I M C HAS ADDED THE REQUIREMENT, UM, TO HAVE GUARDS IF A ROOF HATCH IS WITHIN 10 FEET OF THE ROOF EDGE. 
          WE FELT THIS WAS A LIFE SAFETY ISSUE. 
          IT COULD INCR INCREASE THE COST OF CONSTRUCTION BECAUSE THE CODE DIDN'T PREVIOUSLY IDENTIFY THE REQUIREMENT FOR GUARDS IN THIS LOCATION. 
          UH, BUT BEING IT WAS A LIFE SAFETY ISSUE, WE PROPOSE ADOPT IS WRITTEN. 
          SO IS THIS WRITTEN HOW THE AMENDMENT WOULD BE INSERTED INTO CHAPTER 10? SO THIS ONE IS NOT CURRENTLY AN AMENDMENT AND WE WOULD JUST PROPOSE TO ADOPT THE CHANGE IN THE 2021. 
          ARE WE GONNA INTERPRET THAT WORD GUARD TO INCLUDE PARAPET WALLS? SO IF WE HAVE A PARAPET WALL THAT'S 30 INCHES TALL, THAT IT WOULD BE IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE GUARDING? YEAH, THAT, THAT'S PRETTY MUCH ALL WE'RE DOING IS WHAT WE'RE, BASICALLY, THE REASON WE BROUGHT THIS UP IS BECAUSE WE WANNA ADOPT IT AS IT IS WRITTEN. 
          IN OTHER WORDS, WE'RE GONNA ADOPT THE I M C. 
          WE DON'T WANT TO MAKE ANY AMENDMENTS TO THE WAY IT IS WRITTEN. 
          SO THE ONLY DIFFERENCE, THE ONLY CHANGE WAS THAT THEY ADDED ROOF HATCHES. 
          UM, THERE IS A, THERE IS A SECTION FOR PARAPET, UH, WALLS IN THERE ALSO THAT THAT DIDN'T CHANGE. 
          IT'S JUST THAT THEY'RE ADDING THE ROOF HATCHES TO IT. 
          SO WE'RE JUST GONNA KEEP IT THE SAME. 
          SO WE, WE, WE DON'T WANNA MAKE ANY CHANGES TO IT. 
          SO, SORRY, GREG, IF THE PARAPET IS 42 INCHES OR GREATER THAN IT WOULD QUALIFY AS THE GUARD. 
          OKAY. 
          SO WE'VE GOT A BIT OF A DISCONNECT WHERE A, IF WE HAVE A FLAT ROOF WITH, NO, I'LL SAY, YOU KNOW, A SIX INCH PARAPET WALL, OR IT'S JUST A FLAT ROOF THAT GOES OVER THE EDGE, THEY CAN INSTALL A GUARD THAT'S 30 INCHES TALL. 
          BUT IF THEY HAVE TO HAVE A PART OF THE STRUCTURE OF THE BUILDING, I E THE PARAPET WALL, THAT HAS TO BE 40, BE 42. 
          SO WE'VE GOT A BIT OF A INTERESTING THING THERE. 
          COULD, COULD, WELL YOU COULD HAVE A GUARD THAT'S, THAT'S 30 INCHES TALL AND AND THE TOP 
          [00:15:01]
OF WHERE A PERSON WOULD, WOULD GO OVER THE TOP OF IT, IT'S 30 INCHES. 
          BUT IF WE HAVE A PARAPET WALL THAT'S 42, YOU JUST, THE GUARD SHALL EXTEND ON EACH SIDE OF THE ROOF. 
          I, I DON'T THINK THAT'S AN ELEVATION. 
          SORRY. 
          MY APOLOGIES. 
          OKAY. 
          ARE WE GOOD? UH, ADOPT IS WRITTEN ON THAT ONE. 
          HEAD NODS. 
          UH, THE NEXT, THE NEXT ONE, DO WE NEED TO RECORD HEAD NODS OR IS THAT WE OKAY. 
          I THINK JOSEPH MENTIONED IF WE HAVE A COLLECTIVE, UH, MOTION AT THE END. 
          OKAY. 
          THE NEXT ITEM IS, UH, CURRENT COSA AMENDMENT 3 0 4 POINT 13 INSTALLATION AT GAS VALVES. 
          SO CURRENTLY THE AMENDMENT, UM, STATES THAT MINIMUM SCHEDULE 40 METALLIC PIPE SHALL BE INSTALLED AT GAS VALVE AND EXTENDED A MINIMUM OF TWO INCHES OUTSIDE THE GAS FURNACE AND GAS ROOFTOP UNITS CASING AND MAY BE CONNECTED TO AN APPROVED LISTING FLEXIBLE GAS CONNECTOR. 
          JOE, YOU WANNA EXPAND ON THIS AMENDMENT? YES. 
          UM, THIS HAS BEEN, THIS HAS BEEN IN THE, IN IN AMENDED SINCE I THINK IT WAS 2003, I'M NOT SURE. 
          SOME SOMEWHERE AROUND THERE. 
          BUT BASICALLY WHAT IT IS, IS, YOU KNOW, YOU COME OUT OF THE, THE FURNACE CASING WITH HARD PIPE. 
          AND THE REASON FOR THAT IS 'CAUSE WE DON'T WANT THE FLAGS TO BE RUBBING UP AGAINST THE CASING ON THE, AND CREATE A GAS LEAK. 
          SO THAT WAS THE REASON WHY IT WAS THERE IN THE FIRST PLACE. 
          ALSO, WITH THE NEW, UH, WELL WITH THE MOST OF THE MANUFACTURER'S INSTALLATIONS, HE'S ASKING YOU TO PUT A SEDIMENT TRAP AND MOST OF 'EM IS RIGHT OUTSIDE THE CASING. 
          SO THIS KIND OF COINCIDES WITH THAT ALSO. 
          OKAY. 
          WE'LL LEAVE THAT AND, UH, PROPOSE TO LEAVE THAT AMENDMENT IN THERE. 
          THE NEXT ONE IS ALSO, HANG, HANG ON A QUICK SECOND. 
          GO AHEAD. 
          I'M STRUGGLING TO FIND 3 0 4 POINT 13 IN THE, IN THE I M C. 
          SO IT IS ADDED, UM, WE ADDED THAT SECTION, UH, IN THE AMENDMENT. 
          SO WE JUST LABELED IT THE NEXT NUMBER. 
          SORRY, MY MISTAKE. 
          NO, THAT'S GOOD. 
          SO THE NEXT ONE IS A COASTA AMENDMENT 3 0 6 0.3 0.2. 
          SO THIS ONE WE ARE PROPOSE, IT'S A CURRENT AMENDMENT WE'RE PROPOSING TO MODIFY THE LANGUAGE SLIGHTLY. 
          LET ME READ YOU WHERE WE CAN, UH, LOOK AT WHAT IT SAYS TOGETHER. 
          FOR ACCESS, ACCESS FOR COOLING OR HEATING APPLIANCE, CURRENTLY IT SAYS FOR NEW ONE AND TWO FAMILY RESIDENTIAL OCCUPANCIES AND TOWN HOMES, THE ATTIC SPACE IN WHICH ANY COOLING OR HEATING APPLIANCES INSTALLED SHALL BE PROVIDED WITH A PERMANENT LADDER OR FOLD AWAY LADDER OR DIRECT ACCESS. 
          SO ANY NEW, UH, RESIDENTIAL OR TOWN HOMES BUILT HAVE TO HAVE A PERMANENT PULL DOWN LADDER ACCESS TO THE ATTIC SPACE IF THERE'S EQUIPMENT THERE. 
          SO WE ARE PROPOSING TO CHANGE THAT AMENDMENT TO READ NOT JUST FOR NEW, UH, NEW SINGLE FAMILY DWELLINGS AND TOWN HOMES, BUT EVEN EXISTING SINGLE FAMILY DWELLINGS THAT HAVE NOW ADDED, UH, EQUIPMENT IN THE ATTIC SO HAVE NOT BEEN PREVIOUSLY CONDITIONED OR PREVIOUSLY COOLED, AND NOW THEY'RE ADDING NEW EQUIPMENT IN THE ATTIC. 
          THEN THEY SHOULD HAVE THAT PULL DOWN LADDER. 
          YEAH, I THINK THAT'S ACCEPTABLE FOR NEW, I WOULD NOT AGREE WITH THAT. 
          IF IT'S REPLACEMENT OF EXISTING, CORRECT? YES, THAT'S CORRECT. 
          I'M SORRY. 
          THIS IS, UH, INSPECTOR FOREZ AGAIN. 
          UM, OKAY. 
          SO THE WAY, THE WAY WE'VE, THE INTENT WHEN THAT WAS PUT IN IT WAS TO INCLUDE EXISTING HOMES THAT NEVER HAD AC. 
          SO THEY HAVE TO, IF THEY'RE GONNA PUT IT IN THE ATTIC, THEY'RE GONNA HAVE TO CUT AN OPENING TO PUT THE UNIT IN THERE IN THE FIRST PLACE. 
          SO THAT WAS THE INTENT. 
          BUT THE WAY IT'S WORDED, IT DOESN'T REALLY INCLUDE EXISTING BUILDING OR EXISTING RESIDENTIAL HOMES THAT NEVER HAD AC SO, YOU KNOW, WE, WE STILL ENFORCE IT TO WHERE IF IT'S A NEW SYSTEM ON A, ON A HOUSE THAT NEVER HAD IT, THEN WE, WE, WE WOULD, UH, INCLUDE, WE WOULD ENFORCE THAT. 
          BUT IT, IT IS JUST, IT WASN'T WRITTEN PROPERLY. 
          SO THAT'S WHY WE PUT NEWLY IT, IF IT'S A REPLACEMENT, THAT'S, THAT DOES NOT APPLY. 
          SO THIS IS THE EXACT LANGUAGE THAT WE'RE PROPOSING WHERE IT SPECIFICALLY SAYS NEWLY INSTALLED COOLING OR HEATING APPLIANCES. 
          I THINK WE MAY WANNA WORD THAT EVER SO SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT TO ME IF WE'RE PUTTING IN A NEW FURNACE OR BLOWER COIL 
          [00:20:01]
AS OPPOSED TO A GAS FURNACE THAT SOMEBODY'S ADDING COOLING TO. 
          I MEAN, THEY'VE ALREADY GOT A, GOT SOME SORT OF MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT IN THAT SPACE. 
          SO IF THEY'RE JUST ADDING A, A, A COIL ONTO THE END OF AN EXISTING FURNACE, I DON'T KNOW IF WE WANT TO FORCE THAT STRUCTURAL ADAPTATION TO GET FOR, TO GET UP THERE. 
          YEAH, I MEAN I WOULD, I WOULD SUGGEST THAT MAYBE, YOU KNOW, THE WAY IT WAS WORDED BEFORE IS, IS SUFFICIENT. 
          YOU KNOW, IF, IF YOU'RE GONNA ADD EQUIPMENT INTO THE ATTIC, UM, AND RIGHT NOW YOU HAVE A TWO BY TWO, YOU KNOW, CUBBY HOLE KIND OF THING THAT YOU PUSH OUTTA THE WAY THE ROOF STRUCTURE MIGHT NOT ALLOW, OR THE LAYOUT OF THE HOME MIGHT NOT ALLOW YOU TO HAVE THE FULL, YOU KNOW, BIG LONG THING WHERE YOU CAN FOLD THE LADDER OUT. 
          AND I'D HATE THAT TO PREVENT SOMEBODY FROM, YOU KNOW, INSTALLING THE EQUIPMENT UP THERE. 
          YEAH. 
          THAT COULD STOP THE AIR CONDITIONING OF A HOUSE IF THEY'VE SUDDENLY GOTTA RE-CUT TRUSSES AND, AND GET THAT UP IN THERE. 
          SO IT'S RIGHT. 
          I I I MAYBE IF WE SAID THAT OF NEW AIR MOVEMENT EQUIPMENT TO HANDLE HEATING AND COOLING, I MEAN A WATER HEATER KIND OF WOULD BE A DIFFERENT, MAYBE A DIFFERENT ANIMAL ON THAT TOGETHER. 
          YEAH, I GUESS WHAT I'M SAYING IS IF THE, YOU KNOW, IF YOU HAVE A THREE BEDROOM HOME THAT, UM, IS ON WINDOW UNITS AND YOU WANT TO INSTALL A CENTRAL SYSTEM THAT'S PROBABLY MORE EFFICIENT THAN THAT, UM, THIS MIGHT STOP YOU FROM BEING ABLE TO DO THAT. 
          'CAUSE YOU'RE NOT GONNA BE ABLE TO REDESIGN THE, THE ROOF OR THE LAYOUT OF THE HOME TO, TO GET IT DONE. 
          UM, MAYBE I'M JUST THINKING OUT LOUD HERE, BUT THAT, THAT'S WHAT COMES TO MY MIND. 
          YEAH, I TEND, I TEND TO AGREE WITH YOU ON THAT ONE. 
          SO YOU GUYS PROPOSED FOR BRAND NEW CON, NEWLY CONSTRUCTED ONE AND TWO FAMILY DWELLINGS? I, I THINK SO. 
          THAT'S WHERE I'M LEANING IN UNLESS THERE'S DISAGREEMENT. 
          I, I'M SORRY, BUT MAYBE IF, IF YOU DON'T, IF IF NEW CONSTRUCTION, I MEAN NEW EXISTING HOMES, THIS SHOULD NOT APPLY TO IT. 
          MAYBE WE CAN WORD IT A LITTLE DIFFERENT TO ALSO INCLUDE RENOVATIONS OR ADDITIONS. 
          'CAUSE SOMETIMES IT'S AN EXISTING HOME AND THEY ADD A MASTER BEDROOM AND THEY END UP PUTTING A AC UNIT IN THERE. 
          SO IT'S NOT NECESSARILY, UH, A NEW RESIDENTIAL, IT'S JUST AN ADDITION OR AN, YOU KNOW, TO, TO THE HOME OR, YOU KNOW, WOULD THAT APPLY ALSO? I MEAN, I, I WOULD THINK SO. 
          YEAH. 
          I'D AGREE WITH YOU. 
          IF, IF, IF THE AIR CONDITIONER IS GOING IN THE NEW ADDITION, UH, ABSOLUTELY. 
          I THINK THAT THAT WOULD PROBABLY FALL UNDER PROVIDING THE ADDITIONAL ACCESS IF IT'S, UM, DO WE DEFINE REMODEL? I MEAN, I HISTORICALLY, I'VE ALWAYS USED 50% OF THE VALUE OF THE HOME TO, TO, YOU KNOW, IF SOMEBODY COMES IN AND GUTS THE ENTIRE LIVING SPACE, PULLS IT DOWN TO STUDS AND, AND THAT, YOU KNOW, IF WE HIT THAT 50% MARK, THEN I COULD SAY, YEAH, THAT WOULD'VE TO COME UP AND, AND BE INCLUDED OR IF THERE'S A NEW EDITION. 
          BUT YEAH, I, I MEAN I WOULD TEND TO AGREE WITH THAT IF IT, IF IT'S IN THE NEW EDITION, I THINK THAT'S PROBABLY COVERED BY, I MEAN, EVERYTHING IN THE NEW EDITION HAS TO BE UP TO, TO, TO NEW CODE FOR THE MOST PART. 
          BUT I, I DON'T THINK IT WOULD IN THE EXISTING STRUCTURE. 
          'CAUSE AGAIN, THE IDEA THAT I'M COMING UP WITH IS THAT THE LAYOUT OF THE HOME MIGHT NOT SUPPORT THAT LADDER, YOU KNOW, WITHOUT A ADDING A LOT OF COST TO RESTRUCTURE, YOU KNOW, THE, THE JOISTS OR THE, YOU KNOW, THE, JUST THE WAY THE, IT FALLS IN THE HALLWAY OR IF IT'S THE A ACCESS IS IN A BEDROOM, ET CETERA. 
          THIS IS, THIS IS AMIN THOMAS. 
          UH, WE CAN, UH, REWORD THIS AND WE'LL BRING IT BACK NEXT MEETING WITH, I THINK WE GOT KIND OF THE IDEA THAT YOU'RE LOOKING FOR. 
          LET US WORK, LET US WORK ON IT AND WE'LL BRING IT NEXT MEETING. 
          THANKS AMIN. 
          AND ARE YOU GENTLEMEN DOWN THERE? GOOD, GOOD FOR IT? I DON'T WANNA, I DON'T WANNA BULLY THAT ONE THROUGH. 
          NO, I, I AGREE. 
          OKAY. 
          SO OUR NEXT ITEM IS THE CURRENT CSA AMENDMENT 3 0 7 0.2 0.1 FOR CONDENSATE DISPOSAL. 
          SO WE REVISED THIS SECTION TO REFERENCE CHAPTER 34 FOR THE SAULS REQUIREMENTS FOR CONDENSATE DISPOSAL. 
          SO THE CURRENT I M C IDENTIFIES THAT CONDENSATE SHALL DISCHARGE INTO A STREET, AN ALLEY, UH, OR SHALL NOT, UM, EXCUSE ME, SHALL NOT DISCHARGE INTO A STREET ALLEY OR OTHER AREAS. 
          SO WE REQUIRE, OR SAS REQUIRES THAT THE CONDENSATE IS COLLECTED FOR FUTURE POTENTIAL USE. 
          UM, THAT'S WHAT IS IDENTIFIED IN CHAPTER 34. 
          SO WE JUST, UM, WE JUST, UH, REFERENCE THAT SECTION IN, IN THE CODE. 
          IS 
          [00:25:01]
THERE ANYTHING IN, IN CHAPTER 34 THAT TALKS ABOUT ONSITE REUSE FOR IRRIGATION, ANYTHING LIKE THAT? SO THAT, THAT IF A A, A PROPERTY OWNER CHOOSES TO USE CONDENSATE TO IRRIGATE THAT THAT'S COVERED. 
          YES, THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT, WHAT'S COVERED IN CHAPTER 34. 
          EVERYBODY. 
          GOOD. 
          UH, NEXT ITEM IS I M C 3 0 7 0.2. 
          POINT ONE 0.1. 
          SO THIS IS A NEW SUBSECTION TO CONDENSATE CONDENSATE DISPOSAL, UM, ALLOWING CONDENSATE DRAINS TO CONNECT TO A FLOOR SINK, FLOOR DRAIN TRENCHED DRAIN MOP SINK, UM, CONNECTION TO A LABORATORY WIDE BRANCH TAILPIECE OR A BATHTUB OVERFLOW PIPE IS ALLOWED. 
          UM, IT CONTINUES. 
          A DISCHARGE SHALL BE TO GRADE OUTDOORS OR LOCATED WITHIN THE SAME OCCUPANCY. 
          SO THAT WE CONSIDERED A MAJOR CHANGE THAT IT'S NOW REQUIRED TO BE WITHIN THE SAME OCCUPANCY TENANT SPACE OR DWELLING UNIT AS THE CONDENSATE SOURCE. 
          PREVIOUSLY THE CODE JUST SAID TO AN IMPROVED LOCATION. 
          SO THEY'VE EXPANDED ON THAT. 
          JUST A CLARIFICATION IS WHAT IS THE, UH, THE LAUNDRY BOX CONSIDERED IN THIS? I DON'T SEE IT EXPLICITLY CALLED OUT, BUT I KNOW THERE'S A LOT OF, UH, PRIMARY DRAINS THAT GO INTO THE TOP OF A, OF A LAUNDRY CONNECTION. 
          GREAT QUESTION. 
          LET ME READ THE ET CETERA. 
          I ABBREVIATED IN MY SUMMARY. 
          UM, BUT THE CODE SPECIFICALLY SAYS CONDENSATE DRAINS SHALL NOT DISCHARGE INTO A PLUMBING FIXTURE OTHER THAN FLOOR SINK, FLOOR DRAIN TRENCH, DRAIN MOP, SINK HUB, DRAIN STANDPIPE, UTILITY SINK OR LAUNDRY SINK. 
          SO IT IDENTIFIES ALL OF THOSE. 
          SO ARE WE CONSIDERING WHERE THE, THE WASHER BOX IN THE WALL THAT HAS HOT COLD AND A IN ESSENCE A DRAIN, A HUB DRAIN? WELL, OKAY, SO THE PLUMBING SITE, WE HAVE TO KIND OF TAP INTO THE PLUMBING SITE IN HERE. 
          UM, THEY ARE WASHER, WASHER BOXES THAT, THAT ARE DESIGNATED FOR DRAIN OTHER THAN JUST THE WASHER. 
          SO THEY HAVE TWO HOLES AND THAT'S WHERE NORMALLY WHERE THE, WHERE THE, WHERE THE, THE, THE, THE, THE CONDENSATE GOES TO. 
          OR SOMETIMES IT'S EVEN THE, THE, THE WATER HEATER RELIEF VALVE GOES IN THERE. 
          SO IT JUST DEPENDS ON, ON, ON. 
          BUT WE ALWAYS, EVERY TIME THAT HAPPENS, WE ALWAYS ASK THEM IF, IF THEY'RE GONNA DISCHARGE THAT IT HAS TO HAVE TWO OPENINGS, ONE FOR THE, FOR THE CONDENSATE AND ONE FOR THE WASHER. 
          SO AS FAR AS THE DEFINITION, I DON'T THINK IT'S IN THERE UNLESS YOU WANT TO SAY THAT IT'S, UH, UH, Y BRANCH. 
          'CAUSE SOMETIMES THEY DO THAT ALSO. 
          YEAH, THAT'S, I MEAN THAT'S A NORMAL INSTALLATION THAT I'VE SEEN A LOT. 
          AND SO I THINK WE EITHER, DO WE, DO WE WANT TO EXPLICITLY ALLOW THAT TO GO INTO THAT, THAT WALL BOX OR DO WE WANT TO NOT ALLOW IT? I DON'T THINK THE INTENT WAS TO, TO NOT ALLOW IT. 
          AND WOULDN'T THAT BE CONSIDERED A HUB DRAIN? ISN'T THAT, UH, THAT GETS INTO THE, THE, THE DEFINITION OF WHAT HUB DRAIN IS TO ME, A HUB DRAIN HAS ALWAYS BEEN A STANDALONE PIPE WITHOUT HOT AND COLD WATER RIGHT NEXT TO IT. 
          BUT I'M OKAY WITH, WITH THAT BEING CONSIDERED A HUB DRAIN, JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT'S COVERED AND ALLOWED. 
          IS THAT SOMETHING WHERE WE COULD GET A CODE INTERPRETATION PUT IN AS AN AMENDMENT OR JUST TO CLARIFY FOR, OR IS THAT NOT NEEDED HERE? WE'LL GET SOME CLARIFICATION FROM OUR PLUMBING FOLKS TO MAKE SURE THAT, THAT, THAT THEY'RE ON THE SAME PAGE WITH THAT. 
          SO WE'LL JUST MARK THIS ONE TO REVISIT, UM, NEXT TIME. 
          YES. 
          AND SO ANOTHER QUESTION I HAVE IS, UM, YOU KNOW, I DON'T DO NEW CONSTRUCTION. 
          IS, IS IT COMMON OR UNCOMMON FOR MULTI-TENANT DWELL OR MULTI-DWELLING BUILDINGS TO SHARE A, UH, A CONNECTION? SO THIS IS A SIGNIFICANT CHANGE FOR THAT MARKET? YES, YES. 
          TYPICALLY THE WAY THEY DO IT, ESPECIALLY FOR APARTMENTS, IS THAT THEY HAVE A DEDICATED ADRENALINE FOR CONDENSATE AND THEN THEY TIE IN ALL, ALL THE FIRST, SECOND, AND THIRD FLOOR INTO IT. 
          AND THEN THEY DISCHARGE INTO ONE, WHICH EVEN NOW IT'S AN ISSUE BECAUSE IF THE MAIN ADRENALINE GETS CLOGGED UP, IT STARTS BACKING UP ALL THE WAY. 
          AND EVEN THOUGH YOU HAVE SAFETY DEVICES ON THE FIRST FLOOR, THAT WOULD STOP, BUT IT'LL CONTINUE TO OVERFLOW 'CAUSE IT KEEPS ON BUILDING UP, UP TO THE SECOND, THE SECOND STORY. 
          AND THE THIRD STORY UNIT WILL CONTINUE TO WORK AND THE FIRST FLOOR WILL OVERFLOW. 
          SO THIS IS ACTUALLY A GOOD CHANGE. 
           
          [00:30:01]
E EXCEPT FOR THE COST . 
          THANK YOU. 
          WE'RE GONNA REVISIT THIS LINE, UM, TO CLARIFY THE, THE HUB TRAINING ISSUE, CORRECT? YES. 
          WE'LL MAKE THAT NOTE AND WE'LL GET SOME CLARIFICATION FOR NEXT MEETING. 
          OKAY. 
          NEXT ITEM IS A CURRENT COSA AMENDMENT 3 0 7 0.2 0.2 FOR DRAIN PIPE MATERIALS AND SIZES. 
          IT ADDS A REQUIREMENT. 
          WE'VE ADDED THE REQUIREMENT THAT PRIMARY DRAIN LINES LOCATED IN UNCONDITIONED SPACES BE INSULATED WITH FLOW FOAM PLASTIC, RUBBER BASED ON INSULATION OR APPROVED MATERIAL. 
          SO THIS AGAIN, IS JUST, UM, TO REDUCE CONDENSATION. 
          EVERYBODY. 
          GOOD. 
          ALL THE HEAD NODS RECORDED NEXT TO ITEM CURRENT COSA AMENDMENT 3 0 7 0.2 0.4 0.1 FOR DUCTLESS MINI SPLIT SYSTEM TRAPS. 
          SO THIS, UH, CURRENT COSA AMENDMENT REMOVES A REQUIREMENT FOR THE LOW, I'M SORRY, I GOTTA GO BACK ONE. 
          UM, THE DEFINITION OF CONDENSATE IS LIQUID THAT CONDENSES FROM A GAS, INCLUDING FLUE GAS CAUSED BY A REDUCTION IN TEMPERATURE. 
          SO IS OUR INTENT TO INSULATE FURNACE, CONDENSATE COMING OFF OF A FURNACE, A CONDENSING FURNACE? I DON'T THINK THAT'S PROBABLY OUR INTENT. 
          OUR INTENT. 
          WE, WE MAY WANT TO ADD SOMETHING THAT IT'S, UH, CONDENSATE THAT'S BELOW DEW POINT. 
          'CAUSE WE REALLY WANT TO, AND SO I ASSUME WE WERE GOING AFTER AIR CONDITIONER CONDENSATE, NOT, NOT CONDENSATE FROM A FURNACE. 
          SO, UH, THE WAY, THE WAY WE'RE, WE'RE ENFORCING IT RIGHT NOW. 
          IF IT'S A 90% FURNACE AND IT HAS A DRAIN BECAUSE OF, OF A CONDENSATION, WE WE DO, WE DO. 
          OR, UH, LETTING THEM KNOW THAT IT HAS TO BE INSULATED. 
          OKAY. 
          SO IT IS OUR INTENT TO INSULATE THE DRAINS OFF OF CONDENSING FURNACES AND CONDENSING WATER HEATERS LOCATED IN AN, IN AN UNCONDITIONED SPACE. 
          UH, I DON'T KNOW ABOUT WATER HEATERS. 
          , I HAVE A HIGH, HAD A HIGH EFFICIENCY WATER HEATER THAT HAD THAT, THAT SAME TYPE OF DRAIN DRAIN LIKE YOU'D HAVE ON A CONDENSING FURNACE. 
          I, I WOULD, I WOULD THINK SO. 
          SOME OF THE MANUFACTURERS EVEN TELLS YOU TO, TO INSULATE IT. 
          SOME THAT I'VE, SOME OF THE ONES THAT I'VE SEEN. 
          SO I WOULD THINK THAT THAT WOULD BE THE INTENT TO INSULATE EVEN THOSE. 
          BUT I WAS GONNA SAY, THIS MAY BE ONE. 
          I SEE WE ARE OUR FOLKS OUT IN THE AUDIENCE. 
          DOES, DOES ANYBODY WANT TO COME UP AND RENDER A THOUGHT OR AN APPEND UH, OPINION ON INSULATING ALL OF THAT? I MEAN, OUT IN THE FIELD WHAT WE SEE ALL THE TIME, I'M SORRY. 
          OUT, OUT IN THE FIELD, WHAT WE SEE MOST OF THE TIME IS WHEN THEY HAVE AN 90% FURNACE, THEY ACTUALLY TIE IN TO THE SAME DRAIN AS THE COIL. 
          SO IT'S MAYBE THREE FEET MAY AT THE MOST. 
          'CAUSE THEY'RE JUST TYING THEM TOGETHER AND RUNNING 'EM TOGETHER. 
          SO IT'S NOT LIKE A, YOU KNOW, A WHOLE NEW LINE SET OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT. 
          THERE'S THE COMMON PRACTICE IS JUST TO TIE INTO THE, THE PRIMARY FROM THE COIL. 
          AND THAT JUST GOES. 
          SO IT'S NOT THAT MUCH INSULATION AS FAR AS WATER HEATERS. 
          I DON'T KNOW. 
          SO THIS SECTION DOES FALL UNDER EVAPORATORS AND COOLING COILS. 
          THIS IS A SUBSECTION TO, UM, TO EVAPORATORS AND COOLING COILS. 
          YEAH, THAT, THAT SHOULD BE 'CAUSE YOU'RE, YOU'RE LOOKING AT COLD WATER. 
          THAT'S WHY WE'RE INSULATING THE LINE. 
          SO WHEN YOU'RE COMING FROM A 90% FURNACE, WE DON'T HAVE COLD WATER. 
          YES. 
          SCOTT, CAN YOU, UH, PUSH THE MICROPHONE PLEASE? HE, HE HAS A DIFFERENT STYLE MIC THAT BETTER WHEN THE GREEN IS GREEN. 
          GREEN. 
          YOU'RE GOOD ONE TIME. 
          YEAH, THAT'S FINE. 
          YEAH. 
          SCREAM LOUDER. 
          , HE'S GOT THE MICROPHONE. 
          YEAH, I GUESS WE'RE INSULATED DRAIN LINES. 
          UH, YOU'RE DOING THAT BECAUSE YOU GOT COLD WATER GOING DOWN AND IT COULD CAUSE THE PIPE TO CON TO CONDENSATE OFF THE, THE PRIMARY DRAIN LINE. 
          SECONDARY LINES ARE TYPICALLY NOT INSULATED OR CONDENSATION LINES COMING FROM A A 90% OR CONDENSING FURNACE. 
          UH, AND AND TYPICALLY WE DO TIE 'EM IN WITH THE PRIMARIES GOING OUT. 
          SO, UM, DO WE WANT TO CLARIFY ALSO THAT IT'S JUST THE PRIMARY WE WANT INSULATED? I MEAN THAT'S AGAIN, ANOTHER ADDED COST. 
          I MEAN THAT, THAT I WOULD, YEAH, I WOULD SAY SO. 
          'CAUSE THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN NOW, THEY WOULD BE LOOKING TO TRY TO, UH, INSULATE 
          [00:35:01]
BOTH, WHICH IS, WELL ACTUALLY IT DOES SAY PRIMARY, IT SAYS ADD REQUIREMENTS. 
          THAT PRIMARY DRAIN LINES LOCATED IN UNCONDITION SPACES. 
          IT'S ALREADY WRITTEN LIKE THAT. 
          IT'S ALREADY ON THERE. 
          YEAH. 
          OKAY. 
          OKAY THEN I THINK WE'VE TALKED ABOUT IT ENOUGH. 
          SORRY, I'M MORE TALKATIVE THAN NORMAL. 
          NO, YEAH, NO, THAT, THAT WAS A GOOD POINT. 
          SO NEXT ITEM, COASTAL AMENDMENT 3 0 7 0.2. 
          POINT FOUR 0.1 FOR DUCTLESS MINI SPLIT SYSTEM TRAPS. 
          SO OUR CURRENT AMENDMENT REMOVES THE REQUIREMENT FOR THE LOCATION OF THE INLINE CHECK VALVE AND REFERS TO MANUFACTURER'S RECOMMENDATIONS. 
          WE PROPOSE TO JUST KEEP THIS AMENDMENT AS WRITTEN. 
          SO MY ONLY QUESTION ON THAT FROM, FROM THE CITY'S STANDPOINT, DO YOU HAVE ANY CONCERNS ON GETTING THAT INFORMATION SO YOU CAN ENFORCE THE MANUFACTURER'S RECOMMENDATIONS? NO, NOT AT ALL. 
          AS A MATTER OF FACT, WE ALREADY LOOK AT, AT THE MANUFACTURER'S INSTALLATION INSTRUCTIONS BECAUSE IT, THERE'S SO MANY BRANDS AND MANY STYLES OF, OF MINI SPLITS AND, AND WHAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR IS, UH, DISCONNECTS. 
          AND SOME OF 'EM REQUIRE THEM AND SOME DON'T. 
          SO WE ALWAYS HAVE TO LOOK AT THAT TO MAKE SURE THAT THE DISCONNECTS, YOU KNOW, ARE REQUIRED OR NOT. 
          AND THEN MOST THE ONES THAT I'VE SEEN, 99% OF THE ONES WE'VE SEEN, THEY ALREADY COME WITH A CHECK VALVE OR THEY HAVE A, A LITTLE PUMP THAT PUMPS THE WATER OUT AND IT'S BUILT INTO THE, INTO THE ACTUAL UNIT. 
          SO WE JUST, THIS PART IS LIKE, WE, IT'S NOT NECESSARY. 
          I MEAN THERE, ALL OF THAT'S ALREADY KIND OF BUILT INTO THE SYSTEM. 
          YEAH. 
          I'M, I'M GOOD KEEPING THE AMENDMENT THE WAY IT'S ALRIGHT. 
          UM, NEXT SECTION. 
          UM, A CLARIFICATION IN THE 2021 I M C, UH, 4 0 1 0.2 AND 4 0 3 0.1 FOR MECHANICAL VENTILATION, FOR DWELLING UNITS. 
          UM, THE SUMMARY IS LENGTHY THERE. 
          DO YOU GUYS DON'T, DO YOU WANT ME TO READ THAT WHOLE THING? CAN ANYONE TRANSLATE THAT INTO UH, I GUESS ENGLISH? AM I, IF I'M QUASI READING THIS, OR AT LEAST THE WAY I'M INTERPRETING THIS IS IF THE BUILDING HAS THE TOTAL BUILDING, LIKE IF WE DID A BLOWER DOOR ON IT AND THE BUILDING WAS TIGHT, THEY HAVE TO MECHANICALLY VENTILATE IT. 
          IF IT'S NOT TIGHT AND IT LEAKS LIKE A, LIKE A SIEVE, YOU KNOW, AN OLD BUILDING, THEN THEY DON'T HAVE TO MECHANICALLY VENTILATE IT. 
          WE ALLOW ENOUGH INFILTRATION INTO THE SPACE TO COVER THE QUOTE UNQUOTE VENTILATION. 
          I'M, I'M, SO IF YOU PERVERSE INCENTIVE TO, SO I THINK REALLY THIS CHANGE, UM, IT PREVIOUSLY REFERENCED, UM, R 4 0 2 OF THE I E C C, WHICH IS FOR ALL DWELLING UNITS, THREE STORIES AND LESS, RIGHT? RIGHT. 
          SO THOSE APARTMENT COMPLEXES, SO NOW IT REQUIRES ALL R TWO DWELLING UNITS TO BE MECHANICALLY VENTILATED, NOT JUST THOSE THREE STORIES. 
          AND LESS SO IF YOU HAVE NOW A FOUR OR FIVE STORY, UH, APARTMENT COMPLEX, ALL OF THE DWELLING UNITS HAVE TO BE, BE MECHANICALLY VENTILATED. 
          SO IT WAS REALLY A CLARIFICATION 'CAUSE I GUESS IT WASN'T INTENT, IT WASN'T WRITTEN AS INTENDED. 
          THERE WAS KIND OF A LOOPHOLE THERE THAT IF YOU HAVE NOW A FOUR STORY APARTMENT, YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE ALL OF THE R TWO, ALL OF THE DWELLING UNITS MECHANICALLY VENTILATED BECAUSE THIS SECTION DIDN'T, DIDN'T APPLY BECAUSE OF THE REFERENCE ONLY TO THREE STORY UNLESS IN THE ENERGY CODE. 
          [00:40:02]
SO IS THIS A, UH, INSTANCE OF THE CODE CATCHING UP TO COMMON PRACTICE? ARE, ARE PODIUM BUILDS FOUR STORIES AND ABOVE ALREADY, GENERALLY MECHANICALLY VENTILATED OR NOT? YES. 
          WELL I WAS GETTING, I WAS GETTING A A NO SHAKE FROM . 
          CORRECT. 
          BUT THEY WERE ALREADY BEING MECHANICALLY VENTILATED IS WHAT YOU'RE, I'M ASKING IF COMMON PRACTICE WAS THAT THAT WAS ALREADY HAPPENING. 
          IF IS WHAT IF, IF THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE SEEING OUT, OUT THERE IN THE WORLD OR NOT. 
          'CAUSE IF NOT, THIS CONSTITUTES A PRETTY SIGNIFICANT COST INCREASE FOR THOSE I WOULD IMAGINE. 
          YEAH, IT IT, WHEN APARTMENTS, WHEN APARTMENTS WERE BUILT THAT WERE HIGHER THAN THREE STORIES OR, OR YOU KNOW, FOUR OR FIVE, SIX STORIES, THEY BASICALLY OUTSIDE AIR WAS NOT REQUIRED. 
          ONLY IF THERE WERE THREE STORES OR BELOW. 
          AND THAT'S PRETTY MUCH WHAT THIS IS. 
          YOU KNOW, THEY, THEY WERE VENT, THEY WERE, YOU STILL HAVE EXHAUST FANS FOR THE RESTROOMS AND STUFF LIKE THAT. 
          BUT IT WASN'T, IT WASN'T A REQUIRED MEANT FOR ABOVE THREE STORIES. 
          NOW IT IS. 
          I GUESS, JOE, THE QUESTION IS, DO WE SEE ANY 4, 5, 6 STORY APARTMENTS WITHOUT OUTSIDE AIR? YES. 
          ARE THEY BEING, UH, TESTED FOR TIGHTNESS OR, OR NO, AS PER THE I E C C? YES, BUT IT'S A BATCH TESTING. 
          BUT THREE STORIES AND, WELL, NO, THAT, THAT'S A LITTLE DIFFERENT THE WAY IT'S WORDED, BUT IT, IT WOULD BE A BATCH TEST, NOT EVERY SINGLE UNIT. 
          HMM. 
          SO WOULD THE, THE NEW CODE OR FOUR STORIES OR THREE STORIES FROM ABOVE, WOULD THEY BE TESTED FOR TIGHTNESS IS, YEAH, THAT'S THE BAT BATCH TESTING? YES. 
          SO IF THEY ARE TESTED FOR TIGHTNESS AND THEY ARE TIGHT, THEN I WOULD SAY FRESH AIR WOULD BE RECOMMENDED. 
          SO KIND OF TO, TO PIGGYBACK ON THAT, IS THE INTENT OF THE, THE CITY, LIKE IF SOMEBODY'S REPLACING A FURNACE, DO WE WANT TO HAVE MECHANICAL AIR INCLU, UH, UH, UH, SOME SORT OF OUTSIDE AIR INTRODUCED TO THAT NEW FURNACE WHEN IT'S INSTALLED? NOT ON A REPLACEMENT. 
          THIS IS JUST FOR, MOST OF THIS IS FOR NEW CONSTRUCTION. 
          UH, EVEN ON A RESIDENTIAL HOME, UH, IT'S NOT REQUIRED. 
          IT'S A PREEXISTING CONDITION. 
          YOU KNOW, IF IT'S A BRAND NEW SYSTEM THEN IT IS REQUIRED, BUT IN A PREEXISTING CONDITION THAT IS JUST A CHANGE OUT. 
          WE DO NOT REQUIRE OUTSIDE AIR. 
          OKAY. 
          WOULD Y'ALL BE COMFORTABLE IF WE KIND OF PUNTED THIS ONE TO THE NEXT MEETING? 'CAUSE I'D LIKE TO GET SOME INPUT FROM, UM, SOME PEOPLE ABOUT WHAT COMMON PRACTICES AND, AND WHAT THIS DOES. 
          'CAUSE I, YOU KNOW, I THINK THE I E C C DOES A LOT OF GOOD THINGS, BUT IT ALL, ONE THING THAT IT ABSOLUTELY DOES IS RAISE, RAISE COST, YOU KNOW, AND I THINK JUST WE NEED TO BE CAREFUL. 
          YEAH, THE POINT OF MY EARLIER COMMENT THERE, IT WAS JUST SIMPLY A, YOU KNOW, SINGLE STORY HOUSE WITH THE ATTIC OR WITH THE FURNACE IN THE ATTIC, IT'S RELATIVELY EASY TO ADD OUTSIDE AIR TO IT IF THEY REPLACE THAT FURNACE. 
          SO THAT WAS, THAT WAS KIND OF MY QUESTION. 
          AND, AND IF WE, I DON'T KNOW, WITHOUT MAKING IT EXCEPT EXCEPTIONALLY WORDY AND AN UNENFORCEABLE POTENTIALLY ADDING THAT, SOMETHING LIKE THAT IN A REPLACEMENT SCENARIO. 
          OKAY, WE'LL TABLE THAT ONE FOR, UH, FUTURE DISCUSSION. 
          SO OUR NEXT ITEM IS, UH, 2021 I M C 4 0 1 0.4. 
          AND ALSO 4 0 1 0.3 0.1 FOR INTAKE OPENINGS AND EXHAUST OUTLET LOCATIONS. 
          WE RECOMMEND ADOPT AS WRITTEN. 
          THIS WAS AN ADDED OPTION TO AN EXISTING SECTION. 
          WE ALWAYS LIKE TO SEE THAT FOR, UH, ADDITIONAL, UM, OPTIONS. 
          UM, IN THE NEW CODE. 
          I'LL GIVE YOU GUYS A SECOND TO READ OVER THAT. 
          FROM A VENTILATION AIR AND A 
          [00:45:01]
EXHAUST RELIEF AIR, I HAVE NOT SEEN ONE OF THESE, A FACTORY MANUFACTURED, I'M ASSUMING THAT'S MORE LIKE A COMBUSTION AIR INTAKE AND, AND FLU ON A FURNACE. 
          I JUST HAVEN'T SEEN THOSE. 
          WELL, IT, IT'S A NEW THING THAT'S COMING UP. 
          IT'S ALMOST LIKE THE SAME TYPE OF FITTING FOR LIKE 90% FURNACES AND THEY TIE IN TWO PIPES AND COMBINE INTO ONE. 
          THIS IS KIND OF THE SAME THING, BUT WHAT SO, BUT IT'S FOR THE DIFFERENT USE. 
          IT'S NOT COMBUSTION AIR. 
          IT'S FOR, FOR OUTSIDE AIR AND, UH, EXHAUST. 
          AND, AND I THINK THIS IS JUST SOMETHING THAT THEY ADDED BECAUSE THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN NOW, UM, YOU HAVE TO BE ANY OPEN, ANY TO A BUILDING HAS TO BE THREE FEET AWAY FROM ANY, UH, YOU KNOW, BUT BY DEFINITION, UH, ENVIRONMENTAL LAYER FROM, YOU KNOW, FROM A RESTROOM OR SOMETHING IS CONSIDERED NON-TOXIC. 
          SO THEREFORE THE THE THREE, THE THREE FEET RULE DON'T EVEN APPLY. 
          SO THAT, THAT'S THE WAY IT'S, IT'S WRITTEN NOW. 
          SO I THINK WHAT THEY'RE DOING HERE IS JUST THEY CAME UP WITH SOME SORT OF FITTING TO PUNCH LESS HOLES THROUGH THE WALL TO WHERE YOU CAN DO BOTH THROUGH ONE, ONE END. 
          THEN, THEN MY ONLY REWORD OF THAT, INSTEAD OF FACTORY BUILT WOULD BE UL LISTED. 
          JUST SIMPLY BECAUSE, I MEAN, SOMEBODY'S GOTTA PROVE IT DOESN'T RETRAIN AIR AND IT BILLY BOB'S FACTORY CAN START KICKING THESE THINGS OUT THE DOOR WITH NO, NO TESTING. 
          I GUESS THE ONLY, I MEAN THIS IS THE WAY THE COURT, THE CODE IS WRITTEN. 
          IF WE PUT YOU A LIST, I I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT THE LIST WOULD BE. 
          . 
          SO JOE, WE WOULD MAKE SURE THAT, UM, ANY FACTORY BUILT, ANY, ANY EQUIPMENT INSTALLED WOULD BE UL LISTED AND APPROVED MEANS ACCEPTABLE TO THE CODE OFFICIALS. 
          SO THAT'S DEFINED. 
          SO WE, JOE, CAN YOU CONFIRM? WE USUALLY LOOK FOR A, UM, A LISTING ON ANY TYPE OF EQUIPMENT THAT IT, THAT IT WAS ACTUALLY FACTORY BUILT? UH, YES, WE DO THAT AND ALSO IN MATERIALS. 
          SO WHERE WE'RE LOOKING FOR A UA LISTING, I, I JUST, IT'S JUST THAT THE WAY THE CODE IS WRITTEN, THAT THE WAY THEY WROTE THIS, IT DIDN'T PUT A UA LISTING TO IT. 
          THEY JUST, YOU KNOW, KNOW IT SAYS FACTORY BUILT CRYSTAL. 
          ARE YOU SAYING THAT FACTORY BUILT IS A DEFINED TERM AT THE BEGINNING OF THE BOOK? NOT FACTORY BUILT BUT APPROVED. 
          SO THIS CODE SECTION SAYS APPROVED FACTORY BUILT, UM, AND APPROVED IS DEFINED. 
          DOES THAT SATISFY WHAT YOU'RE YEAH, AS LONG AS WE'RE, WE'RE TAKING IT THAT WAY. 
          ARE YOU, ARE YOU SAYING THAT THE FACTORY BUILT IS IN THE I M C OR THAT'S IN THE AMENDMENT? IT'S STRAIGHT CODE. 
          STRAIGHT CODE, YEAH. 
          AND YOU KNOW, AND ALWAYS, YOU KNOW, THINK ONE, ONE PRECAUTION THAT, UH, WHEN WE START TALKING ABOUT UL THAT WE SHOULD REFER TO LISTING AND NOT NECESSARILY JUST UL LISTING. 
          OF COURSE. 
          GOOD POINT. 
          SO DO WE NEED TO MAKE A CHANGE TO THAT OR WE CAN. 
          WE, I I THINK WE'RE GOOD AS LONG AS IT'S BEING INTERPRETED THAT WAY THAT IT'S GOTTA BE A LISTED DEVICE AND NOT SIMPLY JUST A FACTORY BUILT DEVICE. 
          OKAY. 
          GOOD. 
          THANK YOU. 
          AND CRYSTAL, THANK YOU FOR PROVIDING THESE ENLARGED VERSIONS. 
          'CAUSE THIS IS GREAT. 
          SO MAYBE WE DON'T HAVE TO USE OUR GLASSES. 
          OKAY. 
          UM, THE NEXT ITEM IS, UM, CURRENT CODE, UH, WHERE STAFF IS PROPOSING ADOPT AS WRITTEN CHANGES TO THE TABLE. 
          4 0 3 0.3 0.1 0.1. 
          UM, AND IT PROVIDES CLARIFICATION IF YOU GUYS WANNA READ THAT SUMMARY. 
          [00:50:16]
YEAH, I THINK WE'RE, WE'RE PROBABLY RIGHT ADOPTING THAT AS WRITTEN. 
           THE ONLY ONE THAT SAYS IT'S TABLE 4 0 3 3 1 1. 
          THAT TABLE DOESN'T EXIST IN THIS. 
          AGAIN, I HAVEN'T HAD ENOUGH CAFFEINE TODAY. 
          UM, THAT TABLE STARTS ON FOUR DASH SIX. 
          OKAY. 
          YEAH, I WAS LOOKING FOR IT BACK AT 4 0 3 SECTION 4 0 3. 
          WE'RE WE'RE GOOD THEN. 
          OKAY, WE'LL MOVE ON. 
          OKAY, THE NEXT ITEM, UM, IN THE 2021 I M C 5, 0 2 POINT 20.1 FOR MANICURE AND PEDICURE STATION EXHAUST SYSTEMS, UM, STAFF, STAFF RECOMMENDS ADOPT AS WRITTEN, THIS IS A NEW SUBSECTION TO MANICURE AND PEDICURE STATIONS, UH, STATING THAT THE EXHAUST SYSTEM FOR THOSE STATIONS MUST RUN CONTINUOUSLY WHEN THE SPACE IS OCCUPIED. 
          WE ESTIMATED THIS WOULD BE A SLIGHT INCREASE IN CONSTRUCTION COSTS BECAUSE THAT, UH, THAT COORDINATION WOULD NEED TO BE INTERLOCKED OR THE, IN THE POWER SOURCE WOULD NEED TO BE INTERLOCKED WITH THE LIGHTS OR, UH, ANOTHER AUTOMATIC WAY OF TURNING THE SYSTEM ON WHEN THE SPACE IS OCCUPIED. 
          UH, I WILL ADMIT THAT I HAVE LIMITED EXPERIENCE IN MANNY PETTY, UM, SALONS, BUT IT SEEMS TO ME THAT THERE MAY BE NOT ALWAYS IN USE THAT WE WOULD BE RUNNING A FAN, YOU KNOW, WHEN THEY'RE SITTING EMPTY. 
          I, I JUST, NOT AS MUCH THE CONSTRUCTION COST, BUT JUST THE POWER SUPPLY, YOU KNOW, COST SEEMS, I DUNNO, IS THERE SOMETHING BEHIND THIS? WELL, I, YOU KNOW, I'M, I'M THINKING IN TERMS OF MY WIFE USES THEM FREQUENTLY. 
          I WILL NOT STEP INTO PLACES BECAUSE THE, THE, THE AROMA IS SO INTENSE. 
          . 
          YEAH. 
          AND I'LL AGREE WITH THAT. 
          THAT'S PART OF THE PROBLEM I THINK HISTORICALLY FROM AN OPERATIONAL PERSPECTIVE IS A LOT OF THE TIMES THEY WILL, THE OPERATORS WILL SHUT THE EXHAUST FANS OFF AND THEN YOU HAVE A VERY LARGE BUILDUP. 
          AND, AND I'LL KIND OF GO SECOND AND THIRD HAND, I'VE HEARD PEOPLE TALK ABOUT IF YOU'RE GONNA GO IN AND RENOVATE ONE OF THOSE SPACES BECAUSE THEY DON'T RUN THE EXHAUST FAN. 
          IT'S, IT'S A DOOZY. 
          LIKE TRYING TO GET THE SMELL OUT OF THE DRYWALL POTENTIALLY SOMETIMES IS IT'S LIKE, IT'S LIKE A HOUSE THAT'S HAD A SMOKER IN IT. 
          OKAY. 
          I'M ASSUMING THIS IS FOR NEW YEAH, EVERYTHING HERE SHOULD BE REFERENCE. 
          CORRECT. 
          SO THIS WOULD BE FOR NEW CONSTRUCTION OR A CHANGE OF USE. 
          SO, UM, IF THE SPACE FELL UNDER THE EXISTING BUILDING CODE, A CHANGE OF USE TYPICALLY KICKS YOU BACK INTO NEW REQUIREMENTS. 
          UM, WHICH MAKES SENSE BECAUSE IT'S A NEW, UH, NAIL SALON OR, YES. 
          OKAY. 
          YEAH. 
          GOOD. 
          ALRIGHT, WE'LL GO WITH IT. 
          AND I'LL JUST REITERATE FOR ANYBODY, I MEAN, PLEASE FEEL FREE TO SPEAK UP. 
          WE WANT TO HEAR AS MANY THINGS AS POSSIBLE. 
          SO I'M, I'M GONNA JUST PUT THIS ON THE, YOU KNOW, THE LAWYER HAT ON FOR A SECOND. 
          THIS IS REFERRING TO THE PEDICURE STATIONS, NOT THE ACTUAL BUILDING TYPE THING. 
          SO I'M, WHAT I'M IMAGINING IN MY HEAD ON, ON THIS ONE IS IT WOULD BE A CHAIR THAT HAS AN EXHAUST VENT NEXT TO IT AND POTENTIALLY WITH A SWITCH. 
          UM, JUST, JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT'S HOW WE'RE THINKING THAT'S GONNA BE APPLIED. 
          IS, IS THE INTENT TO TURN ON 23 CHAIRS WHEN THE BUILDING'S OCCUPIED? OR IS THE INTENT TO, TO TURN ON JUST THE CHAIR THAT IS OCCUPIED? WELL, THE TYP THE, THE WAY IT IS WRITTEN RIGHT NOW, UH, THAT'S BASICALLY WHAT IT IS. 
          UH, IT DOESN'T SPECIFY THAT IT HAS TO BE ON, YOU KNOW, CONTINUOUSLY THE WAY IT IS NOW. 
          IT JUST TELLS YOU YOU NEED, YOU KNOW, SIX TO C FENCES PER CHAIR. 
          AND SO, UH, WHAT THEY DO NOW, IT, IT, WHEN IT FIRST, WHEN THIS FIRST ORIGINALLY STARTED, IT WAS A SWITCH BY THE CHAIR OR BY THE TABLE. 
          AND, UH, THEN PEOPLE WERE NOT TURNING 
          [00:55:01]
THEM ON. 
          SO THEN THEY DECIDED THAT, THAT THE PRACTICE WENT A DIFFERENT WAY TO WHERE THEY CONNECT ALL THE TABLES TO ONE EXHAUST. 
          SO THE EXHAUST IS ALWAYS ON AS AS IT IS NOW. 
          AND DEPENDING ON, ON WHICH TIER OR PEDICURE YOU'RE AT, YOU CAN REMOVE THE BAFFLE OR SOMETHING AND THEN IT'LL START SUCKING, YOU KNOW, IT'LL START SUCTIONING FROM THE TABLE OR, OR, OR, OR, UH, OR CHAIR. 
          BUT I MEAN IT, THAT'S ACTUALLY THE COMMON PRACTICE NOW TO WHERE THEY'RE ALL TIED INTO ONE BIG EXHAUST, YOU KNOW, SO THEY HAVE 10 TABLES TIMES 6,600 C F M FANS PUT IT ON THE UP ON THE ROOF AND IT'S ON ALL THE TIME ANYHOW. 
          SO THIS BASICALLY JUST SAYS THAT WHEN YOU WALK IN OR WHEN THERE'S PEOPLE IN THE BUILDING THAT THE, THE, THAT THE FAN FOR THE PEDICURE TABLE AND, AND THE CHAIR WILL COME ON AND IT'LL STAY ON. 
          THAT'S, THAT'S ALL, THAT'S WHAT THIS SAYS THERE IS THE CODE DOES REQUIRE FOR THE TYPE OF USE TO BE ALSO VENTILATED, BUT THEY CAN USE THE VENTILATION ON THE CHAIRS AS PART OF THAT REQUIREMENT. 
          SO IF, IF THEY DON'T HAVE ENOUGH CHAIRS OR TABLES TO MEET THE, THE MINIMUM REQUIREMENT FOR, FOR THE TYPE OF BUILDING, THEN THEY NEED TO ADD EXTRA EXHAUST, YOU KNOW, IN A COMMON AREA. 
          SO, SO, SO ARE WE SEEING DO ASS GO ON THOSE BUILDINGS RIGHT NOW? 'CAUSE I'M JUST, JUST SITTING HERE GOING A LOT OF THOSE, YOU KNOW, IT DOESN'T TAKE VERY MUCH TO GET 10, 10 STATIONS IN SOMETHING THAT'S ONLY GOT A FOUR OR FIVE TON ROOFTOP. 
          AND YES, WE, WE DO SEE AN ADDITIONAL EXHAUST, YOU KNOW, LIKE JUST LIKE A COMMON EXHAUST, LIKE A RESTROOM EXHAUST IN THE MIDDLE OF THE ROOM THAT IT'S ON ALL THE TIME. 
          BECAUSE THAT'S A REQUIREMENT BY, BY BY THE VENTILATION PART OF THE CODE. 
          YEAH, BUT I'M TALKING THE OTHER SIDE OF IT. 
          I MEAN, WE'RE, YOU'RE LIKE YOU SAID, 10 CHAIRS AT AT WHAT? AT 60 C F M A CHAIR, 600 AND YOU CAN HAVE 10 CHAIRS AND UNDER A THOUSAND SQUARE FEET, 1500 SQUARE FEET. 
          YEAH. 
          AND, AND WALMART OR WHATEVER. 
          I SHOULDN'T SAY WALMART. 
          I NEED MORE OF A STANDALONE, UH, LIKE, LIKE A, A STRIP MALL MM-HMM. 
           THAT WE DON'T HAVE ANY COMMUNICATING SPACES AND, AND NOW WE'RE PUTTING 30%, 35% OUTSIDE AIR THROUGH A ROOFTOP UNIT, WHICH DOESN'T HELP THE CASE OF YEAH, YEAH. 
          YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE HEAT LOAD TOO MUCH, TOO MUCH COMING IN AND A LOT COMING OUT. 
          YEAH, I'M, I'M TALKING ABOUT FROM A ROOFTOP UNIT PERSPECTIVE THAT, THAT WE'RE, THESE PLACES USUALLY HAVE A SINGLE STAGE COMPRESSOR, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, SO I'M JUST LOOKING AT FROM THE STANDPOINT, I HATE TO, I HATE TO DRIVE COST, BUT FROM A, FROM A DESIGN PERSPECTIVE, THAT'S WHAT'S GONNA END UP ON THESE THINGS. 
          AND, AND IT'S, DO WE, DO WE NEED TO LOOK AT A THOUGHT PROCESS ON THE OTHER SIDE OF IT AT ALL? DO WE CARE? I MEAN, THAT'S GONNA, WE'RE JUST GONNA BE PUSHING INTO REALLY HIGH PERCENTAGES OF OUTSIDE AIR THAT FROM A, FROM A PREFERRED DESIGN PERSPECTIVE, I'D BE PUTTING A DOAS ON TOP OF THAT BUILDING JUST BECAUSE YOU'RE AT 30, 40% OUTSIDE AIR. 
          BUT WE'LL END UP WITH, WITH A CHEAP ROOFTOP UNIT OR WORSE A RESIDENTIAL FURNACE, IT'S POSSIBLE THAT WE COULD RE YOU KNOW, A LEASE SPACE THAT HAS A, WAS SOMETHING BEFORE THAT THEN BECOME A NAIL SALON THAT COULD REQUIRE MORE CAPACITY, MORE AC TO HANDLE THAT TYPE OF AIR. 
          THAT'S A LOT OF OUTSIDE AIR. 
          UM, IT WOULD BE A COST THING. 
          SO WHAT'S THE RECOMMENDATION? DO WE NEED TO GET SOME ADDITIONAL INPUT ON, ON THIS? I MEAN, YOU KNOW, WHEN WE TALK ABOUT LIFE SAFETY ITEMS, YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT'S A CONSIDERATION IMBALANCE TO THE COST OBVIOUSLY. 
          UM, BUT OBVIOUSLY I'M, I'M THE TYPE THAT SENSITIVE TO MOST COST INCREASES. 
          AND YOU THINK MOST NAIL SALONS ARE PROBABLY MOM AND POP TYPE SHOPS, YOU KNOW? SO WE WANT TO GIVE PEOPLE AN OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE A LIVING. 
          SO, YOU KNOW, THERE'S, UH, THAT'S WHY I SAY IF WE LEAVE IT OPEN TO IT TO A ROOFTOP UNIT, I MEAN THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT THESE THINGS TYPICALLY ARE ENDING UP WITH IS A FOUR OR FIVE TON SINGLE STAGE COMPRESSOR, ROOFTOP UNIT, AND THAT'S IT. 
          AND THEN YOU END UP WITH HUMIDITY CONTROL PROBLEMS, YOU END UP WITH MOLD. 
          THAT'S WHERE I SAY, WELL, I'VE, I'VE HEARD SECOND AND THIRD HAND YOU DO NOT WANT TO REMODEL THESE SPACES INTO ANOTHER BECAUSE THEY'RE, THEY'RE DIFFICULT TO RENOVATE. 
          RIGHT. 
          AND ARE THERE OTHER OPTIONS FOR INTRODUCING EXTRA AIR IN THAT YOU NEED TO, FOR ALL THE AIR EXCHANGE THAT'S GONNA BE HAPPENING? I MEAN, YOU CAN DO IT WITH A HEAT RECOVERY SYSTEM TO TRY TO ATTEMPT TO GET TO IT, BUT A AGAIN, I I, I DON'T WANT TO GET OVERBEARING ON FROM A CODE PERSPECTIVE BECAUSE THERE IS A, A GOOD COST IN INSIDE TO THIS. 
          DO WE KNOW WHAT, WHAT THE CONVERSATION WAS WITH THE CODE COMMITTEES WHEN THEY CAME UP WITH THIS? 'CAUSE I KNOW, YOU KNOW, THERE'S AN ITEM LATER ON THAT WE'LL TALK ABOUT THAT HAS TO DO WITH, YOU KNOW, A A CERTAIN, YOU KNOW, IF THERE'S A CRUSADE, LIKE IF THERE'S PEOPLE THAT ARE BECOMING ILL, IF THIS IS A REAL BIG PROBLEM WITH SOCIETY, IF IT WAS JUST SOMEBODY'S SOMEBODY'S PET PROJECT, YOU KNOW, AND THAT TO ME INFLUENCES WHETHER WE YEAH, WELL I, I THINK 
          [01:00:01]
THE EXHAUST IS ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY. 
          I HAVEN'T READ ANY ASHRAE UH, STUDIES ON IT THAT I, THEY'RE PROBABLY OUT THERE, BUT I HAVE, I HAVEN'T READ ANYTHING. 
          IT'S JUST, I'M LOOKING MAYBE DO WE NEED TO EXTEND IT ONE EXTRA STEP TO SAY NAIL SALON SHALL BE, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING ON THE MAKEUP AIR SIDE SO THAT WE HAVE PROPER AMOUNTS OF MAKEUP AIR GOING INTO THOSE SPACES? WELL, AND I SHOULD, I SHOULD. 
          THEY'RE PROBABLY GETTING THE RIGHT AMOUNT OF AIR, BUT ARE THEY GETTING THE RIGHT TYPE OF AIR? ARE THEY GETTING GOOD CONDITIONED AIR THAT'S GONNA BE, YOU KNOW, COMPLY WITH LIKE ASHRAY 55 FOR TEMPERATURE AND HUMIDITY REQUIREMENTS? THIS IS, UH, JEREMY MCDONALD ALSO SPEAKING WITH, UH, CHIEF EZ ABOUT THIS. 
          SO ONCE AGAIN, AS YOU MENTIONED BEFORE, REALLY WE'RE NOT, THE DESIGN WE'RE SEEING IN THE FIELD IS THESE EXHAUSTS THAT ARE CONTINUOUSLY RUNNING AND THEY'RE USING THE BAFFLES. 
          SO THEY'RE STILL ALLOWED TO HAVE THOSE BAFFLES THAT KINDA SHUT OFF THOSE EXHAUST PORTS. 
          AND THAT MIGHT BE WHAT THEY'RE DOING TO LIMIT THAT AIR CHANGE WHEN THEY'RE NOT BEING UTILIZED. 
          AND YOU KNOW, I UNDERSTAND IF THEY'RE FULLY MAXED OUT, THEY HAVE ALL THE CHAIRS AT THAT POINT, THEY MIGHT HAVE SOMETHING, BUT THIS WOULD NOT BE A CONTINUOUS THING IF THEY IMPLEMENT THE BAFFLES AT EACH OF THESE EXHAUST PORTS. 
          AGAIN, MY INTERPRETATION OF IT SAYS THE EXHAUST SYSTEM SHALL OPERATE CONTINUOUSLY, DOESN'T MEAN THAT THE FANS TURNED ON AND THE DAMPER'S CLOSED. 
          IT MEANS IT'S ON, IT'S OPEN AND IT'S EXHAUSTING. 
          I'LL SAY SOMETHING THAT MIGHT BE CONTROVERSIAL HERE, BUT I MEAN, THIS IS A NEW CONSTRUCTION CODE, SO IT HAS TO BE CAPABLE OF RUNNING CONSTANTLY WHEN THE, YOU KNOW, THE POWER HAS TO BE ACTIVATED AND THAT TURNS THE FANS ON. 
          BUT IF THERE'S SOME KIND OF BAFFLE THAT AFFECTS IT, I MEAN THE CODE INSPECTORS AREN'T GONNA BE IN THE PLACE WHEN IT OPERATES. 
          AM I COMING OUTTA LEFT FIELD HERE? NO, THAT'S CORRECT. 
          I, I THINK AT THAT POINT, MAYBE IT WOULD BE A CODE ENFORCEMENT IF SOMEBODY WERE TO MENTION SOME CONCERNS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. 
          BUT YOU'RE CORRECT THAT IT IS, YOU KNOW, THE DAY OF THE INSPECTION IS, IS LIMITED WHAT WE WOULD SEE. 
          NOW, OBVIOUSLY WE DON'T WANNA GET TOO CUTE ABOUT THAT AS THE  AS THE CODE, UH, PURVEYORS. 
          UH, BUT I DON'T KNOW, I MEAN, I GUESS, YOU KNOW, THIS IS ONE OF THOSE TOUGH CALLS THAT THAT'S WHY WE'RE, THAT'S WHY WE'RE HERE TO MAKE A RECOMMENDATION. 
          YOU KNOW, DO WE THINK IT'S, YOU KNOW, ALL THESE CONSIDERATIONS WERE MADE WHEN THEY WROTE THE CODE. 
          YOU KNOW, DO WE THINK THAT WAS ALREADY KIND OF INCLUDED WHEN THIS WAS WRITTEN OR, OR DO WE NEED MORE? I MEAN FROM OUR, OUR CODE ENFORCEMENT, ARE YOU GUYS GOING TO, WHAT IS YOUR INTERPRETATION OF CONTINUOUSLY OPERATING? THE FANS RUNNING THE BAFFLES ARE CLOSED AND THAT WOULD COMPLY. 
          OKAY, SO THE BAFFLE THING, OKAY, IT, IT'S JUST IN CERTAIN TABLES, CERTAIN CHAIRS, IT'S NOT ALL OF THEM. 
          UH, BUT BASICALLY WE WALK IN AND IT'S, YOU KNOW, EITHER THEY HAVE A MOTION SENSOR OR THEY FLIP THE LIGHTS ON, THEN THE FAN SHOULD BE ON THAT. 
          THAT'S THE, THAT'S HOW WE INTERPRET THIS, YOU KNOW, CONTINUOUS RUNNING. 
          UM, WHAT WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO SAY IS THAT THE COMMON PRACTICE NOW IS JUST ONE FAN AND IS ALWAYS ON. 
          THEY JUST FLIP THE SWITCH ON AND IT'S ON. 
          IF THEY DON'T HAVE NO CUSTOMERS, THEY PROBABLY TURN OFF THE FAN 'CAUSE THERE'S NOBODY THERE. 
          BUT AS SOON AS THEY GET ONE IN, YOU KNOW, ONE CHAIR, THEY TURN THAT THING ON AND IT STARTS, YOU KNOW, IT STARTS EXHAUSTING ALL THE CHAIRS, ALL THE TABLES. 
          'CAUSE THEY'RE ALL CONNECTED INTO ONE FAN. 
          SO THAT'S THE COMMON PRACTICE. 
          NOW, UM, THEY DO HAVE, SOME DO HAVE BAFFLES, WHICH KIND OF HELPS BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE TALKING 600 CFMS THROUGH 10 CHAIRS, BUT IT'S ONLY ONE OR TWO OF 'EM ARE USING AND THEY OPEN THE BAFFLES. 
          IT HAS MORE, MORE EXHAUST JUST TO THOSE TWO TABLES. 
          SO IT KIND OF HELPS BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, YOU GOT MORE, BETTER CAPTURE VELOCITY THROUGH THOSE TWO GRILLS TRYING TO PULL 600 C F M. 
          SO EXACTLY, IT, IT'S JUST A PIECE OF, AGAIN, FROM AN INTERPRETATION, THIS, I SEE THIS AS BEING, I MEAN, IF THIS WERE A RESTROOM AND WE USE THE SAME, THE SAME METHOD ON A RESTROOM, WE WOULD NEVER COME IN AND SAY ONLY BECAUSE ONE PERSON IS USING ONE FIXTURE IN A TO, IN A, IN A EXACTLY SIX, A SIX TOILET RESTROOM, WE WOULD NOT ALLOW AND CONSIDERING THAT SYSTEM OPERATIONAL, IF IT WAS ONLY PULLING 70 C F M BECAUSE THE BAFFLES WERE CLOSED ON THE REST OF THE TOILETS AND THE URINALS. 
          SO THAT'S, THAT'S WHY I'M SAYING THIS, THIS COULD BE INTERPRETED AS THE, IT'S GOTTA BE 600 C F M AND NOT, NOT JUST WHEN ONE CHAIR'S OPEN, IT'S GOTTA BE 600 CCFM EX OF EXHAUST. 
          ANY TIME THAT BUILDING IS OCCUPIED AND, AND NO BAFFLES WOULD BE ALLOWED ON THE CHAIRS. 
          I MEAN, I, I THINK THAT'S THE INTERPRETATION THAT THE WAY THAT READS, OKAY, I MEAN, BAFFLES ARE NOT ANYWHERE IN THE CODE. 
          IT IS JUST THAT THAT'S THE WAY THE MANUFACTURER BUILT THEM. 
          AND SO IF IT'S NOT IN USE, YOU CLOSE IT. 
          IF YOU'RE GONNA USE IT, YOU POP IT UP AND THERE YOU GO. 
          THAT THAT'S HOW THE MANUFACTURER DESIGNS. 
          SOME OF 'EM NOT, THAT'S NOT THE COMMON, BUT THEY DO HAVE THOSE OUT THERE AND WE'VE SEEN THEM ALL THE TIME. 
          BUT, UH, YEAH, PRETTY MUCH IT'S, IT'S CONTINUOUSLY RUNNING. 
          IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE ON AS SOON AS SOMEONE'S THERE. 
          THAT'S HOW I INTERPRET THAT. 
          YEAH, I, I MEAN, I JUST FROM, FROM OUR SIDE UP HERE, I THINK WE WANT TO GIVE YOU SOMETHING THAT'S MORE ENFORCEABLE THAN IT. 
          IT'S EITHER YOU'RE 
          [01:05:01]
PULLING 600 C F M OR YOU'RE PULLING 60, AND EITHER ONE OF 'EM WOULD BE, WOULD BE PROV, WOULD BE IN COMPLIANCE. 
          I, I'D LIKE TO GIVE YOU BETTER DIRECTION ON HOW THAT'S INTERPRETED, BECAUSE AGAIN, I, I'M INTERPRETING IT, IT SAYS WHEN IT'S OCCUPIED IT'S SIX 600 C F M, THE BAFFLES, THE DAMPERS, THE, THE SHUTOFF VALVES ON THE CHAIRS MUST ALL REMAIN OPEN ANYTIME THAT BUILDING'S OCCUPIED OR, YOU KNOW, YOU DO A BAROMETRIC RELIEF TYPE THING UP IN THE CEILING THAT IT GETS 60 FROM A CHAIR AND 540 OUT OF THE CEILING. 
          SO I, I, I THINK WE NEED TO, FROM A BOARD PERSPECTIVE, MAYBE GIVE SOMETHING A LITTLE BIT BETTER ON THAT. 
          'CAUSE I, I THINK THERE'S A, A DISCONNECT BETWEEN POTENTIALLY HOW WE'RE SEEING THIS. 
          SO LET ME, UH, THIS IS, I MEAN, THOMAS' DEVELOPMENT SERVICES, SO AGAIN, LIKE USING THE EXAMPLE OF BAFFLES, RIGHT? SO I HAVE 10 SHARES, EACH ONE IS 60 CFM, THAT'S 600. 
          IF I CLOSE, LET'S SAY FIVE OF THEM WITH BAFFLES, WHAT HAPPENS TO THE OTHER FIVE? EACH ONE GONNA POTENTIALLY PULL ONE 20. 
          SO I'M BACK TO THE 600, REGARDLESS IF I HAVE ONE COVERED OR NOT. 
          NOW YOU'LL, YOU'LL END UP, THE FAN WILL RIDE THE CURVE BECAUSE YOU'VE INCREASED THE PRESSURE DROP, THE FAN WILL RIDE THE CURVE AND YOU'LL END UP PULLING SIGNIFICANT, POTENTIALLY SIGNIFICANTLY LESS C F M OUT OF THE SPACE. 
          WELL, I THINK THAT MAYBE A PARALLEL IS THE CODE REQUIRES ME TO INSTALL A G F C I, YOU KNOW, OUTLETS IN THE KITCHEN. 
          IF AFTER I PASS INSPECTION, I, I, I CHANGE THOSE BREAKERS OUT, I'M VIOLATING THE CODE. 
          BUT THAT DOESN'T, YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW WHAT I'M SAYING? LIKE, IF, IF SOMEBODY'S GONNA VIOLATE THE CODE AFTER THE FACT, THAT'S KIND OF ON THEM. 
          AND THAT'S WHERE CODE ENFORCEMENT, IF AN ACTION IS, YOU KNOW, INITIATED THAT'S, YOU KNOW, THEY WOULD BE FOUND NOT IN COMPLIANCE IF THEY WEREN'T RUNNING THE FANS AT ALL. 
          AS LONG AS WHEN IT'S BUILT, IT'S CONFORMING TO THIS. 
          UM, AND THERE'S A WAY TO INSPECT THAT. 
          YOU KNOW, THAT ALL THE FANS ARE HOOKED TOGETHER AND THAT WHEN THE LIGHT GOES ON, YOU KNOW, THE, THEY'RE ABLE TO BE POWERED THE WAY I'M READING IT, THAT TO ME WOULD SATISFY THAT PORTION OF ARE THEY GONNA CLOSE? YOU KNOW, ARE THERE BAFFLES OR ARE THEY GONNA CLOSE 'EM? I THINK WE CAN, I DON'T THINK THAT IT'S POSSIBLE FOR US TO WRITE CODE THAT PREVENTS PEOPLE FROM CHEATING, BUT, UM, NO, I'D AGREE. 
          YEAH. 
          BUT IF YOU'RE LOOKING AT THAT FROM, TO ME, IN AN INSPECTION STANDPOINT, THAT'S, IF YOU WALK UP TO A CHAIR AND IT HAS, HAS AN INTEGRAL BAFFLE OR DAMPER FROM THE MANUFACTURER, NOW YOU'VE POTENTIALLY GOT AN ISSUE WHERE, AGAIN, IT'S, IT'S, NOW, IF THEY COME BACK AFTER THE FACT AND THERE'S A, A, A GRILL STUCK ON THE, THE TABLE AND THEY DECIDE TO PUT A PIECE OF CARDBOARD OVER IT, THAT'S DIFFERENT. 
          YOU'RE RIGHT. 
          THAT'S, THAT'S THAT APPLICATION YOU'RE CHEATING AFTERWARDS. 
          BUT FROM THE UPFRONT STANDPOINT, IF YOU'RE PUTTING A CHAIR IN, THAT HAS A DAMPER IN IT TO BEGIN WITH, NOW POTENTIALLY YOU'VE GOT, YOU'VE GOT THAT, THAT PIECE. 
          RIGHT. 
          IF I'M BEATING A DEAD HORSE ON HERE, YOU GUYS TELL ME AND I'LL, I'LL  NO, I, I SEE YOUR POINT, BECAUSE NOW IT'S A U LISTED TABLE, AND IF IT HAS A DAMPER, YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO USE IT. 
          SO I, I UNDERSTAND YOUR POINT. 
          UH, SURE. 
          , EITHER WAY. 
          I MEAN, THEY STILL HAVE TO HAVE THE, THE, THAT IT'S JUST THAT, THAT'S, THAT'S THE CHANGE, THAT'S WHAT THE NEW CODE REQUIRES FOR IT TO BE OPEN. 
          UH, IF MAYBE AN OPTION WILL BE TO ADOPT IT AS WRITTEN BUT AMENDED TO SAY, TO SAY NO INDIVIDUAL, YOU KNOW, PER TABLE, NO INDIVIDUAL BAFFLES OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. 
          LET, LET'S JUST TABLE THIS ONE. 
          'CAUSE I SAID I'M, I'M GOING TO, AND WE CAN GET SOME MORE RESEARCH ON IT AND SEE IF THERE'S ANYTHING THAT ASHRAY OR OR I M C COMMITTEE TALKED ABOUT THIS OF, OF WHERE THEY WERE HEADED WITH IT. 
          YEAH, I, I THINK THAT'S FAIR. 
          THANK YOU FOR CATCHING THAT. 
          OKAY, NEXT SECTION, UH, 2021, I M C 5 0 4 0.4 0.1 FOR TERMINATION LOCATION FOR DRYER EXHAUST. 
          SO THIS IS A NEW SUBSECTION TO EXHAUST INSTALLATION. 
          UH, WE'RE PROPO, WE STAFF WOULD LIKE TO PROPOSE TO ADD, UH, AND ANY MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT AT THE END OF THE SENTENCE. 
          SO THE EXHAUST DUCT SHALL TERMINATE AT LEAST THREE FEET FROM BUILDING OPENINGS AND ANY MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT. 
          SO THOSE EXHAUST DUCTS SHOULD TERMINATE, UM, AT LEAST THREE FEET FROM ANY BUILDING OPENING AND MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT. 
          IS THAT THREE FEET REQUIREMENT NEW OR IS THAT JUST REWORDING OR CLARIFYING SOMETHING FROM THE, FROM THE PAST? SO THAT WHOLE SECTION IS NEW FOR TERMINATION REQUIREMENTS. 
          SO WHAT DOES THAT DO, UM, IN TERMS OF DESIGN, IF, YOU KNOW, YOU'VE GOT A BUILDING WITH A LOT OF WINDOWS ON THE FIRST FLOOR. 
          I MEAN, IS THAT, OH, OKAY. 
          LET, THIS IS INSPECTOR FITIA AGAIN. 
          THE, THERE IS A, UH, A SECTION ON, UH, TERMINATIONS OF EXHAUST, AND IT IS THREE FEET. 
          THE DRYER EXHAUST SHALL BE TERMINATED THREE FEET AWAY FROM ANY OPENING, INCLUDING WINDOWS, 
          [01:10:01]
DOORS. 
          BUT THEY ADDED THIS MORE TO BE MORE SPECIFIC. 
          I'M, I'M GUESSING THE WAY THEY PUT IT, THE ONLY, THE ONLY DIFFERENCE IS, IS THAT WE WANNA ADD, UH, FROM ANY, UH, EQUIPMENT, MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT. 
          AND THE REASON FOR THAT IS BECAUSE YOU GET ALL THIS LINT COMING FROM THE DRYER AND IT CLOCKS UP THE CONDENSERS. 
          AND, AND THAT'S A MAJOR ISSUE THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE. 
          EVERY TIME WE GO, THEY EVEN TRY TO MOVE IT AWAY FROM THERE. 
          SO THIS WOULD ONLY BE FOR NEW CONSTRUCTION? IT WOULD NOT BE FOR, FOR EXISTING. 
          YEAH. 
          I MEAN, I, I THINK THREE FEET FROM MECHANICAL SYSTEMS IS, IS A, IS A GOOD AMENDMENT. 
          I WAS JUST CURIOUS ABOUT IF, IF, IF THE THREE FEET FROM OPENINGS, IF THAT'S NEW. 
          IT SOUNDS LIKE IT, IT'S NOT. 
          YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT TERMINATION THAT LIKE BUILDING SOFFITS, PERFORATED SOFFITS, WHAT? WELL, THAT'S WHAT, THAT'S THE WAY IT IS. 
          BUT THIS NEW AMENDMENT, LET ME SEE, HOLD ON REAL QUICK. 
          WE FIND THAT CODE SECTION REAL QUICK, BUT YEAH, SOFFITS IS, SOFFITS IS ONE OF THEM. 
          IF IT'S A PERFORATED SOFFIT, UH, YOU KNOW, YOU CANNOT TERMINATE WITHIN THREE FEET OF THAT ANY, ANY EXHAUST. 
          SO, YOU KNOW. 
          SO A PERFORATED SOFFIT NO. 
          UP ON THE ROOF, YES. 
          ON, ON THE, ON THE SIDE OF THE HOUSE, YES. 
          THREE FEET AWAY FROM ANY WINDOW OPENING OR ANY, UH, DOOR OR ANY ACCESSING BACK INTO THE BUILDING. 
          BUT IT'S LIKE THAT NOW THOUGH. 
          IT'S NOT NOTHING NEW. 
          RIGHT, EXACTLY. 
          THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING. 
          FOR WHATEVER REASON, THEY DECIDED TO ADD IT IT'S OWN PARAGRAPH WHEN IT COMES TO DRYERS. 
          JOE, DO YOU KNOW WHAT SECTION THAT IS IN THE 2018 THAT IDENTIFIES THREE FEET FOR DRYER EXHAUST? UH, IT'S, UH, SECTION 5 0 1 0.3 0.1. 
          LOCATION OF EXHAUST OUTLETS. 
          AGAIN, JUST ASKING FOR, UH, FOR AN INTERPRETATION. 
          IT SAYS ANY OPENING INTO A BUILDING. 
          I ASSUME THAT'S ANY INTAKE. 
          WE WOULDN'T CONSIDER AN EXHAUST FROM A FURNACE OR AN EXHAUST FROM A, OKAY. 
          ANY OTHER CONCERN OR COMMENT ON THIS ONE? MAYBE JUST ADD THE WORD INTAKE TO ANY MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT. 
          THAT'S, THAT'S JUST A, THEN IT'S COVERED. 
          OKAY. 
          THE, SO JOE, IT, SO I JUST WANNA CLARIFY. 
          SO WE'RE ADDING, UH, MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT INTAKE TO THAT AMENDMENT? YEAH, LIKE I'VE GOT A HOUSE WHERE THE, THE FURNACE IS LITERALLY DIRECTLY ABOVE THE DRYER. 
          THEY BOTH GO UP RIGHT NEXT TO EACH OTHER. 
          AND, AND AGAIN, FROM A, DO WE CARE ABOUT THE, THE FLUE FROM A, FROM A FURNACE DISCHARGING WITHIN THREE FEET OF THE ROOF? JACK, IN MY CASE, OF THE ROOF JACK, UH, WHERE IT'S DISCHARGING ON THE ROOF, I DON'T THINK THERE'S AN ISSUE WITH THAT, BUT IT, AND AGAIN, I'LL APOLOGIZE, CER CERTAIN JURISDICTIONS GET WEIRD INTERPRETATIONS FROM THE I M C ALL OVER THE UNITED STATES THAT I DEAL, I DEAL WITH. 
          SO, SO, BUT THERE IS A, THERE IS A CODE SECTION FOR VENT PIPE TERMINATION. 
          SO WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THERE IS, UH, ON THE DEAL, ON, ON THE, ON THE FIELD GAS CODE, IT, IT DOES SAY THAT, YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE TO TERMINATE WITH A VENT PIPE ABOVE ANY OPENING LIKE THAT. 
          SO I DON'T, YOU KNOW, I DON'T THINK THAT WILL BE AFFECTED. 
          I I KNOW WHAT YOU'RE SAYING AND I'VE SEEN IT EVEN ON THE 90% FURNACES, IT TELLS YOU IT HAS TO BE A CERTAIN HEIGHT, BUT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE FURNACE VENT PIPE AND, AND VERSUS THAT VERSUS YOUR, YOUR DRYER. 
          BUT, UH, I DON'T, I DON'T SEE IT THAT I HAVE NEVER SEEN THAT ISSUE. 
          SO I DON'T THINK THAT, I MEAN, WE CAN ADD IT, I GUESS, OR THREE AWAY FROM ANY MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT OR ANY OPENING. 
          WELL, I MEAN 
          [01:15:01]
THAT'S, YEAH, IT'S GETTING INTO THAT DEFINITION OF WHAT IS AN OPENING. 
          YES. 
          IS AN EXHAUST AND OPENING, IS AN INTAKE AN OPENING OR ARE THEY BOTH OPENINGS? I JUST, I'M CONCERNED IF WE SAY THE WORD INTAKE, YOU KNOW, A, UM, AN OUTSIDE AC UNIT, IS THAT CONSIDERED AN INTAKE, EVEN THOUGH IT'S JUST THE FAN IS JUST COOLING THE, THE COILS, YOU KNOW, AND, AND I THINK THE MAIN INTENT IS TO KEEP IT AWAY FROM, OR NOT THE MAIN INTENT, BUT A INTENT IS TO KEEP IT AWAY FROM THOSE. 
          SO IF WE SAID INTAKE, IT MIGHT INADVERTENTLY CHANGE THAT. 
          HAVE YOU EVER SEEN A CONDENSING UNIT ANYWHERE NEAR A, A, UH, CLOSED DRYER? IT GETS A REALLY GOOD FILTER ON THE COIL . 
          WELL, I GUESS IF WE CALL IT A MECHANICAL INTAKE, THEN THE, THE, UH, THE CONDENSER AIR INTAKE ON A, ON AN AC UNIT, IT WOULD BE COVERED TOO. 
          SO I WANNA CLARIFY. 
          SO ARE WE KEEPING THE INTAKE OR WHERE, WHERE ARE WE STAYING ON THIS RIGHT NOW? I, I'D LIKE TO INCLUDE THE WORD INTAKE, MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT INTAKE. 
          THEN IT'S, IT'S VERY EXPLICIT THAT IT'S, IT'S NOT A DISCHARGE, IT'S AN INTAKE WHERE IT WOULD PULL THE, THE LINT INTO A PIECE OF A MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT. 
          SO, SO MAYBE WE SHOULD SAY ANY MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT AND MECHANICAL INTAKE. 
          SURE. 
          SO I JUST WANNA UNDERSTAND. 
          SO BEING WE CAN, MECHANICAL INTAKE IS OUR, NEAR THE MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT, WE'RE WORRIED ABOUT THE IT BUILDING UP ON THE COILS THEMSELVES. 
          SO WE JUST BEING ANYWHERE NEAR IT IS THE CONCERN AND NOT JUST A, A DIRECT POOL INTO THE SYSTEM. 
          YEAH, I GUESS, YOU KNOW, ADDING A, A CONDENSING UNIT AND, AND AS YOU, YOU'VE RUN INTO IT TOO, THEN, UH, I HADN'T EVEN THOUGHT ABOUT A CONDENSING UNIT SITTING OUTSIDE, BUT, UH, MY, MY MORE CONCERN WAS, AGAIN, I DON'T REALLY, I'M NOT REALLY CONCERNED IF THERE IS A DISCHARGE NEAR A DRYER VENT. 
          NO BIG DEAL. 
          I AM CONCERNED THAT IF IT WERE AN INTAKE OF ANY TYPE, WHETHER IT'S FRESH AIR, WHETHER IT'S ATTIC VENTILATION, AIR, YOU KNOW, FROM THE, THE, THE NATURAL VENTILATION AND INTAKE, IF IT'S AN EX GO TO, GO TO A, GO TO A, UH, UH, WHAT WOULD YOU CALL IT? THE, UH, OH GOODNESS, I CAN'T THINK OF THE WORD. 
          AT THE, AT THE RIDGE LINE. 
          A RIDGE VENT. 
          YES. 
          YOU KNOW, WHAT IF, IF IT DOESN'T SAY INTAKE AND IT JUST SAYS ANY OPENING A RIDGE VENT IS AN OPENING INTO THE BUILDING, AND IN THEORY, WE COULD GET POPPED ON THAT. 
          AND THAT IS CORRECT. 
          AND THAT'S THE WAY, THAT'S THE WAY WE EN ENFORCE IT. 
          THAT IS A, AN OPENING. 
          SO IF YOU HAVE LENT COMING OUTTA THERE, IT'LL GO RIGHT BACK INTO THE, THROUGH, THROUGH THE MENT, SO, OR PERFORATED SOFFIT. 
          SO THAT'S WHY WE, WE EXPEND THE THREE FEET. 
          NOW, THE OUTSIDE AIR INTAKE, THERE IS, UH, THERE IS A CODE TELLING YOU HOW FAR AWAY YOU HAVE TO BE FROM ANY EXHAUST. 
          SO THAT WOULD ELIMINATE THE, THE DRYER INTAKE FROM BEING TOO CLOSE. 
          THIS IS OMAR WITH BIO MECHANICAL. 
          BEFORE YOU START, CAN YOU JUST SAY YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS, IS THAT CORRECT ADDRESS PLEASE, OMAR? WITH BIOMECHANICAL, UM, ON THE, IF YOU, IF WE'RE READ AT THE CODE SECTION, IT DOES SAY IN ANY DIRECTIONS, IN ANY DIRECTION FROM OPENINGS INTO BUILDINGS. 
          SO I THINK FOR ME, THAT WOULD CLASSIFY AS THE INTAKE. 
          SO THAT'S THE WAY IT'S ACTUALLY WRITTEN. 
          IT SAYS OPENINGS INTO A BUILDING. 
          SO THAT IS ANOTHER WAY OF SAYING INTAKE, I GUESS. 
          YEAH, THAT WORKS WELL. 
          AND, AND AGAIN, JUST FROM WHAT YOU'VE SAID, A RIDGE VENT, WHICH I WOULD NORMALLY WOULD SAY WOULD BE A DISCHARGE, 'CAUSE THE HEAT IS EXITING THE BUILDING, BUT IF YOU'RE CONCERNED ABOUT A RIDGE VENT, THEN IT'S, THEN IT'S JUST AN OPENING BECAUSE, AND THE REASON FOR THAT IS 'CAUSE YOU NEVER KNOW HOW THE WIND BLOWS. 
          YOU GET THAT STUFF OUT THERE AND IT'LL CLOG UP THE MENT, ESPECIALLY WHEN IT'S NOT INSTALLED PROPERLY. 
          YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO HAVE A TWO INCH GAP AND YOU KNOW, THE ROOFERS COME AND THEY JUST, YOU KNOW, HAVE A QUARTER INCH AND THEN YOU GOT THIS, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE BLOWING OUT DRIER, YOU KNOW, LINT EVERYWHERE. 
          THE WIND JUST PICKS IT UP A CERTAIN WAY AND THEN CLOCKS UP THAT HALF INCH. 
          SO WE CONSIDER THAT AN OPENING INTO THE BUILDING, SO THEY HAVE TO BE THREE FEET AWAY. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          I, I'LL LET IT RUN, I GUESS. 
          SO MAYBE WE DON'T NEED THE AMENDMENT AT ALL. 
          NOT, NOT TO CHANGE IT, NOT TO DO THE INTAKE, BUT KEEP THE, THE MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT. 
          YEAH, I THINK THE MAN MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT ADDITION IS, IS A GOOD AND RIGHT THING TO DO IS, YOU KNOW, WE'VE TALKED AROUND THAT QUITE A BIT AND, AND WITH THE POTENTIAL OF LINT BUILDUP AROUND AC EQUIPMENT OR OTHER ITEMS AS FAR AS THAT GOES, I THINK IS SOMETHING THAT WE NEED TO BE CONCERNED WITH. 
          I AGREE WITH THAT. 
          WE SPEND A GOOD DEAL OF TIME EVERY SPRING CLEANING THOSE THINGS OFF, AND SOME OF 'EM HAVE FUR COATS ON WHEN WE GET TO 'EM, SO 
          [01:20:03]
WE'LL JUST LEAVE IT AS WRITTEN AND MOVE ON. 
          YOU OKAY WITH THAT? OKAY, WE'LL DO THAT. 
          IS, UH, WE'VE BEEN GOING ABOUT AN HOUR AND A HALF NOW. 
          DO WE WANT TO TAKE A, A SHORT BREAK OR DO Y'ALL WANNA JUST KEEP GOING? I CAN USE A, MAYBE JUST, WE'LL TAKE A FIVE, FIVE MINUTES. 
          DOES THAT WORK FOR EVERYBODY? ALRIGHT. 
          ALRIGHT, I THINK WE'LL GO AHEAD AND, UH, GET STARTED AGAIN. 
          AND I THINK THE, UM, OMAR, WE'RE GONNA LET YOU GO AHEAD AND SAY YOUR PIECE SO YOU DON'T HAVE TO SIT THROUGH THE REST OF IT. 
          I APPRECIATE YOU COMING IN. 
          UM, SO MY CONCERN ON THIS, UH, SECTION WAS ADOPTED IN, UH, 2018. 
          I WAS NOT, UH, IN SAN ANTONIO AT THE TIME, BUT THIS IS SOMETHING WE'VE BEEN COMING ACROSS, UH, OFTEN NOW. 
          SO I, UH, I WOULD LIKE TO TAKE THE OPPORTUNITY TO AT LEAST BRING IT UP AND JUST SEE WHAT, WHAT YOU ALL THINK AND SEE IF WE CAN MIX SOMETHING ABOUT IT. 
          UH, IN 2018, IT, THE SECTION OF THE ENERGY CODE 4 0 3 0.7 0.7 SHOT OF DAMPERS, THE EXCEPTIONS. 
          ONE OF THE EXCEPTIONS IS, OR THE EXCEPTION IS NON-MOTORIZED GRAVITY DAMPERS SHALL BE AN ALTERNATIVE TO MODERNIZE DAMPERS FOR EXHAUST AND RELIEF OPENINGS AS FOLLOWS. 
          UH, BEFORE 2018, THE THIS EXCEPTION DIDN'T SPECIFY THAT IT WAS FOR EXHAUST AND RELIEF. 
          UM, WHERE WE'VE COME ACROSS THIS ISSUE, IT'S ESPECIALLY ON INTAKES FOR V R F SYSTEMS OR SPLIT SYSTEMS WHERE YOU HAVE A GRAVITY DAMPER JUST, UH, DIRECTLY TO THE, OR AN OPENING FOR THE OUTSIDE AIR DIRECTLY CONNECTED TO THIS AIR HANDLER. 
          UM, I THINK IT'S, UH, COST PROHIBITED FOR THE BENEFIT IN MY PERSPECTIVE AS, UH, IF YOU'RE, IF YOU'RE GONNA HAVE EXHAUST GRAVITY DAMPERS, BUT INTAKE MOTORIZED DAMPERS, I DON'T REALLY SEE THE, THE BENEFIT OF ENERGY SAVINGS VERSUS COST OF, FOR THE MOTORIZED DAMPER, WHERE IF THE FAN IS NOT RUNNING FOR THE AIR HANDLER, THE FAN COIL, THE THE INTAKE WILL REALLY NOT BE, OR THE INFILTRATION WILL REALLY NOT PRE BE BROUGHT IN, IF THAT MAKES SENSE. 
          ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT FRESH AIR IN, INTO, UH, COMMER RESIDENTIAL OR WHAT? UH, COMMERCIAL. 
          SO WHAT, UM, MAYBE IT HELP CLARIFY YOUR COMMENTS. 
          DO YOU HAVE A RECOMMENDATION ON WHAT, WHAT THAT WOULD READ TO BE, TO BE BETTER IN YOUR OPINION? IN MY OPINION, I THINK IT IS THE EXCEPTION SHOULD APPLY FOR INTAKE AS WELL AS WE ARE, UH, IN CLIMATE ZONES. 
          UH, WHICH NOW IN 2021, IT'S, UH, FOR ZONE 0 1, 2, AND THREE, UH, IN 2018 WAS JUST, UH, ONE, TWO, AND THREE, I BELIEVE. 
          UH, BUT I THINK THESE, THESE THREE EXCEPTIONS SHOULD APPLY FOR INTAKE AS WELL. 
          SO CURRENTLY THE EXCEPTION IS JUST FOR OUT, UH, JUST FOR, UM, EXHAUST COST AND RELIEF. 
          CORRECT. 
          SO, SO MY INPUT ON THAT IS I, I COULD POTENTIALLY AGREE WITH YOU ON A DUCTED RETURN SYSTEM WHERE YOU'RE PULLING YOUR OUTSIDE AREA IN, I THINK WITH A LOT OF FAN COILS, AND PARTICULARLY WITH LIKE A V R F WHERE IT IS INDUCTED OR A VERY SHORT DUCT LENGTH, IN MY EXPERIENCE, A BACK A, A BACKDRAFT OR A GRAVITY DAMPER REQUIRES 0.05 INCHES OF WATER TO OPEN AND OPEN FULLY MM-HMM. 
          , OR AT LEAST, YOU KNOW, AND I THINK THAT'S THE PROBLEM IS, UH, PARTICULARLY WITH A PLENUM RETURN SYSTEM, YOUR, YOUR RETURN SIDE OF THE, OF THE UNIT JUST DOESN'T HAVE ENOUGH NEGATIVE STATIC TO FORCE THE GRAVITY DAMPER OPEN. 
          AND I, AND IF WE WANTED TO LOOK AT IT AS PART OF THE I E C C, I COULD MAYBE SEE IF, IF WE'RE, UH, YOU KNOW, THE FLIP SIDE OF THAT IS NOW YOU'RE PUTTING A DAMPER, UM, LET'S SAY IT'S A PLENUM RETURN, YOU'RE PUTTING A DAMPER IN THE INLET TO THAT, THAT RETURN DUCT AND HAVING TO FORCE AN ARTIFICIAL PRESSURE DROP ON ON THE, THE FAN. 
          AND SO NOW YOU'RE EXPENDING FAN ENERGY TO CREATE ENOUGH NEGATIVE TO FORCE THAT GRAVITY DAMPER OPEN AND, AND CORRECT. 
          NOW YOU'VE GOT A TRADE OFF OF A OF A HUNDRED DOLLARS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT FOR A MOTORIZED CORRECT. 
          AS OPPOSED TO YOU'RE BURNING, YOU KNOW, $10, I'LL MAKE UP A NUMBER $10 A YEAR. 
          RIGHT. 
          AND, AND, UH, EXTRA FAN ENERGY, YOU KNOW. 
          SO I THINK THAT'S IT. 
          I KNOW IN, IN, IN PREVIOUS VERSIONS OF THE I E C C, THEY LOOKED AT SOME OF THAT AS ABOUT A SEVEN YEAR PAYBACK. 
          AND SO THAT'S KIND OF WHERE I MADE MY NUMBERS UP FROM AGAIN. 
          MM-HMM. 
           KNOW IF THEY'RE TRUE OR NOT. 
          UH, BUT THAT'S 
          [01:25:01]
PROBABLY WHY I THINK IF WE WANTED TO LOOK AT THIS AS PART OF THE I E C C STANDPOINT, WE COULD ALWAYS LOOK AT IT AND MAYBE PUT IN, UH, SOMETHING IN THERE FOR THAT POINT IF, IF IT WERE A DUCTED RETURN, POTENTIALLY ALLOW A GRAVITY DAMPER INTO IT. 
          BUT, BUT FROM A PLENUM RETURN, YOU JUST CAN'T. 
          IT'S GOTTA BE A, IT'S GOTTA BE A MOTORIZED DAMPER ON A PLENUM RETURN FOR SURE, IN MY MIND. 
          SO WOULD IT BE APPROPRIATE, SINCE THIS COMMITTEE DOESN'T HAVE AUTHORITY TO ADOPT OR NOT ADOPT I E C C, MAKE AN OFFICIAL REC REQUEST FROM THIS COMMITTEE TO THE I E C C SUBCOMMITTEE TO SPECIFICALLY LOOK AT FOR, UH, THIS IS JEREMY MCDONALD, 4 0 3 7 7? UH, I DON'T THINK WE NEED AN OFFICIAL REQUEST. 
          I MEAN, IT DEFINITELY, THIS IS COMING IN FROM THE PUBLIC. 
          UM, WE'RE GONNA BE SEEING A LOT OF THIS. 
          WE'RE DEFINITELY PUSHING, UH, THE PUBLIC COMMENT AND GETTING IT OUT THERE AND, AND FIRST D S D WILL LOOK AT IT AND SEE IF IT'S SOMETHING WE HAVE. 
          UM, IF NOT, WE WILL AT LEAST BRING IT UP AND HAVE A PUBLIC COMMENT TO THAT COMMITTEE AND SAY, LOOK, THIS WAS BROUGHT UP. 
          INVITE OMAR TO COME BACK AT ANY TIME DURING THOSE THAT I'VE ALREADY PROVIDED THEM WITH THE DATES FOR THOSE MEETINGS. 
          UH, BUT I WOULD, I WOULD RECOMMEND THAT WE DON'T MAKE ANY ACTION WHATSOEVER. 
          RECOMMENDATIONS, REALLY JUST KIND OF TAKE IT A LITTLE BIT OF DIALOGUE WE'VE HAD, I THINK IS PROBABLY KIND OF PUSHING IT AND THEN KIND OF PUT IT AT THERE. 
          UH, BUT YEAH, IT'S DEFINITELY, YOU KNOW, I THINK, GREG, YOU'RE ON THAT COMMITTEE IF I'M CORRECT, SO YES, YOU KNOW, IT'S GOOD THAT, YOU KNOW, IT'D BE SOMETHING WE'RE TALKING ABOUT AND THINKING ABOUT BEFORE WE GET INTO THAT, BUT IT'LL EITHER BE SOMETHING SPECIFIC FROM D S D, WE'LL LOOK AT THAT ON OUR SIDE. 
          IF WE DON'T FEEL THE NEED, THEN IT'S DEFINITELY STILL OPEN FOR, UH, PUBLIC COMMENTS TO BRING TO THE COMMITTEE AND THEN LATER TO THE BOARD AS, AS NEEDED AS WELL. 
          BUT WE ALSO WANNA MAKE SURE THAT ALL STAKEHOLDERS THAT ARE IMPACTED BY THIS, ESPECIALLY WITH THE ENERGY CODE, THERE ARE A LOT OF STAKEHOLDERS THAT ARE NOT GONNA BE PART OF SOME OF THESE MEETINGS ARE INVOLVED AND, AND CAN, YOU KNOW, LOOK AT THOSE AS WELL AT THAT TIME. 
          I MEAN, I THINK THAT MAKES SENSE. 
          I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT, YOU KNOW, OMAR'S, UH, CONCERNS ARE ADDRESSED BY THE APPROPRIATE PLACE. 
          AND IF, IF YOU'RE SAYING THAT'S THE WAY WE DO IT, THEN I, I'M PERFECTLY SATISFIED WITH THAT, CORRECT. 
          YEAH, WE ARE, WE ARE GONNA BE LOOKING AT THAT AND IT'LL DEFINITELY BE BROUGHT BEFORE THAT COMMITTEE. 
          YEAH, I APPRECIATE THAT. 
          THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR BRINGING IT UP. 
          THANK YOU GUYS. 
          OKAY, NEXT ITEM FOR REVIEW IS CURRENT COSA AMENDMENT 5 0 5 0.6. 
          SO THE TITLE OF THIS ONE IS OTHER THAN OUR OCCUPANCIES, AND THIS IS IN RELATION TO REQUIRING A PORTABLE FIRE EXTINGUISHER AND OTHER THAN OUR OCCUPANCIES. 
          UM, SO WE'RE PROPOSING TO REMOVE THIS AMENDMENT. 
          THIS IS COVERED IN THE I F C 9 0 6 0.1. 
          UM, AND OUR MECHANICAL FOLKS AREN'T LOOKING FOR THIS, SO WE FELT THAT IT WAS A, AN OPPORTUNITY TO REMOVE IT. 
          SO REMOVING THIS DOESN'T ADD OR RE REMOVE A REQUIREMENT FOR FIRE EXTINGUISHERS THAT WE MIGHT ALREADY HAVE. 
          IT JUST MOVES IT BACK TO THE APPROPRIATE INSPECTOR, IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING? CORRECT. 
          EXACTLY. 
          YEAH, THIS IS REDUNDANT FROM THE FIRE CODE GREG. 
          RON'S GOT ANY. 
          ALRIGHT, SOUNDS GOOD. 
          SOUNDS LIKE A DOUBLE FOOT STOMP AND WE DON'T NEED THAT. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          I'M ALL FOR MAKING THINGS THAT ARE EASY, EASY. 
          SO LET'S KEEP GOING. 
          UH, NEXT ONE IS A CURRENT CSA AMENDMENT 6 0 6 0.2 THAT WE ARE RECOMMENDING TO KEEP THIS SECTION IS REFERENCING N F P A 90 A FOR INSTALLATION INSTRUCTIONS FOR SMOKE DETECTORS. 
          ANY PROBLEM WITH THIS ONE? GOOD. 
          ALL RIGHT, WELL NEXT, IF YOU NEED MORE TIME TO LOOK AT IT, SAY, SO I DON'T WANNA SKIP PAST ANYBODY'S COMMENTS. 
          NEXT ITEM, NEXT ITEM IS 6 0 7 0.4 ACCESS AND IDENTIFICATION FOR FIRE AND SMOKE DAMPERS. 
          THIS IS A NEW SUBSECTION IN THE 2021. 
          THIS IS ONE I'M JUST GONNA ASK THE QUESTION ON, BECAUSE I KNOW IN HEALTHCARE OCCUPANCIES THAT I, THAT I PREVIOUSLY WORKED ON, WE WERE SEEING THIS BEING BROUGHT INTO EFFECT ON EXISTING BUILDINGS. 
          SO AGAIN, IS THE INTENT TO BRING THIS IN AS OTHER CODES DRAG IT IN? UM, I JUST KNOW A LOT OF PROJECTS I'VE BEEN DOING ON HEALTHCARE WAS A LOT OF FAN RESIN TAGS HANGING FROM CEILINGS. 
          [01:30:08]
WHAT'S YOUR QUESTION SPECIFICALLY, GREG? UM, JUST THAT, THAT THIS IS GONNA BE IN IF OTHER CODES, AND I THINK IT'S, YOU KNOW, N F P A THAT'S, I'M GONNA SAY 1 0 1 AND I'M NOT SURE THAT'S EXACTLY A HUNDRED PERCENT RIGHT ON EXISTING HEALTHCARE OCCUPANCIES IS WHERE I WAS SEEING SOME OF THAT, THAT OTHER, OTHER CODES WERE ADOPTING THIS OR, OR FORCING IT INTO AN EXISTING OCCUPANCY. 
          SO IT WAS JUST KIND OF A QUESTION TO OUR CODE ENFORCEMENT PEOPLE OF, IF THEY'RE SEEING ANYTHING LIKE THAT ON THAT, LIKE RETROACTIVE OR DURING REMODELS RETROACTIVE NO, IT, IT WAS RETROACTIVE THAT THEY WERE HAVING TO GO IN AND, AND ADD THAT TO EXISTING FIRE DAMPERS? NO, IT, WE, THE WAY WE LOOK AT THAT IS IT'S AN EXISTING BUILDING, SO WE'RE NOT, YOU KNOW, MAKING THEM, YOU KNOW, WELL, YOU HAVE A FIRE DUMPER HERE IS YOU NEED A BIGGER DOOR. 
          WE, WE WE'RE NOT DOING THAT. 
          OKAY. 
          UH, LIKE I SAID, AGAIN, IT WAS JUST A MORE OF A QUESTION TO OUR CODE ENFORCEMENT PEOPLE THAN IT WAS TO ADOPTION OF THE CODE. 
          THIS IS EMIN THOMAS DEVELOPMENT SERVICES, JUST F Y I, WE DO NOT, UH, ADOPT OR ENFORCE N F P 1 0 1. 
          YEAH, THIS, THAT WAS FEDERAL, FEDERAL GOVERNMENT PROJECTS. 
          GOOD TO MOVE ALONG. 
          OKAY. 
          ALRIGHT, WE'LL MOVE ON TO THE NEXT ONE. 
          NEXT ITEM 6 0 7 0.5 0.2, DUCT PENETRATIONS OF FIRE BARRIERS. 
          THERE'S A NEW EXCEPTION IN THE CODE FOR DUCTS THAT PENETRATE THE FIRE BARRIERS. 
          IT ALLOWS FOR THAT FLEXIBLE DUCT CONNECTOR, UH, FOR FULLY DUCTED HVAC SYSTEM. 
          AND THIS IS, IS KIND OF WHAT WE'RE SEEING IN A TYPICAL INSTALLATION. 
          SO AGAIN, IT'S JUST A, AN ADDITIONAL EXCEPTION TO NOT REQUIRE FIRE SMOKE DAMPERS WHEN DUCKS PENETRATE FIRE BARRIERS. 
          YEAH, I DON'T HAVE ANY ISSUE WITH THAT ONE. 
          I'VE RUN INTO THAT ONE BEFORE TOO. 
          WE HAD, NOT IN THE CITY OF SAN ANTONIO, BUT OTHER JURISDICTIONS WERE NOT CONSIDERING FLEXIBLE DUCT. 
          SO THAT'S, I THINK PROBABLY WHY THEY ADDED THAT TO THE I M C. 
          SO I'M, I'M PERFECTLY OKAY WITH THAT. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          EVERYBODY ELSE? GOOD. 
          ALL RIGHT, NEXT PLEASE. 
          UH, 6 0 7 0.5 0.5. 
          THIS IS A CHANGE TO, UH, AN EXISTING SECTION AS WRITTEN. 
          THIS IS REALLY JUST ADDING CONSISTENCY IN THE CODE THAT SMOKE DAMPERS HAVE, UH, THE REQUIREMENTS FOR SMOKE DAMPERS WERE ALREADY IN THERE. 
          THEY'RE JUST ADDING THE SAME REQUIREMENTS FOR FIRE DAMPERS. 
          SOUNDS LIKE WE'RE GOOD WITH THAT. 
          ALRIGHT, MOVING ALONG QUICKLY. 
          8 0 1 POINT 21 BLOCKED VENT SWITCH. 
          THIS IS A NEW SECTION ADDING ADDITIONAL SAFETY DEVICE FOR OIL FIRED APPLIANCES TO BE CONSISTENT WITH WHAT IS REQUIRED FOR GAS FIRED APPLIANCES. 
          OKAY, WE'RE ON A ROLL. 
          LET'S KEEP, KEEP GOING. 
          SO NEXT ITEM, NEXT SECTION. 
          THIS IS A NEW SECTION FOR UNVENTED ALCOHOL FUEL BURNING DECORATIVE APPLIANCES. 
          SO A NEW SECTION AND DEFINITION FOR NEW DECORATIVE APPLIANCES. 
          SOME FOLKS MUST BE SEEING IT'S FINE BY ME. 
          SEEMS LIKE WE'RE OKAY WITH IT AFTER. 
          I WON'T DELAY THE MEETING. 
          I'D LOVE FOR SOMEBODY TO TELL ME WHAT THAT ACTUALLY IS AFTER THIS, BUT I'M LOOKING FOR A PICTURE FOR YOU. 
          IT'S, IT'S KINDA LIKE STERNO THROWN INTO A FAKE FIREPLACE. 
          OKAY. 
          YEP. 
          THAT'S PROBABLY THE BEST EXPLANATION YOU CAN HAVE. 
          OKAY, GOOD. 
          NEXT ITEM IS AN EXISTING COSA AMENDMENT FOR 1101 POINT 10 FOR LOCKING ACCESS PORT CAP. 
          SO WE ADDED THE EXCEPTION THAT A TAMPER RESISTANT CAP IS NOT REQUIRED, UM, WHERE CONDENSERS ARE LOCATED IN A FULL, IN A YARD, FULLY ENCLOSED WITH A PERMANENT BARRIER, NOT LESS THAN SIX FEET. 
          SO I WILL, UH, I'LL ADMIT TO BEING THE, THE PROGENITOR OF THIS PARTICULAR AMENDMENT. 
          UM, AND I, AND I, IN FACT, I'D LIKE TO MAYBE PROPOSE THAT WE TAKE IT A STEP FURTHER AND AMEND OUT OF COMPO THE CODE COMPLETELY. 
          UH, 1101 POINT 
          [01:35:01]
10. 
          SO THIS LOCKING CAP, UM, FROM TALKING WITH PREVIOUS, I THINK STARTING TWO CODE CYCLES AGO I STARTED ON THIS, UM, YOU KNOW, IT WAS A, YOU KNOW, LIFE SAFETY CRUSADE BY SOMEBODY AT THE, AT THE I CODE COMMITTEES THAT GOT THIS GOING. 
          UM, THIS IS NOT A, THIS IS NOT A SITUATION WHERE, UH, THERE'S A, AN EXISTING DANGER, I DON'T THINK, ESPECIALLY NOW THAT MOST SYSTEMS HAVE MOVED ON FROM R 22. 
          UM, AND IT JUST ADDS COST TO WHAT I WOULD SAY IS VERY LITTLE BENEFIT THESE, THESE LOCKING CAPS. 
          UM, AND SO THAT WOULD BE MY SUGGESTION IS THAT WE AMEND, UH, 11 0 1 10 OUT COMPLETELY IS THE AMENDMENT. 
          CAN YOU BRING, UH, I THINK ONE THAT THAT'S ALLOWING THEM TO NOT PUT THE CAP ON? IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE AIMING FOR? SO THE FIRST STEP OF MY MULTI-STEP MASTER PLAN  WAS TO, TO JUST GET, UH, ESTABLISH SOME HISTORY OF NOT HAVING THE LOCKING CAP. 
          SO INITIALLY IT WAS, THEY WERE REQUIRED EVERYWHERE WE PUT IT TO WHERE, YOU KNOW, MOST NEW SINGLE FAMILY CONSTRUCTION HAS A, LIKE A PRIVACY FENCE UP. 
          SO FOR THE, IF THE UNIT IS BEHIND THE PRIVACY FENCE, WE DON'T NEED THE LOCKING CAP. 
          UM, IF IT'S AN APARTMENT COMPLEX BEHIND, YOU KNOW, A FENCE, UH, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THOSE GATED COMMUNITIES, YOU DON'T NEED THE LOCKING CAP. 
          UM, I, YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW THAT WE'VE HAD, UM, A LOT OF, A LOT OF REFRIGERANT THEFT LATELY. 
          RIGHT. 
          UH, IN, IN THAT REGARD. 
          SO, I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY IT DOESN'T OUTLAW THE LOCKING CAPS IF YOU WANT TO PUT 'EM ON BECAUSE YOU'RE WORRIED ABOUT SOMEBODY COMING TO TAKE YOUR REFRIGERANT. 
          I JUST, YOU KNOW, IT WAS ORIGINALLY INTENDED THAT, YOU KNOW, KIDS WERE GOING OUT AND, AND BUSTING LINES TO, TO HUFF R 22. 
          AND I JUST DON'T SEE THAT AS A, AS A PROBLEM, UH, THAT WARRANTS, UM, THE EXPENSE THAT THIS ADDS TO, TO INSTALLATIONS. 
          IF I COULD MAKE A POINT OF CLARIFICATION, THE, THIS IS FOR, UM, COMMERCIAL INSTALLATIONS ONLY. 
          UM, NEXT TIME WE WILL TALK ABOUT, UH, SINGLE FAMILY, UH, THE ONE AND TWO FAMILY DWELLINGS. 
          I'LL BRING IT UP THEN TOO. 
          BUT MY POINT STANDS, I GUESS, FOR, FOR COMMERCIAL. 
          UM, I JUST, YOU KNOW, AND, AND YOU KNOW, WE DO A LOT OF REPLACEMENT SYSTEMS AND, UM, I'M VERY COST CON, YOU KNOW, CONSCIOUS ABOUT, AND IT'S ALL OLDER PROPERTIES, NOT FENCED, NOT GATED, UM, HAVE NOT HAD A, AN INSTANCE WHERE PEOPLE ARE, YOU KNOW, A CERTAINLY LIFE AND DEATH THING WHERE KIDS ARE HUFFING THE, THE REFRIGERANT AND DYING. 
          THAT'S NEVER HAPPENED. 
          UM, WE, I DON'T, YOU KNOW, USUALLY IF THEY'RE GONNA STEAL SOMETHING, THEY'LL JUST TAKE THE, THE, THE WHOLE UNIT, UM, FOR THE COPPER AND EVERYTHING. 
          SO I, I JUST, YOU KNOW, I THINK WE HAVE A RESPONSIBILITY TO MANAGE AS WE ADD COSTS IN SOME PLACES. 
          WE SHOULD LOOK FOR PLACES TO REDUCE COSTS, AND I THINK THIS IS AN AREA WHERE WE CAN ACHIEVE THAT, UH, SAFELY AND, AND WITHOUT DEGRADING THE QUALITY OF LIFE OF THE CITIZENS OF SAN ANTONIO. 
          YEAH, I I WAS GONNA SAY TH THIS, IT'S ALL RIGHT. 
          HELP ME OUT HERE AGAIN, I HAVEN'T HAD ALL MY CAFFEINE TODAY. 
          1101 0.9 IS TALKING ABOUT THE LOCKING ACCESS PORT CAPS. 
          IT IS NOT 1101 POINT 10 IN THE NEW VERSION, JUST TO MAKE SURE WE'RE IN THE RIGHT PLACE. 
          I, I, I'M WITH YOU. 
          11 DASH ONE. 
          YEAH, I, I, I'M WITH YOU ON MINIMIZING THE NEED FOR LOCKING CAPS. 
          I, I LIKE YOUR OTHER EXCEPTION THAT'S ADDED IN THERE. 
          UM, I KNOW A LOT OF MY BUDDIES WHO ARE H V A C TECHNICIANS HATE THOSE THINGS, . 
          UH, SO I, I I WOULD DEFINITELY, IF WE CAN'T GET EVERYBODY TO GO ALONG NECESSARILY FOR REMOVING THEM, UM, I, I LIKE THE EXCEPTION THAT YOU PUT IN THERE. 
          I I, I, I HAVE NO ISSUE WITH EXPANDING IT FROM WHAT'S IN 1101 0.9 NOW, FOR AN EXCEPTION, YOU KNOW, WHERE IT'S CONTROLLED ACCESS. 
          I'M WITH YOU ON, IF, IF IT'S JUST BEHIND A FENCE ON ANYWHERE, I, I KINDA GO WITH YOU. 
          I MEAN, JUST TO BE CLEAR, WHERE I'M TRYING TO GET TO IS, IT DOESN'T, THE FENCE IS IR IS, IS IRRELEVANT TO WHETHER OR NOT THE LOCKING CAP IS REQUIRED. 
          SO IT SOUNDS LIKE THE PROPOSAL, AND THANKS FOR THE CLARIFICATION. 
          UM, THIS IS STILL, UH, THE SECTION NUMBER FROM THE 2018. 
          SO IS THE RECOMMENDATION TO COMPLETELY AMEND OUT 1101 0.9 FROM THE 2021? THAT, THAT'S WHAT I'M, THAT'S WHAT I'M RECOMMENDING. 
          AND I MEAN, IT'S NOT GONNA HURT MY FEELINGS IF Y'ALL DISAGREE. 
          I WANT WE'LL WILLING TO HAVE THE CONVERSATION. 
          I JUST, I FEEL LIKE IT'S SOMETHING THAT IS NOT REALLY NECESSARY AND IT'S A, IT'S A WAY TO SAVE, SAVE SOME COST ON NEW SYSTEMS. I, I'D ASK OUR CITY FOLKS, ARE WE SEEING AN INCREASE LIKE REFRIGERANT THEFTS OR, I MEAN, DO YOU, DO YOU THINK THESE THINGS ARE GIVING US A BENEFIT? UH, WELL, I MEAN, I'LL BE HONEST, I JUST STARTED IT, SO I'M, I'M GOING TO KEEP GOING. 
          I, I, I DIDN'T EVEN, I I NEVER UNDERSTOOD WHAT A SIX FOOT FENCE RULE, HOW DID THAT EVEN APPLY? I'LL BE HONEST WITH YOU, IF YOU LOOK AT THE EXCEPTION, 
          [01:40:01]
IT DOES SAY THAT THIS DOES APPLY TO UNITS THAT ARE ON THE ROOF OR, YOU KNOW, UH, THE, THIS SECTION SHALL NOT APPLY TO REFRIGERATOR, CIRCUIT ACCESS, PORTION EQUIPMENT, INSTALLING CONTROL AREAS SUCH AS ON ROOF WITH LOCK ACCESS, HATCHES OR DOORS. 
          UH, I MEAN, IF THEY'RE BEHIND ANY FANS, THAT'S, SO THAT TO ME, THAT'S CONTROL. 
          YOU SHOULDN'T, IF YOU'RE NOT WELCOME THERE, YOU SHOULDN'T EVEN BE THERE IN THE FIRST PLACE. 
          SO, YOU KNOW, SIX FOOT FANS, THAT'S WHY I NEVER UNDERSTOOD THAT. 
          BUT AS FAR AS IF PEOPLE ARE GONNA VIOLATE A LAW AND BREAK INTO SOMEBODY'S YARD OR SOMETHING TO STEAL REFRIGERANT, THEY'RE GONNA CARRY, THERE'S A LOCKING CAP OR NOT, THEY'RE GONNA CUT THE PIPES AND JUST DO IT. 
          YEAH, I THINK FOR MY THOUGHT PROCESS, AND THIS WAS MORE OF THE, AGAIN, THE COMMERCIAL STRIP MALL THAT MIGHT HAVE A SPLIT DX UNIT IN THE, UH, THE, THE CONDENSING UNIT, SETTING ON THE BACKSIDE WHERE IT'S EASY TO DRIVE UP, JUMP OUT, THROW SOME HOSES IN A RECOVERY UNIT AND, AND YOU PULL IT OUT. 
          BUT AGAIN, THAT'S WHY I'M ASKING IS I DON'T EVEN KNOW HOW MUCH, HOW EXPENSIVE THOSE CAPS ARE. 
          THEY, WE, I CAN'T REMEMBER. 
          BUT I MEAN, IT WAS NOT INSIGNIFICANT WHEN WE TALKED ABOUT IT THREE YEARS AGO, FOUR YEARS AGO, WHENEVER WE DID IT. 
          AND AGAIN, IT'S NOT THE, THE INTENT OF THE, OF THAT CODE, AS I UNDERSTAND, IT HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THEFT BECAUSE, UH, THE COMPETENT, IF YOU'RE COMPETENT ENOUGH TO HOOK UP HOSES AND STEAL THE REFRIGERANT, YOU CAN GET AROUND THE, YOU KNOW, THE LOCKING CAPS PRETTY EASILY. 
          UM, IT WAS TO KEEP, YOU KNOW, SO IT'S NOT JUST A, A NAKED SHRADER VALVE FOR SOME KID TO, YOU KNOW, H H I MEAN LITERALLY, IT, IT WAS DESIGNED TO KEEP KIDS FROM KILLING THEMSELVES HUFFING R 22. 
          UM, AND I JUST, I DON'T SEE THE DANGER. 
          I, I UNDERSTAND WHERE YOU'RE COMING FROM AND, AND I'M FINE WHICHEVER WAY YOU WANT TO GO, UH, BECAUSE I DON'T EVEN NEED THE, THE KEY TO OPEN THOSE CAPS. 
          I CAN USE MY KNIFE AND I CAN OPEN 'EM. 
          SO IT'S NOT A BIG DEAL. 
          BUT I JUST WANT YOU TO ALSO TAKE IN CONSIDERATION THE OTHER CODE SECTION 1102 0.3 THAT REQUIRES CAPS. 
          UH, EVEN WHEN YOU SERVICE THE EQUIPMENT, WE, WE, THERE'S NO WAY FOR US TO ENFORCE THAT BECAUSE I MEAN, WHEN YOU SERVICE THE EQUIPMENT, YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO PUT LOCKING CAPS. 
          WE CANNOT ENFORCE THAT. 
          WE'RE NOT EVEN, YOU KNOW, BUT IT IS IN THE CODE. 
          I DON'T KNOW HOW THAT GOT IN OR WHY IT'S IN THERE, BUT THAT'S ANOTHER SECTION THAT THEY'RE, THEY'RE STATING LOCKING CAPS INTO DIFFERENT PLACES FOR ACCESS. 
          AND THEN OVER HERE IT SAYS, YOU KNOW, UH, ACCESS PORTS SHALL BE PROTECTED IN ACCORDANCE WITH SECTION 1109 0.9 WHENEVER REFRIGERATOR IS ADDED TO OR RECOVER FROM REFRIGERATION OR AIR CONDITIONING SYSTEMS. SO THERE'S TWO PLACES WHERE THEY'RE ACTUALLY, YOU KNOW, SAYING THAT ON THE CODE. 
          I'M, I'M FULLY IN SUPPORT OF HUNTING DOWN EVERY REFERENCE TO LOCKING CAPS AND ELIMINATING IT JUST SO YOU'RE, I I, I THINK THE, THE PROTECTION, THE PORT PROTECTION FOR CAPS IS THE SHRADER VALVES ALWAYS. 
          THIS HAS GOT SOME SMALL AMOUNT OF LEAKAGE. 
          SO BY PUTTING A CAP ON TOP OF IT, YOU'RE MINIMIZING THE LEAKAGE RATE OUT OF THE SYSTEM. 
          SO I, I, I CAN AGREE WITH, LET'S TAKE THE LOCKING REQUIREMENT OUT. 
          I DON'T, NEITHER HERE NOR THERE TO ME. 
          UM, BUT I THINK WE GOTTA LEAVE SOMETHING IN THERE THAT SAYS THAT THE CAPS HAVE TO BE INSTALLED. 
          YEAH, DEFINITELY. 
          WE, WE, I MEAN WE'VE, WE ARE ENFORCING THE LOCKING CAPS WITH A SIX FOOT FENCE THING AS IT IS NOW. 
          BUT PRIOR, I MEAN, EVEN PRIOR TO LOCKING CAPS COMING INTO PLACE, THEY HAD TO HAVE CAPS. 
          I MEAN, FACTORY COME WITH THE, THE UNITS COME WITH FACTORY BUILT CAPS, SO THEY ALWAYS HAVE TO HAVE CAPS, YOU KNOW, SO WE ALWAYS, IF IF IT WASN'T MISSING THE CAB, WE WOULD NOT PASS IT EVEN AFTER, EVEN BEFORE LOCKING CAPS WAS EVEN INTO EFFECT. 
          BUT I MEAN, I MEAN, THERE'S A, THERE'S A FINANCIAL INCENTIVE. 
          I MEAN, IF YOU'RE STROKING CHECKS FOR, FOR, YOU KNOW, R 22 OR FOUR 10 A, YOU KNOW, YOU WANT, DON'T WANT LEAKAGE, AND SO YOU'LL HAVE A, YOU KNOW, IF THE CAP IS CAUSING LEAKAGE. 
          SO ANYWAY, I, I DON'T WANNA BE, YOU KNOW, I DON'T WANNA BEAT IT TO DEATH, BUT THAT'S MY LITTLE CRUSADE THAT I'VE BEEN ON FOR THE LAST SIX, SEVEN YEARS. 
          I'D LIKE TO SEE IT THROUGH. 
          I WAS GONNA SAY, DO WE HAVE ANY INPUT FROM THE PUBLIC? IF YOU COULD JUST, UH, SAY YOUR NAME AND, YOU KNOW, WE SAY ADDRESS OR A COMPANY IS FINE IF, UH, DARREL REHAN WITH FREEZING HA HEATING AND AIR CONDITIONING, I ALSO REPRESENT TA UP ON THE BOARD FOR TACA. 
          UH, YEAH, LOCKING CAPS IS A PASSION OF MINE AS WELL. 
          I'VE BEEN AN AC TECH FOR 28 YEARS. 
          I OWN MY OWN BUSINESS NOW. 
          I TOOK IT OVER FROM MY FATHER IN 2014. 
          UM, I'VE SPENT MORE TIME TRYING TO TAKE A CAP OFF. 
          LIKE YOU SAID, THEY'RE EASILY DEFEATED. 
          I MEAN, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, HE SAID POCKET KNIFE, WHATEVER, BUT I'VE SPENT A LOT OF TIME TRYING TO GET THEM OFF AND PUT THEM ON PROPERLY. 
          AND THEY ALSO ARE A LEAK, VERY BAD LEAK SOURCE. 
          SO REFRIGERANT LOSS, I HAVE A LOT OF THEM THAT HAVE CAUSED REFRIGERANT LOSS THAT I'M LIKE, HEY, I'M JUST GETTING RID OF THIS. 
          I PREFER TO PUT THE TYPE OF BRASS CAPS THAT YOU HAVE TO USE THAT NINE 16 INCH TO TIGHTEN IT WITH. 
          TO ME, THAT'S A LOT BETTER THAN A LOCKING CAP. 
          AND I'VE ALMOST NEVER HAD A LEAK WITH THOSE TYPE OF CAPS. 
          SO YEAH, LOCKING CAPS IS A VERY, UH, PASSION OF MINE AS WELL. 
          [01:45:01]
AND, AND, AND, AND YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT THE COST OF THEM, BUT LOCKING CAPS RIGHT NOW ARE BETWEEN EIGHT AND $10, YOU KNOW, PER CAP. 
          AND, AND THAT'S SOMETHING MOST UNITS, WELL ACTUALLY I THINK ALL UNITS COME FROM THE MANUFACTURER WITH CAPS ALREADY INSTALLED ON THEM. 
          AND, YOU KNOW, SO IT'S AN EXPENSE THAT NOW WE HAVE TO TAKE THOSE CAPS AND BASICALLY THROW THEM AWAY TO PUT THE LOCKING CAPS ON. 
          AND IN REFERENCE TO, UM, SOME QUICK STORIES ON, UH, , IF I MAY, ON, UH, MY FATHER, UM, WHEN HE USED TO WORK AT THE BEAR COUNTY CRIME LAB, UM, THERE WAS TWO INCIDENCES OF, UM, FREON. 
          UM, ONE WAS THE GUY BLEW OUT A DRAIN LINE, AND THIS WAS BACK WHEN THE EARLY SEVENTIES BLEW OUT A DRAIN LINE. 
          AND THIS KID WAS WHERE THE PUDDLE WAS OUTSIDE. 
          HE ENDED UP DYING FROM, YOU KNOW, LITTLE INFANT DYING FROM THAT FREON WHEN IT WAS BLOWN THROUGH THE DRAIN LINE. 
          THE OTHER ONE HE HAD WAS, UH, THERE WAS A GUY VENTING, UH, UM, HUFFING FREON IN BED,  AND, AND KILLED HIMSELF, YOU KNOW, BY SUICIDE. 
          UH, THE ONLY OTHER INCIDENTS THAT I'VE KNOWN OF AT ALL WAS HIS, UM, UM, DOCTOR'S OFFICE WHERE THEY WERE, YOU KNOW, STEALING THE FREON. 
          AND IT DIDN'T MATTER THAT THE CAP WAS ON THERE, THEY WERE COME, YOU KNOW, THEY WERE COMING THERE WITH TOOLS AND STUFF AND THEY WERE STEALING THE FREON. 
          SO AGAIN, I THINK IT'S THE LOCKING CAPS WERE A LIFE SAFETY ISSUE, BUT I HAVEN'T SEEN ANY NEWS REPORTS OR HEARD OF ANYBODY OTHERWISE DYING BESIDES THE THREE INSTANCES. 
          SO THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU FOR YOUR COMMENTS, ESPECIALLY SINCE YOU AGREE WITH ME. 
          I, I LIKE THOSE THE BEST . 
          WELL THEN, THEN I'D SAY WE OUGHT TO ASK THE CITY TO GO BACK AND LOOK AT THOSE TWO AND, AND LOOK AT REMOVING THE 1101 0.9 FOR THE LOCKING CAPS AND THEN ADJUSTING THE VERBIAGE OF 1102 0.3 FOR THE ACCESS PORT PROTECTION TO REMOVE THE REFERENCE FOR 1101 0.9. 
          WE GOOD WITH THAT? GREAT. 
          SO WE'RE NOT GONNA VOTE ON THAT ONE TODAY. 
          SO IT'S GONNA BE, GO BACK TO JUST CLARIFY ALL THE LANGUAGE AND ALL THE, ALL THE PLACES THAT WE'VE HUNTED OUT THE, THE LOCKING CAPS. 
          WELL, YOU GUYS CAN MAKE THE RECOMMENDATION TO REMOVE THOSE TWO SECTIONS COMPLETELY. 
          I, I, NO, I, I'M RECOMMENDING REMOVING THE LOCKING CAP, BUT LEAVING THE ACCESS PORT PROTECTION WHERE IT WILL REQUIRE THEM TO HAVE A, A CAP, NOT A LOCKING CAP. 
          JUST A CAP. 
          WELL, IT'S REFERENCING BACK TO THE LOCKING CAP SECTION SPECIFICALLY. 
          YEAH, I BASICALLY, WHAT I, MY SUGGESTION WOULD BE IS, IS ELIMINATE ANY VERBIAGE, UH, AFTER THE WORD PROTECTED. 
          THAT WAY YOU'RE GETTING THE REFERENCE TO 1109 OUT OF THERE. 
          UM, I GUESS YOU COULD LEAVE WHENEVER A REFRIGERANT IS ADDED OR RECOVERED. 
          I, IF I'M INTERPRETING THAT CORRECTLY. 
          I JUST WANT, WHEN THE, THE TECHNICIAN IS DONE AND WALKS AWAY, CAPS NEED TO BE ON THE UNIT, NOT LOCKING CAPS, JUST CAPS. 
          I THINK THE APPROPRIATE THING WOULD BE TO AMEND THAT SECTION OUT ALTOGETHER. 
          BECAUSE THE REASON IT'S THERE IS TO REFERENCE BACK TO THE LOCKING CAP. 
          DO WE HAVE ANOTHER SECTION THAT'S GOING TO ENFORCE PUTTING A CAP ON THE TRADER VALVES? THE, THEY, THEY ALREADY, LIKE HE WAS SAYING, THEY ALREADY COME WITH THEM. 
          SO THAT, I MEAN, AND PRIOR TO LOCKING CAPS, WE WERE ENFORCING THAT ALREADY. 
          UH, WELL I THINK THE, I THINK THE QUESTION IS, DID WHEN THEY INSERTED THE LOCKING CAP LANGUAGE, DID THAT REPLACE GENERAL CAP LANGUAGE? AND IF SO, WE NEED TO HAVE SOME KIND OF CAP LANGUAGE. 
          UM, AND I'M SORRY TO HAVE OPENED THIS DOOR FOR EVERYBODY, BUT I, I JUST, YOU KNOW, I AM I CLARIFYING CORRECTLY WHAT YOU'RE SAYING? YEAH, YEAH. 
          I, LIKE I SAID, IT'S JUST 'CAUSE IF WE, IF WE, AGAIN, HAVING NOT READ IT ALL, IF WE DELETE 1102 0.3, THEN YOU GO, YOU HAVE, UH, FROM MY LIMITED GLANCING THROUGH THERE, YOU HAVE NO ENFORCEABLE LEGAL ENFORCEMENT TO MAKE A CONTRACTOR PUT A CAP ON THE, ON THE VALVES. 
          SO THAT'S, THAT'S WHY I'M, IF THERE'S, IF IT'S SOMEWHERE ELSE, GREAT, WE'RE COVERED. 
          BUT I JUST WOULD, WE'VE, WHEN THE CITY'S LOOKING AT THAT, JUST TO GO BACK AND MAKE SURE THAT THERE IS A, SOMETHING THAT COVERS THAT WHEN THEY'RE DONE, THEY GOTTA PUT THE CAP BACK ON. 
          SO BASICALLY, UH, UH, OMIT 1109 AND THEN, UH, AMEND 1102 0.3 TO READ SOMETHING LIKE REFRIGERANT EXCESS PORTS SHALL BE PROTECTED WHENEVER REFRIGERANT ADDED TO OR RECOVERED FROM REFRIGERATOR OR AIR CONDITIONING EQUIPMENT. 
          IN, IN ESSENCE, YES, THIS IS, UH, JEREMY MCDONALD. 
          WHAT WE CAN DO IS LET'S, LET'S RESEARCH REAL FAST. 
          SEE WHEN THEY ADDED THIS SECTION, SEE WHAT THEY HAD PRIOR TO THAT. 
          AND WE CAN USE THAT AS A REFERENCE POINT, UH, TO THE, TO THE COMMITTEE AND SAY, LOOK, THIS, THIS IS WHAT IT WAS BEFORE THEY CH ADDED THE LOCKING CAPS AND USE THAT AS A STARTING POINT AND GO FROM THERE. 
          WE BOTH FORGOT TO PRESS OUR BUTTON. 
          WE'RE NOT ON THE RECORD FOR YOU SAYING THAT. 
          I 
          [01:50:01]
THINK WE GOT A LITTLE AHEAD OF OURSELVES 'CAUSE OUR CURRENT COSA AMENDMENT ALREADY ELIMINATES THAT SECTION 1102 0.3. 
          SO CURRENTLY WE'VE AMENDED THAT OUT. 
          YES, BECAUSE WE WEREN'T REQUIRING THAT. 
          MAYBE JUST, WE DIDN'T THINK IT WAS ENFORCEABLE BECAUSE WE'RE NOT DOING AN INSPECTION FOR ADDED OR RECOVERED REFRIGERANT. 
          SO WE, IT'S AN UNENFORCEABLE. 
          ALRIGHT, I LIKE THAT TOO. 
          UM, BUT HOW ABOUT WE DO JUST 1102 0.3 IN THE ONE THAT WE JUST TALKED ABOUT. 
          WE'LL JUST PUNT BOTH OF THOSE JUST FOR GIVE STAFF A CHANCE TO LOOK AT 'EM AND MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE, WE'RE NOT CAUSING ANY PROBLEMS FOR OURSELVES. 
          IS THAT FAIR? SOUNDS GOOD. 
          OKAY. 
          THE NEXT SECTIONS, THIS, UH, IS 1101 THROUGH 1108 FOR AMMONIA REFRIGERANT SYSTEMS. SO WE PROPOSED ADOPT AS WRITTEN. 
          UH, THERE ARE CHANGES TO THE EXISTING SECTION AND MOST OF THEM ARE JUST REFERENCING, UM, UH, DIFFERENT STANDARDS, UH, SPECIFIC FOR AMMONIA REFRIGERANT. 
          WE DIDN'T FEEL THIS WAS A SIGNIFICANT CHANGE, JUST EXTENSIVE. 
          SO WE WANTED TO BRING IT TO YOUR ATTENTION BECAUSE IT, IT LOOKS LIKE A BIG CHANGE, BUT IT'S, IT'S NOT SIGNIFICANT. 
          ARE YOU SPECIFICALLY TALKING IN THE EXCEL SPREADSHEET ABOUT ROW 25 OR ARE WE TALKING ABOUT THAT WHOLE GROUP OF CHAPTER 11 TYPE ITEMS? I MEAN, JUST TO MAKE SURE WE'RE ON THE SAME PAGE WITH WHERE YOU'RE AT ROAD 25, DOES ANYBODY HAVE EXPERIENCE WITH AMMONIA AND REFRIGERATION SYSTEMS THAT THIS IS GONNA BE A, A CHANGE TO HOW YOU DO THINGS? OR IS IT JUST A GOOD CLEANUP OTHER THAN STORIES FROM BUDDIES? THE, THE INTERNATIONAL INSTITUTE OF MONEY REFRIGERATION IS MORE STRINGENT, SO I WOULD BE OKAY WITH IT. 
          YEAH, I'D SAY WE'RE GOOD. 
          OKAY. 
          MOVE ON. 
          OKAY, NEXT ITEM. 
          UH, WITHIN THAT SECTION 1105 POINT 0.9 MACHINERY ROOM MEANS OF EGRESS. 
          SO THIS WAS ALREADY IN THE BUILDING CODE, IT'S NOW IN THE MECHANICAL CODE FOR MACHINERY ROOMS, A THOUSAND SQUARE FEET OR MORE REQUIRED TWO EXITS. 
          EVERYBODY GOOD. 
          ALL THE HEADLINE TO, TO BE CLEAR, THIS IS SOMETHING THAT THE I B C REQUIRED ANYWAY, AND NOW IT'S JUST IN THE I M C. 
          SO WHEN WE'RE DESIGNING THESE SYSTEMS, WE, WE ALREADY HAVE IT, I ASSUME. 
          ABSOLUTELY. 
          GENTLEMEN, YOU GOOD? ALRIGHT, WE'LL MOVE NEXT. 
          OKAY, NEXT ITEM IS A CURRENT COSA AMENDMENT TO 1107 0.4 0.1. 
          WE ARE RECOMMENDING TO REMOVE THE AMENDMENT. 
          THERE'S BEEN LOTS OF DISCUSSION ON THIS ONE. 
          SORRY. 
          UM, SO THIS REQUIRES THE R FOUR INSULATION FOR SUCTION LINES WHERE CONDENSATE CAN OCCUR. 
          UM, SINCE THIS IS JUST FOR COMMERCIAL APPLICATIONS WHERE WE'RE RE RECOMMENDING TO REMOVE THIS AMENDMENT AND GOES STRAIGHT CODE THAT HAS A TABLE, UM, CAN WE BRING UP THE, THE ACTUAL 2021 I M C TO REMOVE THE AMENDMENT THAT SPECIFIES R FOUR AND JUST GO WITH THE TABLE IN THE 2021? 
          [01:55:19]
SO WE ADDED THE R FOUR HERE TO BE CONSISTENT WITH WHAT WE REQUIRE IN RESIDENTIAL, UM, USES, IT SPECIFIES R FOUR, UM, BUT IN THE I M C, IT SPECIFIES THIS TABLE WITH, UM, WITH, UH, INCH INCHES OF INSULATION. 
          UH, THIS IS INSPECTOR EZ AGAIN. 
          LET, LET ME TRY TO SEE IF I CAN EXPLAIN THIS REAL QUICK. 
          UH, OKAY, SO ON THE I M C IT, IT GIVES YOU A SIZE. 
          SO IT TELLS YOU ANY PIPE LESS THAN ONE INCH HAS TO BE INSULATED WITH HALF INCH. 
          RIGHT? ON THE I R C IT SAYS R FOUR, WHICH COULD BE HALF INCH, ONE INCH, THREE QUARTER, IT COULD BE A DIFFERENT SIZE. 
          SO THE REASON WE AMENDED IT ON, ON THE I M C, IT'S TO KIND OF BE ON THE SAME LEVEL AS THE I R C BECAUSE YOU CAN PUT THE SAME EQUIPMENT, A SPLIT SYSTEM, FIVE TON ON A COMMERCIAL, AND THEN A RESIDENTIAL. 
          AND THEY HAVE TO HAVE DIFFERENT, UH, INSULATION FOR THE PIPING BECAUSE THE WAY THE CODE IS WRITTEN. 
          SO EVEN ON THE, ON THE ENERGY CODE, IT, IT'S, IT'S STILL, IT IS, IT'S, IT'S NOT CONSISTENT ON THE, I, ON THE COMMERCIAL SIDE, IT TELLS YOU, UH, WHAT IS IT, UH, R THREE, BUT ON THE COMMER ON THE RESIDENTIAL I E C, IT TELLS YOU R FOUR. 
          SO IT'S NOT CONSISTENT. 
          SO THAT'S WHY THIS WAS WRITTEN, BUT WE WERE DISCUSSING THIS AND YOU KNOW, IF WE JUST GO HALF INCH STRAIGHT ACROSS, IT WOULD PROBABLY BETTER FOR THE RESIDENTIAL PART ALSO BECAUSE HALF INCH, TRYING TO GET HALF INCH INSULATION WITH YOUR COPPER DOWN A STUD, IT, IT'S TOO THICK. 
          AND SO WE JUST GO WITH HALF INCH STRAIGHT ACROSS. 
          SO THAT'S WHY THIS WAS KIND OF RECOMMENDED TO BE REMOVED TO JUST GO WITH THE I M C, WHICH IS SAYS HALF INCH. 
          BUT WE WILL HAVE TO AMEND THE MECHANICAL CODE IN THE I R C, BUT THAT'S A DIFFERENT COMMITTEE. 
          I GUESS I'D RATHER STAY WITH AN R FOUR BECAUSE YOU CAN SAY HALF INCH OF INSULATION AND, AND WHAT IS IT CALCIUM SILICATE OR IS IT GONNA BE, YOU KNOW, YEAH, THAT, THAT, THAT HALF FI IT, IT DEPENDS ON THE COPPER SIZE. 
          IT, IT MAY EVEN GIVE YOU 3.1 IF IT, THE SMALLER THE COPPER HALF INCH INSULATION GIVES YOU HIGHER R VALUE. 
          SO YOU CAN GO WITH A THREE QUARTER WITH HALF INCH INSULATION, IT CAN PROBABLY GIVE YOU A 5.3 OR WHATEVER. 
          BUT THE, THE, THE THICKNESS VERSUS THE COPPER IS, IS WHAT CHANGES THE R VALUE. 
          SO WHEN, WHEN THE, WHEN THE, THIS THING SAYS HALF INCH, THEY'RE NOT EVEN CARING ABOUT THE R VALUE, THEY'RE JUST GOING WITH HALF INCH. 
          YEAH, I GUESS WE'RE JUST ALLUDING IT. 
          I'D LIKE TO SEE SOME, YOU KNOW, A MINIMUM OF R FOUR OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. 
          'CAUSE I JUST, I JUST, I'M NEVER A FAN OF THICKNESSES WITH INSULATION BECAUSE DEPENDING ON THE DENSITY, THE INSULATION, DEPENDING ON THE MATERIAL, YOU KNOW. 
          YES. 
          AN EXTREME THING IS, WELL, I JUST BURIED MY REFRIGERANT LINES, EARTH IS AN INSULATION. 
          MM-HMM. 
           YOUR SUGGESTION THAT THE, THE WAY THEY ACCEPT, I'M SORRY, THE AMENDMENT IS WRITTEN TO, TO SAY R FOUR YOU, DO YOU THINK IT'S IT'S FINE THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN AND NOT TO, NOT TO CHANGE, UH, REMOVE THE AMENDMENT? UH, WE JUST HAVE TO GET IT IN THE, POTENTIALLY IN THE RIGHT PLACE. 
          I'M NOT A HUNDRED PERCENT SURE I HAVEN'T. 
          I SAW YOU WERE KIND OF LOOKING FOR WHERE THAT HALF INCH IS IN THE I M C IN A TABLE AND I HAVEN'T YEAH, IT LOOKS LIKE THE THE REFERENCES HAVE CHANGED, HUH? YEAH, THEY MOVED A LOT OF THINGS AROUND. 
          IS IT IN THE ENERGY CODE? YEAH, IT'S IN THE ENERGY CODE AND THERE'S A TYPO. 
          ? YEAH, THERE'S A TYPO. 
          IT'S A WRONG TABLE. 
          , BUT YES, IT'S, IT'S A TABLE. 
          IT'S A TABLE. 
          IT'S 1103. 
          AND ON THE CODE, IT'S ON THE, ON THE BOOK IT'S 1203. 
          YEAH. 
          WAS IT CORRECT FOR WHEN THIS WAS PUBLISHED FOR 2018 AND IT'S JUST NOW YES. 
          CHANGED? YES. 
          OKAY. 
          THAT MAKES THE, THE TABLE, THEY PUT THE WRONG NUMBER ON THE TABLE. 
          IT'S THE SAME TABLE, BUT IT'S NOT 1103, I THINK IT'S 1203 ON THE ENERGY CODE. 
          SO JOE, DOES IT NOT SPECIFY IN THE I M C WHAT THE INSULATION 
          [02:00:01]
SHOULD BE AT ALL? YEAH, THAT'S WHERE I'M GLANCING THROUGH THIS AND I'M NOT NECESSARILY SEEING IT ON THE I M C CHAPTER 11. 
          OH, IT'S 1109 OR ARE YOU, ARE YOU SEEING THE, UH, 11 0 9, 2 0.6 EXPOSED PIPING SURFACE TEMPERATURE EXPOSED PIPING WITH READY ACCESS. 
          THAT'S ONE OF THE PLACES, I GUESS THE OTHER ONE I'M SEEING IS 1109 0.7. 
           CRYSTAL, LET'S UH, TABLE THIS UNTIL THE END OF THE MEETING. 
          UH, LET'S KEEP MOVING WHILE, UH, JOE'S DOING SOME RESEARCH. 
          YEAH, THAT SOUNDS GOOD. 
          OR AT LEAST MAYBE WE EVEN SEND THAT BACK TO THE CITY TO GET A BETTER LOOK AT IT AND, AND COME BACK AT THE NEXT MEETING. 
          OKAY, WE'LL SKIP PAST THAT ONE. 
          THE NEXT SECTION IS THE 2021 I M C SECTIONS 1107 THROUGH 1110 FOR REFRIGERANT PIPING. 
          SO THESE WERE CHANGES TO EXISTING SECTIONS AND SOME ADDITIONS REWRITTEN TO ORGANIZE THE EXISTING TEXTS AND UPDATES. 
          SOME PROVISIONS THAT IT HAD NOT CHANGED IN MANY YEARS. 
          UM, IS HOW I, THE I M C IDENTIFIED THIS, UH, AS A SIGNIFICANT CHANGE. 
          SO IS THE SIGNIFICANT CHANGE THE WAY IT'S ORGANIZED OR ARE THERE ADDITIONAL REQUIREMENTS THAT WEREN'T ON THE BOOKS BEFORE? THERE'S ARE SOME ADDITIONAL REQUIREMENTS. 
          SO WHAT, WHAT ARE THEY? SORRY, I KNEW YOU WERE GONNA ASK THAT. 
          IF THERE'S SOME SIGNIFICANT CHANGES IN THERE, I MEAN, IS IT WORTH HAVING SEPARATE LINE ITEMS FOR FOR THOSE SO WE CAN, SO WE CAN LOOK TO SEE IF THERE'S ANYTHING THAT WE MIGHT WANNA EITHER AMEND OR HAVE DISCUSSION ABOUT? I DON'T, WE DIDN'T THINK SO. 
          WE DIDN'T FEEL IT WAS A NEED TO GO THROUGH THAT. 
          UM, BECAUSE IT WAS SUCH A BIG REORG USED MATERIALS, RIGHT? THEY IDENTIFIED USED MATERIALS, THEY HAVE TO BE CLEAN AND FREE OF FOREIGN MATERIALS. 
          SO WE DIDN'T THINK THAT THAT WAS SIGNIFICANT CHANGE. 
          UM, JOINTS AND CONNECTIONS, THEY IDENTIFIED THOSE, UM, AS NEW SECTIONS, NEW REQUIREMENTS FOR JOINTS AND CONNECTIONS. 
          AGAIN, WE DIDN'T FEEL IT WAS A SIGNIFICANT CHANGE TO WHAT WE SEE. 
          UM, THAT WOULD, THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING THAT WE WANTED TO HIGHLIGHT. 
          LOTS OF THE SECTIONS STAYED THE SAME. 
          THEY WERE JUST REWARDED, REWORDED, UM, TEST GASES THEY ADDED TO THAT. 
          JUST, JUST NOT A LOT OF THINGS THAT WE SEE MUCH. 
          SO AGAIN, WE DIDN'T FEEL IT WAS A SIGNIFICANT CHANGE. 
          THEY MADE SOME CHANGES TO TEST APPARATUS, YOU KNOW, JUST MINOR, UH, UPDATES TO SOME OF THE EXISTING SECTIONS. 
          DO YOU WANNA GO LINE BY LINE? NO, I THINK AS YOU GUYS ARE LOOKING THROUGH IT, ARE YOU SEEING ANYTHING THAT JUMPS OUT AT YOU? MIKE, ARE YOU SAYING YOU DIDN'T READ THIS SECTION? I'M SAYING I COULD HAVE AND I PROBABLY WOULDN'T UNDERSTOOD IT ANYWAY. 
          [02:05:01]
YEAH, I MEAN I, I I'M NOT SEEING ANYTHING, YOU KNOW, AND AGAIN, I HAVEN'T LOOKED AT THE 18 CODE, BUT I KNOW ASH'S BEEN DOING WORK ON LOWER FLAMMABILITY REFRIGERANTS AND, AND SOME PIECES THAT ARE THAT. 
          SO I SEE THERE'S SOME NOTES ABOUT, YOU KNOW, THE A TWO L AND B B TWO, YOU KNOW, TYPE STUFF IN THERE. 
          BUT I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANYTHING IN HERE. 
          LIKE YOU SAID, IT'S A LOT OF IT'S JUST CLEAN THE DAWN DARN PIPE. 
          GOOD. 
          RON, YOU GOOD? OKAY. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          WHAT'S THE ADOPT AS WRITTEN MOVING TO NEXT? SO THE NEXT FEW AMENDMENTS, UH, WE CURRENTLY HAVE THESE AMENDMENTS TO THE I R C, UH, WE'RE NOT GONNA, WE'RE GONNA DISCUSS THOSE AT OUR NEXT MEETING. 
          WE DIDN'T HAVE THE I R C, UH, SPECIFICALLY ON THE AGENDA, SO WE DON'T WANNA, UH, WE DON'T WANNA MAKE ANY RULINGS ON THOSE, BUT, UH, PRETTY STRAIGHTFORWARD IF YOU GUYS WANNA, UM, TAKE A LOOK AT THOSE AND BE PREPARED FOR NEXT MEETING. 
          JUST STALLING TO GIVE JOE SOME MORE TIME. 
          CRYSTAL, YOU'RE SAYING THE LAST FOUR LINE ITEMS ARE TO BE, TO ARE MAYBE FOR DISCUSSION AT, AT A LATER DATE? IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING? YES. 
          WE'LL DISCUSS THOSE AT OUR NEXT MEETING. 
          IS THOSE ARE AMENDMENTS TO THE I M C MECHANICAL SECTIONS I M C, BUT, BUT THE, THE, I'M SORRY. 
          THANKS. 
          AND, AND THE AMENDMENTS ARE TO KIND OF COINCIDE WITH THE, WITH A COMMERCIAL, WITH THE I M C. 
          THAT'S WHAT THOSE ARE. 
          BUT AS FAR AS THE PIPING BACK TO THE PIPING, UH, I, THE WAY IT WAS WRITTEN BACK IN 2018, IT'S VERY VAGUE AND THAT'S WHY WE, WE DECIDED TO PUT THE R FOUR VALUE ON IT TO KINDA COINCIDE WITH, WITH THE ENERGY CODE PLUS THE I R C AT THE SAME TIME. 
          SO THAT'S WHY WE KIND OF LIKE, YOU KNOW, EVERYBODY STRAIGHT ACROSS INSTEAD OF HAVING DIFFERENT GO WITH SIZES VERSUS AN R VALUE ON THE, ON THE, ON THE RESIDENTIAL AND GO WITH, WITH, WITH SIZES ON THE COMMERCIAL. 
          THAT'S WHY WE DECIDED TO GO WITH R FOUR STRAIGHT ACROSS. 
          AND, AND, AND THE WAY THE 2018 READ, IT SAYS THAT REFRIGERANT PIPING AND FITTINGS, UH, DURING, UH, THAT DURING NORMAL OPERATION WILL REACH A SURFACE TEMPERATURE BELOW THE DEWPOINT PORT, THE DEWPOINT OF THE SURFACE SURROUNDING AIR, AND ARE LOCATED IN SPACES OR AREAS WHERE CONDENSATION WILL CAUSE A SAFETY HAZARD TO THE BUILDING. 
          OCCUPANTS AND STRUCTURE ELECTRICAL EQUIPMENT SHALL BE PROTECTED. 
          SO YOU NEVER EVEN SAID TO INSULATE IT WITH HALF INCH OR INSULATE WITH R FOUR, IT JUST SAYS THAT THOSE PIPES HAVE TO BE PROTECTED. 
          SO TO BE STRAIGHT ACROSS THE BOARD, THAT'S WHY WE SAID LET'S JUST WITH OUR R FOUR AND THAT WILL COVER THE I R C ALSO. 
          THAT'S THE REASON WHY THAT WAS THERE. 
          THAT'S WHY IT WAS THERE. 
          SO WHAT'S THE REASON TO REMOVE IT? IS THAT CHANGED? WELL, BECAUSE ON THE ENERGY CODE IT SAYS HALF INCH. 
          SO WE COULD GO WITH HALF INCH ON, ON, ON THE, ON THE COMMERCIAL SIDE AND STICK WITH OUR FOUR ON THE RESIDENTIAL . 
          SO IS THIS SOMETHING THAT NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED IN THE I E C C COMMITTEE? I MEAN IT, THE, ON ON THE MECHANICAL CODE, IT SAYS THAT ON THE, ON THE, ON THE 2018, IT SAYS THAT HE HAD TO BE PROTECTED. 
          HE DIDN'T TELL YOU WITH R FOUR HALF INCH OR ANYTHING. 
          IT JUST SAYS YOU GOTTA PROTECT IT FROM SWEATING, YOU KNOW, FROM CONDENSATION TO FORM AND CAUSE DAMAGE TO THE PROPERTY. 
          SO IT DOESN'T BE, IT'S NOT SPECIFIC AS TO WHAT R VALUE OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT. 
          UH, THAT'S ON THE I E C C, BUT I MEAN IT IS, IT STILL NEEDS TO BE PROTECTED. 
          IT'S JUST A MATTER OF WHETHER WE'RE GONNA GO WE HAVE INCH OR YOU KNOW, OR R FOUR. 
          SO JOE, WERE YOU HAVING A PROBLEM WITH THAT ONE TIME TRYING TO GET THROUGH THE WALLS? WAS IT R FOUR? IT WAS R FOUR, RIGHT? IT'S LIKE THREE QUARTERS OF AN INCH. 
          YEAH. 
          IT WAS ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE ON RESIDENTIAL TO RUN PIPING WITH, YOU KNOW, A ONE INCH REFRIGERANT PIPE OR FOR FIVE TON UNIT WITH THREEQUARTER INCH INSULATION AROUND IT. 
          AND, AND UH, THERE'S JUST NO WAY THEY'D HAVE TO HAVE AN EIGHT INCH WALL TO DO THAT. 
          YEAH. 
          AND, AND SO THE, YOU KNOW, THE, THE REASON WE, WE WERE KIND OF ON THE FENCE ON THIS. 
          WE CAN REMOVE IT FROM HERE, RIGHT? BUT WHEN IT COMES TO THE ENERGY CODE, WE WILL HAVE TO EITHER GO HALF FICH ON COMMERCIAL AND OUR, OUR FORM ON RESIDENTIAL, OR WE CAN GO HALF FINCH STRAIGHT ACROSS SO THAT IT'LL, WE WON'T HAVE THAT ISSUE ANYMORE. 
          BUT THAT'S WHY IT WAS IMPLE, THAT'S WHY IT WAS IN HERE AND THAT'S WHY WE WERE THINKING ABOUT IT SAYS, LOOK, IF WE REMOVE IT, 'CAUSE IT'S NO LONGER IN THE, IT'S NOT IN THE CODE BOOK AS FAR AS THE OUR VALUE, NOT ON THE I M C, IT'S ON THE ENERGY CODE, YOU KNOW, SO WE CAN REMOVE IT FROM HERE AND THEN DEAL WITH IT ON THE ENERGY CODE JUST LIKE, LIKE Y'ALL SAID. 
          BUT BECAUSE 
          [02:10:01]
THAT SECTION 1107 0.4 IS TOTALLY CHANGED IN THE 2021. 
          DON'T EVEN SAY ANYTHING ABOUT PROTECTION. 
          YEAH, I THINK IF IT'S IN THE, IF IT'S IN THE ENERGY CODE, WE, WE DON'T WANT TO NECESSARILY TOUCH IT HERE OTHER, UNLESS WE WANT TO BECOME MORE FORCEFUL. 
          WELL, THE, I, THE ENERGY CODE SHOULD FORCE IT NO MATTER WHAT. 
          THE, THE REASON I WAS JUST BRINGING IT BACK IS IN THE 21 CODE, AND AGAIN, THE JOYS OF LAWYERS, YOU KNOW, IT JUST SAYS POTENTIAL TO CAUSE A SAFETY HAZARD TO THE BUILDING OCCUPANTS STRUCTURE. 
          WELL, OKAY, MY, MY REFRIGERANT PIPING IS RUN IN A MECHANICAL ROOM THAT'S CONCRETE FLOOR. 
          IT AIN'T GONNA HURT NOTHING. 
          I'LL LET IT SWEAT EVERY DAY OF THE WEEK AND LET IT DRIP ON THE FLOOR AND IT'S NO BIG DEAL. 
          AND, AND I DON'T THINK WE NECESSARILY ARE AIMING THAT. 
          I WOULDN'T THINK THE ENERGY CODE WOULD ALLOW THAT, BUT THIS, THIS IS PRETTY VAGUE FROM AN ENFORCEMENT STANDPOINT OF, OF ANY INSULATION. 
          EVEN IF IT'S DRIPPING ON A DRYWALL CEILING, YOU CAN ALWAYS SAY, I DON'T CARE. 
          IT'S A BROWN SPOT. 
          IT'S NOT A SAFETY HAZARD. 
          SO JUST SO THAT, I'M, I UNDER, UH, I WANNA MAKE SURE I UNDERSTAND. 
          THE RECOMMENDATION FROM THE CITY IS TO REMOVE THIS AMENDMENT FROM THE I M C BECAUSE IT, THE, THE INSTALLATION INSULATION OF REFRIGERANT PIPE INSTALLATIONS IS ADDRESSED TO LET IT BE ADDRESSED THERE. 
          IS THAT CORRECT? YES. 
          OKAY. 
          YEAH, I THINK THE THING THAT I LIKE KNOW THE BEST ABOUT IT IS, YOU KNOW, ANYTIME WE CREATE CONSISTENCY BETWEEN THE DOCUMENTS THAT DON'T CURRENTLY EXIST, THEN THAT MAKES ENFORCEMENT A LOT EASIER. 
          SO WE'LL GO BACK TO, IT WAS LINE WHAT, 2027. 
          UM, AND WE'RE GONNA AGREE WITH THE STAFF RECOMMENDATION TO REMOVE THAT AMENDMENT. 
          IS THAT THAT'S WHAT IS GONNA GO WHEN WE DO OUR FINAL VOTE OR WHATEVER. 
          THAT'S OKAY. 
          OKAY. 
          BY MY MATH, WE'VE GONE THROUGH THE WHOLE DOCUMENT THAT WE INTENDED TO REVIEW TODAY. 
          SO THE NEXT STEP WOULD BE TO, I WILL RECAP THE LINE ITEMS ON THIS THAT WE EITHER CHANGED OR DID NOT, OR, OR PUNTED. 
          AND THEN WITH THE EXCEPTION OF THOSE ITEMS, WE'LL HAVE A MOTION TO APPROVE THESE RECOMMENDATIONS TO THE FULL BOARD FOR CONSIDERATION. 
          IS THAT, IS THAT ACCURATE? THAT IS CORRECT. 
          SO WITH THE FOLLOWING EXCEPTIONS, HOW DO I DO, I'M GONNA ASK FOR A MOTION FROM ONE OF THE THREE OF YOU TO, UM, TO SAY THAT WITH THE FOLLOWING EXCEPTIONS, UH, WE, UH, WILL RECOMMEND TO THE FULL BOARD TO ADOPT THE, THE CHANGES. 
          AND THAT'S, UH, COSA AMENDED 3 0 6 0.3230 7.4012 SLASH 4 0 3 0.150 2.2 0 1 11 0 1 0, AND 1102 0.3. 
          AND, UH, ALL THE LAST FOUR CSA AMENDMENTS, UH, M 1305, M 1411, M 1411, AND M 2 0 0 5. 
          WITH THOSE EXCEPTIONS, UH, I'D ACCEPT THE MOTION TO, UH, RECOMMEND TO THE FULL BOARD THAT WE, UM, ADOPT THESE CHANGES AS PRESENTED. 
          AS PRESENTED. 
          I MOVE SECOND. 
          OKAY. 
          IS THERE ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION ON THAT RECOMMENDATION BEFORE WE TAKE A VOTE? ANY COMMENTS FROM, I THINK THAT'S PROBABLY NOT CORRECT BY ROBERT RULES, BUT I'LL DO IT ANYWAY. 
          ANY AND OTHER COMMENTS FROM OUT THERE. 
          OKAY. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          SO ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE. 
          AYE. 
          AYE. 
          AYE. 
          ANY OPPOSED? COULDN'T BE 'CAUSE ALL THREE OF YOU SAID YES. 
          SO IT CARRIES. 
          UM, SO THAT, I THINK THAT'S IT. 
          SO IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE ON THE AGENDA THAT WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT BEFORE WE ADJOURN? ONE, ONE QUICK QUESTION TO STAFF. 
          WILL IT BE POSSIBLE TO GET A COPY OF THE RESULTS THAT WE DID TODAY SO WE'RE IN PREPARATION FOR NEXT WEEK'S MEETING? WILL DO, YEAH. 
          OKAY. 
          AND DO YOU GUYS HAVE ANY SPECIFIC ITEMS FOR DISCUSSION FOR NEXT TIME? ANY SECTIONS THAT YOU'D LIKE TO BRING UP THAT HAVEN'T BEEN ADDRESSED OTHER THAN THE CHANGES THAT AND RESEARCH THAT WE ASKED FOR? YEAH, IS THERE ANYTHING THAT YOU SAW IN YOUR RESEARCH OF THE BOOK THAT, THAT WE DIDN'T ADDRESS THAT WE NEED TO? NO. 
          ANYTHING FROM THE GUESTS IN THE GALLERY THAT, OKAY. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          UH, JEREMY MCDONALD DEVELOPMENT SERVICES. 
          SO THE LAST ITEM 
          [
Director's Report
 ]
ON THE AGENDA FOR TODAY WOULD BE THE DIRECTOR'S REPORT. 
          UH, REALLY WHAT THIS IS, UH, ALL WE HAVE TO KINDA DISCUSS IS MOSTLY REALLY FOR THE PEOPLE THAT AREN'T HERE. 
          UM, 
          [02:15:01]
IT'S ANYBODY THAT'S WATCHING THIS RECORDING, UH, EITHER LIVE OR IS RECORDING, WANNA LET THEM KNOW ABOUT THE ADDITIONAL INFORMATION OUT THERE. 
          SO WE HAVE THE CODE ADOPTION WEBSITE AT OUR D S D WEBSITE. 
          THIS IS THE SOURCE FOR THAT. 
          YOU GO THERE AND YOU CAN SEE, YOU'LL BE ABLE TO FIND OUR SCHEDULE OF ALL THE DIFFERENT MEETINGS WE HAVE PROPOSED, UH, THE PRE THIS PROCESS, HOW IT'S OUTLINED, ALL THE AMENDMENTS THAT WE'RE PRESENTING TO THE BOARD AS THEY'RE BEING UPDATED WILL BE LOCATED THERE AS WELL. 
          UH, SO THAT'S AVAILABLE. 
          AND THEN ANYTIME SOMEBODY WANTS TO HAVE ANY SPECIFIC COMMENTS TO D S D STAFF ABOUT ANY OF THE CODES THAT ARE BEING ADOPTED, THEY CAN EMAIL THE B R F C A B@SANANTONIO.GOV. 
          GOT THE VR UH, WELL, I'VE BEEN SAYING IT SINCE I'VE BEEN HERE, SO ABOUT THREE AND A HALF YEARS PLUS THE TWO YEARS I WAS ON THE BOARD AS WELL. 
          SO, UH, ABOUT A YEAR AGO I GOT IT FIGURED OUT, . 
          UH, AND THAT CONCLUDES ALL THE DIRECTOR'S REPORTS FOR TODAY. 
          DO WE WANNA ACCRUE THROUGH THE WEBSITE? UH, YEAH, IF Y'ALL WOULD LIKE, AND WE PUT A LOT OF EFFORT INTO THIS, SO WE WANNA SHOW IT OFF A LITTLE BIT. 
          SO THERE'S WHERE THE CALENDAR IS THERE AT THE BOTTOM. 
          UM, WE'LL HAVE THE TRACKING AND PUBLIC COMMENT, WHICH, UH, GOES STRAIGHT TO THAT EMAIL ADDRESS. 
          JEREMY MENTIONED, UM, THE CURRENT CODES OBVIOUSLY. 
          AND THEN WE HAVE, UH, UNDER PROCESS, WE HAVE A, UM, YOU CAN CLICK ON IT A FACT SHEET, RIGHT? SO IF ANYBODY'S INTERESTED ON, AND WHAT WE'RE DOING HERE, UH, THEY CAN GO HERE IS KIND OF A FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS, HOW IT WORKS, HOW LONG IS IT GONNA TAKE? AND THEN OBVIOUSLY ANY ADDITIONAL INFORMATION THEY CAN REACH OUT TO US. 
          AND, UM, WITH THAT EMAIL ADDRESS THERE AND THEN THE CALENDAR, THERE'S ALL OF OUR MEETINGS SCHEDULED THERE FOR THE NEXT FOUR MONTHS. 
          THAT IS CORRECT. 
          AND THAT BEING SAID, UH, THE NEXT PLAN MEETING FOR THIS COMMITTEE IS NEXT THURSDAY AT 1:00 PM FEBRUARY 24TH. 
          UH, ONCE AGAIN, IT'LL BE LIVE HERE IN THE, IN THE BOARDROOM AND WE'LL STREAM THAT LIVE, UH, FOR THE, ANY CITIZENS THAT ARE ABLE TO, TO ATTEND AND WE'LL RECORD THAT AND THEY'LL BE ABLE TO WATCH THAT ANYTIME THEY WANT FROM OUR WEBSITE. 
          GREAT. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU JEREMY. 
          SO THE RECORDING IS, UM, THE RECORDING OF OUR SESSION WILL BE UPLOADED TOMORROW. 
          UH, AND THEN WE'LL WORK ON GETTING THIS UPLOADED WITHIN 48 HOURS. 
          UH, AND THEN BACK TO YOU GUYS AS WELL WITH OUR, WITH OUR FINAL, UM, MOTION  BUSINESS DAYS. 
          OH, THE, THE 19TH. 
          YEAH. 
          NO, YOU, YOU DON'T HAVE TO BE ON THE SATURDAY. 
          NO, THAT'S A, UH, PUBLIC FORUM. 
          WE'LL BE ADDING THOSE AS WELL IN, IN ADDITION TO THAT, AS WE START SEEING THE NEED FOR MORE STAKEHOLDERS, THIS IS A MORE KIND OF INFORMATION ABOUT THIS PROCESS. 
          WE ALSO HAD ONE LAST TUESDAY NIGHT. 
          UH, BUT AS WE LOOK INTO ALSO STAKEHOLDER MEETINGS, YOU KNOW, IF ENERGY CODE REQUIREMENTS AND STUFF LIKE THAT BEFORE WE MOVE TO THE COMMITTEE AND WE SEE ITEMS THAT WE NEED TO ADDRESS AND GET A LITTLE BIT MORE CONSENSUS FROM STAKEHOLDERS BEFORE COMING TO THE THE COMMITTEE, THAT'LL BE SOME OF THE MEETINGS THAT WE'LL HAVE AND WE'LL POST THOSE AS WELL, SO YOU'LL BE AWARE OF THEM. 
          UH, BUT ONCE AGAIN, THESE WILL BE KIND OF MORE OF AN OPEN FORUM, UH, NOT A SPECIFIC COMMITTEE OR BOARD MEETING. 
          WELL, YOU'RE RIGHT TO BE PROUD OF THAT. 
          THAT'S A REALLY NEAT THING. 
          AND I CONGRATULATE ALL OF YOU FOR THE WORK, TREATING THE CITIZENS AS CUSTOMERS AND, AND MAKING THAT UP. 
          I'M BEING SERIOUS. 
          THAT'S THAT'S REALLY NEAT. 
          AND IT'S NOT SOMETHING YOU SEE VERY OFTEN, SO THANK YOU. 
          YEAH, AND I WANT TO THANK STAFF FOR PUTTING THE DOCUMENT TOGETHER. 
          I KNOW I TOOK A LOT OF TIME, ENERGY, AND EFFORT, BUT IT CERTAINLY MAKES OUR JOB A LOT EASIER ON THIS END OF THE EQUATION. 
          THANK Y'ALL. 
          ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS FROM THE COMMITTEE? ALL RIGHT, WE STAND ADJOURNED. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU.
* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.