* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting. [3:00 P.M. – Call to Order] [00:00:07] I HAD LIKE TO CALL TO ORDER THE HISTORIC AND DESIGN REVIEW COMMISSION FOR WEDNESDAY, JULY 20TH, 2022. MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE? GIBBS IS ABSENT. FISH IS ABSENT. SAVINA HERE. VELASQUEZ HERE. MORALES HERE. MASUKA HERE. CARPENTER HERE. GROUP IS RUNNING LATE. ANTE HERE. LA IS ABSENT. AND FETZER. HERE WE HAVE A QUORUM. THANK YOU. UH, BEFORE WE GET STARTED, WE DO HAVE A BRIEF ANNOUNCEMENT REGARDING INTERPRETIVE SERVICES FOR THE MEETING. ELLA, CAN WE PLEASE HAVE THE CHAIRMAN'S STATEMENT? THE HISTORIC AND DESIGN REVIEW COMMISSION IS AN ADVISORY BOARD APPOINTED BY THE CITY COUNCIL. I'M JEFFREY FETZER, CHAIRMAN AND THE VICE-CHAIR OF SCOTT CARPENTER. IT IS A FUNCTION OF THE COMMISSION TO ADVISE THE CITY MANAGER AND ALL RELEVANT CITY DEPARTMENTS CONCERNING ALL APPLICATIONS FOR PERMITS FOR PROPERTIES IN HISTORIC DISTRICTS FOR LANDMARKS ON CITY PROPERTY, IN THE RIVER IMPROVEMENT OVERLAY, AND FOR DEMOLITIONS. AND CONSIDERING WHETHER TO RECOMMEND APPROVAL OR DISAPPROVAL OF AN APPLICATION FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS, THE COMMISSION SHALL BE GUIDED BY THE CITY'S UNIFIED DEVELOPMENT CODE AND DESIGN GUIDELINES AND STANDARDS THAT HAVE BEEN ADOPTED BY CITY COUNCIL IN APPEAL. AN APPEAL OF A DECISION BY AN ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL CAN BE FILED IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE CITY'S UNIFIED DEVELOPMENT CODE. THE MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC CAN WATCH THIS MEETING THROUGH LIVESTREAM VIA THE CITY'S WEBSITE. FOLLOWING THE MEETING, A RECORDING WILL BE PROVIDED ON THE CITY'S WEBSITE. THE MEETING IS BEING RECORDED IN SPANISH AND ENGLISH. FOR THOSE APPLICANTS OR MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC THAT REQUIRE INTERPRETIVE SURFACES, SURFACES, THE INTERPRETER WILL TRANSLATE OVER THE PHONE AS NECESSARY. APPLICANTS ARE ASKED TO KEEP PRESENTATIONS AS BRIEF AS POSSIBLE TO ALLOW TIME FOR DISCUSSION. MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC WHO ARE SPEAKING IN SUPPORT OR OPPOSITION EACH HAVE A MAXIMUM OF TWO MINUTES FOR THEIR COMMENTS. COMMISSIONERS WILL BE LIMITED TO THREE MINUTES FOR QUESTIONS AND COMMENTS REGARDING EACH APPLICATION. MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION, AS WELL AS APPLICANTS ARE PART, ARE PARTICIPATING VIRTUALLY TODAY. WE ASK THAT THOSE WHO ARE ATTENDING SPEAK CLEARLY INTO A MICROPHONE SO EVERYONE CAN HEAR ALL COMMENTS. APPROVAL BY THE COMMISSION DOES NOT TAKE THE PLACE OF ANY TYPE OF PERMIT. PERMITS MUST BE OBTAINED FOR ALL WORK. CERTIFICATES OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR WORK APPROVED BY THE COMMISSION WILL BE EMAILED TO YOU WITHIN 10 DAYS. NO WORK OF ANY TYPE IS TO BE STARTED WITHOUT OBTAINING THE APPROPRIATE CITY PERMITS AFTER A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS HAS BEEN ISSUED BY THE OFFICE OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION. DIFFICULT QUESTIONS, TOUGH CHALLENGES TO A PARTICULAR POINT OF VIEW AND CRITICISM OF IDEAS AND INFORMATION ARE LEGITIMATE ELEMENTS OF A FREE DEMOCRACY IN ACTION. THIS DOES NOT ALLOW, HOWEVER, COMMISSIONERS, STAFF MEMBERS, APPLICANTS, OR MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC TO MAKE BELLIGERENT, PERSONAL IMPERTINENT OR THREATENING COMMENTS. ALL THOSE ATTENDING EITHER IN PERSON OR VIRTUALLY MUST HONOR THE ROLE OF THE CHAIR IN MAINTAINING ORDER. THEY MUST ALSO PRACTICE CIVILITY, PROFESSIONALISM, AND DECORUM IN DISCUSSIONS AND DEBATE. AT THIS TIME, I'LL ASK O H P STAFF TO PROVIDE ADDITIONAL INSTRUCTIONS FOR TODAY'S MEETING. YES, THANK YOU. CAN Y'ALL HEAR ME OKAY? NEW MICROPHONE. UM, SO A COUPLE OF QUICK ANNOUNCEMENTS FOR ITEMS ON THE AGENDA. SO ITEM 25, YOU'LL NOTE, 2 38 WEST HOLLYWOOD HAS BEEN WITHDRAWN AND WILL NOT BE HEARD TODAY. UM, AND ITEMS 27 AND 28, THOSE ARE 5 0 6 DEARIN, 3 0 5 LAVACCA HERE ON THE SCREEN. THOSE HAVE BOTH BEEN POSTPONED BY THE APPLICANT AND WILL NOT BE CONSIDERED TODAY. I DON'T THINK WE HAD ANY MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC SIGN IN TO SPEAK ON THOSE, BUT IF YOU'RE WATCHING ONLINE FOR THOSE UH, ITEMS, JUST KNOW THEY WON'T BE HEARD TODAY. UM, GOING BACK TO THE CONSENT ITEMS, WE HAVE, UM, 17 ITEMS ON THE CONSENT AGENDA AND WE HAVE A FEW VOICEMAILS TO PLAY FOR THOSE. UM, FIRST I WANT TO HIGHLIGHT THE U D C AMENDMENTS. AND SO, UH, YOU HAVE A HANDOUT AND THEY WERE POSTED ONLINE AS WELL OF 21 U D C AMENDMENTS REQUIRING ACTION BY THE H D R C TODAY. UM, THOSE HAVE GONE THROUGH THE FULL, UH, U D C UH, PROCESS AND I HAVE D S D STAFF HERE, UM, WHO CAN PROVIDE ADDITIONAL INFORMATION IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE. UM, I CAN SAY I WAS PROVIDED A SUMMARY THAT, UM, OF THE AMENDMENTS, UM, UP FOR CONSIDERATION TODAY. THERE HAVE BEEN 48 DIFFERENT TIMES WHEN THERE'S BEEN PUBLIC SUPPORT FOR THOSE ITEMS. UM, FOR ANOTHER CASE, THERE WAS, UH, THE ITEM FOR THE MISSION PROTECTION OVERLAY DISTRICTS. THERE WAS 48 LETTERS OF SUPPORT AND TWO IN OPPOSITION AT SOME POINT. BUT [00:05:01] PLEASE NOTE THAT THAT REQUEST HAS ALSO BEEN AMENDED. SO YOU'RE PROVIDED AN AMENDED VERSION OF ITEM 13 ONE, UM, I THINK IT'S AMENDMENT TWO ON YOUR LIST HERE. UM, SO JUST NOTE THAT THAT HAS BEEN AMENDED AT THE REQUEST OF THE APPLICANT WHO IS ALSO HERE AND CAN ANSWER QUESTIONS. BUT, UM, IF THERE AREN'T ANY QUESTIONS, IT MIGHT SEE ON CONSENT, BUT IT'S BEEN LIMITED TO 1800 FOOT, UH, UH, IN RADIUS FOR THE REVISION TO THE MISSION PROTECTION OVERLAY DISTRICTS. UM, SO IF THERE'S ACTION TO APPROVE THE UTC AMENDMENTS, JUST NOTE THAT THAT'LL BE ACTION ON THE AMENDED, UM, AMENDMENT FOR THAT ONE, ITEM TWO. UM, AND THEN OF COURSE, AND I SAID THIS EARLIER, UM, IN THE EMAIL, IF THERE'S ANY COMMISSIONERS THAT WANT TO CONSIDER IF THESE, ANY OF THESE INDIVIDUALLY OR HAVE QUESTIONS, UH, FOR CLARIFICATION FOR STAFF, UM, WE'RE HAPPY TO HEAR THOSE INDIVIDUALLY, BUT WE DO HAVE THEM ON CONSENT AT THIS TIME. UM, SO RACHEL, IF YOU'LL GO AHEAD AND START PLAYING THE VOICEMAILS THAT WE HAVE FOR CONSENT ITEMS, [Approval of Minutes] ACTUALLY, UH, APPROVAL OF MEETING MINUTES. THANK YOU. YES, WE HAVE MEETING MINUTES FROM JULY 6TH, I BELIEVE, JUNE 29TH. UH, MR. CHAIRMAN, I MOVE FOR APPROVAL OF B MINUTES FOR JUNE 29TH AS THANK YOU SUBMITTED. I SECOND IF YOU HAVE A MOTION AND SECOND, MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE? SAVINA? AYE. VELAZQUEZ VELASQUEZ. ONE MORE TIME. AYE. AYE. JUST LOOKING FOR THE BUTTON. MORALES AYE. MAZUA AYE. CARPENTER. AYE. GROOVE IS PRESENT GROUP. AYE. CERVANTES? YES. AND ZER AYE. MOTION PASSES. [CONSENT AGENDA Items are placed on the consent agenda when staff recommends approval or recommends approval with stipulations that the applicant agrees to. Any member of the public desiring to speak on a consent agenda item may sign up and be heard prior to voting on the consent agenda. Commissioners may request to remove any item from the consent agenda and have it placed on the individual consideration agenda. All items on the consent agenda will be considered for approval by one motion adopting the items with staff findings and recommendations.  ] THANK YOU. NOW CONSENT AGENDA ITEM ONE U D C AMENDMENTS. YES, THIS IS REGARDING AGENDA ITEM NUMBER ONE FOR THE 21 PROPOSED U D C AMENDMENTS, FIVE BEING DISCUSSED TODAY AT H D R C. MY NAME IS , I'M CHAIR OF THE MONTICELLO PARK NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION REVIEW COMMITTEE OFFERING COMMENTS ON BEHALF OF DREA GARZA, PRESIDENT OF M P AND A AND THE M P A BOARD OF DIRECTORS PO BOX 1 0 0 3 1 5 7 8 2. UH, WE APPRECIATE AND WE SUPPORT THE ONE PROPOSED CHANGES TO THE UNIFIED DEVELOPMENT CODE ON AGENDA ITEM NUMBER ONE. WE SPECIFICALLY WOULD LIKE TO RECOGNIZE, UM, THE OFFICE OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION FOR THEIR ROBUST PUBLIC ENGAGEMENT THAT THEY HAD REGARDING THESE AMENDMENTS. AS WE ALL KNOW, THE AMENDMENT PROCESS WAS PUT ON HOLD BECAUSE OF THE PANDEMIC. HOWEVER, O H P MAINTAINED TRANSPARENCY BY HAVING THESE AMENDMENTS AVAILABLE WELL BEFORE THEY SUBMITTED THEM TO THE PROCESS ON THEIR WEBSITE. AND THEY HELD STAKEHOLDER, UH, MEETINGS WITH THE HISTORIC DISTRICT COALITION AND SOUGHT TO OUTREACH TO THE COMMUNITY TO EDUCATE THEM AND BRING THEM FORWARD. UH, WITH SOME OF THESE PROPOSED CHANGES, UH, THAT ARE BEING PRESENTED TODAY, I THINK IT'S THE GOLD STANDARD IN WHAT THEY HAVE PROPOSED AND THE METHOD THAT THEY HAVE PROPOSED THESE AMENDMENTS WITH THE TRANSPARENCY. UM, M P N A IS VERY THANKFUL AND OF COURSE IS SUPPORTIVE. THANK YOU FOR CONSIDERING OUR COMMENTS. AND THANK YOU FOR SERVING ON H C R C ITEM 7 7 32 NORTH PINE. HELLO, MY NAME IS VALERIE CORTEZ AND I RESIDE AT 5 0 8 LAMAR STREET WITH INDIGNITY HILL. I'M CALLING ON BEHALF OF THE CONCERNED CITIZENS OF DIG WITTY HILL WITH REGARD TO CASE NUMBER 2022 DASH THREE 70, LOCATED AT 7 32 NORTH PINE. WHILE WE AGREE WITH O P'S RECOMMENDATION FOR THE REQUESTED FENCE LOCATION IN HEIGHT, WE'RE CONCERNED THAT THE FRONT SIDEWALK WAS NEVER TAKEN BACK TO CEMENT ROCK. FRONT SIDEWALKS WITH FLAGSTONE ARE NOT APPROPRIATE IN HISTORIC DISTRICTS AND WE BELIEVE THAT THE REQUEST TO HAVE THE SIDEWALK REPLACED WITH CEMENT SHOULD BE COMPLETED BY THE OWNER. THANK YOU. ITEM 8 19 14 EAST HOUSTON. HELLO, MY NAME IS VALERIE CORTEZ AND I RESIDE AT 5 0 8 LAMAR STREET WITHIN DIG WHITTY HILL. I'M CALLING ON BEHALF OF THE CONCERNED CITIZENS OF DIG WHITTY HILL WITH REGARD TO CASE NUMBER 2022 DASH TWO 90, LOCATED AT 1914 EAST HOUSTON STREET. ON THE REAR ELEVATION IS THE DOOR ON THE RIGHT, A SLIDING DOOR IF SLOW SLIDING DOORS ARE NOT HISTORICALLY ACCURATE AND SHOULD BE REPLACED WITH A STANDARD SIZED DOOR, THE SLIDING WINDOW SHOULD BE REPLACED WITH A TRADITIONAL ONE OVER ONE WINDOW AND WINDOWS MATERIALS SHOULD BE IDENTIFIED. THERE IS NO DELINEATION BETWEEN THE HISTORICAL ORIGINAL HOUSE AND THE NEW ADDITION. WE WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHERE THAT IS CALLED OUT IN THE APPLICATION. THE MATERIAL FOR THE REAR PORT SHOULD BE IDENTIFIED [00:10:01] AS MATERIALS LIST IN GENERAL FOR THE ENTIRE NEW EDITION. THE CONSTRUCTION DOCUMENTS ARE NOT COMPLETE. THERE ARE NO MEASUREMENTS FOR THE WINDOWS AND THEY ALMOST LOOK LIKE THEY'RE TOO CLOSE TO THE GROUND. THIS REQUEST SHOULD NOT BE APPROVED UNTIL A COMPLETE SET OF CONSTRUCTION DOCUMENTS ARE ITEM 11 9 0 9 HAYES. HELLO, MY NAME IS VALERIE CORTEZ AND I RESIDE AT 5 0 8 LAMAR STREET WITH IN DIGNITY HILL. I'M CALLING ON BEHALF OF THE CONCERNED CITIZENS OF DIGNITY HILL WITH REGARD TO CASE NUMBER 2022 DASH 3 4 7 LOCATED AT 9 0 9 HAYES STREET. WHILE WE DON'T DISAGREE WITH O P'S RECOMMENDATIONS, WE'RE WONDERING WHY THE NEW PATIO AND ROOM EDITION ARE NOT PART OF THIS REQUEST. MATERIALS LISTS, FENESTRATION AND ELEVATIONS ARE ALL REQUIRED FOR ANY ADDITIONS YET. WE DON'T SEE ANYTHING ABOUT THIS EVEN THOUGH THE DRAWINGS SHOW THESE TWO ADDITIONS. PLEASE CONFIRM. THANK YOU. UM, AND REAL QUICKLY, I WILL CONFIRM THAT THE REAR ADDITION AND PATIO WERE CONSIDERED AT A PREVIOUS HEARING THIS SPRING. I DON'T HAVE THE EXACT DATE, BUT I THINK THEY'VE BEEN ADDRESSED. SO THIS IS A REVISED OR NEW, NEW PART OF THAT SCOPE. AND ITEM 14 11 27 NOLAN. HELLO, MY NAME IS VALERIE CORTES AND I RESIDE AT 5 0 8 LAMAR STREET WITH DITY HILL. I'M CALLING ON BEHALF OF THE CONCERNED CITIZENS OF DIGNITY HILL WITH REGARD TO CASE NUMBER 2022 DASH 360 1, LOCATED AT 1127 NOLAN STREET. WE AGREE WITH O P'S RECOMMENDATION TO REMOVE THE WATER HEATER AND ADD AN ADDITION TO THE HOUSE, BUT WE DON'T AGREE WITH THE PLANS THAT WERE SUBMITTED FOR. THE ADDITION QUESTIONS WE HAVE ARE, WHERE IS THE NEW WATER HEATER GOING TO BE INSTALLED? WHAT TYPE OF SIDING IS GOING TO BE USED? WHAT TYPE OF SEPARATION WILL BE BETWEEN THE ORIGINAL HOUSE AND NEW ADDITION? WHERE IS THE MATERIALS LIST? A FORMAL SET OF DRAWINGS SHOULD BE SUBMITTED PRIOR TO APPROVING ANY ADDITION. THANK YOU. AND I'LL JUST CONFIRM, I DON'T BELIEVE WE HAVE ANY, UH, MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC SIGNED IN TO SPEAK ON ANY ITEMS. OKAY. SO DO COMMISSIONERS WISH TO PULL ANY ITEMS FOR INDIVIDUAL CONSIDERATION? I KNOW WE HAVE AT LEAST ONE RECUSAL FROM COMMISSIONER FETZER. UM, AND THEN I BELIEVE COMMISSIONER SABINO ALSO HAS A FEW, UH, COMMENTS ON CASES THAT SHE'D LIKE TO MAKE. UM, CORY, I'D I'D LIKE TO PULL JUST THE UUD C AMENDMENTS. A COUPLE OF QUICK COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS. IS THERE AN AN AMENDMENT IN PARTICULAR YOU WOULD LIKE TO DISCUSS? NO, IT'S KIND OF A GENERAL, UH, GENERAL COMMENT. ADDITIONALLY, I'D LIKE TO ACTUALLY DISCUSS ITEM NUMBER EIGHT IN ADDITION TO, UH, COMMISSIONER VASQUEZ'S POLL OF THE U D C AMENDMENTS. UH, LEMME CLARIFY. SO AMENDMENT EIGHT OR AGENDA ITEM EIGHT HERE. ITEM NUMBER EIGHT ON YOUR U D C AMENDMENTS, HISTORIC AND DESIGN REVIEW COMMISSION, UH, PROPOSALS. OKAY, SO THAT'S AMENDMENT 20 DASH SIX. THANK YOU. THAT IS CORRECT. I WOULD LIKE TO PULL ITEM NUMBER FIVE, UM, OF THE CONSENT AGENDA, ITEM NUMBER EIGHT AND NUMBER 11. AND I DO WANT TO COMMENT FOR ITEM NUMBER SEVEN, IF IT DOES NOT GET PULLED, UM, I DO WOULD LIKE THERE TO BE AN ACKNOWLEDGEMENT THAT WHATEVER NEW ITEMS, NEW INFORMATION, NEW DOCUMENTS, DRAWINGS THAT THE APPLICANT SUBMIT TO STAFF BASED ON OUR APPROVAL THAT THEY BE POSTED TO THE EXPLORER MAP. UM, I THINK IT'D BE WISE TO HAVE, UM, PUBLIC EYES AND EVERYBODY'S EYES ON WHAT DOES GET APPROVED. IT'S KIND OF AWKWARD IF WE'RE APPROVING SOMETHING THAT WE DON'T EVEN SEE AND STAFF DOESN'T EVEN SEE. SO, UM, THAT WOULD APPLY TO, UM, NUMBER SEVEN. AND SO LET, JUST FROM A PROCESS STANDPOINT, LET ME KIND OF CLARIFY WHAT HAPPENS IS IF WE DO GET, UM, ADDITIONAL DOCUMENTS FROM AN APPLICANT THAT ARE CREATED TO SHOW THAT THEY'RE ADDRESSING STIPULATIONS AS WE OFTEN DO, UM, IN ORDER TO, FOR US TO ISSUE THE C O A, UM, THOSE ULTIMATELY DO END UP AS PART OF THE CASE RECORD ON OUR END, BUT THEN ARE PUBLICLY VISIBLE THROUGH OUR ONLINE EXPLORER MAP. UM, PART OF WHAT COMMISSIONER SABINO IS ALSO SUGGESTING IS AS WE GET ITEMS THAT ARE, UH, LATE, UM, SO SOMETIMES WE POST THE AGENDA AND THEN WE GET SOMETHING THAT WAS CREATED AFTER THE FACT TO MAKE THOSE AVAILABLE AS SOON AS POSSIBLE THROUGH THAT ONLINE EXPLORER MAP. AND WE'RE CERTAINLY COMMITTED TO DOING THAT. THANKS AS CHAIRMAN. IN ADDITION TO THE, UH, ITEMS THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN, UH, DRAWN FOR INDIVIDUAL CONSERVATION, I'D LIKE TO, UH, DRAW NUMBER EIGHT AND NUMBER 14 BASED UPON COMMENTS THAT WE RECEIVED. SO WE'RE PULLING CONSENT AGENDA ITEMS [00:15:01] 1, 5, 8, 11, AND 14. CORRECT. ANYTHING ELSE? AND THEN 10 FOR RECUSAL. OKAY. AND I AM RECUSING SO YOU CAN HANDLE THE BALANCE OF THE OKAY. CONSENT AGENDA. ALRIGHT. LET THE RECORD STATE THAT COMMISSIONER FETZER HAS LEFT THE ROOM AND, UM, I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION THEN FOR THE BALANCE, WHICH WOULD BE ITEMS 2, 3, 4, 6, 7, 9, 12, 13, 15, 16, AND 17. SO JUST TO CLARIFY, ITEM 10 WOULD BE INCLUDED ON THIS VOTE AND ITEM 10? CORRECT. I'LL MAKE A MOTION THAT WE ACCEPT THOSE STATED ITEMS FOR CONSENT ON THE CONSENT AGENDA WITH ALL STAFF STIPULATIONS. WE HAVE A MOTION. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND. A SECOND. MOTION IS SECOND. ROLL CALL PLEASE. SAVINA. AYE. VELAZQUEZ. AYE. AYE. AYE. THANK YOU. MORALES. AYE. MASUKA. AYE. CARPENTER. AYE. GROUP. AYE. ANTES? YES. CHAIRMAN. FETZER IS RECUSED. MOTION PASSES. I THANK YOU. OKAY. UM, IF CHAIRMAN FETZER CAN REJOIN US, I THINK HE HEARS ME. [INDIVIDUAL CONSIDERATION  ] UM, WE'VE GOT QUITE A FEW ITEMS TO DISCUSS. SO, UM, WE WILL QUICKLY MOVE TO U D C AMENDMENTS. UM, IF IT'S A DISCUSSION WE CAN HAVE QUICKLY, THEN I'D SAY LET'S GO AHEAD AND HAVE IT. IF WE THINK THAT, UM, WE'RE GONNA HAVE A LOT OF DISCUSSION, WE MIGHT CONSIDER HOLDING IT LATER IN THE HEARING SO THAT WE CAN GET THROUGH SOME OF THE NORMAL CASES, BUT I'LL LEAVE THAT TO THE CHAIR. COMMISSIONER VELASQUEZ? UH, OKAY. WELL, PART, PART OF, I, I GUESS MAYBE WE'RE GONNA HIT TWO, TWO, UH, TWO ITEMS OR TWO QUESTIONS WITH ONE 'CAUSE. UM, ON THE, ON THE SPREADSHEET IS THE MASTER LIST, FORMAL ACTION EIGHT HAS POTENTIAL IMPACT OF AMENDMENT ON HISTORIC PROPERTIES, WHICH SEEMS TO BE REALLY KIND OF GROSSLY MISCHARACTERIZED. IT WOULD DEFINITELY BE CITYWIDE AND IT WOULD DEFINITELY BE, YOU KNOW, HISTORIC OBVIOUSLY, BUT JUST ON REVIEW, YOU KNOW, JUST LOOKING FOR THAT ONE ITEM. THAT'S THE PLACE, YOU KNOW, WHERE I LOOK FOR REFERENCE AND, AND IT, IT MOST DEFINITELY, YOU KNOW, IS NOT, IS NOT CATEGORIZED IN, IN A PROPER WAY. UM, NOW WITH RESPECT TO THAT, UM, THE, THE LANGUAGE THAT IS IN FRONT OF US IS NOT REALLY AS MUCH AS HAS BEEN EXPLAINED TO US THROUGH THE, THROUGH THE BRIEFS THAT, THAT WE GET, AT LEAST THE PAPERWORK BRIEFS. RIGHT. UM, AND A COUPLE OF THE CONCERNS THAT I HAVE WITH RESPECT TO IT, I, I KNOW THAT THERE, THAT THERE'S SOME LANGUAGE THAT TALKS ABOUT THE MAKEUP OF THE, OF THE MEMBERSHIPS AND, AND THERE'S A, A, YOU KNOW, KIND OF AN EFFORT TO SET THE BAR HIGHER TO LOOK FOR PROFESSIONALS IN THE INDUSTRY, UH, ARCHITECTS, URBAN PLANNERS, UH, PERSONALITIES OF THAT, OF THAT MATTER. I DON'T KNOW IF THAT LANGUAGE STAYED IN THE, IN THE, UM, YEAH, THE LANGUAGE. ACTUALLY, WE WILL PULL IT UP ON THE SCREEN FIRST AND THEN WE'LL TALK ABOUT IT. IF, UH, YOU CAN GET THAT PULLED UP FOR US, RACHEL, ZOOM IN A LITTLE BIT MORE SO THAT I CAN SEE IT, THEN I CAN HELP YOU GET THERE. THAT'S TOO FAR. ONE MOMENT. HERE IT IS. UM, SO THE RED TEXT AS A REMINDER IS LANGUAGE THAT IS EXISTING IN THE U D C THAT IS PROPOSED FOR REMOVAL. THE BLUE UNDERLINED TEXT IS WHAT IS PROPOSED. UM, IT'S SIMILAR, BUT IT'S [00:20:01] SIMPLIFIED. AND SO I CAN SAY THAT THIS LANGUAGE IS CONSISTENT WITH THE GUIDANCE THAT THE, UH, STATE HISTORIC PRESERVATION OFFICE PROVIDES TO US. UM, AND ALSO INCORPORATES, UM, SOME OF THE PREVIOUS LANGUAGE AS WELL. OKAY. WELL, THE, THE ISSUE, LET ME, LET ME BE VERY DIRECT. UM, AND, AND IT HAS TO DO WITH, YOU KNOW, THE, THE, THE PREVAILING, UH, DISCUSSION NATIONWIDE, RIGHT? WITH RESPECT TO EQUITY AS A, AS A, AS A GOAL, UH, OUTCOME, RIGHT? AN OUTCOME OF OUR GOALS. NOW, UH, THE GENERAL COMMENT IS THAT, YOU KNOW, IT'S SURPRISING TO ME THAT EQUITY DOES NOT ENTER INTO THE LANGUAGE IN ANY WAY, SHAPE OR FORM INSIDE OF, UH, U D C AMENDMENTS OR INSIDE OF ANY OVERARCHING SPIRIT OF THE, OF THE WAY THAT, THAT WE'RE TO APPLY, UM, OUR, OUR, OUR DELIBERATION. AND, AND THAT'S NOT JUST SPEAKING ABOUT IT WITH RESPECT TO MY OPINION, BUT THE OPINION OF THE CITY OF SAN ANTONIO AND THE EFFORTS THAT IT'S MADE TO, UH, TO TRY TO BALANCE OUT, UH, THE WAY THE CITY IS GROWING AND THE, AND, AND, YOU KNOW, THE, THE, THE, UM, RE REOCCURRING, YOU KNOW, KIND OF DUBIOUS FACT THAT SAN ANTONIO'S THE MOST ECONOMICALLY SEGREGATED CITY IN THE NATION. NOW, THAT, UH, APPLIED TO THIS, UH, PIECE HERE IS VERY IMPORTANT AS WELL BECAUSE, UH, WHEN, RIGHT NOW, THE WAY THAT A COUNCIL PERSON, UH, SELECTS, UH, AN INDIVIDUAL FROM A COMMUNITY, OBVIOUSLY IT HAS, ITS, ITS ITS COMPLICATIONS WITH, WITH THE POSSIBILITY THAT SOMEBODY COULD BE SELECTED TO PARTICIPATE ON THIS COMMISSION THAT DOESN'T KNOW THE FIRST THING ABOUT PRESERVATION. AND, AND I CAN, I CAN UNDERSTAND THE, THE, UM, THE HESITATION FOR, FOR CONTINUING A PROCESS THAT WORKS THAT WAY. BUT I THINK ONE THING THAT HAS TO BE REALLY TAKEN INTO CONSIDERATION IS THAT WHEN WE RAISE THE BAR HIGH LIKE THAT, WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A CITY THAT'S 67% LATINO, UH, WHEN WE, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN WE BRING IN THE, THE, THE, THE KIND OF VERY, UH, UH, UH, UM, VERY WELL-KNOWN STATISTICS OF GRADUATIONS, UH, OF THE, I MEAN THE AMOUNT OF ARCHITECTS THAT EXIST IN LATINO COMMUNITY VERSUS OTHER COMMUNITIES, THE AMOUNT OF URBAN PLANNERS, ENGINEERS, ALL THAT GAMUT OF PROFESSIONALS, AT SOME LEVEL, THE GENERAL, UH, UH, PROCESS OR, OR THE PROCESS OF, OF, OF SELECTING FROM THE GENERAL PUBLIC PROVIDES THE GREATEST OPPORTUNITY FOR BALANCE OF A SYSTEM THAT IS DISPROPORTIONATELY WEIGHED TOWARD ONE CULTURE VERSUS ANOTHER. AND WE'VE HAD THIS CONVERSATION MANY TIMES, OR AT LEAST I'VE, I'VE PUSHED A CONVERSATION MANY TIMES THAT WE'RE PRIMARILY WORKING IN COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE HISTORICALLY, UM, UM, UH, NOT INCLUDED THE PERS THE PER UH, PERSPECTIVES OR, OR THE, THE BUILT ENVIRONMENT, UM, UM, UM, CHARACTERISTICS OF A COMMUNITY THAT WAS, YOU KNOW, THE 1920S, 1930S DIDN'T EVEN GET TO PARTICIPATE. SO, SO THERE IT SEEMS THAT, THAT, THAT EVERYTHING SEEMS TO JUST, UH, CODIFY ITSELF IN SUCH A MANNER AS TO PROTECT THE, THE, YOU KNOW, THE ABSOLUTE, UH, UH, ADHERENCE, UH, OR ACCULTURATION TO, YOU KNOW, THE, THE, THE, YOU KNOW, THE RACIST COMMUNITY, THE S COMMUNITY OF SEGREGATION OF THE PRE 1950S. AND, AND THE MINORITY COMMUNITY'S EXPECT IT JUST TO, UM, UH, GO ALONG WITH IT BECAUSE THAT'S JUST THE WAY THAT IT'S BEEN. AND NOW, UH, WE'RE LOOKING AT SIMPLIFYING A LANGUAGE THAT TALKS ABOUT PARTICIPATION BECAUSE I MEAN, PROFESSIONALLY IT MAKES SENSE, BUT, BUT WITH RESPECT TO THE WAY THAT, UH, YOU KNOW, THE, THE PERCENTAGE OR IN THE SINGLE DIGITS OF LATINO PARTICIPATION IN THE PROFESSIONS THAT MAKE UP WHAT LEADS YOU TO A HISTORIC PRESERVATION BACKGROUND OR AN ARCHITECTURE BACKGROUND, UM, IT JUST, IT, IT NOW IT MINIMIZES THAT POOL OF, OF, OF PARTICIPATION FROM THE CITIZENS AT LARGE. OR IF NOTHING LESS, IT SURE MAKES A HELL OF AN ARGUMENT FOR WHY SOMEBODY'S NOT ABLE TO SIT ON THIS COMMISSION. SO, UH, I DON'T KNOW WHERE JIMMY'S HEADED, BUT I'M, I'M, I'M, I'M DYING TO HEAR WHAT JIMMY'S COMMENTS ARE, BUT I, I, I PERSONALLY, UH, FIND, UM, UH, THAT THAT EIGHT REALLY SHOULD BE DROPPED, THAT IT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT, THAT I WOULD SUPPORT, UH, BECAUSE FIRST OF ALL, THE STATUS QUO, IT'S WORKING, RIGHT? BUT, BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY, IT IT, IF IT'S GONNA DO SOMETHING LIKE WHAT IT'S ATTEMPTING TO DO, IT REALLY NEEDS TO INCLUDE THE LANGUAGE OF, OF EQUITY. NOW, LET ME JUST TELL YOU, LOOK, THE, THE, YOU KNOW, WHEN WE TALK ABOUT PRESERVATION AND, AND, AND THE, AND THE CODES THAT, THAT ENFORCE PRESERVATION, THE ME THE MEDIAN HOUSEHOLD, UH, THE MEDIAN HOME COST IN SAN ANTONIO IS HITTING $350,000 IN, IN SAN DIEGO, IT'S $600,000. THESE MECHANISMS ARE GENTRIFYING OUR [00:25:01] COMMUNITY AT, AT LEVELS THAT WE ARE NOT ABLE TO KEEP UP WITH, AND WE ARE NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO KEEP UP WITH. THE NUMBER OF NEW HOME PURCHASES IN OUR INNER CITY ARE NOT BY THE TRADITIONAL PERSON BUYING A HOUSE OR BY THE TRADITIONAL FLIPPER BUYING A HOUSE. 45% RIGHT NOW IS OF LIMITED LIABILITY CORPORATIONS. AND THE WAY THAT OUR, OUR, OUR, OUR H H D R C, OUR, OUR EXPANSION OF OUR JURISDICTIONS AND, AND, AND THE KIND OF THE HEARTLESS, UH, MECHANISM THAT WE HAVE WITH RESPECT TO THE, THE BLATANT ECONOMIC INEQUITY IN THIS CITY AND, AND, AND WHAT IN THE LATINO COMMUNITY HISTORICALLY BEEN THE, THE BENCHMARK CORNERSTONE OF UPWARD MOBILITY, UH, UH, ALL OF THESE ARE, ARE, ARE, ARE SERIOUSLY AFFECTING OUR ABILITIES TO, TO REMAIN IN THE INNER CITY AS, AS, AS PEOPLE THAT ARE MAKING, IT'LL BE BELOW SIX DIGITS. SO, UM, I'LL TURN IT OVER TO JIMMY. THANK YOU CO. THANK YOU, CORY. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR HOUSE, YOUR HONOR. LOCK, THE, SO, UM, YEAH, JUST PIGGYBACK ON PIGGYBACKING OFF OF WHAT COMMISSIONER VASQUEZ SAID, I'M LOOKING AT THIS MORE FROM A, A BALANCED STANDPOINT, RIGHT? UM, FROM A PROCESS AND GOVERNMENTAL STANDPOINT, YOU DEFINITELY DON'T WANT TO EXCLUDE THE GENERAL PUBLIC, AND I'M SPEAKING BECAUSE I AM THE EXAMPLE OF THAT, WHAT YOU ARE JUST DESCRIBING RIGHT HERE IS ACTUALLY ME. I'VE GOT A BACKGROUND IN PLANNING, I'VE GOT A BACKGROUND IN GOVERNMENT, BUT I DON'T HAVE A BACKGROUND IN HISTORICAL PRESERVATION. OKAY? SO, BUT WHAT I DO HAVE A BACKGROUND IS IN COMMON SENSE, IS IN COMMON SENSE. I LIKE TO THINK EVERYBODY ELSE DOES. SO, WHILE ME AND MY COMMISSIONERS HAVE NOT ALWAYS AGREED ON CERTAIN ASPECTS, I HAVE BOTH LEARNED FROM THEM, AND I'VE LEARNED FROM THE STAFF, AND I'VE LEARNED FROM THIS, FROM THIS BOARD, I THINK RELATIVELY QUICKLY HOW TO BALANCE THAT. AND I THINK IF YOU EXCLUDE, I'M GOING TO, I'M GONNA SAY THE, THE COMMON PERSON, RIGHT? THE COM, IF YOU EXCLUDE THEM OR YOU GIVE PREFERENTIAL TREATMENT TO, TO KEEP THEM OUT, I THINK THAT'S KIND OF CONTRIBUTING TO SOME SORT OF INEQUALITY OR, UH, ECONOMIC INEQUALITY REPRESENTATION IN THIS WHOLE PROCESS. UM, I WOULD THINK THAT THESE OUTLINE OR THESE PARAMETERS THAT YOU HAVE OUTLINED HERE WOULD PROBABLY BE BETTER APPLIED TO THE STAFF. NOT SAYING THAT THEY'RE NOT, BUT IF YOU'RE, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE HIRING PEOPLE, YOU WANT, YOU WANNA BE STRICT ON YOUR, YOUR PAID EMPLOYEES. YOU WANNA BE STRICT ON WHO YOU HAVE DOING THIS DAY TO DAY, AS OPPOSED TO THE POLITICAL APPOINTEES, RIGHT? UM, AND I DEFER TO THE EXPERTISE OF THE STAFF ON, ON, ON, ON A GREAT MANY, UH, UH, ITEMS, RIGHT? AS WELL AS SOMETIMES THE EXPERTISE, UH, OF MY FELLOW, UH, UH, COMMISSIONERS. SO I, I WOULD SAY THAT NUMBER EIGHT RIGHT NOW, FROM THAT STANDPOINT, I, I HAVE TO AGREE WITH, WITH, UH, UH, COMMISSIONER SKE, IT'S NOT NECESSARILY ON THE SAME SAME LINES OF IT, BUT YEAH, I DO AGREE WITH IT. UM, WITH HIS ASSESSMENT, THEN YOU START LOOKING AT PROCESSES, GROWTH OF THE CITY, UM, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE GONNA HA YOU'RE GONNA START HAVING BUILDINGS AND NEIGHBORHOODS THAT ARE GONNA START, UH, AGING IN, AND THAT'S GOING TO INCREASE STAFF WORKLOAD, RIGHT? AND YOU'RE LOOKING AT PROPO POTENTIALLY PUTTING TWO, TWO SEPARATE COMMISSIONS TO HANDLE TWO DIFFERENT SIDES OF THE WORKLOAD. THAT'S BIGGER GOVERNMENT, RIGHT? THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT WE DON'T WANT AS TAXPAYERS, RIGHT? WE DON'T WANT BIGGER GOVERNMENT. WE WANT A PROCESS THAT'S STREAMLINED, RIGHT? SO THAT'S WHERE MY ISSUE IS WITH NUMBER EIGHT ON THAT STANDPOINT. UM, I HONESTLY THINK IT'S GONNA BE DIFFICULT TO FILL TWO, UH, COMMISSIONS. UM, YOU KNOW, AND AGAIN, I'M JUST TRYING TO LOOK OUT FOR THE TAXPAYER IN THIS ASPECT. I'M TRYING TO LOOK OUT FOR THE ECONOMIC REPRESENTATION OF PEOPLE ON, ON, ON THE BOARD THAT LIVE IN THE PARTS OF THE CITY THAT MAYBE, UH, UH, THAT MIGHT GET EXCLUDED FROM. UM, SO WITH THAT SAID, I, I'D HAVE TO DISAGREE WITH NUMBER EIGHT IN ITS CURRENT FORM, RIGHT? IN ITS CURRENT FORM. I THINK THAT IF, IF GUIDELINES, STANDARDS, I LIKE TO USE THE WORD STANDARDS, RIGHT? I KNOW WE HAVE GUIDELINES. I LIKE THE WORD STANDARDS BECAUSE IF YOU'RE GIVING ME GUIDELINES, I CAN SEE YOU ON GUIDELINES AND WIN ALL DAY LONG. I THINK I MENTIONED THAT TO THE COUNSELOR A FEW MONTHS AGO, RIGHT? BUT IF YOU GIVE ME STANDARDS AND YOU SOLIDIFY 'EM, YOU MAKE 'EM A LITTLE BIT STRICTER, I THINK THE NEED FOR A SECOND COMMISSION WON'T BE THERE. I THINK IF WE REWRITE OUR, OUR, OUR, OUR, OUR GUIDEBOOK, YOU KNOW, ON CERTAIN ASPECTS, NOT EVERYTHING, EVERYTHING'S STILL GONNA BE A CASE BY CASE. I GET IT. SO THERE'S GONNA BE SOME CASE BY CASE PRESENTATIONS, BUT I THINK WE ARE KIND OF MAKING A LITTLE MORE WORK FOR US. AND I, WHEN I SPEAK FOR US, I SPEAK AS THE CITY OF SAN ANTONIO STAFF COMMISSION, BUT MOSTLY STAFF AND WHATNOT. UM, I THINK WE'RE ACTUALLY GIVING US A LITTLE BIT MORE WORK BY HAVING AMBIGUOUS GUIDELINES, WHICH THERE IS A POSITIVE TO AMBIGUOUS GUIDELINES. THERE IS A POSITIVE TO THAT. WHEN YOU HAVE A SMALL CITY, WHEN YOU'RE DEALING WITH A SMALL WORKLOAD AND YOU HAVE THE TIME TO DO THAT, THEN THAT'S FINE. BUT I, I THINK THIS, THIS, THIS, UH, THIS OFFICE IS GONNA GET, UH, OVERWHELMED WITH WORKLOAD HERE IN THE NEXT FIVE TO 10 YEARS IF IT HASN'T BEEN OVERWORKED ALREADY. [00:30:03] THAT'S ALL I HAVE. I HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS YES. REGARDING THAT ONE. UM, SO LET ME UNDERSTAND THE PROCESS CORRECTLY. IF WE DON'T AGREE ON IT, THIS IS NOT THE SETTING TO AMEND OR MODIFY OR REVISE, AND THAT THERE WOULD BE ANOTHER OCCASION TO DO THAT AND BRING THIS BACK. THIS IS ABSOLUTELY THE SETTING. AND OH, MELISSA, IF YOU WANNA COME UP AND SPEAK A LITTLE BIT TO THE TIMELINE, BUT I MEAN, THE TIMELINE IS SET. THIS IS GONNA BE MOVING FORWARD TO PLANNING COMMISSION WITH A RECOMMENDATION OR NON RECOMMENDATION FROM THIS BODY. AND SO IF THERE'S A CHANCE TO GET TO AN AGREEMENT THAT, THAT WE'RE SATISFIED WITH, AND THIS WOULD BE THE BEST ARENA FOR THAT. OKAY. MY SECOND QUESTION WOULD BE, MELISSA, DID YOU WANNA ADD ANYTHING? NO, THAT WAS, THAT WAS PERFECT, COREY, I'LL JUST BE HERE IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS. OKAY, GREAT. THANK YOU, COMMISSIONERS. AND MY SECOND QUESTION IS, UM, BASED ON THE, THE PREVIOUS RED TEXT THAT HAS BEEN REDACTED, WHAT ABOUT THAT TEXT DID YOU FEEL NEEDED TO BE CHANGED? UH, THAT'S WHAT WE'RE OPERATING UNDER CURRENTLY. WHAT WOULD WE NEED TO CHANGE? SO THIS LANGUAGE HAS ALWAYS BEEN, UM, PROVIDED AT THE STATE LEVEL. AND SO WE'VE BEEN FOLLOWING THIS, THE STATE'S LEAD ON THIS ISSUE SINCE THEY PROVIDE THE GUIDANCE FOR CERTIFIED LOCAL GOVERNMENTS FOR, UM, COMPOSITION AND MEMBERSHIP OF COMMISSIONS. THEY, THEY HAVE REMOVED THIS LANGUAGE. AND SO WE WERE ACTUALLY TRYING TO ADD FLEXIBILITY. UM, SO FLEXIBILITY IS THE NAME OF THE GAME. UM, IF YOU, IF YOU READ THIS NOW, IT SAYS, SHALL BE COMPRISED OF THE FOLLOWING CATEGORIES. AND SO THAT CAN MAKE IT MORE DIFFICULT FOR COUNCIL MEMBERS TO DEFINE SOMEBODY THAT MEETS THE RIGHT QUALIFICATIONS. UM, ULTIMATELY AT THE COUNCIL LEVEL, THEY CAN WAIVE THOSE REQUIREMENTS. AND SO WE DO SEE, UM, MEMBERSHIP FROM PEOPLE THAT DON'T NECESSARILY MEET THESE QUALIFICATIONS NOW. UM, AND SO THE, THE, THE, UM, THE RECOMMENDED LANGUAGE IS MEANT TO KIND OF, UH, PROVIDE FLEXIBILITY, BUT ALSO HONOR THAT WE ARE LOOKING FOR, UM, SUBJECT MATTER EXPERTS IN THE FIELD AS WELL AS GENERAL POSITIONS STILL. AND SO YOU'LL SEE THAT THERE'S STILL OPPORTUNITY FOR GENERAL POSITIONS, UM, AND THIS WOULD ALLOW COUNCIL PEOPLE TO HAVE THAT FLEXIBILITY TO APPOINT THE PEOPLE THAT THEY SEE FIT AND THAT A REPRESENTATIVE OF THEIR NEIGHBORHOODS. AND THEN, SO WHAT IS THE MEANS BY WHICH WE WOULD GET AN EQUAL DISTRIBUTION OF THOSE PROFESSIONS, BACKGROUNDS, AND, UM, UH, DISCIPLINES WITH THE REWRITE? SEE, I THINK THAT'S KIND OF THE BENEFIT OF WHAT THE PREVIOUS, UM, DRAFT OR THE, THE EXISTING DRAFT DOES, IS IT GIVES YOU THAT GUARANTEED DISTRIBUTION. SO WE DON'T END UP WITH, LORD FORBID, 11 ARCHITECTS. I MEAN, WE'RE NOT FAR FROM THAT. WE, WE'VE GOT, GOT QUITE A FEW ARCHITECTS ON THE BOARD NOW, UM, WHICH IS APPROPRIATE. I MEAN, YOU'RE DEALING WITH DESIGN ISSUES, AND SO IT'S HELPFUL TO HAVE THAT, THAT LEVEL OF EXPERTISE. UM, BUT I'M JUST GONNA REPEAT LIKE THIS, THIS SAYS THAT PREFERENCE SHALL BE GIVEN TO THOSE CATEGORIES. AND SO IT'S DIRECTION AND GUIDANCE FOR COUNCILS AND MAKING THEIR APPOINTMENTS, UM, BUT IT'S NOT BINDING THEM TO ANY SORT OF, UH, UH, EXPERIENCE REQUIREMENT. MR. CHAIRMAN. YEAH, I WANTED TO SEIZE UPON THAT BECAUSE I, I THINK THE, THE OPERATIVE WORD HERE FOR ME IS PREFERENCE AND THAT IT'S INCUMBENT UPON THE ELECTED OFFICIALS TO THE CITY COUNCIL TO APPOINT, YOU KNOW, COMMISSIONERS THAT ARE REFLECTIVE OF THE COMMUNITIES THEY REPRESENT. AND I THINK THAT'S SORT OF BAKED INTO THE PIE HERE. UM, I DO APPRECIATE THE, THE, THE COMMENTS THOUGH THAT HAVE BEEN MADE BY BOTH, UH, BY ALL THREE, UH, COMMISSIONERS SO FAR REGARDING THIS. BUT I, I ACTUALLY DID SEE THIS AS, AS BEING MORE FLEXIBLE AND PERHAPS OPENING UP THE ABILITY TO, UM, YOU KNOW, FILL THE COMMISSION MORE READILY. AND ALSO, KEEP IN MIND THIS, THIS IS CREATING A SORT OF, SORT OF A TECHNICAL COMMITTEE AND THEN A, UM, ONE THAT WILL DEAL WITH, UH, PERHAPS MORE GLOBAL ISSUES IN THE, IN THE, IN THE CITY HERE. SO I THINK IT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE TO HAVE PEOPLE WHO ARE MAYBE MORE TECHNICALLY MINDED, UH, ON THIS, UH, ON THIS NEWLY FORMED, UH, COMMISSION THAT'S GOING TO BE DEALING WITH, WITH, UM, UH, COMPLIANCE CASES AND THINGS LIKE THAT. SO I, I THINK IT SHOULD PROBABLY BE WEIGHTED TOWARDS THAT. BUT I THINK FOR ME, THAT OPERATIVE WORD OF PREFERENCE STILL, YOU KNOW, THE, THE ULTIMATE DECISIONS MADE BY THE, UH, CITY COUNCIL ON WHO THEY WANT TO APPOINT. AND IF THERE'S SOMEONE WHO IS, YOU KNOW, AN ACTIVIST IN THE COMMUNITY OR IS, IS A HISTORIAN THAT'S OF, YOU KNOW, UH, DIFFERENT FROM AN ARCHITECTURAL HISTORIAN OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, I THINK THEY'RE, YOU KNOW, FULLY, UH, IT'S WITHIN THEIR, THEIR, UM, POWERS TO, TO APPOINT THAT PERSON AND TO HAVE THAT BE MORE REPRESENTATIVE OF OUR COMMUNITY. THANK YOU, COMMISSIONER. YES. I WOULD, UM, ECHO THOSE COMMENTS, AND I THANK ALL THE COMMISSIONERS FOR THEIR COMMENTS. UM, AND BASED ON THE FACT THAT IT SAYS PREFERENCE [00:35:01] IN TERMS OF, UH, THE DISCIPLINES OR BACKGROUNDS OF THE, THOSE SELECTED AND THE FACT THAT WE'RE, UH, FOLLOWING ONTO THE T H C, UH, TITLE 13, IT SAYS, UH, ALL MEMBERS SHALL HAVE A DEMONSTRATED INTEREST, COMPETENCE, OR KNOWLEDGE OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION, WHICH, UH, TELLS ME THAT IF THERE, IT'S OPEN TO ANYONE WHO HAS THAT INTEREST. SOME OF THEM MAY HAVE PROFESSIONAL DEGREES OR, UH, UH, LIFETIME EXPERIENCES THAT WOULD, UH, SPEAK MORE TO, UH, ARCHITECTURE PLANNING, UH, THAT SORT OF THING. BUT, UH, IT DOES NOT PRECLUDE, UM, THE COUNCIL PERSON APPOINTING, UH, A SOMEONE WHO DOESN'T HAVE THAT, UM, EDUCATIONAL BACKGROUND, BUT HAS A, AN INTEREST, UH, IN THE, IN HISTORIC PRESERVATION. SO I'M IN FAVOR OF, OF THIS PARTICULAR, UH, U G C AMENDMENT FOR THOSE REASONS. AND THE FACT THAT, UH, SPLITTING THE, THE WORKLOAD FROM THE H C R C, UH, AND UH, CREATING THE COMPLIANCE AND TECHNICAL ADVISORY BOARD, I THINK WILL HELP STREAMLINE THE H C R C, UH, CASELOAD AND AGENDA AND ACTUALLY BE BENEFICIAL FOR, UM, APPLICANTS MR. MR. CHAIR. UH, ONE MOMENT. WE HAVE SOME OTHER COMMISSIONERS TO SPEAK FIRST. OKAY. YES. I HAD A QUESTION. ARE THESE THE SAME, UH, QUALIFICATIONS THAT WERE USED FOR US TO BE ON THIS PANEL, ON THIS COMMISSION? YEAH. THE, THE LANGUAGE IN RED IS EXISTING TODAY, EVEN THOUGH IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S, IT'S PROPOSED FOR REMOVAL, BUT THIS IS WHAT WE ARE WORKING OFF TODAY. AND SO, AS, AS I MENTIONED, SO EVEN THOUGH IT SAYS, SHALL, UM, COUNSEL HAS THE ABILITY TO WAIVE, YOU KNOW, OUR OWN REQUIREMENTS, AND SO IF THERE'S EVER AN APPOINTMENT THAT DOESN'T FALL INTO ONE OF THESE CATEGORIES, THEN THE APPOINTMENT STILL MOVES FORWARD WITH, WITH COUNSEL'S DECISION. OKAY. THAT'S A QUESTION, BECAUSE IF, IF WHAT'S IN BLUE ALLOWS FOR THE SAME MECHANISMS THAT ARE IN RED, THEN I'M IN AGREEMENT BECAUSE THAT'S HOW I'M ON THIS BOARD. COMMISSIONER GRU. YEAH, I WAS GONNA SAY, UM, I, I AGREE WITH COMMISSIONER, UH, CHAIRMAN FETZER, AND COMMISSIONER CARPENTER WAS SAYING IS, UH, THIS IS A PREFERENCE. AND I THINK THAT'S THE KEY WORD. UM, I WAS ALSO GONNA REFER TO ITEM C, WHICH IS THE COMPOSITION AND QUALIFICATION. MM-HMM. , IT SAYS, SENSITIVE TO THE PRESERVATION AND DEVELOPMENT GOALS OF THE CITY. IT IS TOTALLY UP TO CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS, AND, AND WE ALSO GET REAPPOINTED EVERY TWO YEARS, UH, OR JUST CHOOSE TO STAY ON. BUT IT IS REALLY, I THINK, UM, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I SOMETIMES, YOU KNOW, TELL THE CITY COUNCIL, UH, PEOPLE THAT I KNOW IS PERSONALLY IS I WOULD JUST RATHER SEE MORE WOMEN ON THE BOARD AND BE MORE, YOU KNOW, ACTIVE IN THAT PART. UM, I'VE BEEN ON IT NOW FOR OVER SIX YEARS, AND I DON'T THINK WE'VE BEEN MORE THAN TWO WOMEN AT A TIME AT ANY POINT IN THE SIX YEARS, BUT YES, I'M NOT ONE THAT FALLS UNDER, I MEAN, ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT IS ALSO VERY BROAD TERM. IT COULD BE A LOT. UH, SO I, I AM TOTALLY IN FAVOR OF WHAT'S BEING SUGGESTED TODAY IN COMPARED TO WHAT WAS BEFORE. THANK YOU, COMMISSIONER VELAZQUEZ, MR. CHAIR, YOU, YOU KNOW, IT'S MY, MY UNDERSTANDING FROM BEING THROUGH, YOU KNOW, HUNDREDS, WELL, I GUESS I'M EXAGGERATING, BUT TENS OF MUNICIPAL LEADERSHIP INSTITUTES, THAT THE MAIN OBJECTIVE OF THE BOARDS AND COMMISSIONS IS SPECIFICALLY TO PROMOTE TRANSPARENCY. AND THE LINE BETWEEN STAFF AND, AND, UH, CITY COUNCIL AND THE COMMISSIONS IS THAT THERE WOULD NOT BE A COMMISSION IF, IF THE CITIZENS HAD BELIEVED THAT, UH, UH, THAT, THAT THE DUTIES OF THE COMMISSION WERE, UH, BEST, UH, ACCOMPLISHED BY STAFF IN, IN FACT, UH, IT'S JUST INHERENT IN THE FACT THAT THERE IS A COMMISSION, THAT THERE ARE CERTAIN DECISIONS THAT ARE NOT TO BE LEFT TO STAFF, THAT, THAT, THAT THEY ARE ACTUALLY DECISIONS THAT THE CITIZENS WANT TO MAKE, AND THEY WANNA WATCH THEIR REPRESENTATIVES MAKE THOSE DECISIONS. SO, BY VIRTUE OF THE FACT THAT WE'RE APPOINTED BY REPRESENTATIVES, WE REPRESENT, UH, THE, UH, THE INTERESTS OF THE COMMUNITIES THAT, THAT WE WORK FOR. SO WE SAY PREFERENCE, SEE, PREFERENCE IS ONE THING. WHEN YOU, WE LOOK AT IT IN TERMS OF, UH, [00:40:01] OF YOU, YOU SPINNING IT IN A GOOD WAY, BUT PREFERENCE CAN BE SPUN IN A BAD WAY, TOO. AS A MATTER OF FACT, YOU'RE GONNA FIND PREFERENCE USED IN THE NEGATIVE MORE THAN YOU'RE GONNA FIND IT USED AS A POSITIVE IN GOVERNMENT. SO THE WORD PREFERENCE REALLY WHAT IT, WHAT, WHAT, WHAT BASICALLY, UH, IT IT DOES IS IT, IT LIMITS THE OPPORTUNITY FOR THE COUNCIL TO HAVE, UH, UH, YOU KNOW, AN OPEN-ENDED, UH, UH, SELECTION BASED ON WHAT THEY THINK IS IMPORTANT, BECAUSE THEN IT GIVES THEM A PREFERENCE OVER THE VERY, UH, NARROW, UM, UM, UH, DEFINITION THAT'S BEEN GIVEN. BECAUSE IF THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE, LIKE MY FELLOW COMMISSIONER, UH, MAZUA SAID, IF WE'RE THERE BY VIRTUE OF WHAT'S IN RED, AND THEREFORE WE WOULD BE OKAY WITH WHAT'S IN BLUE, WELL THEN WHY WOULDN'T BE OKAY WITH WHAT'S IN RED? BECAUSE, BECAUSE THE, THE, ULTIMATELY, THE, THE, THE MAIN PROBLEM THAT WE'VE HAD IN THE CITY, HISTORICALLY IS WHEN THESE RULES ARE USED AGAINST MINORITIES, UH, MINORITY PEOPLE OF COLOR, LOWER ECONOMIC PEOPLE, BECAUSE MOST DEFINITELY PRESERVATION KICKS ALL THIS STUFF UP A BAR WHEN IT COMES TO THE ECONOMICS OF OUR COMMUNITY. AND, AND, AND THERE HAS BEEN, THERE HAVE BEEN EVERY OPPORTUNITY FOR THE OFFICE OF PRESERVATION TO ENTER THE TERMS OF EQUITY INTO ITS PROCESSES, UH, A A AS IT'S, AS IT'S, UH, UH, BEEN GIVEN THAT PERMISSION FROM CITY COUNCIL TIME AND TIME AGAIN, THE MAYOR CONSTANTLY IS, IS IS DOING HIS, HIS BEST TO TRY TO, UH, UH, YOU KNOW, HAVE THE CITY MOVE IN A, IN A, IN A, IN A, IN A, IN A WAY THAT PUTS EQUITY AS JUST AS IMPORTANT OF ALL THESE OTHER THINGS THAT WE SAY ARE IMPORTANT, THAT EQUITY IS, IF NOT MORE IMPORTANT, JUST AS IMPORTANT AS A WOOD WINDOW IS, YOU KNOW? SO IT IT GIVES ME VERY, UH, UH, UH, IT MAKES ME VERY HESITANT AND, AND, AND GIVES ME EVERY REASON TO NOT BE ABLE TO SUPPORT, UH, UM, UH, LANGUAGE THAT, THAT, THAT TO ME IS LIMITING. AND IF IT'S NOT GOING TO BE LIMITING, THEN IT NEEDS TO BE JUST PRETTY FORTHRIGHT ABOUT, UH, HOW IT'S MAKING, UH, HOW IT, HOW IT TENDS TO BALANCE OUT THAT EFFORT AND FOR THE LACK OF PROFESSIONALS IN THE LATINO COMMUNITY WITH RESPECT TO THE BUILT ENVIRONMENT. YOU, YOU KNOW, AND, AND, AND, YOU KNOW, KEEP IN MIND, UH, SAN ANTONIO HAS A MASSIVE LOWER ECONOMIC COMMUNITY THAT HISTORICALLY HAS BEEN LATINO, AND ECONOMICS ARE VERY IMPORTANT LIMITER WHEN IT COMES TO, UH, COLLEGE EDUCATIONS AND PROFESSIONAL CERTIFICATIONS. AND THIS IS REALLY THE ONLY WAY THAT WE GET TO PARTICIPATE AT LARGE IN A PROCESS THAT AFFECTS OUR, UH, OUR, OUR, OUR FINANCIAL OBLIGATIONS AND THE PROPERTY INTERESTS OF THE COMMUNITY THAT HAVE PROPERTY THAT, YOU KNOW, FROM ON A, ON A, ON A DAY-TO-DAY BASIS, OR HAVING TO DEAL WITH THE OUTRAGEOUS, UH, UH, UH, UH, UH, TAX VALUATIONS AND ALL THESE THINGS. COMMISSIONER, IF WE THINK THAT PRESERVATION HAS A DIRECT, UH, IS DIRECT, DIRECT IMPLICATION ON ALL OF THESE THINGS, COMMISSIONER, LET ME POINT. YES, YES, SIR. EXCUSE ME FOR INTERRUPTING, BUT LET ME POINT OUT WHAT'S IN THE U D C RIGHT NOW AND HAS BEEN, IT'S NOT PROPOSED TO BE CHANGED. COMPOSITION AND QUALIFICATIONS, WHICH IS THE, THE PARAGRAPH IN BLACK IN APPOINTING MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION. THE CITY COUNCIL SHALL MAKE APPOINTMENTS THAT ARE SENSITIVE TO THE PRESERVATION AND DEVELOPMENT GOALS OF THE CITY AND WILL ENABLE THE CITY TO RETAIN COMPLIANCE. ONE OF THE DEVELOPMENT GOALS THAT YOU'VE POINTED OUT IS EQUITY. SO THIS DOES NOT EXCLUDE ANYTHING THAT THE CITY COUNCIL DEEMS AS PART OF THE DEVELOPMENT GOALS OF THE CITY. IT DOESN'T SPECIFICALLY SAY EQUITY, BUT IT DOES, UH, EQUITY IS A CURRENT DEVELOPMENT GOAL OF THE CITY. UH, YOU, YOU KNOW, MR. CHAIR, WITH ALL DUE RESPECT, JOHN F. KENNEDY USED TO SAY THAT SINCERITY IS ALWAYS SUBJECT TO PROOF. ALL, ALL I'M SAYING IS THAT BEING ON THE FRONT LINES OF A BATTLE FOR EQUITY FOR FAR TOO LONG, I WANNA SEE IT SPELLED OUT. IT'S, IT'S, IT'S, WE ARE, WE ARE PAST THE POINT OF EXPECTING INTERPRETATION TO BE EMPOWERED, OR, OR, OR THE USE OF PREFERENCE TO BE EMPOWERED. WE NEED LANGUAGE WHEN IT COMES TO THESE THINGS THAT ARE BEING CHANGED, THAT FOR ALL PRACTICAL REASONS, THEY DON'T NEED TO BE CHANGED, RIGHT? I MEAN, IT REALLY, IF, IF, IF WHAT EVERYBODY'S SAYING IS IT REALLY DOESN'T CHANGE ANYTHING, IT DOES CHANGE SOMETHING. IT, IT, IT, IT, IT PINPOINTS SOMETHING THAT IS AN ELIMINATION OF SORTS. AND, AND WE BE, WE CAN BEGIN WITH, WITH JUST LOOKING AT THE FACT THAT IT'S SHOWN HERE AS HISTORIC PROPERTIES AND DOESN'T SHARE POTENTIAL IMPACT OF AMENDMENT AS A CITYWIDE. SEE, THERE'S ALREADY KIND OF THIS, THIS KIND OF, UH, UH, YOU KNOW, MAYBE UNINTENTIONAL, BUT AT THE SAME TIME STILL HAS A NEGATIVE OUTCOME AS FAR AS I'M CONCERNED. IT TO, TO ME, IT'S NOT SOMETHING I CAN SUPPORT. I'D ASK, UH, ANY, ANY FELLOW COMMISSIONERS [00:45:01] TO TRY TO UNDER UNDERSTAND WHERE I'M, WHERE I'M COMING FROM, UM, AND SEE THAT, THAT A LOT OF WORK NEEDS TO BE DONE WITH RESPECT TO CRAFTING, UH, A C COMPOSITION OF QUALIFICATIONS THAT ACTUALLY DOES STICK ITS HAND INTO THE, THE DIRTY WORLD OF, OF, OF WHY, UH, MINORITY PEOPLES DON'T HAVE, DON'T, DON'T HAVE ACCESS TO EDUCATION AND ALL THOSE THINGS, BUT THAT THE OUTCOME IS THAT WE'RE NOT ON THE BOARDS AND COMMISSIONS THAT CHANGE OUR PROPERTY VALUES. THANK YOU, SIR. THAT'S MASSIVE. COMMISSIONER GROUP. MR. CHAIR, I JUST HAD A QUESTION. IF, UM, IF THIS ITEM, UH, THE BLUE LANGUAGE IS NOT, UM, PUT IN THE, UM, VOTE, THE VOTE TODAY, THE RED LANGUAGE STAYS IN FORCE, CORRECT? THAT'S HOW IT WOULD BE. CORRECT. UM, SO I MEAN, IN THE INTEREST OF KIND OF FINDING A PATH FORWARD, UM, WE'RE OPEN TO ANY ADDITIONAL LANGUAGE THAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE IN BLUE THAT WOULD SPEAK TO SOME OF THESE CONCERNS. AND I WILL ADD THAT THE CITY CLERK'S OFFICE AS PART OF OUR BOARD OF COMMISSION RECRUITING EFFORTS, IS DEFINITELY, UM, DEVOTED TO REACHING, UM, THOSE GROUPS. AND, AND WE INCLUDE LANGUAGE THAT WE, UM, ARE SEEKING CANDIDATES THAT, YOU KNOW, ARE REFLECTIVE OF THE DEMOGRAPHICS OF THE CITY AS A WHOLE. AND SO FROM AN EQUITY LENS LIKE WE DO ABSOLUTELY WANNA MAKE SURE THAT, YOU KNOW, OUR REPRESENTATIVES THAT ARE BOARD OF COMMISSIONS ARE, ARE REPRESENTATIVE OF THE CITY AS A WHOLE, AS A WHOLE, AND THE BLACK LANGUAGE IS NOT UP FOR THAT, IS STAYS AS IS. SO IT'S REALLY JUST REPLACING RED WITH THE BLUE LANGUAGE. AND, AND MR. CHAIR, UM, WHENEVER THE COMMISSIONER IS READY, I'LL DO A MOTION. MR. CHAIR, I STILL HAVE A ANOTHER QUESTION YES. FOR THE STAFF. SO, UH, THE WORKFORCE ANALYSIS OR MANPOWER ANALYSIS FOR THE INCREASE OF, UH, UH, OF COMMISSIONS FROM, YOU KNOW, TWO DIFFERENT EIGHT, EIGHT PANEL COMMISSIONS, I THINK, HOW MUCH IS THE CITY OR THE OFFICE OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION, HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE GONNA GET HIRED TO SUPPORT THAT GROWTH AND WHAT'S THE BUDGET GONNA LOOK LIKE? THERE'S, THERE'S NO KIND OF STAFF COMPLIMENT TO THIS PROPOSAL. THERE'S NO CHANGE IN BUDGET. UM, REALLY IT'S THE SAME NUMBER OF CASES THAT WE'RE REVIEWING TODAY. IT'S JUST ANOTHER PUBLIC HEARING. SO IT'S REDUCING YOUR TIME SPENT AT PUBLIC HEARINGS. UM, AND STAFF'S TIME IS GONNA STAY ABOUT THE SAME. AND WHAT'S GONNA BE YOUR CRITERIA, OR WHO'S GONNA DETERMINE WHO SITS ON EITHER BOARD, UM, THE COUNCIL PERSON WHO MAKES THE, THE APPOINTMENTS. AND SO THEY WILL HAVE THE ABILITY TO MAKE TWO APPOINTMENTS. AND SO THEY WILL MAKE AN APPOINTMENT TO EACH BOARD, UM, WHERE THERE'S A VACANCY. AND IF THE COUNCIL MEMBER DECIDES TO APPOINT THE SAME PERSON TO BOTH BOARDS THAT I'M HEARING, IT'S POSSIBLE THAT'S POSSIBLE BASED ON HOW IT'S CURRENTLY WRITTEN. MR. CHAIR, I HAVE A, I HAVE A PROPOSAL, I HAVE A, A MOTION. LET'S, IF I MAY, JUST FOR ONE SECOND, MR. CHAIR, I JUST WANNA CLARIFY YOUR OUTCOME HERE. WHATEVER YOU RECOMMEND EITHER AMENDMENTS TO THIS PROPOSED AMENDMENT, U D C AMENDMENT OR RECOMMEND APPROVAL, UH, OR DENIAL ON THIS AMENDMENT THAT WILL MOVE FORWARD THROUGH THE NEXT STEP IN THE PROCESS, WHICH WILL BE CONSIDERATION BY PLANNING COMMISSION. PLANNING COMMISSION WILL CONSIDER ALL THE U D C AMENDMENTS THAT WE HAVE, AND THEN IT'LL MOVE FORWARD THEIR RECOMMENDATION AS WILL YOURS MOVE FORWARD THROUGH THE PROCESS TO CITY COUNCIL. OKAY. THANK YOU, COMMISSIONER. JIMMY, MIGHT I JUMP IN REAL QUICK BEFORE YOU MAKE YOUR MOTION? YES. ACTUALLY, IT WAS COMMISSIONER GRU WHO HAD SAID SHE WANTED TO MAKE A MOTION. COMMISSIONERS, BEFORE WE START MAKING MOTIONS, I JUST, I WANT TO SUGGEST THAT SINCE THERE'S REALLY ONLY ONE OUT OF THESE 21 AMENDMENTS THAT WE SEEM TO BE HAVING, UH, DEBATE ABOUT, IF WE CAN DO ONE MOTION THAT IS FOR ALL OF THE AMENDMENTS SAFE FOR ITEM EIGHT, AND THEN A SEPARATE MOTION AND ACTION FOR ITEM EIGHT CO. CORY, CAN YOU CLARIFY ITEM EIGHT? YES, THAT'S WHAT I WAS MR. QUE, WHAT WAS THE QUESTION? I'M SORRY. CAN YOU CLARIFY ITEM EIGHT? ITEM EIGHT IS THE ONE WE WERE JUST DISCUSSING AS A AMENDMENT 20 DASH SIX REGARDING THE H T R C COMPOSITION AND, AND THAT THAT'S INCLUDING THE CREATION OF THE DUAL AND THE LANGUAGE. IT'S THE ENTIRE SECTION, UM, WHERE COMMISSIONER JIMMY WAS TALKING ABOUT AND WHAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT IS EIGHT, CORRECT? CORRECT. THAT'S ALL EIGHT. SO I WOULD ALSO RECOMMEND THAT WE, LET'S DEAL WITH THE OTHER 20, IF THERE'S ANY DISCUSSION ON ANY OF THOSE. IF NOT, I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION. WELL, MR. CHAIR, I WAS GONNA DO A MOTION TO APPROVE AS PRESENTED TODAY. 'CAUSE I DON'T, UM, WE HAVE DISCUSSED THIS AS A, AT A BRIEFING. WE WERE BRIEFED, I THINK OVER A YEAR AGO ABOUT THIS [00:50:01] DUAL BOARD. AND, AND I THINK IT WOULD FACILITATE A LOT. UM, I THINK ONE OF THE THINGS ABOUT THIS COMMISSIONER IS THAT IT'S TIME CONSUMING AND I DON'T THINK CITY COUNCIL ACTUALLY KNOWS THE AMOUNT OF TIME THAT WE ACTUALLY ALL INDIVIDUALLY SPEND ON THIS COMMISSION BOARD. AND I THINK IT WOULD FACILITATE OUR LOAD STAFF'S LOAD. I THINK IT WOULD, I MEAN, I, BASED ON THE BRIEFING, DETAILED BRIEFING WE WERE DOING, I DON'T KNOW WHEN IT WAS IN THE BEGINNING OF THE YEAR, CALENDAR YEAR AND HOW THAT IS GONNA WORK WITH CERTAIN CASES GOING TO THE ALTERNATE BOARD. I THINK THIS IS THE FUTURE OF WHAT THIS COMMISSION SHOULD BE. I MEAN, IT CAN'T, AND WE ARE ALSO JUST A RECOMMENDING BODY, WHICH ALSO WAS MENTIONED AGAIN TODAY. SO THIS IS NOT FINAL ACTION EITHER. WE ARE RECOMMENDING. SO MY MOTION, IF I CAN MAKE MY MOTION, WOULD BE TO, UM, MOTION TO RECOMMEND AS PRESENTED TODAY, THE U D C AMENDMENT'S RECOMMENDED TODAY. SO WE DO HAVE A MOTION FOR APPROVAL OF THE PROPOSED U D C AMENDMENTS AS PRESENTED TODAY. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND? WE HAVE A SECOND DISCUSSION. YES. TO MY RESPECTED COMMISSIONER GRU OVER THERE, WE HAVE A DUTY TO THE CITY, TO THE PEOPLE, AND TO THE, UH, ALL EMPLOYEES OF THE, UH, OFFICE OF HIS, UH, HISTORIC PRESERVATION TO DISCUSS THIS AS LONG AS WE NEED TO, AS LONG AS IT TAKES TO GET IT RIGHT. SO THERE'S NO TIME CONSTRAINT, AT LEAST IN MY EYES. AND STAY HERE ALL DAY, ALL NIGHT, IT DOESN'T MATTER. OR COME BACK AGAIN TOMORROW. THE POINT I'M MAKING IS THAT IT'S GOTTA BE DONE RIGHT, 'CAUSE IT'S GONNA BE SET IN STONE. WE WERE BRIEFED ON IT A YEAR AGO. I THINK I EXPRESSED AT THAT POINT DURING THE BRIEFING, MY CONCERNS WITH IT. I THINK COMMISSIONER VASQUEZ, MAYBE A FEW OTHERS DID. GETTING BRIEFED ON IT DOES NOT IMPLY CONSENT. SO THAT'S ONE THING THAT I CAN, I THINK FROM A PROCESS STANDPOINT, WE NEED TO LOOK AT. SO I WOULD RESPECTFULLY ASK COMMISSIONER GRU IF SHE WOULD BE WILLING TO AMEND THE EXCLUSION OF ITEM EIGHT ON THIS SHEET, WHICH IS 20 DASH. SO MY SIX, THE ONLY PROBLEM WITH THAT IS, UM, WE CAN KEEP DISCUSSING IT, BUT THIS WILL GO FORWARD WITH THE PLANNING AND THIS APPROVAL. THIS WILL NOT GIVE US MORE TIME TO DISCUSS THAT ITEM AND THEN ADD IT LATER. SO I'M REALLY INS AND, AND I, AND I'LL, UH, I HAVEN'T SAID YES OR NO YET, BUT I WANNA ASK MAYBE STAFF TO SAY THAT THIS, IF WE LEAVE THAT OUT, FIRST OF ALL, WE ARE LEAVING LANGUAGE RED IN FORCE, WHICH I THINK IS VERY INEQUITABLE. AND ALSO WE'RE ELIMINATING THE OPTION OF CREATING THIS ALTERNATE BOARD. SO THIS IS, THIS IS, THESE ARE THE TWO REASONS WHY I WOULD SAY THIS SHOULD MOVE FORWARD, BECAUSE I DON'T THINK THAT BY ELIMINATING THIS, WE GET THE STAFF WANNA SAY, DO WE GET THE OPTION TO PUT IT IN LATER? NO. RIGHT. I THINK THIS IS THE END. WE'VE HAD MANY MONTHS TO, TO BE ABLE TO HAVE THAT DISCUSSION OR CONCERNS. SO THAT'S MY ONLY ISSUE IS IF WE LEAVE IT OUT, THEN RED LANGUAGE STAYS AND WE DON'T GET AN ALTERNATE BOARD. I WOULD LIKE TO ADD THAT. UM, I, I DO HAVE MY CONCERNS, UM, ABOUT IT. HOWEVER, KNOWING THAT THIS PROCESS COMES AROUND EVERY FIVE YEARS, I AM WILLING TO, TO WATCH IT TAKE PLACE AND TO UNFOLD. AND IF WE BUILD ANOTHER COMMISSION THAT'S WORKS SATISFACTORILY TO ALL OF THE GOALS SET FORTH, UM, I THINK IT WOULD BE A, A WORTHWHILE EXPERIMENT FIVE YEARS AND COME BACK. UM, MR. CHAIR, I, YES, SIR. I, UH, AM NOT CERTAIN THAT YOU, YOU, YOU KNOW, THE IMPORTANT THING ABOUT DELIBERATION IS, YOU KNOW, I GUESS WE, WE, WE, UM, WE COMMUNICATE TO THE CITIZENS, RIGHT? 'CAUSE THEY'RE, THEY'RE DEFINITELY PARTICIPATING IN THE LISTENING ENVIRONMENT. THE, THE, UM, THE CONVENIENCE TO A COMMISSIONER IS THE CONVENIENCE TO GET OFF OF A BOARD THAT THE COMMISSIONER FEELS, TAKES UP TOO MUCH OF THE COMMISSIONER'S TIME. WE'RE ALL ON THE SAME COMMISSION, AND I'M SURE IT'S NOT EVERYBODY'S FIRST RODEO OVER HERE. I'M SURE THAT YOU'VE ALL BEEN ON MANY COMMISSIONS. THERE ARE COMMISSIONS THAT ARE, THAT ARE EVEN MORE, UH, TIME CONSUMING, LIKE THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT. AND THERE ARE COMMISSIONS THAT YOU CAN GO PUT A LITTLE BIT OF TIME IN AND GET OUT AND IT'S NO BIG DEAL. UH, BUT, BUT THE CONVENIENCE TO THE COMMISSION ISN'T TO TRY TO FIGURE OUT HOW WE CAN, UH, UH, UH, MAKE CODE OUT OF TIME SAVING FOR, FOR OURSELVES THAT BECAUSE THERE'S NOBODY FORCING US TO BE HERE, WE'RE VOLUNTEERS. RIGHT? AND IT'S, IT'S TIME CONSUMING AND YEAH, THAT'S WHY THEY GIVE YOU TERM LIMITS. YOU DO YOUR TWO YEARS AND WHEN YOU'VE HAD ENOUGH, YOU LEAVE. YOU DON'T COMPLAIN AND TRY TO CHANGE THE RULES TO SUIT YOUR SCHEDULE. THE REALITY IS [00:55:01] THAT, UH, UH, YOU KNOW, THESE THINGS TAKE AS LONG AS THEY TAKE. AND THAT'S JUST THE WAY THAT IT IS THE CREATION OF, OF, OF TWO COMMISSIONS. IT, IT, IT MAKES WHAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT WITH RESPECT TO EQUITY EVEN WORSE BECAUSE IT, IT CREATES, UH, ALTERNATE, UH, SITUATIONS. WE ALREADY SEE WHAT HAPPENS WHEN A, WHEN A C WHEN A, WHEN AN APPLICANT COMES BEFORE THE COMMISSION, THEY DON'T GET WHAT THEY WANT AND THEN THEY KEEP COMING BACK AND THEY KEEP COMING BACK AND THEY KEEP COMING BACK AND THEY KEEP COMING BACK. RIGHT. AND THEY WAIT TILL THE COMMISSIONER IS VOTING AGAINST IS NOT THERE. RIGHT. WE, WE'VE SEEN HOW THAT, HOW THE POLITICS OF IT ALL HAS PLAYED OUT. WELL, THE, THE, THE, THE, THE IMPRESSION THAT WE WOULDN'T BE DOING THE SAME THING, RIGHT? THAT WE WOULDN'T BE SWITCHING COMMISSIONS IN ORDER TO MAKE IT GO A PARTICULAR WAY, GETS TO THE VERY REASON WHY THERE'S A COMMISSION. BECAUSE YEAH, GOVERNMENT IS ALWAYS GONNA LOOK FOR A WAY TO WIN. IT'S ALWAYS GONNA LOOK FOR A WAY TO, TO ADVANCE ITS AGENDA. OUR OB OBLIGATION IS NOT TO BE HERE JUST TO ADVANCE THE CITY'S AGENDA, BECAUSE OTHERWISE, WHY WOULD WE HAVE A DEMOCRATIC VOTE INHERENT IN OUR, IN OUR ACTIVITIES? THE VOTE MEANS THAT THERE IS NO DECISION THAT'S BEEN MADE TO GET TO WHAT JIMMY HAD SAID A SECOND AGO THAT YEAH, ALL THE BRIEFINGS WE GET, THAT'S NOT, THAT'S NOT AN AGREEMENT OR A CONSENSUS OF ANY KIND. THEY'RE JUST BRIEFINGS. THIS IS WHERE, WHERE THE RUBBER MEETS THE ROAD WITH RESPECT TO THE CITIZENS ACTUALLY LISTENING AND PARTICIPATING. AND IT'S, AND, AND I, I MEAN, I WOULD THINK THAT, THAT THE, THAT THE STAFF WOULD HAVE TO PRODUCE FOR US TWO YEARS WORTH OF MEETINGS THAT WHERE WE DID NOT GET A QUORUM TO SHOW US WHAT IS THE OVERWHELMING, UH, UH, UH, UH, NEED. NOT PRO, NOT NOT BASED ON HOW, HOW, HOW, UH, STRESSED WE FEEL, BUT ON ARE WE MAKING A GENDER? ARE, ARE, ARE WE MAKING OUR QUORUM OR ARE WE MAKING OUR QUORUM? AND IF WE'RE MAKING OUR QUORUM, THEN OBVIOUSLY THIS IS UNCOMFORTABLE FOR SOME PEOPLE. AND, AND PROBABLY THAT HAD BEEN VOCAL ABOUT IT BEING UNCOMFORTABLE. BUT AGAIN, I IS THERE, IS THERE A LIST OF HOW MANY OF US HAVE GONE OVER OUR TWO YEARS AND ARE COMPLAINING ABOUT TIME? RIGHT? COMMISSIONER? SO, SO, SO THE, SO THE FREEDOMS AND THE, AND THE BREATHING SPACE IS BUILT INTO THE PROCESS, BUT TO GO AND CREATE, UH, YOU KNOW WHAT, WHAT I'M REFERRING TO, RIGHT? THIS IS JUST ME, A SHADOW COMMISSION. YOU KNOW, I, I DON'T, WELL, COMMISSIONER, EXCUSE ME. DON'T THERE'S ENOUGH OBJECT. EXCUSE ME, COMMISSIONER. IT'S POINT OF ORDER. EXCUSE ME. POINT OF ORDER. I'M SORRY. I'M SORRY. I'M ON ZOOM AND I, AND I, I'M, I'M, I CAN'T SEE ALL, ALL I CAN SEE IS THE COREY, THE PAPERWORK AND JEAN MORALE, MORALES. THAT'S ALL I SEE HERE. I DON'T SEE ANYTHING ELSE. SO FORGIVE ME IF, IF I'M NOT GETTING THE VISUAL CUES. YES. I JUST, WE HAVE, THANK YOU FOR YOUR COMMENTS. WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND WE'VE HAD DISCUSSION. I'M CALLING FOR A ROLL CALL. IF IT DOESN'T PASS, THEN WE CAN CONSIDER, UH, AMENDMENTS TO THIS PARTICULAR ITEM. HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE. SAVINA. AYE. VELASQUEZ. NAYYY. MORALES. NAYYY. MASUKA. NAYYY. CARPENTER. AYE. GRO AYE. ANTES, NEW AND FETZER. AYE. MOTION FAILS. IT'S FOUR FOUR. WE HAVE A TIE. DO WE HAVE ANOTHER MOTION? I MOVE THAT WE APPROVE THE AMENDMENTS MINUS THE CURRENT ONE IN DISCUSSION. IN DISCUSSION, WHICH WOULD BE 20 DASH SIX ITEM NUMBER EIGHT ON THE, UH, SPREADSHEET THAT WAS PRESENTED TO US. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? I'LL SECOND. WE HAVE A SECOND. ANY DISCUSSION? WE HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE. SINA NAY QUE AYE. MORALE? AYE. . AYE. CARPENTER? AYE. GRO AYE. ANTES? YES. AND FETZER. AYE. DO WE HAVE A MOTION FOR AMENDING ITEM NUMBER EIGHT? I HAD A QUESTION WHETHER IT WOULD BE AMENABLE TO FELLOW COMMISSIONERS TO HAVE THE LANGUAGE OF EQUITY JUST BE INCLUDED IN THAT LINE. I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S REDUNDANT AND SEEMS UNNECESSARY, BUT THAT MIGHT AMELIORATE [01:00:01] THE, THE LOG JAM HERE. WELL, I GUESS THE, MY QUESTION TO THAT IS THE DEFINITION OF EQUITY AND HOW THAT IS ACHIEVED AND HOW IT IS WORDED IN THIS, UM, U D C ITEM. WE, YOU CERTAINLY DO NOT NEED TO DEFINE EQUITY. THE CITY HAS PLENTY OF, OF, UH, MATERIAL THAT DEFINES THAT AND EXPLAINS THE CITY'S GOALS AND OBJECTIVES PERTAINING TO EQUITY. SO, UM, SIMPLE REFERENCE TO THAT I THINK WOULD BE A PROMPT TO THE CITY AND, AND TOWARDS APPOINTMENTS. UM, BUT AGAIN, I ALSO SUGGESTED THE CITY CLERK'S LANGUAGE ABOUT MEMBERSHIP BEING REPRESENTATIVE. UM, AND AS A CITY OF A WHOLE, AS AS THE CITY AS A WHOLE IN TERMS OF DEMOGRAPHIC, DEMOGRAPHICS AND, AND RACE AND, AND GENDER AND ALL OF THOSE THINGS. MR. CHAIR, THE CITY HAS HAD LANGUAGE THAT SUPPORTS ALL KINDS OF THINGS, RIGHT? BUT IT, IT, I MEAN, IT, IT CAN, IT CAN GO, UH, UH, UH, 15 DIFFERENT WAYS DEPENDING ON WHICH WAY YOU WANNA GO. BUT SOME YEARS AGO, AND I BROUGHT IT TO THE ATTENTION OF THE COMMISSION MANY TIMES, AS A MATTER OF FACT, ONE TIME I ASKED FOR IT TO BE ON THE RECORD AND IT WAS DENIED TO BE PUT ON THE RECORD. OKAY. I UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT I WANNA MAKE SURE THAT WE PUT PUT IT IN, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, WE'RE ABOUT, HAS PUT IT, PUT EQUITY IN THE RIGHT TERMINOLOGY FOR THIS U D C AMENDMENT. OKAY. I WOULD SAY, UH, IN A PROCESS THAT IS CONSISTENT WITH THE CITY'S ORDINANCE, DEEMING, UH, RACISM, A HEALTH CRISIS, THAT, THAT YOU DON'T EVEN HAVE TO SAY THAT. I'M JUST SAY CONSISTENT WITH THAT ORDINANCE. PUT THAT ORDINANCE NUMBER. COMMISSIONER, CAN WE JUST TO CHAIR, I, I THINK, WAIT, UH, COMMISSIONER, CAN WE, WE WANNA MAKE SURE WE'RE TRACKING YOUR PROPOSED EDIT SO EVERYONE CAN SEE IT ON THE SCREEN. IF YOU CAN GIVE US JUST A SECOND SO WE CAN PULL UP THE AMENDMENT, UM, AND THEN WE CAN CONTINUE THE DISCUSSION SO YOU HAVE SOMETHING TO LOOK AT, BE, THIS IS THE PART OF THE DISCUSSION WHERE WE CAN MAKE AMENDMENTS HERE AT THE MEETING IN THIS FORMAL SETTING. SO, UM, GIVE US JUST A MINUTE IF YOU DON'T MIND, AND THEN IF WE CAN GO OVER YOUR RECOMMENDED LANGUAGE ONCE AGAIN. SO, SO MR. CHAIR, I DO AGREE WITH YOU ON THE BROAD DEFINITION OF EQUITY AND, AND WHAT ARE WE LOOKING AT? ARE WE LOOKING AT ECONOMIC EQUITY? ARE WE LOOKING AT CULTURAL EQUITY? ARE WE LOOKING AT, UH, YOU KNOW, HISTORICAL WHAT? YES, YOU ARE CORRECT ON THAT. I'M COMING MORE FROM A PERSPECTIVE, ALTHOUGH SIMILAR AND PARALLEL. I'M LOOKING AT REPRESENTATION, I'M LOOKING AT REPRESENTATION OF THE COMMON PERSON WITH REGARDS TO THIS. I'M LOOKING AT REPRESENTATION ON THE COMMON PERSON'S ABILITY TO SAY, I DON'T WANT, UH, UH, UH, CITY GOVERNMENT TO GROW FOR THE SAKE OF GROWING, RIGHT? I DON'T WANT, YOU KNOW, PROCESSES TO JUST BE AMBIGUOUS AND THEN LEAD TO GROWTH, YOU KNOW, THE BIGGER GOVERNMENT AND THAT WHOLE THING STARTS SPIRALING OUTTA CONTROL. SO I'M LOOKING AT IT FROM A REPRESENTATIVE STANDPOINT. SO I DON'T KNOW IF WE CAN EDIT ALL THAT RIGHT NOW BECAUSE IT'S, IT'S, IT'S KIND OF BROAD. IT'S GOTTA BE CLEARLY DEFINED, RIGHT? IT, IT DON'T WANT TO GET WRAPPED AROUND THE ACTUAL, ON JUST THE WORD EQUITY AND, AND HOW IT CAN PERTAIN TO MANY DIFFERENT ASPECTS OF IT. I'M, I'M LOOKING AT IT FROM REPRESENTATION. THAT'S JUST MY, MY PIECE. MR. CHAIRMAN, MAY I RESPOND TO THAT JUST FOR A SECOND? 'CAUSE I THINK WHAT'S A CRITICAL POINT HERE THAT COREY MENTIONED IS THAT THE OFFICE OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION, AS THE ARM OF THE CITY GOVERNMENT HERE ISN'T GROWING AS A RESULT OF THIS. WHAT THEY'RE TRYING TO DO IS MORE EFFICIENTLY DEAL WITH THE NEEDS OF THE PUBLIC TO GET THROUGH A REVIEW PROCESS. SO I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT PEOPLE ARE UNDERSTANDING, IT'S NOT BLOATING UP THE GOVERNMENT. WHAT IT'S TRYING TO DO IS OPEN UP THE GATEWAYS AND, AND ACCESS TO WORK WITH THAT GOVERNMENT TO GET THE APPROVALS THEY NEED FOR THEIR PROPERTIES. CORRECT. COMMISSIONER AND I, AND I CONCUR THAT IN THE IMMEDIATE TIME, THAT THAT'S PROBABLY NOT THE INTENTION. BUT AGAIN, HAVING BEEN IN GOVERNMENT, FEDERAL GOVERNMENT FOR COMING UP ON 30 YEARS, THAT DOES HAPPEN A YEAR DOWN THE ROAD, SIX MONTHS DOWN THE ROAD BECAUSE THE REQUIREMENTS, YOU KNOW, WE, WE SET UP, WE SET UP A REQUIREMENT, WE SET A SYSTEM UP IN PLACE THAT ULTIMATELY IS LACKING IN STAFF AND, AND, AND BUDGET. BUT, BUT I WOULD COUNTER THAT SYSTEM IS RESPONDING TO THE ECONOMIC BOOM OF THE CITY AS A WHOLE, CORRECT. OR BUST. AND THAT THAT OFFICE IS GOING TO GROW, EXPAND, OR SHRINK IN RESPONSE TO THAT. WHOLEHEARTEDLY AGREE WITH THAT ASPECT. WHICH IS WHY I THINK WE NEED TO LOOK AT GUIDELINES. WE NEED TO LOOK AT STANDARDS VERSUS GUIDELINES. AND AGAIN, THIS IS ALL A PROCESS THAT I THINK NEEDS TO BE WORKED OUT. AND I AGREE WITH YOU, YOU ARE CORRECT. CORRECT. I, I'D LIKE TO RESPOND TO THAT AS WELL. 'CAUSE I, I'D LET THAT GO BEFORE IT. THERE'S A REASON WHY WE CALL THEM GUIDELINES AS AN ADVISORY COMMITTEE. WE'RE A COMMISSION. WE'RE HERE FREQUENTLY TALKING ABOUT GUIDELINES BECAUSE OF THE NATURE, THE UNIQUE NATURE OF HISTORIC PROPERTIES. IF YOU [01:05:01] START APPLYING STANDARDS, THEN THAT ACTUALLY BEGINS TO, UH, HANDCUFF EVERYONE IN THAT, IN THAT PROCESS. SO WHILE IT SOUND SOUNDS GOOD THAT, HEY, I WANT STANDARDS, THAT'S HOW INEQUITY, AND THAT'S HOW INJUSTICE GETS MANIFEST BECAUSE YOU START APPLYING A STANDARD TO A SITUATION THAT'S VERY UNIQUE THAT SHOULD BE BROUGHT BEFORE A COMMITTEE LIKE THIS OR A COMMISSION LIKE THIS TO CONSIDER IT. SO THAT'S WHY THE LANGUAGE IS VERY SPECIFICALLY CALLED A GUIDELINE RATHER THAN A STANDARD. CORRECT. AND I AGREE WITH YOU, MR. MR. COMMISSIONER. I DO, OR RATHER A FELLOW COMMISSIONER. I DO AGREE WITH YOU ON THAT. I, I'M JUST SAYING THAT GUIDELINES ARE THE ENTIRE MAKEUP OF THE ENTIRE, OF, YOU KNOW, OF, OF WHAT WE REFERENCE. AND I THINK SOME OF THAT NEEDS TO BE STANDARDS IN AN ORDER IN A WAY TO STREAMLINE THE PROCESS FOR STAFF AND FOR GOVERNMENT AS IT COMES TO US TO VOTE ON. I THINK SOME THINGS NEED TO BE STANDARD, AND I DON'T WANT TO, YOU ARE CORRECT, IT SHOULDN'T BE STANDARDS 100 ACROSS 100% ACROSS THE BOARD. SO I DO AGREE WITH YOU, AND I THINK I JUST DIDN'T EXPRESS IT CLEARLY MYSELF THAT I'M NOT LOOKING FOR STANDARDS. 100%. I'M JUST LOOKING FOR ADJUSTMENT TO OUR, OUR WORKING DOCUMENTS THAT WE USE AS REFERENCES TO HELP TIGHTEN UP THE PROCESS A LITTLE BIT. MR. MR. AND I THINK THAT HASNT BEEN LOOKED, MR. DEVIATING FROM THE ITEM AND DISCUSSION CHAIR, WITH RESPECT TO COMMISSIONER, UH, JIMMY'S COMMENTS. LOOK, REDLINING WAS A GUIDELINE. OKAY? IT WAS A GUIDELINE. THE, THE, THE CASES OF INEQUITY, THEY COME FROM UNJUST PEOPLE, NOT JUST SYSTEMS, RIGHT? SO YOU, YOU, YOU, YOU HAVE TO HAVE LANGUAGE THAT, THAT, UH, HANDCUFFS PEOPLE WHO USE CODE TO LIMIT THE UPWARD MOBILITY AND THE EQUAL OPPORTUNITY OF ALL THE CITIZENS OF SAN ANTONIO. I'M NOT SURE THAT A 15 MINUTE, UH, UH, SEARCH FOR THE ONLY LANGUAGE THAT WE CAN FIND TO GET IN HERE, SO WE CAN GET A VOTE AS A WAY TO GO ABOUT THIS. IF, IF IT MEANS THAT YOU'VE GOT 20, UH, UM, UH, POTENTIALS HERE, THAT PASS AND ONE THAT YOU REALLY WANTED, THAT YOU DON'T GET. I THINK WHAT IT REALLY SAYS IS THAT, YEAH, BUT MAYBE THERE NEEDS TO BE SOME TIME SPENT IN DESIGNING THIS ONE, THIS ONE OBJECTIVE. AND THEN AS COMMISSIONER, FELLOW COMMISSIONER SERINA WAS SAYING, THEN FIVE YEARS DOWN THE LINE, WE CAN PUT IT IN. BUT FOR RIGHT NOW, THERE'S NOTHING THAT SAYS THAT THIS HAS TO HAPPEN NOW, PARTICULARLY WITH RESPECT TO THE 19 THAT ARE THERE, BECAUSE THIS IS NOT A PROBLEM THAT WAS CREATED OVERNIGHT IN SAN ANTONIO. IT'S A VERY COMPLEX PROBLEM. BUT I GUARANTEE YOU THERE ARE PEOPLE ALL OVER THE UNITED STATES IN GOVERNMENT THAT ARE WORKING VERY HARD TO, UH, UH, TO, TO, TO MAKE THE ADJUSTMENTS NECESSARY TO, TO UNDO THE WRONGS THAT WERE DONE TO MINORITY PEOPLES OVER THE COURSE OF PERIODS. AND I, AND, AND BELIEVE ME, I TAKE NO JOY IN HAVING TO EXPLAIN THAT, UH, IN A COUPLE OF SECONDS HERE, BECAUSE I MEAN, YOU, YOU KNOW, I, I UNDERSTAND THE EXPERTISE OF EVERYBODY HERE AT THIS TABLE, BUT I, I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW TOO MANY THERE THAT ARE, YOU KNOW, UH, WARRIORS IN THE, IN THE BATTLE TO GAIN EQUITY ACROSS THE BOARD OF GOVERNMENT. I JUST DON'T, UH, I WOULD THINK THAT STAFF WITH THE CONVERSATIONS THAT WE'VE HAD WOULD'VE SAID, HEY, DIRECTOR, WE NEED TO TAKE SOME OF THESE ARGUMENTS THAT WE'RE HAVING VERY SERIOUSLY AND SAY THAT THIS LANGUAGE NEEDS TO BE PUT INTO THIS WAY, IN A WAY THAT IT'S NOT RUSHED, BUT IT'S ACTUALLY THE LANGUAGE THAT HELPS US TO CREATE EQUITY AND DOESN'T NEGATIVELY AFFECT BECAUSE WE'RE FOLLOWING GUIDELINES NEGATIVELY AFFECT PEOPLE WHO DON'T HAVE THE MONETARY CAPABILITY TO KEEP UP WITH, UH, UH, THE CITY GROWTH. BECAUSE THE WAY THAT IT'S GOING RIGHT NOW, THE H D R C CAN BECOME NOTHING MORE THAN A MECHANISM TO SAY, NOT IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD. AND THAT'S JUST IT. AND, AND MR. CHAIR, I, I THINK, UH, I MEAN, WE VOTED ON IT. WE CAN, INSTEAD OF TRYING TO CORRECT, YOU KNOW, WORD DOCUMENTS ON THE FLY HERE IN PUBLIC, I THINK WE SHOULD JUST, WE WANT, WE VOTED. IT'S, IT'S, IT'S NOT DEAD, IT'S JUST OPEN FOR DISCUSSION. SO I WOULD ENCOURAGE, YOU KNOW, THE REWRITE TO PUT SOME, SOME THOUGHT AND EFFORT INTO WHAT WAS SAID HERE FROM ALL COMMISSIONERS, BECAUSE EVERY ONE OF US HAVE THE SAME VOTE, BUT THEY CAN'T PRESENT ANYTHING WITH OUR APPROVAL, AND THIS IS MOVING FORWARD. SO THEY CAN'T REWRITE SOMETHING WITHOUT US, DON'T APPROVE THIS. SO BASICALLY JUST MOVES FORWARD WITHOUT ITEM EIGHT. YES. THIS, THIS IDEA OF HAVING AN ALTERNATE BOARD AND, AND MAYBE THE LANGUAGE IN, IN JUST IF, IF THE LANGUAGE IN THIS BLUE LANGUAGE THAT IS BEING PRESENTED TO US IN THE SCREEN, IF THAT'S THE MAIN ISSUE. BUT THE IDEA OF AN ALTERNATE BOARD, AND I'M NOT SAYING IT'S LESS TIME CONSUMING FOR THE COMMISSIONERS AS IT WAS CLARIFIED, THE CITY COUNCIL CAN CHOOSE TO, YOU KNOW, UH, APPOINT THE SAME PERSON. AND IT'S NOT ABOUT TIME, IT'S ALSO ABOUT THIS. WE HAVE MANY AND BEING RESPECTFUL OF OTHER PEOPLE'S TIME ON THE FLOOR, THE PUBLIC, NOT OUR TIME, THE PUBLIC'S TIME. AND I THINK OF STAFF, I THINK A LOT OF CASES COULD BE MAYBE THE DENIED WHAT WE SEE ON CONSENT AGENDA. SO THE FIRST TIME I HEARD OF THIS ALTERNATE BOARD WAS OVER A YEAR AND A HALF, MAYBE TWO YEARS [01:10:01] AGO. THERE WAS, YOU KNOW, GIVING US OPTION TO US TO GIVE OUR OPINION ON IT OR HOW WE WOULD LIKE THIS. SO IT JUST, I FEEL LIKE THE PUBLIC HAS BEEN ASKED. THERE WAS ALSO A COMMITTEE FORMED WITH PUBLIC INPUT TO, TO HOW TO THIS LANGUAGE WAS GONNA BE. SO I'M JUST, I DO AGREE. I'M WORRIED ABOUT US CHANGING LANGUAGE RIGHT HERE ON THE FLOOR. IF THERE'S JUST ONE PHRASE IN THIS BLUE AND EVERYBODY'S GOOD WITH IT, THEN I'LL SUPPORT THAT. I SUPPORTED THE MOTION BECAUSE STAFF AND CITY PEOPLE, AND THEY'VE WORKED FOR THIS FOR A LONG TIME, AND, AND THERE'S, AND WE'RE DOWN TO LIKE ONE ITEM. THE ONLY THING IS THAT EVERYBODY NEEDS TO UNDERSTAND IS IT WITHOUT THIS RECOMMENDATION TODAY, IT JUST MOVES FORWARD WITHOUT IT. AND WE DON'T DISCUSS THIS UNTIL FIVE YEARS FROM NOW. SO IF I MAY, MR. CHAIR, SO THIS AMENDMENT, UM, YOU DO HAVE THE ABILITY TO MAKE CHANGES TODAY ON THE FLOOR, UH, AT THE OTHER BOARDS AND COMMISSIONS FOR BOARD OF ADJUSTMENTS AND ZONING COMMISSIONS. THEY MADE CHANGES TO SEVERAL AMENDMENTS AT THEIR MEETING. SO THIS IS AN ACCEPTABLE PROCESS. THIS IS A PART OF THE PROCESS. AND IF THERE'S PROPOSED LANGUAGE THAT IS WORKABLE FOR EVERYONE, THAT'S WHAT WE WOULD RECOMMEND, UH, IN ORDER TO MOVE THE AMENDMENT FORWARD. UH, THE OTHER OPTION IS, I DON'T THINK IT WOULD GET THERE, BUT RECOMMENDATION FOR APPROVAL OR A RECOMMENDATION FOR DENIAL, AND THEN THE ITEM MOVES FORWARD THROUGH THE NEXT STEPS IN THE PROCESS, OR NO RECOMMENDATION. I MEAN, IF WE CAN'T GET THERE TODAY, IT WOULD MOVE FORWARD WITHOUT A RECOMMENDATION. CORRECT. SO IT WOULD BE A LACK OF A MOTION. I, I ANTICIPATE THAT'S HOW IT WOULD MOVE FORWARD. AND WE CAN CLARIFY, UH, ALMA, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU HAVE ANY RECOMMENDATIONS. SO, WELL, WE CAN APPROVE IT AS PRESENTED. WE CAN APPROVE IT AS AMENDED, OR WE COULD RECOMMEND DENIAL, IN WHICH CASE THE ORDINANCE STANDS. SO THE THERE IS NO, NO, THAT IS NOT THE CASE. DIVISION MOVING FORWARD, IF YOU'RE RECOMMENDING DENIAL, YOU'RE RECOMMENDING DENIAL AS PRESENTED, WHICH THE PRESENTED ITEM WILL CONTINUE TO MOVE FORWARD THROUGH PLANNING COMMISSION, THE COUNCIL COMMITTEES AND TO CITY COUNCIL. IT WOULD NOT HAVE A RECOMMENDATION FROM THIS COMMISSION IF, YEAH, IT WOULD NOT HAVE A RECOMMENDATION FROM THIS COMMISSION. I MEAN, THAT, IF THAT'S, IF THERE'S NOT A CONSENSUS, IF YOU CAN'T GET THERE, IT WOULD BE LACK OF A MOTION. BUT IT STILL WOULD ME BE, BE MOVING FORWARD AS PRESENTED. AS PRESENTED. OKAY. MR. CHAIRMAN, I WOULD BE SUPPORTIVE OF THE MODIFICATIONS THAT ARE BEING, UH, PROPOSED HERE WITH THE CHANGE OF ONE WORD, RATHER THAN SAYING A BALANCED AND EQUITABLE COMMISSION. HAVE IT SAY A REPRESENTATIVE AND EQUITABLE COMMISSION, BECAUSE I THINK THAT GOES TO SOMETHING THAT JIMMY WAS SPEAKING OF AS WELL. THAT'S IT'S ABOUT REP REPRESENTATION. AND I, I COULD SUPPORT THAT. I THINK THE REST OF THE, THE, UH, ELEMENTS THAT COME ABOUT AS THE RESULT OF THIS PROPOSED AMENDMENT, I THINK ARE, ARE, UH, ADDRESSING SOME REAL ISSUES THAT WE'VE DISCUSSED FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS. AND I'D, I'D HATE TO SEE THIS ELEMENT GET, UH, ELIMINATED OR, OR LEFT BEHIND FOR ANOTHER FIVE YEARS. AND I ALSO, I ALSO THINK THAT THIS OPENS UP THE DOOR FOR GREATER, UH, FOR MORE VOICES TO BE HEARD IN THIS, UH, IN THESE TWO, UH, DIFFERENT COMMISSIONS BECAUSE IT DOES NOT, UH, SAY IT HAS TO BE FIVE OF THIS DISCIPLINE OR, YOU KNOW, TWO OF THIS DISCIPLINE. AND IT BROADENS THE, THE TYPES OF DISCIPLINES THAT CAN COME TO THE TABLE AND, AND BE REPRESENTATIVE OF, OF OUR, UH, OUR, UH, COMMUNITY. MR CHAIR. COMMISSIONER VELASQUEZ? YES, SIR. MR. CHAIR. THE, THE PROBLEM WITH, WITH WHAT'S BEING PRESENTED IS THAT IT SAYS IN, IN CONSIDERATION OF, NOW LOOK, WE SHOULDN'T HAVE TO PLAY LAWYER HERE OR ACT LIKE WE KNOW WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT. WHEN IN REALITY, THIS, THIS STUFF IS STUFF THAT WOULD BE TAKEN TO A LAWYER IF THERE WAS A PROBLEM. RIGHT? SO WE HAVE TO THINK IN TERMS OF WHAT IS, WHAT, WHAT IS TRULY EMPOWERING LANGUAGE, NOT NOT LANGUAGE THAT CAN BE, UH, UH, LEFT AMBIGUOUS. YOU, YOU CAN'T SAY IN CONSIDERATION OF, BECAUSE THEN IN CONSIDERATION OF MEANS THAT ALL THAT'S EQUITABLE IS IN SUPPORT OF THE BLUE LANGUAGE, WHEN IT SHOULD BE IN REVERSE IN TERMS OF THE WAY THAT YOU UNDERSTAND OR THE WAY YOU READ IT. SO IT WOULD BE BETTER TO SAY, NOT WITHSTANDING A PRIORITY TO CREATE AN EMPOWER, AN EQUITABLE COMMISSION, WHICH MEANS THAT NONE OF WHAT'S IN BLUE STANDS IN FRONT OF THE FIRST PRIORITY, WHICH WOULD MEAN AN EQUITABLE COMMISSION THAT THAT IS ABOUT REPRESENTING SAN ANTONIO IN THE MOST EQUITABLE FASHION. NOT THAT THE ARCHITECTS AND ALL THOSE OTHER PEOPLE ARE, ARE UNDERSTANDING WHAT EQUITY MEANS, BUT THAT THE LANGUAGE OF THE, OF, OF, OF C UH, ONE HERE IS PLACING AS ITS PRIORITY EQUITY. OKAY, LET'S [01:15:01] REPEAT. YOU WOULD HAVE TO SAY, NOT WITHSTANDING A PRIORITY TO CREATE AND EMPOWER AND EQUITABLE COMMISSION. AND IF, IF, IF, IF LEGAL COULD, COULD CLARIFY THAT, THAT WOULD MEAN THAT NOTHING WOULD GET IN FRONT OF EQUITY AS A PRIORITY. NOTWITHSTANDING A PRIORITY TO CREATE AND IN POWER. AND IN POWER, AN EQUITABLE COMMISSION. A REPRESENTATIVE, AN EQUITABLE COMMISSION. NO, NOT A REP. YOU DON'T REPRESENTATIVE CHANGES EVERYTHING. IT WOULD JUST BE, WELL, AN EQUITABLE COMMISSION. WE ARE A COMMISSION. I'M TRYING TO HONOR THE LANGUAGE THAT OTHER COMMISSIONERS SUGGESTED. SO LET'S SEE IF WE CAN GET THERE WITH A COMBINATION. I AGREE. I HEAR WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, BUT THAT'S WHY, THAT'S WHY 15 MINUTES AIN'T THE WAY TO DO THIS. BECAUSE YOU WE'RE TALKING ABOUT SENTENCES HERE, NOT WHAT WORD DO YOU LIKE? RIGHT? WORDS CHANGE MEANINGS. SO YOU PUT YOU, YOU'RE GONNA CHANGE THE MEANING. YOU'RE GONNA CHANGE THE WHOLE SENTENCE. YOU'RE GONNA LOSE SUPPORT FROM THE ONE THAT GAVE YOU THE SENTENCE CAN'T WIN. LET ME MAKE A SUGGESTION, WHICH MAY OR MAY NOT SIT WELL WITH THE COMMISSION. WE TABLE THIS ITEM TILL THE END SO THAT WE CAN DEAL WITH THE APPLICANTS WHO HAVE BEEN SITTING HERE FOR AN HOUR AND A HALF TRYING TO GET THEIR CASES HEARD. AND WE DEAL WITH THIS AT THE END OF OUR REGULAR AGENDA. AND JUST I WOULD AGREE TO THAT IS MOTION. I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE MAYBE IT IS SOMETHING THAT LEGAL ARE YOU FROM THE LEGAL OFFICE OF, OKAY. 'CAUSE I WAS WONDERING IF THERE WAS SOMEBODY THAT COULD WRITE MAYBE BASED ON HEARING THIS DISCUSSION THAT COULD WRITE SOMETHING. UM, THE CITY COUNCIL APPOINTS US AND THEY DON'T REALLY LOOK AT WHAT'S ON THE REST. THEY JUST LOOK IN THE OWN DISTRICT. SO IT'S JUST FOR ME, CAN WE REALLY, LIKE, WHO WOULD BE THE ENFORCER OF THIS? AND HOW DO YOU PREVENT ONE CITY COUNCIL MEMBER WELL, TO SAY, WELL, YOU CAN'T APPOINT THIS PERSON. 'CAUSE THEN IT WOULD BE UNEQUAL TO THE COMMISSION. YOU CAN'T SAY THAT EITHER. SO I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE ALSO NOT SAYING SOMETHING THAT'S ACTUALLY NOT ENFORCED WHERE THEY, OR EVEN MR. CHAIR, IF I MAY, IF I'M LOOKING AT THIS, COURTS WOULD, WOULD BE THE AR THE COURTS, ONE MOMENT PLEASE. IF I MAY, WHEN WE GENERALLY LOOK AT THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE LOOKS AT THIS LANGUAGE, WHEN LOOKING AT WHO'S BEING APPOINTED AND WHAT QUALIFIES FOR ME, THE SIMPLE SOLUTION IS, UM, CHANGING THE SHELL TO MAY CONSIDER OR MAY, AND THAT WOULD MEAN THAT COUNCIL'S HANDS ARE NOT TIED, BUT THEY ARE LOOKING AT THE SPECIFIC PROFESSIONS AND CATEGORIES TO CONSIDER. AND THAT MAY BE THE SIMPLE SOLUTION TO ADDRESSING SOME OF THE COMMENTS MADE HERE, ALLOWS COUNSEL TO HAVE FLEXIBILITY AND IN, IN THEIR APPOINTMENTS AND DOESN'T NECESSARILY RESTRICT THEM. MR. CHAIRMAN, MY PROBLEM IS, AND I AGREE TO, TO TABLE IT TO THE END, BUT MY PROBLEM IS THAT IF WE'RE GONNA LEAD THAT, BECAUSE THE LANGUAGE HERE IS LEADING COUNCIL, RIGHT? AND THEN THEY'RE GONNA REST ON THAT. THEY FOLLOWED THAT. WELL, IF THEY'RE GONNA FOLLOW SOMETHING, THEY NEED TO FOLLOW SOMETHING THAT WE'RE SAYING IS IMPORTANT TO US, IT'S IMPORTANT TO THE CITIZENS AND WELL, AND THEY, THEY NEED TO BEGIN WITH EQUITY. BUT LET'S TABLE IT. LET'S MOVE THIS. I THINK WE SHOULD COME BACK FRIDAY. IF THERE'S ANY OBJECTIONS, I MOVE THIS, LET'S MOVE THIS TO THE END OF THE REGULAR AGENDA AND PROCEED WITH THE, UH, REST OF THE, UH, INDIVIDUAL CASES. ANY OBJECTION? NO OBJECTION. NO. OKAY. THANK YOU. SO CONSENT AGENDA ITEM NUMBER FIVE WAS PULLED FOR QUESTIONS. THE APPLICANT HERE, MIKE PEREZ, COMMISSIONER SAVINO. THANK YOU MR. PEREZ. UM, I JUST HAD A ONE AREA THAT CONCERNED ME ON YOUR PROJECT, AND THAT WAS JUST THE SQUARE FOOTAGE. AND I KNOW THAT STAFF HAD ASKED FOR MORE INFORMATION ABOUT IT. AND, UM, I'M NOT AS CONCERNED ABOUT THE ACTUAL SQUARE FOOTAGE SIMPLY BECAUSE WE KNOW YOU'RE STARTING WITH A VERY SMALL FOOTPRINT TO BEGIN WITH. AND IN ORDER TO ADEQUATE ADEQUATELY ADDRESS THE PROGRAM, YOU DO NEED CERTAIN FUNCTIONAL THINGS. UM, MY CONCERN IS ON THIS AREA AS, AS IT RELATES TO THE HISTORIC BUILDING. AND I SAY THAT BECAUSE IT, ONCE WE SEE THE, [01:20:01] THE, THE FLOOR PLAN AND THE ELEVATIONS, IT'S THE, IT'S A COMBINATION OF THAT LARGE FLOOR PLAN AND THE ELEVATIONS, THE, THE BUILDING HEIGHT IN COMBINATION THAT BEGIN TO OVERWHELM THE HISTORIC STRUCTURE. SO IT'S NOT SOMETHING I REALLY WANT TO ASK YOU TO SOLVE TODAY, BUT RATHER TO MAKE MY MY CONCERNS CLEAR THAT I THINK AS YOU TAKE THOSE, UM, ASPECTS INTO CONSIDERATION, THE THE SQUARE FOOTAGE ALSO LOOK AT THE ELEVATION THAT WILL BRING YOU TO PROBABLY REVISING SOME OF THOSE WINDOWS TOO. I JUST THINK IT, WE HAVE A SITUATION WHERE THE AD ADDITION JUST REALLY OVERWHELMS AND OVERPOWERS THE ORIGINAL WITHOUT THE THREE D RENDERINGS THAT YOU PROVIDED IN EARLIER VERSIONS. UH, SQUARE FOOTAGE OF THE RENOVATION IS 7 39. THE ADDITION IS, UH, 1,277 TOTAL SQUARE FOOTAGE. 2016, THE LOT IS 7,533. MM-HMM. . MM-HMM. , YOU'RE ALMOST DOUBLING THE SQUARE FOOTAGE ALMOST. AND, UM, AGAIN, I I UNDERSTAND WE'RE, WE'RE GONNA NEED THAT. IF I UNDERSTAND, LET ME PRESENT. I MEAN, IT'S A, IT'S A CAFE AND WE WANT TO GET SOME SEATING. SO LET ME, LET ME DRIVE ON MY, UH, PRESENTATION JUST REAL QUICK AND I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, BUT I ALSO HAVE TO, WE HAVE TO MAKE SIZABLE ROOM FOR, YOU KNOW, TO OPERATE IT AS A, AS A NEIGHBORHOOD BUSINESS. BUT THANK YOU. SO YOU CAN STOP AT THE TOP. SO JUST REAL QUICK, I KNOW WE'VE TAKEN A LOT OF TIME, WE HAVE TO REMEMBER THAT, UM, THIS IS AN ALTA VISTA, SO IT CONCURRENTLY GOES WITH THE NEIGHBORHOOD CONSERVATION, NON-RESIDENTIAL STANDARDS. SO I'M TRYING TO BALANCE THAT AS WELL. AND THEY'RE ALL RIGHT IN HERE. THIS FIRST ONE KIND OF JUST SHOWS YOU, WELL, THAT JUST KIND OF SHOWS YOU WHERE IT'S AT. IT'S ON, UM, NORTH FLORE AND, UH, WEST RUSSELL, RIGHT ON THE CORNER THERE. NEXT ONE. UM, IT WAS BUILT, THAT'S WHAT'S SITTING RIGHT NOW. IT'S JUST A SHELL. IT WAS ORIGINALLY BUILT IN 1926 AS LIBERTY SERVICE STATION IN THE FORTIES. IT WAS A GROCERY STORE BETWEEN THE FIFTIES AND SEVENTIES. IT WAS AN ICE HOUSE. AND IN THE EARLY TWO THOUSANDS, BY THEN IT WAS PATSY'S BAR, IT WAS A MUSIC VENUE HANGOUT. AND THEN I HAD IT ZONED HISTORIC, UM, EARLY LAST YEAR. SO RIGHT NOW, UM, AGAIN, LAST BUSINESS WAS, UH, PATSY'S. IT'S VACANT, IT'S UNDERUTILIZED, IT'S OVERGROWN, IT'S URBAN BLIGHT. I'M REALLY TRYING TO MAKE, IT'S SOMETHING NEAT. CAFE RESTAURANT FOR, UH, THE COMMUNITY THERE FOR THE ALTA VISTA COMMUNITY. EXCELLENT. THIS IS A GOOD ONE TO LOOK AT. THIS IS THE WIND AND SUN STUDY. YOU CAN SEE THE PREVAILING WINDS OUT OF THE SOUTHEAST COME, UM, OFF OF THE SOUTH, OFF OF RUSSELL STREET. THE NORTHERN WINDS COME FROM THE NORTH. IT IS SIGNIFICANTLY HOT ON THE WEST SIDE, AS WE KNOW OUTSIDE, WE WANT OUTDOOR SEATING. SO I DID WANTED TO TAKE IN MIND THE, THE FOOTPRINT THAT WE PUT ON THAT, UH, THAT I PUT ON MY SITE PLAN. WE WENT TO ZONING, STICK WITH IT, I GOT WITH THE NEIGHBORHOOD. THEY WERE GOOD. UM, AND AGAIN, UM, JUST TO KIND OF SEE WHERE THE SUNSET'S HOT ON THE WEST. SO HERE'S THE FLOOR PLAN THAT DID FOLLOW, UH, MY, MY ZONING APPLICATION THAT WOULD, I GOT WITH THE NEIGHBORHOOD PARKING, UH, ON THE SUNNY SIDE. I REALLY DON'T WANT PEOPLE OVER THERE KIND OF SITTING OUTSIDE ENJOYING COFFEE OR WHATEVER. IT'S ON THE SOUTH, UM, EAST SIDE WHERE WE HAVE A LITTLE BIT MORE ROOM. FOLKS CAN SIT OUTSIDE, PUT SOME UMBRELLAS, CHAIRS, THAT KIND OF, THAT KIND OF, UM, SEATING ARRANGEMENT. HERE'S SOME OF THE ELEVATIONS, WHICH YOU CAN SEE. I THINK MONICA, YOU WERE BRINGING UP THE ORIGINAL AND TO THE ADDITION. I DID INCLUDE A ROOF PLAN IN MY, UM, PRESENTATION. WE CAN GO, BUT I REALLY WANTED TO HIDE THE MECHANICAL, THE UGLIES, THE VENTILATION WHERE THE KITCHEN COMES UP. SO WE DID, WANTED TO DO A PARAPET, UM, WHERE WE CAN KEEP THE ORIGINAL STRUCTURE YET HIDE ALL THE UGLIES IN A, IN A GOOD, UH, SIZABLE AREA THAT RESPECTS THE ORIGINAL HOR HISTORIC STRUCTURE THAT HAS A KITCHEN AND, AND, AND DINING. ANOTHER PERSPEC, UH, ANOTHER ELEVATIONS PERSPECTIVE THAT GIVE YOU THE HEIGHTS. AND IT IS ALL ONE STORY. THANKS. UM, AND THEN THE OTHER PERSPECTIVE HERE, YOU CAN SEE THE ROOF PLAN AND ON THE RIGHT SIDE YOU CAN SEE THOSE SQUARES. UM, THAT'S WHERE WE'RE PLANNING ON KEEPING SOME OF THE AC UNITS AND, UM, YOU KNOW, THE OVERHEAD VENTILATION WHERE WE CAN HIDE THOSE DETAILED FLOOR PLAN. I DON'T HAVE A, A LITTLE LASER PIN, BUT YOU CAN KIND OF SEE WHERE EVERYBODY, I MEAN, THOSE DON'T HAVE TO BE EXACT SEATINGS, BUT TO SEE WHERE PEOPLE WOULD SIT AT THE SERVICE AREA IN THE FRONT WHERE THE CANOPY USED TO BE IN THE REAR [01:25:01] AND TO GO OUT INTO THE SHADY PART OF THE YARD. UM, AGAIN, ON THE WEST SIDE, THE KITCHEN KIND OF STORAGE AREA, HOT, UNDESIRABLE, AND THAT'S KIND OF HOW WE POSITIONED IT. LASTLY, WHERE IT, UH, WHERE IT'S SITTING RIGHT NOW AND WHAT I'M PROPOSING, AND THEN I JUST TOOK A CRACK AT A LANDSCAPE SHOP, UH, PLAN. IT'S A WORK IN PROGRESS, WANT TO POSITION THE TREES. I'LL REARRANGE THAT AND THEN GET, UM, YOU KNOW, I, I KIND OF WANT TO TIGHTEN UP ALL THE PLANT LISTS FOR DROUGHT RESISTANCE AND ALL THAT, BUT THAT'S WHAT I HAVE. UM, THANK YOU. THANK YOU MR. PEREZ. I, UM, UH, AM ARE, DO YOU HAVE ANY, UM, WHAT ARE YOUR COMMENTS, UH, REGARDING THE STAFF'S COMMENTS? ARE YOU IN SUPPORT OF, FOR ALL THE STAFF'S COMMENTS? I'M IN SUPPORT AND I'M IN AGREEANCE AND I'M QUITE HAPPY WITH THE SIZE THAT WE REALLY WORKED HARD WITH, WITH, WITH THE COMMUNITY, WITH THE COMMUNITY THERE AND TRYING TO MAKE A, A, A BUILDING FOOTPRINT THAT MATCHES THE AREA. SO THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT I HAVE TO SAY ABOUT THAT. OKAY. AGAIN, THE FOOTPRINT ON IS ON ITS OWN, IS NOT A CONCERN, IT'S JUST HOW IT RELATES TO THE EXISTING HISTORIC STRUCTURE. SO THANK YOU. IF MY, UM, FELLOW COMMISSIONERS HAVE, UM, IF YOU HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD, OTHERWISE, I'D LIKE TO JUST MAKE A MOTION THAT WE, UM, APPROVE THE PROPOSAL WITH ALL STAFF STIPULATIONS. SECOND, I, I'LL SECOND IT. WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND. ANY DISCUSSION? WE HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE. SABINA. AYE. VELASQUEZ? AYE. MORALES? AYE. MAZUA. AYE. CARPENTER. AYE. GROUP. AYE. ANTE? YES. AND FED. AYE. MOTION PASSES. THANK YOU. ITEM NUMBER EIGHT. I AM FINDING RICHARD GONZALEZ IN THE LIST HERE. MR. GONZALEZ, ARE YOU THERE? YOU MIGHT NEED TO UNMUTE. YES, I'M, I'M HERE TODAY. PERFECT. WE HAD A QUESTION FROM COMMISSIONER SABINO. UM, YES, I HAD SOME QUESTIONS AND MY COMPUTER CRASHED, SO I DON'T HAVE MY DRAWINGS IN FRONT OF ME. UM, I THINK MY CONCERNS WERE, UM, RELATIVE TO THOSE THAT THE, UH, COMMUNITY PRESENTED REGARDING THE DRAWINGS. UM, LET, LEMME SEE IF I CAN OPEN UP MY FILE. HERE WE GO. I JUST WANTED TO CONFIRM WITH THE APPLICANT THAT STAFF, UM, STIPULATIONS TO PROVIDE UPDATED DRAWINGS WAS AMENABLE TO YOU BECAUSE I NOTICED THE DRAWINGS, THE, OF THE EXISTING STRUCTURE REALLY DO NOT REFLECT THE ACTUAL CONDITION, THE DIMENSIONS, UM, OF THE EXISTING HOUSE. SO I THINK IT WOULD BE REALLY HELPFUL FOR EVERYBODY IF YOU HAD UPDATED DRAWINGS. IS THAT SOMETHING YOU CAN PROVIDE? YES. AND PER THE COMMUNITY'S, THE COMMUNITY'S COMMENTS, ALSO NOTATION MATERIALS AND YES, SO, SO THE SIDING IS THE, UH, HISTORIC, UH, WOOD, UM, ONE 17 SIDING. SO THAT'S GONNA STAY EXACTLY THE SAME. I THINK THE NEIGHBORHOOD, UH, WAS COMMENTING TO HAVE A DIVISION OR, UH, MAYBE A TRIM TO SEPARATE THE EXISTING STRUCTURE FROM THE ADDITION. UH, THAT'S NOT A PROBLEM EITHER. AND I THINK THE OTHER COMMENT WAS THE SLIDING DOOR. UM, I'M NOT AWARE ABOUT HISTORIC, UH, UM, HOUSES NOT HAVING SLIDING DOORS. AND IF THAT'S AN ISSUE WE CAN JUST PUT A REGULAR DOOR. I THINK. UM, UH, LET'S SEE. STAFF, DID YOU COMMENT ON THAT? SO THERE'S A FINDING IN THE, IN THE FINDINGS THAT DOES ADDRESS THE ACCURACY OF THE DRAWINGS. UM, AND SO IT REALLY CLARIFIES THE SCOPE HERE. AND SO THERE ARE DISCREPANCIES IN THE DRAWING. SO WE'RE JUST CLARIFYING IN THE FINDINGS THAT THOSE DISCREPANCIES AREN'T PART OF [01:30:01] THE REQUEST. WE'RE NOT REQUESTING TO CHANGE THE PORT TRUTH JUST 'CAUSE IT'S DRAWN THAT WAY. SO, OKAY. WE ARE TRYING TO WORK WITH THE APPLICANT WHERE WE CAN ON THOSE, BUT THERE WE AGREE THAT THERE'S SOME DETAILS THAT NEED TO BE CAPTURED IN THE FINAL APPROVAL. OKAY, THANK YOU FOR THAT CLARIFICATION. AND AS WELL ON THIS ONE, UH, I THINK I WOULD LIKE TO, I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION UNLESS, UM, MY FELLOW COMMISSIONERS WOULD LIKE TO ADD. I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO ACCEPT ALL STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS WITH, UM, STIPULATIONS, ALL STIPULATIONS INCLUDING ALL NEW MATERIAL DOCUMENTS, UH, PROVIDED TO STAFF BE ALSO UPLOADED TO THE EXPLORER MAP. WE HAVE A MOTION. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND. ANY DISCUSSION? HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE. SABINA? AYE. VELAZQUEZ, I, AYE. MORALES? AYE. ZUKA. AYE. CARPENTER. AYE. GROUP. AYE. ANTES? YES. AND FED. AYE. MOTION PASSES. THANK YOU. AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 11. . MY QUESTIONS ON THIS ONE WERE PRIMARILY FOR STAFF AND I WAS WONDERING WHY, WHAT WAS THE ORDER OF OPERATIONS HERE WE OFF? WE APPROVED PREVIOUSLY THAT PORCH OR THE ADDITION, CORRECT? YES, I AM LOOKING FOR THE FILE, BUT I THINK IT WAS APRIL OF THIS YEAR. RIGHT. AND WHY IS THE DEMOLITION COMING TO US NOW? WAS THAT NOT HANDLED AT THE TIME? UM, I HAVE THE APPLICANT, FRANK TELLIS HERE, AND EDWARD IS THE CASE MANAGER. AND SO EDWARD'S VERY FAR AWAY IN HAWAII RIGHT NOW. BUT I BELIEVE, UH, THE ISSUE WAS IT WAS INCOMPLETE. AND SO WE'VE BEEN WORKING WITH MR. TEIS TO COMPLETE THE APPLICATION AND SO WE NOW HAVE IT HERE. SO WE ACTUALLY APPROVED WITHOUT THE APPROVED THE NEW WORK WITHOUT APPROVING THE DEMOLITION. WHAT WAS APPROVED PREVIOUSLY WAS JUST THE, THE REAR ADDITION AND THE PATIO THAT YOU'RE CITING IN THE PLANS, RIGHT? MM-HMM. . AND THEN TODAY IS THE DEMOLITION AND REPLACEMENT WITH THE NEW ACCESSORY. OKAY. AND FRONT PORCH. OKAY. LET'S HAVE MR. UM, WHERE IS IT? MR, ARE YOU THERE? YEAH. MR. TELLIS. TELL US ABOUT THAT. WE'RE STILL MUTED. SEE? OKAY. CAN YOU HEAR ME? YES. OKAY, SO WE'RE ON THE OUTBUILDING. WE, WE WERE GONNA TRY TO SALVAGE IT, BUT IT WAS DETERIORATED FOR THE FOUNDATION AND A LOT OF THE WOOD MEMBERS WERE ROTTED, SO THAT'S WHY WE DID NOT, UH, PURSUE DEMOING AT THE BEGINNING. OKAY. SO THE CLARIFICATION IS A, A CHANGE IN SCOPE TO THE PREVIOUS REQUEST. SO WHAT WAS CONSIDERED BEFORE WAS A REHAB. AND SO WHAT IS COMING NOW IS DEMOLITION WITH NEW CONSTRUCTION AFTER DEMOLITION. ACTUALLY, I'M SORRY, IT'S DEMOLITION. SORRY, I'M GONNA SEE MY CASES. YEAH, THIS IS KIND OF, THIS IS REALLY WORRISOME THAT WE'RE JUST, IF I'M UNDERSTANDING THIS CORRECTLY, THAT WE HAVE APPROVED SOMETHING, UH, SOMEBODY'S BUILDING AND IT'S AFTER THE FACT. WE FIND THAT THERE'S ANOTHER BUILDING IN THE WAY AND NOT IN GOOD SHAPE AND WE TAKE IT DOWN. IS THAT WHAT'S NO, THAT'S NOT SO I'M NOT GETTING IT. THE PREVIOUS APPROVAL INCLUDED REHABILITATION OF THE GARAGE. UM, AS MR. TELLIS STATED, THEY FOUND THAT TO BE UNFEASIBLE AND SO THEY'VE COME FORWARD TO MEET THE REQUIREMENTS FOR ECONOMIC HARDSHIP AND ARE PURSUING DEMOLITION OF THE GARAGE. A DEMOLITION WITH NO RECONSTRUCTION. OH, RECONSTRUCTION. I APOLOGIZE. 'CAUSE IT'S ACCESSORY. SO YEAH. OKAY. THAT'S IT. OKAY. UH, I HAVE NO FURTHER QUESTIONS. IF SOMEBODY WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION, WELCOME TO IT. I MOVE FOR APPROVAL WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS. I SECOND YOU HAVE A MOTION? A SECOND. ANY DISCUSSION? I JUST WANTED TO ASK MR. TE IF HE WAS OKAY WITH, UM, STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS? YES, WE'RE IN AGREEANCE. THANK YOU. HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE. SINA. AYE. VELAZQUEZ? AYE. MORALES? AYE. ZUKA. AYE. CARPENTER. AYE. GROUP. AYE. ANTES? YES. AND FETZER? YES. MOTION PASSES. AGENDA ITEM 14. OKAY, LET ME FIND GARRETT COX. GARRETT, ARE YOU THERE? YES, I'M HERE. PERFECT. YES. COMMISSIONER CARPENTER HAD [01:35:01] QUESTIONS. UH, THANK YOU MR. CHAIRMAN. APPRECIATE THAT. THE, I PULL IT MAINLY IN RESPONSE TO THE COMMENTS THAT WE RECEIVED FROM THE COMMUNITY. THERE'S A QUESTION ABOUT WHERE THE EXTERIOR WATER HEATER, UM, IS GOING TO BE RELOCATED TO. UM, THERE WAS, UH, ALSO A QUESTION ABOUT THE MATERIALS LIST. AND ONCE AGAIN, AS KIND OF A THEME WITH LAST, UH, TWO PROJECTS, SOME DELINEATION OF A SEPARATION BETWEEN THE NEW AND OLD. UM, WOULD, WOULD YOU BE, UH, AMENABLE TO, UM, YOU KNOW, ADDING SOME TRIM OR SOMETHING THAT SHOWS WHERE THE NEW AND OLD, UH, TAKE PLACE? YES, SIR. ABSOLUTELY. OKAY. AND CAN YOU ANSWER THE COMMUNITY'S QUESTION ABOUT WHERE THE WATER HEATER, UH, SINCE THE EXTERIOR CLOSET'S GOING AWAY, IS THAT BEING PULLED INTO THE INTERIOR OF THE, OF THE BUILDING? YES, SIR. WE PULLED INTO THE INTERIOR OF THE BUILDING, SO IT'LL BE SWITCHED OFF FOR A TANKLESS HEATER THEN AND, UH, PLACED IN THE, IN THE ADDITION. UM, SO YES, IT'LL BE INSIDE. GREAT. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. I APPRECIATE IT. AND THANK YOU FOR WAITING SO LONG. UH, MR. CHAIRMAN, I MOVE FOR APPROVAL WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS, THE ADDITIONAL STIPULATION THAT, UM, A TRA UH, TRIM OR SOME OF SOME, UM, KIND OF DELINEATION BETWEEN THE OLD AND NEW BE INCORPORATED INTO DESIGN AND REVIEWED BY O H P PRIOR TO, UH, UH, APPROVAL OF A, A RELEASING OF A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS. I SECOND WE HAVE A MOTION. AND SECOND. ANY DISCUSSION? I HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE. SINA AYE. VELASQUEZ AYE. MORALES? AYE. MAZUA? AYE. CARPENTER? AYE. GRUB? AYE. ANTE? YES, I PET. AYE. MOTION PASSES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 18. AGENDA ITEM 18, H C R C CASE NUMBER 2022 DASH 3 73, 11 11 AND 1115 NORTH PALMETTO. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO ONE, AMEND A PREVIOUSLY APPROVED DESIGN REGARDING WINDOW MATERIALS FOR THE NEW CONSTRUCTION AT ONE, I'M SORRY, 1111 AND 1115 NORTH PALMETTO. TWO AMEND THE PREVIOUSLY APPROVED DESIGN BY MODIFYING THE PREVIOUSLY APPROVED FENESTRATION PATTERN FOR BOTH STRUCTURES ON THE NORTH, SOUTH AND EAST FACADES. THREE. INSTALL COMPOSITE SIDING FEATURING A SEVEN INCH EXPOSURE IN FAUX WOOD GRAIN FINISH. IN LIEU OF THE PREVIOUSLY APPROVED COMPOSITE SIDING, STIPULATED TO FEATURE AN EXPOSURE OF FOUR INCHES AND A SMOOTH FINISH AND FOUR INSTALL BOARD AND BATTEN SIDING ON SECTIONS OF THE FRONT FACADE OF BOTH STRUCTURES. RECOMMENDATION STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF THE INSTALLATION OF ALUMINUM WINDOWS. HOWEVER, THE PROPOSED WINDOW MUST MEET STAFF STANDARDS FOR WINDOWS AND NEW CONSTRUCTION AS NOTED IN THE APPLICABLE CITATIONS AND BELOW TWO STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF ITEM TWO. MODIFICATIONS TO EXISTING FENESTRATION AND DESIGN BASED ON FINDING. D. STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT THE ORIGINAL DESIGN SHOULD BE ADHERED TO AS SHOWN IN THE ORIGINAL, IN ORIGINAL CONSTRUCTION DOCUMENTS AS IT RELATES TO ALL FENESTRATION. NUMBER THREE, STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF ITEM THREE, THE INSTALLATION OF COMPOSITE SIDING FEATURING A SEVEN INCH EXPOSURE AND FO WOOD GRAIN FINISH BASED ON FINDING F. STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT THE PREVIOUSLY APPROVED SPECIFICATION SHOULD BE FOLLOWED. THAT SIDING SHOULD FEATURE A FOUR INCH EXPOSURE AND SMOOTH FINISH. STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THE APPLICATION OF LATEX PAINT TO OBSCURE THE FAUX WOOD GRAIN TEXTURE. AND FOUR STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF ITEM FOUR, THE INSTALLATION OF BOARD AND BATTEN SIDING IN LIEU OF HORIZONTAL SIDING. BATTENS SHOULD BE INSTALLED 12 INCHES APART AND SHOULD FEATURE A WIDTH OF APPROXIMATELY 1.5 INCHES. AND I BELIEVE THE APPLICANT JAMES BENFIELD IS WITH US VIRTUALLY. I'M HERE. CAN YOU HEAR ME? YES. HELLO BOARD. UH, THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME. UM, SO I WAS IN THERE, UH, NOT THAT LONG AGO AND UM, I GOT SOME RECOMMENDATIONS AND I WAS JUST, I'M RUNNING UP ON A MATURING LOAN AND I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO DO THIS. UM, AND I ASKED MR. HALL FOR SOME GUIDANCE AND WE WENT OVER A FEW THINGS. I'D LIKE TO DISCUSS THOSE. BUT JUST FOR THE RECORD, THE FIRST THING THAT I DID WHEN I LEFT THE MEETING, AS YOU CAN SEE, THE HOUSE ON THE RIGHT, THAT THERE'S NO WINDOWS YET. AND I ACTUALLY, UM, CANCELED THE ORDER FOR THOSE WINDOWS BECAUSE I HAD FOUND, UM, THROUGH MR. HALL, HE SENT ME TO A HOUSE AT SIX 11, UH, SIX 11 DAW, SIX 19 DAWSON. AND I SPOKE TO THAT INVESTOR AND HE HAD KIND OF THE SAME PROBLEM AND HE REFERRED ME ACTUALLY TO A GENTLEMAN WHO I'VE NEVER HEARD OF BEFORE, BUT CAN GET THE WINDOWS INSTEAD OF 10 AND 11 MONTHS IN, IN EIGHT WEEKS. SO [01:40:01] I CANCELED THAT ORDER AND ORDERED THE WINDOWS FOR THE, FOR THE RIGHT HOUSE. SO THOSE ARE ORDERED AS YOU CAN SEE, THE WINDOWS ON, ON THE FIRST HOUSE, WHICH IS THE ONES THAT ARE IN QUESTION TO DO ALL OF THEM. UM, I JUST DON'T THINK I'D BE ABLE TO GET IT DONE BEFORE MY LOAN MATURES. SO I ASKED HIM, IS THERE ANY OPTIONS? CAN YOU, CAN YOU GIVE ME SOME IDEAS? AND WE COLLABORATED AND HE CAME UP WITH A FEW THAT I THOUGHT WOULD WORK AND I WOULD LOVE TO DISCUSS THOSE WITH YOU AND HOPEFULLY WE CAN, WE CAN MEET IN THE MIDDLE AND GET THEM APPROVED. UM, THE, THE FIRST ONE IS CHANGING THE FIRST TWO WINDOWS ON THE FRONT. THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO BE OPERABLE, BUT ALSO I, I WAS ABLE TO ORDER THOSE. UM, AT THE SAME TIME I ORDERED THE WINDOWS FOR THE HOUSE ON THE RIGHT. SO THEY WILL MEET SPECS, THE TWO HOUSES ON THE FRONT PATIO, UM, AND THEN ALSO, UM, TO PUT SCREENS ON ALL THE OTHER WINDOWS. SO I DID SEND A PICTURE OF WHAT THE SCREENS WOULD LOOK LIKE, SO THE WINDOWS WOULD LOOK HISTORICAL. UH, HOPEFULLY HE PUT THOSE IN THERE. LET'S SEE. NO, NO. OKAY, SO THOSE WEREN'T PUT IN BEFORE WE LEFT, I GUESS. UH, SO THERE'RE WOOD SCREENS THAT WE CAN MAKE, UM, THAT ACTUALLY HAVE, THEY'RE MADE OUT OF WOOD AND THEN THE TOP IS JUST TINY SQUARES. UM, BUT THERE AREN'T A LOT OF THE HISTORICAL HOMES DOWN THERE AND, AND WE CAN MAKE ONE FOR EVERY WINDOW. UM, WE CAN DO THAT BESIDES THE TWO IN THE FRONT. AGAIN, WE WOULD, WE WOULD TURN THOSE INTO WINDOWS THAT ACTUALLY, UH, FIT THE SPECS THAT YOU GUYS ARE REQUESTING. UM, AND THEN THE OTHER ITEM THAT WAS DISCUSSED WAS THE FAUX WOOD. AGAIN, IF YOU REMEMBER CORRECTLY, WE DO HAVE THE FAUX WOOD ON THE SIDES, BUT WE CAUGHT THE CONTRACTOR IN TIME TO MAKE CHANGES TO THE FRONT. SO THE FRONT DOES HAVE THEM FLIPPED BACKWARDS. HE MADE THE SUGGESTION OF DOING THAT EPOXY PAINT, WHICH IS A MUCH THICKER PAINT. AND I DID INCLUDE A PICTURE OF A HOUSE THAT WAS DONE BEFORE WITH THAT EPOXY PAINT. UM, AND IT COVERED UP THE FAUX WOOD SIDING VERY WELL. UM, YOU CAN SEE THAT ON THERE IT'S GREEN SHOULD HAVE POWER. AND JAMES, SORRY TO INTERRUPT. WE DID HAVE THOSE PHOTOS SUBMITTED IN OUR LATE SUBMISSIONS PHOTO, SO I'M GOING TO SHOW THOSE NOW. OH, THERE THEY'RE, YES. SO THAT'S THE SCREENS THAT I'M TALKING ABOUT. UM, AND DOING THE HYPOXY PAINT. UM, AND THEN THE ONLY THING THEN THAT WOULD BE, I GUESS WHAT WE CAN'T DO ANYTHING ABOUT IS THE, UM, THE EXPOSURE, WHICH IS WE ARE SIX INCHES. I THINK EDWARD SAYS WE'RE SEVEN INCHES. I THOUGHT WE WERE SIX, BUT INSTEAD OF THE FOUR AND HE SENT A FEW ADDRESSES TO ME TO, TO GO TAKE PICTURES OF WHICH I SUBMITTED AS WELL ON THOSE. UM, HOPING TO GET APPROVAL ON THAT COMMISSION. WE HAVE PUBLIC COMMENTS FOR THIS CASE. YES. AND THEN THERE THERE'S ONE BELOW THAT THAT IS ACTUALLY, UH, CLOSE UP. THAT'S THE GUY THAT ACTUALLY GOT THE WINDOW REFERRAL FROM. ALL RIGHT, UH, MAY WE HEAR THE, UH, CITIZEN VOICEMAIL? HELLO, MY NAME IS VALERIE CORTEZ AND I RESIDE AT 5 0 8 LAMAR STREET WITH INDI WITTY HILL. I'M CALLING ON BEHALF OF THE CONCERNED CITIZENS OF DIGNITY WITTY HILL WITH REGARD TO CASE NUMBER 2022 DASH 3 73, LOCATED AT 1111 AND 1115 NORTH PALMETTO. WE AGREE WITH O P'S RECOMMENDATION TO NOT ALLOW THE CHANGES THIS DEVELOPER IS REQUESTING THAT DEAL WITH WINDOW MATERIAL, FENESTRATION CHANGES AND SITING CHANGES WITH THE EXCEPTION OF THE BOARD AND BATTEN. IN ADDITION, WHERE IS THE LANDSCAPING DESIGNED? THIS IS REQUIRED FOR ALL NEW BILLS. WHY IS THERE NOT ONE INCLUDED IN THE PACKET? THE EXAMPLES OF THE HOUSE IS BUILT WITH THE FULL WOOD FINISHED SIGHTING SHOULD NOT BE TAKEN INTO CONSIDERATION AS PRESIDENTS IN THIS HISTORICAL DISTRICT. THE TYPE OF PAINT JOB THAT IS BEING RECOMMENDED DOES NOTHING TO HIDE THE FACT THAT THE FULL WOOD GRAIN IS EXPOSED. BECAUSE IF YOU ZOOM IN ON THE IMAGES PROVIDED, YOU CAN STILL SEE THE WOOD GRAIN EVEN THROUGH THE PAINT. WE SHOULD THANK THE APPLICANT [01:45:01] FOR PRESENTING THESE OTHER DEVELOPMENTS THAT DID NOT FOLLOW O H P PROCEDURE AND ASK O H P TO CITE THEM FOR NOT FOLLOWING THE GUIDELINES. THESE ARE THE TOP OF NINE COMPLIANT DEVELOPERS THAT SHOULD NOT BE CALLED OUT AND FIND. IN ADDITION, THE EXAMPLES THAT THE APPLICANT USES FOR 1117 NORTH PALMETTO IS NOT WHAT YOU SEE ON GOOGLE MAPS. THE IMAGE PROVIDED IS OF A SINGLE STORY, SMALL BUNGALOW HOUSE INSTEAD. THE OTHER QUESTION WE HAD CONCERNS THE THIRD LEVEL OF STAIRS THAT LEADS TO THE ROOF, WAS THIS EVER APPROVED BY O H P? WE DON'T RECALL THIS BEING APPROVED. I WOULD LIKE CONFIRMATION. THANK YOU. UM, I CAN CONFIRM THAT THE STAIRS SHOWN IN THE ELEVATIONS WERE APPROVED AT A PREVIOUS HEARING. YES. YEAH, THEY WERE. OKAY, THANK YOU. AND ALSO THE LANDSCAPING WAS, I SENT THE PLANS WITH LANDSCAPING PLANS AS WELL. WE WE HAVE A LANDSCAPING PLAN AS WELL. SO QUESTIONS, COMMENTS ON THE, FOR THE RECORD ONE MORE TIME. I'M SORRY. EXCUSE ME. I APOLOGIZE FOR THE RECORD. THE HOUSE, THE HOUSE ON THE RIGHT MEETS ALL THE SPECS. THE, THE ONLY THING THAT IT WON'T, IN OTHER WORDS, ALL THE SIDING IS TURNED. 'CAUSE WE DID CATCH IT WHEN THEY WERE, AGAIN, ABOUT 70% DONE WITH THE OTHER HOUSE. BUT THE HOUSE ON THE RIGHT, ALL OF IT IS FLIPPED BACKWARDS. ALL THE WINDOWS WILL BE THE SPEC. THE ONLY THING THAT WON'T BE WAS, IS THE EXPOSURE. SO WE'RE TRYING TO DO THE RIGHT THING. WE JUST, THERE WAS A COUPLE BALLS THAT WERE DROPPED ON THE HOUSE ON THE LEFT, MR. YES. COMMISSIONER GROUP. SO I WANNA HEAR ABOUT THIS EXPOSURE. CAN YOU GO BACK TO THE PICTURE? I THINK YOU HAD IT EARLIER. YEAH, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE GRA EXPOSURE. SO THAT'S THE NO, THE EXPOSURE. I'M SORRY. THAT'S THE TERMINOLOGY THAT EDWARD WAS USING HIS EMAILS TO ME, SO I THOUGHT YOU GUYS WERE WERE FAMILIAR. IT'S THE INCHES IS WHAT I MEAN BY THE EXPOSURE. THE WIDTH IN BETWEEN LAPS. YEAH. SO, AND YOU MENTIONED EARLIER THAT EDWARD HAD PUT IN THE APPLICATION SEVEN INCHES WERE YOU'RE GONNA DO SIX INCHES. LIKE WHAT, WHAT IS IT? NO, NO, NO. I I THOUGHT IT WAS SIX INCHES. HE SAID IT'S SEVEN INCHES. I'M JUST SAYING WHAT HE SAID WAS IN IT. BUT IT'S, IT PER THE, THE PLANES, IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE FOUR INCHES AND WHAT YOU HAVE RIGHT NOW IS BETWEEN SIX AND SEVEN. I MEAN, IT'S PROBABLY INSTALLED SEVEN. AND JUST CLARIFY THE WINDOW FENESTRATION. 'CAUSE YOU KEEP SAYING WE'RE NOT CHANGING ANYTHING, BUT THERE IS PART OF THE APPLICATION WHERE YOU'RE, WHERE YOU'RE ASKING CHANGE IN FENESTRATION, NOTHING'S CHANGING TO WHAT WAS DONE CONSTRUCTION WISE WE SEE IN THE PICTURE, WHICH IS NOT WHAT WE APPROVED INITIALLY. CORRECT. IS THAT WHAT I'M UNDERSTANDING? SO WHEN THE APPLICANT SAYS WE'RE NOT CHANGING ANYTHING, IS STAYS THE SAME ON THE PROPERTY TO THE RIGHT, BUT IT'S NOT WHAT WE APPROVED. IT'S THE SIDING AND THE WINDOWS ARE THE TWO ITEMS THAT HAVE DISCREPANCIES WITH THE APPROVED STIPULATIONS ON THE HOUSE, ON, ON THE HOUSE ON THE LEFT. THAT, THAT THE HOU THE EVERYTHING ON THE RIGHT IS WHAT'S APPROVED. I, LIKE I SAID, I REORDERED THE WINDOWS. UM, THE, THE REASON WHY THE HOUSE ON THE LEFT, AND I STATED THIS IN THE LAST MEETING IS BECAUSE THERE'S SOME MAJOR LOGISTICAL ISSUES GOING ON RIGHT NOW. SO I HAD ORDERED THE CORRECT WINDOWS. THEY WERE WOOD CLAD. I HAD ORDERED THEM, BUT I KEPT GETTING DELAYS. IT WAS FIRST IT WAS GONNA BE THREE MONTHS, THEN IT WAS SIX MONTHS AND THEN IT WAS A YEAR. SO I WAS LIKE, OKAY, I CAN'T DO THIS. I WAITED SO LONG I STARTED BUTTING UP AGAINST MY LOAN MATURING. SO I ORDERED WHAT WAS AVAILABLE SO THAT ALSO THE DRYWALL WAS IN, EVERYTHING WAS IN INSIDE THE HOUSE AND I NEEDED TO COVER UP. SO I ORDERED THAT AND I ASKED EDWARD, WHAT ARE SOME OPTIONS THAT WE CAN DO? OH, I UNDERSTAND THAT PART. BUT YEAH, THE APPLICATION, I WAS JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT WHAT'S IN THE APPLICATION IS WHAT WE RECOMMEND TODAY ON THE REC APPLICATION. IT SAYS PATTERN FENESTRATION PATTERNS FOR BOTH STRUCTURES. AND THAT'S NOT WHAT HE'S SAYING RIGHT NOW. SO JUST WANNA MAKE SURE WE'RE ALL ON THE SAME PAGE. I I BELIEVE IT'S THE ONE HOUSE WE'RE LOOKING AT AT THIS TIME. THE ONE TO THE LEFT. CORRECT. OKAY. SO THE APPLICATION SAYS, UH, PATTERN FOR BOTH STRUCTURES ON THE NORTH, SOUTH AND EAST FACADES. I WILL SEEK CLARIFICATION FROM EDWARD IF I CAN. NO, I KNOW, I KNOW EDWARD WON'T. NO, I KNOW. I WANNA MAKE SURE THAT NO, I MEAN I THINK THE APPLICANT CAN ANSWER IT. [01:50:01] I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE UM, AND THEN YOU SAID YOU FOUND SOME THE WINDOWS. YEAH, FOR THE HOUSE TO THE RIGHT. I THINK WHAT I THINK WHAT HE MEANT BY THE FENESTRATION, 'CAUSE I THINK THERE'S A CONTINUANCE OF THE ORIGINAL ONE, MEANING THAT I HAD ORDERED THE WRONG WINDOWS FOR THE HOUSE ON THE RIGHT TOO. BUT I CHANGED THOSE SO I I DID GET THE CORRECT ONES ON THE RIGHT. AND I THINK WHAT HE'S TALKING ABOUT ALSO IS THE HOUSE ON THE LEFT. THERE'S IT'S NON OPERABLE WINDOWS IN THE FRONT AND AND THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO BE, THE ONES ON THE FRONT PORCH ARE SUPPOSED TO BE OPERABLE. SO IF THE WINDOWS THAT YOU FOUND FOR THE RIGHT ARE NOT CHANGING ANY SIZE, CORRECT? NO. YEAH, THOSE, IT'S NOT GONNA CHANGE ANY FENESTRATION. IS IT GONNA CHANGE ANY OF THE DESIGN? IS IT, DOES IT ADHERE TO THE WINDOW SPECIFICATIONS THAT STAFF HAS? CORRECT. YES. AND THE AND THE SCREENS ARE JUST FOR THE ONE TO THE LEFT? YES, MA'AM. I MEAN, THE ONLY CONCERN I HAVE IS THOSE SCREENS REALLY DON'T GO WITH THAT SIZE OF WINDOW EVEN HISTORICALLY. SO I DON'T KNOW IF IT WOULD EVEN BE WORSENING THE MATTER. I DON'T KNOW HOW TO SAY IT. BUT THE SCREENS ARE MADE FOR, YOU KNOW, THE, THE SIZE OF A ONE OF A ONE. NOT FOR LIKE A RECTANGULAR, ELONGATED WINDOW. UM, OH NO, NO, I'M NOT AND NOT, NOT THE, NOT THE ONES THAT ARE, THAT ARE, UM, JUST THE BOTTOM ONES. YEAH. YEAH, JUST THE OPERABLE ONES IS WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT. NOT, NOT THE ONES THAT, THAT, UH, NOT THE ONES THAT AREN'T OPERABLE. THEY DON'T SELL THOSE WINDOWS OF THAT SIZE THAT ARE OPERABLE. THOSE ARE JUST REGULAR FIXED GLASS. AND THE ONLY OTHER THING TOO IS ON THE, ON THE, UH, ON THE HOUSE ON THE LEFT, THE FRONT ONES ON THAT POP OUT, THAT LITTLE PART THAT COMES OUT, THEY SHOW 'EM AS OPERABLE. BUT YOU CAN'T DO THOSE OPERABLE BECAUSE THEY WON'T PASS CODE. UM, THEY'RE, THEY'RE TAN. THEY'RE, UM, MY GOSH, WHAT, WHAT'S THE WORD I'M LOOKING FOR? THEY, THEY'RE, THEY'RE THE, UH, THE UNBREAKABLE GLASS TEMPERED, EXCUSE ME. UM, BECAUSE THEY, THEY'RE WHERE THE STAIRS ARE. SO, BUT THEY'RE AT FOOT LEVEL, SO YOU DON'T WANT TO TOGGLE OPENING UP A WINDOW AND FALLING OUT THE WINDOW. SO THEY MAKE THOSE FIXED TEMPERED GLASS, THE ONES THEY'RE ON THE STAIRS. UM, SO I APOLOGIZE FOR THE CONFUSION. IT IS THE SIDING ON BOTH HOUSES. SORRY. EXCITED. YES. THE EXPOSURE OF HOUSES. IT'S WELL AND THE, THE FAUX WOOD GRAIN ISSUE, I DON'T HAVE IT ON THE RIGHT. HI RIGHT HOUSE. OKAY. OKAY. SO THAT'S WHAT I, OKAY, SO IT'S THE WRONG EXPOSURE ON BOTH HOUSES. IT'S THE WRONG, UH, TEXTURE ON THE LEFT HOUSE AND EXPOSURE. YEAH. ON THE LEFT FOR THE WINDOWS. IT'S BOTH. BUT MR. BENFIELD, I THINK YOU CAN, UM, EXPLAIN, I THINK YOU'RE WILLING TO CORRECT THE ISSUE WITH ALL OF THE FIXED WINDOWS ON THE ONE HOUSE AND DO SASH WINDOWS. IS THAT CORRECT? YES. THERE'S ONLY TWO THAT SHOULD BE SASHED AND THAT AREN'T, AND UH, THEY WERE ORDERED THIS WAY 'CAUSE IT SHOWS THAT ON THE PLANS WHEN WE TURNED THEM IN TO THE, THE MATERIALS COMPANY, G***O MATERIALS, SO THAT'S WHAT THEY ORDERED. 'CAUSE IT SAYS F A F X D GLASS, BUT THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO BE OPERABLE ONES, THE ONES ON THE FRONT. SO I DID REORDER THOSE TO THE EXACT SPECS THAT ARE ON THE ORIGINAL, ORIGINAL, UM, PLAN FROM YOU GUYS. IN OTHER WORDS, THE ASHS OF THE EXACTLY WITH THE MEETING RAIL, EVERYTHING IS THE CORRECT MEASUREMENTS AND I'LL BE REPLACING THOSE. ANOTHER THING IS WE KNEW THAT WE WERE, YOU KNOW, GONNA BE OFF A LITTLE BIT. SO WE DID MAKE EVERY ATTEMPT WE COULD TO MAKE THOSE OTHER WINDOWS LOOK HISTORICAL AS WE COULD. WE, WE SET THEM BACK AND WE MODIFIED THEM AND PUT SOME TRIM IN THAT MADE THEM LOOK REALLY NICE. UM, HOWEVER, THE SASHES ARE A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT SIZE FROM EACH OTHER, SO THAT'S WHY MR. HALL CAME UP WITH THE IDEA OF THE SCREENS. AND I SAID THAT THAT'S A GREAT IDEA. WE CAN DEFINITELY DO THAT. AND TO CLARIFY, THE SCREENS ARE ONLY GOING ON THE HOUSE ON THE LEFT, CORRECT? YES, SIR. AND ALL OF THE WINDOWS OR JUST THE ONES THAT ARE FRONT FACING? ALL OF 'EM. ALL OF THEM. THE ONES THAT ARE FRONT FACING WON'T BE NECESSARY BECAUSE WE'RE CHANGING OUT THE WINDOWS ON THE FRONT TO MEET THE SPECS. SURE. BUT JUST YOU, YOU MAY CONSIDER GO AHEAD AND DO IT BECAUSE IT JUST [01:55:01] TO GIVE CONSISTENCY TO THE PROPERTY FOR CONSISTENCY. THAT DOES MAKE SENSE. YES. AND WE CAN DO THAT. AND JUST TO CLARIFY, STAFF IS NOT, STAFF IS RECOMMENDING THAT THE ORIGINAL FENESTRATION TYPES AND DESIGNS LIKE BE RETAINED AT THE DESIGN. SO THE SCREENS WAS FLOATED AS AN EXAMPLE OF SOMETIMES THIS IS APPROVED, LIKE MAYBE YOU SHOULD CONSIDER IT, BUT WE'RE NOT RECOMMENDING THAT. YEAH, I UNDERSTAND. THAT'S THE COMPROMISE THAT WE'VE DONE PREVIOUSLY IN, IN EGREGIOUS CASES. SO I HOPE YOU'RE TRYING TO CRAFT A MOTION. BUT I WILL, I WILL ASK ONE QUESTION. WHEN HE SAYS THE WINDOWS AND THE STAIRS AND, AND WE'VE HAD SOMETIMES YES, GUIDELINES DON'T LOOK AT, YOU KNOW, COMPLIANCE IN THAT WAY. BUT WHEN YOU SAY THEY'RE FIXED OR THEY'RE JUST NOT OPERABLE, BUT THEY STILL HAVE A ONE OF A ONE MR. BEKO? YES. YES. OKAY. I JUST WANNA CLARIFY THAT. WELL, AND THEY'RE GONNA HAVE THE APPEARANCE OF HAVING ONE OVER ONE IF YOU PUT THE SCREENS ON THERE AS WELL. UM, THAT'S WHY I WAS MAYBE SUGGESTING CORRECT, THAT YOU, YOU BE CONSISTENT WITH THE TREATMENT OF THE SCREENS 'CAUSE THAT WILL HELP TO SUBDIVIDE, UH, WHAT IS OTHERWISE KIND OF A CONTEMPORARY LOOKING WINDOW. SO, MR. CHAIRMAN, I WOULD MOVE FOR APPROVAL, UM, OF ITEM ONE WITH THE ADDITION THAT, UH, SCREENS BE UTILIZED AS PRESENTED BY THE, UH, APPLICANT TODAY TO HELP CONCEAL, UM, THE NONCOMPLIANT WINDOWS AND TO BE CONSISTENT, UH, HAVE THE SCREENS ON, ON ALL OF THE WINDOWS. UM, I ALSO MOVE FOR, UM, APPROVAL OF ITEM NUMBER TWO AS PRESENTED BY THE APPLICANT TODAY. AND ITEM NUMBER THREE AS PRESENTED BY THE APPLICANT TODAY. THAT'S WITH THE EXISTING SEVEN INCH, UH, REVEAL, BUT WE'RE USING THE EPOXY PAINT TO CONCEAL THE FAUX GRAIN, UH, WHERE NECESSARY. UM, AND THEN, UH, ITEM FOUR AS, UH, RECOMMENDED BY STAFF. I'LL SECOND. WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND. ANY DISCUSSION? WE HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE. SABINA. AYE. VELASQUEZ AYE. MORALES? AYE. MASUKA. AYE. CARPENTER. AYE. GROUP. AYE. ANTES? YES. AND FED NAY. MOTION PASSES. MOTION PASSES. AGENDA ITEM 19. AGENDA ITEM 19, H D R C, CASE NUMBER 2022 DASH 3 15 10 14 NORTH CHERRY 10 12 NORTH CHERRY. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT SIX TWO STORY RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURES ON THE VACANT LOTS AT 10 12 AND 10 14 NORTH CHERRY LOCATED WITHIN THE DENOTE HILL. HISTORIC DISTRICT RECOMMENDATIONS STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL BASED ON FINDINGS. A THROUGH X STAFF FINDS THAT THE INCONSISTENCIES WITH THE GUIDELINES AS NOTED BELOW, SHOULD BE ADDRESSED PRIOR TO RECEIVING A RECOMMENDATION FOR FINAL APPROVAL. ONE THAT THE APPLICANT DECREASED MASSING ON SITE AS NOTED IN FINDING G. A REDUCTION IN BUILDING FOOTPRINT OR LOWERING OF HEIGHT TO SINGLE STORY FOR SOME STRUCTURES WOULD BE MORE APPROPRIATE AND WOULD FOLLOW THE HISTORIC DEVELOPMENT PATTERN THROUGHOUT THE DISTRICT. TWO, THAT TRADITIONAL MATERIALS BE USED IN PLACE OF THE PROPOSED TERRACOTTA, BRICK AND STUCCO AS NOTED IN FINDING K. AND THAT FACADE MATERIALS BE CONSISTENT ON EACH FACADE WITH THOSE FOUND HISTORICALLY. AND RESIDENTIAL CONSTRUCTION WITHIN THE DISTRICT. SIDING SHOULD BE CONSISTENT WITH STAFF STANDARD SPECIFICATIONS AS NOTED IN FINDING K THREE. THAT UNIQUE ARCHITECTURAL ELEMENTS BE ADDED TO PROTOTYPE C AS NOTED IN FINDING O THAT DIFFERENTIATE, DIFFERENTIATE EACH STRUCTURE SUCH AS CHANGES IN MATERIAL LOCATIONS, FENESTRATION PROFILES, COLORS, AND MASSING. FOUR THAT THE PROPOSED STANDING SEAM METAL ROOF SHOULD FEATURE SMOOTH PANELS THAT ARE 18 TO 21 INCHES WIDE. SEAMS THAT ARE ONE TO TWO INCHES IN HEIGHT, A CRIMPED RIDGE RIDGE SEAM OR A LOW PROFILE RIDGE CAP AND A STANDARD GLOOM FINISH. IF A RIDGE CAP IS PROPOSED, IT MUST BE SUBMITTED FOR REVIEW AND APPROVAL. FIVE. ARCHEOLOGY. THE PROJECT SHALL COMPLY WITH ALL FEDERAL, STATE LOCAL LAWS, RULES AND REGULATIONS REGARDING ARCHEOLOGY AS APPLICABLE. AT THIS TIME, THE APPLICANT HAS NOT SUBMITTED CONSTRUCTION DOCUMENTS FOR PROTOTYPE. FOUR. FULL CONSTRUCTION DOCUMENTS SHOULD BE SUBMITTED TO THE H D R C FOR REVIEW AND APPROVAL PRIOR TO THE ISSUANCE OF A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR THE STRUCTURE SITE. WORK PERMITS OR FOUNDATION PERMITS WILL NOT BE ISSUED UNTIL A C O A HAS BEEN ISSUED BY THE H D R C. A FOUNDATION INSPECTION IS TO BE SCHEDULED WITH O H P STAFF TO ENSURE THAT FOUNDATION SETBACKS AND HEIGHTS ARE CONSISTENT WITH THE [02:00:01] APPROVED DESIGN. THE INSPECTION IS TO, TO OCCUR AFTER THE INSTALLATION OF FORM WORK AND PRIOR TO THE INSTALLATION OF FOUNDATION MATERIALS. A STANDING SEAM METAL ROOF INSPECTION IS TO BE SCHEDULED WITH O H P STAFF TO ENSURE THAT ROOFING MATERIALS ARE CONSISTENT WITH APPROVED DESIGN AND INDUSTRIAL RIDGE CAP IS NOT TO BE USED. AND THE APPLICANTS ARE WITH US IN PERSON. I'M THE ARCHITECT ON THE PROJECT. UM, LET'S SEE. OH, THANK YOU AGAIN FOR LISTENING TO OUR PRESENTATION AND UM, UM, I KNOW MOST OF Y'ALL ARE VERY FAMILIAR WITH THIS PROJECT BY NOW, UM, BUT I'LL DIVE RIGHT IN. UM, WELL ACTUALLY FOR THE RECORD, UM, OUTTA THE FIVE STAFF STIPULATIONS THAT ARE CURRENTLY, UM, ON THE AGENDA, WE, WE ABSOLUTELY AGREE WITH FOUR AND FIVE. UM, STIPULATION THREE. UM, WE ACTUALLY WORKED WITH STAFF ON A MIDDLE GROUND. UM, WE WERE ABLE TO UPDATE THE CONSTRUCTION DOCUMENTS. WE DID NOT HAVE ENOUGH TIME TO UPDATE THE RENDERINGS, BUT WE CAN GET TO THAT AS I DIVE INTO THE PRESENTATION. AND WE, WE DO HAVE ITEMS ONE AND TWO TO DISCUSS. UM, SO REAL QUICK OVERVIEW OF THE LOCATION OF THE PROJECT. UM, Y'ALL ARE FAMILIAR WITH THE SITE. UM, WE'RE KIND OF ON THE BOUNDARY OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. VERY CLOSE TO DEED, DOWNTOWN ZONING. NEXT SLIDE. UH, WE HAVE AN OVERVIEW OF THE PROJECT TIMELINE. YOU KNOW, WE'VE BEEN AT THIS FOR, FOR A BIT NOW. UM, SEVERAL DRCS AND TRYING TO REACH A CONSENSUS OVER THE PROJECT. UM, NEXT SLIDE. UH, A BIRD'S EYE VIEW. WE GOT, UM, THE PARK LOCATIONS AND THE PROXIMITY OF AMENITIES, UM, AND OF COURSE THE INDUSTRIAL, UM, ZONES AND THE, THE FREEWAY. UM, NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. THIS IS OUR SITE. UH, WE'VE SINCE CLEANED IT UP A LITTLE BIT, UM, BUT TWO LARGE VACANT LOTS IN THE MIDDLE OF THE BLOCK FACE. NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. AERIAL. UM, WE GOT TREES AGAIN. WE'VE CLEANED UP SOME OF IT. UM, VERY LARGE PARCEL, UM, IN THE MIDDLE OF THE BLOCK PHASE. NEXT SLIDE. UM, OUR SETBACK EXHIBIT. THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE'VE WORKED ON QUITE A BIT. UM, WE DID RECESS, UM, 10 14 AND, AND 10 12, UH, AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE, UH, TO HELP EASE THE, UH, HEIGHT CONCERNS. NEXT SLIDE, PLEASE. UM, THIS SHOWS OUR SITE AND LANDSCAPE PLAN. WE GOT OUR DOUBLE DRIVEWAY FOR FIRE EGRESS, OUR TWO PARKING SPOTS PER HOME, UM, BACKYARDS. UM, EVERYTHING IS ROOMY. UH, BACK HERE. NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. OUR FENCE EXHIBITS AND THE PROPOSED FENCING. UM, VERY UH, OVERVIEW. UM, NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. UM, THIS SHOWS THE, THE DIMENSIONS ARE, IT'S KIND OF A DIMENSION CONTROL PLAN. THIS WAS REQUESTED, UM, AS PART OF THE STAFF REVIEW. UM, SO WE'VE PROVIDED THIS. UM, NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. OF COURSE, THE, THE RENDERINGS OF, UH, THE STREET VIEW. UM, WE DID ACTUALLY LISTEN TO THE CONCERNS IN THE HOUSE AT 10 12. THE ONE ON THE RIGHT, WE ACTUALLY SHRUNK THE ROOF PLATE DOWN ONE FOOT. UM, WE'RE STILL KEEPING OUR CEILINGS ON THE INSIDE, BUT WE WERE ABLE TO SHRINK EVERYTHING ONE FOOT AND WE'RE HOPING THAT HELPS. UM, NEXT SLIDE. THIS SHOWS THE TWO REAR UNITS, UM, ON THE BACK UNIT. UM, WE DID SWITCH IT TO ALL SIDING VERSUS HAVING THE BRICK AND THE STUCCO MIX. UM, ANOTHER CHANGE THAT WE DID, AGAIN, WE WEREN'T ABLE TO UPDATE THE, UM, RENDERINGS DUE TO TIME CONSTRAINTS. UM, BUT WE DO HAVE THE CDS UPDATED. WE ACTUALLY CHANGED THE, THE GABLE ON THE LAST HOUSE TO A HIP ROOF, WHICH ALSO HELPS DIMINISH THE OVERALL HEIGHT AND MASSING. NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. ANOTHER VIEW OF THAT, IF YOU CAN VISUALIZE THE ONE ON THE LEFT, UH, WITH A HIP ROOF, IT DOES HELP BRING, UM, THE HEIGHT DOWN QUITE A BIT. UM, NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. THESE ARE A PROPOSED MATERIAL PALETTE. UM, THIS WAS REVIEWED DURING, UM, H D R C CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL. UM, IT IS, UM, WE ARE GRABBING FROM THE NEIGHBORHOOD IN THE INDUSTRIAL AREA, DOING A MIX AND TRYING TO CREATE HARMONY BETWEEN THE OLD AND THE NEW. UM, NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. THIS IS OUR STREETSCAPE. AGAIN, YOU KNOW, THE TREES WERE, WERE, WE'RE CONFIDENT THE TREES ARE GONNA HELP TIE THIS THING TOGETHER. WE'RE PRESERVING AS MANY TREES ON SITE AS POSSIBLE. UM, AND AGAIN, THAT HOUSE AT 10 12 SHRINKING A FOOT. UM, YESTERDAY WE WERE ACTUALLY DOOR KNOCKING, GATHERING MORE LETTERS OF SUPPORT FROM THE NEIGHBORS. AND SURPRISINGLY, THE LADY ON THE RIGHT, WHICH HAS THE SMALLEST HOME AND WAS THE CONCERN, THIS WHOLE CONVERSATION, SHE WAS, SHE WAS VERY INDIFFERENT. SHE ACTUALLY JUST SAID, JUST PLEASE CLEAN IT UP AND [02:05:01] KEEP THE HOMELESS PEOPLE OUT. THAT'S ALL SHE WANTED. AND WE SAID WE WILL DO THAT. UM, AND SO THAT'S, THAT'S OUR PROMISE TO HER. UM, NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. HERE YOU GET INTO THE CDS AGAIN, THIS IS 10 12. YOU CAN SEE THE, UM, WE CAN, UM, KEEP GOING. THE FLOOR PLANS AND THE ELEVATIONS. THIS IS WHERE WE REVISE THE HEIGHT. WE STILL HAVE OUR NINE FOOT CEILINGS, BUT, UH, EIGHT FOOT ROOF PLATE HEIGHT. NEXT SLIDE, OUR DETAILS. NEXT SLIDE DETAILS. WE DID SWITCH TO WOOD WINDOWS, SO WE'RE COMPLIANT THERE. WE, WE MEET ALL OF THE STAFF STIPULATIONS THERE. UM, NEXT SLIDE IS 10 14. NEXT SLIDE. THIS, THIS UNIT STAY THE SAME, BUT WE PUSHED IT BACK FURTHER ON THE SETBACK. NEXT SLIDE. DETAILS. NEXT SLIDE. THIS IS THE MIDDLE UNIT. YOU CAN KEEP GOING. NEXT SLIDE. UM, LET'S KEEP GOING ACTUALLY TO 3 0 1. THIS ONE. THE RENDERINGS WERE PRETTY UP TO DATE. UM, BUT THE LAST UNIT, THE 3 0 1, UM, I THINK IT'S ONE MORE, UH, OR FOUR MORE SLIDES. YEAH, THERE YOU GO. THIS GUY, THIS IS THE ONE WE'VE TURNED INTO A HIP ROOF. AND AGAIN, WE, WE DO THINK THAT THAT'S GONNA HELP BRING THAT MASSING DOWN. AND I KNOW WE'RE NOT PURSUING THE FINAL APPROVAL FOR THE CUSTOM HOME YET, BUT I THINK WE HAVE ENOUGH SPACE THERE TO REALLY EXPLORE ONE AND A HALF STORY THERE. UM, AS WE MOVE FORWARD WITH THAT PROJECT, UM, I THINK WE CAN GO THROUGH TO THE LETTERS OF SUPPORT. I THINK WE HAVE A DIAGRAM THAT SHOWS, UM, OUR ADDITIONAL SUPPORT. UM, LET'S SEE RIGHT THERE. ONE ABOVE. SO THIS IS KIND OF OUR BLOCK WALKING EFFORTS. WE DID FOCUS ON THE 200 FEET BECAUSE OF THE UPCOMING REZONING. UM, BUT THIS IS WHERE WE'RE AT RIGHT NOW. WE'RE 12 IN FAVOR, EIGHT AGAINST, UM, AND WE ACTUALLY WERE, WE WERE AT NINE, WE WERE ACTUALLY ABLE TO TALK TO THE PERSON ACROSS THE STREET, AND SHE ACTUALLY CAME AROUND AND SAID, HEY, I, I, I REALLY LIKE WHAT YOU'RE DOING. UM, SO SHE SIGNED IN FAVOR. UM, WE ACTUALLY HAVE ABOUT SIX MORE THAT WE'RE EXPECTING TO COME IN, IN FAVOR. WE JUST HAVE TO FOLLOW UP. WE HAVE, WE HAVE SOME, SOME OF THESE FOLLOW-UPS SCHEDULED FOR LATER THIS WEEK. UM, WE HAVE OUR UPCOMING REZONING ON AUGUST 4TH. UM, SO WE, WE STILL GOT SOME WORK TO DO. UM, AND THE REST OF THE SLIDES ARE THE LETTERS OF SUPPORT, UM, FROM SMALL BUSINESSES IN THE AREA AND THE 200 FEET AND THE REST OF OUR, OUR PROPERTY OWNERS AND RESIDENTS, UH, IN THE AREA, ALONG WITH THE SUPPORT WE HAD PREVIOUSLY, WHICH WAS THE 14, UM, INCLUDING THE NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION. UM, I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS THE COMMISSION MAY HAVE. THANK YOU. I BELIEVE WE HAVE A COUPLE OF VOICEMAILS, AND I WOULD LIKE TO, UH, STATE FOR THE RECORD THAT COMMISSIONER GRU HAS RECUSED HERSELF. HELLO, MY NAME IS VALERIE CORTEZ, AND I RESIDE AT 5 0 8 LAMAR STREET WITH DITY HILL. I'M CALLING ON BEHALF OF THE CONCERNED CITIZENS OF DITY HILL WITH REGARD TO CASE NUMBER THREE 15, LOCATED AT 10 12 10 14 NORTH CHERRY STREET. WE, AGAIN AGREE 100% WITH O H P'S FINDINGS AT SCALE. MASSING MATERIALS FOR THIS PROJECT HAVE NOT CHANGED OR IMPROVED IN THE LAST H D R C HEARING AND AGREE THAT THEY SHOULD NOT BE APPROVED AT THIS HEARING EITHER. ALL THE SAME THINGS ARE BEING PRESENTED FOR THE PROPOSED SIX UNIT DWELLINGS. ADDITIONALLY, THEY DID NOT RECEIVE APPROVAL AT THE JUNE 21ST ZONING HEARING TO REZONE THE LOTS TO BUILD THREE STRUCTURES ON EACH LOT. THERE WAS OVERWHELMING OPPOSITION FROM BOTH WITHIN AND IMMEDIATELY OUTSIDE THE 200 FOOT RADIUS FOR THIS PROJECT, ZONING CURRENTLY ALLOWS THEM TO BUILD TWO STRUCTURES ON EACH LOT. THE REQUEST IS THAT THEY BUILD THE TWO STRUCTURES WITH THE DESIGN THAT COMPLIMENTS OUR DISTRICT AND MATERIALS THAT FOLLOW THE HISTORIC GUIDELINES. THE DEVELOPER WILL HAVE YOU THINK THAT THIS DEVELOPMENT AND DESIGN ARE BLENDING IN WITH THE CHARACTER OF THE DISTRICT, BUT THESE MASSIVE STRUCTURES WITH ALL THE WRONG MATERIALS WILL OVERPOWER THE SMALL BUNGALOW, SINGLE FAMILY HOMES THAT MAKE UP THIS BLOCK AND THE BLOCKS THAT SURROUND IT. NO ONE IS OPPOSED TO DEVELOPMENT ON THESE TWO LOTS, BUT PEOPLE ARE OPPOSED TO THE CURRENT NUMBER OF UNITS SIZE, HEIGHT, AND MATERIALS BEING REQUESTED. THEIR PREVIOUS PRESENTATIONS INCLUDED THE 1904 SANDBORN MAP WHERE THEY WERE SUGGESTING THAT THESE TWO LOTS HAD A HISTORY OF HIGH DENSITY. WHAT IT REVEALED WAS THAT EACH LOT HAD ONLY TWO STRUCTURES ON IT. THE LARGER LOT SHOWS A COUPLE OF GREENHOUSES PLUS A STABLE OR A SHED. THEY'VE BEEN REPEATEDLY TOLD BY O BOTH O H P STAFF AND H D R C COMMISSIONERS WHAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO SEE AS FAR AS RECOMMENDED CHANGES TO INCLUDE PROVIDING MISSING DOCUMENTS, MISSING DESIGN DOCUMENTS. YET HERE WE ARE AGAIN AT ANOTHER H D R HEARING WITH NONE OF THOSE VERY SPECIFIC ISSUES RECTIFIED. THANK YOU. GOOD EVENING. MY NAME IS KATHY VIC, 1 0 7 KING WILLIAMS [02:10:01] STREET, SAN ANTONIO, TEXAS. THIS IS IN REGARDS TO ITEM NUMBER 19. THE CONSERVATION SOCIETY OF SAN ANTONIO JOINS WITH THE OFFICE OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION STAFF AND THE ZONING COMMISSION IN RECOMMENDING THAT THIS PROJECT NOT RECEIVE FINAL APPROVAL. THE BUILDING'S, MASSING MATERIALS AND CREATION OF AN INTERIOR STREET DO NOT CONFORM TO THE HISTORIC DESIGN GUIDELINES OR WITH HISTORIC DEVELOPMENT PATTERNS FOUND IN THE DIG WHITTY HILL HISTORIC DISTRICT. THANK YOU FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION. AND THAT CONCLUDES PUBLIC COMMENT. THANK YOU. UH, ANY COMMENTS ON THOSE? UM, I'LL, I'LL TOUCH BRIEFLY. I BELIEVE THE, THE, THE SPOKESPERSON FOR THE CONCERNED NEIGHBORS. UM, I BELIEVE THAT WAS MS. VALERIE. UM, WE DID SPEAK WITH HER, UM, ABOUT SOME OF THE CONCERNS THAT WERE MENTIONED. AND, YOU KNOW, THE CHALLENGE WE'RE POSED WITH HERE WITH THIS URBAN INFILL IS, YOU KNOW, THE, THE PROPERTY COSTS WHAT IT COSTS, RIGHT? AND IT'S, WE HAVE THE HOUSING CRISIS, AND IT'S OKAY. ZONING ALLOWS US TO DO FOUR HOUSES. AND THEN FROM A PURELY ECONOMIC STANDPOINT, IT'S LIKE, WELL, WE CAN DO FOUR LARGE HOMES, BUT BY SQUARE FOOTAGE ALONE, THOSE FOUR BIGGER HOMES ARE GONNA BE MORE EXPENSIVE THAN IF WE'RE ABLE TO DO SIX SMALLER HOMES. AND IT'S JUST A MATHEMATICAL EQUATION. SO IF WE'RE ABLE TO DO SIX HOMES, OR ORIGINALLY WE WERE PROPOSING EIGHT, SO WE FEEL WE'VE COMPROMISED. UM, IF WE'RE ABLE TO DO SIX HOMES, SIX SMALLER HOMES ARE, IT'S STILL A MARKET RATE ENDEAVOR, BUT THEY'RE MORE ATTAINABLE TO MORE PEOPLE THAN FOUR LARGER HOMES THAT ARE QUASI MANSIONS, RIGHT? AT, ESPECIALLY AT THE PRICE POINTS, DINU STARTING TO REACH. UM, SO IT'S A, THE INFILL DEVELOPMENT, IT'S, IT'S A TOUGH CHALLENGE WE'RE NAVIGATING AS A COMMUNITY, UM, BUT WE, WE THINK WE'RE, WE'RE TRYING TO DO THE RIGHT THING. UM, AND AS FAR AS TAXES GOING UP, THINGS LIKE THAT, YOU KNOW, I, I CAN'T, I FULLY DON'T UNDERSTAND HOW THAT WORKS, BUT I KNOW THAT IT, THEY'RE, IT SEEMS LIKE THEY'RE GOING UP WITH OR WITHOUT THE DEVELOPMENT. THAT'S PART OF THE CHALLENGE. SO, UM, BUT I MEAN, WE HAD ALREADY REVIEWED MATERIALS. I KNOW THE DESIGN IS COMPLIANT WITH THE GUIDELINES IN TERMS OF HEIGHT. WE'RE DOING THE BEST WE CAN TO MINIMIZE THE MASSING, MINIMIZE THE SCALE. UM, WE'RE HOPEFUL THAT THE CHANGES WE'VE MADE, UH, WITH MULTIPLE DRCS ARE SUFFICIENT AND YOU FIND ADEQUATE TO, UH, PROVE THIS. UM, AND I THINK ONE OF THE COM, ONE OF THE CONCEPTS THAT CAME OUT OF THE LAST D R C WAS THAT THE, THE THIRD HOUSE BEING CHANGING AND MASSING AND MATERIALS CAN KIND OF START BECOMING THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE TO THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE. RIGHT? THAT WAS KIND OF A CONCEPT THAT THAT WAS DISCUSSED. BUT, UM, I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY OTHER QUESTIONS YOU MAY HAVE. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. UH, COMMISSIONER'S, QUESTIONS? COMMENTS? UM, MR. CHAIR, I, I'D LIKE TO SEE THE ELEVATION THAT WAS, UH, PRESENTED WAS THE TWO D, UH, 200 PAGE, 200, I THINK TWO OH, OF THE CDS OH EIGHT 200. UM, SO IT'S OUR EIGHT 200 ELEVATION SHEET. UM, FOR WHICH UNIT? COMMISSIONER VELASQUEZ? WELL, IT, IT WAS THE, UM, IT HAD, IT, IT, IT DIDN'T HAVE A LOT OF TEXTURE ON FRED WAS, UM, YOU GOT ME ON THAT. MAYBE THE 3 0 1. WAS IT THE ONE THAT THEY'VE ADDED THE ONE THE HIP ROOF? I THINK IT WAS ONE FROM THE STREETSCAPE. OH, SO ONE OF THE FRONT ONES. UM, SO IT'S EITHER PROBABLY THIS ONE, AND THEY, I THINK THEY, THEY'RE ALL, THEY'RE ALL WITHIN, WITHIN THE SAME, UH, I, I THINK THE SAME COMMENT THAT, THAT, YOU COULD EVEN LEAVE IT RIGHT THERE. UM, YOU KNOW, WITH ALL OF THE CONVERSATIONS THAT WE'VE HAD AND THE VISITING BACK AND FORTH, I, I WANNA JUST COMMENT TO THE DESIGNER THAT I'M REALLY KIND OF BLOWN AWAY BY THE MAINTENANCE OF THE PROPORTIONS THAT, UH, WITH THE, WITH THE, WITH THE INS AND OUTS THAT YOU'VE DONE, UH, THESE PROPORTIONS SEEM TO HAVE, I CAN SEE THEM, UH, KIND OF SQUATTING A BIT, BUT, BUT JUST IN THE WAY THAT YOU HANDLED THE PITCHES AND ALL THAT, IT JUST, THEY JUST SEEM TO GET LIKE A LITTLE PIECE OF CANDY. I MEAN, THEY'RE REALLY, REALLY NICELY DONE. UM, I, I DON'T KNOW THAT THERE'S, YOU KNOW, WHAT DO THEY SAY? YOU CAN'T SQUEEZE BLOOD OUT OF A TURNIP, RIGHT? I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW IF THERE'S ANYTHING ELSE TO SQUEEZE OUT OF THESE THINGS, BUT I'VE GOTTA TELL YOU THAT I DO FIND, UH, YOUR, YOUR, YOUR, YOU KNOW, PLAYFULNESS AND WILLINGNESS TO TAKE THE COMMENTS. I THINK YOU TOOK COMMENTS FAR BEYOND WHAT I WOULD'VE TAKEN, BUT IT WITHIN THAT, WITHIN ALL OF THAT, YOUR, YOUR, YOUR ABILITY TO, TO STAY PROACTIVE AND STAY DESIGNING. [02:15:01] I WANT TO COMMEND YOU ON THAT AND JUST TELL YOU THAT, UH, UH, I, I THINK THAT THE, THE DESIGNS, UH, ONCE BUILT THAT, THAT THEY, THEY'LL QUICKLY BECOME VISUAL ASSETS AS WELL AS I DO APPRECIATE THAT, YOU KNOW, YOUR, YOUR KINDA SENSITIVITY TO WHAT THE REALITY ON THE GROUND IS WITH, WITH, UM, AFFORDABILITY AND ALL THAT IN, IN HOUSING IS, IS REALLY GETTING A CHALLENGE. IT'S GONNA BECOME A GREATER CHALLENGE IN THE INNER CITY. SO I THINK THAT, UM, I, I PERSONALLY FEEL MR. CHAIR, THAT THIS, THIS PROJECT'S READY TO ROLL. UM, THOSE ARE MY COMMENTS, MR. CHAIR. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER VELAZQUEZ, OTHER COMMISSIONERS, COMMISSIONER SAVINO. YES. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. UH, JUST A COUPLE OF QUICK QUESTIONS. UM, OF, AND I KNOW WE DON'T HAVE PURVIEW OVER THE OCCUPANCY, THE ZONING, UM, ANY OF THOSE OTHER USES, BUT, OR AFFORDABILITY EVEN. UM, BUT YOU'VE BROUGHT THOSE ITEMS UP OF THE SUPPORT YOU RECEIVED WITHIN THAT 200 FOOT AREA IN PREP FOR A ZONING. UM, WHAT WAS THE OWNER OCCUPANCY RENTAL RATE OF THOSE THAT SIGNED? I MEAN, I COULDN'T ATTEST TO, WE'D PROBABLY HAVE TO DO AN, AN EQUATION, RIGHT? BUT I, I, THERE WAS A GOOD MIX. THERE WAS SEVERAL RENTERS. UM, SOME PEOPLE WERE RENTERS AND THEY DID NOT WANT TO SIGN BECAUSE THEY, THEY EXPRESSED THAT THEY WEREN'T THE PROPERTY OWNER. UM, WE EVEN, WE STILL EXPRESSED THAT THE CITY TASKED US WITH REACHING OUT TO RESIDENTS, NOT, I, AT LEAST IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT IT DOESN'T AFFECT OWNERSHIP STATUS. RIGHT. UM, BUT THERE WAS A FEW THAT, THAT STILL, THAT DID, YOU KNOW, LISTEN TO US AND PROCEEDED AND SIGN, AND THERE WAS SOME THAT SAID, NO, YOU KNOW, I NEED TO ASK THE LAND, THE LANDLORD. UM, BUT AS FAR AS A MIX, I'D SAY MAYBE 30 TO 40% WERE RENTERS. YEAH. UM, IF I HAD TO GUESS, YEAH, IT'S ALWAYS GOOD TO KNOW, UM, WHAT THAT IS. AND IT'S GOOD EVEN WITH RENTERS, BECAUSE WE DO HAVE A LOT OF LONG-TERM RENTERS IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD MM-HMM. , BUT YEAH, FOR CITY PURPOSES, IT USUALLY IS THE PROPERTY OWNERS SINCE THEY'RE LONG-TERM HOLDER. UM, AND, UM, THE OTHER QUESTION I HAD, BECAUSE YOU DID MENTION ZONING, YOU SAID YOU HAD ZONING FOR FOUR HOUSES ALREADY FOR THOSE TWO LOTS. THAT IS MY UNDERSTANDING IS WE HAVE, UM, RM FIVE, I BELIEVE, AND THAT ALLOWS FOR TWO, UH, DWELLINGS PER LOT. SO WE'RE, WE'RE, OUR REQUEST IS TO INCREASE THE DENSITY BY ONE HOUSE PER LOT. PER LOT. OKAY. UM, BECAUSE IT, IT KIND OF, UH, GOES TOWARDS THAT CONVERSATION WE'VE HAD, UM, SINCE WHAT JANUARY, UM, ON HOW TO MIX UP THE MASSING MM-HMM. , BECAUSE OF THE MASSING BEING SO PROMINENT AND SO DIFFERENT THAT DOING FEWER HOUSES, ONE COULD DO MORE WITH SINGLE STORY OR STORY AND A HALF AND HAVE MORE FLEXIBILITY. SO I GUESS I WAS JUST, UH, THINKING ABOUT THAT. BUT AGAIN, WE DON'T HAVE PURVIEW OVER THAT. AND JUST AS A SIDE NOTE, AFTER A RECENT, UH, UM, SURVEY, UM, OUR HISTORIC DISTRICT, IGN HILL HISTORIC DISTRICT HAS, UM, WE DO HAVE A HOUSING PROBLEM IN THE CITY. WE HAVE A HOUSING CRISIS IN ALL OF OUR OLD NEIGHBORHOODS, BUT OUR DISTRICT HAS OVER 230 EMPTY HOMES CURRENTLY FOR A NUMBER OF REASONS, RANGING FROM DEMO BY NEGLECT, ALL THE WAY TO SHORT TERM RENTALS THAT GET RENTED OUT ONE WEEKEND OF A MONTH. OKAY. BUT BASICALLY, THESE ARE NOT AVAILABLE FOR PEOPLE TO LIVE. SO THAT'S WHEN I HEAR HI HOUSING CRISIS. IT JUST REMINDS ME OF HOW COMPLEX THAT IS. RIGHT. YEAH. THANK YOU. THANK YOU FOR YOUR COMMENTS. THE NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION LETTER COMMISSIONER CARPENTER. YEAH, I JUST, UM, YOU KNOW, IN, IN SPEAKING TO SOME OF THE COMMENTS, I THINK FROM STAFF, I, I THINK I'VE BEEN AN ADVOCATE ALL ALONG ON THE USE OF MAYBE A LITTLE BIT MORE INVENTIVE, UH, MATERIAL PALETTE HERE THAT, THAT'S APPROPRIATE BECAUSE OF THE, YOU'RE ON THE FRINGE OF THE, OF THE, UH, HISTORIC DISTRICT AND, AND IN CLOSE PROXIMITY TO THE, UH, SOME OF THE INDUSTRIAL BUILDINGS. SO I THINK IT'S AN APPROPRIATE RESPONSE TO THE, THE CONTEXT, THOUGH YOU STILL HAVE SOME, UH, VERY MODEST, UH, RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURES THAT ARE, UH, NEIGHBORING YOUR PROPERTY. SO I THINK IT'S JUST IMPORTANT TO BE REALLY SENSITIVE TO THAT. UM, I THINK IN GENERAL, THE, YOU KNOW, THE SMALL MOVES SOMETIMES CAN REALLY, UH, MAKE A BIG DIFFERENCE. YOU KNOW, THINGS LIKE PULLING DOWN THE PLATE HEIGHTS, THE SECOND LEVEL THAT GOES TOWARDS THE PROPORTIONS THAT, UH, COMMISSIONER, UH, VELASQUEZ MENTIONED THAT BEGIN TO FEEL BETTER, UH, WHEN YOU HAVE KIND OF A, UH, ONE, YOU KNOW, ONE THIRD, TWO THIRDS PROPORTIONING, UH, THAT THAT ARRIVES IN THE, IN THE ELEVATIONS AND THAT SORT OF THING. SO I, I THINK IT HAS BEEN MUCH IMPROVED [02:20:01] THROUGH, UH, THE PROCESS. I'M SORRY THAT PROCESS HAS BEEN SO LONG. I THINK SOMETIMES IT'S JUST, UH, IT TAKES A LONG TIME TO, TO, TO GET THE CAKE TO BAKE HERE. UM, YOU KNOW, GOING BACK TO THE MATERIALS, THERE'S ONE THING I'VE MENTIONED KIND OF CONSISTENTLY I THINK IS, UH, I DON'T MIND A, A, A DEVIATION OR AN TIVE USE OF KINDA MORE QUASI INDUSTRIAL MATERIALS, BUT I STILL WANT THOSE TO BE DONE IN AN AUTHENTIC WAY. AND I THINK THERE'S STILL SOME AREAS WHERE, UH, LIKE THE, UH, THE STRUCTURAL CLAY TILE OR, OR, OR, UH, THE, THE BRICK IS BEING KIND OF USED ALMOST, UH, LIKE WALLPAPER RATHER THAN KIND OF USED MORE TO EXPRESS, UH, A VOLUMETRIC OR A PLANNING, UH, REPRESENTATION. YOU KNOW, THAT'S THE, THAT'S THE, UH, THE ORIGINS OF, OF THE MODERN MOVEMENT IS THE PLAN IS THE GENERATOR. AND I JUST WISH THERE WOULD'VE BEEN A LITTLE BIT MORE CONSIDERATION ABOUT PLAN AND MATERIAL USAGE TO EXPRESS THAT HONESTY OF THE INTERIOR ARRANGEMENT. UH, BUT SOME OF THAT'S NI NITPICKING ON MY PART. I THINK, UM, IN GENERAL, YOU KNOW, THE, THE, UH, THE SCHEME HAS DEVELOPED AND HAS BEEN IMPROVED OVER, OVER THIS PROCESS. THANK YOU, CHAIRMAN. OKAY. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. UM, I WOULD ECHO, UH, COMMISSIONER CARPENTER'S COMMENTS AND, UM, WANNA THANK Y'ALL FOR WORKING WITH THE COMMISSION AND THE NEIGHBORHOOD TO, UM, ONE, REDUCING THE NUMBER OF UNITS, UH, TWO, REDUCING THE SCALE, UH, AND BRINGING IT DOWN, UH, TO BE MORE APPROPRIATE WITH THE, THE BLOCK. UM, I THINK THE USE OF MATERIALS IS, IS, UM, INVENTIVE AND, AND I'M IN FAVOR OF IT. UM, SO I WOULD, I APPRECIATE Y'ALL LOOKING AT THAT ROOF ON THAT, UH, LAST UNIT AND, AND, UH, PROPOSING A HIP ROOF AGAIN TO REDUCE THE SCALE AS YOU MOVE FURTHER BACK INTO THE SITE. AND I WOULD SUPPORT THAT AS WELL. UM, OTHER QUESTIONS? AND , DO WE HAVE A MOTION? OH, I JUST HAVE TO AGREE WITH YOUR COMMENTS, COMMISSIONER. UM, BUT I DON'T THINK IT'S NITPICKY. I THINK IT'S SOME OF THE ISSUES WITH MODERN ARCHITECTURE WHERE THE, UH, PLAN LOOKS LIKE IT'S A GREAT DESIGN ON PAPER, BUT IN ACTUALITY WHEN YOU'RE THERE, IT'S NOT. AND I AGREE THAT THE MATERIALS SHOULD BE USED TO DEFINE VOLUMES AS OPPOSED TO JUST A PAINTING ON THE FACADE. SO, THANK YOU. DOES SOMEONE WISH TO ATTEMPT A MOTION? MR. CHAIR? I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE AS PRESENTED. LET, LET ME GET A, LET ME GET A CLARIFICATION FROM THE, FROM THE PRESENTER, UH, WITH, WITH RESPECT TO THE, THE, THE FIRST COMMENT THAT YOU MADE, UH, ON REFERRING TO STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS. CAN YOU CLARIFY, UM, UH, WHAT WITHIN STAFF'S COLLAPSE, UH, STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS THAT YOUR IN LINE WITH? UM, WE ARE IN FULL AGREEMENT WITH STIPULATION FOUR AND FIVE. OKAY. IT IS IMPORTANT BECAUSE I, YOU GOTTA WRITE ALL THAT STUFF DOWN, AS YOU SAID, BECAUSE IT'S JUST SO HARD TO, SO IT, IT WOULD BE A MOTION, MR. CHAIR, TO, UM, APPROVE AS SUBMITTED BY THE APPLICANT WITH STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS FOUR AND FIVE. THANK YOU. WE HAVE A MOTION. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND WE HAVE A MOTION. AND SECOND. ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? YES, MR. CHAIR? YES, MA'AM. I WOULD LIKE TO ADD SOME ADDITIONAL COMMENTS. UM, I, UM, PROVIDED MY SUPPORT DURING THE CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL PROCESS, AND I DID SO WITH, UM, VERY GOOD FAITH AND ENCOURAGEMENT THAT SOME OF THE LARGER, UM, CONCEPTUAL LEVEL ISSUES, DEVELOPMENT PATTERN MASSING WOULD BE ABLE TO, UM, BE ADDRESSED IN A, IN A RELATIVELY SIGNIFICANT WAY, BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT WE'VE BEEN STRUGGLING OVER FOR SO LONG. SO THOSE ARE SIGNIFICANT, AND I, I DON'T FEEL LIKE WE ARE THERE TO BE EVEN GENERALLY IN CONFORMANCE WITH THE GUIDELINES. OKAY. UM, I, GOING FROM, I'LL TRY TO GO QUICKLY HERE. DEVELOPMENT PATTERN, I UNDERSTAND WE HAVE CURB CUTS THAT ARE DOUBLE ON THAT STREET, BUT THERE'S A VERY CLEAR DEFINITION BETWEEN ONE LOT AND THE OTHER, AND I UNDERSTAND IT IS A CODE ISSUE REGARDING FIRE ROAD, RIGHT? AND ACCESS. WELL, THAT JUST [02:25:01] GOES TO HAVING MAYBE A, A HOUSE TOO FAR BACK OR TOO MANY HOUSES. BUT THAT DEVELOPMENT PATTERN IS SO SKEWED WITH THE PRIVATE ROAD IN THE MIDDLE. THAT'S WHAT SKEWS IT. AND THE WHOLE, ONE OF THE MAIN IDEAS ABOUT DIGNITY HILL, BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE A LOT OF SPECIMENS, IS IT'S ABOUT THE COLLECTION. AND IT'S WITHIN THE, IT'S ABOUT THE FRAMEWORK IN WHICH THIS COLLECTION SITS. AND SO THERE IS GOOD FLEXIBILITY. WE SEE IT ALL THE TIME, AND WE ARE OPEN TO THAT. BUT HAVING THAT MAIN STREET GOING THROUGH THE FRONT IN THE MIDDLE IS, IS A, IS A DEVIATION. UM, THE MASSING, YOU'VE COME A LONG WAY, BUT THERE'S STILL SOME AREAS THAT NEED, SOME ARE VERY CLEAR ABOUT SAYING WHEN YOU DO HAVE TWO STORIES OR ONE WHOLE STORY ABOVE YOUR NEIGHBORING HOUSES, THAT YOU REALLY SHOULD HAVE A TRANSITION THAT DOESN'T EXCEED 50% OF THAT OTHER HEIGHT. AND AS WE'VE TALKED ABOUT, OR AS I'VE TALKED ABOUT MASSING AND SUGGESTED ONE AND A HALF STORIES AND OTHER DEVICES, I'VE JUST SORT OF BEEN WAITING TO SEE HOW THAT CREATIVE SOLUTION COULD COME ABOUT. AND I JUST, IT, ESPECIALLY WITH THOSE HOUSES IMMEDIATELY TO THE EAST OR NORTH AND SOUTH, THEY ARE RIGHT UP IN THE PROPERTY LINE. IT'S NOT SUCH A BIG DEAL WHEN YOU HAVE DRIVE HOUSE, DRIVE HOUSE, WHEN YOU HAVE THAT RHYTHM IN THE DEVELOPMENT PATTERN. UM, SO IT'S THAT TRANSITION FROM THE VERY MODEST TO THAT TWO STORY. I ALSO THINK THE GUIDELINE WAS WRITTEN AT A TIME WHEN WE DIDN'T ANTICIPATE TWO STORY HOUSES, NUMBERING SIX ON A LOT. SO I THINK THAT'S, YOU KNOW, THE SPIRIT, THE SPIRIT OF THE GUIDELINE IS THAT IT IS A MODEST TWO STORY WITH AN ACCESSORY DWELLING BEHIND. I THINK THAT'S WHAT EVERYBODY'S EXPECTATION WAS AT THE TIME THAT IT WAS WRITTEN. NOW WE SEE THE MARKET IS DIFFERENT. AND THEN AGAIN, WITH THE MATERIALS, I'LL HAVE TO AGREE THE MATERIALS ARE JUST, UM, REALLY CHALLENGING. THE, THE, UM, NOT THINKING ABOUT IT IN THE ROUND IN THE VOLUMETRICALLY DOES POSE A PROBLEM. AND I JUST WOULD NOT, I JUST WOULDN'T SUPPORT MATERIALS TAKEN FROM INDUSTRIAL AND COMMERCIAL PROPERTIES. GUIDELINES ARE VERY CLEAR ABOUT RESIDENTIAL AND HISTORIC PROPERTIES, BUT OTHERWISE, I APPRECIATE ALL THE WORK, UM, THAT Y'ALL HAVE DONE. THANK YOU FOR YOUR COMMENTS, COMMISSIONER. UM, I KNOW THERE'S A MOTION AND A SECOND. CAN I TOUCH BASE ON THAT OR LEAVE IT ALONE? UH, , I'D MOVE FORWARD. ALRIGHT, SOUNDS GOOD. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. UM, MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE? SINA NAY VELASQUEZ AYE. MORALES AYE. MASUKA AYE. CARPENTER AYE. GROUP IS RECUSED CERVANTES? YES. AND ZER AYE. MOTION PASSES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR TIME COMMISSIONERS. AGENDA ITEM 20, AGENDA ITEM 20 H D R C, CASE NUMBER 20 C, CASE NUMBER 2022 DASH 3 74 4 0 9 EQUIPMENT. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO ONE, REMOVE EXISTING NON-ORIGINAL WINDOW OPENINGS FROM THE EAST FACADE. TWO, INSTALL A SLIDING GLASS DOOR IN PLACE OF DAMAGED FRENCH STYLE DOORS ON THE WEST FACADE. THREE, CONSTRUCT A REAR ADDITION RECOMMENDATIONS. STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF ITEM NUMBER ONE. FENESTRATION MODIFICATIONS TO THE EAST FACADE. STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT THE APPLICANT INSTALL WINDOWS ON THE EAST FACADE TOWARD THE FRONT OF THE HISTORIC STRUCTURE. WINDOWS SHOULD COMPLY WITH STAFF STANDARD FOR WINDOWS AND NEW CONSTRUCTION. TWO, STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF ITEM NUMBER THREE, THE INSTALLATION OF SLIDING GLASS DOORS AS SUBMITTED. THREE STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF ITEM NUMBER THREE. THE CONSTRUCTION OF A REAR ADDITION STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT THE ADDITIONS ROOF FORM, MATERIALS AND FENESTRATION PROFILE BE MODIFIED TO BE CONSISTENT WITH THE GUIDELINES. COMPOSITE SIDING WITH THE FOUR INCH EXPOSURE AND NO FAUX WOOD GRAIN MAY BE USED IF WOOD SIDING THAT MATCHES THAT. IF THE HISTORIC STRUCTURE IS NOT USED, A GABLE OR HIP ROOF SHOULD BE INSTALLED AND WINDOWS SHOULD COMPLY WITH STAFF STANDARD FOR WINDOWS. AND NEW CONSTRUCTION STAFF FINDS THAT AN EXTENSION OF THE SHED ROOF ON THE WEST FACADE MAY LIMIT THE IMPACT AND VISIBILITY OF THE REAR STRUCTURE'S ROOF. AND THE APPLICANT, ALEX CRUZ IS WITH US VIRTUALLY. MR. CRUZ, ARE YOU WITH US? SORRY ABOUT THAT. I WAS MUTED. AM [02:30:01] I, CAN EVERYONE HEAR ME NOW? YES. YES, SIR. AH, THERE WE GO. SORRY ABOUT THAT. UM, UH, YEAH, SO JUST GIVE, UH, SOME, SOME HISTORY HERE. SO WE'VE HAD A, A SITE WALK WITH THE, WITH THE, UM, WITH THE STAFF AND DESIGN REVIEW COMMISSION. UH, WHAT BASICALLY HAPPENED IS I HIRED SOMEONE WHO SAID THEY KNEW WHAT THEY WERE DOING OR HOW TO DO THIS SORT OF THING, AND, UH, CLEARLY THEY DID NOT. AND, UM, SO THEY BUILT SOMETHING THAT'S NOT SUPPOSED TO BE THERE. UM, AND SO THAT'S A CHALLENGE FOR US, UH, TO NOW FIX. AND, UM, IT'S TAKEN QUITE SOME TIME HERE TO EVEN, WE JUST GOT THE POWER ON, UH, THIS LAST WEEK BECAUSE THEY ALSO, AS ONE WENT EXPECT WHEN THEY DON'T DO THE HISTORIC PART, RIGHT. THEY ALSO DID NOT DO THE INTERNAL STUFF EXACTLY RIGHT TO CODE. SO, UM, BUT I, I WANT IT DONE CORRECTLY. AND, UH, SO WHEN WE DID THE SIDEWALK WALK, IT SEEMED LIKE THERE WAS TWO PRIMARY THINGS THAT WE NEEDED TO FIGURE OUT. ONE WAS THE MOST OBVIOUS, WHICH IS THAT HE REMOVED THE WINDOWS IN THE FRONT AREA, WHICH, UM, WAS, UH, OBVIOUSLY A MISTAKE THAT DOESN'T EVEN LOOK GOOD. AND SO WE'RE, UH, WE, WE PURCHASED THE NEW WINDOWS. WE HAVE THAT APPROVED THROUGH, UM, UH, THE STAT THROUGH, THROUGH EDWARD ON, UH, ON WHAT TYPE OF WINDOWS THEY ARE ARE. AND SO WE HAVE THOSE COMING IN, WE'RE REINSTALLING 'EM, UM, ON THE EAST FACADE. UH, IT, UH, WHEN WE DID THIS, THE WALKTHROUGH, IT SOUNDED LIKE THIS WAS APPROVED WHEN THEY FIRST DID THE RE THE REMODEL. UM, WHICH NONE OF THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE ACTUALLY CHANGED REALLY THROUGH THIS, EXCEPT FOR THAT EAST FACADE AND THOSE TWO WINDOWS IN FRONT. UM, UH, UH, WHEN THEY DID SORT OF THE REHAB WORK THAT THEY DID. UM, AND IT SOUNDED LIKE THOSE WINDOWS WEREN'T SUPPOSED TO REALLY BE THERE ON THE EAST SIDE ANYWAYS, SO THEY WERE UNCERTAIN, I GUESS IF MAYBE WE SHOULD, UM, NEED TO ADD THOSE BACK. I'M OPEN TO ADDING 'EM BACK IF THAT'S WHAT, UH, PUTS US, UH, TO WHERE, WHERE IT'S CONSISTENT AND IT LOOKS THE RIGHT WAY FOR THE, FOR THE AREA. UH, AND WE, UH, AGAIN, WE, WE WE'RE GETTING THE RIGHT WINDOWS AND PUTTING THAT STUFF IN THERE. NOW ON THE, THAT EXTENSION, UH, THAT'S WHERE THE REAL BIG PROBLEM IS BECAUSE THAT'S LIKE BASICALLY A WALL THAT STICKS OUT. UM, AND I RECOGNIZE THAT IS SOMETHING THAT WE NEED TO MAKE. LOOK, BASICALLY WHEN WE WERE DOING THE WALKTHROUGH, IT SOUNDED LIKE THE, WE HAD THE, THE WAY THAT IT WOULD NEED TO BE DONE. UH, IF WE WENT BACK IN TIME AND, AND DID IT RIGHT, THAT WOULDN'T EXIST. UM, AND SO YOU'D HAVE TO SHAVE OFF A PART OF THE BUILDING, WHICH, UM, I DON'T REALLY HAVE THE MONEY FOR. UM, BUT, UH, WHAT I'M LOOKING FOR, UH, APPROVAL ON IS RIGHT NOW EVEN CONCEPT. AND WE CAN GET SOME ARCHITECTS OR SOME DRAWINGS OR SOMETHING THAT, THAT REALLY ILLUSTRATE HOW THIS MIGHT WORK. UH, IF WE EXTENDED THAT ROOFTOP TO THE LEFT, LIKE THE, THE PART THAT STICKS OUT THERE WAS ALREADY THERE, THE, THE PART WITH THE WINDOW, UM, UH, WAS THERE. AND SO TO BASICALLY DOUBLE THAT AND, AND THEN PUT TWO, YOU KNOW, PUT THE, THE TWO HISTORICAL, UH, GUIDELINE CONFORMING WINDOWS KIND OF THERE. AND I SENT A, I WENT WALKING. I ACTUALLY JUST WALKED THROUGH THE, THE NEIGHBORHOOD THIS MORNING TO, TO TRY TO FIND SOME, BECAUSE AT FIRST WE WERE JUST THINKING, CAN WE EXTEND THE ROOFTOP AND MAYBE MAKE LIKE A, A CARPORT OR SOMETHING THERE? UM, BUT, UH, I DON'T THINK THAT'S GONNA GET APPROVED. UH, SO I KIND OF WENT THROUGH THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND, UH, AND, AND KIND OF MOCKED UP SOMETHING THAT I THINK MIGHT HAVE A BETTER CHANCE. AND I'M HOPING TO GET SOME GUIDANCE FROM THE, UM, UH, FROM THE COMMISSION HERE ON IF, IF I'M HEADED THE RIGHT DIRECTION OR IF WE NEED TO, UH, BE RE RETHINKING THIS. I, IT, IT'S BEEN A LITTLE BIT OF A CHALLENGE, UH, TO, TO PULL MONEY TOGETHER TO FIGURE OUT WHAT THE RIGHT WAY TO FIX THIS IS, UH, THAT DOES IT RIGHT. AND ALSO, YOU KNOW, UH, THAT IT, IT IS NOT JUST IN CONFORMANCE, BUT YOU KNOW, KIND OF DOES WHAT I FELT LIKE IS, UM, DOING THINGS THE RIGHT AWAY. SO I'LL LEAVE IT AT THAT. UM, THAT'S SORT OF LIKE ME DOING A REALLY, REALLY BAD PHOTOSHOP, UH, 'CAUSE THAT'S NOT WHAT I DO, BUT THAT'S SORT OF WHAT I WAS THINKING. MAYBE WE, UM, WOULD BE MOVING TOWARDS. OKAY. THANK YOU. UH, DO YOU HAVE ANY VOICEMAILS? WE DO NOT. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. I HAVE A COUPLE QUESTIONS. YES. COMMISSIONER GROUP. UM, I REMEMBER GOING TO THIS PROPERTY, BUT NOT IN JUNE, WAY BACK, LIKE, WHEN WAS IT FEBRUARY? YOU THE SAME THAT DID, GAVE A TOUR, MR. CRUZ? YES. YES. AND SO I ACTUALLY HAD TO, SO MY MOM'S ALSO ON THE CALL. I'M NOT SURE IF SHE'S ABLE TO TALK, BUT I'VE SINCE GIVEN HER POWER OF ATTORNEY. SO IT JUST, IT WAS A REALLY BIG PROJECT TO ACTUALLY GET THE INSIDE FIXED. OKAY. I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT WE ARE, YOU ARE THE SAME PERSON. SO, YES. UM, AND YOU HAD, AT THAT MEETING, WE HAD AGREED [02:35:01] THAT YOU DID. WELL, NOT AGREED, BUT WE FELT LIKE, I FELT COMFORTABLE SAYING, UM, THAT THE WINDOWS ON THE EAST SIDE DID NOT NEED TO BE MODIFIED IF YOU WERE WILLING TO PUT THE WINDOWS IN THE FRONT. THE ONLY ISSUE WE HAVE IS THAT THE TYPE OF WINDOWS THAT HAVE BEEN INSTALLED IN YOUR HOUSE PRIOR TO YOU WAS, UM, THEY'RE KIND OF LIKE UNEQUAL IN SIZES, THE UP AND DOWN, BUT THEN YOU WOULD FIND WINDOWS THAT MATCH WHAT'S INSTALLED. RIGHT? I THINK THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE DISCUSSED, I THINK, UH, YES. ONE OF THE OTHER THINGS THAT WE DID DISCUSS WAS YES, OF COURSE SOLUTIONS. UM, THERE WHATEVER YOU'RE PROPOSING AND THE IDEA OF THE ROOF AND THE WINDOWS, I DO THINK IT'S A BIGGER CONVERSATION, AND I DO THINK IT DOES INVOLVE AN ARCHITECT. SO I DON'T THINK IT'S SOMETHING THAT JUST CAN BE MOCKED UP. UM, BUT ONCE WHAT IT, WHAT COULD BE HERE AND WHAT MAYBE WE COULD MOVE FORWARD IS WE APPROVE SOME OF IT. AND THEN THE OTHER IS YOU TALK WITH AN ARCHITECT TO SEE WHAT IS POSSIBLE BECAUSE OF THE SLOPES OF THE ROOF. AND I REMEMBER THIS, THIS IS THE ROOF OF TERRACE, RIGHT? ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THAT WALL. YES. AND I THINK THERE WERE SOME OTHER ISSUES THAT WE LOOKED AT, LIKE, OKAY, WELL MAYBE YOU CAN'T DO IT. SO, I MEAN, EVEN WHATEVER, YOU KNOW, WE SAY, YEAH, WE LIKE IT. IT'S AN ARCHITECT HAS TO KIND OF, IT COULD BE A, AN INFORMAL DISCUSSION. WE CAN HAVE A D R C, BUT I DO BELIEVE THAT YOU WOULD PROBABLY NEED AN ARCHITECT ANYWAY, SO YOU MIGHT AS WELL DO IT NOW. YES. YEAH. AND THAT'S, AND THAT'S SORT OF, UM, I WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT, BECAUSE I'M, I'M GONNA HIRE TO GET FINAL APPROVAL OF WHATEVER WE DO HERE, BECAUSE THANKFULLY WE HAVE THE POWER ON. SO AT LEAST I'M ABLE TO, TO LIVE HERE. UM, UH, LIKE I, I WANNA DO IT THE RIGHT WAY AND ALSO HOPEFULLY NOT WASTE TOO MUCH TIME BY BRINGING PLANS OR AND MONEY TO BRING PLANS THAT, THAT MAY NOT EVEN HAVE A SHOT. AND SO I WAS HOPING, BECAUSE I REALLY ACTUALLY ENJOYED THE CONVERSATION THAT WE HAD HAD, AND, YOU KNOW, WE'RE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT, OKAY, HOW DO WE MAKE IT WORK HERE? UM, AND SO, UM, IF, IF I GET ANY FEEDBACK ON THAT, AND ALSO GET THE APPROVAL FOR THE WINDOWS SO I CAN INSTALL THOSE AS THEY COME IN HERE, UM, UH, OR, OR KNOW IF I NEED TO ORDER SOME MORE FOR THE EAST FACADE, UM, UH, YOU KNOW, THAT WOULD BE GREAT. BUT ALSO ON THAT FINAL, THAT FINAL POINT IS GONNA BE BE A LITTLE BIT OF A WORK IN PROJECT HERE, UH, OR PRO UH, UH, WORK, UH, WORK IN PROCESS HERE. BUT LIKE, UH, JUST WANTED TO GET HOPEFULLY A LITTLE BIT OF INSIGHT INTO WHETHER OR NOT EXTENDING THAT, THAT PART THAT STICKS OUT TO BASICALLY DOUBLE THAT UP AND THEN MAKE THAT THAT GABLE ROOF OR WHAT, WHATEVER TYPE OF ROOF THAT IS LIKE, JUST EXTEND MR. THAT THAT'S A POTENTIAL. YOU'VE BEEN REALLY GOOD AND I THINK YOU WERE REALLY OPEN AND MR. CHAIR, IF, IF YOU DON'T MIND, I I WOULD TRY TO DO A MOTION. OKAY. AND THE MOTION WOULD BE TO APPROVE, UM, I GUESS IT'S ITEM ONE AND TWO AS PRESENTED, BUT YOU REALLY HAVEN'T REALLY PRESENTED, BUT I CAN MAYBE SAY IT'S, IT'S REINSTALLING THE FRONT WINDOWS AND KEEPING EVERY OTHER FENESTRATION AS IS TODAY. UH, I'LL PROVE ITEM NUMBER TWO. AND THEN ON ITEM NUMBER THREE, I WOULD SEND THAT TO A D R C MEETING, WHICH MEANS THAT, YOU KNOW, WE'RE PUSHING IT TO A, TO AN INFORMAL DISCUSSION. AND IN THE MEANTIME, WE'RE NOT GONNA MAKE YOU REMOVE THAT WHOLE ADDITION. WE ALL AND SAW IT. AND IT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT YOU'RE GONNA BE REMOVING. WE'RE JUST GONNA COME TO AN AGREEMENT ON HOW WE MAKE THAT LOOK. YOU KNOW, THE HOW DO WE CAN COMPENSATE FOR THAT WOMAN NUMBER. AND SOME OF THE IDEAS THAT YOU'RE COMING WITH UP TODAY, I THINK WOULD BE JUST, UH, WOULD BE ACCEPTABLE. IT'S JUST, I THINK WE NEED TO JUST LOOK AT ALL THE OPTIONS. I'LL SECOND IT. COMMISSIONER GROUP, SO WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND. ANY DISCUSSION? YES. COMMISSIONER SAVINO? UH, I DO HAVE A QUESTION. UH, MR. CRUZ, WERE YOU THE OWNER AT THE TIME WHEN THE FRONT PORCH WAS REMOVED? NO. NO. I DIDN'T KNOW THERE WAS A, I DIDN'T EVEN KNOW THERE WAS A FRONT PORCH EVER THERE, TO BE HONEST. OKAY. JUST CURIOUS. THANK YOU. YEAH, THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE LOOKED EXACTLY THE SAME EXCEPT FOR THE WINDOWS MISSING NOW. MM-HMM. AS, AS WHEN I BOUGHT IT. OKAY. THANK YOU. MM-HMM. COMMISSIONER CARPENTERS? YEAH, JUST TO, JUST TO ADD ONTO THAT COMMENT, I THINK IF YOU LOOK TO YOUR NEIGHBOR TO THE EAST, UH, THOSE WERE SORT OF COMPANION HOUSES, VERY SIMILAR IN DESIGN, AND, AND THERE'S A PORSCHE THERE, AND I, I RECALL, UH, US MAKING THE SITE VISIT OUT THERE. AND I, I THINK THIS IS A REASONABLE, UH, APPROACH TO FINDING THE SOLUTION. AND, AND WE APPRECIATE YOUR COOPERATION AND, UM, YOU KNOW, CONTINUED, UH, ENGAGEMENT WITH US. AND I THINK, UM, WE'LL, WE'LL GET YOU THERE, UM, TO SOMETHING THAT I THINK THE, THE NEIGHBORHOOD WILL, WILL FIND ACCEPTABLE AND, UH, WON'T COMPLETELY BREAK THE BANK IN MAKING IT HAPPEN. , I, I APPRECIATE THAT. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU, CHAIRMAN. THANK YOU. UM, MAY YOU HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE? [02:40:01] SINA? AYE. VELAZQUEZ? AYE. MORALES? AYE. MASUKA. AYE. CARPENTER. AYE. GROUP. AYE. ANTE? YES, I'M ZER. AYE. MOTION PASSES. THANK YOU. THANK Y'ALL VERY MUCH FOR YOUR TIME. AGENDA ITEM 21, AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 21, H D R C, CASE NUMBER 2022 DASH 3 34 9 15 EAST CROCKETT. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT A TWO STORY SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURE ON THE VACANT LOT AT NINE 15 EAST CROCKETT, LOCATED WITHIN THE NUITY HILL HISTORIC DISTRICT. RECOMMENDATIONS, STAFF RECOMMENDS CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL BASED ON FINDINGS A THROUGH Q WITH THE FOLLOWING STIPULATIONS, ONE THAT THE APPLICANT CONFIRMED THE PROPOSED NEW CONSTRUCTION WILL FEATURE A SETBACK THAT IS EQUAL TO OR GREATER THAN THOSE FOUND HISTORICALLY ON THIS BLOCK. AS NOTED IN FINDING D A SETBACK THAT MATCHES THAT OF THE NEW CONSTRUCTION AT NINE 19 EAST CROCKETT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE AS THE SETBACK IS CONSISTENT WITH THE GUIDELINES. TWO, THAT THE APPLICANT INCORPORATED A FOUNDATION HEIGHT OF AT LEAST ONE FOOT IN HEIGHT AS NOTED IN FINDING G THREE, THAT IF COMPOSITE SIDING IS INSTALLED, IT FEATURE A SMOOTH FINISH AND AN EXPOSURE OF FOUR INCHES BOARD. AND BATTEN SIDING SHOULD FEATURE SMOOTH BOARDS THAT ARE APPROXIMATELY 12 INCHES IN WIDTH WITH BATTENS THAT ARE APPROXIMATELY 1.5 INCHES IN WIDTH. METAL AND SHINGLE ROOFING ARE BOTH APPROPRIATE, HOWEVER, METAL ROOFING SHOULD FEATURE SMOOTH PANELS THAT ARE 18 TO 21 INCHES IN WIDTH SIMS THAT SEAMS THAT ARE ONE TO TWO INCHES IN HEIGHT, A CRIMPED RIDGE SEAM OR A LOW PROFILE RIDGE CAP AND A STANDARD GAL LOOM FINISH FOUR, THAT THE APPLICANT INSTALL WOOD OR ALUMINUM CLOUD WOOD WINDOWS THAT ARE CONSISTENT WITH STAFF STANDARDS FOR WINDOWS AND NEW CONSTRUCTION. AS NOTED IN THE APPLICABLE, APPLICABLE CITATIONS AND FINDING K FIVE THAT THE APPLICANT REVISED, THE PROPOSED FENESTRATION PROFILE IS NOTED IN FINDING L WINDOWS AND THEIR OPENING SHOULD FEATURE TRADITIONAL SIZES AND PROFILES. GROUPED WINDOWS SHOULD BE SEPARATED BY A MULIAN OF AT LEAST SIX INCHES IN WIDTH. SIX THAT THE PROPOSED PORCH COLUMNS BE SIX INCHES SQUARE AND FEATURE CAPITAL AND BASE TRIM SEVEN THAT THE APPLICANT DEVELOP A DETAILED LANDSCAPING PLAN THAT NOTES THE INSTALLATION OF LANDSCAPING MATERIALS. INCLUDES A FRONT WALKWAY AS NOTED IN FINDING QUEUE AND INCLUDES ANY FENCING PLANS AS NOTED IN FINDING O EIGHT THAT THE PROPOSED DRIVEWAY BE SEPARATED FROM THE PROPOSED NEW CONSTRUCTION BY A LANDSCAPING STRIP AND BE NO MORE THAN 10 FEET IN WIDTH. AND I BELIEVE THE APPLICANT, JENNIFER PARK IS WITH US IN PERSON. HI GUYS. CAN YOU HEAR ME? WOO-HOO. YES. ALL RIGHT. INTRODUCE YOURSELF PLEASE. UH, MY NAME'S JENNIFER PARK AND I ACTUALLY LIVE IN DIGNITY HILL IN NINE 19 EAST CROCKETT STREET, AND I OWN THE LOT NEXT TO IT, AND I'M LOOKING AT BUILDING A SIMILAR HOUSE NEXT DOOR TO IT. SO I WAS HERE A COUPLE YEARS BACK. I DON'T KNOW IF YOU REMEMBER ME, , BUT, UM, THE HOUSE ON THE RIGHT, RIGHT THERE IS MY HOUSE I'M LIVING IN RIGHT NOW, AND I WANTED TO BUILD A SIMILAR HOUSE NEXT DOOR TO IT. I AGREE TO ALL OF THE, THE STIPULATIONS EXCEPT FOR NUMBER THREE AND NUMBER FIVE. UM, NUMBER THREE, I AGREE WITH EVERYTHING EXCEPT FOR THE FOUR INCHES EXPOSURE. THE HOUSE NEXT DOOR ON NINE 19 IS A, IS LIKE THE SEVEN INCH THAT JIM WAS TALKING ABOUT ON PALMETTO, UM, IS A, IT'LL BE A CEMENT, UM, FIBER, JUST LIKE THAT HOUSE, RIGHT? OR JUST LIKE NINE 19, BUT IT'S THE SEVEN INCHES INSTEAD OF THE FOUR FOR THE, FOR THE SIDING. AND, UM, THAT WAY IT'LL BE CONFORMING TO THE NEXT HOUSE TO IT. THERE IS A HOUSE ACROSS THE STREET THAT HAS SIMILAR, THE WIDER SIDING AS WELL, AND IT'S, IT'S SMOOTH AS WELL. AND IT'S A HISTORICAL HOUSE. THERE ARE TWO AIRBNBS NEXT TO NINE 19 ON THE EAST SIDE THAT HAVE THE SMALLER FOUR INCH SIDING. UM, BUT THEN THERE'S TWO MORE NEXT TO IT THAT ARE NEWER CONSTRUCTION THAT ALSO HAVE THE, THE WIDE SIDING. UM, AND THEN NUMBER FIVE IS THE WINDOWS. THAT'S MY MAIN CONCERN FOR TALKING ABOUT TODAY, IS I, I AM GONNA CONCEDE TO THE, THE WOOD CLAD WINDOWS. HOWEVER, THE, THE SIZES I WANTED TO TO TELL YOU, I WENT THROUGH THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND LIKE THE CLOSE STREETS NEARBY AND FOUND ALL KINDS OF WINDOW SIZES AND SHAPES AND, AND PROFILES. AND, UM, SO I WANTED TO KIND OF KEEP MY SIZES THAT I HAVE. AND I THINK THE, THE ONES ON THE EAST ARE, SOME PEOPLE HAD, UM, WHEN I WENT TO THE DESIGN REVIEW, THEY WANTED ME TO MAKE THEM LONGER, BUT THERE ARE SEVERAL HOUSES, OLDER HOUSES IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD THAT HAVE THE SQUARE WINDOWS TOO, AND THAT'S ON THE EAST SIDE OF THE HOUSE AND THE DRIVEWAY'S ON THAT SIDE. SO THEY'RE GONNA GET BLOCKED AND IT'S RIGHT NEXT TO THE NET, THE HOUSE NEXT TO IT. SO THEY'RE NOT GONNA BE VIEWED BY A LOT OF PEOPLE. AND THEN I THINK THAT'S IT. OKAY. THANK YOU. BUT IF YOU LOOK AT THE, THE PICTURES I HAVE OF ALL THE HOUSES THAT ARE CLOSE BY THAT HAVE THE WIDER WINDOWS OR THAT LAST SLIDE IS ACTUALLY NEW CONSTRUCTION. AND I WANTED TO GIVE YOU GUYS A VIEW OF WHAT HAS BEEN APPROVED. AND [02:45:01] I'M NOT ASKING FOR ANYTHING MODERN LIKE THAT. ALL THE OTHER HOUSES I HAVE ARE HISTORICAL AND THEY HAVE, THE WINDOW SIZES ARE WIDER THAN THEY ARE TALL IN SOME OF THE SITUATIONS. AND I ONLY HAVE THE ONE WINDOW IN THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE THAT'S A FOUR FEET WIDE BY SIX FEET TALL WINDOW. AND IT'S NOT ANYTHING OUTLANDISH, BUT TAKE A LOOK AT THE, THERE'S THE ELEVATIONS. OKAY, THANK YOU. I BELIEVE WE HAVE A VOICEMAIL. YES. ONE VOICEMAIL. HELLO, MY NAME IS VALERIE CORTEZ AND I RESIDE AT 5 0 8 LAMAR STREET WITH IN DIGA WHITTY HILL. I'M CALLING ON BEHALF OF THE CONCERNED CITIZENS OF DIGA WHITTY HILL WITH REGARDS TO CASE NUMBER 2022 DASH 3 34, LOCATED AT NINE 15 EAST CROCKETT STREET. WE SUPPORT O P'S RECOMMENDATIONS WITH THESE ADDITIONAL COMMENTS. THE FENESTRATION SEEMS TO BE LACKING ON THE EAST ELEVATION, AND IT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE FOR THE WINDOWS TO BE IN THE TRADITIONAL ONE OVER ONE STYLE. WE AGREE THAT THE WINDOWS SHOULD NOT BE VINYL WINDOWS. PLEASE ENSURE THAT THE APPLICANT UNDERSTANDS THAT ANY FUTURE CARPORT CANNOT BE ATTACHED TO THE HOUSE AND CANNOT EXTEND PAST THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE AS THIS IS NOT HISTORICALLY ACCURATE. THANK YOU. THERE WILL BE NO CARPORT. THANK YOU. AND THEN THE WINDOWS, THERE'S A, ONE OF THE SMALLER WINDOWS IS A BATHROOM WINDOW, AND THEN ON THE OTHER SIDE, THE FOUR BY FOUR IS A KITCHEN WINDOW. IT'S OVER THE KITCHEN SINK. SO THERE'S REASONS WHY THEY'RE NOT ABLE TO BE LONGER. OKAY. THANK YOU. AND YOU DID AGREE TO, UM, DO A WOOD CLAD WINDOW? YES, SIR. OKAY. I HAVE THE, I THINK THEY'RE THE JEL WIND, UH, SIGHTLINE SERIES. OKAY. AND ARE MOST OR ALL OF THE WINDOWS OPERABLE? THE EACH ROOM HAS, UH, AT LEAST ONE WINDOW FOR EGRESS THERE. IT'S A MIX BETWEEN THE CASEMENT AND THE FIXED. OKAY. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. YES, I'D LIKE TO COMMISSIONER SPEAK. THANK YOU. UM, MS. PARK, UM, I THINK, UM, I BELIEVE THAT YOUR, YOUR PRECEDENCE THAT YOU'RE SHOWING AND WHAT YOU SEE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD, UM, IS A REFLECTION OF WHAT'S THERE. THERE'S A LOT OF, UM, THERE NON-CONFORMING WORK, THINGS THAT HAVE BEEN ADDED TO. SO WHEN WE USE THE GUIDELINES, WHAT WE'RE HOPING TO DO IS USE THE HISTORIC STRUCTURE AS ORIGINALLY BUILT AS POSSIBLE AS OUR GUIDE, NOT THE ANOMALY OF THE REPAIR JOB OR THE ANOMALY OF, UM, YOU KNOW, UH, YEAH, REPAIRED WINDOW, A REPLACED WINDOW. WE LOOK AT THE, UM, HER HISTORICALLY ORIGINAL WINDOW AS THE FRAME OF REFERENCE, PARDON THE PUN. UM, SO WHAT YOU HAVE, LIKE ON THE ONE PAGE, ON PAGE EIGHT, WE HAVE SOME POSTWAR BUILDINGS, THE FLAT, FLAT ROOF, LOW SLOPE, 1960S, PROBABLY LATE 1950S, EARLY SIXTIES, JUST ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE BLOCK. SO YEAH. ON RIETTA. YEAH. SO THOSE, THOSE WINDOWS ACTUALLY GO WITH THOSE STYLES. THOSE ARE STYLISTICALLY APPROPRIATE. NOW, THE BUNGALOW IN THE UPPER RIGHT HAND CORNER, THOSE CAME IN LATER. AND THE, UH, VICTORIAN FOLK, VICTORIAN, MY WORD, THOSE HAVE CLEARLY BEEN REPLACED AS WELL AS A NUMBER OF THESE. SO TYPICALLY WHEN WE'RE LOOKING AT PRECEDENT, WE'RE LOOKING IDEALLY AT THE ORIGINAL HISTORIC, YOUR HOUSE HAS VERY STRONG VERNACULAR LINES. I WOULDN'T EVEN CALL IT MODERN, IT'S KIND OF CONTEMPORARY, BUT IT'S, IT TAKES, UH, A LOT OF, UH, LESSON FROM VERNACULAR FORM COMPOSITION. SO THE WINDOW THAT WOULD BEST FIT WOULD BE ONE WITH PROPORTIONS OF A VERNACULAR. DO YOU FOLLOW ME? I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THAT IS. OKAY. UH, IT'S THE STYLE, IT'S THE STYLE OF YOUR HOUSE. AND THE STYLE OF A WINDOW OFTEN GOES WITH THE STYLE OF THE HOUSE, AND I BELIEVE THAT'S WHAT STAFF IS. SO WHAT SIZE WOULD THAT BE? IT WOULD BE A NARROWER IF YOU'RE, IF YOU'RE, FOR INSTANCE, ON YOUR ELEVATION, NUMBER ONE, YOUR FRONT ELEVATION, UM, CHANCES ARE THAT WOULD BE EITHER TWO SMALLER ONES SIDE BY SIDE, SEPARATED WITH A STUD POCKET IN THERE, OR IT MAY BE JUST ONE A LITTLE BIT NARROWER A LITTLE BIT. AND IT WOULD BE A DOUBLE HUNG, MAYBE SINGLE HUNG, EQUALLY DIVIDED VERTICALLY. AND THAT HAS TO DO PRIMARILY WITH THE STYLE OF THE HOUSE AND THE STYLE OF THE WINDOW BEING COMPLIMENTARY. SO, UH, THAT, IT'S JUST MY OBSERVATION AND MAYBE SOME INSIGHT ON, UM, WHY YOU STAFF MADE THIS COMMENTS. THANK YOU, CHAIR. I STILL DON'T THINK IT'S TOO MUCH TO ASK FOR. UM, WITH THE SIZE, IT'S NOT ANYTHING THAT'S GREATLY GONNA BE NOTICED BY ANYONE. IT'S, UM, I THINK IT LOOKS PROPORTIONAL TO THE HOUSE AND 30 OR 40 OTHER HOUSES [02:50:01] NEARBY HAVE OTHER, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE, WHETHER THEY'RE NEW OR REPLACED, THEY'RE, THEY'RE THERE, YOU KNOW, AND THAT'S NOT GONNA TAKE ANYTHING AWAY FROM THE NEIGHBORHOOD. IT'S GONNA, YOU KNOW, THE, THE REST OF THE HOUSE, IT'S SET BACK. IT DOESN'T TAKE ANYTHING AWAY FROM THE HISTORICAL HOUSES IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD. I'M GONNA, I'M GONNA TRY TO KEEP THOSE SIZES. OKAY. THANK YOU. AND I AGREE TO DO THE WINDOW, UM, THE, THE WOOD CLAD WINDOWS, THE MATERIALS. COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, I REALLY HAVE NOTHING MORE TO ADD THAN WHAT, UH, COMMISSIONER SABINO SAID THAT, YOU KNOW, I THINK SHE'S SPOT ON ON WHERE, YOU KNOW, I THINK THE, THE STYLE OF THIS HOUSE, LIKE, IT'S LIKE SHE SAYS IN VERNACULAR, MOST THINGS ARE WORKING WELL WITH THAT. THERE ARE A FEW THINGS THAT JUMP OUT AT US LIKE THOSE WINDOWS, BECAUSE THOSE ARE SUCH A IMPORTANT CHARACTER DEFINING FEATURE. MM-HMM. AND I WOULD MAKE A MOLD PAIR OF WINDOWS THERE AND ACHIEVE WHAT YOU'RE TRYING TO DO. UH, THAT'S WOULD BE CONSISTENT WITH THE REST OF THE DESIGN STYLE THAT YOU ARE, UH, TRYING TO, UM, TO ACCOMPLISH HERE. SO IT'S JUST, IT'S KINDA LIKE A FAUX PA. YOU LOOK AT THAT AND YOU GO, MM, OKAY, THAT'S A MISS. JUST A LITTLE TWEAKING, AND YOU WOULD BE SPOT ON. OKAY. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. YES, SIR. UM, I, I, UM, UM, I THINK, I THINK WHAT, WHAT MR. CARPENTER IS TELLING YOU, UH, TO THE APPLICANT IS REALLY KIND OF, I, I MEAN, JUST THE WAY HE COMMUNICATED IT, IT, IT'S, IT'S IS IF YOU HAVE, UM, YOU HAVE A WALL, BUT YOU HAVE NO WINDOWS IN IT, RIGHT? SO NOW YOU GOTTA GO BUY YOUR WINDOWS. SO AT THAT POINT, IT IS JUST A QUESTION OF WHETHER OR NOT YOU BUY THE RIGHT WINDOW OR THE WRONG WINDOW, RIGHT? WORKING WITHIN, LET'S JUST SAY THAT YOU FIND THE WINDOW THAT YOU NEED WITHIN THE PRICE POINT WHERE YOU'RE AT, RIGHT? RIGHT. LET'S SAY THAT THAT'S AN IMPORTANT CRITERIA, BUT AS FAR AS THE, THE, YOU KNOW, WHAT MAKES A WINDOW FIT, SOMETIMES IT'S SOMEBODY ELSE TELLING YOU, YEAH, SURE. BUT NOT THAT WINDOW, RIGHT? SO IT'S, I I WOULD SAY IT'S IN YOUR BEST INTEREST TO, TO TAKE THAT ADVICE AS SOME HIGH LEVEL, UH, UH, ADVICE. NOW, I, I'M GONNA TELL YOU WHAT, WHAT MY PROBLEM IS WITH IT, BUT I DON'T WANNA, UH, GIVE YOU THE IMPRESSION THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT IT, FOR ME, IT'S A LIMITATION, RIGHT? PEOPLE, THEY MAKE THE DECISIONS THAT THEY MAKE, AND SOMETIMES YOU JUST DRIVE BY AND GO, WHY WOULD THEY DO THAT? I, AND, AND I SAY THAT WITH YOUR, WITH RESPECT TO YOUR PORCH AND THE HOUSE THAT YOU SHOWED AS YOUR HOUSE, RIGHT? MM-HMM. NEXT DOOR MM-HMM. , THIS, UH, UH, THE WAY THAT YOU'RE GOING ABOUT THIS PORCH FOR ME, RIGHT? AND THIS IS JUST MY OPINION IS, IS THE WORST, ABSOLUTE WORST KIND OF PORCH YOU COULD EVER HAVE. 'CAUSE IT'S REALLY NOT A PORCH, IT'S JUST A COVER FOR THE RAIN. AND YOU KNOW, WHEN PEOPLE TRY TO DO THAT HISTORICALLY, RIGHT? THEY DON'T PUT A COVER, THEY JUST PUT A REALLY NICE DETAIL OVER THE DOOR, AND YOU GET WET WHEN YOU GO TO THE DOOR BECAUSE THERE'S A, THERE'S A WAY TO DO THAT, RIGHT? BUT, BUT WHEN YOU, WHEN YOU PUT A LITTLE PORCH AND YOU STEP IT OUT, THAT'S MORE CONSISTENT WITH THE BACK DOOR, RIGHT? WHERE NOBODY SEES THAT. WHEN YOU DO THAT IN THE FRONT, YOU USE ALL OF THAT SPACE, THAT, THAT, THAT, UH, SETBACK, FRONTAGE, ALL OF THOSE THINGS, YOU PUSH YOURSELF FURTHER BACK IN THE LONG RUN. YOU LOSE BY NOT TAKING ADVANTAGE OF, UH, UH, IF YOU'RE, IF YOU SAY YOU'RE GONNA DO A PORCH, DO A PORCH, RIGHT? AND THEN YOU HAVE DIFFERENT, UH, SHAPES AVAILABLE TO YOU. YOU HAVE A A, A, A, A, A SEMI FLAT SLOPE PORCH THAT COMES TO THE FRONT, PLENTY OF THOSE IN THAT NEIGHBORHOOD. YOU HAVE A PORCH THAT STEPS OUT THE FULL LENGTH OF THAT GABLE. UH, BUT WHATEVER IT IS, I'M JUST GIVING YOU, UH, UH, MY PERSONAL OPINION BECAUSE ONCE IT'S DONE, IT'S DONE, RIGHT? MM-HMM. . AND IF YOU HAVE THIS, THIS ASSET THAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT CREATING IN THAT NEIGHBORHOOD, UM, THAT TO ME, THAT THAT IS JUST KIND OF LIKE, UM, IT'S A VERY, UH, ELEMENTARY, RIGHT? VERY, VERY ELEMENTARY, UH, WAY TO, TO GO ABOUT DEALING WITH THE ENTRANCE INTO YOUR HOUSE. SO FOOD FOR THOUGHT. UM, IF YOU, IF YOU FEEL LIKE, UM, YOU WANT TO COME BACK WITH, WITH, WITH, WITH SOME MAJOR IMPROVEMENTS TO THAT, MAYBE, MAYBE LOOK AT YOUR HOUSE THE WAY YOU LIKE TO HAVE A PORCH, RIGHT? AND, AND, AND DON'T LOOK AT IT LIKE MY HOUSE OR THEIR HOUSE. LOOK AT IT LIKE THIS HOUSE AND THAT HOUSE, AND THAT HOUSE HAS FEELINGS TOO. YOU'RE GONNA HURT THIS HOUSE'S FEELINGS. OKAY. THAT'S, THOSE ARE MY COMMENTS. OKAY. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. UM, JUST A REMINDER THAT THIS IS FOR CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL. SO ANY STIPULATIONS SUCH AS STUDYING THE, THE FRONT ELEVATION OF THE HOUSE, THE WINDOWS, THE PORCH, UM, SPECIFICALLY THOSE COULD BE ADDED TO ANY MOTION THAT IS MADE. WELL, MR. CHAIR, JUST ON THAT, JUST SO THAT I, UH, I DON'T FURTHER CONFUSE THIS APPLICANT. I LIKE WHAT YOU'RE, WHAT YOU'VE DONE. I LIKE THE WAY THAT THAT CHANGED PITCH STEPS OFF. I SEE HOW IT'S JUST A, JUST, IT'S JUST A, A, A, A SMALL THING THAT'S DONE. SO EVERYTHING'S NICE. [02:55:01] I DON'T UNDERSTAND THIS PORCH, IT DOESN'T, DOESN'T GO WITH THE REST OF THE HOUSE. SO I'M ONLY TALKING ABOUT THE PORCH. I THINK EVERYTHING ELSE IS PRETTY COOL, PARTICULARLY IF YOU TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION, UH, COMMISSIONER SENOS AND COMMISSIONER CARPENTER'S COMMENTS ABOUT THE WINDOWS. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER GROUP. YEAH, I WAS GONNA SUGGEST, UM, THE APPLICANT, WE COULD DO A CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL OF STAFF STIPULATIONS AND THEN SUGGEST THE APPLICANT TO GO TO A D R C MEETING WITH ANY, UH, LIKE WITH THE ACCEPTANCE OF THE STIPULATIONS, AND THEN YOU CAN KIND OF GO BACK AND FORTH ON THE WINDOWS. BUT I DO FEEL LIKE, YEAH, MOST OF THE COMMISSION, I THINK WE AGREE ON THE WINDOWS. UM, I, SOME OF THEM I THINK YOU CAN WORK, YOU'RE STILL ON AN INITIAL STAGE, AND I THINK THERE CAN BE SOME SOLUTIONS TO, ESPECIALLY THE FRONT, UM, ON THE SIDE. I WOULD BE MORE FOCUSED ON JUST KEEPING THEM AT THE SAME HEIGHT, JUST DECIDE ON ONE OR THE OTHER. AND I THINK A LOT OF THE, UH, EXAMPLES THAT YOU USED IN PICTURES, THAT'S WHAT WE'VE APPROVED AND THAT'S WHAT WE'VE ESPECIALLY BEEN FOCUSED ON WHEN WE APPROVED THOSE CASES. MANY OF THE PICTURES I, I REMEMBER. UM, AND THEN I WOULD JUST, THE SETBACKS, OF COURSE, THAT STAFF HAS, WHICH IS STIPULATION ONE, BUT WHAT'S THE HEIGHT DIFFERENCE BETWEEN YOUR HOUSE AND HOUSE AND THIS, SO WHAT, WHAT WOULD BE THE SETBACKS DIFFERENCE BETWEEN YOURS AND THIS ONE? DO YOU KNOW THAT THE SETBACKS ARE GONNA BE THE SAME AND THE, UM, THE PITCH IS GONNA, OR THE, THE TOP IS GONNA BE, I THINK A FOOT, UH, SHORTER. 'CAUSE IT'S GOT THE, THE SLOPED CEILINGS ON THE SECOND FLOOR AND IT'S FARTHER BACK. SO I THINK IT'S LIKE A FOOT, FOOT SHORTER FOOT OR TWO SHORTER THAN THE YES, THAT WOULD, THAT WOULD BE PART OF WHAT I WOULD SAY, JUST TO SHOW US THAT SO THAT WE MAYBE CAN LIKE SEE, OKAY, WHAT'S IMPORTANT, BECAUSE THE TWO HOUSES, EVEN THOUGH YOU OWN THEM NOW, YOU KNOW, THEY MAY BE, YOU KNOW, TWO DIFFERENT LOTS AND TWO DIFFERENT ADDRESSES, BUT MAYBE WE CAN SAY LET'S FOCUS MORE ON THE WINDOWS IN THE FRONT AND NOT SO MUCH ON THE SIDES ONCE WE SEE HOW THE TWO HOUSES, BUT UP, YOU KNOW, KIND OF UP AGAINST EACH OTHER, MAYBE ON THE EAST SIDE IS NOT AS IMPORTANT AS THE WEST SIDE. I THINK YOU CAN WALK US THROUGH THAT. I THINK THAT WOULD HELP US. I KIND OF HAVE A PICTURE OF THEM SIDE BY SIDE ON THE SITE PLAN. SO YOU COULD SEE THE SETBACK. IF YOU GO TO THE FRONT OF THE, MY, UH, THING, I SUBMITTED THE POWERPOINT OR THE FRONT, UH, NUMBER TWO, THAT'S HOW THEY'RE GONNA LOOK SIDE BY SIDE. THAT'S LIKE THE LANDSCAPING PLAN TOO. IT'S GONNA HAVE LIKE THE DECOM OR WAS, I DON'T KNOW, , IT WAS GONNA HAVE DECOMPOSED GROUND ON THE SIDES. THE DRIVEWAY WAS PULLED AWAY FROM THE HOUSE, HAD THE FRONT SIDEWALK. I WAS GONNA DO THE PRIVACY FENCE ON THE SIDES. WELL, IT ALREADY HAS ON THE EAST SIDE, IT HAS A PRIVACY FENCE. SO, UM, YEAH, OKAY, SO THIS IS CONCEPTUAL ANYWAY, SO NO, THERE WAS AN EMPTY LOT TO THE WEST OF IT, SO THERE'S NOTHING ON THAT SIDE. SO THOSE WINDOWS WILL BE SEEN ON THAT SIDE RIGHT NOW. I DON'T THINK THERE'S GONNA BE ANYTHING BUILT THERE FOR A WHILE. I THINK, I DON'T KNOW IF STEPH, THIS WAS AFTER, SO, BECAUSE I DON'T SEE ANY COMMENTS ON THAT DRIVEWAY. WAS THAT PART OF THE INITIAL PROJECT? I SAID AFTER I HAD MY, UM, DESIGN REVIEW MEETING WITH EDWARD, HE, UM, I DID THAT, UM, I PULLED THE DRIVEWAY OVER AND DID THAT, SUBMITTED THAT, UH, LAST FRIDAY. OKAY. SO I GUESS THAT THAT WILL ALSO MAYBE CHANGE A LITTLE BIT ON, UM, BECAUSE WE DON'T WANNA AVOID LIKE A FRONT PARKING, UM, SCENARIO. AND I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS CREATING THAT FRONT PARK BECAUSE YOU HAVE THE FIVE FEET, BUT YOU REALLY DON'T, THE FIVE FEET DON'T GIVE YOU ENOUGH FOR A DRIVEWAY. UM, AND I SEE YOU DON'T HAVE ANY OTHER CHOICES, BUT IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD IT'S NOT. SO I THINK THIS ACTUALLY MAYBE EVEN MORE, WE, WE NEED TO MOVE ON TO CONCEPTUAL AND, AND MOVE TO D D R C. AND I THINK IT'S VERY IMPORTANT THAT WE DISCUSS THE DRIVEWAY BEFORE YOU, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S WRONG WITH THE DRIVEWAY? WELL, WHAT YOU'RE CREATING IS THERE, BY PUTTING THE DRIVEWAY THERE, YOU'RE GONNA AUTOMATICALLY BE PARKING ON THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE? NO, THERE'S GONNA BE TWO CARS THAT PARK ON THE DRIVEWAY. NO ONE'S GONNA PARK IN THE FRONT, JUST LIKE THE HOUSE NEXT DOOR. IT HAS, SEE HOW IT HAS THE DRIVEWAY, BUT THE DRIVEWAY IS ACTUALLY ATTACHED TO THAT HOUSE, THE HOUSE I'M IN NOW. YEAH. SO THE DRIVEWAY GOES ALL THE WAY DOWN, RIGHT? THERE'S NO, YOU HAVE A PATIO RIGHT THERE. WELL, THERE'S A FENCE THERE, SO THERE'S NOTHING, THERE'S ONLY ONE CAR THAT PARKS IN THE FRONT ON THE DRIVEWAY. YEAH. YEAH. BUT YOUR DRIVEWAY GOES ALL THE WAY. MM-HMM. , IT DOESN'T, YOU DON'T, YOU'RE NOT STOPPED BY A BUILDING OR A HOUSE OR SOME CONSTRUCTION, AND THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE DOING HERE. OKAY. YOU, YOU'RE NOT ABLE TO GO ALL THE WAY DOWN. RIGHT? RIGHT. SO INSTEAD OF FITTING THREE CARS THAT COULD ONLY FIT TWO, WHEREAS THE ONE THAT'S ALREADY EXISTING CAN FIT THREE CARS. THAT ONE CAN ONLY, THAT CAN FIT TWO, IT RUNS OUT. I WOULD RATHER NOT, UH, I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS NOT PART OF THE INITIAL REQUEST. I THINK CONCEPTUALLY I'M GOOD WITH DESIGNS OF THE FRONT, UH, ELEVATION OF THE ELEVATIONS THAT YOU HAVE SHOWN TODAY. I WOULD KEEP ALL THE STIPULATIONS AND THEN I WOULD SUGGEST ANOTHER D R C WHERE WE LOOK AT THE DETAILS OF THE DRIVEWAY AND, AND, UM, AND THE WINDOWS [03:00:01] NEED TO, UM, I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH DECIDING. I'M JUST GONNA KEEP THE STIPULATION THERE IN CASE YOU CHANGE YOUR MIND. UM, BUT THE WINDOWS I THINK NEEDS TO BE WORKED ON. MM-HMM. , WOULD YOU ALSO ADD THE FRONT PORCH FOR DISCUSSION? I MEAN, I, I DON'T WANNA PUT IT ON, ON THE APPLICANT. I THINK IT WAS A GREAT SUGGESTION. IT'S TRUE. I MEAN, YOU'VE ALREADY TAKEN AWAY SQUARE FOOT FOR YOURSELF, SO YOU MIGHT AS WELL, YOU KNOW, MAKE IT REALLY NICE AND ABLE. AND I THINK THAT IT'S A GREAT SUGGESTION, BUT IT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT I'LL IMPOSE. OKAY. SO YOU HAVE A MOTION, SORRY. UH, MOTION TO APPROVE, UH, WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS. SECOND. YOU HAVE A MOTION? A SECOND. YOU NEED FURTHER DISCUSSION, MR. CHAIR, I'D JUST LIKE TO ASK APPLICANT A QUESTION. UM, A APPLICANT , IF, IF THAT PORCH WAS PUT ON FOR DESIGN REVIEW COMMITTEE, WOULD YOU HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT? OR DO YOU REALLY LOVE THE WAY THIS PORCH IS RIGHT NOW? I REALLY LOVE IT. I LOVE EVERYTHING ABOUT IT. I'VE ALREADY MOVED INTO MY MIND, SO, OH GOODNESS. WELL, YEAH. TO EACH HIS OWN. OKAY. I JUST WANTED TO, TO ASK. OKAY. YEAH. ALL THE OTHER PORCHES, LIKE THE PORCH I HAVE ON MY HOUSE NOW IS WORTHLESS. YOU KNOW, I, I MEAN IT, I KNOW IT'S HISTORICAL, BUT IT'S LIKE IT GETS NO USE. ALL IT IS IS THERE FOR PEOPLE TO LOOK AT. SO, WELL, LET ME JUST, IF, IF I MIGHT JUST SAY ONE THING, MR. CHAIR, TYPICALLY WHAT I'VE, IN POOR NEIGHBORHOODS OR LOW, LOW ECONOMIC NEIGHBORHOODS, THE, THE LITTLE PORCH HAPPENS OUT OF A SHOTGUN HOUSE AND IT MAKES SENSE. AND THEN AS THEY STEP BACK, THEY ADD AN ADD IN A LINEAR WAY, AND YOU END UP WITH THIS BUILDING TYPE. IT'S INTERESTING TO ME THAT THIS IS A NEW HOUSE THAT HAS THAT BUILDING TYPE. IT'S JUST, IT'S IN AN EVOLUTIONARY WAY. IT JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE TO ME. IT'S A SHOTGUN LOT. BUT, UH, BUT WE COULD TALK FOREVER ABOUT ARCHITECTURE. UH, I DEFER TO THE MOTION. OKAY. WE HAVE A MOTION. A SECOND. MAY WE HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE? SABINA? AYE. VELAZQUEZ? AYE. MORALES? AYE. MAZUA. AYE. CARPENTER. AYE. GROUP. AYE. CERVANTES? YES. AND FETZER. AYE. MOTION PASSES. SO, MS. PARK, UM, AS YOU FURTHER DEVELOP THE, THE, UH, PLANS AND LOOK AT THESE STIPULATIONS, UH, FEEL FREE TO REACH OUT AND, AND REQUEST A DESIGN REVIEW COMMITTEE. UM, AND THERE MAY BE ISSUES THAT, UM, YOU FEEL STRONGLY ABOUT THAT, UH, YOU'D LIKE TO KEEP AS PRESENTED TODAY. SO, UH, JUST KEEP THAT IN MIND. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. AGENDA ITEM 22. AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 22 H D R C CASE 2022 DASH 3 3 2 26 EAST TWEACH AVENUE. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO REPLACE 19 EXISTING WOOD WINDOWS WITH NEW WOOD WINDOWS. YEAH, MY NAME'S RICHARD GARCIA. SORRY, RICHARD. I'M GONNA READ AJOUR OH, REALLY QUICK AND THEN I'LL LET YOU STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL BASED ON FINDINGS B THROUGH E STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT THE APPLICANT RESTORE THE DETERIORATED WOOD WINDOWS AND PRESERVE ALL ORIGINAL WINDOWS WINDOW OPENINGS. UM, SORRY. THE APP, THE CONTRACTOR, RICHARD GARCIA IS HERE, UH, TO SPEAK. YES, SIR. YEAH. MY NAME'S RICHARD GARCIA. I'M HERE TO REPRESENT THE OWNER IN NAV AT, UH, 2 26 ATCH FOR REPLACING THE OLD WOOD WINDOWS. UM, JUST FOR THE RECORD, I WAS THROWN IN HERE AS OF YESTERDAY. I DIDN'T KNOW I WAS SUPPOSED TO BE HERE. I WAS NOTIFIED THAT HE COULDN'T MAKE IT. SO I'M THE GENERAL CONTRACTOR ON THE JOB, AND WE'VE TAKEN THIS PROPERTY AND, UH, WE ACTUALLY GUTTED IT, AND IT'S NOW, I MEAN, A HUNDRED PERCENT UP TO CODE OF TODAY'S STANDARDS AS FAR AS WATER HEATERS, WIRING, PLUMBING, EXTREMELY SUFFICIENT, I THINK OVERLY DONE INSULATED. UM, EVEN THE AC UNITS WILL BE, UM, SIXTEENS HERE, BUT WHEN IT COMES TO THE WINDOWS FROM THE OUTSIDE, THEY LOOK FINE. I MEAN, THEY, THEY'RE BEING HELD TOGETHER BY STUCCO AND, AND SOME PAINT, AND THAT'S ABOUT IT. ON THE INSIDE YOU CAN SEE LIKE JUST THIS WINDOW RIGHT HERE. SO THE OLD FINGER JOINT JAMS ARE LITERALLY COMING APART. AND SO REDOING THOSE OR TRYING TO MEND THAT IS ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE. THE THREE UNITS HAVE BEEN VACANT FOR AT LEAST TWO YEARS THAT I KNOW OF, OR NO, SINCE, UM, 2018. ONLY ONE UNIT HAS BEEN OCCUPIED SINCE 2018, AND THAT WAS REDONE BY ANOTHER GENTLEMAN [03:05:01] BEFORE ME FOR THE OWNER. UM, I TOOK THESE PICTURES HERE THIS IS ONE OF THE WINDOWS THAT HAS THE PIECE MISSING OFF THE SIDE. AS YOU CAN SEE, REPLACING A PIECE OF FINGER JOINT IS IMPOSSIBLE TO DO. AND THEN THE WINDOWS ARE UNEVEN. SOME OF 'EM ARE JUST BROKEN. BUT LIKE THAT WINDOW RIGHT THERE, IF YOU LOOK AT THE BOTTOM JAM, YOU SEE HOW IT'S SEPARATED. AND THAT'S FROM THE OLD DAYS WHEN THEY SLAMMED THE WINDOWS, THE BOTTOM SILL SEPARATED. AND SO WHEN YOU TRY TO LIFT THAT UP OR GET IT TO GROW BACK WITH A CROWBAR, THE WINDOW'S BEEN DOWN AND THAT WAY SO LONG ON ONE OF 'EM, I ACTUALLY BROKE THE SILL. 'CAUSE IT WOULDN'T, IT WOULDN'T GO BACK UP. AND ALL OF THEM ARE LIKE THAT. I HAVE OTHER ILLUSTRATIONS OF THAT TOO, SO I, ALRIGHT. CAN OTHER, DOES HE HAVE OTHER PICTURES? SURE, I CAN JUST GO THROUGH THEM. SEE THAT HERE? OKAY. YEAH, LIKE, SO THIS WINDOW HERE, HERE'S A WINDOW FOR THE, THE WINDOW PANE. THE BOTTOM PIECE IS LIKE TOTALLY GONE. YOU CAN SEE WHERE THE WINDOW, I MEAN, I'M SURPRISED THE WINDOW'S JUST HANGING IN THERE. AND THAT'S THE UPPER OF THE ONE OVER ONE. AND THERE'S SEVERAL WINDOWS THAT ARE LIKE THAT. LIKE THIS ONE HERE, HERE'S ANOTHER WINDOW. AND THAT'S THE BOTTOM OF THE ONE OVER ONE WOOD, JUST ALMOST READY TO JUST FALL OFF. UM, AND THIS IS ANOTHER, JUST ANOTHER THREE OH WINDOW. SOME OF THESE, A COUPLE OF THESE STILL. THIS IS, UM, THE WINDOW THAT'S ON THE STAIRWAY. OF COURSE IT'S, WE DIDN'T MESS WITH THAT ONE, BUT THE TOP PIECE IS GONE. BUT LIKE I SAID, THE UNITS HAVE BEEN VACANT FOR LIKE, SINCE 2018. UH, THESE ARE THE BACK WINDOWS. I MEAN, THEY LOOK LIKE THEY CAN BE REBUILT, BUT THEY RATTLE, UH, TOTALLY INSUFFICIENT FOR ANYTHING, ANYTHING UP TO LIKE, WHAT WOULD BE TODAY'S STANDARDS FOR, UH, ENERGY EFFICIENT OR WHAT THEY CALL A FIVE STAR RATING. AND I BELIEVE WHAT, UM, NADAV IS PROPOSING IS HE'D LIKE TO ADD OR REPLACE THEM WITH WOOD WINDOWS, MARVIN WOOD WINDOWS, WHICH I BELIEVE I WAS TOLD BY A SUPPLIER THAT THEY ARE A APPROVED WINDOW FOR REPLACING. I'M NOT POSITIVE ABOUT THAT. THAT'S JUST WHAT I WAS TOLD. UM, BUT THEY WOULD BE WOOD WINDOWS, NOT A CLAD, AND THEY WOULD BE ONE OVER ONE. OF COURSE THE STAIRWAY WOULD BE TEMPERED GLASS AND THE BATHROOM WINDOWS WOULD BE TEMPERED, BUT THEY WOULD STILL BE ONE OVER ONE. SO THEY WOULD JUST ABOUT MATCH ALMOST EXACTLY LIKE WHAT'S THERE. AND WITH THE STUCCO, THE TRIM, EVERYTHING WOULD BE IDENTICAL ON THE OUTSIDE. OKAY. THANK YOU. YOU MENTIONED ONE APARTMENT HAD ALREADY BEEN DONE. WHAT DID THEY DO WITH THOSE WINDOWS? I HAVE NO IDEA. THE LADY BASICALLY REALLY JUST MOVED OUT TODAY. SO YOU DON'T KNOW IF THOSE ARE STILL UNIT? I HAVE NOT BEEN IN THAT UNIT WINDOWS. I HAVE NOT BEEN IN THAT UNIT. OKAY, THANK YOU. BUT I THINK THE, I THINK THE REASON THE OTHER WINDOWS ARE IN SUCH BAD SHAPE ALSO, 'CAUSE YOU CAN SEE WE HAVE SOME OF THEM BOARDED UP. SO THE THREE UNITS HAVE BEEN VACANT, VACANT SINCE 2018. I MEAN, WE'RE GETTING, UM, THE CITY'S ALREADY, UM, HOW WOULD YOU SAY, RE APARTMENT, THIS WHOLE SITUATION. SO THEY RE-ADDRESSED THEM. C P S IS BRINGING IN NEW METERS, NEW GAS LINES. SO IT'S GOOD THAT THE LADY'S GONE. 'CAUSE THEY'RE GONNA PUT IN ALL BRAND NEW METERS. AND ACTUALLY THE DOWNSTAIRS UNIT USED TO BE A LIVABLE APARTMENT AND WE'VE SINCE GOT RID OF THAT. NOW. IT'S WHAT THEY CALL AN S T R. IT'S JUST A STORE ROOM AND ALL IT'S GONNA HAVE IS AN ELECTRICITY METER FOR WHOEVER OWNS THE BUILDING TO PAY THAT BILL. SO, YOU KNOW, GETTING BACK TO THE WINDOWS, I THINK THE NEW WINDOWS WOULD ACTUALLY INCREASE THE ENERGY EFFICIENCY OF THE PLACE, PLUS THE LOOK INSIDE AND OUT. BUT LIKE THE WINDOWS THAT WOULD GO IN THERE BEING WOOD, IT WOULD LOOK EXACTLY LIKE THAT. OKAY. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. UM, QUESTIONS, COMMENTS FROM THE COMMISSION? QUICK QUESTION OF STAFF. HAVE YOU ALL BEEN OUT TO, UH, REVIEW THE CONDITION OF THE WINDOWS, UH, TO FORMULATE YOUR RECOMMENDATION? YES, I PERFORMED A SITE VISIT. UM, THIS WAS ONLY FROM THE EXTERIOR AND THE GROUND LEVEL, BUT JUST FROM LOOKING AT THEM IN THE PHOTOS THAT WERE SUBMITTED, THE, THE WINDOWS LOOK TO BE IN REPAIRABLE CONDITION. YEAH, I MEAN THAT'S, THAT'S MY IMPRESSION FROM JUST WHAT I'VE SEEN HERE. IS IT EASY? NO, NOT ALWAYS, BUT I DON'T THINK IT'S, IT'S, UH, SOMETHING THAT'S, THAT'S IMPOSSIBLE. AND SO THAT'S WHY I'M, I'M KIND OF QUESTIONING A WHOLESALE REPLACEMENT OF THE, OF THE WINDOWS, WHETHER THAT'S WARRANTED HERE. NOW YOU CAN REPLACE WITH THE MARVIN, BUT THAT'S ONLY WHEN THE WINDOWS ARE SO DETERIORATED, THEY CAN'T BE REHABILITATED, RIGHT? I MEAN, I'VE BEEN DOING THIS FOR 45 YEARS AND [03:10:02] THEY'RE BEYOND REPAIR IT. IF WE WERE TO REBUILD THE WINDOWS, IT WOULD COST THEM ALMOST AS MUCH AS HALF OF THE REMODEL WE'RE DOING. I MEAN, I'VE TALKED TO A WINDOW GUY AND UM, I FORGOT HIS NAME, BUT HE'S PRETTY POPULAR AND BACKED UP. BUT HE DOES 'EM ONE AT A TIME AND HE CAN'T, HE SAID THERE'S NO WAY, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, IT'S JUST NO WAY. WELL, UM, THAT, THAT'S PROBABLY ONE PERSON'S OPINION AND MINE IS, WELL, I MEAN, YOU KNOW, THEY CAN BE REBUILT. YEAH. RIGHT. I'M NOT GONNA SAY THEY CAN'T. IT WAS THE STREAM NUMBER ONE, THEY'RE NOT GONNA BE ENERGY EFFICIENT. YOU'RE NOT GONNA BE ABLE TO SEAL THE WINDOWS LIKE THEY HAVE THE ROPES. SO EVEN RIGHT NOW, THE ONES THAT STILL WILL GO UP AND DOWN, THEY RATTLE. I MEAN, WHEN IT, WHEN IT'S A WINDY DAY, THEY JUST RATTLE. SO HIM BRINGING IN THE R FACTOR FOR THE INSTALLATION THROUGH THE CEILING, SOUNDBOARD, BRAND NEW INSTALLATION, SHEET ROCK, EVERYTHING. AND THE NEW AC UNITS. I MEAN, IT DOESN'T MAKE THE UNIT ANY MORE ENERGY EFFICIENT. WELL, MANY OF THESE WINDOWS, UM, THE ONES THAT RATTLE PROBABLY DON'T HAVE ANY WEATHER STRIPPING. TRUE. AND WHICH WOULD GO A LONG WAY IN HELPING WITH THAT, UH, ENERGY EFFICIENCY. MM-HMM. , MS. SAVINA. YEAH. UM, I THINK CATCH YOUR LAST NAME. MY NAME'S GARCIA. RICHARD GARCIA GARCIA. MR. GARCIA, I'VE BEEN DOING THIS A LONG TIME. OKAY. AND, AND MY SPECIALTY, UM, I STARTED WAY BACK WORKING FOR GORDON HARTMAN AND I'VE, IN 86 I STARTED, OR 85 I STARTED DOING REMODELING. AND I'VE, I ACTUALLY, UM, SPECIALIZE IN OLD HOMES FROM ALL THE ONES THAT YOU'VE SEEN. YOU'VE PROBABLY SEEN A TON. WE'VE SEEN A LOT HERE ON THE COMMISSION AND DONE, UM, SITE VISITS. AND, UH, JUST FROM THE LOOKS OF THESE PHOTOS, THESE LOOK LIKE SOME OF THE BETTER ONES I'VE SEEN. WELL, FROM THE OUTSIDE THEY LOOK FINE, OR EVEN FROM THE INSIDE. AND I THINK, UM, WHAT YOU'LL FIND, AND WHAT WE USUALLY FIND IS NOT ALL WINDOWS REQUIRE THE SAME AMOUNT OF ATTENTION, TIME, RESOURCES. SOME OF THESE COULD PROBABLY JUST BE CLEANED UP, SANDED COAT OF PAINT, WEATHER STRIPPING. SEE, WHEN YOU PUT THE TRIM BACK UP, THEN YOU SEAL IT. AND THAT KEEPS OUT A GOOD AMOUNT OF THE DRAFT. ALSO, USUALLY YOUR MEETING RAILS ARE THE AREA THAT GETS THE RATTLING. RIGHT. AND THAT'S PRIME PLACE FOR WEATHER STRIPPING. UM, AND A COAT OF PAINT. I THINK YOU HAVE A COUPLE OF, LOOKS LIKE A COUPLE OF SASHES THAT REQUIRE REBUILDING. WELL, THERE'S MORE THAN A COUPLE OF THEM PLUS THE, UM, THE SILLS. BUT THE SILLS, THESE WINDOWS ARE NOT MADE TO HAVE WEATHER STRIPPING. LIKE WHEN YOU PUT THE TRIM ON AND PUT 'EM TOGETHER, THEY'RE, THEY WERE NOT DESIGNED EVER TO HAVE ANY KIND OF WEATHER STRIPPING. THEIR WINDOWS WERE MADE TO GO WOOD ON WOOD, SLIDE UP AND DOWN. YOU CAN PUT METAL CLIP STRIPPING, UH, YOU CAN PUT THE BRASS STRIP IN. YES. THAT'S, IT'S REALLY THAT, I MEAN, THAT'S OLD SCHOOL, BUT IT, IT'S MAGICAL TOO. IT WORKS WONDERS. IT, IT MAY STOP THE RATTLING, BUT I DON'T BELIEVE IT'S GONNA STOP THE, THE ACTUAL AIR FROM COMING THROUGH. 'CAUSE YOU CAN DO THE SIDES, BUT WHERE THE WINDOWS COME TOGETHER ACROSS, HOW DO YOU FEEL THAT? SO I'M JUST SAYING, I MEAN, I'M NOT, YEAH, I'M NOT TRYING TO BANDY WORDS OR, OR, OR, YOU KNOW, I'M JUST VOICING AN OPINION BECAUSE LIKE I SAID, I'VE DONE THIS A LOT OF TIME. YEAH. THEY, UM, I DON'T KNOW IF OTHERS WOULD LIKE TO SITE VISIT. YEAH, NO, I THINK, UM, I MEAN, I THINK MR. GARCIA AND I KIND OF AGREE WITH COMMISSIONER SAVINA AND KNOW MANY OF THOSE WINDOWS, AND I DO PUT WITH A STRIP IN BETWEEN, AND IT KEEPS 'EM FROM MOVING SOME HOMES THAT WE'VE SEEN HERE, UH, ON THE COMMISSION AS WELL. SOME WINDOW PROJECTS. THEY'VE BEEN ABLE TO ALSO JUST DO THE WINDOW INSERTS FROM THE INSIDE THAT HAS KEPT THEM FROM, YOU KNOW, HAVING TO, I THINK WHAT WE WANT IS PRIORITY IS PRESERVATION OF THE OLD WINDOWS. IT'S REALLY GOOD WOOD. THEY, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE, THERE'VE BEEN THERE FOR OVER A HUNDRED YEARS. UM, I WOULD SAY THAT, YOU KNOW, NOW KIND OF WHERE AT LEAST SOME OF THESE COMMISSIONERS STAND ON WINDOW MM-HMM. REPLACEMENT. WE COULD DO A SITE VISIT AND WE COULD SAY, WE COULD KIND OF RUN THROUGH YOU BY ONE BY ONE AND SEE WHICH WINDOWS COULD BE REPLACED, IF THAT'S EVEN AN INTEREST FOR THE OWNER. BECAUSE AS WE SEE, I DON'T THINK THERE'S A, THERE'S A OPTION FOR 19 WINDOWS. SO IS THE ONO BEN TO MAYBE CHANGING FIVE WINDOWS? NO. I MEAN, IF, IF YOU WANTED TO COME AND DO A SIDE VISIT, I MEAN, I, I BELIEVE THERE WAS A MEETING SCHEDULED BEFORE THIS ONE AND SOMEBODY CAME OUT TO THE JOB. WELL, I WASN'T AWARE OF THAT. THIS WOULD BE A MEETING WHERE AT LEAST TWO OR THREE OF THIS COMMISSION AND STAFF WOULD COME BACK. FINE. THAT WOULD BE FINE. AND I COULD ACTUALLY GET, BRING A, I COULD SEE IF I COULD BRING A SAMPLE WINDOW OF WHAT WE ARE RECOMMENDING TO REPLACE. BECAUSE ALSO JUST, NOT JUST THE PART ABOUT REBUILDING THE WINDOWS OR RE REFURBISHING THOSE WINDOWS. WE'RE LOOKING AT THE ENERGY EFFICIENCY [03:15:01] OF MAKING THE UNIT UP TO TODAY'S CODE. GIVE IT AT A FAR STAR RATING. I MEAN THE, THE HOMEOWNER'S INVESTING A LOT OF MONEY, UH, TO BRING IT AND MAKE IT A REALLY NICE PLACE. I MEAN, LEVEL FIVE SHEET ROCK, NEW FLOORING, CABINETS, EVERYTHING. AND SO THE NEW WINDOWS WOULD BE A PLUS. PLUS THEY WOULD BE OLD WIN, UH, WOOD WINDOWS INSIDE AND OUT, AND THEY WOULD ACTUALLY MIMIC WHAT YOU HAVE. AND IF HE GOES WITH THE DARK PAINT ON THE OUTSIDE, YOU WOULDN'T EVEN KNOW THAT THEY WERE REPLACED. MR. CHAIR, I, I'D LIKE TO, TO TRY TO COMMUNICATE SOMETHING TO THE, TO THE CONTRACTOR. OH, THERE HE IS. SIR. SIR. SORRY, I'M TRYING, I WANNA MAKE SURE THAT, THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT THERE'S NOT A GRAY AREA, RIGHT? WE'VE HAD A LOT OF CASES COME BEFORE US AND A LOT OF A, A LOT OF APPLICANTS HAVE MADE, UM, YOU KNOW, ARGUMENTS FOR ENERGY EFFICIENCY, AND I HAVE NOT SEEN IT PERSONALLY AS A, AS A PRIORITY IN ANY WAY, SHAPE OR FORM REALLY WITH RESPECT TO WINDOWS. SO THE BEST I'VE SEEN IS, UH, YOU KNOW, THERE'S A LOT OF KNOWLEDGE ON THE COMMISSION AND THEY HAVE, UM, WORKED PROJECTS WHERE THEY PUT INSULATED GLASS REPLACEMENT OF THE SINGLE PANE, HISTORIC GLASS, UH, NOTHING THAT DEALS WITH, UM, YOU KNOW, THE TRANSFERENCE OF ENERGY. BUT, BUT JUST SO YOU KNOW, THE, THE ENERGY EFFICIENCY HAS NOT REALLY, UH, DIALOGUE HAS NOT REALLY REACHED THE OFFICE OF PRESERVATION. WHAT, WHAT DOES TOUCH US WITH RESPECT TO THAT IS WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE WOOD, I THINK WE TALK ABOUT THAT THE WOOD IS THERE AND THE WOOD IS GOOD, BUT I THINK MORE IT'S ABOUT THE, THE, THE, THE, THE NON-RENEWABLE RESOURCES, RIGHT? THAT, THAT IT, THAT A WINDOW THAT EXISTS IS A, IS A TREE THAT DOESN'T GET CUT DOWN THEORETICALLY. RIGHT? SO IN THAT THERE'S SOME ATTENTION TOWARD, UM, YOU KNOW, UM, A A, UH, UH, UH, A CULTURE OF WASTE VERSUS, UM, VALUING EXISTING, UM, ARTIFACTS, RIGHT? OR EXISTING PIECES OF BUILDINGS. SO I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT A A AS YOU MAKE THAT ARGUMENT, THAT YOU, THAT ARGUMENT'S PROBABLY GONNA FALL ON DEAF EARS, RIGHT? NO, I MEAN, THAT'S FINE. I MEAN, I, I'M JUST, LIKE I SAID, I GOT THROWN INTO THIS YESTERDAY. I MEAN NO, NO, I, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT THIS, I MEAN, HE TEXTED ME AND SAID, YOU'RE ON THE LIST. YOU'VE GOTTA GO SIT DOWN AND HAVE A CONVERSATION WITH SOMEBODY THAT YOU'RE ABLE TO DELIVER TO THEM. NOT JUST THAT, THAT IT, THAT IT ISN'T A MATTER OF WHETHER OR NOT, YOU KNOW, UH, YOU KNOW, DON'T THEY CARE ABOUT ENERGY EFFICIENCY? I, SO I, I'M SURE THAT IN ONE WAY OR ANOTHER, EVERYBODY ON THE CUP MACHINE CARESS ABOUT ENERGY EFFICIENCY. BUT THE SOLUTIONS YOU'RE GONNA FIND HERE ARE MORE LIKELY TO SUGGEST THE TYPE OF GLASS THAT YOU'RE USING. AND EVEN IF YOU BRING IN USING A TAPE ON THE WINDOW, THAT'S PROBABLY NOT EVEN GONNA BE APPROPRIATE. IT'S PROBABLY GONNA BE MORE OF WHAT TYPE OF RETROFIT THESE WINDOWS CAN DO. BUT I, I, I, I'M INTERESTED, I DON'T KNOW IF COMMISSIONER GROUP WANTED TO DIVE IN A LITTLE DEEPER ON WHAT SHE WAS SUGGESTING WITH RESPECT TO, UH, A, A VISIT AND THEN, UM, YOU KNOW, WHAT, WHAT WINDOWS ARE ABSOLUTELY. IN NEED OF REPLACEMENT AND WHAT WINDOWS ABSOLUTELY WOULD BE, NEED TO BE, UH, UH, REFURBISHED. I JUST WANT TO JUST SHARE THIS CONVERSATION. YOU, THANK YOU, SIR. THANK YOU FOR THE TIME, MR. CHAIR. OKAY. YEAH, I MEAN, I'M OPEN TO A VISIT. I MEAN, IF SOMEBODY WANTS TO, WOULD LIKE TO COME AND WALK THROUGH THE, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, DOES, DOES THE CHAIRMAN, DOES THE OWNER HAVE A REQUIREMENT IF HE'S GOING TO MAKE APARTMENTS OR RENTAL UNITS OUT OF THESE RIGHT. AN APARTMENTS? YES. DOES HE HAVE A REQUIREMENT, HE OR SHE HAVE A REQUIREMENT FOR A SAFETY STANDARD, PARTICULARLY FOR WINDOWS ON THE SECOND FLOOR, THAT THEY'RE NOT BRITTLE OR FALLING THROUGH OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT? I MEAN, WELL, THE WINDOWS, I MEAN, THEY ARE PRETTY BRITTLE. I MEAN, THAT'S ONE THING. I MEAN, THEY, SOME OF 'EM, LIKE IN THE PICTURE, SOME OF 'EM YOU CAN'T REALLY REPAIR. I MEAN, YOU JUST CAN'T DO IT. UM, YOU KNOW, GETTING 'EM BACK TOGETHER, LIKE I SAID, THE OUTSIDE, THEY'RE BEING HELD TOGETHER, YOU KNOW, BY STUCCO AND PAINT. BUT ON THE INSIDE, SOME OF 'EM WERE PRETTY BEAT UP, YOU KNOW? AND YEAH, THEY'VE BEEN DAMAGED AND VANDALIZED. UM, UM, SO I MEAN, I WAS JUST HERE TO TELL, YOU KNOW, TELL THE STORY. I MEAN, A LOT OF THESE PICTURES HE HAD, I MEAN, HE FILLED THIS OUT AND SUBMITTED IT. UM, BUT I, I HAD TOLD HIM ABOUT SOME OF THE WINDOWS THAT NEEDED TO BE REDONE, THAT THEY WERE JUST IMPOSSIBLE TO, UH, REDO MR. CHAIRMAN, I WOULD, YES, SIR, I WOULD, UH, MOVE FOR THIS CASE TO BE REFERRED TO A D R C TO REVIEW THE CONDITION OF THE, OF THE WINDOWS. UH, SO WE CAN, YOU KNOW, SEE IF THERE IS A SELECTIVE REMOVAL OR, UM, WHETHER THEY ARE, UH, CONDITION THAT CAN BE REHABILITATED. AND JUST WOULD ALSO ADD, SINCE THIS, IT GOES OUT TO THE WORLD HERE, THAT, UH, THE OFFICE OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION IS VERY MUCH IN SUPPORT OF SUSTAINABILITY. AND THAT HISTORIC PRESERVATION IN ITSELF IS A SUSTAINABLE ACT. AND THAT, UH, YOU'RE SUSTAINING NOT ONLY CULTURE, MEMORY, AND UNIQUENESS OF PLACE, BUT ALSO, UH, THE MATERIALS AND THE, AND [03:20:01] THE, THE, THE RESOURCES OF THE PLANET. THANK YOU, SIR. I'LL SECOND THAT ENTIRE MOTION AND STATEMENT. WELL, THAT'S WHY ONE OF THE THINGS WE WERE LOOKING AT WHEN WE WERE INVESTIGATING BEING ABLE TO CHANGE OUT THE WINDOWS, WAS GOING WITH A ALL WOOD WINDOW AND NOT A CLAD WINDOW, BECAUSE IT WOULD GIVE IT THE SAME LOOK. AND IF YOU PAINTED IT THE DEEP BROWN LIKE IT IS RIGHT NOW, YOU WOULDN'T, YOU WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO TELL THAT THEY WERE, THEY WERE REPLACED. OKAY. THANK YOU. UM, YOU HAVE A MOTION? A SECOND. MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE? BEFORE WE DO A MOTION? I JUST WANNA CLARIFY, IT'S A D R C SITE VISIT? YES. ALL RIGHT. PERFECT. UM, SINA AYE. VELASQUEZ AYE. MORALES? AYE. MASUKA. AYE. CARPENTER? AYE. GROUP. AYE. ANTE? YES. AND FED? AYE. MOTION PASSES. THANK YOU, SIR. THANK YOU. STAFF WILL GO WITH YOU AND SCHEDULE THAT MEETING. AGENDA ITEM 23. AGENDA ITEM 23, H D R C, CASE NUMBER 2022 DASH 1 3 0 3 34 WEST ELSMERE PLACE. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR FINAL APPROVAL TO ONE, MODIFY THE FRONT PORCH TO INCLUDE A LARGER FOOTPRINT AND LOW WALLS. TWO, CONSTRUCT A ONE STORY REAR ADDITION WITH ATTACHED UNCOVERED DECK. THREE. MODIFY THE REAR ACCESSORY STRUCTURE TO INCLUDE THE REMOVAL OF TWO WALLS AND THE CONSTRUCTION OF A SECOND STORY. ADDITION. STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF ITEM ONE. MODIFICATION OF THE FRONT PORCH BASED ON FINDING C. STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT THE APPLICANT RETAINS THE EXISTING FOOT FRONT PORCH CONFIGURATION. TWO. STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF ITEM TWO, CONSTRUCTION OF A REAR ADDITION ON THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE STRUCTURE BASED ON FINDINGS D THROUGH I WITH THE FOLLOWING STIPULATIONS, ONE THAT THE APPLICANT SALVAGE AND REUSED THE WINDOWS TO BE REMOVED FOR THE REAR ADDITION. AS NOTED IN FINDINGS D AND H TWO, THAT THE APPLICANT PROVIDES CLEAR MEASURED DIMENSIONAL DRAWINGS THAT CLEARLY CONVEY WHAT WILL BE RETAINED AND WHAT ELEMENTS ARE NEW FOR THE ADDITION. THREE. STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF ITEM THREE, MODIFICATION OF THE REAR ACCESSORY STRUCTURE BASED ON FINDING J WITH THE FOLLOWING STIPULATIONS. ONE THAT THE APPLICANT PROVIDES CLEAR MEASURED DIMENSIONAL DRAWINGS THAT CLEARLY CONVEY WHAT WILL BE RETAINED AND WHAT ELEMENTS ARE NEW FOR THE A D U TWO THAT THE APPLICANT SUBMIT A LINE OF SIGHT STUDY FOR THE A D U THAT SHOWS THE COMPARATIVE HEIGHT OF THE A D U AND THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE. UM, THE APPLICANT, TOM KREVI, IS JOINING US VIRTUALLY. I'M SORRY, ONE MOMENT. MR. KREVI, ARE YOU THERE? YOU MIGHT NEED TO UNMUTE. GOOD AFTERNOON. CAN YOU HEAR ME? YES. GREAT. GOOD AFTERNOON, COMMISSIONERS. I'M TOM KREVI. I'M REPRESENTING THE OWNERS FOR THIS PROJECT. WE ARE SEEKING FINAL APPROVAL AND ARE SATISFIED WITH STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS TWO AND THREE AND WOULD LIKE TO DISCUSS RECOMMENDATION ONE FURTHER, WHICH IS, UH, FOR THE FRONT PORCH. UH, THE OWNERS ARE HOPING TO FIND A PORCH SOLUTION, WHICH WILL ENABLE THEM TO SIT IN THE FRONT OF THEIR HOME AND ENJOY THE NEIGHBORHOOD. OUR GOAL IS TO ATTAIN A DESIGN WHICH IS CONSISTENT WITH THE STYLE OF THE EXISTING HOME AND IS COMPATIBLE WITH THE NEIGHBORHOOD. UH, WE BASED OUR UNCOVERED PORCH DESIGN ON A SIMILAR NEIGHBORING HOME. IT IS CONSISTENT WITH SEVERAL OTHER HOMES IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD AS WELL. AND THIS IS SHOWN ON, UH, EXHIBIT B. UM, YEAH, THERE WE GO. PERFECT. UH, SO THESE ARE SOME OTHER HOMES IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD, UM, WHICH, UH, YOU KNOW, IF I PUT THE, THE FRONT PHOTO OF THE FRONT OF THE PROJECT HOME NEXT TO, ESPECIALLY THAT 3 22 WEST ELSMERE, IT LOOKS ALMOST IDENTICAL. UH, SO THIS, UH, FRONT PORCH WAS DISCUSSED EXTENSIVELY AT D R C ON MARCH 8TH AND AT H D R C ON APRIL 6TH. UH, AT WHICH TIME WE RECEIVED IT WAS A GOOD DISCUSSION. WE RECEIVED SOME GREAT FEEDBACK AND [03:25:01] WE RECEIVED PRELIMINARY APPROVAL AT THAT H D R C. BASED ON THESE DISCUSSIONS, THE PORCH WAS PULLED BACK FROM THE SIDE WALLS. UH, SO LET'S SEE. IT'S, UH, PERFECT. SO IF YOU LOOK AT, UM, THE STREET VIEW, UH, THAT'S BEING SHOWN RIGHT NOW, UH, THE PORCH WAS PULLED BACK FROM THE SIDEWALLS TO MAKE IT SUBSERVIENT TO THE HOUSE FORM. SO THE HOUSE FORMS NOW PREDOMINANT, UH, STAIRS WERE INCLUDED ON BOTH SIDES AT THE HOUSE FACADE TO REDUCE, UH, DAMAGE TO THE ORIGINAL SIDING AND THE MATERIALS WERE SPECIFIED. UM, SO BASED ON THESE PREVIOUS DISCUSSIONS AND THE INFORMATION PRESENTED HERE, WE'RE HOPING TO COMMISSION THIS FRONT PORCH DESIGN. AND THAT CONCLUDES MY COMMENTS. THANK YOU. YES, I WAS IN A D R C WITH THIS CASE, AND, UH, WE JUST LOOKED AT THE OTHER HOUSES ON THE, ON THE BLOCK AND IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD THAT ARE SIMILAR STYLE, UH, WITH A SIMILAR, UM, UNCOVERED FRONT PORCH, UH, SIMILAR TO WHAT'S BEING PROPOSED HERE. AND WE DID DISCUSS PULLING IT BACK FROM THE CORNERS OF THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE SO THAT THE FRONT FACADE READS INTACT AND THAT THE PORCH IS MORE OR LESS, UM, NOT FREESTANDING, BUT, BUT ISOLATED FROM, UM, THE FRONT FACADE OF THE, THE, UH, OF THE BUILDING. QUESTIONS AND COMMENTS? UM, COMMISSIONER SINO? YEAH. BEING PART OF THE D R C MEETINGS, I THINK THE SOLUTION REALLY IS VERY APPROPRIATE, SENSITIVELY DONE, ESPECIALLY SINCE THERE'S NO ROOF OVERHANG MODIFICATION. SO I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION THAT WE ACCEPT, UM, THE PROPOSAL. HOW DO WE DO THIS WITH THE, WITH THE, UH, UH, STAFF DENIAL? WE SUPPORT ITEM NUMBER ONE, NUMBER TWO, AND NUMBER THREE WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS FOR TWO AND THREE. SECOND, WE HAVE A MOTION A SECOND. ANY DISCUSSION? YE YES, SIR. MR. CHAIR, I, I'M WONDERING IF A PICTURE CAN BE PROVIDED FOR THE ALTERATION OF THE FRONT, UM, OR, OR THE BEST, THE BEST ELEVATION FOR THE, UM, FOR WHAT IS PRE, UH, PRESENTED FOR THE FRONT. IT'S FUNNY BECAUSE THIS IS KIND OF THE POINT I WAS MAKING TO THE YOUNG LADY EARLIER THAT THAT FELT THE NEED TO PUT A, YOU KNOW, A PORCH ON A BUILDING THAT IT'S NOT DESIGNED TO HAVE A PORCH, DESIGNED TO HAVE A PORCH. RIGHT. UM, SO THE STREET FACING FACADE, RIGHT? I I SEE IT ON THE, I GUESS IT'S IMAGE STREET. YEAH, IT'S IN THE BLUE THERE, STREET FACING FACADE. NOW IT, IS IT CORRECT TO SAY THAT NOTHING IS HAPPENING AT THE DOOR OR AT THE ROOF? YES, THAT'S CORRECT. OKAY. SO, SO NOW WHEN WE'RE LOOKING AT THE BRICK, RIGHT, THE, THE, THE BRICK, UM, THE DETAILS ON THE STEPS THAT'LL REMAIN AND, AND THEN IT'LL BE EXPANDED TO THE LEFT AND TO THE RIGHT. THAT'S CORRECT. AND IT'LL BE COVERED BY, BY A LOW, KIND OF LIKE WHAT MIGHT APPEAR TO BE A GARDEN WALL. I MEAN IT BE, UH, THE PERIMETER. YES. THERE'LL BE A LOW WALL AT THE PERIMETER. SO THE LOW WALL IS GONNA RISE ABOVE THAT BRICK LINE. ABOUT HOW HIGH? UH, APPROXIMATELY 12 TO 16 INCHES. OKAY. SO THEN I GUESS WE CAN COUNT THE, THE NUMBERS OF BOARDS. SO YOU'RE A COUPLE OF BOARDS BELOW THE WINDOW. UM, YEAH. UH, MY, MY, MY, UH, COMPLIMENTS TO THE D R C AND TO Y'ALL A WONDERFUL SOLUTION WITHOUT ALTERING, UH, THAT, THAT FRONT FACADE IS THAT, THAT'S ALWAYS BEEN, UM, UM, YOU KNOW, A, A LOVE OF MY WIFE AND I, WE DRIVE AROUND AND, AND LOOK FOR THESE CONDITIONS, UH, WHERE THERE'S A WALL AND THEN YOU HAVE TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO DO AN ENTRY AND YOU'RE NOT ALLOWED TO HAVE A PORCH, RIGHT? UH, SO THIS IS WHAT IS WHAT WHAT IS ORIGINAL IS REALLY, REALLY BEAUTIFUL. BUT WHAT, WHAT YOU ALL ARE, UM, UH, PRESENTING IS, UH, UH, COMPLIMENT TO IT AS WELL. SO THANK YOU. THANK YOU FOR LETTING ME HAVE THAT TIME. I JUST WANTED TO MAKE IT. OH, THANK YOU. THANK YOU FOR YOUR COMMENTS. THANK YOU. UH, WE HAVE A MOTION, A SECOND AND HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE. SINA AYE. VELASQUEZ. AYE. MORALES? AYE. ZUKA. AYE. CARPENTER. AYE. GROUP. AYE ES? YES. AND BUD? AYE. MOTION PASSES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU. AGENDA ITEM 24. [03:30:12] ITEM 24 ON THE AGENDA, H D R C, CASE NUMBER 2022 DASH 2 53 1 32 EAST MAGNOLIA AVENUE. THE APPLICANT REQUESTS A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL, APPROVAL TO DEMOLISH A REAR ONE STORY PORCH ON THE HOUSE. CONSTRUCT A ONE STORY REAR ADDITION, DEMOLISHED THE DETACHED REAR ONE STORY CARPORT AND LIVING QUARTERS. CONSTRUCTED A TWO STORY REAR DETACHED BUILDING. STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF ITEM ONE, DEMOLITION OF THE REAR ONE. STORY PORCH BASED ON FINDING B. STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF ITEM TWO, CONSTRUCTION OF A ONE STORY REAR EDITION BASED ON FINDING C AND D WITH THE FOLLOWING STIPULATIONS. UH, ONE THAT THE PROPOSED SIDING MATCH EXISTING AND MATERIAL AND DIMENSIONS, TWO, THAT ANY WINDOWS REMOVED BE INCORPORATED INTO THE NEW ADDITION. THREE, THAT NEW WINDOWS MATCH EXISTING WINDOWS AND MATERIAL AND DIMENSIONS. FOUR, THAT THE APPLICANT SEPARATE THE REAR DOOR AND WINDOWS SO THAT THE SIDING IS VISIBLE BETWEEN THE DOOR AND WINDOW TRIM. FIVE, THAT THE APPLICANT USE A MORE TRADITIONAL CONFIGURATION SUCH AS ONE OVER ONE FOR THE WINDOW NEXT TO THE REAR DOOR, AND SIX, THAT THE NEW ROOF BE CLAD AND COMPOSITION SHINGLE STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF ITEM THREE, DEMOLITION OF THE DETACHED REAR ONE STORY CARPORT AND LIVING QUARTERS. BASED ON FINDINGS E THROUGH H, THE APPLICANT HAS NOT MADE A CASE FOR LOSS OF INTEGRITY OR UNREASONABLE ECONOMIC HARDSHIP THAT WOULD WARRANT FULL DEMOLITION OF THE FUTURE. STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT THE APPLICANT FURTHER EXPLORE RETENTION OR INCORPORATION OF THE EXISTING STRUCTURE INTO THE PROPOSED DWELLING UNIT. SHOULD THE COMMISSION FIND THE CONDITIONS REQUIRED FOR APPROVAL OF DEMO DEMOLITION HAVE BEEN MET, STAFF RECOMMENDS THE FOLLOWING STIPULATIONS FOR ITEM FOUR CONSTRUCTION OF A TWO-STORY REAR DETACHED BUILDING. ONE THAT THE APPLICANT PROPOSED ROOF EAVES CONSISTENT WITH THOSE PREDOMINANTLY FOUND ON THE BLOCK, CONSISTENT WITH THE GUIDELINES THAT THE APPLICANT PROPOSES WINDOW PROFILES THAT HAVE MORE TRADITIONAL PROPORTIONS OF AND OTHERWISE MEET STANDARD SPECIFICATIONS FOR WINDOWS AND ADDITIONS AND NEW CONSTRUCTION THAT THE APPLICANT PROPOSED. REDUCED AREAS OF ARTIFICIAL TURF FOR THE, FOR WATER PERMEABILITY AND OPPORTUNITIES FOR NATURAL PLANTINGS. CONSISTENT WITH THE GUIDELINES WE HAVE THE APPLICANT, ALAN NEFF. THANK YOU JESSICA. UH, GOOD EVENING COMMISSIONERS. THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE AND EXPERTISE AND THOUGHTFULNESS. I'VE, I ALWAYS ENJOY SITTING HERE. UM, MY NAME IS ALAN NEFF, UM, ARCHITECT 36 SQUARE, UH, REPRESENTING MY CLIENTS AT 1 3 2 EAST MAGNOLIA. UM, THERE'S MULTIPLE PARTS TO THIS AS JESSICA JUST JUST DESCRIBED, AND IT'S BEEN A LONG PROCESS SO FAR. UM, MY CLIENTS BOUGHT THIS EXISTING HOME A FEW YEARS AGO. IT WAS A FLIP JOB THAT SAT ON THE MARKET A LONG TIME BEFORE THEY BOUGHT IT. UM, AND IT SAT ON THE MARKET A LONG TIME, PROBABLY BECAUSE OF WHAT THEY DID TO IT WHEN THEY FLIPPED IT, UH, NOT GETTING H D R C APPROVAL FOR THE WORK THEY DID. AND, UH, THE, BASICALLY THE WORK THAT WAS DONE, UH, LEFT A LOT TO BE DESIRED, BUT THEY LOVED THE LOCATION AND LOVED THE HOME. UH, AND THEY'RE MAKING DO WITH THE INTERIORS. UH, BUT THEY FOUND THAT IT'S JUST SO CHOPPED APART PROBABLY FROM BEING MULTIPLE APARTMENTS OVER THE YEARS, UM, THAT THE FLOOR PLANS DON'T WORK. THE ROOM SIZES AREN'T THAT GREAT FOR THEM. SO, UH, THEY'VE DECIDED TO MAKE THE DOWNSTAIRS BEDROOM IN THE BACK, THEIR MASTER BEDROOM. UM, BUT IT'S REALLY NOT SIZED THE WAY THEY WANT IT TO BE. SO WE'RE LOOKING AT AN ADDITION TO THE REAR. UM, SO AS YOU CAN SEE, THIS IS A SOMEWHAT GRAND TWO STORY HOUSE. MAYBE NOT GRAND FOR MONTEVISTA, BUT, UH, STILL LARGE, ALMOST 3000 SQUARE FEET. UH, MOST OF THE HOUSES ON THE BLOCK ARE TWO STORIES, SOME ARE THREE STORIES LIKE THE HOUSE TO THE RIGHT. UM, COULD YOU GO TO THE NEXT SLIDE, PLEASE? UH, SO THIS, UH, A LATER PART OF THE OPTIONS OR THE PRESENTATIONS IS THIS IS THE EXISTING CARPORT, UH, THAT IS BACK THERE. IT WAS KIND OF PRETTY MUCH RECONSTRUCTED IN ITS ENTIRETY DURING THE FLIP WITHOUT H D R C OR H P O GUIDANCE. UH, BUT I GUESS IT GOT AFTER THE FACT APPROVAL. UM, IT'S COMPLETELY REBUILT. UM, DOESN'T HAVE A FOUNDATION, UM, DOESN'T SERVE ANY PURPOSE FOR MY CLIENTS BECAUSE THEY DON'T PARK THERE AND DON'T INTEND TO. UH, NEXT SLIDE. SO THIS IS THE EXISTING REAR OF THE HOUSE, AN EXISTING SITE PLAN. UM, THAT REAR PORCH THAT IS THERE WAS BUILT AT THE TIME OF THE FLIP IS NOT ORIGINAL, ACTUALLY THE WHOLE BEDROOM AND LAUNDRY ROOM THAT IS KIND OF SHOWN IN THAT IMAGE. THAT WAS ALL IN ADDITION AT SOME POINT IN TIME, BUT [03:35:01] THAT'S A LONG AGO ADDITION, WHICH IS COMMON ON THESE HOUSES. UM, NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. UH, HERE ARE JUST SOME EXISTING ELEVATIONS SHOWING THAT REAR PORCH AND BASICALLY THE MASSING OF THE HOUSE LEAVING A LOT TO BE DESIRED. NEXT SLIDE, PLEASE. UH, THIS IS THE PROPOSED, UH, RECONSTRUCTION OR ADDITION OF THE MAIN HOUSE. SO ADDING A APPROXIMATELY 220 SQUARE FOOT ADDITION TO THE REAR THAT IS SIX INCHES DEEPER THAN THE EXISTING PORCH THAT'S THERE. UM, AND THEN CREATING A SQUARE PORCH THAT CONNECTS TO THE EXISTING LAUNDRY ROOM, WHICH IS THE REAR ENTRANCE TO THE HOUSE, AND PROVIDING A REAR ENTRANCE THROUGH THE MASTER. UM, I'M PROPOSING A MORE SQUARE, MORE TRADITIONAL REAR PORCH, RATHER THAN THE, THE STRANGE ANGLE THAT THEY CREATED IN ORDER TO DRIVE THROUGH AND PARK THEIR CARS, UH, OR AN ASSUMPTION OF THAT. UM, NEXT SLIDE, PLEASE. THESE SHOW THE REVISED ELEVATIONS WITH, UM, NOT IN THE BOTTOM. YOU CAN SEE THE REAR OF THE ADDITION WITH THE PORCH AND THE ROOF THAT COVERS ALL OF THOSE. UH, EVERYTHING IS BEING DONE TO PROTECT THAT MASSIVE TREE THAT'S, UH, STILL THERE. WE'RE STAYING ABOUT THE SAME DISTANCE FROM IT WITH THE PLANNED ADDITION AS THE EXISTING PORCH WAS. UM, NEXT SLIDE, PLEASE. UH, THERE'S A PHOTO OF THE REAR OF THE HOME AS IT IS TODAY. UH, NEXT SLIDE. ANOTHER ONE THAT JUST SHOWS THE WHOLE THING, BUT IT'S PRETTY DARK. NEXT SLIDE. UH, THIS AGAIN IS THAT, UH, REAR CARPORT. AND YOU CAN SEE AT THE HOME NEXT DOOR, THEY JUST FINISHED CONSTRUCTION OF A NEW ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT WITH A GARAGE. UH, AND I'LL TALK MORE ABOUT THAT AS WE GET INTO THAT. ONE. NEXT SLIDE, PLEASE. SO, PART TWO OR THREE, DEPENDING, I GUESS WE HAVE THE DEMOLITION OF EXISTING MAIN HOUSE ELEMENTS. THEN WE HAVE THE PROPOSED ADDITION TO THE MAIN HOUSE. THEN WE HAVE DEMOLITION OF THE CARPORT AS REQUEST THREE. UM, SO AS YOU CAN SEE, THIS IS JUST A PHOTO LOOKING UP INTO THE STRUCTURE. THE ROOF STRUCTURE, IT'S COMPLETELY MODIFIED. THERE ARE SOME OLD BOARDS. THE ROOF JOISTS ARE MOSTLY ORIGINAL, UH, BUT THE TRUSS BRACING THAT WAS BUILT IS NEW. UH, THERE'S O SS B DECKING ON TOP OF SOME OF THE OLD KIND OF ROTTED PURLINS FROM THE ORIGINAL. UM, ALL. OH, NEXT SLIDE. THIS IS THE STORAGE ROOM THAT JESSICA SAID WAS SERVANTS QUARTERS. UM, I FEEL SORRY FOR THE SERVANTS BECAUSE IT'S REALLY TINY. NO PLUMBING, NO ELECTRICITY. UM, IT'S COMPLETELY RECONSTRUCTED. ALL THE WALLS STUDS ARE NEW. THE DOOR IS NEW. THE WINDOWS APPEAR TO BE SALVAGED FROM SOMEWHERE 'CAUSE THEY ARE OLDER WOOD WINDOWS, BUT THEY DON'T APPEAR TO BE A HUNDRED YEARS OLD. UM, NEXT SLIDE HERE. JUST A CLOSEUP OF THAT KIND OF DENTAL MOLDING THAT GOES ABOVE THE CARPORT. YOU CAN SEE THOSE ARE JUST MODERN TWO BY EIGHTS SANDWICHED TOGETHER WITH SOME MODERN PINE. JUST CUT TO MAKE THE DENTAL MOLDING. IT'S RECREATED. IT'S NOT ORIGINAL. NEXT SLIDE. UH, THIS IS THE DOOR INTO THE STORAGE ROOM. IT STILL HAS THE, YOU KNOW, THE MANUFACTURER'S TAG AND SOME PARTS THEY DIDN'T PUT INTO IT, AND THEY DID IT A FEW YEARS AGO. NEXT SLIDE. UM, THIS IS JUST A CLOSEUP OF THE SIDING ON THAT, SHOWING THAT THERE IS NOT EVEN PRIMER UNDER THAT ONE COAT OF PAINT, WHICH LEADS ME TO BELIEVE THAT IT'S ALL NEW SIDING ON THE ENTIRE CARPORT, INCLUDING THE COLUMNS AROUND THE CARPORT PARKING SPACES. NEXT SLIDE. THIS JUST SHOWS, UM, YOU KNOW, THERE'S REALLY NOT MUCH OF A FOUNDATION. THERE'S THIS, I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT TO CALL THESE KIND OF PORCH BLOCKS THAT YOU MIGHT USE WHEN YOU'RE NOT CONCERNED ABOUT THE PERFORMANCE OF A BUILDING IN THE FUTURE. UM, I WOULDN'T, I WOULD NOT RECOMMEND TO MY CLIENT THAT THIS BUILDING SHOULD IN ANY WAY BE USED AS A, A STARTING POINT FOR ANY NEW STRUCTURE. UM, IT'S JUST, THERE'S TOO MANY ISSUES WITH IT, STARTING WITH THE FOUNDATION AND THE GROUND. NEXT SLIDE. UH, SO MY CLIENTS LIKE TO ENTERTAIN. SO THIS IS REALLY AN EXTENSION OF THEIR HOME TO KIND OF MAKE CORRECTIONS TO SOME OF THE PARTS OF THE HOUSE THAT DON'T WORK FOR THEM. UM, SO REALLY THE LIVING SPACE BEING SO SEPARATE FROM [03:40:01] THE KITCHEN, UH, YOU DON'T, YOU'RE NOT ABLE TO SEE ALL THAT, BUT IT REALLY DOESN'T FLOW WELL AND DOESN'T WORK. SO THEY WANT TO USE THIS AS KIND OF THEIR ENTERTAINING SPACE, USING THE BACKYARD AS AN EXTENSION OF LIVING SPACE. UH, SO IT IS A CASITA, THERE'S NO PARKING INTENDED. THE PARKING WOULD REMAIN IN THE DRIVEWAY AS THEY HAVE PARKED FOR YEARS. UM, IT'S BASICALLY A ONE STORY CASITA WITH A MEZZANINE LOFT THAT IS OPEN LOOKING DOWN TO BELOW, UM, LIVING KITCHEN STORAGE BATH. IT'S MODEST, UM, BUT IT FUNCTIONS FOR WHAT THEY WOULD LIKE. NEXT SLIDE. THIS SHOWS THE, THE LOFT, WHICH WOULD HAVE A BED UP ABOVE FOR GUESTS TO STAY. IT'S NOT INTENDED TO BE AN SS T R AIRBNB LONG-TERM RENTAL. IT IS TRULY AN EXTENSION OF THEIR LIVING SPACE. NEXT SLIDE. HERE ARE, UH, FOUR ELEVATIONS OF THE STRUCTURE. UH, SO NORTH ELEVATION, THAT IS WHAT FACES THE MAIN HOUSE AND THE BACKYARD. UH, AND I SHOULD SAY THAT THESE ARE UPDATED DRAWINGS FROM WHAT JESSICA HAD RECEIVED PREVIOUSLY AND WHAT HER RECOMMENDATIONS WERE BASED ON. I'VE INCORPORATED, UH, AS MUCH AS I CAN THE COMMENTS FROM H D R, FROM H P O, UM, AND AS WELL THE D R C MEETING WITH, UH, CHAIRMAN FETZER THAT OCCURRED. UM, SO, UH, GOING WITH MORE TRADITIONAL ONE OVER ONE DOUBLE HUNG WOOD WINDOWS IN LOCATIONS THAT I MAY HAVE HAD A FIXED TRANSOM OR A FIXED WINDOW SOMEWHERE ELSE JUST TO MAKE IT MORE CONSISTENT WITH WHAT IS, UH, THE PREDOMINANT WINDOW TYPE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD. NEXT SLIDE. OH, AND I SHOULD SAY THAT ALL THE, THE SIDING ON THAT IS INTENDED TO BE WOOD SIDING PAINTED, UH, THE PROFILE OF THE SIDING WOULD MATCH THE MAIN HOUSE PAINT COLORS WOULD MATCH THE MAIN HOUSE. UM, MY CLIENTS ARE FINE WITH AN ASPHALT SHINGLE ROOF. THEIR IDEA WAS WHAT COMMISSIONER FETZER HAD MENTIONED OUT THERE TO DO STANDING SEAM METAL ON THIS CASITA. AND THEN IN THE FUTURE WHEN THEY NEED A NEW ROOF, THEY'D PUT STANDING SEA METAL ON THE MAIN HOUSE. BUT, YOU KNOW, JUST TO GET THROUGH THIS PROCESS, THEY'RE FINE WITH THE ASPHALT SHINGLES. UM, NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. SO, AS I ALLUDED TO THIS IS, UM, THE NEIGHBOR'S HOUSE AT 1 2 8 EAST MAGNOLIA. AND THEY JUST CONSTRUCTED THIS POOL HOUSE. UH, BASICALLY THEY HAVE A BACKYARD POOL. UM, IT HAS A LITTLE ACCESSORY DWELLING AND A SINGLE PARKING SPACE ACCESSIBLE FROM THE ALLEYWAY. UH, IT IS A ONE STORY STRUCTURE, BUT IT IS QUITE TALL. UM, SO NEXT SLIDE. SO I WANTED TO TALK ABOUT MASSING. THIS, UH, THIS IS JUST THE KIND OF THE NOTIFICATION AREA I TRIED TO USE OR THE BLOCK, UM, TO SHOW KIND OF HOW THE CONTEXT IS. SO ALL THE BLOCKS IN RED ARE INTENDED TO BE TWO STORY. ALL THE BLOCKS IN YELLOW ARE INTENDED TO BE ONE STORY. UH, SO JUST FOCUSING ON THE ALLEYWAY ITSELF AND THE ACCESSORY DWELLINGS, WHICH MOST OF THEM ARE DWELLINGS. UM, THERE ARE SEVERAL TWO STORY ACCESSORY DWELLINGS THAT EXIST. UM, AND SEVERAL ONE STORIES. AND THERE'S A COUPLE CARPORTS BACK THERE TOO THAT ARE ONE STORY. UM, SO IT'S NOT OUT OF LINE AT ALL TO SAY THAT A TWO STORY CASITA IN THE REAR YARD ALONG AN ALLEYWAY IS, UH, IT'S APPROPRIATE IN MY MIND. UM, NEXT SLIDE. SO THEN I HAVE JUST IMAGES AS IF YOU'RE DRIVING THROUGH THIS. UM, RIGHT HERE ON THE RIGHT, THERE'S A TWO STORY BUILDING THAT'S HIDDEN BEHIND THAT CREPE MYRTLE. UM, AND THEN YOU CAN SEE SOME ONE STORY KIND OF STORAGE SHED. AND THEN FURTHER BACK A, A, A DWELLING. NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. SO THIS IS AT MY CLIENT'S HOUSE ON THE RIGHT, THAT IS THEIR EXISTING CARPORT. UH, ON THE LEFT THERE'S ALSO A DWELLING. THAT'S ONE STORY. AND THEN JUST BEYOND THAT IS THE NEIGHBOR'S HOUSE AT 1 2 8 THAT HAS THE TALL ONE, TALL ONE STORY, UH, NEW ACCESSORY DWELLING, AND I DON'T THINK IT'S IN THAT PHOTO 'CAUSE IT'S GOOGLE EARTH. NEXT SLIDE. UH, GOING FURTHER UP TOWARDS MAINE, UH, THESE ARE SOME TWO STORY DWELLING APARTMENTS. UH, NEXT SLIDE. UH, [03:45:01] SAME THING, JUST SEEING MORE OF THOSE. NEXT SLIDE. SAME THING MORE, YOU SEE THERE ARE, THERE IS A PATTERN OF TWO STORY, UH, ACCESSORY DWELLINGS. AND I STILL CONTEND THAT WE'RE PROPOSING A ONE STORY DWELLING WITH A MEZZANINE LOFT FOR SLEEPING. UM, AND IT'S INTENDED TO BE THE SAME HEIGHT AS THE HOUSE. THAT WAS JUST THE ACCESSORY DWELLING THAT WAS JUST BUILT NEXT DOOR. UM, NEXT SLIDE. THAT IS THE ONE THAT WAS JUST BUILT NEXT DOOR AT 1, 2 8. NEXT SLIDE IF THERE IS ONE. OKAY. UM, SO, UH, I WOULD STATE THAT, YOU KNOW, THE NEW CASITA THAT'S BEING DESIGNED IS DIMINUTIVE TO THE MAIN STRUCTURE. IT'S SIGNIFICANTLY SHORTER AND SMALLER IN MASS AND SCALE. IT IS COMPARABLE, IF NOT IDENTICAL, TO THE MASS SCALE HEIGHT OF THE NEW POOL HOUSE NEXT DOOR. UH, AND IT IS SHORTER AND SMALLER THAN SEVERAL OF THE TWO STORY ACCESSORY DWELLINGS THAT EXIST ON THAT ALLEY BLOCK. UM, I PROBABLY MISSED A FEW THINGS, BUT I'LL OPEN IT UP TO YOUR COMMENTS 'CAUSE I KNOW EVERYONE'S BEEN HERE A LONG TIME. OKAY, THANK YOU. I BELIEVE WE HAVE A VOICEMAIL. HELLO? UH, THIS MESSAGE IS IN SUPPORT OF, UM, ITEM NUMBER 24. UM, THEY'RE PROPOSING TO REPLACE THE EXISTING CARPORT STRUCTURE WITH THE CASITA. UH, WE ARE NEIGHBORS TO THE FLORIST FAMILY ITEM 24 ADDRESS, UM, 1 32 EAST MAGNOLIA AVENUE. UM, AND WE SUPPORT THEIR CONSTRUCTION. UH, WE ARE NEIGHBORS AND ADDRESS ONE 28TH EAST MAGNOLIA AVENUE. UM, SHOULD YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS OR CONCERNS, PLEASE FEEL FREE TO GIVE ME A CALL BACK. MY NAME IS SUN GREEN. UM, TELEPHONE NUMBER. OKAY, THANK YOU. UM, I DID MAKE THE SITE VISIT A FEW WEEKS AGO, AND, UM, YES, THE LITTLE, WHAT I WOULD CALL A STORE ROOM HAD BEEN COMPLETELY REBUILT. UM, THERE WAS NO FOUNDATION, UM, IN THE CARPORT AREA AND, UM, OR THE, THE, THE SHED AREA, THEY HAD PUT IN SOME ADDITIONAL FRAMING TO, UH, KEEP THE ROOF FROM COLLAPSING. UM, BUT I WOULD SAY THE, THE VAST MAJORITY OF THE, UH, HISTORIC FABRIC HAS BEEN, UH, REPLACED OR COMPROMISED. MR. CHAIR? YES, SIR. IN, IN THE, IN THE HOPES OF, UM, QUICK DIALOGUE. IT, IT SEEMS THAT Y'ALL HAVE HAD SOME VIGOROUS DISCUSSION. I THINK THE APPLICANT HAS SHOWN PICTURES OF A, OF A BUILDING THAT'S THERE THAT CLEARLY HAS BEEN RECONSTRUCTED AND RECONSTRUCTED OVER TIME. UM, I, I, UM, I, I, I'M MAY, IT MAY BE A, UM, UH, JUST SOMETHING THAT I'M DRAWING FROM HIS, FROM HIS DRAWINGS, THAT SOMEHOW THERE'S A RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE OPENING THAT HE HAS THERE AND THE TWO OPENINGS OF THE LITTLE OLD BUILDING THAT ARE THERE. CLEARLY IT'S SITTING ON, UH, ON A, UH, ON, UM, YOU KNOW, UN ON AN UN UN IN AN INSECURE, UNSECURED, UH, FOUNDATION. BUT IT IS SIMPLE AND IT SEEMS THAT IT STAYS WITHIN THE SPIRIT OF WHAT WAS THERE ORIGINALLY. NOW OBVIOUSLY IT PRESENTS AN OPPORTUNITY IF IT'S SOMETHING THAT IS IN EFFECT, UH, PAST ITS USABLE TIME AND, AND IS NOT, UH, YOU KNOW, UH, TRULY SPEAKING TO THE HISTORIC CHARACTER OF THAT ENVIRONMENT. HE'S STAYING WITHIN THE SCALE OF THAT. AND OBVIOUSLY IT HAS A DIFFERENT LIFE AND IT, IT DOES A TOTALLY DIFFERENT THING THAN I, I'M SURE IT DID ORIGINALLY. UM, BUT, UH, I, I'M TAKEN FROM HIM AND TAKING FROM YOUR CONVERSATIONS, Y'ALL HAVE HAD, UH, VIGOROUS DISCUSSION AND THAT THIS APPLICANT IS COMING BACK WITH, WITH AN UNDERSTANDING OF THE, THAT DISCUSSION. AND IF THERE AREN'T ANY OBJECTIONS, THEN I, I'LL HOLD WAITING FOR OTHER, UM, UH, COMMISSIONERS, BUT I, I'LL WE'LL BE READY TO MAKE A MOTION. THANK YOU, SIR. THANK YOU. UM, OTHER COMMISSIONERS? MR. CHAIR? YES. COMMISSIONER GROUP. SO YOU, YOU DO FEEL LIKE THIS, IT'S LOST THE HISTORIC ELEMENTS YOU CAN SAY OF THE YES, THAT WOULD BE THE MAIN. UM, SO IF WE FOLLOW STAFF STIPULA RECOMMENDATIONS, YOU HAVE BASICALLY FOLLOWED ALMOST ALL STIPULATIONS ON ITEM ONE AND TWO. AND I WOULD SAY ON ITEM FOUR WOULD BE PENDING WOULD BE THE QUESTION OF, AND I WAS GONNA ASK YOU, WHAT'S THE LOT COVERAGE GONNA BE IF THIS PROJECT DOES BECOME APPROVED AND AND PERMEABILITY? YES. UM, SO WITH THE [03:50:02] ADDITION TO THE MAIN STRUCTURE AND YOU COUNT PORCHES IN THAT THE ACCESSORY DWELLING IS 32% OF THE MAIN HOUSE FOOTPRINT TO FOOTPRINT. SO IT'S WELL UNDER THE 40% RULE. SO THAT SHOULDN'T BE AN ISSUE AT ALL. UM, IN TERMS OF PERMEABILITY, I KNOW STAFF'S COMMENT WAS THAT ARTIFICIAL TURF SHOULD BE MINIMIZED IN ORDER TO INCREASE PERMEABILITY, BUT REALLY ARTIFICIAL TURF IS PERMEABLE AND WHEN INSTALLED CORRECTLY DOES DRAIN, UM, I SHOW IT VERY ARBITRARILY WITHOUT KIND OF ANY FINESSE OF A LANDSCAPE PLAN. I JUST SAY ARTIFICIAL TURF. BUT THERE WILL BE, YOU KNOW, GRAVEL SURROUNDING THE WALKWAY, THE CONCRETE WALKWAY. THERE WILL BE NATIVE PLANTINGS ON THE EAST FENCE LINE TO KIND OF SHROUD THE FENCE. UH, SO IT WON'T JUST BE THIS FENCE TO FENCE, ARTIFICIAL TURF. THERE WILL BE SOME NUANCE TO THE DESIGN. IT'S JUST NOT IN MY SCOPE OF WORK TO FULLY DESIGN THE LANDSCAPING ON THIS ONE. MR. CHAIRMAN? YES, SIR. I, I, OF THE OPINION THAT THE, THE LITTLE STRUCTURE THAT'S BACK THERE IS AS LOW INTEGRITY AND HAS LOST IT'S, IT'S IN, IT'S, UM, IT'S HISTORIC SIGNIFICANCE BECAUSE OF ALL THE ALTERATIONS. SO I'M IN SUPPORT OF, OF ITS, UH, DEMOLITION IN THE SPIRIT OF WHAT IS BEING PROPOSED BACK THERE AS THIS CASITA, UM, YOU'LL HAVE TO PURSUE A, UH, A VARIANCE, WON'T YOU, IN ORDER TO HAVE THAT STRUCTURE THAT CLOSE TO THE REAR, UH, SETBACK LINE, CORRECT? NO, IT COMPLIES WITH ALL SETBACKS. UM, THE WAY THE SETBACK ZONING CODE WORKS IS YOU MEASURE FROM THE CENTER POINT OF AN ALLEYWAY. OKAY. SO YOU'RE WORKING, SO YOU'D BE MEASURING FIVE FEET FROM THE CENTER POINT AND WE'RE MORE THAN THAT. YEAH. OKAY. YES. SO WE, I, I'VE HAD THAT EXPERIENCE AS WELL. WHEN, WHEN YOU DO HAVE THOSE ALLEYS, YOU CAN MAKE, MAKE USE OF THAT CENTER POINT. SO THAT'S, THAT'S GREAT. YOU'RE NOT HAVING TO GO THROUGH THOSE HOOPS 'CAUSE THAT'S A TWO MONTH, UH, PLUS PROCESS TO GET THAT DONE, OR SIX DEPENDING ON THE PROJECT. YEAH. . UM, AND I AM REALLY ENCOURAGED BY WHAT I WAS LOOKING AT EARLIER TODAY. SEEMS LIKE ALL OF MY NOTES WERE PICKED UP AND INCORPORATED FROM THE D R C THAT, UH, THAT, UH, THE CHAIRMAN, UH, WAS INVOLVED WITH. SO I, I REALLY AM SUPPORTIVE OF HOW THINGS HAVE EVOLVED AND HAVE BEEN FINESSED. THE HUNKERING DOWN OF THE, OF THE, UH, THE ROOF PLATE, UH, OF THAT STRUCTURE, THE KIND OF, UM, NORMALIZING OF THE, UH, OVERHANG SO THAT WE DIDN'T HAVE THE KIND OF FUNNY, UH, LITTLE, UH, BREAK IN IT. AND THEN THE ADOPTION OF SOME WINDOW, UH, PROPORTIONS AND, AND LANGUAGE THAT SEEMS MORE CONSISTENT WITH THE, THE MAIN HOUSE. SO I, I'M GENERALLY SUPPORTIVE OF, OF, UH, THE SCHEME. THANK YOU, SIR. MAY I COMMENT ON ONE THING I FORGOT TO BRING UP? YES, SIR. UM, JESSICA SHARED THE VOICEMAIL. THERE WAS ALSO A LETTER PROVIDED BY THE NEIGHBOR ACROSS THE STREET, THE SP STREETERS. YOU MAY HAVE THAT IN YOUR FILE, JUST WANNA MAKE SURE IT'S ON RECORD. UM, AS WELL, I'VE WORKED WITH THE MONTE VISTA NEIGHBORHOOD, A R C FOR ABOUT A YEAR ON THIS PROJECT. MET MULTIPLE TIMES, UM, THEY LIKED IT, BUT TOTALLY REJECTED MY FIRST DESIGN OPTION. SO I WENT BACK TO THEM WITH SOMETHING FAR LESS CONTEMPORARY, EVEN THOUGH THEY SAID THEY LIKED CONTEMPORARY AND CAME TO THE OPTION THAT WAS SUBMITTED. UM, UNFORTUNATELY I TRIED TO MEET WITH THEM THIS MONTH IN PREPARATION FOR THIS MEETING, AND THEY ONLY HAD ONE DATE AT 6:00 PM AND I HAD A CONFLICT, SO WE WEREN'T ABLE TO GET TOGETHER TO REVIEW, UH, THE FINAL DESIGN. AND THAT'S PROBABLY WHY THEY DIDN'T SUBMIT A LETTER IN SUPPORT OR AGAINST, I'M MAKING AN ASSUMPTION, BUT THEY'D BEEN IN SUPPORT OF THIS PROJECT FOR A NUMBER OF MONTHS. UM, SO I TAKE THE SILENCE AS A GOOD THING AND JUST BECAUSE I WASN'T ABLE TO MEET WITH THEM, THAT WAS ALL. OKAY. THANK YOU. AND YOU ARE, UH, AGREED TO STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS FOR ITEMS ONE AND TWO. I DON'T HAVE THIS MEMORIZED, I'M SORRY. WELL, I, MR. CHAIR, I THINK ITEM TWO FALLS OFF, RIGHT? IF IT'S A, IF IT'S A MOTION TO APPROVE AS PRESENTED AND THEN THAT TAKES YOU TO THE PART OF ABOUT THE DEMOLITION THAT, THAT, THAT THE ROOFS ARE CONSISTENT WITH PREDOMINANTLY FOUND IN THE AREA THAT THE WINDOW PROFILES. AND THE OTHER TWO THAT ARE PRETTY MUCH ITEM TWO IS, IS, UH, THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE ADDITION TO THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE. OKAY. SO ITEM ONE IS DEMOLITION OF THE EXISTING PORCH. ITEM TWO IS CONSTRUCTION OF THE ADDITION TO THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE. ITEM THREE IS REGARDING DEMOLITION OF THE EXISTING DETACHED, [03:55:01] UH, ONE STORY CARPORT. AND THEN ITEM FOUR IS, UH, SHOULD THE COMMISSION FIND THAT THE APPLICANT HAS MET, UH, OR MET, UH, CONDITIONS REQUIRED FOR APPROVAL OF DEMOLITION. UM, THEN RECOMMENDATIONS FOR THE PROPOSED NEW CONSTRUCTION COMMISSIONER VELASQUEZ, I'M SURE YOU'RE GONNA MAKE A MOTION AND JUST TO CONSIDER ON ITEM NUMBER TWO. I THINK THE ONLY STIPULATION THAT I'VE PROBABLY, MAYBE NOT REALLY CLARIFIED ON THE, HAS PRESENTED TODAY WAS JUST DECIDING, BUT I THINK IT IS KIND OF A, GIVEN THAT YOU ARE MATCHING THE SIDING WITH THE REST OF THE HOUSE. AND THEN WOULD YOU BE OPEN TO INCORPORATE THE REMOVED WINDOWS INTO THE NEW ADDITION? YES. UH, ALL THE DRAWINGS SUBMITTED DUE STATE THAT ALL SIDING WILL MATCH THE ORIGINAL HOUSE. UM, THAT'S ALWAYS BEEN INTENDED FROM DAY ONE JUST BECAUSE I KNEW THE RIGHT WAY TO HANDLE THAT. UM, AND INCORPORATING THE WINDOWS, YES, ABSOLUTELY. WE'LL, WE'LL INCORPORATE, THERE'S A COUPLE ON THE REAR OF THE MAIN HOUSE AND THERE ARE TWO ON THE CARPORT THAT WE CAN INCORPORATE SOMEWHERE FOR SURE. THAT'S NOT A PROBLEM. I, AND CHAIRMAN FETZER, YOU ASKED IF I AGREED TO ONE AND TWO. DID YOU MEAN FOR THE MAIN HOUSE? YES. OKAY. YES. ALL THE STIPULATIONS OR RECOMMENDATIONS ON NUMBER TWO. I'M PRETTY SURE WE'RE AT THE POINT WHERE WE ARE AGREEING TO ALL OF THE STIPULATIONS, EVEN WHETHER THEY'RE INCORPORATED IN THE DRAWINGS OR NOT. OKAY. IS THERE ANY MENTION OF S BETWEEN WINDOW AND DOUBLES AND TRIPLETS? IS THAT PART OF, UH, STAFF STIPULATIONS AND STANDARD? UM, THOSE STANDARDS? GENERALLY IT'S INCLUDED IN ITEM FIVE UNDER, OR I'M SORRY, IN THREE BULLET FIVE UNDER ITEM TWO, UM, TRADITIONAL CONFIGURATIONS FOR WINDOWS. PERFECT. MAN, I'M LOOKING AT SOMETHING, I DON'T KNOW WHAT IT IS I'M LOOKING AT, 'CAUSE IT, IT, I HAVE THE SAME THING ON, ON, ON PAGE, BUT MY THREE, IT SAYS THAT NEW WINDOWS MATCH EXISTING WINDOWS AND MATERIAL AND DIMENSIONS. THAT'S, OH, I'M SORRY, COMMISSIONER, ARE YOU LOOKING AT ITEM THREE UNDER THE RECOMMENDATION FOR, SO YOU'RE LOOKING AT THE BULLET STIPULATION THREE UNDER ITEM TWO. I'M SORRY, IT WAS JUST A LANGUAGE CLARIFICATION. I, I APOLOGIZE. BUT THE SPIRIT OF IT'S THE SAME, RIGHT? I MEAN THAT HE'S, HE'S RE REEMPLOY, UH, WHATEVER, UH, HE'S, UH, THAT THEY'RE CONSISTENT WITH THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND THAT THE WINDOWS WOULD BE REEMPLOYED AT IN, IN SPACES IN THE NEW CONSTRUCTION OF THE ADDITION. I MEAN, OF THE LITTLE BUILDING HE'S BUILDING, I, I THINK THE ISSUE IS JUST THAT WE'RE CONFLATING ITEMS AND STIPULATIONS. SO, UH, YES, ITEM, ITEM TWO, STIPULATIONS TWO AND THREE ADDRESS, UH, OKAY. WINDOW CONFIGURATIONS. OKAY. SO THEN IT COULD BE JUST A MOTION TO APPROVE WITH STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS AND AS PRESENTED, RIGHT, I THINK YOU HAVE TO SAY IF I MAY, UH, UM, APPROVE ITEM NUMBER ONE, APPROVE ITEM NUMBER TWO WITH STAFF STIPULATION. YOU HAVE TO MAKE SURE YOU SAY APPROVE ITEM NUMBER THREE. I WITH STAFF STIPULATION. THAT'S OKAY. SO JUST, UM, BECAUSE ITEM NUMBER FOUR, SORRY, YOU'RE APPROVING ITEM NUMBER FOUR AS WELL. AND TO BE HONEST, I WOULD REMOVE STAFF STIPULATIONS. I WOULD SAY APPROVE ITEM NUMBER FOUR AS PRESENTED TODAY. OKAY. SO THEN THE, UH, A MOTION TO APPROVE ITEM NUMBER ONE, ITEM NUMBER TWO, ITEM NUMBER THREE, AND ITEM NUMBER FOUR WITHOUT, UH, LEAVING OFF STAFF STIPULATIONS. THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER GROUP. CAN, CAN YOU LEAVE STAFF STIPULATIONS FOR ITEM NUMBER TWO? YES. YES. THERE'S UH, UH, ITEM NUMBER TWO WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS. THE ONLY STIPULATIONS THAT DROP OFF ARE THOSE ON NUMBER FOUR. COREY, CAN I ASK FOR A CLARIFICATION? UM, BECAUSE WHAT WAS PRESENTED ISN'T WHAT'S INCLUDED IN THE POSTED CASE FILE. DO THEY NEED TO SPECIFY WHICH SET OF PLANS PRESENTED TODAY THAT'S PRESENTED AND GOTCHA. PERFECT. I MEAN, AS A CATCHALL, IF THERE'S ANY STIPULATIONS YOU WANT TO INCLUDE, THEN WE CAN ALWAYS MAKE SURE THAT THE UPDATED PLANS CAPTURE THOSE, I BELIEVE IS THE INTENT. I'LL SECOND SO WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND. ANY DISCUSSION? WE HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE. SABINA. AYE. VELAZQUEZ? AYE. MORALES? AYE. MASUKA. AYE. CARPENTER. AYE. GROUP. AYE. ANTE? YES. AND SPENCER AYE. MOTION PASSES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU ALL VERY MUCH. APPRECIATE IT. AGENDA ITEM 26, JUST A QUICK REMINDER THAT ITEM 25, UM, WHICH WAS 2 38 WEST HOLLYWOOD, WAS WITHDRAWN BY THE APPLICANT. [04:00:01] ITEM 26 H D R C, CASE NUMBER 2022 DASH 3 3 9 5 16 NOLAN STREET. THE APPLICANT REQUESTS CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT AN 810 SQUARE FOOT EDITION, CONSTRUCT A 310 SQUARE FOOT DECK AND REPLACE TWO WOOD CASEMENT WINDOWS AND FOUR ONE OVER ONE WOOD WINDOWS WITH ALUMINUM FRAME WINDOWS. STAFF RECOMMENDS CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL OF ITEM ONE CONSTRUCTION OF AN 810 SQUARE FOOT EDITION BASED ON FINDINGS B THROUGH G WITH THE FOLLOWING STIPULATIONS. ONE THAT THE APPLICANT PROPOSED A ROOF FORM THAT IS SIMILAR TO THE HISTORIC STRUCTURE OR APPROPRIATE FOR THE STYLE TWO THAT WHERE WINDOWS ON THE REAR ADDITION ARE 60 INCHES IN HEIGHT. THEY BE 30 INCHES WIDE TO MATCH CONDITIONS ON THE EXISTING REAR. ADDITION THREE THAT THE APPLICANT PROPOSED WOOD SIDING THAT MATCHES THE 1909 PHASE OF THE HOUSE IN PROFILE DIMENSIONS AND TREATMENT PAINT AND UTILIZE A TRIM PIECE TO DIFFERENTIATE NEW AND OLD FOR THAT THE APPLICANT PROPOSED A STYLE OF RAILING KEEPING WITH THE ARCHITECTURAL STYLE OF THE ORIGINAL STRUCTURE, SUCH AS A WOOD RAILING SIMILAR TO WHAT IS FOUND ON THE FRONT PORCH. STAFF RECOMMENDS CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL OF ITEM TWO, CONSTRUCTION OF A 310 SQUARE FOOT DECK BASED ON FINDING H WITH THE FOLLOWING STIPULATION THAT THE APPLICANT PROPOSED A STYLE OF RAILING KEEPING WITH THE ARCHITECTURAL STYLE OF THE ORIGINAL STRUCTURE, SUCH AS A WOOD RAILING SIMILAR TO WHAT IS FOUND ON THE FRONT PORCH. STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL OF ITEM THREE, REPLACEMENT OF TWO WOOD CASEMENT WINDOWS AND FOUR ONE OVER ONE WOOD WINDOWS WITH A ALUMINUM FRAME WINDOWS BASED ON FINDING I. AND, UH, WE HAVE THE APPLICANT ON THE LINE. HELLO? CAN YOU HEAR ME? JUAN, ARE YOU THERE? YES, THIS IS WALKING. YOU'RE, WE CAN BARELY HEAR YOU. IF YOU CAN SPEAK A LITTLE CLOSER TO YOUR MIC, PLEASE. YOU'RE NOT GONNA, IS THAT BETTER? THAT'S MUCH BETTER, THANK YOU. OH, GOOD. AN ADJUSTMENT. OKAY. UM, WELL THANK YOU FOR TAKING THE TIME, UM, AND I APPRECIATE THAT. UM, I JUST WANTED TO, UM, GO OVER THE, UH, PROJECT HERE. IT'S, UM, JUST, UH, IN ADDITION TO THE REAR AND JUST DOING OUR BEST TO TRY TO KEEP, UM, EVERYTHING CONSISTENT, UH, WITH THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND, UM, ON, ON THE PLAN ITSELF. UM, IT'S JUST REALLY ADDING A, UH, A MA A MASTER BATH, UH, A MASTER SUITE REALLY IN THE BACK REAR, UH, JUST TRYING TO UTILIZE THE SPACE AS BEST AS POSSIBLE. UM, THERE'S ALSO, YOU KNOW, JUST HAVE A LITTLE ENTRY HERE ROOM. UM, THERE'S ON, ON THIS SITE. UM, IF YOU LOOK TO THE WEST, YOU'LL SEE THAT, UM, YOU HAVE A BEAUTIFUL VIEW OF THE, YOU KNOW, TOWERS OF AMERICA. AND, UM, THERE'S A LOT OF, YOU KNOW, I GUESS THE, THE HOUSE NEXT DOOR IS REALLY, UM, KIND OF IN BAD SHAPE. AND THEN ACROSS THE STREET THERE'S A LOT OF, UH, ANOTHER BUILDINGS THAT ARE IN BAD SHAPE AS WELL. BUT, BUT IF YOU LOOK AT, THERE'S A BEAUTIFUL NICE FIRE STATION KIND OF ONE HOUSE OVER. UM, SO THE LAYOUT WAS TRYING TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THAT. UM, YOU KNOW, THE REASON FOR THE DECK AND, AND THE SPACES OUTDOORS JUST TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THE, THE VIEWS. IT'S BEAUTIFUL. UM, I THINK, UH, WHEN YOU GO OUT THERE, YOU'D SEE IT RIGHT AWAY. UM, SO, BUT IT'S JUST A SIMPLE ADDITION TO THE REAR. UH, JUST TRYING TO SEE IT DO THE BEST TO STAY CONSISTENT WITH, WITH, WITH THE STYLE OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND NOT TO BE TOO OBTRUSIVE AND, UM, AND TRYING TO KEEP IT, YOU KNOW, WITHIN A CERTAIN SCALE AS WELL. UM, SO I I, I THINK IN LOOKING AT WHAT THE, UH, THE STAFF RECOMMENDS, I THINK EVERYTHING LOOKS GOOD. I JUST WOULD LIKE TO, UH, MAYBE DISCUSS THE, THE ROOFTOP PART HERE. UM, AND UH, I THINK THAT WAS THE MAIN . THIS IS JUST FOR CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL, SO I WOULD LIKE TO, YOU KNOW, JUST GET SOME FEEDBACK AND, AND, AND JUST LISTEN TO THE COMMENTS AND, AND TRY TO MAYBE WORK A, A SOLUTION THERE. IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, I'D BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO ANSWER. THANK YOU. UM, LET, UH, THE RECORD SHOW THAT THE CHAIRMAN STEPPED OUT FOR JUST A SECOND, UM, FELLOW COMMISSIONERS. DOES ANYONE HAVE ANY COMMENTS, QUESTIONS FOR THE, CAN I QUICKLY SAY WE HAVE A VOICEMAIL FOR THIS ONE? OH, THANK YOU. HELLO, MY NAME IS VALERIE CORTEZ AND I RESIDE AT 5 0 8 LAMAR STREET WITH INDEED WITTY HILL. I'M CALLING ON THE BEHALF OF THE CONCERNED CITIZENS OF DING WOODY HILL WITH REGARDS TO CASE NUMBER 2022 DASH 3 39, LOCATED AT FIVE 16 NOLAN STREET. WE SUPPORT O P'S RECOMMENDATION WITH ALL OF THEIR PROPOSED STIPULATIONS. THE ROOF FORM FOR THE ADDITION SHOULD MATCH THE EXISTING HISTORICAL ROOF AND ALL MATERIALS SHOULD MATCH THE HOUSE. WE ALSO STRONGLY DISAGREE WITH ALLOWING THE APPLICANT TO REPLACE EXISTING WOOD WINDOWS WITH ALUMINUM FRAME WINDOWS. THANK YOU. OKAY, THANK YOU. NOW, [04:05:02] ANYONE HAVE QUESTIONS, COMMENTS FOR THE APPLICANT? MR. VICE CHAIR? UM, YES SIR. I, I, UM, I, I JUST KIND OF WANNA MAKE A NOTE OF SOMETHING. THIS, THIS, UH, REAR ADDITION THAT IS IN THE DECK IS VERY SIMILAR TO THE, THE CASE WE GOT A LITTLE EARLIER. I THINK THEY'RE, THE HOUSES ARE VERY SIMILAR IN, IN WHAT THE OTHER GENTLEMAN WAS TALKING ABOUT, IT BEING KIND OF LIKE COMPLETELY OFF. SO USING HIS TERMINOLOGY EARLIER, THIS WOULD BE COMPLETELY OFF, BUT I THINK IT, IT, IT IS A MATTER OF HOW IT'S DEALT WITH. SO WITHOUT HAVING OBJECTION TO TO THIS, THIS DECK, I'D JUST LIKE TO BRING IT TO THE ATTENTION OF THE COMMISSION THAT THE OTHER CASE WILL BE COMING BACK AROUND AS A D R C AND WE SHOULD KIND OF TRY TO RELATE THE TWO. 'CAUSE THEY'RE VERY SIMILAR HOUSES AND, UH, THE ALIENNESS OF THIS IN THE BACK IS VERY SIMILAR TO THE ALIENNESS OF THE OTHER, BUT I HAVE NO OBJECTION TO IT. THOSE ARE MY COMMENTS, MR. CHAIR. THANK YOU. THAT'S A GOOD OBSERVATION AND CERTAINLY A BIG DIFFERENCE THERE IS THAT WAS ALREADY BUILT, UH, WITHOUT, UH, YEAH. CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS. MM-HMM. , MR. VICE CHAIR? YES, PLEASE. I'D LIKE TO ADD SOME COMMENTS. UM, JUST OBSERVATIONS OF THE EXISTING HOUSE. IT IS A REALLY FINE EXAMPLE OF, UH, ARTS AND CRAFTS, ESPECIALLY BY, UM, PETRI, IS IT PETRI AUER, UM, THE BUILDER. HE, THIS BUILDER, UH, HAD A LOT OF PRODUCTION IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD. NOTABLE, UM, BUILDER, UM, THE FORM IS VERY WELL THOUGHT OUT. IT'S VERY CLEAN. I THINK THAT'S ONE OF THE ATTRIBUTES OF THIS PARTICULAR HOUSE. UM, AND IT IS VISIBLE, VERY VISIBLE FROM THE STREET. SO I WOULD SUGGEST WE TAKE GREAT CARE IN, UH, GUIDING, UH, THE APPLICANT WITH AN ADDITION. I THINK THAT PUTTING THE, THE STAIRCASE OFF TO THE SIDE WHERE IT'S VISIBLE FROM THE STREET IS PROBABLY NOT THE MOST DESIRABLE PLACE, FOR EXAMPLE. UM, BUT, UH, THERE ARE A FEW THINGS THAT WE COULD, UM, IMPROVE UPON TO MAKE THE TRANSITION FROM THAT VERY FINE ORIGINAL HOUSE FORM TO THE ADDITION. YES, I, I CONCUR. THIS IS A SUPERB EXAMPLE AND ONE THAT WE OUGHT TO BE VERY CAREFUL ABOUT HOW WE'RE, UM, YOU KNOW, GUIDING THE APPLICANT ON, ON ANY MODIFICATIONS BECAUSE IT, IT WOULD BE A CRIME TO, UH, TO MESS THIS ONE UP. SO THIS HAS TO BE DONE VERY SKILLFULLY AND I APPRECIATE THAT THE LOCATION, THE VIEW IS, IS WHAT'S COMPELLING THEM TO, TO MAKE THESE, UM, MODIFICATIONS. BUT IT'S GOTTA BE DONE VERY, VERY CAREFULLY. MM-HMM. , I THINK, EXCUSE ME, I WAS JUST GONNA SAY, I THINK THE FOOTPRINT IS, IS NOT AN ISSUE AND NEEDS SOME DEFINITION. SO IT'S NOT THE AREA, IT'S NOT THE USE OR EVEN THE SIZE OF THE ADDITION, BUT IT'S HOW IT'S EXPRESSED AS IT COMES OUT, OUT OF THE GROUND. AND, AND, AND JUST TO MAKE A COMMENT, SORRY, UM, I DON'T WANNA INTERRUPT YOU, BUT, UM, THERE'S SOME OF THE, THE, THE LINES WE'RE JUST KIND OF, I, I HAD TO PUT THIS TOGETHER, TOGETHER REALLY QUICK TO, AS FAR AS, AND THAT'S NOT THE MOST UPDATED PLAN. EVERYTHING KINDA LINES UP IF YOU SEE THAT. SO, UM, I'LL BE SUBMITTING THAT, YOU KNOW, RELATIVELY QUICK, BUT, SO JUST IGNORE THAT OFFLINE WORK THERE. THAT WAS JUST SOME WORK THAT WAS, UH, NOT FINISHED. AND I THOUGHT I SUBMITTED THE, THE ORIGINAL FINAL ONE, BUT I DIDN'T. BUT THAT'S THE ONLY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WHAT I WAS GONNA SUBMIT, BUT I WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT'S CLEAR. WHAT WAS THE PART THAT WAS NOT WHERE YOU SAID OFFLINE? OH, IF YOU LOOK AT THE FLOOR PLAN ON THE EXISTING, THERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF OFFLINE WHERE YOU SEE, UM, ON THE PLAN ITSELF. SO THAT'S, THAT'S BEEN ALL CORRECTED AND LINED UP PROPERLY. BUT, UM, IN JUST TRYING TO SUBMIT EVERYTHING ON TIME, UH, SUBMIT IT THE LONG ONE. BUT THAT'S, EVERYTHING'S PROPERLY LINED UP. UH, YEAH, I THINK, I THINK JUST IN GENERAL, UM, WHAT I AGREE WITH THE COMMENTS THAT HAVE, UH, BEEN SAID BY THE OTHER COMMISSIONERS. SO JUST, YOU SAID YOU WANTED SOME GUIDANCE? SOME AND SOME ADVICE. I DON'T THINK THIS IS THE, THE FORUM TO START DESIGNING, BUT I DO BELIEVE THAT, YOU KNOW, STAFF, I THINK THE WINDOWS THAT YOU'RE SPECIFICALLY WANTING TO BE REPLACED, I THINK STAFF HAS IT, RIGHT? I MEAN, AND, AND LOOKING AT THE PROPERTY JUST BY THE PICTURES AND I DON'T KNOW IT, BUT I WOULD SAY, UH, THESE ARE VERY CURATIVE DEFINING WINDOWS FOR THIS HOME. SO I THINK THOSE, YOU SHOULD TRY TO FIND ANOTHER SOLUTION WITH A REPAIRING PAINTING. UH, AND THEN ON THE ADDITION, UM, I AGREE, UH, COMMISSIONER VELASQUEZ MENTIONED A PREVIOUS CASE, WHICH WAS, YOU KNOW, BUILT WITHOUT PERMITS AND NOW WE'RE, IT BECAME A BIGGER ISSUE. I THINK THE STAIRS ARE DEFINITELY, THIS ONE IS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT BECAUSE THE ONLY THING THAT'S REALLY COMING OUT IS THE STAIRS. SO MAYBE THERE IS A WAY TO DO THIS DECK MORE HIDDEN BEHIND, I WOULD SAY, YOU KNOW, AS [04:10:01] LESS, NOT VISIBLE AT ALL FROM THE STREET. UM, WHETHER IT'S THE STAIRS IMPLEMENTING THE STAIRS INSIDE OR ON THE OUTSIDE. I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU WOULD DO THAT. UM, AND I DO BELIEVE THAT STAFF IS ALSO MENTIONING SOMETHING ABOUT THE ROOF FORMS, AND I AGREE, AND I THINK THAT THE COMMENTS FROM THE NEIGHBORHOOD WERE THE SAME. AND I WOULD AGREE IF THE TYPE OF ROOF FORM FOR THE, UM, I GUESS THAT'S THE SUNROOM. YES. UH, HOW YOU'RE, YEAH, I WOULD SAY TRY TO FIND, YOU KNOW, WAY OF EXTENDING THE ROOF FROM THE, THE HOUSE. SO I WOULD SUGGEST, UH, WE GO TO A D R C. I THINK CONCEPTUALLY I DON'T SEE AN ISSUE APPROVING, UH, NOT THE WINDOWS, BUT THE ITEMS OF THE DECK AND THE ADDITION CONCEPTUALLY, MEANING ADDING THAT TO THE HOME AND THEN INNER D R C, UH, LET'S SEE OPTIONS THAT ARE WITH THESE COM. MAYBE A LITTLE BIT MORE GUIDING, AND THEN MAYBE HAVE A BIGGER CONVERSATION OF HOW THAT, THOSE ROOF FORMS SHOULD BE. OKAY. SO WOULD THAT BE COMMISSIONER S? WOULD THAT BE A MOTION TO ACCEPT STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS WITH STIPULATIONS AND AN ADDITIONAL D R C VISIT TO ADDRESS? WELL, ONLY FOR ITEM ONE AND TWO, UH, UH, APPROVE CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL ITEM ONE AND TWO WITH STAFF STIPULATION AND, UM, DENIAL OF ITEM NUMBER THREE. YES. AND A AND A, UM, SORRY. D R C VISIT OR D R C MEETING. SO, SO DURING THE, THIS WOULD BE MY FIRST TIME DOING IT, BUT WOULD THE D R C VISIT WOULD I BE ABLE, WOULD BE ABLE TO DISCUSS THE, UH, YOU KNOW, THE OTHER PART OF THE ADDITION WITH THE ROOF FORM WITH THE, THE ROOFTOP OF COURSE. IN, IN THE STAIRS? YES, SIR. A, A DESIGN REVIEW COMMIS COMMITTEE MEETING. UM, SEVERAL OF THE COMMISSIONERS WILL GET TOGETHER WITH, WITH YOU AND STAFF, UH, VIRTUALLY AND, UH, AT A, AT LEAST 30 MINUTE TIMEFRAME. SO THERE'S A LOT MORE OPPORTUNITY FOR IN-DEPTH, UH, DISCUSSION ON THESE ITEMS. AND YOU CAN GO ON LIMITED TIMES. YES, I'M FAMILIAR WITH THAT. OKAY. OKAY. I APPRECIATE THAT MOTION. SO WE HAVE A MOTION. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND MOTION AND A SECOND. ANY DISCUSSION? HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE. SABINA? AYE. VELAZQUEZ? AYE. MORALES? AYE. ZUKA? AYE. CARPENTER? AYE. GRO AYE. ANTES? YES. AND ZER. AYE. MOTION PASSES. THANK YOU. UM, WE, ITEMS 27 AND 28 WERE POSTPONED BY THE APPLICANT. SO WE ARE NOW BACK TO THE U D C ITEM EIGHT. AND BEFORE WE GET INTO THAT, 'CAUSE THIS, HOPEFULLY IT WON'T TAKE REAL LONG, BUT DOES, DO THE COMMISSIONERS NEED A FIVE MINUTE BREAK? SURE, I DO . OKAY. WE'LL TAKE FIVE MINUTES. I CALLED THE HISTORICAL DESIGN REVIEW COMMISSION BACK INTO SESSION. WE ARE HERE TO DISCUSS U D C AMENDMENT. IT'S 20 DASH SIX, 20 DASH SIX. SO AS YOU RECALL, WE HAD DISCUSSION ABOUT THE LANGUAGE YOU SEE ON THE SCREEN. UM, YOU ASKED, OH, ALMA'S RETURNING. SO YOU ASKED ALMA IF SHE COULD KIND OF TAKE SOME OF THE FEEDBACK AND SUGGEST SOME LANGUAGE. AND SO WE'VE DONE THAT HERE. IT'S COREY, I CAN'T HEAR YOU. I'M SORRY. IT'S A PRETTY SIMPLE AMENDMENT. UM, SO WE'VE ADDED LANGUAGE THAT YOU SEE HIGHLIGHTED. UM, AND WE CAN HAVE A DISCUSSION. UM, JUST A REMINDER, UM, THE, THE PLANNING COMMISSION WILL REVIEW, UM, THE AMENDMENTS NEXT WEEK, RIGHT NEXT WEEK ON THE 27TH, ON THE 27TH OF THIS MONTH. AND SO WE ARE LOOKING FOR ACTION. SO EITHER AN AMENDMENT TO THIS AMENDMENT, UM, OR A APPROVAL OR DENIAL OR NO ACTION. UM, IT WOULD MOVE FORWARD WITH THAT RECOMMENDATION TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION. SO IF, IF I COULD, JUST STARTING WITH THIS REAL QUICK, CAN WE UNDERSTAND WHO WE HAVE HERE IN FRONT OF US THAT ARE GONNA BE TRYING, THAT WAY WE CAN KIND OF, KIND OF PUT A POSITION, A POSITION AND A NAME TO WHEN, THAT WAY THEY CAN SPEAK UP AND WE ? YEAH, I APOLOGIZE. I THOUGHT I INTRODUCED MYSELF. I'M MELISSA RAMIREZ. I'M THE ASSISTANT DIRECTOR FOR DEVELOPMENT SERVICES. MY TEAM AND I OVERSEE AND ADMINISTER THE UNIFIED DEVELOPMENT CODE PROCESS. SO WE'VE BEEN PROCESSING U D C AMENDMENTS FOR QUITE SOME TIME. AND I HAVE LOGAN SPARROW, WHO IS OUR POLICY ADMINISTRATOR HERE BEHIND ME, MONIQUE, UM, MERCADO AND [04:15:01] LAUREN CHAVEZ WITH ME AS WELL, ALL DEVELOPMENT SERVICES STAFF. OKAY. EXCELLENT. UH, COREY, CAN I ASK YOU TO CONTINUE TO SCROLL ON THAT SCREEN YOU'RE AT AND FINISH OFF? THERE YOU GO. RIGHT THERE. GO A LITTLE BIT MORE. SO, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT CONCERNS ME ABOUT ALL OF THIS, AND I WAS JUST KIND OF LOOKING AT THE, LOOKING AT YOUR DOCUMENT HERE, IS YOU'VE GOT LANGUAGE IN HERE THAT YOU'RE CUTTING OUT, RIGHT? LANGUAGE THAT I THINK PROBABLY IS TIED TO FEDERAL FUNDS THAT YOU'RE REQUIRED TO HAVE IN SOME OF YOUR POLICIES. IF YOU'RE GETTING ANY TYPE OF FEDERAL SUPPORT OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT, WORKING WITH, UH, EITHER THE, THE BASIS OR ANY HISTORICAL BUILDINGS IN AND AROUND FEDERAL, FEDERAL, UH, UH, LANDS, YOU'RE CUTTING OUT. MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION SHALL REPRESENT THE GENERAL ETHNIC AND GENDER MAKEUP OF THE COMMUNITY. THAT'S LIKE IN DIRECT CONTRADICTION TO WHAT THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT IS TRYING TO DO WITH, YOU KNOW, WITH REGARDS TO INCLUSION AND FAIR REPRESENTATION. SO I PERSONALLY DON'T FEEL COMFORTABLE VOTING ON SOMETHING. I KNOW MY COMMISSION WOULD PROBABLY BOUNCE ME OFF A GOVERNMENT CANYON IF I VOTED FOR SOMETHING LIKE THIS. THIS IS GOING ASK BACKWARDS AS OPPOSED TO GOING FORWARD. THAT'S JUST MY OPINION. IF YOU CONTINUE TO SCROLL DOWN, AND I'LL TELL YOU WHERE TO GET TO IF YOU GET TO MOTIONS ON WHAT YOU WROTE FOR MOTIONS, LET ME KEEP THIS HIGHLIGHTED. OKAY. KEEP IT HIGHLIGHTED. ALL MOTIONS. UH, THIS WAS NOT HOW IT WAS BEFORE, I THINK, BUT IT SAYS, DISCUSSION SHALL TERMINATE WHENEVER A MEMBER SHALL CALL FOR A VOTE UPON THE QUESTION OR WHENEVER THE CHAIR SHALL SO RULE. SO AS IT STANDS NOW, THE CHAIR ACTUALLY CAN SAY, WE'RE GONNA GO AHEAD AND CALL IN A VOTE WHEN, WHEN HE FEELS THAT THERE'S BEEN ENOUGH DISCUSSION. BUT WHAT YOU'RE PUTTING IN THERE IS SOMEONE ELSE CAN CALL IN AHEAD, UH, AND INTERVENE. SO IF, IF ONE OF MY FELLOW COMMISSIONERS IS TALKING AFTER A MOTION OR A SECOND TO A MOTION, I CAN CUT HIM OFF MID-SENTENCE AND CALL FOR A VOTE, RIGHT? IS THAT WHAT THAT'S SAYING? COUNCILOR CAN CHIME IN AS NECESSARY. I WILL. UM, BASICALLY ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER ALLOWS FOR ANY MEMBER TO BE ABLE TO CALL THE QUESTION. AND SO THAT'S JUST INCORPORATING THAT SPECIFIC ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER. OKAY? SO THEN WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE SECRETARY, OKAY, YOU GO DOWN TO THE WHAT YOU DELETED ON THE SECRETARY'S PORTION. OKAY. LOOK AT WHAT YOU DELETED. WELL, ACTUALLY, YOU CAN LOOK AT WHAT YOU WROTE INSTEAD. UH, OKAY. THE MINUTE SHALL SHOW PERTINENT FACTS PRESENTED DURING THE DISCUSSION AND THE VOTE OF EACH MEMBER ON EACH DISCUSSION OF THE COMMISSION, OR IF ABSENT OR FAILING TO VOTE, INDICATING THAT FACT MINUTES OR MINUTES. IF SOMEONE MAKES A POINT OF ORDER THAT MAY NOT BE BASED ON FACTS TO ANY PERTINENT CASE, THEY STILL HAVE A RIGHT TO MAKE A POINT OF ORDER. WHAT I'M SEEING THERE IS THAT THE SECRETARY DOES NOT HAVE TO PUT THAT INCLUDED IN THE MINUTES. NOW, THAT'S NEVER HAPPENED TO ME, BUT I THINK SOMEONE, ONE OF MY OTHER FELLOW COMMISSIONERS, I DON'T REMEMBER WHO IT WAS, HAS, HAS HAD THEIR POINTS NOT PUT INTO THE MINUTES. AGAIN, THIS IS THE KIND OF THINGS THAT I THINK HAS US GOING BACKWARDS WHEN YOU'RE LOOKING AT POLICY. AND I, I, AGAIN, I I DON'T FEEL COMFORTABLE ON THE RIGHT OF THIS, AND I THINK IT'S SOMETHING THAT NEEDS TO BE REWRITTEN AND REPRESENTED. AGAIN, FROM A POLICY STANDPOINT, IF ANY OF YOU GUYS ARE EXPERTS ON POLICY, YOU KNOW WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT. RIGHT? AND I THINK COUNCIL WILL PROBABLY AGREE TO SOME OF THE POINTS I'M SAYING. HAVE YOU LOOKED AT FEDERAL FUNDING AND HOW YOU INTERACT WITH THE CITY INTERACTS WITH RE RECEIVING FEDERAL FUNDS, UH, WITH REGARDS TO, UH, YOU KNOW, I HATE USING THE WORD EQUITY, BUT WITH INCLUSION AND THAT SORT OF THING, YOU KNOW, GENDER BIAS, ALL THAT OTHER STUFF, YOU START CUTTING THAT FROM THERE. YOU'RE JUST OPENING THE CITY UP FOR POTENTIAL LAWSUITS OR SOMEONE COMPLAINING ABOUT IT OR SOMETHING LIKE, I MEAN, WE'RE, WE'RE AT A POINT HERE WHERE WE CAN AVOID DOING STUFF LIKE THAT. SO I WILL SAY MOST OF THIS ADDITIONAL BLUE LANGUAGE IS FROM OUR RULES OF PROCEDURE THAT WERE ADOPTED IN 2010. AND SO WE'RE, THERE WAS A DECISION MADE TO MOVE A LOT OF THAT INTO THE U D C JUST SO THAT MORE PEOPLE WOULD HAVE ACCESS TO IT. UM, SO THIS ISN'T, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING NEW, SO TO SPEAK, THE ROLE OF THE SECRETARY AND THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION OFFICER AND MAINTAINING MINUTES. UM, AND AGAIN, WE'RE HERE DISCUSSING THIS NOW, SO IF THERE ARE ADDITIONAL TEXTS OR LANGUAGE EDITS YOU WANNA INCLUDE HERE, WE CAN DO THAT. UM, IN REGARDS TO FEDERAL FUNDING, I, I MEAN, THAT'S, WE DON'T RECEIVE FEDERAL FUNDS BASED ON THIS LANGUAGE. WELL, WITH REGARDS TO THAT, AND I'M GONNA JUST CUT YOU OFF A LITTLE BIT WITH REGARDS TO THAT. I THINK A LOT OF THIS PREVIOUSLY WAS WRITTEN WITH THE UNDERSTANDING OF HOW CITY TIES IN THE STATE AND STATE TIES IN THE FEDERAL AND FEDERAL TIES IN THE CITY, AND HOW IT'S ALL INTERRELATED. AND SOME OF THE LANGUAGES IN HERE SEEMS TO CORRESPOND TO SOME OF THAT, THE OLD LANGUAGE. RIGHT? AND I WOULD JUST CAUTION THAT IF YOU'RE GONNA CUT SOME OF THIS STUFF OUT, THAT SOMEONE HAS DONE THE DUE DILIGENCE OF UNDERSTANDING THEIR INNER RELATIONS, UM, TO [04:20:01] MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE DOING IT RIGHT AND NOT SETTING OURSELVES UP FOR FAILURE COM. JUST COMMISSIONER VELASQUEZ, YOU KNOW, I, I THI THIS IS, UH, YOU KNOW, THIS SEGMENT OF THE UD C STUDENT KNOW, I'M NOT LOOKING AT IT FOR THE FIRST TIME. I'VE BEEN STUDYING IT, AND I'VE BEEN SEEING, I SEE IT AS KIND OF A REACTION TO, YOU KNOW, UM, PERHAPS A FEELING OF, OF OUT OF CONTROLNESS, UH, YOU KNOW, THE SELECTIVE USE OF ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER, RIGHT? THE SELECTIVE SEGMENTS TO SAY THAT THIS SEGMENT IS IMPORTANT. WELL, ROBERT RULES OF ORDER EXISTS. THERE'S NO NEED TO, TO, TO, TO PIECEMEAL, UH, THE RULES THAT CAN, THAT CAN STOP DIALOGUE, BECAUSE SOMEHOW THAT'S NEEDED. BECAUSE THE REALITY IS THERE'S RULES TO COUNTER ALL OF THAT. IF ANYBODY KNOWS ROBERT RULES OF ORDER, YOU CAN USE ROBERT RULES OF RULES OF ORDER TO STOP ACTION ON ANYTHING AT ANY GIVEN TIME, IF YOU KNOW HOW, AND IF THAT'S WHAT YOUR END OBJECTIVE IS, RIGHT? SO, YOU KNOW, THERE'S, THERE'S LANGUAGE THAT, THAT IS TO ME, DISEMPOWERING. ONE OF THE THINGS, UH, THAT, THAT, UH, THAT, THAT, YOU KNOW, DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE TO ME IS YOU'VE ALREADY HAD AT LEAST ONE COMMISSIONER ME, SAY THAT THERE NEEDS TO BE MORE TRANSPARENCY, AND TRANSPARENCY IN THE MINUTES IS DEFINED AS, UH, UH, VIGOROUS DIALOGUE BEING CAPTURED BY THE MINUTES. AND, YOU KNOW, I CAN TAKE YOU TO, TO THE MINUTES OF CITY COUNCIL WHERE THEY, THEY RECORD EVERYTHING. EVERYTHING, YOU KNOW, AND YEAH, THAT MIGHT CHANGE OVER TIME AS GOVERNMENTS BECOME A LITTLE BIT MORE AFRAID OF OPEN DIALOGUE. BUT THE REALITY IS, IT'S, IT'S ALL BUILT FOR THE, FOR THE, IT'S, IT'S ALL SUPPOSED TO BE. GOVERNMENT IS ALSO SUPPOSED TO BE FOR TRANSPARENCY. SO, YOU KNOW, WE USE, I I SEE YOU SAY WITH CONSIDERATION FOR EQUITABLE REPRESENTATION, YOU KNOW, THAT THAT E EQUITY MEANS A LOT OF THINGS. THE, THE, THE EXACT DIALOGUE THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS RACIAL EQUITY. WHEN WE TALK ABOUT SAN ANTONIO AS AN ECONOMICALLY SEGREGATED CITY, RIGHT? THE MOST ECONOMICALLY SEGREGATED IN THE CI IN THE, IN THE UNITED STATES, THAT EQUITY IS NOT IMPORTANT BECAUSE THERE'S RICH PEOPLE AND BAD AND POOR PEOPLE. THAT IS IMPORTANT BECAUSE THE VAST MAJORITY OF THOSE THAT FALL ON THE LOWER ECONOMIC ARE PEOPLE OF COLOR. SO YOU CAN'T TAKE OUT THAT SEGMENT ON THE BOTTOM THAT IS VERY SPECIFIC TO GENDER AND ALL THOSE OTHER THINGS. AND JUST STICKING THE TERM, UH, UH, EQUITY IN THERE AND THINK THAT YOU'VE COVERED THAT. YOU'VE COVERED SOME, SOMEHOW THAT YOU'VE ACTUALLY ADVANCED TRANSPARENCY, BECAUSE IT BECOMES, IT BECOMES EITHER LIKE SOMEONE TOTALLY UNQUALIFIED TO DO THIS, DID THIS, OR SOMEONE INTENTIONALLY LOOKING TO, TO SIDESTEP THE GROWING, UH, UH, UM, UM, UH, ATTENTION TOWARD THE FACT THAT OUR POLICIES ARE DISEMPOWERING OUR COMMUNITIES, RIGHT? SO IT, IT, IT, THIS SEGMENT, THIS SECTION HERE, IT SEEMS TO ME THAT EVEN IN THE, EVEN IN THE, AND I DON'T WANNA OFFEND ANYBODY BECAUSE YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW WHO MAKES THESE DECISIONS, BUT EVEN IN THE COMMENTS THAT I HAD MADE ABOUT THERE NOT BEING FAIR REPRESENTATION ON THE U D C UH, COMMITTEE, ON THE SIDE OF THE A O O H P OR THE H D R C, WHERE WAS THE MINORITY PARTICIPATION IN THAT PROCESS? RIGHT? SO IT'S, IT'S, IT'S, THERE'S A, THERE, THERE, THERE HASN'T BEEN ATTENTION TO THAT IN, UH, IN AN INTENTIONAL MANNER FROM THE GET GO. UH, AND, AND, AND THIS SEGMENT OF IT, IT SHOULDN'T BE TREATED AS IF IT'S A ROBERT'S RULES ORDER ISSUE OR IF IT'S THE SIZE OF A WINDOW ISSUE. THIS IS, THIS IS A SEGMENT THAT REALLY NEEDS TO BE PULLED ASIDE AND IT NEEDS TO BE DESIGNED. AND IF THERE IS NO CASE MANAGEMENT, NO CASE, UH, UH, EXAMPLE OF IT, IT'S BECAUSE SAN ANTONIO HASN'T CARED. THAT'S WHY IT'S IN AN AND, UH, A CITY OF, OF, UH, EQUITABLE DISPARITY ON, I MEAN, OF, OF MAMMOTH, UH, SCALE IN THE, IN THE UNITED STATES. WE'RE NOT JUST ANOTHER CITY LOOKING TO FIND A SOLUTION. WE'RE A CITY THAT HAS COMPLETELY DONE IT WRONG. THERE IS NOBODY THAT'S GOING, WELL, WE, WE'VE KIND OF DONE IT, RIGHT? NO, SAN ANTONIO HAS DONE IT WRONG. COMPLETELY. MR. CHAIR COUNCIL GETTING OFF SUBJECT. NO, IT'S THE SAME. THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING IS THAT IT SOUNDS LIKE A DIFFERENT SUBJECT. IT'S NOT A DIFFERENT SUBJECT. WELL, I KNOW, BUT HERE, I THINK WHAT THEY WANT IS A SOLUTION. IF WE'RE GONNA GO POLITICAL AND WE'RE GONNA GO AND, AND, YOU KNOW, TRYING TO CHANGE THE CITY, I GET THAT. BUT NOW WHAT I SEE HERE IS THERE MIGHT BE SOME REDUNDANT WITH ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER. I THINK IT'S ONLY, IT'S OKAY IF THEY'RE, HOLD ON AND THERE'S NO FEDERAL FUNDING DEPENDING ON ANY OF THIS U D C RULES, BUT IF MR. VELAZQUEZ, COMMISSIONER VELAZQUEZ, YOU HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THIS SECTION, RIGHT? AND THAT'S FINE. BUT THE PROBLEM IS, IF WE DON'T COME UP WITH A SOLUTION OR A LANGUAGE THAT IS ACCEPTABLE AS THE RECOMMENDATION, IT IS STILL GONNA MOVE FORWARD. AND MAYBE WHAT YOU WANT IS FOR IT TO SAY, WE'RE NOT MOVING FORWARD WITH US PUTTING OUR MARKS SAYING WE'RE NOT MOVING FORWARD BECAUSE WE DON'T AGREE [04:25:01] AND WE WANT THE CH CITY TO CHANGE. I DON'T AGREE WITH THAT POSITION. AND THEN NOW I WANT MORE, BECOMING MORE A POLITICAL VOICE MORE THAN TALKING ABOUT LANGUAGE. I AGREE WITH YOU. WHAT? THAT, THAT'S NOT WHAT I'M SAYING WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. WELL, BUT THE PROBLEM IS WE WANNA MOVE, I WANNA TRY TO MOVE FORWARD. I WANNA TRY AND MOVE FORWARD TONIGHT WITH SOMETHING, IF NOT THIS GOES, MOVES FORWARD SAYING WE'RE NOT RECOMMENDING, ARE WE GONNA SAY WE'RE NOT RECOMMENDING IT WITH A SPECIFIC REASONING BEHIND, OR WE CAN'T JUST TABLE THIS? I DON'T KNOW. IT'S BEEN SAID TWICE TONIGHT. THEY'RE NOT ASKING US TO TABLE THIS OR TO NOT, THEY'RE ASKING FOR US IF WE'RE GONNA MAKE AN AMENDMENT OR IF WE'RE GONNA MAKE A RECOMMENDATION THAT WE DO NOT AGREE WITH THIS. THAT IS IT. SO I, I WANNA KIND OF, LET'S, LET'S GET IT THIS WAY, COMMISSIONER, THERE ARE 20 ITEMS IN FRONT OF US, RIGHT? OR HOW MANY ITEMS ARE THERE IN FRONT OF US? 1, 1 20 NUMBER. WELL, YEAH, BUT, BUT OF THE OVERALL, WHAT WAS PRESENTED TO US COMPLETELY RIGHT? 20 OF THEM, 20 OF THEM HAVE BEEN, UH, ENDORSED BY THIS COMMISSION. OKAY? SO THAT BEING SAID, LET'S NOT TRY TO SAY THAT, THAT, THAT IT'S A BIG DEAL FOR ONE TO CAUSE US AN IMMENSE AMOUNT OF THOUGHT PROCESS AND DILIGENCE. RIGHT? ONE OUT OF ALL THE ONES THAT PASSED, AND I'M PART OF THE PART OF THE COMMISSION THAT SAID, OKAY, LET'S LET THESE PASS, OKAY, THERE WE LET 'EM PASS. NOW THERE'S THIS ONE, ONE, AND IT'S IMPORTANT. YES. BUT THIS ONE DEALS WITH THIS COMMISSION IN DEPTH AND DETAILED. SO, MR. CHAIR, IF I COULD ALSO, I WANT TO, I'M NOT TRYING TO INSULT ANYBODY HERE, BUT PEOPLE HAVE TO UNDERSTAND THAT ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER ARE A TOOL TO MOVE A MEETING ALONG. THEY HAVE NO LEGAL STANDING, THEY ARE NOT BINDING IN ANY WAY OTHER THAN A GENTLEMAN LEE WAY TO MOVE A MEETING ALONG. SO YOU CAN'T REFERENCE RO UH, ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDERS AS PART OF POLICY. YEAH. OUR CODE OF CONDUCT IS TO ADHERE TO ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER IS A PART OF OUR CITY CODE. CORRECT. BUT THAT'S ONLY FOR THE, FOR THE PROGRESSION OF A MEETING OR FOR A MEETING MOVING ALONG. IT'S NOT TO TRY AND DIRECT WHAT GOES IN THE POLICY. IT'S A GUIDELINE. COUNSEL, CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, IF IT BECOMES PART OF THE PROCESS THAT IS ADOPTED, IT IS, IT IS REQUIRED. CORRECT. RIGHT, RIGHT. BUT RIGHT. BUT NOW WHY ARE SOME SEGMENTS MORE IMPORTANT THAN OTHERS? SHOULDN'T, SHOULDN'T YOU JUST REFERENCE ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER? I MEAN, I MEAN, IT WAS STATED PRETTY CLEARLY TO US. I MEAN, THAT, THAT'S THE KIND OF RHETORICAL QUESTION BECAUSE IT WAS SAID THAT SOMEHOW THESE PIECES WERE MORE RELEVANT WITH RESPECT TO, UH, WHAT THINGS THAT HAPPEN WITH US. SO WHAT HAPPENS IF THE, WHAT HAPPENS IF THE PROBLEM YOU HAVE, UH, THE GRADE IS NO LONGER THERE, THEN IT'S IN THERE FOR WHAT? RIGHT. WHEN YOU REALLY JUST ARE SAYING THAT YOU ITEM NUMBER ONE SPECIFIES ROBERT'S RIR THIS. SO, MR. CHAIR, IF I MAY RESPOND. YES. SO THE, THE REASON THAT WAS INCORPORATED AS COREY, UM, REPRESENTED BEFORE IS THERE WAS AN ACTUAL ORDINANCE ADOPTING THESE RULES. AND SO WE CODIFIED THESE WE'RE, THIS IS PROPOSING CODIFYING THAT ORDINANCE INCORPORAT. SO IT'S ALREADY PART OF ADOPTED CITY POLICY. IT'S JUST INCORPORATING IT IN THE SAME SECTION THAT YOU ARE SPEAKING ABOUT THE DIFFERENT PROCESSES AND PROCEDURES OF THE H D R C. SO YOU DON'T HAVE TO GO TO TWO SEPARATE FORMS TO FIND THE POLICY. YOU HAVE THE POLICY ALL IN ONE SECTION, WHICH INCORPORATES THE PROCEDURES AND INCORPORATES THE RULES. OKAY. SO THEN OUR POLICY WRITING EXPERT, HOW CAN WE POLICY WRITE ON THE FLY TONIGHT? AGAIN, THE, THE PURPOSE OF TODAY IS TO CONSIDER IN WHOLE OR IN PART THE RECOMMENDATION THAT WAS FORWARDED TO THIS COMMITTEE. YOU CAN MAKE EDITS TO IT. YOU CAN RECOMMEND CHANGES TO IT, YOU CAN RECOMMEND APPROVING IT AS IT WAS SUBMITTED. YOU CAN RECOMMEND DENYING IT AS IT WAS SUBMITTED. BUT THIS IS THE OPPORTUNITY, AND I DO WANT TO STRESS THAT. I THINK IT'S BEEN REPEATED A COUPLE TIMES ALREADY. IF THE BOARD DOESN'T TAKE ACTION TODAY, PLANNING COMMISSION WILL TAKE ACTION BEFORE THIS BOARD MEETS AGAIN. CORRECT? RIGHT. BUT I MEAN, WHY DO YOU SAY THAT? IT SOUNDS LIKE A THREAT. NO, IT'S A STATEMENT OF FACT. WE'RE RECOMMENDING BODY, WE'RE NOT SITTING COUNCIL. IT'S A FACT. BUT IT'S A FACT. WITHOUT SAYING IT, IT'S STILL A FACT, RIGHT? I MEAN, IT IS ABSOLUTELY A FACT. IT'S ALREADY BEEN MADE CLEAR TO US, IF WE DON'T DO ANYTHING, THIS LANGUAGE IS GONNA MOVE FORWARD. RIGHT? SO IT'S REALLY NOT INCUMBENT ON US TO DO ANYTHING IF, IF, IF, IF WE DON'T FEEL LIKE DOING ANYTHING. 'CAUSE THE LANGUAGE IS THERE ALREADY, RIGHT? IT'S ONLY IMPORTANT TO THOSE WHO IT'S IMPORTANT TO. IT'S NOT IMPORTANT TO ANYBODY ELSE. THE ONLY REASON WE'RE SITTING HERE IS BECAUSE, RIGHT. YOU, COMMISSIONER VELASQUEZ AND COMMISSIONER, YOU DECIDED THAT YOU WERE IN AGREEMENT WITH THE LANGUAGE. LANGUAGE. I THINK THE REST OF US, OR AT LEAST [04:30:01] SEVERAL OF US HERE, ARE SITTING HERE AND ARE OPEN TO SEE REVISIONS WHERE WE WANNA MOVE FORWARD. IF YOU'RE NOT GONNA COME UP WITH A SOLUTION, THEN I'M READY TO MAKE A MOTION. SO THEN I'M, I'M PREPARED TO STICK WITH THE OLD LANGUAGE. THAT'S, THAT WOULD BE MY MOTION. I MOVE THAT WE KEEP THE PREVIOUS LANGUAGE WITH REGARDS TO THE COMPOSITION OF THE COMMITTEE. I MOVE THAT WE STRIKE THE ALTERNATE, UH, REQUIREMENT FOR THE SECONDARY COMMISSIONERS, AND WE KEEP IT TO THE 11 AS IT ORIGINALLY WAS. THIS MEANS THAT WE'RE NOT RECOMMENDING THE AMENDMENT. BASICALLY, IF YOU WANNA STAY WITH THE OLD, THAT MEANS YOU'RE NOT RECOMMENDING THE AMENDMENT. SO MAKE A MOTION AND LET'S GO TO THE COURT. THEN I MOVE, WE KEEP THE AMENDMENT OR KEEP THE, UH, UM, LANGUAGE. I WOULD RECOMMEND JUST A MOTION TO DENY A MOTION TO DENY 20 DASH SIX AS IT SITS RIGHT NOW, AND KEEP THE PREVIOUS ITERATION OF IT AND USE THAT TO INCLUDE THE ALTERNATE. YOU'RE NOT DECIDING TO KEEP, WE'RE JUST DENYING THE AMENDMENT CORRECT. THAT'S IT. WE ARE DENYING THE AMENDMENT. OKAY. I JUST, COMMISSIONER? YES, BUT JIMMY WAS SAYING SOMETHING. HE WAS INTERRUPTED. WHAT WAS THE LAST PART YOU WERE SAYING, JIMMY? THAT ALSO INCLUDES THE ALTERNATE, UH, ALTERNATE COMMISSION. ONE TWO DASH SIX, BASICALLY ALL OF 20 DASH SIX AS IT'S WRITTEN, ALL OF 20, UH, WE HAVE A MOTION TO DENY APPROVAL OF U D C 20, UH, ITEM 20 DASH SIX. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SO, COMMISSIONER SES, I JUST WANT TO CLARIFY THAT YOU UNDERSTAND THAT THAT MEANS ELIMINATING THE ENTIRE CONCEPT OF THE SECOND BOARD THAT'S INCLUDED HERE, THE COMPLAINT, CORRECT? DO WE HAVE A SECOND? I'LL SECOND. YOU HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND? ANY DISCUSSION? YES, SIR. NOW IT WITH THAT, IN, WITH THAT IN MIND, WITH WITH JIMMY, SUGGESTED IN MIND, COMMISSIONER CERVANTES, UM, IF, IF WE COULD GO TO THAT FIRST LINE THAT, THAT WAS SUBMITTED BY STAFF RIGHT NOW, AND, AND I WANNA, I I, I DO WANNA MAKE SOMETHING VERY CLEAR, MR. CHAIR. I, I, I, I HOLD THIS STAFF IN HIGH REGARD. I THINK CORY DOES A WONDERFUL JOB. RACHEL'S ON TOP OF HER GAME. UH, AND, AND IF I MENTION AOME, I'M GONNA FORGET, YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW, EDWARD, Y'ALL KNOW HOW HARD EDWARD WORKS. BY, BY NO MEANS AM I TRYING TO SAY THAT, THAT, UH, YOU KNOW, UH, ANY WAY THAT THIS IS NOT A STELLAR STAFF. THESE ARE SPECIALIZED ENVIRONMENTS WHEN WE TALK ABOUT RACIAL EQUITY, THAT THERE, IT'S, THERE IS NO PREREQUISITE TO HAVE AN UNDERSTANDING OR A PRIORITY FOR THESE. IT IT, THAT'S WHAT IT'S SO IMPORTANT THAT THE COMMISSIONERS, UM, YOU KNOW, ARE THE CANARIES IN THE COAL MINE RIGHT NOW. I'M THE CANARY. NOBODY ELSE HAS TO BE THAT CANARY, BUT I HAVE TO BE. SO THIS WITH CONSIDERATION FOR EQUITABLE REPRESENTATION, FOR ME, IT'S A RUN ON, AND IT, AND IT ONLY SUPPORTS THE BLUE. IT, IT, IT, THE YELLOW SUPPORTS THE BLUE. THEY'RE, THEY'RE REALLY ONE AND THE SAME. IT, IT HAS TO HAVE SOMETHING VERY SPECIFIC. UH, WHAT, WHAT, WHAT I'M WRITING HERE IS NOTWITHSTANDING THE CITY'S POLICY TO ADVANCE RACIAL EQUITY PREFERENCE SHALL BE GIVEN. SO THAT THE, THE, THE FRONT IS, IS, UH, THAT, THAT A, THAT A, THAT A CITY COUNCIL PERSON IS ABLE TO SAY THE MOST IMPORTANT THING HERE IS RACIAL EQUITY. AND YEAH, THAT MIGHT NOT BE THE MOST IMPORTANT THING TO PRESERVATION, BUT THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT THE CANARY'S JOB IS HERE, RIGHT? IS TO, IS TO SAY, HEY, THERE ARE PEOPLE IN THIS CITY THAT ARE NOT MAKING IT, AND THEY'RE NOT PARTICIPATING AND THEY'RE NOT ALLOWED TO. AND, AND THERE ARE, THERE ARE, UH, STANDARDS THAT IF A PERSON WENT AND LOOKED, THEY WOULD LOOK AT THOSE STANDARDS AND SAY, OH, IT IT, I CAN'T BEAT, I CAN'T BEAT ME. THEY, IT SPEAKS. BUT IF POLICY WAS SAYING UPFRONT, HEY, IF YOU'RE, IF, IF YOU FEEL THAT THERE'S A NEED FOR YOUR PARTICIPATION TO HAVE AN EQUITABLE, UM, UM, UH, YOU KNOW, LEVELING OF THE PLAYING FIELD OUT HERE, THEN THEN, THEN IT IS A PRIORITY AND IT IS A PRIORITY FOR THE CITY WITHIN ITS POLICIES WITH RESPECT TO THAT. UM, IF, IF, IF COMMISSIONER JIMMY WAS WILLING TO SAY THAT, THAT THAT LANGUAGE WAS, WAS, WAS, UM, UH, CLOSER TO THE MARK, AND I WOULD, UH, UH, UH, UM, ASK HIM TO AMEND THAT PIECE, BUT I WOULD STAND WITH HIM ON, ON THE ELIMINATION OF THE ASPECT OF CREATING THE DUAL BOARD AT THIS TIME. WELL, WE HAVE A MOTION. WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND TO DENY APPROVAL OF THE AMENDED U D C ITEM 20 DASH SIX W WITH A REQUEST FOR A FRIENDLY AMENDMENT TO COMMISSIONER JIMMY TO ALLOW THE LANGUAGE THAT STARTS TO SAY, NOTWITHSTANDING CITY'S POLICY TO ADVANCE RACIAL EQUITY AND THEN THE REST, AND TO SUPPORT HIS, UH, NOT, UM, UM, TO, TO SUPPORT THE DROPPING OFF OF THE ALTERNATE, UH, COMMISSION AT THIS TIME. LEMME SEE IF I GET ON THE SCREEN WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE. THIS IS VERY, UH, I'M SORRY, AND I'M, UH, I'M ALL ABOUT [04:35:01] RACIAL EQUITY, BUT I THINK IT'S LANGUAGE THAT SHOULD NOT EVEN, THAT DOES NOT, UH, TAKE PLACE HERE. AND I WOULD SAY THOSE ARE WORDS THAT I, I MEAN, JUST SAYING I WOULD NOT SUPPORT INCLUDING THOSE WORDS. THIS IS NOT A UUD C UM, ADDING THAT TO IT. SO YEAH, COMMISSIONER VELAZQUEZ TO WHAT YOU JUST SAID. I MEAN, IF THIS WERE TO BE DENIED, THERE WOULD BE NOWHERE TO INSERT THESE EDITS. LIKE THE RED TEXT WOULD REMAIN, THIS BLUE TEXT WOULD GO AWAY. SO YOU'RE SUGGESTED LANGUAGE WOULD, I'M ASKING JIMMY, IS THAT IF, IF THE, IF THE, UH, THE, UH, AMENDMENT THAT DROPS OFF GENDER EQUALITY AND ALL THOSE THINGS IS MADE LEVEL WITH, UH, A GENERAL COMMENT OF EQUITY AT THE BEGINNING OF IT, THAT WOULD BE ONE ASPECT OF THE MOTION. AND THEN DROPPING OFF THE SECOND COMMISSION WOULD BE THE OTHER ASPECT OF COMMISSIONER CERVANTES MOTION THAT I WOULD SUPPORT HIS DROPPING OFF IF HE WOULD SUPPORT THE PUTTING IN OF THIS LANGUAGE OF EQUITY. WELL, THAT WOULD BE AN, AN EDIT OF THE ORIGINAL RED TEXT THAT WE SEE THERE. JUST ADDING THE EQUITY PORTION OF IT, WHICH I THINK IS COVERED. IF YOU LOOK AT, UH, WHEN YOU TALK NEED IT, JIM, IF, IF, IF THE LANGUAGE STAYED THE WAY THAT IT IS, IT WOULDN'T BE NEEDED BECAUSE IT COVERS IT IN THAT NUMBER, UH, THAT, THAT BOTTOM, VERY BOTTOM PART C. YEAH. SO YEAH, IT COVERS IT IN AN OLD SCHOOL WAY. RIGHT, RIGHT. THAT'S WHAT I'M PROPOSING THAT WE KEEP WELL, AND COMMISSIONERS, CAN I JUST CLARIFY, WE'RE IN AGREEMENT WITH THIS, AND I APOLOGIZE IF THIS LOOKED LIKE AN INTENTIONAL OMISSION, BUT THIS KIND OF GOT CUT UP IN THE FORMATTING, AND WE NEVER INTENDED FOR THIS LANGUAGE TO BE STRICKEN. SO WE'RE, WE'RE HAPPY AND SUPPORTIVE TO INCLUDE THIS. THAT'S WHY I'VE GOT IT HIGHLIGHTED HERE. RIGHT? THAT'S ALREADY INCLUDED IN THE ORIGINAL TEXT. SO I'M, I, I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. COMMISSIONER VASQUEZ, IT'S ACTUALLY IN THERE. SO MY, MY MOTION IS TO KEEP THAT IN THERE. YEAH, YEAH. WITH YOUR MOTION IS TO DENY, TO DENY IF MY ORIGINAL MOTION KEEPS THAT PARAGRAPH IN THERE. OKAY. THANK YOU. I UNDERSTAND. ANY OTHER DISCUSSION? YES, MR. CHAIRMAN, I'D, I'D LOVE TO, JUST TO MAKE A, A COMMENT IF I CAN. 'CAUSE I, YOU KNOW, THE REASON WHY H D R C EXISTS IS FOR HELPING TO BALANCE WHAT'S IN THAT PARAGRAPH RIGHT ABOVE THAT PARAGRAPH C WHERE IT TALKS ABOUT THE COMPOSITION AND QUALIFICATIONS. IT'S, IT'S TRYING TO BE SENSITIVE TO THE PRESERVATION AND DEVELOPMENT GOALS OF THE CITY. WHEN THIS WAS PUT TOGETHER, THE MAIN MISSION OF H D R C WAS TO FIND A WAY IN WHICH WE COULD PRESERVE WHAT'S UNIQUE ABOUT OUR COMMUNITIES, WHICH INCLUDES CULTURE, WHICH INCLUDES ALL THOSE INTANGIBLE THINGS, BUT ALSO GROW AND DEVELOP AS A CITY, WHICH ALSO INCLUDES THINGS LIKE ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITIES. AND I, I THINK WHAT I WOULD ENCOURAGE US TO FOCUS ON IS YES, EQUITY, YES, FAIRNESS, JUSTICE. HOW CAN WE MAKE THAT HAPPEN WITHIN THE CONFINES OF WHAT THIS COMMISSION IS CHARGED SPECIFICALLY TO DO? SO THAT IN EACH OF THE ARMS OF THIS CITY'S ORGANIZATION, BOTH THE, THE, THE, THE STAFF, THE, YOU KNOW, THE PROFESSIONALS, BUT ALSO US LOWLY, UH, CITIZENS WHO, UH, WHO VOLUNTEER FOR THIS ABUSE, WILL WILL HAVE THAT IN MIND. BUT IT REALLY, I THINK WE'RE, WE'RE GETTING KIND OF OFF SUBJECT OF WHAT THE PRIORITY IS FOR THIS PARTICULAR COMMISSION. AND I JUST WOULD ENCOURAGE US TO THINK ABOUT THAT, THAT ONE OF THE REASONS WHY THESE AMENDMENTS WERE BEING PROPOSED IS BECAUSE SOMETHING WASN'T WORKING. OUR CITY IS GROWING VERY FAST, UH, BUT DISPROPORTIONATELY AGREED IN CERTAIN AREAS. AND THERE'S THINGS LIKE, UM, GENTRIFICATION THAT'S TAKING PLACE DISPROPORTIONATELY IN CERTAIN DISTRICTS. AND THIS COMMISSION CAN BE, UM, UH, AN, AN AGENCY OF POSITIVE CHANGE THAT BENEFITS ALL OF OUR CITIZENS AND NOT HAVE IT JUST HAPPEN FOR THE CARPET BAGGERS AND THE FLIPPERS THAT, YOU KNOW, COME FROM SOMEPLACE ELSE. SO I, I JUST REALLY ENCOURAGE US TO UNDERSTAND WHY THESE CHANGES WERE BEING PROPOSED. BECAUSE WE WERE HAVING A LOG JAM OF CASES WHERE YOU'VE GOT A LITTLE OLD LADY'S WANTING A, A SEVEN FOOT FENCE IN HER BACKYARD, SITTING BEHIND A, A TWO HOUR HEARING FOR A 20 STORY HOTEL BUILDING DOWNTOWN. SO THIS ISN'T INTENDED TO MAKE THINGS WORK MORE EFFICIENTLY, MORE FAIRLY. AND I JUST WANT FOLKS TO UNDERSTAND THAT IT'S NOT ABOUT BLOATING GOVERNMENT, IT'S ABOUT MAKING GOVERNMENT WORK FOR ITS CITIZENS. THANK YOU, COMMISSIONER. OKAY. EXCUSE ME. CAN [04:40:01] I HAVE A CLARIFICATION ON YOUR, ON YOUR MOTION? MY MOTION IS THAT AS IT STANDS PRESENTED TO US, 20 DASH SIX, I'M GETTING CAUGHT UP HERE, IS DENIED. AND WE JUST REVERT BACK TO THE SAME, TO THE OLD RULES WE HAD BEFORE. SO THIS WOULD NOT GET APPROVED. THE BLUE THAT YOU SEE WOULD NOT GET APPROVED. THE RED IS WHAT WOULD STILL CONTINUE TO RIDE FOR OUR GUIDELINES WITHOUT A SECOND, UM, COMMISSION TO DISCUSS THOSE THINGS LIKE FENCING AND WINDOWS AND STUFF, CORRECT? YOU'RE SAYING TO CORRECT. I DO WANNA CLARIFY. THIS IS, WE ARE JUST A RECOMMENDING BODY. THIS IS JUST RECOMMENDING WHAT WE THINK OF THESE CHANGES. THEY'RE STILL GONNA GO TO PLANNING. THEY'RE STILL GONNA GO. SO WHEN YOU SAY THAT MEANS EVERYTHING REVERTS TO THE OLD, NO, IT DOESN'T. SO YES, IT WILL GO TO COUNCIL, ABSOLUTELY. THAT'S THEIR JOB. BUT DO YOU THINK THEY'RE GONNA BE AS IN-DEPTH AND IN KNOWLEDGE AS KNOWLEDGEABLE AS WE ARE ON THIS PARTICULAR SUBJECT? NO. THEY'RE GONNA LOOK TO THE EXPERT. THEY'RE GONNA SAY, WHAT DID WE VOTE ON? AND WHAT DID WE DISCUSS? RIGHT? 'CAUSE THEY'RE GONNA PROBABLY, BUT I'M JUST MAKING, WE'RE MAKING ASSUMPTIONS THAT I THINK SHOULD BE ON THE RECORD, BUT WE DON'T SHIRK OUR DUTY BECAUSE SOMEONE ELSE COULD PROBABLY DO IT FOR US, RIGHT? WE DO WHAT WE HAVE TO DO, WE DON'T MAKE, AND THEN WE ASSUMPTIONS THAT OTHER MAY CONFUSE WHAT OTHER COMMISSIONS ARE THINKING THEY'RE VOTING ON. I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT WE ARE NOT MAKING ASSUMPTIONS CORRECT. WELL, NO, BUT THERE, IN DEMOLITION CASES, THEY COME BEFORE US, AND IN A LOT OF CASES, THERE ARE DECISIONS THAT WE MAKE THAT COME BEFORE US. AND IF WE DON'T MAKE AN AFFIRMATIVE DECISION, THEY DON'T MOVE FORWARD. SO WE MAKE DECISIONS THAT ARE NOT JUST ADVISORY. I MEAN, WE'RE NOT LIKE THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENTS, BUT WE'RE VERY CLOSE WITH RESPECT TO SOME OF THE DECISIONS THAT WE MAKE THAT ARE JUST ABSOLUTE RIGHT. IF A PERSON HAS TO HAVE WINDOWS THAT WE SAY THAT THE, THE WINDOW THAT THEY HAVE TO USE THAT DOESN'T GO TO CITY COUNCIL, WE MAKE THAT DECISION. THAT'S OUR DECISION. SO THERE ARE, THERE ARE RAMIFICATIONS TO IT, EVEN MORE REASONS WHY WE SHOULD HAVE A, AN ALTERNATE BODY , BUT FOR THE SAME, FOR THE SAME TOKEN, WHEN WE MAKE A DECISION THAT, THAT WE, THAT WE UNDERSTAND, WE'RE ALL INTELLIGENT PEOPLE HERE, WE UNDERSTAND THAT THE MAJORITY OF THE HISTORIC STOCK FALLS IN A BRACKET OF TIME WHEN MINORITY PEOPLE WEREN'T EVEN ALLOWED TO LIVE IN THOSE NEIGHBORHOODS. SO WHEN IT COMES TIME FOR US TO LIKE PROPOSE ALTERNATE, UH, UH, UM, UH, BUILDING TYPES ON AN EMPTY PIECE OF PROPERTY, WE'RE CODED OUT. NOT ONLY ARE WE CODED OUT TODAY, BUT WE WERE CODED OUT BY REDLINING AND BY AND BY, UH, SEGREGATION. SO THAT, THAT ATTITUDE OF, OF BELIEVING THAT, YOU KNOW, SOMEHOW THE PERSON SITTING IN THE CHAIR DOESN'T MATTER BECAUSE WE'RE ALL GOVERNED BY GUIDELINES. IT'S JUST NOT TRUE. AND IT SHOULDN'T BE TRUE, AND WE SHOULDN'T BE CODIFYING IT TO BE TRUE. THE REALITY IS THE CITY'S ALREADY MADE COMMITMENTS TO ADVANCE RACIAL EQUITY. AND THAT'S A FACT. AND IT'S NOT ABOUT EQUALITY. IT'S NOT SAYING THAT EVERYBODY SHOULD HAVE THE SAME THING. IT'S SAYING THAT EVERYBODY SHOULD BE GIVEN THE SAME OPPORTUNITY. AND THAT OPPORTUNITY, IN MANY CASES BEGINS WITH OUR DELIBERATION. SO THE MAKEUP OF THE COMMISSION IS, YOU KNOW, YEAH. IT YOU SAY POLITICAL. WE'RE GETTING POLITICAL. YEAH. IT'S A POLITICAL POSITION. WE GIVE AND TAKE, WE MOVE BACK AND FORTH. OKAY. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. I THINK IT HAS TO BE TAKEN VERY SERIOUSLY. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. I'M GONNA CALL FOR A VOTE. HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE. SAV NAYYY VELASQUEZ. AYE. MORALES AYE. MASUKA NAY CARPENTER NAY GRO NAY ANTES. YES. AND FATER NAYYY MOTION. I WANNA MAKE A MOTION, MR. CHAIR, THAT WHAT WAS PRESENTED BY MOTION FAILS. HOLD ON. MOTION. THE MOTION FAILS. MOTION. MOTION FAILS. YEAH, I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION THAT, THAT IF WE COULD GO TO WHAT CITY, UH, WHAT STAFF PUT ON ON THE, OKAY. THAT, THAT, THAT RIGHT THERE WHERE IT SAYS, WITH CONSIDERATION FOR EQUITABLE REPRESENTATION, THAT WOULD SAY, RATHER NOT WITHSTANDING THE CITY'S POLICY AND COMMITMENT TO ADVANCED RACIAL EQUITY. THAT'S IT. INSTEAD OF, OR IN ADDITION TO, INSTEAD OF, INSTEAD OF WITH CONSIDERATION FOR, FOR EQUITABLE REPRESENTATION. AND IF I CAN GET MOTION AND YOUR MOTION IS TO APPROVE EVERYTHING ELSE AND ONLY CHANGING THAT. NO, THE MOTION WOULD BE TO ACCEPT THE AMENDMENT, MEANING THE BLUE LETTER, EVERYTHING WITH YOUR ONE PHRASE IN THE BEGINNING. IS THAT CORRECT? ONE PHRASE IN THE BEGINNING, I'D LIKE COUNSEL TO, TO GIMME CLARIFICATION ON SOMETHING. BUT YOU ARE STILL ALSO ACCEPTING ALL THE OTHERS, THE ALTERNATE BOARD AND EVERYTHING. WELL, [04:45:01] I, I, I PERSONALLY AM NOT SURE WHY WE'RE GROUPING THIS TOGETHER WITH THE ALTERNATE BOARD. THEY'RE TWO TOTALLY DIFFERENT TOPICS, AND I, I, I FEEL THEY NEED TO BE TWO DIFFERENT QUESTIONS. YOU'RE ADDING A DIFFERENT TOPIC TO IT BECAUSE YOU'RE BRINGING RACIAL EQUITY INTO IT. OH, NO, NO, NO, NO. THIS, THIS IS ABOUT COMPOSITION AND THE COMMISSION, THIS, THAT MY COMMENTS ARE ABOUT COMPOSITION ON COMMISSIONER GROUP. WITH ALL DUE RESPECT, THE ONLY THING YOU'RE TELLING ME IS THAT YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT THAT MEANS, WHAT'S BEING PUT UP THERE. AND I CAN RESPECT THAT. YOU DON'T HAVE TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THAT MEANS. OKAY. I DO ALSO ALSO ASK YOU RESPECT. TIME OUT, TIME OUT. COREY. COULD YOU TYPE IN THE PROPOSED UNDERSTANDING THE CITY'S POLICY CHANGE COMMITMENT, DO YOU WANT POLICY AND COMMITMENT, CITY POLICY AND COMMITMENT TO ADVANCE RACIAL EQUITY? AND THEN I'D LIKE TO ASK LEGAL A QUESTION IN, IN, IN LEGAL TERMS. UH, ALMA, IS THAT ALMA THERE? YES. IN NOT WITHSTANDING MEANS WHAT? TO, TO THE CITY DESPITE, OKAY. WE DON'T WANNA SAY DESPITE, WE JUST GOTTA FIND A WORD THAT, THAT IS SAYING. UM, NOT BEFORE, NOT WAITED MORE THAN WITH, WITH, CAN I JUST HEAR FROM THE OTHER COMMISSIONERS BEFORE WE EVEN PICK A WORD? UH, HOW WOULD YOU FEEL ABOUT THOSE? THAT PHRASE IN THERE? I, I'M, I'M, I'M STRONGLY AGAINST HAVING THOSE WORDS IN THIS PART OF THE U D C AMENDMENT, AND, AND I DON'T REALLY SEE HOW THIS IS GONNA MAKE, UH, COMMISSIONER CERVANTES CHANGE HIS MIND, BECAUSE IT REALLY JUST ONLY CHANGES ONE PHRASE AND EVERYTHING ELSE STAYS AS AN AMENDMENT. SO I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR FROM THAT AS WELL. SO COREY ADDED SOME LANGUAGE, PROPOSED LANGUAGE IN HERE. I DON'T KNOW IF THIS HELPS THE SITUATION, UM, BUT IF YOU CHOSE TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THE CHANGES MADE HERE TONIGHT, IT WOULD BE A MOTION TO APPROVE AS AMENDED TODAY. AND THEN EVERYTHING ELSE WOULD STILL STAY WITH THE, EXCEPT THIS IS THE MAJOR CHANGE THAT'S HAPPENING. AND THE AMENDMENT WOULD BE PRESENTED TO PLANNING COMMISSION FOR CONSIDERATION. SO I WOULD PROPOSE A FRIENDLY AMENDMENT TO MY FELLOW COMMISSIONER, THEN AFTERWARD, WELL, WAIT, HOLD ON. I'M SORRY. WE DON'T HAVE A SECOND YET ON THIS. I DON'T THINK WE HAVE A MOTION. WE'RE STILL, WE'RE STILL TALKING ABOUT, IS THIS YOUR MOTION? COMMISSIONER VELASQUEZ? IS THIS THE LANGUAGE FOR YOUR MOTION TO ACCEPT AS WE'RE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE FIRST THREE WORDS HERE, RIGHT? THIS IS A PRO, A, A PRODUCTIVE, PROACTIVE, UM, MEETING OF THE MINDS HERE, RIGHT? LET'S NOT TURN IT INTO SOMETHING ELSE. WE'RE NOT IN A RUSH. OKAY? IF ANYBODY'S IN A RUSH, THEY SHOULD LEAVE. WE NEED TO FIGURE THIS OUT. THE PROBLEM I HAVE WITH THIS, YOU DON'T NEED TO SAY THAT, PLEASE. WELL, WELL, I FEEL RUSHED. I FEEL LIKE I'M BEING INTIMIDATED. SORRY. I FEEL LIKE I'M BEING, I'M SORRY FOR THAT. INTIMIDATED TO HURRY UP. I'M SORRY FOR THAT, MR. CHAIRMAN. I THINK HE'S INTIMIDATING EVERYONE ELSE THROUGH THIS PROCESS. YOU HAVE BEEN INTIMIDATED. WELL, RA, LOOK, RA, RACIAL, THE, THE, THE LANGUAGE OF RACE IS A VERY HARD CONVERSATION TO HAVE, BUT CITIES HAVE TO BE WILLING AND BRAVE ENOUGH TO HAVE THESE CONVERSATIONS. THEY'RE DIFFICULT. THEY MAKE PEOPLE FEEL UNCOMFORTABLE. I DON'T MEAN TO, BUT IS THIS THE FORUM FOR IT? IT'S NOT, YES, IT IS. BECAUSE WE ARE, WE ARE TALKING ABOUT LIMITING THE PARTICIPATION OF MINORITY PEOPLES BASED ON THE LACK OF PARTICIPATION IN THE PROFESSIONS. YOU HAVE TO BE SENSITIVE TO THAT. COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, WHY DON'T YOU DO GOOGLE THERE AND FIND OUT WHAT THE PERCENTAGE OF LATINOS PARTICIPATING IN THE ARCHITECTURAL WORLD ARE VERSUS LET'S, LET'S, LET'S STICK TO THE SPECIFICS OF THIS PROPOSAL. YEAH, WELL, YEAH, BECAUSE YOU'RE SAYING THAT, THAT, THAT THE MAKEUP OF THE COMMISSION WILL BE GOVERNED BY, OR WILL HAVE PREFERENCE FOR AN ACTUAL WORD IS PREFERENCE FOR THOSE WHO HAVE DEGREES OR WHO HAVE LICENSES AND HAVE ALL THAT. AND, AND I HAVE A LI A DEGREE. I'M NOT, I'M NOT LIKE ARGUING FOR MYSELF. OKAY, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE CITIZENS HERE, RIGHT? SO MY, MY PROBLEM HERE IS THAT IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE CITY'S POLICY COMMITMENT, I DON'T FEEL STRONG ABOUT IN ACCORDANCE WITH, OKAY, SO COMMISSIONERS, I BELIEVE, SO THIS IS THE LANGUAGE THAT'S ON FRONT OF THE SCREEN. HE DOESN'T FEEL COMFORTABLE WITH THE LANGUAGE IN ACCORDANCE WITH, I THINK MR. CERVANTES HAD SOMETHING. I HAVE EDITS. I'M SORRY, I HAVE MORE EDITS. OKAY. AND MR. CERVANTES HAS, OR COMMISSIONER CERVANTES, EXCUSE ME, HAS MORE EDITS SO WE CAN ASK FOR YOUR AMENDMENTS TO THIS, UM, CHANGE. AND THAT WAY WE CAN HAVE THE DISCUSSION. THIS IS MY RECOMMENDATION. THIS IS HOW WE'VE DONE IT IN OTHER BOARDS AND COMMISSIONS. THE COMMISSIONERS GO BACK AND FORTH AND PROPOSE SOME LANGUAGE, AND THEN IF THERE IS A CONSENSUS, THEN THEY TAKE A VOTE ON THAT. [04:50:01] MR. CHAIR? YES MA'AM. I'M A LOZANO WITH THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. I'D LIKE TO CALL AN EXECUTIVE SESSION. OKAY, YOU PLEASE PAUSE THE LIVE LIVESTREAM A PUBLIC MEETING. THAT'S WHAT IT SOUND LIKE. IF I SAY IS CREATED, I'M TALKING ABOUT A PHRASE. I'M TALKING ABOUT COMMITMENT TO RACIAL EQUITY. NO, NO, NO. I THE MAKEUP. BECAUSE LOOK AT WHAT YOU'RE TAKING OUT. COMMISSIONER VELASQUEZ. TIME OUT. TIME OUT. LOOK AT WHAT YOU'RE TAKING OUT. TIME OUT, MR. CHAIR. OH MY GOD. IT WAS NEVER IN THERE. THERE TIMEOUT. COREY, WOULD YOU PUT IN THE, SAY THE COMMISSION IN ACCORDANCE WITH CITY POLICY AND COMMITMENT TO ADVANCE EQUITY. TO ADVANCE EQUITY? 'CAUSE THERE'S ALL SORTS OF EQUITY, NOT JUST RACIAL. YES, IT'S RACIAL EQUITY IS WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT. RACIAL EQUITY. BUT THERE'S ALSO ECONOMIC EQUITY, RELIGIOUS EQUITY, GENDER, GENDER EQUITY. IF YOU PUT IN ONE, YOU HAVE TO PUT 'EM IN ALL. THAT'S I THINK WHAT WAS REALLY, WOW, YOU'RE TELLING ME THAT I HAVE NO PLACE AT THE TABLE BECAUSE NO, I'M NOT SAYING THAT AT ALL. I'M BALANCED IN ANOTHER SPOT. I'M NOT SAYING THAT AT ALL. LOOK, LOOK, THE PEOPLE WHO WANNA ARGUE ECONOMIC EQUITY, LET THEM COME AND ARGUE IT. THE PEOPLE THAT WANNA ARGUE EQUITY OF, OF, OF THE STORY OF BUILDINGS, LET THEM COME AND ARGUE IT. RIGHT NOW YOU HAVE AN ARGUMENT AT THE TABLE ABOUT RACIAL EQUITY. THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT. THE, THE CITY'S COMMITMENT TO ADVANCING RACIAL EQUITY AND RECOGNIZING HOW BACKWARDS THE CITY IS, BECAUSE IT REFUSES TO DO THAT. UM, WE'RE SUPPORTED BY CITY POLICY IN DOING THIS. WE ARE, BUT PLACING IT IN HERE AT LEAST GIVES THE COUNCIL SOME DIRECTION, SOME BLATANT DIRECTION. LOOK, LOOK AT THE ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER LANGUAGE THAT YOU WANTED TO PUT IN THERE JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT WE KNOW WHAT THE RULES ARE, RIGHT? YOU ARE GONNA PUT ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER JUST TO KEEP US CORRALLED. WELL, YOU KNOW, UH, OUR LEADERSHIP NEEDS TO BE CORRALLED A LITTLE BIT TOO. THEY NEED TO KNOW THAT WHEN THEY PICK SOMEBODY, THAT THEY HAVE PERMISSION TO PICK A PERSON THAT MAY NOT HAVE A DEGREE, BUT, BUT IT COMES FROM AN UNDERSERVED COMMUNITY AND SHOWS THE INTELLIGENCE TO BE ABLE TO PARTICIPATE ON THIS BOARD. THAT'S WHY WE'RE ADDING THE, UH, CITIZEN AT LARGE AS PART OF THE, UH, IT'S JUST KEEPING THE LANGUAGE THAT'S RIGHT THERE. IT'S JUST, IT'S JUST, I KNOW IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT TIME. IT'S JUST NOT TIME, RIGHT? WE'RE JUST NOT THERE YET. ARE WE GONNA ADVANCE? WE NOT, WE'RE NOT ADVANCED ENOUGH TO SEE, IT LOOKS LIKE WE'RE NOT GONNA COME TO AN AGREEMENT IF THOSE WORDS AREN'T REMOVED FROM THIS RACE. WELL, AS DEFENSE, WHO MAKES THE MOTION, I'M NOT AGREE TO IT. I'M NOT GONNA AGREE TO IT. IF WE DON'T COME TO THE SPIRIT OF SOMETHING THAT IS TALKING ABOUT THE ADVANCEMENT OF RACIAL EQUITY, LET ASK OUR, OUR ATTORNEY SOMETHING. HAS THE CITY ADOPTED A RACIAL EQUITY ORDINANCE OR GUIDELINE OR GOAL? I'VE READ IT TO Y'ALL MANY TIMES. THE CITY DID ADOPT, UM, A RACIAL ORDINANCE. OKAY? SO IT IS IN THE CITY EXISTING. IT ALREADY EXISTS SPECIFICALLY FOR RACIAL. YEAH, BUT YEAH. BUT THIS IS, LOOK, I'M JUST, I'M JUST SHOWING YOU MR. CHAIR, THAT OVER HERE IN THE ROBERT RULES OF ORDER, YOU DIDN'T JUST SAY IN ADHERENCE WITH ROBERT RULES OF ORDER, BUT NOW YOU'RE SAYING THAT OVER HERE IT SHOULD SAY AND ADHERES WITH THE CITY'S POLICIES. RIGHT? BUT YOU'RE NOT SAYING THAT ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER, BECAUSE IT'S NOT TO, IT'S NOT SPECIFIC ENOUGH FOR WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO ACHIEVE, RIGHT? SO OVER HERE WE'RE SAYING, COMMISSIONER SAVINA, IT HAS TO BE THIS, A MOTION HAS TO BE THAT. I'M SAYING THE SAME THING. MR. CHAIR, I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION. COMMISSIONER SAVINA, I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION THAT WE ACCEPT, UH, WHICH ONE IS THIS? UM, NUMBER 2020 DASH SIX 20 DASH SIX WITH THE CHANGES MODIFIED THAT WE'VE JUST MADE THAT SHOW UP IN THE MONITOR IN BLUE, HIGHLIGHTED WITH YELLOW, UM, TO YOU'RE KEEPING OH TO THE UPPER, OH, TO, UH, REMOVE IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE CITY POLICY AND COMMITMENT TO ADVANCE EQUITY. COMMA, SPACE PREFERENCE SHALL BE GIVEN TO THE FOLLOWING DISCIPLINES AND BACKGROUNDS, AND WE HAVE GONE THROUGH WHAT'S ALREADY THERE. WE'RE ALSO ADDING OR NEIGHBORHOOD REPRESENTATIVE, BECAUSE I DO THINK THAT IS PERTINENT TO THE COMMUNITY OF PRESERVATION AND CULTURE, UH, SERVING AS A CITIZEN AT LARGE. AND THEN WE ALSO INCLUDE THE HIGHLIGHTED BLUE PARAGRAPH BELOW ON THE FOLLOWING PAGE, 20 OF 20.6. MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION SHALL REPRESENT THE GENERAL ETHNIC AND, UH, GENERAL ETHNIC AND GENDER MAKEUP OF THE COMMUNITY, ET CETERA, ET CETERA. EVERYTHING ELSE IN THE AMENDMENT AND THE YES IN BLUE. I'LL SECOND. WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND DISCUSSION. YES. CO COMMISSIONER SABINO. UM, I'D LIKE TO CALL FOR A VOTE. [04:55:01] I WANNA BRING SOMETHING TO, JUST TO YOUR ATTENTION, RIGHT? WE HAVE CALLED FOR A VOTE. THE WORD. WELL THAT, YEAH, BECAUSE YOU PUT IT IN. ROBERT HASN'T BEEN APPOINTED. OH, COMMISSIONER JUST MADE US REALIZE THAT WE EQUITY COMMENT BECAUSE IT'S NOT IMPORTANT. YOU CANNOT MAY HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE. JUSTICE. WHAT AN INJUSTICE. OH, CALL SAVINA. THAT'S NOT ON THE OLD RULE RULE. THAT'S ON THE NEW RULE. JUSTICE VELAZQUEZ. I PROTEST. WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? THAT'S NOT IN LINE WITH ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER. THAT HAS BEEN, WELL, I'M NOT GONNA FOLLOW THAT RULE. I, I PROTEST Y Y NA OR ABSTAIN. I PROTEST. I PROTEST. YOU CALL IT WHAT YOU WANT. I PROTEST. OKAY. OKAY. MORALES. UH, AYE. MAZUA, UH, AYE. CARPENTER. AYE. GROUP. AYE. CERVANTES, CAN I GET CLARIFICATION? BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW EXACTLY WHAT'S BEING VOTED ON. HERE. IT IS. THE, THE AMENDMENT AS SUBMITTED WITH THE ADDITIONAL HIGHLIGHTED LANGUAGE. DOES THAT INCLUDE THE SECOND COMMITTEE? YES. THEN I VOTE NO. AND, AND, AND THAT THERE WAS NO DISCUSSION. NONE WE'RE FOLLOWING ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER. RIGHT? RIGHT. BUT JUST SO LONG AS THE RECORD REFLECT THAT YOU HAD NO DISCUSSION WHEN DISCUSSION WAS ALREADY COMMENCING, THAT YOU WITH THE RECORD, REFLECT THAT IT'S EIGHT 15 AT NIGHT AND THAT THERE WAS LOTS OF DISCUSSION DELIBERATION. THERE'S BEEN FOUR HOURS OF DISCUSSION. DELIBER, PLEASE CONTINUE WITH THE DIFFERENT MOTION. PLEASE CONTINUE WITH THE RELEVANT CALL. ALRIGHT. UM, SO BUTZER AYE. MOTION PASSES. MOTION PASSES WITHOUT DISCUSSION. THANK YOU ALL VERY MUCH. WE ARE ADJOURNED. BEAUTIFUL. * This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.