* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.
          [00:00:04]
          MR. CHAIRMAN, WHILE WE WAIT FOR A QUORUM, WOULD IT BE APPROPRIATE TO ASK STAFF TO JUST KIND OF, UH, GIVE US A SUMMARY OF WHERE WE ARE, HOW MANY MORE ITEMS WE HAVE, HOW MANY MORE MEETING DATES WE HAVE, JUST A GENERAL PERSPECTIVE OF WHERE WE ARE. 
          'CAUSE THAT DOESN'T REQUIRE ACTION, IT'S JUST INFORMATION. 
          I WILL BE HAPPY TO DO THAT FOR YOU, , BECAUSE WE'RE ACTUALLY GONNA START, UH, UNDER THE S A P M C, SECTION 2 0 2 GENERAL DEFINITIONS. 
          UH, WE COMPLETED BASICALLY ITEM 83 AND GOING TO START ON ITEM 81. 
          AND I'M, EXCUSE ME, 41 AND 41 AND 64 ARE GOING TO BE IDENTICAL. 
          AND I THINK THAT'S ON PAGE SEVEN OF THE SHEET WE HAD HANDED OUT. 
          UH, SOMEBODY COUNT THE PAGES REAL QUICK, BUT IF YOU GO BACK TO THE TWO, UH, SECTION 2 0 2 GENERAL DEFINITIONS AT THE HEADING OF THE PAGE, UH, YOU'LL SEE ITEM NUMBER 59 AT THE TOP OF THAT PAGE. 
          AND THEN GO DOWN 1, 2, 3 TO THE FOURTH ITEM, WHICH IS ITEM 41. 
          SO THAT'S WHERE WE'LL BASICALLY START. 
          AND WHILE WE'RE DOING THAT, LET'S JUST HAVE A, A GENERAL, UH, QUESTION ANSWER, I GUESS OF, OR AT LEAST A, A POLL OF EVERYONE. 
          IF MS. BROWN DOES NOT GET HERE IN A COUPLE OF MINUTES, WHAT I'D LIKE TO DO, MS. BROWN IS HERE. 
          THEREFORE WE WILL START, UH, AS SOON AS WE GET HER SEATED. 
          GOOD EVENING, EVERYONE. 
          YOU'RE GONNA BE, THEY GOT YOU SET UP. 
          OKAY. 
          THAT'S THE, THAT'S THE IN TROUBLED SPOT. 
          IN TROUBLED SPOT. 
          YEAH. 
          THAT'S THE PERSON WHO GOT IN TROUBLE. 
          GLAD TO SEE YOU, LADY. 
          GLAD TO SEE YOU. 
          THANK YOU SO MUCH. 
          BUT I'M NOT GLAD TO BE HERE. 
          . 
          I'M A BIT NOT. 
          THE TIME IS NOW ONE 19. 
          ACCORDING TO MY MICKEY MOUSE WATCH. 
          ON 22 JUNE, 2022, THE SAN ANTONIO, UH, PROPERTY MAINTENANCE CODE COMMITTEE WILL COME TO ORDER. 
          I'M DWAYNE NELSON. 
          I'M THE CHAIR OF THE COMMITTEE. 
          UH, IF WE COULD, LET'S HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE. 
          MS. BROWN. 
          HERE. 
          HERE. 
          FREDERICK ANDES. 
          HERE. 
          DAVID GARZA. 
          PRESENT ISH. 
          GUPTE. 
          PRESENT. 
          KAY MIRANDA. 
          DUWAYNE NELSON. 
          PRESENT. 
          JOE SOLIS. 
          ROBERT TAPIA. 
          AND WEINER. 
          JESSE ZUNIGA. 
          HERE YOU TREJO. 
          HERE. 
          RAY MORALES. 
          HERE. 
          NEPALI RODRIGUEZ JR. 
          HERE. 
          ESTEBAN LOPEZ. 
          PRESENT. 
          ALSO PRESENT IN THE MEETING FROM THE CITY OF SAN ANTONIO FOR THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. 
          SAVI R AND FROM DEVELOPMENT SERVICES, MICHAEL SHANNON. 
          DIRECTOR EM MEAN TOMA. 
          DEPUTY DIRECTOR DANNY LIGA, CODE ENFORCEMENT ADMINISTRATOR JENNY RAMIREZ, CODE ENFORCEMENT MANAGER. 
          AND MYSELF. 
          JUDY KRUM. 
          B S B. 
          LIAISON CHAIR. 
          QUORUM IS PRESENT. 
          THANK YOU. 
          WE HAVE A QUORUM. 
          MAY WE HAVE SPANISH TRANSLATION PLEASE? GOOD AFTERNOON. 
          MY NAME IS JEAN MARIE RINI. 
          I'M ONE OF THE SPANISH INTERPRETERS. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THE, UH, MINUTES HAVE BEEN CIRCULATED FROM OUR LAST MEETING. 
          UH, CHAIR WILL ENTERTAIN A MOTION. 
          MR. CHAIR, A MOTION THAT WE ACCEPT THE MINUTES AS IS MR. ANDES MOTION DE ACCEPT AS IS? DO I HAVE A SECOND? SECOND. 
          MS. BROWN. 
          SECOND. 
          ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION, SAY AYE. 
          AYE. 
          THOSE OPPOSED SAY NAYYY. 
          MOTION CARRIES. 
          ONE QUICK ADMINISTRATIVE ISSUE OR NOTE IS ON YOUR CELL PHONES OR ANY OTHER DEVICE THAT MIGHT INTERRUPT THE MEETING, PLEASE TURN THEM TO SILENT OR TURN THEM OFF. 
          AND AGAIN, WE ARE ACTUALLY GOING TO START, UH, ON ITEM NUMBER 41. 
          UH, AND THAT'S, UH, ON THE S A SS A P M C, UH, SECTION 2 0 2 FOR GENERAL DEFINITIONS. 
          I'LL GIVE YOU A CHANCE TO GET TO THAT PARTICULAR PAGE. 
          2 0 2. 
          YEAH, PAGE SEVEN, 
          [00:05:01]
I THINK. 
          AND BASICALLY, THIS PARTICULAR SECTION IS REQUESTING A DEFINITION OF ACCUMULATION AND SOME OTHER INFORMATION. 
          AND I'LL CALL HIM MR. ANDIS TO ACTUALLY GIVE US THE D O D DEFINITION OF ACCUMULATION. 
          THE D O D DEFINITION OF ACCUMULATION IS ANYTHING MORE THAN ONE SUCH AS A CIGARETTE BUTT ON THE GROUND. 
          AND YOU ARE REQUIRED TO PICK UP ALL ACCUMULATIONS. 
          AND THE REASON WHY I CALLED ON HIM IS BECAUSE HE AND I FREQUENTLY ARGUED ABOUT THE D O D, UH, EXPERIENCES THAT WE HAD, UH, BOTH OF US IN, UH, IN IRAQ, NOT TOGETHER AT DIFFERENT TIMES, BUT IT'S, UH, IT'S, IT IS INTERESTING THAT D O D HAS THAT DEFINITION. 
          UH, A QUANTITY OF ONE, UH, CHAIR WOULD ENTERTAIN A MOTION ON THE PROPOSALS FOR ITEM 41 AND 64, WHICH ARE IDENTICAL PROPOSALS. 
          MR. ZIKA, WHAT IS YOUR MOTION, SIR? YOUR, YOUR MOTION? UH, ACCUMULATIVE, UH, IT'S CALLED COMMENT THERE. 
          THE, THE WRITING ON IT AS FRED TO ACCEPT AS WAS PROPOSED. 
          RIGHT. 
          THANK YOU. 
          UH, DO I HAVE A SECOND ON THAT MOTION? SECOND. 
          THIS IS FRED ANDIS. 
          I SECOND THE MOTION. 
          THE MOTION IS MADE TO ACCEPT THE INFORMATION AS PROPOSED ON THE S C M P C CODE, WHICH, UH, NOW WOULD DEFINE ACCUMULATION. 
          HOWEVER, I GUESS WE DO NEED TO MAKE A DEFINITION OF ACCUMULATION SINCE IT SAYS IT'S NOT THERE. 
          UH, DID YOU ACCEPT THE ARMY'S OR DODS DEFINITION OF ACCUMULATION? IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE ALSO ADDING TO IT? LET'S HAND YOUR, OKAY. 
          MR. CHAIR? YES, MA'AM. 
          UH, I, I WOULD NOT RECOMMEND, UH, UTILIZING DODS DEFINITION. 
          UH, WE HAVE ALWAYS RELIED ON, UH, WHEN A WORD IS NOT DEFINED, YOU GO TO THE STANDARD DEFINITION DEFINITIONS IN THE TRADITIONALLY RECOGNIZED, UM, DICTIONARIES. 
          UH, THE TR UH, TRANSLATION THAT THE COURTS UTILIZE FOR ACCUMULATION. 
          AND THAT IS WHY IT IS NOT DEFINED. 
          ACCUMULATION IS A MASS OR QUANTITY OF SOMETHING THAT HAS GRADUALLY GATHERED OR BEEN ACQUIRED. 
          UH, SO THAT IS THE DEFINITION THAT THE COURTS GO TO, THAT, UH, WE GO TO IN ARGUING. 
          AND SO SINCE THERE IS A DEFINITION THAT IS UTILIZED BY THE COURTS, THEN IT SHOULD BE LEFT TO, UH, THEIR DETERMINATION. 
          BUT, UH, SPECIFICALLY TO ADDRESS, UH, THIS CONCERN, I BELIEVE, UH, KAYLA HAD BROUGHT IT UP ABOUT SOMEBODY BEING CITED FOR A CANDY WRAPPER. 
          UH, THAT IS NOT ACCUMULATION. 
          IT HAS TO BE A MASS OR A LARGE OR A QUANTITY OF SOMETHING. 
          MS. MR. SUNA DID YOU WANT TO ACCEPT? SAY AGAIN. 
          WITHDRAW BROUGHT D O D, YOU WITHDRAW THE D O D MOTION AND ACCEPT WHAT? AND, AND ACCEPT THE 41 AS WRITTEN. 
          WELL, 41 AS WRITTEN, UH, ACCUMULATION IS ACCUMULATION AND NOT CHANGE IT AT ALL. 
          IT WOULD BE, THE DEFINITION WOULD NORMALLY BE ACCEPTED. 
          IN OTHER WORDS, YOU'RE ACCEPTING THE PROPOSED CHANGE BY LEGAL COUNSEL. 
          YES. 
          OKAY. 
          MR. ZUNIGA? EXCUSE ME. 
          MR. ANDES, YOU SECOND THAT MOTION? YES. 
          UH, THANK YOU. 
          AND, AND WITH, UH, THE, THE NORMAL LEGAL USE OF ACCUMULATION, WHICH IS WHAT COUNSEL WAS REFERRING TO, THAT'S COUNT. 
          YES. 
          AND I THINK THAT WAS THE MOTION AMENDED. 
          UH, THE MOTIONS HAS BEEN MADE TO, UH, ACCEPT THE WORDING. 
          THE SS C M P C DOES NOT STATE THE DEFINITION OF ACCUMULATION. 
          AND INDEED WE WOULD ADD A DEFINITION OF ACCUMULATION, WHICH WOULD BE THE LEGAL, UH, OR THE NORMAL USE OF ACCUMULATION, UH, OPEN FOR DISCUSSION. 
          ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION TO ADD A DEFINITION OF 
          [00:10:01]
ACCUMULATION TO THE CODE, SAY AYE. 
          AYE. 
          THOSE OPPOSED, SAY, NAYYY. 
          ITEM NUMBER 41 AND 42 NOW HAVE A DEFINITION IN THE MAINTENANCE CODES. 
          MOVE NOW TO ITEM 45 AND 61. 
          UH, THIS IS AN ISSUE OF IMMINENT DANGER AND CHANGES THE DEFINITION OF IMMINENT DANGER. 
          UH, CHAIR'S VIEW IS THAT BY LISTING THE ITEMS THAT WE HAVE. 
          MR. CHAIR, GO AHEAD. 
          UH, I'M SORRY. 
          UH, TO GO BACK TO, SO DID Y'ALL JUST VOTE TO PUT IN OF WORD DEFINITION OF ACCUMULATION? EXCEPT IT'S THE DEFINITION NORMALLY ACCEPTED AS ACCUMULATION. 
          OKAY. 
          SO THE, WHICH WAS THE, IT'S GOING TO REFERENCE, WHICH IS THE LEGAL AS HOW IT IS DEFINED IN THE DICTIONARY. 
          YES, MA'AM. 
          OKAY. 
          OR AT LEAST THAT'S THE CHAIR'S UNDERSTANDING. 
          IS THAT EVERYONE ELSE'S UNDERSTANDING? YES. 
          YES. 
          DAVID, YOU UNDERSTAND THAT MR. GUPTA? YES. 
          OKAY. 
          IT'S, IT'S ALL UNDERSTOOD AS THE LEGAL DEFINITION. 
          AND NOW THEN MOVING TO IMMINENT DANGER, UH, WE'VE LISTED SEVERAL ITEMS IN IMMINENT DANGER. 
          AND, UH, THERE THE ISSUES ARE, UH, NOT INCLUDED, WOULD BE THINGS LIKE DROWNING, EXPLOSION, FIRE, ET CETERA. 
          UH, SO, UH, CHAIR WOULD ENTERTAIN THEM. 
          AND BY THE WAY, UH, WE'RE LOOKING AT ITEM 45 61. 
          AND ON THE NEXT PAGE, ITEM 82, THESE ARE ALL IDENTICAL PRESENTATIONS. 
          SO I'LL LET YOU HAVE A CHANCE TO READ ALL THREE OF THEM TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY INDEED ARE ALL IDENTICAL. 
          YOU SAID 82, 61, 82 AND 45 ARE ALL IDENTICAL. 
          AND WE'VE ALSO DISCUSSED THE DEFINITION OR THE USE OF THE WORD REASONABLE. 
          SO TAKE THAT IN CONSIDERATION. 
          AS YOU READ, FIND DEFINITION, SERIOUS THREATENING INJURY OR DEATH ORATION, OR THE STRUCTURE IS REASONABLE, LIKELY TO COLLAPSE. 
          UH, SO MY MOTION STANDS FOR ITEM 21 45 6 1 AND 82. 
          AND THAT IS TO ACCEPT THE PROPOSAL THAT IS PRINTED IN FRONT OF US. 
          VERY GOOD. 
          MR. GUPTA MADE THE MOTION TO ACCEPT THE PROPOSAL THAT WE'RE READING ON THE PAGE FOR ALL THREE CATEGORIES. 
          UH, DO I HAVE A SECOND? IS IS FRED ANDIS? I SECOND MR. ANDIS. 
          SECOND THE MOTION. 
          ANY DISCUSSION? YES, SIR. 
          MR. CHAIR. 
          UH, GO. 
          MR. ZUNIGA, GO AHEAD. 
          PLEASE GO AHEAD. 
          THERE'S SOMETHING MISSING HERE AND RIGHT NOW, I THINK. 
          BUT WHAT, IT'S MORE THAN ELECTRICAL IGNATION OR ION ON THE STRUCTURE. 
          IT'S GOTTA BE SOMETHING ELSE HERE. 
          THAT'S SOMETHING MISSING. 
          BUT I GO ALONG WITH, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S WRITTEN, BUT, YOU KNOW, LET'S, LET'S GO AHEAD WITH IT THEN. 
          OKAY, MR. GARZA, ALONG THOSE LINES, I, I BELIEVE I'D LIKE FOR EITHER STAFF OR LEGAL TO REMIND US. 
          'CAUSE WE HAD DISCUSSION ABOUT THIS AT THE LAST MEETING, AND I'VE CAN'T RECALL IF WE WERE LIMITING OURSELVES BY THESE SPECIFIC ITEMS, AND THEREFORE IT WAS NOT SUGGESTED WE, WE FOLLOW THIS PATTERN OR, UH, ENLIGHTEN ME. 
          UH, REMIND ME WHAT THE DISCUSSION WAS ON, ON THIS, UH, PARTICULAR DEFINITION. 
          UM, THE, WELL, THERE WERE, UH, TWO THAT WE HAD BROUGHT UP EARLIER, UM, TRYING TO, THE, THE PROPOSAL IS LIMITING THE BUILDING OFFICIALS DISCRETIONARY DETERMINATION 
          [00:15:01]
THAT A CONDITION, UH, IS, UH, PRESENTS, UM, A THREAT. 
          THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN NOW IS TO CODIFY WHAT THE BUILDING OFFICIALS POWERS ARE INHERENTLY UNDER THE CITY'S POLICE POWER AUTHORITY. 
          IT ALSO CODIFIES CASE LAW DATING BACK TO 1823. 
          THE, UH, BUILDING OFFICIAL HAS CO UH, COMPLETE DISCRETION TO DETERMINE IF A CONDITION IS AN IMMEDIATE DANGER. 
          THE WAY THIS IS WRITTEN, WELL, FIRST, UH, AS FAR AS ADDING IN STRUCTURE IS REASONABLY LIKELY TO COLLAPSE. 
          UH, THAT'S, UH, SAMHSA DOESN'T COVER THAT. 
          CHAPTER SIX DOES, SPECIFICALLY 6 1 7 5 ADDRESSES, UH, EMERGENCY DECLARATIONS AND OR DANGEROUS STRUCTURES THAT PRESENT AN IMMEDIATE HAZARD. 
          ALSO, UH, LIMITING THE, UH, THE POSSIBLE MEANS OF INJURY TO, UH, ELECTROCUTION IGNITION OR ASPHYXIATE. 
          UH, AS THAT , UH,  ASPHYXIATION THERE, THERE, THERE ARE A LOT MORE CONDITIONS OUT THERE THAT WOULD NOT BE COVERED. 
          THE EXAMPLE I BROUGHT UP AT THE LAST MEETING IS THE BOARDING HOME. 
          UH, THERE WERE SEVERAL DISABLED ELDERLY PEOPLE WHO WERE CONFINED TO THEIR BED. 
          UH, THEY, UH, WOULD NOT HAVE THE ABILITY TO GET UP AND LEAVE, UH, IN CASE OF A FIRE AT THE INSPECTION, THERE WAS A CONCERN THAT, UH, ABOUT THE BOILER, A 24 HOUR NOTICE WAS GIVEN. 
          THE CONCERN WAS THE BO THE BOILER LOOKED LIKE IT, IT WOULD EXPLODE AND, UH, CAUSE A FIRE. 
          UM, AT THE TIME, UM, THE PRO THE BOARDING HOME OPERATORS REFUSED TO COMPLY. 
          TWO DAYS LATER, UH, THE BOILER BLEW THE ENTIRE STRUCTURE CAUGHT ON FIRE. 
          THAT'S NOT COVERED BY THIS, A SITUATION THAT I BROUGHT UP, UM, WHERE WE FOUND THE ELDERLY WOMAN IN HER HOUSE, UM, UH, COVERED WITH, UH, TICKS AND SORES, UM, UH, LIVE DOGS, DEAD DOGS, FECES THROUGHOUT THE HOUSE, UH, FECES, UH, IN THE, UH, BATHTUB. 
          UH, SHE WAS SITTING IN HER OWN FECES. 
          THE, UH, THE, UH, HAZMAT TEAM HAD TO BE CALLED OUT. 
          THE AMMONIA LEVELS WERE SO HIGH THAT, UH, THE FIRE DEPARTMENT DETERMINED IT WAS DETRIMENTAL. 
          SHE HAD TO BE, UH, VACATED. 
          THAT WASN'T IMMEDIATE HAZARD. 
          SHE WAS BY HERSELF. 
          THERE WAS NO FOOD THERE. 
          THIS WOULD NOT GIVE THE BUILDING OFFICIAL THE AUTHORITY, UH, TO ADDRESS THAT SITUATION. 
          SO THERE'S, UH, THERE'S, IF YOU LIMIT IT TO JUST THESE THREE, YOU'RE REMOVING THE CITY'S ABILITY TO ADDRESS ALL THESE OTHER SITUATIONS. 
          THANKS, MA'AM. 
          AND I CAN KEEP GOING ON, UM, WITH OTHERS. 
          UH, BUT, UH, THOSE TWO HIGHLIGHTED FINALLY, THE THIRD ONE, UH, AT A ILLEGAL BOARDING HOME, WE FOUND A ELDERLY WOMAN TIED TO A WHEELCHAIR, HAD NO FOOD, NO WATER. 
          THE REFRIGERATOR WAS PADLOCKED. 
          SHE HAD BEEN SITTING IN HER OWN FECES AND URINE FOR DAYS. 
          UM, THE CONDITIONS THROUGHOUT THE PROPERTY, UH, WERE HORRENDOUS. 
          AGAIN, ANOTHER SITUATION, IF YOU START SPECIFYING, THEN YOU REMOVE THE ABILITY FOR THE CITY TO GO IN AND ASSIST THE MOST VULNERABLE. 
          THANK YOU FOR THAT. 
          UH, CLARIFICATION 
          [00:20:01]
AND REMINDER. 
          UH, YES, ILLEGAL. 
          WAIT JUST A MINUTE, JESSE, GO AHEAD. 
          TO, JUST TO PLAY THE TABLE ADVOCATE HERE, UH, I'M TRYING TO GET IN THE SHOES OF THE PEOPLE THAT MAYBE WROTE THIS OR PROPOSE THIS AMENDMENT. 
          AND I THINK THEIR SENSE WAS TO THINK OF WAYS TO HOW TO LIMIT THE OVERREACHING, UH, TIMES THAT, UH, UH, MAYBE THE CITY, UH, CITY OFFICIALS HAVE GONE A LITTLE TOO FAR AND DONE THINGS THAT MAYBE COULDN'T HAVE, UH, CONSIDER IM IMMINENT DANGER. 
          SO I WOULD LIKE TO ASK YOU, UH, IF THERE ARE WAYS, OR HOW DO WE GO AROUND THE, THE ORIGINAL, EH, SPIRIT OF THE PEOPLE TRYING TO PROPOSE THIS, WHICH IS PROBABLY HOW DO WE, UH, CREATE A SPACE FOR CITY OFFICIALS TO NOT OVERREACH THEIR POWERS? OF COURSE, LET'S TAKE CARE OF THOSE VULNERABLE, AND LET'S GIVE THEM THE POWER TO DO THAT. 
          BUT HOW DO WE LIMIT THE THEM OVERREACHING THEIR POWERS IN CASE THAT THAT'S THE CASE, BECAUSE THAT, THAT, THAT, UH, A HOLE STILL EXISTS. 
          AND IF WE DON'T DO ANYTHING HERE, MAYBE WE JUST LEAVE THAT EMPTY AND THOSE, UH, UH, UH, CASES COULD BE HAPPENING TOO. 
          UH, IF, IF, UH, THAT'S A CONCERN. 
          UM, I DON'T, IS, UH, ANYONE WHO PROPOSED THESE PRESENT TO NO. 
          UH, IF I COULD COMMENT, GO AHEAD. 
          WHEN YOU READ THE ORIGINAL, UH, S A P M C CODE, UM, IT, IT LEAVES IT VERY OPEN, UH, THAT THE, UH, CODE OFFICIAL, UH, CAN, UM, ACTUALLY DETERMINE WHETHER SOMETHING IS SERIOUS, UH, OR CREATE A, A SERIOUS SITUATION. 
          UH, BUT IF WE, UH, CAN INSERT IMMINENT DANGER, A CONDITION WHICH WOULD CAUSE A REASONABLE LIKELIHOOD OF A SERIOUS LIFE-THREATENING INJURY OR DEATH AT ANY TIME, AND NOT INCLUDE ELECTROCUTION IGNITION OR ASPHYXIATION, WOULD THAT CLEAR THE ISSUE UP FOR YOU? SAVITA? UH, IT, IT CERTAINLY WOULD BE BETTER, BUT AGAIN, UH, THEN I AM GOING TO HAVE TO GO INTO COURT AND ARGUE REASONABLE AND, UH, AND LIKELIHOOD THINK, UH, LIKELIHOOD. 
          SO THIS IS JUST THE DEFINITION NOW, WHAT ESTEBAN HAD, UH, BROUGHT UP, KEEP IT. 
          THE, UH, THE CONCERNS ARE, UH, HAD A CHALLENGE IF, UH, THERE'S AN OVERREACH. 
          SO, UH, THE IMMINENT DANGER, THIS IS JUST THE DEFINITION. 
          BUT THEN AS WE GET TO, UH, THE APPEAL PROCESS, THAT'S HOW TO CHALLENGE THE, UH, DETERMINATION THAT IT'S, UH, THE CONDITION IS AN IMMINENT DANGER. 
          UH, SAMHSA VIOLATIONS THAT WOULD GO TO B SS B, UH, IF IT'S COMING OUT OF CHAPTER SIX, THAT GOES TO, UH, DISTRICT COURT. 
          SO THERE ARE LEGAL AVENUES, UH, TO PROCEED IF, UH, THE, UH, PROPERTY OWNER OR TENANT PROPERTY OWNER, UH, CONTESTS THE DETERMINATION. 
          AND SO, IN CASES OF IMMINENT DANGER CASE LAW, UH, I WON'T BORE YOU WITH ALL THE CASE LAW BACK FROM THE, UH, 12 HUNDREDS, BUT, UM, BUT BRI CASE LAW GOING FORWARD, UH, HAVE ALL PROVIDED INHERENT AUTHORITY TO ADDRESS WHAT A BUILDING OFFICIAL, WHAT A FIRE CHIEF, WHAT A POLICE CHIEF DETERMINE IMMINENT. 
          SO THEY CAN TAKE IMMEDIATE ACTION AS LONG AS THERE IS, UH, WHAT'S CALLED POST DEPRIVATION PROCESS PROVIDED IN THE POST DEPRIVATION PROCESS FOR SAMHSA IS TO GO TO B S B. 
          IF, UH, THE, UH, APPELLANT, UH, DISAGREES WITH THE BSBS DETERMINATION, THEY HAVE AN ABSOLUTE RIGHT TO GO TO DISTRICT COURT ON THE STRUCTURAL SIDE UNDER CHAPTER SIX FOR EMERGENCY DEMOLITIONS. 
          UH, THEY, UH, THE PROPERTY OWNER HAS AN IMMEDIATE RIGHT TO GO TO DISTRICT COURT. 
          WE ALSO HAVE THE ISSUE OF JUST STAFF, STAFF STRUCTURE. 
          YOU'VE GOT A CODE OFFICER, YOU'VE GOT A CODE SUPERVISOR, THEN YOU'VE GOT A CODE SUPERVISOR OF THE SUPERVISORS, AND THEN YOU'VE GOT A CODE, I MEAN, A DIRECT OR ASSISTANT DIRECTOR 
          [00:25:01]
OF THE DEVELOPMENT STAFF. 
          AND THEN YOU'VE GOT THE DIRECTOR OF THE DEVELOPMENT STAFF. 
          SO IDEALLY, THE ORGANIZATIONAL STRUCTURE SHOULD HOPEFULLY ELIMINATE THAT POSSIBILITY. 
          UH, LET ME GO TO MR. ZIKA AND THEN I'LL COME BACK TO YOU, MR. ZIKA. 
          YES. 
          LEGAL, WHAT WORD TO ADD A WORD HERE, YOU KNOW, JUST KEEP, WHAT'S THERE? WHAT WORD COULD WE PUT IN THAT WOULD SURVIVE A CHALLENGE MORE OR LESS, YOU KNOW, YOU SUGGESTIONS, MAYBE THE BOARD HAS A SUGGESTION, BUT TO ME, WHAT WORD WOULD IT BE? AND THEN TO SURVIVE, YOU KNOW, THE CHALLENGE, MAY I MAKE ONE ANSWER FOR YOU AS A REAL SHORT ANSWER? THE, THE REAL, REAL SHORT ANSWER IS THE RECOMMENDATION FROM LEGAL WAS LEAVE IT LIKE IT WAS, AND LEGAL. 
          I DID NOT WANT TO SPEAK BEFORE YOU NECESSARY. 
          GO AHEAD AND, AND AGREE WITH ME OR DISAGREE WITH ME ON THAT, UH, RESPONSE. 
          YOU SEE, YOU'RE LIMITED IN HERE AND IT DOESN'T COVER EVERYTHING. 
          I GUESS, YOU KNOW, COL WOULD, IF COTIS, YOU KNOW, SATISFIED WITH IT, GREAT. 
          BUT TO ME, IT NEEDS A WORD TO CATCH ALL. 
          OKAY. 
          BECAUSE TO ME, THERE'S DIFFERENT SITUATIONS. 
          AND, UH, PART OF THE HOUSE IS, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, DAKOTA OFFICER CAN'T GO IN THERE TO SAY IT'S DANGEROUS BECAUSE PART OF THE HOUSE IS IN GOOD, UH, FLOORING. 
          AND THE OTHER JUST A MINOR, UM, UH, KINDERGARTEN EXAMPLE. 
          AND THE OTHER ONE IS ALL ROTTEN AND THE LIKES, SO THE COURT OFFICER, I MEAN, I WOULD SAY DON'T GO, YOU KNOW, AND THAT WOULD BE HIS DECISION, LIKE YOU SAY. 
          AND THERE'S LAYERS OF LEADERSHIP. 
          OKAY. 
          BUT I MEAN, IS THERE A WORD? YOU KNOW, WE COULD LEAVE IT THE WAY IT IS AND, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER, YOU KNOW, AND, UH, BUT REALLY, I MEAN, I WOULD LIKE A WORD TO BE PUT IN THERE, AND I'M, YOU KNOW, I'M ASKING BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW WHAT WORD IS THAT I WOULD PUT IN THERE, ET CETERA. 
          NO. 
          BUT SOMETHING THAT WILL, YOU KNOW, LIKE SURVIVE THE CHALLENGE. 
          THANK YOU, AMIN. 
          THANK YOU. 
          UM, SORRY, THIS IS AMIN THOMAS. 
          MAY I JUMP IN JUST A MINUTE? LET ME, UH, COME BACK TO YOU. 
          THANK YOU. 
          UH, JUST, JUST TO FOLLOW UP, UH, WOULD IT BE A GOOD IDEA TO, UH, NO, LET ME REPHRASE THIS. 
          IF A PERSON READS THE GENERAL DEFINITIONS, THESE, THESE DAYS, UH, DO THEY UNDERSTAND CLEARLY THAT ALL THESE DEFINITIONS, INCLUDING IMMINENT DANGER IF USED BY A CO OFFICIAL, CAN BE CHALLENGED, UH, IN, IN THE PROCESS? LIKE, OR, OR WOULD IT BE BETTER TO INCLUDE HERE AFTER THE DEFINITION OR AT, AT THE, AT THE TOP, I DUNNO WHERE EXACTLY. 
          A, A A PHRASE THAT EXPLICITLY STATES THAT A PERSON, UH, UH, OR ANY ACTION TAKEN UNDER THESE DEFINITIONS CAN BE CHALLENGED. 
          IS THAT CLEAR CURRENTLY? OR SHOULD WE ADD THAT? UH, I, I, UH, AND I SEE WHERE, UH, YOU'RE GETTING AT TO MAKE IT MORE CLEAR, UH, I DON'T THINK IT'S APPROPRIATE TO PUT IT IN THE DEFINITIONS, BUT WHEN WE GET TO THE SECTIONS ADDRESSING THE PROCESS, AND, UH, AT THAT POINT, UH, IT, IT'S ALREADY STATED IN THERE THAT, UH, THESE DECISIONS, UH, CAN BE APPEALED. 
          BUT I WOULD RECOMMEND DOING IT WHEN WE GET TO THE SECTIONS. 
          UM, I, I, I'M ASSUMING, BUT I DON'T KNOW. 
          UM, YEAH, 'CAUSE I, I, UH, I DON'T KNOW WHO PROPOSED IT OR WHAT, UH, UM, THE REQUEST WAS. 
          BUT IF THIS IS RELATED TO NOTICES TO VACATE, WHICH IS, UH, BEING LITIGATED RIGHT NOW, UM, THAT WHOLE, UH, ISSUE IS ABOUT, UH, THE RIGHT TO APPEAL A NOTICE TO VACATE. 
          AND SO IF THAT'S WHAT THE CONCERN IS, THEN, UH, DEFINITION, IT SHOULD NOT BE PUT IN DEFINITIONS, BUT RATHER IN THE SECTION THAT DEALS WITH PROCESS. 
          AND THEN, UH, AS FAR AS LIKE NOTICES TO VACATE LANGUAGE HAS BEEN ADDED, THAT YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO APPEAL TO THE BUILDING STANDARDS BOARD. 
          UH, SO I THINK IT WOULD BE MORE APPROPRIATE TO ADDRESS IT WHEN, IF, IF IT'S RELATED TO NOTICES TO VACATE, WHICH I, I THINK IT IS. 
          BUT, UH, IT WOULD BE BETTER TO ADDRESS IT IN A DIFFERENT SECTION THAN DEFINITIONS. 
          MR. CHAIRMAN, UH, JUST A MINUTE, WE HAVE SOMEONE SIGNED UP TO SPEAK. 
          IF YOU WOULD PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME AND THAT YOU ARE A CITIZEN OF SAN ANTONIO. 
          [00:30:02]
WHO WAS THAT, THAT WAS TRYING TO SPEAK, OR WAS? OH, IT WAS THAT. 
          THAT'S ME. 
          THIS IS AMIN AL. 
          OH, I'M SORRY, AMIN. 
          I, I APOLOGIZE. 
          I DIDN'T NO, NO PROBLEM. 
          I DIDN'T RECOGNIZE YOU FOR SOME REASON. 
          GO AHEAD, . 
          NO, IT'S OKAY. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANKS FOR ALLOWING ME TO SPEAK, AND SORRY I COULDN'T BE THERE TODAY. 
          , I'M ON  DUE TO CLOSE CONTACT WITH COVID, SO I DON'T WANNA GET IN. 
          I'M NOT SICK SO FAR, BUT I DON'T WANT ANYBODY TO GET SICK. 
          UH, SO JUST REAL QUICK, UM, I, I DON'T WANNA SAY THE SAME THINGS I GUESS YOU GUYS TALKED ABOUT, BUT DEFINITELY I THINK THE WAY IT IS COVERS BASICALLY EVERYTHING, AND WE DON'T WANNA LIMIT OURSELF TO ONLY LIKE TWO OR THREE ITEMS, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, I THINK I, I KIND OF UNDERSTAND WHERE THEY'RE COMING FROM AND THEY WANNA MAKE SURE WE DON'T OVERREACH. 
          SO BASICALLY MY QUESTION IS, DO WE HAVE EXAMPLES OF WHEN DO YOU FEEL THE CITY OVERREACHED, UH, USING THIS DEFINITION? BECAUSE WHEN WE KNOW THOSE EXAMPLES, MAYBE WE CAN'T TAILOR THE DEFINITION TO FIT THAT, BUT WITHOUT KNOWING EXACTLY WHAT, WHEN DID WE OVERREACH OR WHAT ARE THE EXAMPLES? I MEAN, WHAT ARE WE TRYING TO FIX? I GUESS WITHOUT KNOWING THE ISSUE, IF YOU WOULD GO AHEAD. 
          I DIDN'T, I, I DIDN'T WRITE THE PROPOSAL AMENDMENT, SO I DON'T KNOW. 
          I'M JUST OKAY. 
          AS ANY PERSON THAT YOU WOULD AGREE, IT'S NOT HARD TO THINK IT OTHER POSSIBILITY WHERE THERE COULD BE AN OVERREACH, MAYBE A PERSON THINKS, SINCE THIS IS SUBJECTIVE, AND LEAVE IT TO, UH, THE APPRECIATION OF ONE PERSON DECIDING, ONE PERSON COULD DECIDE AND CAN MAKE A MISTAKE TOO, ON THIS IS IMMINENT DANGER, BECAUSE I THINK BECAUSE THE CULTURAL VALUES THAT I CARRY WITH, MAYBE, BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, I MISSED ONE OF THE DAYS ON THE, ON THE, ON THE ORIENTATION TO BECOME A, A CITY, UH, CODE OFFICIAL. 
          AND I DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THIS VERY WELL. 
          SO THERE COULD BE CASES, IT'S NOT TOO HARD TO THINK THAT AN OVERREACH COULD BE DONE EITHER BY MISTAKE, EITHER BY MISINTERPRETATION MISINFORMATION, OR MAYBE EVEN INTENTIONALLY. 
          SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE SPECIFIC EXAMPLES ARE. 
          I ACTUALLY DON'T THINK WE SHOULD BE GUIDING POLICY BASED ON A SPECIFIC EXAMPLES. 
          YOU KNOW, THE IDEA OF LEGAL IS LET'S TRY TO KEEP THESE AS, AS, AS GENERAL AS POSSIBLE SO WE CAN FEED ALL THE CASES. 
          I UNDERSTAND THE, THE QUESTION FROM, UH, FROM, UH, AMIT, BUT MAYBE SOME OF THE OTHER, UH, NON-BOARDING MEMBERS COULD SHED MORE LIGHT TO THAT. 
          I, I, I COULD, I I THINK THAT THE PROPOSAL IS TRYING TO CLARIFY WHAT IMMINENT DANGER IS. 
          UH, AND, UH, IMMINENT DANGER DESCRIBES A CONDITION THAT IS, UH, UH, LIKELY TO OCCUR. 
          OKAY. 
          AND, AND AS IT STANDS RIGHT NOW, AS THE, UH, ITEM NUMBER ONE STANDS RIGHT NOW, UH, IT DOESN'T DESCRIBE THAT CONDITION. 
          IT, IT, IT JUST IN GENERAL SAYS, UH, A CONDITION WHICH COULD CAUSE COULD CAUSE SERIOUS, UH, OR LIFE-THREATENING INJURY. 
          UH, AND, AND THE PROPOSAL, UH, IT'S A LITTLE BIT WORDY, BUT, UH, IT, IF WE COULD, UH, I GUESS DESCRIBE OR CLARIFY WHAT IMMINENT DANGER IS, UH, AND, UH, THAT WOULD MAKE IT A, A LOT LESS LIKELY FOR ANY OVERREACH, UH, WHERE THE CODE OFFICIAL COULD INTERPRET THAT ANY CONDITION THAT HE SEEMS, UH, THAT HE DEEMS, UH, COULD CAUSE A SERIOUS INJURY. 
          UH, SO, SO WE CAN CLARIFY THAT, THAT, UH, UH, CONDITION THAT IT, IT IS MORE LIKELY TO OCCUR OR IT'S IMPENDING, UH, AND THAT IT HAS A DIFFERENT DEGREE OF, UM, I GUESS PERIL. 
          AND, AND THAT'S WHAT THE, THE TERM IMPLIES, UH, IMMINENT DANGER. 
          SO PRIMARY, THE WORD LIKELY IS, UH, THE KEY WORD THAT YOU'RE THINKING ABOUT. 
          OKAY, MIKE? UM, I JUST KIND OF WANTED TO JUMP IN A LITTLE BIT. 
          I KNOW, RAY, YOU HAD ASKED A QUESTION A COUPLE COMMENTS AGO, WHICH IS MAY, MAYBE WE DON'T LIMIT IT TO THESE THREE OR FOUR KIND OF LAUNDRY LIST OF ITEMS, BUT IF WE WERE TO ADD REASONABLE LIKELIHOOD, AND I KNOW IN TALKING WITH NOT ONLY SAVITA, BUT OTHER ATTORNEYS, IT'S A TOUGH ONE TO, TO BE IN COURT IF YOU'RE GOING TO DEFEND THAT. 
          BUT I THINK, I THINK WE'RE OKAY. 
          I THINK I WOULD BE OKAY AS A CODE OFFICIAL, IF WE WERE TO ADD A CONDITION WHICH COULD CAUSE IN A REASONABLY LIKELIHOOD SCENARIO OR WHATEVER THAT PART OF IT IS, I THINK WE'D BE OKAY WITH THAT. 
          BECAUSE WHEN WE, WHEN WE USE THE TERM IMMINENT DANGER, WHEN STAFF AND I USE IT AND WE MAKE DECISIONS BASED ON THAT, IT'S NOT, WELL, SOMETHING COULD HAPPEN MAYBE SOMEDAY IF I DO A WORST CASE SCENARIO, WORST CASE SCENARIO, WORST CASE SCENARIO, IT IS, THERE'S SOMETHING PRETTY BAD RIGHT THERE, AND IT'S, IT, IT, IT'S LIKELY THAT IT COULD HAPPEN TODAY, TOMORROW, THIS WEEK. 
          SO I DON'T KNOW IF RAY, UH, TO YOUR POINT, I THINK WE, 
          [00:35:01]
I WOULD BE COMFORTABLE IF WE ADDED REASONABLE LIKELIHOOD TO THE PIECE, BUT NOT THE SECOND PIECE, BECAUSE I JUST FEAR IF WE MISS SOMETHING ON THE LAUNDRY LIST THAT WE RUN INTO LATER, THAT WOULD BE AN ISSUE. 
          UM, SO THAT WOULD BE MY 2 CENTS. 
          UH, AND, AND RAY, I WAS JUST WANTED TO GET BACK TO YOUR COMMENT, WHICH WAS, WHICH IS, COULD, COULD WE, COULD WE GO WITH THE FIRST PART OF THIS RECOMMENDATION, BUT MAYBE NOT THE SECOND PART? AND TO ME, I THINK THAT'S A, I THINK THAT'S A GOOD IMPROVEMENT. 
          I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING WE CAN WORK WITH. 
          SAVITA MIGHT WORK A LITTLE HARDER IN A COURT CASE, BUT THEN SHE'LL JUST CHARGE ME MORE LATER FOR IT. 
          I'M SURE. 
          SO, WHICH IS WHAT THAT JUST AGAIN, MY 2 CENTS, I LET YOU GUYS DECIDE WHAT AND APPROPRIATE, THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT YOU SAID A MOMENT AGO, ISN'T IT? THANK YOU. 
          UH, MR. ZIKA, MR. CHAIRMAN. 
          MR. CHAIRMAN. 
          WAIT, I LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION. 
          NO, I'VE GOT, I'VE GOT A MOTION THAT I'VE GOTTA DEAL WITH. 
          FIRST WE'RE DISCUSSING, SO THERE'S ALREADY BEEN A MOTION. 
          AND THE SECOND, MR. GUPTA, YOU HAVE THE MICROPHONE, SIR, THAT THE, THE, THE MOTION ON THE TABLE ACTUALLY IS TWO PA HAS TWO PARTS TO IT. 
          ONE IS THE, UH, LIFE THREATENING INJURY, WHICH IS A HUMAN FACTOR, AND THE SECOND ONE IS THE COLLAPSE OF THE STRUCTURE, WHICH IS THE STRUCTURE PART OF IT. 
          WELL, THE, THE LEGAL, UH, GUIDANCE WAS YOU CAN'T USE COLLAPSE ONLY BECAUSE THERE'S SEVERAL OTHER THINGS THAT COULD HAPPEN, RIGHT? I E A BORDER COULD EXPLODE, ET CETERA. 
          AND I DON'T WANNA ARGUE WITH YOU, IT'S YOUR MOTION. 
          YEAH. 
          THAT, THAT'S JUST AN ISSUE, UH, THAT WE WOULD HAVE TO DEAL WITH FROM A LEGAL. 
          SO THE QUESTION IS, DO YOU WANT TO SEPARATE THE TWO? UH, BECAUSE THE ORIGINAL SA P M C SET IS DEALS ONLY WITH THE HUMAN INJURY, AND THIS SECOND PO, UH, THE PROPOSAL ALSO INCLUDES THE STRUCTURE. 
          UH, YOU WANNA MODIFY YOUR MOTION THEN? LET ME, LET ME ALLOW YOU TO AT LEAST MODIFY THE MOTION. 
          YEAH. 
          IF YOU WANT TO LEAVE JUST THE HUMAN PART, UH, AND ELIMINATE THE STRUCTURE PART, I'LL BE FINE WITH IT. 
          AND WE'LL WANT, I, I, I CAN MOVE TO MODIFY THE MOTION, UH, TO SAY THAT THE CONDITION WHICH COULD CAUSE A REASONABLE LIKELIHOOD OF SERIOUS OR LIFE-THREATENING INJURY, PERIOD. 
          OKAY, THEN THAT'S WHAT, THAT'S WHAT RAY WAS SUGGESTING THEN BASICALLY, SO LEMME REITERATE, THE MOTION IS TO ACCEPT THE REVISED DEFINITION OF IMID DANGER TO, TO READ A CONDITION WHICH COULD CAUSE A REASONABLE LIKELIHOOD OF SERIOUS OR LIFE-THREATENING INJURY OR DEATH. 
          CONCUR. 
          THAT IS THE MOTION. 
          I HAVE A SECOND. 
          SECOND. 
          I'M SORRY. 
          SECOND MS. MS. BROWN ALSO, SHE JUMPED ON MR. , MS. BROWN. 
          SECOND THE MOTION. 
          UH, ANY DISCUSSION ON THE REVISED PROPOSAL? WELL, IT'S DISCUSSION, SO YOU CAN BRING THAT UP. 
          ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION, SAY AYE. 
          AYE. 
          AYE. 
          THOSE OPPOSED SAY NAY. 
          THE MOTION CARRIES. 
          MR. CHAIR. 
          YES, MA'AM. 
          UM, AGAIN, UH, WITHOUT KNOWING, UH, THE PURPOSE OF THIS, BUT IN, IN LIGHT OF, UH, ALL THE ISSUES WITH THE NOTICES TO VACATE, UH, I THINK IT WOULD BE HELPFUL FOR EVERYBODY TO KNOW WHAT THE, THEIR, THE PROCESS IS BEFORE A NOTICE TO VACATE IS ISSUED. 
          SURE. 
          SO THAT, I, I THINK THERE'S SOME MISUNDERSTANDING IN THAT, UM, DANNY COULD GO OUT AND, UH, DETERMINE, UH, THERE'S A THREAT, AND HE WILL ISSUE THE NOTICE TO VACATE RIGHT THEN AND THERE. 
          UH, THE CODE OFFICER DOES NOT HAVE THE ABILITY TO DO THAT. 
          IT GOES THROUGH A PROCESS WHERE THEN, UH, MIKE AND AMIN MAKE THE FINAL DECISION. 
          SO JENNY, I GUESS, OR DANNY, UH, DO Y'ALL WANNA JUST PROVIDE WHAT THE STEPS ARE AND, UH, BEFORE A NOTICE OF VACATED SHOULD? YEAH, SURE. 
          I CAN TAKE THAT. 
          UM, THIS IS JENNY EZ, UH, CODE ENFORCEMENT MANAGER WITH THE DEPARTMENT. 
          SO OUR TYPICAL STANCE IS, UM, WHETHER A CASE IS WHAT WE CALL PROACTIVE, AN OFFICER'S DRIVING BY AND OBSERVES IT. 
          A SITUATION OR A REACTIVE CALL COMES IN, SOMEBODY HAS CALLED IT IN TO 3 1 1 TO INVESTIGATE. 
          WE DO GO MAKE THE LOCATION OFFICER WILL ISSUE NOTICES. 
          THOSE ARE SIMPLY NOTICES OF VIOLATION TO CORRECT AND ISSUE A DEFICIENCY, WHETHER IT'S A TALL GRASS AND WEEDS ACCUMULATION OVER 12 INCHES IN HEIGHT, WHETHER WINDOWS ARE BROKEN, WHETHER STRUCTURAL, YOU KNOW, IT, IT GOES THE WHOLE GAMUT FROM EXTERIOR MAINTENANCE, UH, EXTERIOR MAINTENANCE TO INTERIOR MAINTENANCE OF, UH, ANY PART OF THE STRUCTURE ON THAT PROPERTY THAT THEY'RE 
          [00:40:01]
ABLE TO OBSERVE AND, UH, MAKE NOTE OF THOSE DEFICIENCIES, THOSE NOTICES ARE ISSUED THAT NOTICES THAT NOTICE IS REQUIRED TO BE POSTED ON THE STRUCTURE AND ALSO TO BE MAILED IF THAT NOTICE CANNOT BE ISSUED IN PERSON, IF NOBODY'S THERE TO TAKE THE NOTICE, UH, IN HAND ONCE THOSE NOTICES ARE MAILED, IF NOBODY'S THERE TO TAKE IT IN PERSON, IT'S SENT IN THE MAIL. 
          THERE IS A TIMELINE THAT WE DO GIVE AS WELL FOR THE PROCESS OF MAILING. 
          SO TYPICALLY IT'S ABOUT A TWO WEEKS THAT WE WILL THEN DO A RE-INSPECTION. 
          A RE-INSPECTION DOES OCCUR AT THE EXPIRATION OF THE NOTICE TO SEE HAS ANY TO ACTION TAKEN PLACE AS ANY COMMUNICATION TAKEN PLACE, HAS THEY REACHED OUT FOR CLARIFICATION OR ANY COMMITMENT OF WHEN THEY WILL RECTIFY THOSE ISSUES OR HOW THOSE ISSUES ARE BEING TAKEN CARE OF? IF THERE'S NO COMMUNICATION, THE OFFICERS DOCUMENTING THAT, UM, TYPICALLY MOST OF THESE TYPE OF ISSUES THAT RISE TO THE LEVEL OF IMMINENT DANGER ARE GONNA BE ONE OF TWO THINGS. 
          UM, IF IT'S A, AN OCCUPIED STRUCTURE THAT HAS AN ACT OF SEWER LEAK, AN ACT OF, UM, YOU KNOW, UH, OUTDOOR GAS, UH, WATER HEATER THAT YOU WOULD TYPICALLY SEE FROM THE OUTSIDE, UM, THOSE ACTIONS WOULD, WOULD BE TAKEN, UH, AS I MENTIONED BEFORE. 
          AND IF THOSE, IF NOTHING HAS BEEN DONE, NOTHING'S BEEN COMMUNICATED TO MAKE THOSE CORRECTIONS, OR HOW THOSE CORRECTIONS ARE GONNA TAKE PLACE, THOSE PHOTO DOCUMENTATION WOULD BE TAKING PLACE, WRITTEN DOWN IN A CONVERSATION, WOULD THEN HAVE TO TAKE PLACE WITH THEIR SUPERVISOR. 
          THIS IS WHAT I'VE GOT. 
          THIS IS WHAT'S NOT OCCURRING. 
          THIS IS WHERE I SEE AN IMMEDIATE DANGER IS A POTENTIAL FOR A FIRE FOR, YOU KNOW, FURTHER, UM, I GUESS YOU COULD SAY DAMAGE TO OCCUR EITHER TO THE RESIDENCE OF THE PROPERTY OR TO THE NEIGHBORING RESIDENTS OR BOTH. 
          SO IF THEY'RE MAKING THAT, THAT COMMUNICATION NOW TO THEIR SUPERVISOR, THAT'S AN ESCALATION PHASE. 
          UM, SO WE ARE ALREADY TWO WEEKS OUT POTENTIALLY, UM, BEFORE THAT'S NOW BEING, UH, ESCALATED TO THEIR SUPERVISOR. 
          IF THE SUPERVISOR AGREES WITH THAT ASSESSMENT, TYPICALLY THE SUPERVISOR WILL ACTUALLY GO ON SITE. 
          SO THERE'S ANOTHER INSPECTION THAT'S ALSO GONNA TAKE PLACE. 
          THEY NEED TO SEE WHAT'S OCCURRING, TO SEE WHAT'S THE EXTENT OF THIS DAMAGE, WHAT THE EXTENT OF, OF THE, UH, THE ISSUE IS. 
          IF THEY'RE IN AGREEMENT WITH THAT IN ASSESSMENT, THEN THEY DO WRITE UP A RECOMMENDATION. 
          THEY WRITE UP A MEMO, TAKE THEIR PHOTOS, TIMESTAMP. 
          WE ALSO NEED TO MAKE SURE IF WE'RE GOING TO THIS LEVEL OF IMMINENT DANGER, WE'RE ALSO ENGAGING WHAT WE CALL OUR NEIGHBORHOOD HOUSING. 
          UH, OUR HOUSING NEIGHBORHOOD SERVICES DEPARTMENT, THOSE ARE THE FOLKS THAT DO HAVE THE, UM, ACCESSIBILITY FOR, UH, POTENTIALLY OFFERING ASSISTANCE, WHETHER IT'S RELOCATION ASSISTANCE OR POTENTIALLY REPAIR ASSISTANCE AND THINGS LIKE THAT ARE ALSO OCCURRING. 
          SO WE ALSO HAVE TO MAKE SURE WE'VE ENGAGED THOSE FOLKS. 
          IF THIS IS AN OCCUPIED STRUCTURE, WHICH IS TYPICALLY WHY WE WOULD, UM, ENGAGE FOR A POTENTIAL VACATE ORDER. 
          ONCE THAT INSPECTION IS MADE WITH HOUSING AND NEIGHBORHOOD SERVICES ON SITE, HAVE THEY BEEN ABLE TO MAKE THOSE CONTACTS WITH THE RESIDENTS OR TENANTS OR OWNERS? THEN THAT IS THAT PACKET THAT WE WERE TALKING ABOUT GETS PUT TOGETHER DATES AND TIMES OF WHEN THESE OFFERS HAVE BEEN MADE, WHAT THE SUPERVISOR OBSERVED, THE PHOTOS AND THE DATE AND TIMESTAMPS THAT IS PUT TOGETHER, AND THEN PROCESSED TO A MANAGER WITH A DEPARTMENT, EITHER, UH, MYSELF, DANNY, OR WE HAVE TWO OTHER MANAGERS IN THE DEPARTMENT TO NOW REVIEW THE ENTIRETY OF THAT PACKET, CHECKS THE BOX TO SEE WHAT IS OCCURRING, WHAT'S THE LEVEL OF THIS OCCURRING, WHAT IS THE POSSIBILITY OF THIS BEING REPAIRED BY THE OWNER? IS IT JUST MORE TIME THEY NEED, DO THEY HAVE NOT HAVE THE FUNDS? YOU KNOW, AND AGAIN, WHO AND HOW ARE THESE IMPACTING THE RESIDENTS ON THE PROPERTY OR THE NEIGHBORING RESIDENTS? EVERYTHING IS THEN IN AGREEMENT. 
          THEN THE NEXT LEVEL, AS IT GOES TO THE, THE DEPUTY DIRECTOR AND THE BUILDING OFFICIAL, OUR DIRECTOR, UH, MIKE SHANNON, FOR A FINAL RECOMMENDATION AND FOR THEIR SIGNATURE, IF THEY HAVE MORE QUESTIONS, THERE MAY BE MORE QUESTIONS THAT ARISE, OR THEY, THEY, UH, THEY MAY BE IN AGREEMENT OR THEY MAY NOT BE IN AGREEMENT, BUT THEY HAVE THE FINAL SAY ON WHETHER WE HAVE NOW REACHED THAT THRESHOLD OF IMMINENT DANGER. 
          SO THERE ARE MANY DIFFERENT LEVELS THAT ARE BEING, UM, REVIEWED ON THIS TYPE OF CASE. 
          WHEN IT REACHES THIS, TO QUANTIFY THIS, TO QUALIFY THIS, THERE ARE MANY DIFFERENT LEVELS OF, OF ADDITIONAL EXPERIENCE AND ADDITIONAL SCRUTINY THAT ARE DEFINITELY OCCURRING. 
          AND, AND I'VE JUST REALLY GENERALIZED IT AND STREAMLINED IT BECAUSE THERE'S STILL A LOT OF OTHER THINGS THAT MAY POP INTO THAT AT ANY GIVEN TIME. 
          BUT THAT'S THE KIND OF GENERAL STRAIGHT GUIDELINE OF SOMETHING THAT WOULD OCCUR WHEN WE'RE THE LEVEL OF MAKING THE RECOMMENDATION THAT WE BELIEVE THIS PROPERTY, UH, IS CREATING AN IMMINENT DANGER FOR EITHER THE RESIDENTS OR THE NEIGHBORING RESIDENTS, THE IMMEDIATE NEIGHBORING RESIDENTS, 
          [00:45:01]
BECAUSE IT'S NEVER JUST THE PROPERTY, IT'S ALWAYS WE'RE HAVING TO TAKE INTO ACCOUNT THE NEIGHBORS AS WELL OF HOW THEY'RE BEING IMPACTED AT ANY GIVEN TIME. 
          AND I THINK THAT COVERED THE VERY HIGH LEVEL, UH, LOGISTICS OF IT. 
          SAVITA, THANK YOU. 
          YEAH, I JUST WANTED TO, I THINK THERE, THERE'S JUST SOME CONFUSION, UM, OUT IN THE PUBLIC, SO I, I APPRECIATE IT. 
          THANK YOU VERY MUCH. 
          IF, IF I COULD. 
          ALRIGHT, RAY, UH, JENNY, YOU MADE A COUPLE OF STATEMENTS THERE. 
          UH, THAT I THINK ADDS TO THE CONFUSION TO THE PUBLIC AND, AND ONE, ONE OF THE STATEMENTS WAS THAT GENERALLY IT TAKES ABOUT TWO WEEKS. 
          UH, WHEN WE ASKED FOR, UH, 10, UH, TWO WEEK, UM, DEFINITION OR A STATEMENT ON THE NOTICES, UH, WE WERE TOLD IT IT'S ONLY 10 DAYS. 
          AND 10 DAYS IS, UH, IT COULD INCLUDE A WEEKEND OR HOLIDAY. 
          SO TWO WEEKS IS NOT, IT IS, IN MY OPINION, A LOT MORE REASONABLE THAN 10 DAYS, BUT ON THE NOTICE IT SAYS 10 DAYS. 
          SO I THINK, UH, THE PUBLIC HAS A RIGHT TO BE CONFUSED WHEN I MENTION TWO WEEKS. 
          WE ADD THOSE EXTRA TWO DAYS GENERALLY BECAUSE OF THE MAILING, BECAUSE WE DO KNOW MAILING DOESN'T OCCUR THAT SAME DAY THAT WE'RE INPUTTING THE REQUEST FOR THE MAIL OUT. 
          WE'RE, WE'RE ADDING THAT LITTLE BIT OF BUFFER. 
          SO WE WE'RE TRYING TO BE AS REASONABLE AND WHERE REASONABLE AS COMES INTO PLAY. 
          THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO WORK WITH. 
          UM, THERE IS A DATE THAT USUALLY PRINTS OUT ON THOSE NOTICES OR IS WRITTEN ON THOSE NOTICES TO CLARIFY THAT, SO THAT THERE'S NOT CONFUSION. 
          THE OFFICER DOES ADD A DATE ON THERE OF WHEN THEY WILL BE BACK FOR RE-INSPECTION, AS WELL AS THEIR NAME AND THEIR PHONE NUMBER. 
          AND THE TIMES THAT THEY ARE ON DUTY AND AVAILABLE TO ANSWER QUESTIONS OR TO COMMUNICATE THAT EFFORT. 
          THEY DO LEAVE THEIR NAME ON ANY TYPE OF HANDOUTS THEY'RE DOING OR LEAVING IS NAME AND PHONE NUMBER OF THE OFFICER WHO'S BEEN ON SITE. 
          ANOTHER STATEMENT THAT, THAT YOU ALSO MADE IS THAT, UH, THE OFFICER, UH, CONTACTS N H S D AND, UH, AND THEY CAN PROVIDE SERVICES. 
          HOWEVER, MOST OF THE TIME, OR A LOT OF THE TIMES, N H SS D IS OUT OF FUNDS, SO THEY CANNOT PROVIDE SERVICES, UH, ANY TYPE OF SERVICES. 
          SO, UH, ALTHOUGH IT SOUNDS REALLY NICE THAT, UH, N H S D CAN, CAN, UH, UH, PROVIDE SOMETHING IT, THAT USUALLY DOESN'T HAPPEN. 
          IS THAT TAKEN INTO ACCOUNT? I'M NOT SURE WHAT YOU MEAN BY TAKING INTO ACCOUNT. 
          UH, I, I'M ACTUALLY GONNA DIRECT JENNY NOT TO ANSWER THAT QUESTION. 
          THAT'S NOT RELEVANT. 
          UH, UH, THIS DISCUSSION THAT'S, UH, UM, N H SS D HAS SERVICES AND, UH, THEY PROVIDE, UH, MORE THAN JUST PROGRAMS. SO, UM, LET'S NOT GET INTO THAT. 
          AND YOU ALSO HAVE THE ISSUE THAT EVERYTHING IS NOT ABSOLUTE FINITE EITHER, ESPECIALLY IF THERE'S, UH, CIRCUMSTANCES THAT CAN BE IDENTIFIED SPECIFICALLY. 
          UH, AND THAT HAPPENS FREQUENTLY. 
          I'M SORRY, BUT SHE, SHE BROUGHT UP N H S D. 
          I UNDERSTAND THAT. 
          AND, AND, UH, I DON'T THINK SAVITA IS THE CHAIR. 
          YEP, I UNDERSTAND THAT. 
          WE'RE GONNA MOVE TO ITEM NUMBER 46 AND 84. 
          THOSE ARE IDENTICAL, UH, PROPOSALS. 
          GIVE YOU A CHANCE TO READ THROUGH THOSE. 
          [00:50:04]
AND I WILL SAY THE CHAIR HAS SOME CONCERNS ABOUT REPURPOSING, BECAUSE I HAVE SEEN SOME EXTREMELY CREATIVE REPURPOSING, BUT THAT'S JUST ME. 
          UH, CHAIR ENTERTAIN A MOTION ON ITEMS COMBINED ITEMS 46 AND 84, MR. CHAIR, UNDER S A P M C, SECTION 2 0 2 GENERAL DEF DEFINITIONS, UH, 46 AND 84. 
          I MOTION THAT WE STAY WITH THE 2018 VERSION. 
          MOTION ON THE FLOOR IS TO STAY WITH THE, UH, 2018 VERSION FOR OUTPLACEMENT SECOND MOTION. 
          UH, SECOND, MR. ZIKA AND MR. GUPTA COMBINED A DISCUSSION ON THE MOTION. 
          CAN YOU, UH, GO AHEAD. 
          CAN YOU PLEASE PROVIDE AN EXPLANATION TO WHY WOULD YOU KEEP THE, THE ONE FROM 2018, UH, DISCARDING ALL THE PROPOSED, UH, AND WHY, CAN YOU JUST EXPLAIN TO US WHY YOU DON'T THINK, UH, THAT THE PROPOSAL IS, OR ANY PART OF THE PROPOSAL IT'S ACCEPTABLE? I, I, UH, CHAIR, DO WE NEED TO DEBATE IT OR CAN HE ASK THAT KIND OF A QUESTION THAT'S HE'S COMFORTABLE? GO AHEAD. 
          THAT, THAT'S FINE. 
          GO AHEAD. 
          I WAS GONNA DO IT ANYWAY ONCE WE HAD THE SECONDS BECAUSE IT, SO FOR DISCUSSION, TWO PARTS IN HERE, WE KEEP GOING BACK TO THAT'S REASONABLE. 
          OKAY. 
          REASONABLE HAS BEEN BEAT TO DEATH SO MANY TIMES IT'S NOT NECESSARY IN THIS DEFINITION. 
          UM, ALSO THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS REPURPOSING AUTOMOBILE CHAIRS FOR FURNITURE. 
          THEY'RE AUTOMOBILE CHAIRS. 
          SO WHEN PEOPLE SAY, LIKE THE PHRASE HERE TO INCLUDE FURNITURE FROM AN AUTOMOBILE, OKAY, IT'S JUST NOT, BECAUSE THEN WE'RE GONNA GET INTO THE SLIPPERY SLOPE OF, OH, NOW I CAN DO A TOILET SEAT OR A TOILET FOR, THEN YOU START THAT. 
          THE DEFINITION AS IS SPECIFICALLY STATES EVERYTHING THAT THIS OTHER ONE DOES, EXCEPT FOR THE LANGUAGE THAT'S NOW INCLUDED FOR THE SPORTS EQUIPMENT, IT'S NOT NECESSARY TO START IDENTIFYING SPECIFICS. 
          REMEMBER, THESE RULES ARE, ARE DESIGNED FOR BROAD, SO YOU JUST DON'T TIE ANYTHING TO THIS. 
          ALL OF THIS IS NOW SPECIFICALLY PICKING PIECES, AND NOW YOU HAVE TO EXCLUDE THIS. 
          SO WHAT ARE WE GONNA EXCLUDE THE NEXT TIME? IT KIND OF REMINDS ME OF THE SWIMMING POOL. 
          OKAY? YOU HAVE AN ABOVE GROUND AND BELOW GROUND SWIMMING POOL. 
          YOU WANT A FENCE ON ONE, BUT NOT ON THE OTHER. 
          WE START NITPICKING THINGS LIKE THIS AND WE'RE LIKE, WE'RE GONNA BE HERE WITH ANOTHER BOOK. 
          SO TO ME, ADDING ALL OF THIS OTHER STUFF IS UNNECESSARY WHEN IT'S, THE GENERAL PURPOSE IS ALREADY DEFINED UNDER OUR, THE 2018. 
          GOOD. 
          HAVE YOU EVER BEEN IN THE HEMISPHERE PARK? UH, I TAKE MY KIDS, UH, GENERALLY THERE TO PLAY. 
          THERE IS A VEHICLE THAT IS NORMALLY USED FOR CABLE THAT YOU, YOU TRANSPORT PEOPLE IN A CABLE. 
          I FORGET THE THE ENGLISH NAME FOR IT. 
          IT'S  IN SPANISH. 
          BUT, UH, IT'S A VEHICLE THAT'S BEEN REPURPOSED FOR RECREATIONAL USE. 
          UH, AND IT'S NOT MEANT TO TO TRANSPORT ANYBODY ANYMORE. 
          IT'S FOR PEOPLE TO PLACE IT AND TAKE PICTURES. 
          I UNDERSTAND WHERE YOU'RE COMING FROM, AND I UNDERSTAND, AND I AGREE WITH SOME OF THE POINTS OF THIS BECOMING A SLIPPERY SLOPE, BUT WOULDN'T INDEED THAT BE A COUNTER EXAMPLE TO YOUR LOGIC OF ALL THEIR TYPE OF, UH, FURNITURE FROM VEHICLES BEING REPURPOSED? DON'T WE WANT TO HAVE A MORE CIRCULAR ECONOMY IN WHICH WE REPURPOSE SOME OF THE THINGS AND STOP ME CREATING TOO MUCH WASTE? THAT'S NOT WHAT WE'RE HERE FOR. 
          WE'RE HERE FOR A SPECIFIC DEFINITION, WHICH HAS ALREADY BEEN DEFINED. 
          AND AGAIN, A REPURPOSING OF AN AUTOMOBILE CHAIR IS ALREADY DEFINED AS AN AUTOMOBILE CHAIR, NOT FURNITURE. 
          I THINK I'VE SEEN SOME. 
          THIS IS PLACE, THIS IS PLACEMENT. 
          OH, WAIT. 
          OH, I'M SORRY. 
          GO AHEAD. 
          GO AHEAD. 
          SEEN SOME EXAMPLES OF PEOPLE, UM, SPECIFICALLY ON THE WEST SIDE, REUSING THEIR, UM, UM, VEHICLE PARTS LIKE, UH, CHAIRS. 
          I HAVE SEEN THEM USE 'EM AS LAWN FURNITURE. 
          AND, UM, AGAIN, I KNOW THIS IS NOT WHY WE'RE HERE TO, UM, PUSH FORWARD SUSTAINABILITY OR WHATEVER IT IS, BUT CONSIDERING, UM, YOU KNOW, THAT THESE THINGS CAN BE REUSED AND THAT THEY ARE OF USE STILL, UM, JUST BECAUSE THE CAR DOESN'T MOVE ANYMORE, IT DOESN'T MEAN THAT THE CHAIR, UM, DOESN'T WORK. 
          AND I'VE SEEN PEOPLE 
          [00:55:01]
USE THEIR, UM, CAR CHAIRS AS A WAY TO JUST SIT DOWN OUTSIDE. 
          UM, AND FURTHER ON MOVING FORWARD TO THE REST OF WHAT IT WAS SAYING HERE, IT WAS SAYING THAT, UM, REPURPOSE FUNCTIONAL ART OR DECORATIVE ITEMS, UM, OF CULTURAL OR RELIGIOUS VALUE, INCIDENTAL TO THE USE OF THE PROPERTY. 
          UM, I, I DO THINK THAT THAT SHOULD ALSO BE INCLUDED IN THERE BECAUSE SOME PEOPLE, UM, REPURPOSE, UM, YOU KNOW, ONE MAN'S TRASH IS ANOTHER MAN'S TREASURE. 
          UM, SO I THINK PEOPLE DO REUSE, UM, CERTAIN PIECES OF WHAT WE MAY SAY IS TRASH AND THEY MAKE IT INTO SOMETHING BEAUTIFUL. 
          UM, AND I THINK THAT CAN POTENTIALLY BE, UM, IN HERE WITH NO HARM TO THE CODE. 
          THANK YOU CHAIR. 
          IF I COULD COMMENT AFTER E THANK YOU, MS. BROWN. 
          I WAS ONLY GONNA MAKE A COMMENT. 
          I WAS ONLY GONNA MAKE A COMMENT ABOUT THESE ARE HOMES THAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT. 
          YOU KNOW, IT IS NOT A THEME PARK WHERE WE'RE GONNA TAKE A, A CAR SEAT AND PUT A, A WIRE HOOK ON IT AND LET IT SWING FROM SIDE TO SIDE. 
          IT'S NOT ABOUT THAT. 
          IT'S ABOUT A HOME. 
          SOMEBODY'S FRONT YARD, YOU KNOW, IF THEY WANNA PUT, PUT A DECORATIVE ITEM IN THEIR FRONT YARD, THAT'S FINE, BUT A CAR SEAT IS NOT A DECORATIVE ITEM. 
          IF THEY WANT TO TAKE SOME METAL, UH, A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE A TENDENCY TO, UH, TO, TO REDEFINE OR REPURPOSE METAL, AND THEY CAN MAKE IT TURN, TWIST, AND TURN INTO A BEAUTIFUL WORKS OF ART. 
          AND THAT'S FINE TO PUT INTO YOUR FRONT YARD OR YOUR BACKYARD OR WHEREVER YOU WANT IT. 
          BUT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT TO THE REPURPOSE OF ITEMS. A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE NOT HANDY AT REPURPOSING ITEMS, YOU KNOW, AND THEN IT, IT PILES UP TO BE JUNK EVENTUALLY. 
          AND THEN IT JUST SITS THERE AND IT SITS THERE AND IT SITS THERE, HIT THE RAIN, COMES THE SNOW OR WHATEVER, AND THEN YOU JUST GOT A MESS ON YOUR HANDS. 
          AND THEN THEY DON'T EVER MOVE IT. 
          SO THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE. 
          WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE REPURPOSING, UM, UH, METAL INTO ART FORM. 
          THAT'S NOT, THAT'S NOT IT. 
          YOU CAN PUT IT IN, IN YOUR YARD, BUT SHE IS RIGHT THOUGH. 
          ONE PERSON'S TRASH IS ANOTHER PERSON'S HEART. 
          AND, AND THE QUESTION, AND THE QUESTION IS, UH, HOW DO YOU, UH, EVALUATE THAT, UH, WHETHER IT'S A DECORATIVE ITEM OR NOT. 
          I KNOW OF A SPECIFIC INSTANCE AT, AT ALAMO HEIGHTS WHERE THERE'S AN ARTIST THAT REPAINTS TOILET SEATS, YOU BROUGHT UP TOILETS AND THAT THERE'S SOUGHT OUT, SOUGHT AFTER THROUGHOUT THE STATE. 
          UH, THERE'S BEEN, UH, ALL KINDS OF, UH, UH, YOU KNOW, UH, UH, EXHIBITS BASED ON THAT. 
          AND, UH, SO HOW DO YOU DETERMINE THAT? AND, AND WHAT THIS PROPOSED AMENDMENT SEEKS TO DO IS OPEN UP THAT, THAT, UH, ABILITY, UH, FOR SOMEONE TO REPURPOSE SOME MATERIALS, UH, TO MAKE IT MORE SUSTAINABLE, REUSE CERTAIN THINGS. 
          UH, UH, SO I, YOU KNOW, UH, I WOULD, I WOULD, UH, SUPPORT THIS AMENDMENT. 
          THANK YOU. 
          ANY OTHER DISCUSSION? THE MOTION ON THE FLOOR IS TO STAY WITH, I'M SORRY, MIKE, SPEAK UP, . 
          I'LL MOVE ON. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          SO THIS, THIS IS ALWAYS A TOUGH SECTION, I THINK, UM, I THINK EVERY YEAR IT COMES UP. 
          AND WHAT WE SHOULD ADD OR SUBTRACT TO THIS LIST. 
          UH, I, I MIGHT ADD THAT, UM, I JUST DID A QUICK GOOGLE SEARCH ON REPURPOSED AUTOMOBILE SEATS, RIGHT? AND, UH, I ALWAYS SAY THAT PICTURES ARE WORTH, YOU KNOW, A THOUSAND WORDS ON THINGS LIKE THIS. 
          'CAUSE I'M REALLY TRYING TO GET AT WHAT ARE WE TRYING TO ADD TO THE CODE AND, AND MAYBE LOOSEN, BUT NOT GO DOWN THE VERY SLIPPERY SLOPE THAT I THINK WE ALL CAN IMAGINE. 
          I MEAN, I THINK, I THINK THAT'S WHAT THE PROPOSAL'S ADDING. 
          UM, I DON'T KNOW WHEN THE NEXT BREAK IS, OR IF WE ARE GONNA HAVE A BREAK DURING THIS, BUT DURING THE BREAK, WE MIGHT BE ABLE TO PULL UP SOME PHOTOS OF WHAT A TYPICAL REFURBISHED OUTSIDE CAR SEAT LOOKS LIKE. 
          I JUST LOOKED AT SOME, SOME LOOKED IN MY HUMBLE OPINION, THEY LOOKED LIKE I WOULDN'T PUT IN MY FRONT YARD, BUT THEN THERE'S SOME THAT I SAID, WELL, THAT'S PRETTY COOL. 
          I MIGHT, I MIGHT BE, I MIGHT BE OKAY WITH THAT. 
          BUT BEFORE WE GO TOO MUCH FURTHER, DOES ANYBODY WANNA LOOK AT SOME PHOTOS? UH, WE CAN, WE CAN TEE IT UP AFTER THE BREAK, IF THAT'S OKAY. 
          I JUST, UH, I I THINK IT'D BE WISE FOR US TO GET AN ADDITIONAL INPUT. 
          AND THEN THE OTHER ONE, I, I DON'T KNOW ABOUT THE, THE, THE OTHER ONE'S ABOUT, UM, I MEAN, I DIDN'T, I'M NOT EXACTLY SUPPORTING EQUIPMENT. 
          WHAT CULTURAL OR RELIGIOUS ITEMS? I'M NOT REALLY SURE WHICH ONES THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT. 
          UH, CERTAINLY THAT'S A VERY TOUCHY SUBJECT. 
          I'M SURE GETTING INTO ANYTHING RELIGIOUS. 
          MY LAWYER'S GONNA PROBABLY TELL ME THAT WE WANNA STAY AWAY FROM THAT, BUT WE CAN MAYBE LOOK AT THAT AS WELL. 
          YOU STAY WITH PROP FROM THAT JUST BECAUSE OF PROPERTY CODE, BUT THAT'S OKAY. 
          YEAH, BUT I, I DON'T KNOW, MAYBE IF WE WANNA LOOK AT A FEW PICTURES BEFORE WE MAKE A DETERMINATION OR A VOTE, WOULD THAT BE APPROPRIATE? UH, 
          [01:00:01]
CHAIR'S WILLING TO ACCEPT THAT. 
          DID ANYBODY ELSE HOST THAT? LET'S LOOK AT 'EM. 
          RAY, RAY, THIS SIDE, MAYBE HELP US ANSWER A FEW. 
          OKAY. 
          AND MR. CHAIR? UH, YES MA'AM. 
          UH, THE ELL POINTED IT, UH, OUT AND I DIDN'T REALIZE, UH, THE TWO PROPOSALS, UH, WHILE THEY'RE SIMILAR ARE IN FACT DIFFERENT. 
          AND SO THEY NEED TO BE VOTED ON SEPARATELY, INDIVIDUALLY, OKAY. 
          YES. 
          FRED CAN MORE OREOS DOWN THERE? I'M SORRY, ARE WE, UH, TAKING A BREAK? NO, THERE'S SOME BACK THERE. 
          NO, THERE'S NOT IN THERE. 
          I WASN'T SAYING TAKE A BREAK NOW. 
          I JUST SAID, WHENEVER YOU DO TAKE A BREAK, WE'LL ASK, UH, JUDY TO KIND OF TEE IT UP FOR US AND WE'LL DO SOME PICTURE, UH, SURFING. 
          WELL BEFORE WE TAKE A BREAK. 
          LET ME ADD THIS IN HERE, BECAUSE IT SAYS RIGHT AFTER THE 24 HOURS ON BOTH THE 2018 AND THE PROPOSED, IT SAYS RIGHT IN HERE, IT SAYS TO EXCEED 24 HOURS PERIOD. 
          SET ITEMS INCLUDE, BUT NOT LIMITED TO AUTOMOTIVE PARTS. 
          OKAY? SO THAT MEANS YOU CAN'T LEAVE ANYTHING OUT THERE IF IT'S AN AUTOMOTIVE PART OR NOT. 
          THEN YOU GOT WHOEVER PUT THIS PROPOSAL IN, PUT IN COMMENTS NOT TO INCLUDE FURNITURE FROM AN AUTOMOBILE. 
          THERE IS NO FURNITURE FROM AN AUTOMOBILE. 
          IT'S A PART. 
          SEATS ARE CONSIDERED PARTS, UH, A SEAT IS A SEAT, RIGHT? BUT IT'S ALSO AN AUTOMOTIVE PART WHEN YOU ORDER IT. 
          YES, IT IS AN AUTOMOTIVE PART, BUT A SEAT IS A SEAT. 
          UH, IF I CAN SIT IN IT, I CAN CALL IT A SEAT. 
          UH, BECAUSE JUDY, YOU'VE ACTUALLY GOT THE, THE PHOTOGRAPHS, OKAY. 
          YOU ACTUALLY SET 'EM UP NOW. 
          UH, MIKE, DO YOU WANT US TO TAKE AN ACTUAL BREAK TO LOOK AT THEM? THAT WAY WE CAN GET UP CLOSE AND PERSONAL. 
          UH, AND ACTUALLY GUYS, I CAN'T SEE IT, SO WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO TAKE A BREAK TO ACTUALLY SEE IT. 
          WELL, MAYBE WE'LL DO THAT. 
          I THINK EVERYBODY, WE CAN PUT IT ON THE SCREEN FOR EVERYBODY. 
          YEAH, WHEN WE COME BACK, EVERYBODY HAS A CHANCE. 
          UH, UM, A LOT OF US I SEE HAVE SOME SORT OF SMARTPHONE. 
          IF YOU DON'T, WE CAN SHARE. 
          BUT, UH, YEAH, MAYBE TAKE A BREAK AND JUST TAKE A LOOK. 
          AND I THINK YOU CAN PROBABLY DO THE SAME WITH TYPICAL ITEMS REPURPOSED FOR GARDENING USE. 
          I JUST, THE TIME IS NOW TWO 19. 
          UH, AND WE WILL TAKE A BREAK AND THEN BREAK. 
          I THINK WE CAN DO IT ALL IN 10 MINUTES, BOTH, UH, HYGIENE BREAK AS WELL AS A PHOTOGRAPH BREAK. 
          SO TWO 19 AND WE'LL RECONVENE AT 2 29. 
          LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, WE'RE GONNA RE RECONVENE OUR MEETING. 
          I'M TRYING TO THINK OF THAT, THAT WEBSITE AND EVERYBODY GOES TO, I WOULD JUST SAY WEBSITE. 
          THEY WANT, THEY WANT ON ORGANIZING THE CLOSET SO I CAN BRING YOU ALL BACK TO THE CENTER STAGE. 
          THERE IS A MOTION ON THE FLOOR TO ACCEPT THE, OR TO KEEP THE 2018, UH, DEFINITION. 
          UH, AND WE HAD A CHANCE TO LOOK AT SOME REPURPOSED EQUIPMENT, UH, AS EXAMPLES OF WHAT HAS BEEN DONE IN DIFFERENT LOCATIONS. 
          UH, AND THERE WAS A COMMENT MADE TO ME INDIVIDUALLY THAT SAYS, IF YOU TAKE THE 2018 DEFINITION AND GO DOWN TO THE, ALMOST THE CENTER PORTION WHERE IT SAYS THIS DOES NOT INCLUDE, SO IT'S IN THE CENTER OF IT. 
          IT SAYS, THIS DOES NOT INCLUDE LAWN CARE TOOLS OR RECREATIONAL EQUIPMENT, INCIDENTAL TO THE USE OF THE PROPERTY BUILDING MATERIALS, ET CETERA. 
          UH, IF YOU TAKE A LOOK AT THIS AS A PROPOSAL, IT WOULD READ, THIS DOES NOT INCLUDE LAWN CARE TOOLS OR ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED EQUIPMENT. 
          AND THAT IS IN THE FORM OF A FRIENDLY AMENDMENT. 
          DID WE, MR. CHAIR AUTO PARTS IS NOT INCLUDED AND NOTHING ELSE IS INCLUDED. 
          IT'S JUST ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED EQUIPMENT. 
          GO AHEAD. 
          THE PREVIOUS MOTION WAS THERE A SECOND TO IT? UH, YES, THERE WAS. 
          SO THEN WE HAVE A MOTION ON THE MOTION FLOOR BEFORE WE MOTION AND THAT FRIENDLY AMENDMENT. 
          MM-HMM. 
          , WELL, WELL, LET'S, WE ARE STILL STILL IN THE DISCUSSION PHASE OF IT. 
          BUT AGAIN, LIKE I SAID BEFORE, BECAUSE THE STIPULATION OF THEIR STATES AUTO 
          [01:05:01]
PARTS A CHAIR AS THEY DEFINED IT, IT IS WHEN YOU GO TO THE AUTOMOBILE STORE AND YOU WANNA REPLACE YOUR TRUCK SEAT, IT IS CONSIDERED A SEAT, BUT IT'S ALSO CONSIDERED A PART. 
          'CAUSE THAT'S HOW YOU DO IT. 
          A PART NUMBER. 
          NOW, AS WE WERE DISCUSSING EARLIER, OFF, OFF SIDELINE, YOU CAN DETERMINE WHATEVER, BUT WHEN YOU DEFINE AN FURNITURE FROM AN AUTO AUTOMOBILE, IT CAN'T BE DONE BECAUSE IT ALREADY SAYS PARTS CAN ONLY STAY IN THE YARD FOR 24 HOURS. 
          YEAH. 
          SO THE AMENDMENT IS TO NOT STATE THE AUTOMOBILE SIDE OF IT, BUT TO STATE THE REPURPOSING OF, LIKE GENTLEMEN SAID EARLIER, TOILET SEATS AND STUFF LIKE THAT IS CONSIDERED ART. 
          BUT IN THIS CASE HERE, BECAUSE IT SPECIFICALLY SAYS AN AUTOMOBILE AFTER STATING PARTS, AND THEN YOU EXCLUDE WHERE IT SAYS HERE, NOT INCLUDING AUTOMOBILE OR FURNITURE MADE FROM AN AUTOMOBILE. 
          OKAY? NOW IT DOESN'T SAY SEAT IN THERE IT SAYS AN AUTOMOBILE. 
          SO THAT MEANS I CAN BRING A VAN IN MY YARD AND CALL IT A PIECE OF FURNITURE BECAUSE IT STATES AUTOMOBILE, NOT A SEAT. 
          NO, I UNDERSTAND THE FRIENDLY AMENDMENT. 
          I WAS JUST CLARIFYING TO MAKE SURE THAT WE HAD A MOTION AND THE SECOND ON THE FLOOR BECAUSE I INTEND TO SUPPORT THAT MOTION. 
          YEAH, WE WE'RE STILL IN THE DE DEBATE, AND HIS FRIENDLY AMENDMENT WAS TO CLARIFY SOME OF THE LANGUAGE. 
          SO YOU WOULDN'T DEFINE, LIKE DOWN HERE WHERE IT SAYS SPORTS, WHICH IS ALREADY CLARIFIED OVER HERE, AND THEN THE AUTOMOBILE, BECAUSE IT DOES NOT SAY SEED, IT SAYS AUTOMOBILE. 
          SO THE ADDITIONAL WORDS TO THE 2018 DEFINITION, UH, WOULD BE ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED EQUIPMENT AND EQUIPMENT IS ALREADY THERE. 
          SO IT'S TWO WORDS IN THERE. 
          UH, AND I GUESS THE QUESTION IS, DID YOU ACCEPT THE FRIENDLY AMENDMENT? YEAH, I ACCEPT THE FRIENDLY AMENDMENT BECAUSE IT, IT DOESN'T LIMIT, IT OPENS THE DOOR TO POSSIBILITIES OF OTHER, LIKE WOOD CARVINGS AND THINGS LIKE THAT. 
          SO, BUT THE WAY IT'S TURNED IN HERE, THAT'S UNACCEPTABLE. 
          SO YES, I ACCEPT THE AMENDMENT. 
          AND MR. GUPTA, YOU SECOND THAT MOTION. 
          THANK YOU. 
          NOW THEN ANY DISCUSSION ON THAT CHANGE ABOUT JESSE? UH, WELL, JESSE ALSO SECONDED, BUT I, MR. GUPTA WAS FIRST BEFORE . 
          OKAY, SO, UH, WHAT IS THE MOTION? WE DIDN'T HEAR THE FRIENDLY AMENDMENT. 
          THE MO THE MOTION. 
          THE MOTION WAS TO MODIFY THE 2018 DEFINITION OF OUTSIDE PLACEMENT. 
          NO, NO. 
          WHO BY ADDING THE MOTION WAS TO ACCEPT THE 2018 AS IS. 
          IT WAS SECOND THE FRIENDLY AMENDMENT. 
          AMENDMENT WAS, WAS TO, BUT NOW THEN THE MOTION IS THAT'S WAS REQUESTED. 
          THE MOTION IS TO KEEP THE 2018 DEFINITION, BUT ADD TO THE BODY OF IT DOWN TOWARD THE BOTTOM THIRD WHERE THE COPY READS. 
          THIS DOES NOT INCLUDE LAWN CARE TOOLS. 
          ARE YOU THERE? YEP. 
          OKAY. 
          AND THEN INSERT OR ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED. 
          AND THEN OF COURSE IT CONTINUES TO READ EQUIPMENT AND EVERYTHING ELSE WOULD STAY AS WRITTEN. 
          I'M SORRY, I DIDN'T UNDERSTAND WHAT THE AMENDMENT WAS. 
          THE AMENDMENT. 
          THERE YOU GO. 
          THIS WOULD CHANGE THE WE DELETED, HERE YOU GO. 
          THE WORD, GO AHEAD MIKE. 
          GO HERE. 
          YOU'RE GONNA KEEP 2018, BUT ADD RIGHT HERE. 
          READ IT AGAIN. 
          UH, OR, OR, AND WE DELETE THE WORD RECREATIONAL. 
          COME BACK THIS WAY, MIKE. 
          THERE YOU GO. 
          AFTER OR RIGHT. 
          OH, RIGHT HERE. 
          RIGHT HERE. 
          OR DELETE THE WORD RECREATIONAL AND INSERT ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED AND THEN READS ON EQUIPMENT. 
          OKAY. 
          DOES THAT, DOES THAT KEEP RECREATIONAL EQUIPMENT IN THERE ALSO? UH, IT NOW ACTUALLY KEEPS THE RECREATIONAL EQUIPMENT, AUTOMOBILES, UH, ALMOST ANYTHING ELSE BECAUSE THE RECREATIONAL EQUIPMENT HAS BEEN DELETED. 
          IF YOU FEEL LIKE RECREATIONAL NEEDS STAY THERE, IT'S JUST ANOTHER WORD. 
          WELL, NO, HOLD ON. 
          IT HAS TO STAY THERE BECAUSE OTHERWISE YOU'RE DELETING. 
          WE DON'T WANNA 
          [01:10:01]
DELETE THAT, RIGHT? NO, WE WANNA KEEP, WE WANNA ADD ONLY ARTISTIC ARTISTICAL ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED. 
          YOU'RE JUST ADDING THAT IN THERE. 
          AND WE'RE GONNA KEEP RECREATIONAL THAT WAY. 
          ANYTHING THAT YOU NEED TO REPURPOSE TO INCLUDE RECREATIONAL, YOU CAN DO, YOU'RE MODIFYING THE MOTION TO INCLUDE KEEP RECREATIONAL. 
          YEAH, WE'LL, WE'LL DO THAT. 
          WE'LL KEEP, WE'RE JUST GONNA ADD THE ARTISTIC NOW, THEN WE'RE CHANGING THE DEFINITION SLIGHTLY. 
          UH, NOW THEN WE HAVE SIMPLY THE WORDS ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED RECREATIONAL EQUIPMENT, COMMA, RECREATIONAL. 
          YEAH, THE COMMA WAS THERE. 
          THERE'S A COMMON BETWEEN RECREATION. 
          EVERYONE UNDERSTAND WHAT THE MOTION IS? LEGAL , UH, ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED WHAT? RECREATIONAL EQUIPMENT? NO. 
          ON RECREATIONAL OR, OR RECREATIONAL. 
          THE INTENT IS, OR, OR I'M SORRY. 
          OR WAS ALWAYS THERE. 
          IT NEVER WAS TAKEN OUT, RIGHT? TOOLS OR RECREATIONAL? NO. 
          OR I'M ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED. 
          REPURPOSED RECREATIONAL EQUIPMENT. 
          WELL, WHAT IS ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED RECREATIONAL EQUIPMENT? LET'S DO PHRASES. 
          IT'S, IT'S A COMMA IN BETWEEN. 
          IT'S TWO PHRASES. 
          UH, MS. W RYE, UH, IT IS A, UH, ADDING ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED OR RECREATIONAL EQUIPMENT? NO, NO, NO. 
          IT'S TOOLS OR ARTISTIC. 
          WHAT'S THE, YOUR, YOUR MOTION, AS I UNDERSTAND IT, IS TO INSERT TWO WORDS. 
          AND THE FIRST WORD AFTER TOOLS IS, OR WHICH STATEMENT? ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED RECREATIONAL EQUIPMENT. 
          IT'S, IT'S ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED, COMMA, BECAUSE IF YOU TAKE OUT THE, THE EQUIPMENT PART, THE, UH, UH, RECREATIONAL, WHICH IS WAS IN THERE ALREADY, THAT MEANS YOU CAN'T HAVE ANY RECREATIONAL STUFF IN YOUR YARD, IS WHAT IT SAYS. 
          ONCE YOU TAKE IT OUT. 
          IF YOU LEAVE IT, THEN THAT'S WHAT IT'S SAYING. 
          YOU CAN LEAVE RECREATIONAL STUFF IN YOUR YARD WITHOUT BEING PENALIZED. 
          CHAIRMAN, I BELIEVE THEY'VE ADDED IT UP ON THE SCREEN JUST FOR THE VISUAL TOOLS OR POSE EQUIPMENT OR RECREATIONAL EQUIPMENT. 
          THERE. 
          THAT'S, THAT'S BETTER. 
          YOU ADDED THE EQUIPMENT RIGHT THERE. 
          OKAY. 
          QUESTION. 
          MR. GUPTA. 
          I GO BACK TO YOU AS A SECOND. 
          HOLD, HOLD COUNSEL. 
          YEAH, THERE NEEDS TO BE A SECOND BEFORE WE SECOND. 
          SECOND. 
          MR. ZUNI, THE FIRST CASE THAT COMES BEFORE US HAS GOT A, A, ONE OF THOSE BICYCLES IN THEIR YARD, AND THEY'RE GONNA CLAIM IT'S RECREATIONAL MATERIAL. 
          IT'S ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED, BUT THAT'S OKAY, COUNSEL. 
          SO, UH, WHAT, WHAT IS AN EXAMPLE OF ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED EQUIPMENT? THAT'S THE REASON WHY YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE FUN WITH THIS IN COURT. 
          , AND I CANNOT DEFINE IT FOR YOU. 
          THE CO COUNSEL, THE, THE THING COMES ABOUT BECAUSE THEY'RE USING AND IN THE TOP PART, AGAIN, I GO BACK TO WHERE IT SAYS AUTOMOBILE PARTS. 
          IT SAYS 24 HOURS. 
          UH, THE ITEMS ARE AUTOMOBILE PARTS WHERE IT LIMITS. 
          YOU CAN ONLY HAVE 'EM THERE. 
          THEN IT HAS A NOTE OR A COMMENT AND NOT TO INCLUDE FURNITURE FROM THE AUTOMOBILE THAT HAS BEEN REPURPOSED. 
          SO AGAIN, I GO BACK TO THE AUTOMOBILE BECAUSE IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT DOES ACTUALLY, 'CAUSE YOU CAN, WHAT'S THAT SAYING IS YOU CAN ACTUALLY TAKE A JUNK CAR. 
          IT'S NOT SAYING SEAT, IT SAYS AUTOMOBILE. 
          THERE IS NO DISCUSSION ON THE AUTOMOBILE. 
          SO, WELL, THIS IS WHERE I GOT IT FROM. 
          SO THEN WE GO BACK TO ELIMINATE THE AUTOMOBILE PART OF THE REPURPOSING AND GO DOWN TO, AS THE DISCUSSION WAS EARLIER, TO TAKE IN CERTAIN THINGS. 
          AND SOME PEOPLE TURN IT INTO ART. 
          WELL, IN ORDER TO COVER ART, IT'S A, IT'S A BROAD DEFINITION. 
          AND THIS IS BASICALLY LIMITED IT TO ONLY AUTOMOBILES. 
          SO THE BROAD DEFINITION WOULD BE ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED, WHICH COULD BE PRETTY MUCH REP AS LONG AS, AS LONG AS IT'S REPURPOSED. 
          RIGHT. 
          THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING. 
          WHEN YOU DO SOMETHING THAT'S ARTISTICALLY, THAT DEFINITION COULD BE PRETTY MUCH, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, IT'S NOT TYING YOUR HANDS ON IT. 
          BOTH, BOTH WORDS CAN BE CHA I MEAN, CHALLENGED. 
          ANY WAY YOU WANNA LOOK AT IT, BECAUSE I LIVE WITH AN ARTIST. 
          WELL, YEAH. 
          SO WHAT'S THE SAYING? IT'S 
          [01:15:01]
THE, THE ARTIST IN THE EYES OF BEHOLDER. 
          SO SOME PEOPLE AREN'T GONNA LIKE IT. 
          SOME ARE, BUT I TOOK THAT AS MORE OF A, A COMPROMISE AND MORE BROAD THAT YOU CAN DO CERTAIN THINGS IN YOUR YARD, BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN EVERYTHING CLASSIFIES ART. 
          BUT THIS OPENS THE DOOR TO WHAT THE PANEL OVER HERE WAS TALKING ABOUT, THAT THE BROAD SPECTRUM OF WHAT PEOPLE CONSIDER ART. 
          AND I THINK THAT WOULD BE MORE OF A COMPROMISE. 
          MAYBE WE NEED TO HONE IN ON THE DEFINITION A LITTLE MORE, BUT THAT GIVES US A START OF WHAT WE ARE LOOKING AT IS NOT TRYING TO NARROW, BUT TRYING TO MAYBE EXPAND WITH REASON, IF THAT MAKES SENSE. 
          DEFINE REASON. 
          DON'T, DON'T, DON'T, DON'T. 
          I I WAS JUST REASON IS WHATEVER ANYBODY WANTS TO DETERMINE WHO IS, DO NOT COUNSEL. 
          I, I LEAVE THE FLOOR WITH YOU. 
          UH, UH, THERE, THERE'S GONNA BE, HAVE TO BE, UH, THERE'S NO SUCH THING AS ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED EQUIPMENT. 
          UH, SO, UH, EQUIPMENT, NECESSARY ITEMS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. 
          SO, SUCH AS RECREATIONAL EQUIPMENT, THERE'S DEFINITIONS FOR THAT. 
          BUT, UH, TO GET TO YOUR INTENT, I THINK IT WOULD BE BETTER, UH, TO, UH, GESTATE, UH, ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED ITEMS. ITEMS. OKAY. 
          THAT'S, THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING. 
          THAT'S WHAT WE HAD TO START. 
          NOW WE NEED TO HONE IN. 
          SO ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED ITEMS, IS THAT ACCEPTABLE TO ALL? GO TO YOUR SECOND. 
          IS THAT ACCEPTABLE? GO TO YOUR SECOND. 
          OKAY. 
          IS THAT ACCEPTABLE? THE MOTION. 
          THE MOTION ON THE FLOOR. 
          OKAY. 
          AS READ IT ON THE, ON THE 2018 SIDE, WHICH IS YOUR LEFT SIDE, IS THAT ACCEPTABLE TO THE BOARD AND TO THE PANELS? NO. 
          WAIT A MINUTE. 
          I'LL CALL THE MOTION. 
          WELL, I'M JUST SAYING THAT WAY. 
          UH, IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION ON THE CHANGE OF THE WORD EQUIPMENT TO ITEM CHAIR? THIS IS AMIN THOMAS. 
          CAN I CHIME IN? GO AHEAD, AMIN, FROM ABOVE. 
          SO, YEAH, I'M, I'M, I'M DOING SOME GOOGLE SEARCH ON THAT. 
          AND I, I CANNOT FIND THE DEFINITION OF, OF ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED EQUIPMENT OR ITEMS, EITHER ONE. 
          BUT WHEN I PLUG THAT IN, I GET ALL KIND OF THINGS . 
          SO ARE WE SAYING ANYBODY CAN PUT ANYTHING THEY WANT AS LONG AS THEY SAY IT IS REPURPOSED? UH, FOR OUTDOOR USE, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THIS IS LIKE BASICALLY OPENING CAN OF WORMS, YOU KNOW, IF I COULD, UH, IF IT HASN'T BEEN REPURPOSED AND THERE'S NO ARTISTIC INTENT, THEN IT DOESN'T FIT THE DEFINITION. 
          YEAH, BUT THE, THE, THE, IF IT'S JUST A RUSTY BICYCLE, LIKE, UH, MS. BROWN MENTIONED, THEN IT DOESN'T FIT THE DEFINITION. 
          BUT THAT COULD BE, UH, YOU KNOW, AN ART FOR SOMEBODY. 
          LIKE SOMEBODY WOULD PUT THE BIKE AND SAY, THIS IS AN ARTISTIC PIECE OF EQUIPMENT OR AN ITEM FOR ME. 
          THAT'S HOW I SEE IT. 
          YOU SEE IT DIFFERENTLY. 
          LIKE THERE IS NO EXACT DEFINITION FOR THIS, AND THAT'S WHY I'M SAYING IT'S VERY WIDE OPEN. 
          IT'S VERY SUBJECTIVE. 
          WE HAVEN'T HAD A PROBLEM WITH, UH, UH, DEFINITIONS IN THE PAST. 
          HAVE WE , YOU KNOW, BECAUSE WE HAVE DEFINITIONS IDENTIFIED AND, AND NOTED IN THE BOOK. 
          THIS IS, THIS IS VERY WIDE OPEN. 
          THIS IS WHEN, UM, I JUST WANNA SAY THAT MAYBE, UM, LIKE FOR EXAMPLE, WITH JUST A BICYCLE RUSTING OUTSIDE, UM, IF THERE WAS NO LIKE, WORK DONE ON IT, THEN IT CAN'T BE CONSIDERED ART. 
          SOMEONE CAN'T JUST PUT OUT A BICYCLE AND SAY, THIS IS ART. 
          JUST 'CAUSE THEY THINK IT'S ART, BUT THEY HAVEN'T DONE ANYTHING TO IT TO MAKE IT MORE AESTHETICALLY PLEASING, I GUESS. 
          UM, SO IN TERMS OF ART, I, I CONSIDER ART TO BE, UM, HAVING WORK DONE ON IT TO MAKE IT LOOK AESTHETICALLY PLEASING. 
          , UH, WITH, WE HAVE, WE HAVE A MOTION ON THE FLOOR. 
          UH, LET, LET ME, MR. CHAIR, I, I'M SORRY. 
          I WAS GONNA SAY GO AHEAD AND, AND GO AHEAD WITH YOUR THOUGHT FOR THE NEXT TWO ITEMS. CAN WE TABLE IT UNTIL THE NEXT MEETING SO THAT, UH, WE CAN ASK WHOEVER, UH, IS RECOMMENDING, UH, THIS, 
          [01:20:01]
LIKE, WHAT, UH, WHAT IS IT THAT THEY'RE SEEKING? UH, I DO HAVE A CONCERN ABOUT, UM, WHO DETERMINES IF IT'S ARTISTIC, UH, IS THE BOARD, UH, 'CAUSE Y'ALL ARE GONNA HEAR THE, UH, THESE APPEALS, UH, IT WOULD BE UP TO Y'ALL TO DECIDE IF SOMEONE IS ARGUING. 
          IT'S ARTISTIC. 
          UM, AND, AND THEN, UH, AGAIN, UH, YOU KNOW, I, I UNDERSTAND THE BIKE EXAMPLE BECAUSE, UH, WE DEALT, UH, WITH THE PROPERTY, UH, ON WEST SIDE, NORTH SIDE, UM, WHERE IT WAS ALL RUSTED ITEMS, INCLUDING SEVERAL, UH, WHAT HE DEFINED AS ANTIQUE BIKES AND HIS DEFENSE WAS ALL THE STUFF IN THE YARD WAS ART, INCLUDING THE, UH, THE RUSTED BIKE. 
          SO, UH, I JUST, I, I HAVE A CONCERN ABOUT DEFINING, UH, ARTISTIC AND OR, UM, LEAVING IT AGAIN. 
          AND IT WAS, UH, MY SUGGESTION, SO I APOLOGIZE. 
          BUT ARTISTIC ITEMS, UH, SO, UH, IF EVERYBODY'S OKAY WITH IT, I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE IT TABLED JUST SO I CAN, UH, GET ADDITIONAL INFORMATION AS TO WHAT IS BEING SOUGHT. 
          AND THEN, UH, LET'S SEE IF WE CAN, UH, UH, COME UP WITH A, A DEFINITION THAT WOULDN'T BE SUBJECT TO DIFFERENT INTERPRETATIONS. 
          AND WITH THAT, MR. CHAIR, I WOULD LIKE TO, TO, BECAUSE I WAS GONNA RECOMMEND THE SAME THING. 
          IS 46 AND 84 BE TABLED UNTIL WE GET MORE CLARIFICATION? UH, I THINK THAT'S WHAT EVERYBODY WOULD LIKE, BECAUSE WE DON'T WANT TO, WE'RE GONNA MOVE ON WITH TABLING ADAM NUMBER. 
          OH, UM, SORRY, I HAD ONE MORE THING. 
          UM, WOULD IT BE HELPFUL IF WE HAD CREATED LIKE, SOME TYPE OF PRESENTATION WITH REPURPOSED ART THAT WE'VE SEEN AROUND TOWN? OR MAYBE JUST, YOU KNOW, UM, SOME TYPE OF SLIDESHOW THAT HAS EXAMPLES OF THAT TYPE OF ART? THAT WOULD BE GREAT. 
          YEAH. 
          YEAH. 
          I, I WOULD APPRECIATE IT. 
          JUST SO, BECAUSE I JUST, I, I, I DON'T KNOW ANYTHING BEHIND JUST THE WORDING, SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE INTENT IS. 
          UM, RAY, I THINK ONE OF THESE WAS YOUR PROPOSAL. 
          SO WHICH ONES THE TOP OR THE BOTTOM? WELL, THE CONCERN THAT I HAVE IS THAT YOU'RE TRYING TO DEFINE THIS TERM, WHEREAS IN THE PAST, YOU HAVEN'T DEFINED THE TERMS YOU HAVE, UH, UH, ABSTAINED OR, OR, UH, UH, UH, PREVENTED YOURSELF FROM, UH, UH, DEFINING ACCUMULATION FOR ONE, YOU KNOW, AND, AND SO NOW YOU'RE, UH, APPLYING THE SAME REASONING TO THIS TERM, UH, THAT WE HAVE BEEN USING IN THE PAST WHERE WE HAVE BEEN WANTING TO CLARIFY. 
          AND THAT IS YOUR INTENT. 
          IS THAT CORRECT? YOU WANNA CLARIFY WHAT A, UH, UH, REPURPOSED, UH, UH, ITEM IS ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED ITEM IS. 
          AND AND YOU HAVE CONFUSION ON THAT. 
          AND THAT HAS BEEN OUR INTENT AT THE VERY, FROM THE VERY BEGINNING, THAT THERE'S CONFUSION ON SOME OF THESE TERMINOLOGY. 
          NOW YOU ARE USING THIS REASONING AGAINST US. 
          UH, NO, THE DIFF THE DIFFERENCE RIGHT HERE. 
          THIS IS, I MEAN, THOMAS, THE DIFFERENCE IS ACCUMULATION. 
          YOU CAN PLUG IT IN AND GET DEFINITION FROM ANY DICTIONARY AND GIVES YOU VERY SPECIFIC DEFINITION. 
          IF YOU PLUG THIS IN. 
          I'M NOT GETTING ANYTHING. 
          I, I'VE BEEN SEARCHING NOW FOR THE LAST 10 MINUTES AND I'M NOT, I'M GETTING ALL RANDOM THINGS. 
          SO WE, WE DON'T HAVE TO DEFINE EVERY WORD IN THE BOOK IF THERE IS ALREADY DEFINITION OUT THERE, AND YOU CAN UTILIZE ANY DICTIONARY AND PULL IT AND SAY, HERE'S THE DEFINITION. 
          'CAUSE IT'S A STANDARD DEFINITION. 
          THAT'S WHY THOSE ARE TWO DIFFERENT THINGS. 
          I MEAN, YOU'RE COMPARING APPLES TO ORANGES. 
          UNDERSTOOD. 
          MIKE AND I, I, I JUST WANTED, I, I'D LIKE A LITTLE BIT MORE TIME. 
          I'D LIKE TO READ THIS RECOMMENDATION. 
          I MEAN, LOOK, I THINK THIS, THIS IDEA HAS MERIT. 
          I CERTAINLY THOUGH WANT TO CAUTION THE CODE ENFORCEMENT STAFF AND NEIGHBORS AND OUR BOARD FROM BECOMING THE ART POLICE. 
          AND, AND I THINK A LITTLE BIT MORE, WHETHER IT BE LANGUAGE OR EXAMPLES, I THINK WILL HELP US AS WE MOVE FORWARD TO TRY TO APPLY IT IN REAL LIFE. 
          UH, WE'RE DEALING WITH A SIGN CODE AS WELL THAT'S BEING AMENDED. 
          AND 
          [01:25:01]
YOU SHOULD HEAR THE, THE, THE, WHAT'S A SIGN VERSUS WHAT'S ART, RIGHT? IT'S A SIMILAR IDEA, RIGHT? AND WE'RE HAVING DEBATES ON WHAT IS SIGNAGE VERSUS ART. 
          SO I THINK IT'S GOOD TO HAVE A LITTLE BIT MORE TIME. 
          UM, MAYBE IF WE COULD GET A FEW EXAMPLES. 
          I THINK THAT WAS OFFERED, UH, HEY, THIS IS REALLY WHAT WE'RE SEEKING TO ADD TO THE CODE, SO IT'S NOT A CODE VIOLATION. 
          I THINK THAT'LL HELP THE GROUP. 
          SO, UH, AS I STATED, THE MOTION HAS BEEN WITHDRAWN, AND I WILL TABLE ITEMS NUMBER 46 AND 84 FOR THE NEXT MEETING. 
          WE'RE GONNA MOVE TO ITEM 40, AND I BELIEVE ITEM NUMBER 60 ARE THE TWO. 
          SO IF YOU'LL TAKE A LOOK AT ITEM 40 AND 60 COMBINED. 
          47 RIGHT THERE, 47. 
          AND IN FACT, IF YOU WANTED TO, YOU COULD ACTUALLY LOOK AT A WHOLE BUNCH OF THEM. 
          BUT SPECIFICALLY THE, THE WORDING, IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN, ON, UH, ITEM NUMBER 40 AND 60 ARE, ARE IDENTICAL, REUSABLE. 
          THAT'S NOT MR. CHAIRMAN EXACTLY. 
          VERBATIM. 
          WORD FOR WORD. 
          EXCUSE ME, MR. CHAIRMAN. 
          MR. ZUNIGA, HOW WAS THIS? UH, 40 AND 84 SUBMITTED BY WHO? THE ONE WE WERE TALKING ABOUT. 
          I ACTUALLY DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER. 
          AND GIMME ONE SECOND. 
          I'LL, I'LL CHECK. 
          SIR, GO AHEAD. 
          YOUR, YOUR MOTION IS TO NOT ACCEPT THE CHANGE. 
          YEAH, IT WAS IN THE, IT WAS IN THE ACTUAL, UH, SHEETS WE GOT BEFORE THIS ONE. 
          SO, UH, I GUESS THAT'S WHAT DANNY'S LOOKING AT IS WHO MADE THE PROPOSAL FROM THAT. 
          CAN YOU SEND? NO, YOU'RE LOOKING AT THIS ONE AND THIS ONE HAS REASONABLE TIME TOO. 
          OKAY, WE'LL GET THE ANSWER. 
          CHAIR CHAIR WOULD ACCEPT A MOTION FOR ITEM NUMBER 40 AND 60. 
          MR. CHAIR, THIS IS FRED ANIS. 
          I RECOMMEND THAT WE KEEP THE S A P M C SECTION 2 0 2 40 AND 60, UM, AS THE 2018 DEFINITION, UH, KEEP IT AS IS SECOND IS MADE, IS MADE. 
          AND SECOND TO KEEP THE 2018, UH, REFERENCE AS IS DISCUSSION CHAIR. 
          JUST TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, IT WAS SUBMITTED TWICE, ONCE BY RICK ACOSTA, PRESIDENT OF MY CITY IS MY HOME. 
          AND ONCE AGAIN, BY TEXAS HOUSER STAFF F MR. KO WITHDREW HIS REQUEST FOR IT ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION TO KEEP THE 2018 AS PRESENTED. 
          ALL SAY, AYE. 
          AYE WAS OPPOSED, SAY, NAYYY WAS THERE DISCUSSION? YES, MA'AM. 
          THERE WAS DISCUSSION. 
          THERE WAS A SECOND . 
          THERE WAS NO DISCUSSION. 
          WE WON'T HAVE ANY TIME FOR DISCUSSION . 
          I, I ACTUALLY, STATISTICALLY, I DID NOT WRITE THE NAME DOWN. 
          SO THEREFORE, CHAIR WILL GO BACK TO THE MOTION, UH, THAT MR. ANDIS MADE AND ASK FOR A SECOND. 
          SECOND. 
          AND MS. BROWN DID SECOND THAT TIME. 
          ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION, SAY AYE. 
          AYE WAS OPPOSED, SAY NAY. 
          HOLD ON. 
          YOU DIDN'T CALL FOR A DISCUSSION, UHUH, WE HAD DISCUSSION. 
          OH, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT BEFORE? NO, WE NEED WITHDRAW A DISCUSSION BEFORE VOTE. 
          I WITHDRAW THE VOTE. 
          THERE WAS A MOTION MADE BY MR. ANDIS TO KEEP THE 2018. 
          AND MS. BROWN SECOND THE MOTION DISCUSSION. 
          I APOLOGIZE. 
          NO, I'M NOT READY TO  ITEM 40 AND 60. 
          SO, SO QUICK QUESTION IS, IS IT REASONABLE FOR A, A NON MEMBER OR A VOICE MEMBER ONLY TO ASK IT FOR CLARIFICATION WHEN, UH, A MOTION IS MADE AND WHY IS THE, 
          [01:30:01]
THE, THE, THE REASONABLE? BECAUSE LAST TIME I ASKED THAT QUESTION ABOUT SOMETHING WAS SAID THAT I WASN'T SUPPOSED TO SAY THAT. 
          NO, THAT WAS ME. 
          I SAID I DID NOT WANT TO DEBATE. 
          AND THAT WAS, UH, AN INVITATION TO DEBATE. 
          UH, AND THE MOTION, UH, THE PERSON WHO MADE THE MOTION WAS WILLING TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION. 
          UH, SO IF YOU WANT TO ASK THAT QUESTION AGAIN, IF THEY WANTED TO ANSWER, I WANTED TO LET 'EM ANSWER AGAIN. 
          MOST OF THE TIME WE DO THIS IS WE HAVE TO HAVE THE PROPOSAL AND THEN A SECOND TO GET IT TO DEBATE. 
          SO, OKAY, ON THIS PARTICULAR PART, WE'VE COVERED REASONABLE, REASONABLE TIME BEFORE, AND IT'S ALWAYS BEEN 10 DAYS. 
          SO TO KEEP ON THE OTHER SIDE, UH, FOR EXAMPLE, 40 WHERE IT TALKS ABOUT 60 TO 90 HAS BEEN DISCUSSED, I FORGET WAY BACK IN THE BEGINNING. 
          AND THE REASON IT WAS NOT ACCEPTED THEN IS BECAUSE THE STATE SAYS 10 DAYS. 
          OKAY? SO, AND ALL THE DISCUSSIONS THAT WE HAVE WHEN THEY SEND PAPERWORK OUT IS 10 DAYS. 
          UM, 60 IS PRETTY MUCH THE SAME THING, 60 DAYS IN MY OPINION. 
          47 IS THE SAME, BUT WE'LL DISCUSS THAT ONE IN A MINUTE. 
          BUT NO, ONCE IT'S ALREADY DEFINED BY THE STATE AS 10 DAYS, THE STATE'S THE ONLY ONE THAT CAN CHANGE IT BY LEGISLATION. 
          SO THESE ARE, COULD, COULD, COULD WE HAVE A CITATION ON THAT? WHERE, WHERE IT'S STATED COUNSEL, UH, IT, IT'S IN, UH, UH, SEVERAL STATUTES. 
          I WOULD DEPEND ON, UH, CHAPTER 54, TEXAS LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE TWO 14, LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE CHAPTER 2 43 OF THE HEALTH AND SAFETY CODE. 
          BUT WHAT I WANNA POINT OUT IS, UH, IT SHALL GRANT A MINIMUM OF 10 DAYS SO THAT, AND IT GOES ON FURTHER TO, UH, ALLOW FOR EXTENSIONS BASED ON THE CIRCUMSTANCES. 
          SO THE 10 DAYS ARE IN LINE WITH STATE STATUTES AND OUR OTHER ORDINANCES, SPECIFICALLY CHAPTER 14 AND CHAPTER SIX. 
          BUT KEEP IN MIND IT SAYS MINIMUM. 
          AND THIS WAS, UH, BROUGHT UP AT THE, UH, LAST MEETING, UH, IN, UH, THE CHANGING IT, UH, 60 OR 90 CALENDAR DAYS AS A MINIMUM. 
          UH, THINK ABOUT, UH, YOU KNOW, WHAT I HAD BROUGHT UP, UH, LAST MONTH, I MEAN, AT THE LAST MEETING, 60 TO 90 DAYS. 
          SO, UH, LET'S SAY SOMEONE HAS, UM, WEEDS OR GRASS IN EXCESS OF 12 INCHES, THEN, UH, DO YOU WANNA ALLOW 90 DAYS TO PASS BEFORE SOMETHING IS ADDRESSED? UM, THE REASON THE HEALTH AND SAFETY CODE, UH, STATES 10 DAYS BECAUSE HIDE GRASS WEEDS, TRASH, DEBRIS, UM, UH, CREATE AN ENVIRONMENT FOR VERMIN, UH, SPECIFICALLY RATS. 
          SO, UH, IF IT'S SOMEONE IS ALLOWED TO NOT ABATE THE PROBLEM FOR UP TO 90 DAYS, UM, IT JUST THINK ABOUT THE PEOPLE LIVING NEXT TO THE PROPERTY AND, UH, BEING DIRECTLY IMPACTED. 
          SO THAT IS WHY THE, UH, THE 10 DAYS, FIRST OF ALL IS IN THERE BECAUSE IT IS STATE STATUTE, BUT THE LANGUAGE WAS ADDED WHEN THE SAMHSA WAS CREATED, THAT FOR THE SAMHSA, UM, IT WOULD BE 10 DAYS MINIMUM, WHICH COULD BE EXTENDED, AND IT OFTEN IS EXTENDED AS NECESSARY EXCEPT FOR, UH, IF IT'S, UH, AN EGREGIOUS SITUATION. 
          GO AHEAD. 
          UH, AS AMIT HAS, UH, SAID BEFORE, IN OTHER CONVERSATIONS, UH, THE, UH, NOTICE OF CITATION, UH, OR A CODE VIOLATION, A FORM HAS ALREADY 10 BUSINESS DAYS IN THERE. 
          SHOULD WE AMEND THIS REASONABLE TIME TO INCLUDE THE BUSINESS WORD THAT IS CURRENTLY MISSING SINCE YOU KNOW THE PEOPLE ARE GONNA NEED THE, UH, THE, THE SERVICES BEING OPENED, AND THAT DOES NOT INCLUDE THE, THE WEEKENDS FROM LEGAL PERSPECTIVE IS PREFERABLE JUST TO LEAVE IT AT 10 DAYS. 
          THAT'S HOW WE'RE, UH, WORKING AROUND THE STATE STATUTE. 
          UH, FOR EXAMPLE, THE HEALTH AND SAFETY CODE, IT'S 
          [01:35:01]
10 DAYS, 10 CALENDAR DAYS BY LEAVING IT AT JUST 10 DAYS. 
          IT ALLOWS, UH, FOR LIKE, WITH, UH, EXAMPLE JENNY PROVIDED TO ALLOW FOR THE MAILBOX RULE TO ALLOW FOR THE TIME THAT IT WILL BE MAILED. 
          SO LET'S SAY, UH, IF WE PUT 10 BUSINESS DAYS, UH, TO A BETA VIOLATION, THERE'S GONNA BE, UM, TIMES WHEN, UH, THE CITY IS CLOSED. 
          AND SO, UH, FOR EXAMPLE, THE CITY CLOSES, UH, JUST PRIOR TO CHRISTMAS TO, UH, AFTER NEW YEAR'S, WE CAN'T COUNT THOSE AS BUSINESS DAYS. 
          SO THEN NOTHING COULD BE DONE FOR THAT. 
          SO IT'S BETTER TO LEAVE IT AT 10 DAYS AS A MINIMUM. 
          AND THEN, UH, CODE PROVIDES, UH, THE ADDITIONAL TIME FOR THE MAILING. 
          AND LET ME, UH, THIS IS AMIN THOMAS. 
          LET ME JUST JUMP IN TO CLARIFY ONE THING. 
          YEAH, WE TALKED ABOUT THIS BEFORE AND WHEN WE TALKED ABOUT THE 10 BUSINESS DAYS, IT IS ON THE NOTICE, IT'S WRITTEN THERE. 
          THAT IS THE APPEAL TIME. 
          WE DON'T WANNA TAKE AWAY FROM THE PERSON THE RIGHT TO APPEAL. 
          SO IF THE CITY'S CLOSED 10 DAYS AND WE SAY, JUST YOU HAVE 10 DAYS TO APPEAL AND WE ARE CLOSED, THEN THEY DON'T HAVE ANY RIGHT TO APPEAL. 
          BASICALLY, THEY LOSE THAT. 
          THAT'S WHY THE APPEAL PROCESS IS THEY HAVE 10 BUSINESS DAYS TO APPEAL THE DECISION. 
          BUT IN REGARDS TO THE NOTICE, IT'S, IT'S AT LEAST AT MINIMUM 10 CALENDAR DAYS. 
          THANK YOU. 
          ANY OTHER DISCUSSION? ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION, WHICH IS TO MAINTAIN THE 2018 DEFINITION, SAY AYE. 
          AYE. 
          THOSE OPPOSED SAY NAYYY. 
          ITEM NUMBER 40 AND 60 IS APPROVED TO STAY WITH THE 2018 DEFINITION. 
          IF YOU TAKE A LOOK NOW AT ITEM NUMBER 47 AND ITEM 85, THE ONLY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THERE IS THE WAY IT WAS STRUCK OUT. 
          SPECIFICALLY, THE RECOMMENDATION IS TO BE 15 DAYS INSTEAD OF 10 DAYS. 
          AND I WOULD SUGGEST TO YOU THAT WE'VE EXHAUSTED THAT DISCUSSION, BUT I WILL ENTERTAIN A MOTION. 
          SO MOVED. 
          MR. CHAIR. 
          UH, THIS IS FRED ANDES. 
          UNDER SS A P M C, SECTION 2 0 2 ITEMS 47 AND 85. 
          I RECOMMEND THAT WE KEEP THE 2018 VERSION. 
          IS THAT A MOTION OR A RECOMMENDATION? UH, THAT'S A MOTION. 
          THANK YOU. 
          SECOND. 
          SECOND. 
          MR. ZUNIGA DISCUSSION? ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION TO KEEP THE 2018 DEFINITION? SAY AYE. 
          AYE. 
          THOSE OPPOSED SAY NAYYY. 
          MOTION CARRIES. 
          TAKE A LOOK NOW AT ITEM NUMBER 48 AND 86. 
          THESE ARE IDENTICAL, UH, RECOMMENDATIONS. 
          48 AND 86. 
          48 AND 86. 
          DID YOU FIND THEM? DO THESE FALL UNDER THE, UH, TABLE CATEGORY BASED ON THE, UH, AMENDMENTS? I'M SORRY, SAY THAT AGAIN. 
          PLEASE? DO THESE ITEMS FALL UNDER THE TABLE CATEGORY BASED ON THE AMENDMENTS? UNLESS THE ITEM HAS BEEN REPURPOSED FOR OUTDOOR USE? UH, THAT WOULD BE MY RECOMMENDATION, UH, TO THE COMMITTEE, UH, TO, UH, TABLE THIS AS WELL BECAUSE OF THE CORRECT THE, TO GET FOR THIS ALSO, UH, I JUST NEED MORE INFORMATION AS TO WHAT THE GOAL IS. 
          MR. GARZA? THAT WAS A MOTION, IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SUGGESTING? YES. 
          TO TABLE IT. 
          DO I HAVE A SECOND? I TO TABLE THIS, MR. SECOND? ANY DISCUSSION CHAIR? YES, SIR. 
          THIS IS DIFFERENT THAN THE, UH, ARTISTICALLY REPURPOSED, UH, ITEM. 
          THIS IS TALKING ABOUT RUBBISH AND THE DEFINITION OF WHAT RUBBISH IS. 
          WE'RE STILL DEALING WITH THIS ISSUE OF REPURPOSING. 
          AND, UH, THIS IS NOT ART. 
          THIS IS RUBBISH THAT HAS BEEN REPURPOSED. 
          UH, FOR EXAMPLE, AS AN ARCHITECT, I'VE USED GLASS HAS BEEN SAND WASHED, AND I'VE USED IT FOR PAVING. 
          UH, AND THAT'S BEEN REPURPOSED. 
          THAT'S, THAT'S AN ACCEPTABLE BUILDING MATERIAL. 
          YEAH. 
          AND THAT, THAT'S THE REASON WHY HE PROMOTION WAS TO TABLE IT. 
          SO WE CAN GET MORE CONVERSATION ABOUT OVERALL REPURPOSING. 
          AND, AND I AGREE WITH YOU ON THE ISSUE OF REFURBISH. 
          UH, 
          [01:40:01]
THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS THAT YOU CAN REFURBISH THAT ARE IN THE TRASH CAN TODAY. 
          UH, ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION TO TABLE ITEM NUMBER 48 AND 86 SAY, AYE. 
          A AYE, THOSE POSTS SAY NAYYY. 
          THANK YOU. 
          WE'LL MOVE TO ITEM NUMBER 26. 
          EXCUSE ME. 
          GO AHEAD. 
          JUST, JUST A QUICK COMMENT THAT I, I WOULD SUGGEST A LEGAL IN THEIR INVESTIGATION TO REFER TO THE, THERE ARE OTHER CITY APARTMENTS THAT I, I AM AWARE OF, THAT THEY ARE CURRENTLY SEEKING INTO, UH, EXPANDING THEIR, UM, PROGRAMS FOR A REPURPOSING AND REBUILDING. 
          THERE'S THE, UH, THE CONSTRUCTION COMMITTEE THAT, THAT BASICALLY IS IN CHARGE, IN CHARGE OF LOOKING AND LOCATING, UH, PLACES WHERE AT, AT A DEMOLITION OR AT THE CONSTRUCTION PERMIT HAS BEEN ISSUED, UH, TO REPURPOSE SOME OF THE MATERIALS AND SALVA SOME OF THE MATERIALS THAT CAN BE USED FOR CONSTRUCTION IN OTHER SITES. 
          SO THAT COULD BE A POSSIBILITY WHERE THERE COULD BE A FRUITFUL DISCUSSION TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THEY THINK ABOUT HOW THEY THINK ABOUT THIS REPURPOSING AND REFURBISHING, UH, UH, UH, MATERIALS, THE STORAGE OF THEM, BECAUSE I, I, I KNOW THAT SOME OF THOSE MATERIALS STAY FOR WEEKS, SOMETIMES IN PROPERTY LOANS, JUST WAITING TO BE, TO BE, BE PICKED UP FOR EITHER THE CITY OR SOME OTHER OWNERS. 
          AND THAT COULD BE, YOU KNOW, UH, UH, GROUNDS FOR IF WE HAPPEN TO, UH, REMOVE THO THAT, THAT POSSIBILITY OUT OF THE CODE TO, YOU KNOW, HAVE VIOLATIONS THAT WE MAY NOT, UH, WANT TO DO BECAUSE WE WILL BE LIMITING THEIR, THEIR CAPACITY AND THEIR, UH, WHAT THEY'RE TRYING TO DO IN THEIR REFURBISHING AND REPURPOSING AREAS. 
          UH, YES. 
          AND, UH, THAT'S A GOOD POINT. 
          THE, UH, WHAT THEY'RE WORKING ON RIGHT NOW IS A DECONSTRUCTION ORDINANCE FOR, UH, MATERIALS THAT CAN BE, HAS THEY HAVE BEEN DETERMINED THAT CAN BE REUSED FOR THE SAME PURPOSE AT ANOTHER LOCATION. 
          UM, THIS IS, UH, SO, UH, LIKE THE ITEMS THAT, UH, THEY'RE LOOKING AT FOR DECONSTRUCTION OR THE WINDOWS, THE, THE DOORS, UM, FRAMING, UM, THOSE, THOSE WILL ALL BE, UH, MATERIALS THAT CAN BE USED AT OTHER PLACES. 
          UH, THIS IS DEALING WITH, UH, THE, THE TRASH, UH, OUTSIDE. 
          SO IT, IT, IT'S, UH, I, I UNDERSTAND WHERE THE DECONSTRUCTION PORTION IS RELATED TO THAT, TO MATERIALS THAT HAVE BEEN DETERMINED TO BE USED IN THE SAME MANNER AT A DIFFERENT LOCATION. 
          WHEREAS, UH, HERE JUST, UH, SOME OF THESE ITEMS, UH, SUCH AS, UM, TREE BRANCHES, YARD TRIMMINGS, UH, I, I JUST NEED EXAMPLES OF LIKE, HOW, HOW THOSE COULD BE, UH, REPURPOSED OR REFURBISHED. 
          SO, UH, THE, THIS RUBBISH DEFINITION IS MORE FOR, UM, I, OH, I, UH, EXAMPLES OF RUBBISH, UM, LIKE, UH, UH, ITEMS THAT, UH, COULD CAUSE HARM OR ARE FLAMMABLE OR TOXIC. 
          UH, THAT'S THE IN INTENT OF THIS. 
          BUT I ALSO WANNA JUST ALSO MAYBE GET SOME MORE INFORMATION FROM WHOEVER PROPOSED IT, UH, WHAT THE INTENT IS. 
          UM, ALSO, UH, THE TIN CANS, UH, BEING REMOVED FROM THE LIST. 
          SO, SO IT'S NOT THE ITEMS THAT, UH, WE ARE ADDRESSING IN THE DECONSTRUCTION ORDINANCE. 
          THIS IS FRED ANDIS ALSO ON THAT. 
          YOU SEE ALL THESE GUYS THAT CUT LAWNS TREES. 
          HERE'S A PERFECT EXAMPLE. 
          THE CITY, I THINK A COUPLE YEARS AGO HAD THAT TIRE. 
          THE GUY WHO WAS COLLECTING ALL THE TIRES IN THE YARD, THAT KIND OF STUFF IS CONSIDERED, BUT WHAT HE WAS DOING WAS HE'S, AND THE PALLETS THAT CAUGHT, WAS IT JUST A COUPLE OF BLOCKS DOWN WHERE HE HAD ALL THE PALLETS IN THERE AND THEY CAUGHT ON FIRE. 
          THAT'S THE KIND OF STUFF THAT THIS IS DIRECTED TO. 
          THE UNSAFE STORAGE OF DEBRIS, GRASS CLIPPINGS, TREE LIMBS AND STUFF LIKE THAT. 
          MAINLY TIRES AND PALLETS IS ONE. 
          AND I KNOW THE FIRE MARSHAL WAS BRINGING THAT UP THE LAST TIME WE WERE DISCUSSING THESE CODES, IS IT WAS REAL PROMINENT THEN WHEN THEY WERE HAVING ALL THOSE FIRES, BECAUSE GUYS WERE JUST STACKING AND STACKING AND THEY WOULD CATCH ON FIRE. 
          BUT THAT'S THIS INTERPRETATION FOR THAT. 
          IT'S NOT DEALING WITH, I'M NOT GONNA SAY MAJORITY OF AVERAGE CITIZENS. 
          THERE ARE 
          [01:45:01]
A FEW OUT THERE THAT YOU PROBABLY KNOW THAT DO THAT. 
          SO THAT'S WHAT IT'S TRYING TO TELL MAINLY FOR COMMERCIAL SIDE CHAIR, IF I COULD, UM, FRED, I, I SEE YOUR POINT. 
          UH, HOWEVER, AS AN ARCHITECT, AND, AND IF YOU, UM, GO TO DIFFERENT PLACES HERE IN SAN ANTONIO, FOR EXAMPLE, THE BOTANICAL CENTER, THEY REUSED AND REPURPOSE A LOT OF MATERIALS OUT THERE THAT ARE RUSTED, UH, AND, UH, GLASS. 
          UH, AND, AND SO MAYBE WHAT WE NEED IS A DIFFERENT DEFINITION OF RUBBISH. 
          SOMETHING THAT THAT SATISFIES, UH, MS. RICE'S, UH, CONCERNS, UH, BECAUSE IT'S NOT CLEAR, UH, WITH THIS DEFINITION WHAT IS INCLUDED AS RUBBISH. 
          AND, UH, SO IF WE'RE GONNA INCLUDE A, A DEFINITION, UH, UH, MAYBE WE CAN CLARIFY THIS ONE, UH, A LITTLE BIT BETTER BECAUSE WE'VE TABLED THOSE TWO ITEMS. I'M GOING TO MOVE ON TO ITEM NUMBER 26, 57 AND 68. 
          THEY'RE IDENTICAL PROPOSALS. 
          THIS IS IN SECTION 1 0 2 0.8. 
          UH, THESE ARE ITEMS THAT ARE NOT, UH, COVERED BY THE CODE AT THE PRESENT TIME. 
          NO, EXCUSE ME. 
          UH, IT'S SECTION 1 0 2 0.8, ITEMS 26, 57 AND 68. 
          AND THEY'RE ALL IDENTICAL ON JUNE THE 24TH. 
          UH, WE DEALT WITH THIS ISSUE, AND, UH, WE CAME UP WITH THE INFORMATION THAT'S IN THE UPPER RIGHT HAND CORNER THAT READS REQUIREMENT NECESSARY FOR STRENGTH, STABILITY, AND PROPER OPERATIONS OF EXISTING FIXTURE STRUCTURE OR EQUIPMENT OF THE PUBLIC SAFETY, HEALTH, AND GENERAL WELFARE, NOT SPECIFICALLY COVERED BY THIS CODE, SHALL BE DETERMINED BY THE CODE OFFICIAL. 
          SO WE'VE DEBATED THIS ISSUE AND WE'VE HAD A MOTION TO ACCEPT CHAIR TO ENTERTAIN A MOTION. 
          MR. CHAIR, THIS IS FRED ANDIS. 
          I, UM, MOTION THAT WE ACCEPT THE PREVIOUS ON 6 24, 20 22 FOR ITEMS 26 57 AND 68. 
          UH, WE ARE ACCEPTING OR USING THE INFORMATION AS APPROVED ON 6 24 20 22. 
          UH, DO I HAVE A SECOND ON THE MOTION? SECOND AND A SECOND TWICE. 
          MR. GUPTA AND BROWN DISCUSSION, NO DISCUSSION. 
          ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION, SAY AYE. 
          AYE. 
          AYE. 
          OPPOSED? A OPPOSED SAY NAY. 
          THE MOTION. 
          S I DIRECT YOUR ATTENTION TO SECTION 1 0 6 0.4 VIOLATION PENALTIES, WHICH IS ITEM NUMBER 62 AND 70. 
          THE INFORMATION IS IDENTICALLY PROPOSED. 
          IF YOU WOULD TAKE A LOOK THROUGH THAT, THAT WE KEEP THE 18 CODE AS, AS DIVIDED IN ITEM 62 AND 70. 
          THE MOTION ON THE FLOOR IS TO ACCEPT OR TO KEEP THE 2018 TEXT SECOND. 
          AND MR. ZIKA SECOND. 
          ANY DISCUSSION? UH, COULD YOU, UH, I JUST PROVIDE A, A LITTLE BIT MORE TIME? UH, I, I'M HAVING A HARD TIME, UH, LOCATING. 
          YOU DIDN'T DO YOUR HOMEWORK. 
           DIDN'T HAVE IT. 
          , US CITY ATTORNEYS DON'T HAVE MONEY TO PRINT THIS BIG. 
          WE GRANT YOUR TIME. 
          OKAY. 
          WHAT TIME I NEED TO SAY AGAIN? THREE, FIVE MINUTES. 
          THE SAME QUESTION. 
          NO, BE EASY. 
          NO, YOU CAN'T. 
          OKAY. 
          AND, UH, THANK YOU FOR THE TIME. 
          UH, SO WHAT IS THE MOTION ON THE TABLE? THE MOTION IS TO KEEP THE 2018 TEXT. 
          I HAVE A QUESTION ON THE 2018 TEXT. 
          DO YOU MIND EXPLAINING TO ME EXACTLY WHAT IT'S SAYING HERE? 'CAUSE IT HAS A LOT OF WORDS, AND I CAN READ THEM, BUT I DON'T KNOW IF I QUITE UNDERSTAND THEM. 
          [01:50:03]
UH, THIS, OH, DID THAT TO ANYBODY? THE, UM, YEAH. 
          THIS IS IN LINE WITH, UH, CHAPTER 54, WHICH GIVES THE AUTHORITY FOR HOME RULE MUNICIPALITIES TO ENACT ORDINANCES WHEN THE SAMHSA WAS WRITTEN. 
          AND, UH, WHAT CHAPTER 54 ALLOWS FOR IS TO DEAL WITH, UH, REPEAT OFFENDERS. 
          AND SO THE FIRST TIME, AND THIS IS COMPLETELY UP TO THE DISCRETION OF THE JUDGE, WE CAN RECOMMEND, BUT THEN THE JUDGE HAS THE FINAL SAY. 
          AND SO, UH, IN THE STATUTE FOR VARIOUS TYPES OF ORDINANCES, THE STATUTE LIMITS HOW MUCH CAN BE ASKED. 
          IN INSTANCES WHERE, UH, IT, UH, DEALS WITH, UM, SANITATION, PUBLIC HEALTH, IT CAN GO UP TO 2000. 
          SO WHAT THIS IS PROVIDING FOR IS A METHOD WHEREBY IF THERE'S A REPEAT OFFENDER, THE FIR THE FIRST TIME, UH, WE CAN ENTER INTO A PLEA AGREEMENT, UH, PROVIDE TIME. 
          IF THEY DON'T MEET IT, THE JUDGE CAN FIND THE A HUNDRED DOLLARS RATHER THAN IMMEDIATELY JUMPING TO 500, WHICH IS THE DEFAULT, OR TO 2000, DEPENDING ON THE VIOLATION. 
          THIS PROVIDES A SYSTEM WHERE WE HAVE A, UM, REPEAT OFFENDER EGREGIOUS VIOLATOR. 
          SO, UH, THE JUDGE CAN TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION HIS OR HER PRIOR DECISION, SEE THAT THEY ASSESS THE HUNDRED. 
          AND, UH, SO THIS IS THE SECOND TIME THEY CAN ASSESS 200 AS A MINIMUM OR MORE. 
          AND, UH, IT JUST ALLOWS FOR, UH, ENHANCED, UH, MONETARY, UH, FINES TO GO ALONG WITH A CONVICTION OR A PLEA BARGAIN. 
          SO, IF I UNDERSTAND CORRECTLY, WHEN IT SAYS EACH DAY A VIOLATION IS PERMITTED TO EXIST, SHALL CONSTITUTE A SEPARATE OFFENSE, THAT MEANS THAT EACH DAY THAT A VIOLATION KEEPS CONTINUING AND THE OWNER DOES NOT RESOLVE IT. 
          SAY, I WAS CHARGED A THOUSAND DOLLARS THE FIRST TIME, IF IT EACH DAY IS IT IS GONNA BE TURNING INTO A SEPARATE OFFENSE, THE NEXT DAY I'M GONNA BE CHARGED A THOUSAND DOLLARS. 
          THE NEXT DAY I'M GONNA BE CHARGED ANOTHER A THOUSAND DOLLARS. 
          SO IF 10 DAYS GO BY THAT I DON'T TAKE CARE OF THAT VIOLATION, I MIGHT GET CHARGED $10,000. 
          IS THAT A CORRECT INTERPRETATION OF THAT? UH, NO. 
          UM, IT'S, AND, AND, UH, I'LL THROW THIS INTO, UH, THE, THE PROPOSAL, UM, IS, UH, TRUMP BY STATE LAW. 
          UH, STATE LAW, THE LEGISLATURE, UH, WHEN THEY ENACTED CHAPTER 54 AND ALL THE HEALTH AND SAFETY ORDINANCES, UH, RELATED TO, UM, THE, THAT WERE ALLOWED TO BE CREATED, UH, THAT'S, UH, THAT'S STATE STATUTE, THAT EACH SEPARATE DAY IS A, UH, A NEW VIOLATION. 
          NOW, UH, WHEN YOU ARE ISSUED A VIOLATION, AND, UH, YOU GO TO COURT, UH, WHETHER BY TRIAL, BY BENCH TRIAL, OR YOU WORK OUT A DEAL WITH THE PROSECUTOR AND YOU'RE SECURITY AND YOUR ASSESSED THAT AMOUNT, THAT'S FOR IN CRIMINAL COURT. 
          UH, THAT'S ITS OWN SPECIFIC DEFINED VIOLATION. 
          NOW, UH, THE LEGISLATURE WAS, UH, VERY FIRM ON THIS POSITION THAT TO ALLOW THE CITIES TO, UH, FILE CITATIONS, UH, IF THE ABATEMENT HAS NEVER OCCURRED. 
          UH, SO AGAIN, UH, STATE STATUTE 
          [01:55:01]
TRUMPS THIS, UH, 'CAUSE UH, THAT'S JUST THE LAW. 
          WE JUST, UH, ARGUED, UH, ABOUT THIS IN COURT. 
          BUT DOES, UH, CODE ENFORCEMENT GO OUT AND ISSUE CITATIONS EVERY SINGLE DAY? NO. 
          THIS IS JUST THE ABILITY TO DO SO AS, UH, PER THE DICTATES OF THE TEXAS LEGISLATURE. 
          SO IN YOUR, UH, IS IT A POSSIBILITY, UH, LET'S SAY, UH, IF Y'ALL RECALL, UM, ON APPLEWHITE, THE TIRE RECYCLING FACILITY, UH, IT HA IT, WE DISCOVERED IT AT THE SAME TIME AS, UH, I CAN'T REMEMBER IF IT WAS BERNIE OR WHEREVER THE BIG FIRE, UH, WAS. 
          UH, A FIRE HAD STARTED AT THE APPLEWHITE FACILITY. 
          A FIRE, UH, DEPARTMENT WAS VERY, VERY CONCERNED THAT IF A, A FIRE HAPPENED AT APPLE WIDE, IT WOULD BURN, UH, FOR A YEAR AND A HALF BECAUSE OF ALL THAT, UH, THE OWNERS, UH, WERE COMPLETELY NON-RESPONSIVE. 
          AND, UH, SO IN THAT INSTANCE, AND WORKING WITH THE ATTORNEY GENERAL'S OFFICE, UH, T C E Q, UH, WE DID, YOU KNOW, I, I, I DID ASK MY CLIENTS TO CITE ON A, A REGULAR BASIS. 
          I, I THINK AT THE TIME, I, DANNY, I, YEAH, ONCE A WEEK MAYBE, UH, BECAUSE THAT WAS, UH, THE ONLY WAY WE COULD ESTABLISH ENOUGH TO JOIN THE ATTORNEY GENERAL IN THE LAWSUIT AGAINST THE PROPERTY. 
          SO IT'S, IT'S USED IN, IN MORE EGREGIOUS SITUATIONS. 
          UH, I CAN'T THINK OF, UH, ANY INSTANCE WHERE, UH, CODE ENFORCEMENT, AT LEAST IN, IN MY 16 YEARS, HAS EVER ISSUED A CITATION EVERY DAY. 
          BUT IT'S IN THERE BECAUSE IT'S STATE LAW. 
          THE MOTION OF THE FLOOR IS TO, TO KEEP THE 2018, UH, WORD OR TEXT THAT WE HAVE. 
          UH, ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION, SAY AYE. 
          AYE. 
          AYE. 
          THOSE OPPOSED, SAY NAYYY. 
          THE MOTION CARRIES FOR ITEM NUMBER 62 AND 70. 
          CHAIR WOULD DIRECT YOU TO, UH, SECTION 1 0 8 0.12, UNSAFE EQUIPMENT, AND THE CHAIR WOULD INVITE A MOTION. 
          MR. CHAIR, THIS IS FRED ANDES, S A P M C, SECTION 1 0 8 0.2. 
          UH, ITEM 73, I REC, UH, I HAVE MOTION THAT WE KEEP THE 2018 DEFINITION. 
          SECOND MOTION HAS BEEN MADE, AND SECOND, TO KEEP THE 2018 TEXT FOR UNSAFE EQUIPMENT. 
          ANY DISCUSSION? UM, I THINK THAT THE INCLUSION OF IMMINENT IN THE PROPOSED AMENDMENT, UM, IS USEFUL JUST BECAUSE THIS IS TALKING ABOUT UNSAFE EQUIPMENT, UM, UNSAFE EQUIPMENT, UM, THAT PROPOSES AN IMMINENT HAZARD TO HEALTH, UM, LIFE, PROPERTY, OR SAFETY. 
          UM, I BELIEVE THAT IT, IT LOOKS GOOD THE WAY THAT IT IS. 
          UM, YEAH, THAT'S MY COMMENT. 
          . 
          IT LOOKS GOOD AS IT WAS PROPOSED. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU. 
          CHAIR. 
          YES, SIR. 
          GO AHEAD, RAY. 
          I THINK THE ADDITION OF IMMINENT ON THERE, UH, INDICATES THAT, THAT THE HAZARD IS, UM, IMPENDING AS OPPOSED TO, UM, UH, LOTS OF EQUIPMENT THAT IS IN THIS REPAIR COULD BE HA HAZARDS. 
          UH, BUT IT'S NOT IMPENDING. 
          IT'S NOT IMMINENT. 
          [02:00:01]
AND, AND ADDING IMMINENT ON THERE CLARIFIES THAT, THAT VERY LIKELY, UH, IT COULD CAUSE A HAZARD. 
          UH, BUT YOU CAN, YOU KNOW, DRIVE AROUND SAN ANTONIO AND FIND ALL KINDS OF EQUIPMENT NEED REPAIR, THAT'S HAZARDOUS. 
          I MEAN, JUST DRIVING YOUR CAR DOWN THE ROAD IS HAZARDOUS. 
          THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. 
          I HAVE A QUESTION FOR STAFF AND LEGAL. 
          UM, DOES THIS LIMIT US IN ANY WAY? UM, I, I'LL JUST ANSWER. 
          UM, I, I DON'T LIKE THAT THEY'RE IMMINENT FOR, UM, UNSAFE EQUIPMENT. 
          I CAN THINK OF TOO MANY EXAMPLES. 
          I THINK YOU SAID, RAY, UM, I WAS THINKING OF IMMINENT MEANING LIKE ABOUT TO HAPPEN. 
          YOU USED ANOTHER TERM. 
          I CAN'T REMEMBER WHAT YOU JUST SAID. 
          YOU JUST IMPENDING, IMPENDING, UM, HEATING EQUIPMENT THAT DOESN'T HAVE THE PROPER VENTILATION, FOR EXAMPLE, I THINK IS UNSAFE, RIGHT? WE HAVE A LOT OF INSTANCES WHERE THE HVAC UNIT IN THE HOUSE, IF IT'S NOT VENTED PROPERLY, CAN EVENTUALLY OVER TIME CAUSE C O TWO OR CO IN THE, IN THE HOUSE AND, AND CAUSE SERIOUS DAMAGE. 
          IS THAT GONNA HAPPEN TODAY, TOMORROW, NEXT WEEK, NEXT MONTH? I DON'T KNOW. 
          BUT TO ME, THAT'S VERY UNSAFE, RIGHT? IT'S UNSAFE EQUIPMENT THAT I'M GONNA ASK SOMEONE TO FIX RIGHT AWAY. 
          SO I HAVE A FEW MORE EXAMPLES LIKE THAT. 
          SO THIS ONE, THIS ONE GIVES ME A LITTLE PAUSE. 
          UM, I, I, I KNOW THE INTENT, IT, IT CAN'T BE JUST SOMETHING SMALL ON A PIECE OF EQUIPMENT THAT'S A LITTLE OFF, RIGHT? THAT DOESN'T DEEM IT UNSAFE. 
          WELL, MAYBE IT'S NEEDS A LITTLE TWEAK, NEEDS A LITTLE FIX OR SOMETHING. 
          LIKE, I GET THAT, BUT I'M, I HAVE A LITTLE PAUSE PUTTING HIM IN ON THIS SECTION. 
          I JUST THANK YOU. 
          AND, UH, FROM A LEGAL PERSPECTIVE, UH, AGAIN, IT, IT WOULD OPEN UP THE CITY, UH, TO A TREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF LIABILITY IF THE CITY IS MADE AWARE THAT, UH, ANY OF THESE ITEMS OR EQUIPMENT ARE, UH, MALFUNCTIONING OR ABOUT TO MALFUNCTION. 
          UH, AND, UH, IF IT'S LIMITED TO IMMINENT, THAT'S THE SAME AS LIKE, SUCH AS OUR EMERGENCY DEMOLITION AUTHORITY. 
          SO, UH, YOU KNOW, THIS WAS ALSO PUT IN, UH, BY FIRE, UH, FIRE SUPPRESSION SYSTEM. 
          UH, WE, UH, HIT A LOCATION TODAY THAT THE FIRE MARSHAL, UH, WAS CONCERNED ABOUT 'CAUSE THEIR FIRE SUPPRESSION SYSTEM WAS NOT WORKING, BUT PEOPLE WERE, UH, RENTING ROOMS IF IT HAD TO BE IMMINENT, THE FIRE MARSHAL WOULDN'T, UH, HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO ORDER THE PROPERTY CLOSED UNTIL THEY'RE IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE FIRE CODE OR, UH, OR WAIT UNTIL A FIRE HAPPENS. 
          AND SO, UH, I HAVE THE SAME CONCERN AS MIKE, BUT FROM THE LEGAL PERSPECTIVE, THANK YOU. 
          CAN I, CAN I JUST ADD ONE MORE THING TO, TO THE POINT I, I DO THINK THE LANGUAGE THAT'S IN THERE, IT SAYS, WHICH IS IN SUCH DISREPAIR OR CONDITION, THERE HAS TO BE AN ELEVATED, SOMETHING WRONG WITH IT. 
          I THINK THERE, THAT MEANS SOMETHING IS PRETTY BAD WITH IT. 
          I, I THINK THAT'S ENOUGH. 
          I'VE USED THAT ENOUGH AS CODE OFFICIAL WORKING WITH MY CHIEF BUILDING INSPECTOR, OR CHIEF MECHANICAL INSPECTOR OR CHIEF ELECTRICAL THAT WE'VE BEEN ABLE TO UTILIZE THIS TO DEFINE UNSAFE VERSUS SOMETHING THAT JUST NEEDS A, A, A FIX, RIGHT? SOMETHING THAT NEEDS, I GUESS, A LITTLE FIX. 
          SO, AGAIN, NOT TO DISMISS THE IDEA, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, I THINK WHAT WE HAVE IS, I FEEL PRETTY GOOD WITH WHAT WE HAVE. 
          I IMMINENT THERE AS I, IT CAUSES ME PAUSE. 
          MY NOTE WAS, UH, IF A BEAR WIRE IS A BEAR WIRE, IT IS NOT AN IMMINENT DANGER UNTIL SOMETHING ELSE HAPPENS, AND YET IT IS A DANGER. 
          UH, SO I WAS CONCERNED ABOUT THE ISSUE OF IMMINENT IN THAT PARTICULAR CASE. 
          ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? CALL FOR THE VOTE. 
          ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION TO MAINTAIN THE COPY AS IN, AS PRESENTED, THE 2018 CODE. 
          SAY AYE. 
          AYE. 
          THOSE OPPOSED, SAY NAYYY. 
          THE MOTION ON ITEM NUMBER 73 CARRIES, I DIRECT YOU TO 1 0 8 0.1 0.5. 
          ITEM NUMBER 75 IS A PROPOSED AMENDMENT. 
          AND MY COMMENT 
          [02:05:01]
IS THAT IT'S BASICALLY AN ISSUE THAT'S COVERED IN CHAPTER, UH, IT'S COVERED IN OTHER CODE ALONG WITH CHAPTER SIX, BUILDING ARTICLE EIGHT, ET CETERA. 
          UH, AND AS A RESULT, I'M NOT SURE IT'S, IT'S VIABLE. 
          IN ADDITION, IT SAYS THAT, UH, I DON'T BELIEVE A CASE WOULD ACTUALLY BE REFERRED TO THE B S B. 
          THEY HAVE NOT DONE SO SO FAR. 
          MR. CHAIRMAN? YES, SIR. 
          I MOVE TO KEEP IT AS IS MOTION ON THE FLOOR IS TO, UH, KEEP THE COPY OF THE TEXT AS WRITTEN, 2018, RIGHT? UH, AS WRITTEN IN 2018. 
          YES. 
          I'M SORRY. 
          THEN I, I SECOND THE MOTION. 
          MR. ZIKA HAS MADE THE MOTION TO KEEP THE, THE TEXT, UH, FROM 2018 AND SECONDED BY MR. ANDES DISCUSSION? NO DISCUSSION. 
          NO DISCUSSION. 
          YOU CAN'T SAY THAT. 
          CALL FOR THE VOTE. 
          ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION, SAY AYE. 
          AYE. 
          THOSE OPPOSED SAY NAY. 
          ITEM NUMBER 75 CARRIES. 
          I WOULD DIRECT YOUR ATTENTION TO ITEM NUMBER 76 UNDER S A M P C CODE 1 0 8. 
          MR. CHAIRMAN? YES, SIR. 
          ON ITEM 76, MOVE TO KEEP THE LANGUAGE AS WRITTEN IN 2018. 
          SECOND MOTION IS MADE. 
          AND SECOND, TO KEEP THE TEXT IN 2018. 
          DISCUSSION, PLEASE GO AHEAD. 
          COULD THE PERSON, UH, FILE A MOVING THE MOTION FORWARD? EXPLAIN WHY WOULD NOT BE A GOOD IDEA TO GIVE MORE TIME BEFORE THE DISCONNECTION OF UTILITIES? COULD YOU USE YOUR MICROPHONE PLEASE? IF IT'S A HAZARDOUS CONDITION, I DON'T THINK THERE'S, THERE IS A QUESTION OF TIME. 
          IT'S A QUESTION OF LIFE AND DEBT. 
          AND SO THE COURT OFFICER SHOULD IN MOVE INSTANTANEOUSLY. 
          AND MY COMMENT IS, UH, A NOTICE TO DISCONNECT IS USUALLY NOT, USUALLY A NOTICE TO DISCONNECT IS ALMOST ALL, NOT EVEN, ALMOST ALWAYS A MOTION TO DISCONNECT IS AN EMERGENCY SITUATION. 
          UM, THIS IS A QUESTION FOR, UM, THE CODE OFFICERS. 
          UM, DO YOU ALL USUALLY, UM, NOTIFY PEOPLE ABOUT UTILITY DISCONNECT BEFOREHAND? THAT'S, I, I DON'T WANNA SAY WE ALWAYS DO. 
          I THINK WHAT WE DO IS WE FOLLOW WHAT'S IN THE CODE TODAY, WHICH IS WE ATTEMPT TO, LEMME SEE HERE, WHAT DOES IT SAY? AND WHENEVER POSSIBLE WE NOTIFY THE OWNER OR OWNER'S AUTHORIZED AGENT AN OCCUPANT OF THE BUILDING, DA, DA, DA, IF NOT NOTIFIED. 
          WE DO AFTER. 
          SO WHAT WE DO IS WE FOLLOW TODAY, UH, WHICH EMERGENCY, UH, HAZARD CONDITION OR IMMINENT HAZARD TO LIFE, WHICH IS IN THE CODE. 
          UM, BUT THEN WE WILL CERTAINLY, AND MANY TIMES THEY KNOW IT'S COMING, BUT I'M SURE THERE'S SOME TIMES WE'VE HAD TO DO IT RIGHT AWAY AND THEN NOTIFY THEM. 
          SO I THINK WHAT'S BEING PROPOSED HERE IS WAIT TILL YOU NOTIFY THEM AND THEN TAKE ACTION. 
          BUT THE ANSWER TO YOUR QUESTION IS, WE FOLLOW TODAY'S CODE. 
          UM, DOES THAT HELP? DOES THAT HELP ANSWER IT? UM, YEAH, IT DEFINITELY DOES HELP ANSWER. 
          SO, UM, IF WE WERE TO JUST TAKE OUT THE, YOU KNOW, NOTIFYING THEM FIVE DAYS PRIOR, BECAUSE I UNDERSTAND THAT SOMETIMES IT'S 
          [02:10:01]
AN EMERGENCY AND YOU HAVE TO DO IT ALL OF A SUDDEN, UM, IF YOU'RE, UM, YOU KNOW, TALKING TO THEM AFTERWARDS, UM, TO PERHAPS NOTIFY THEM OF THE UTILITY DISCONNECT, UM, WOULD IT STILL BE ALLOWED TO INCLUDE, UM, NOTIFYING OCCUPANTS OF AVAILABLE ASSISTANCE OR RELOCATION PROGRAMS? I THINK THE QUESTION IS, CAN WE ADD THAT PIECE OF IT? I DON'T THINK WE WOULD HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT. 
          I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING WE, BY POLICY ATTEMPT TO DO. 
          IF, YOU KNOW, AND I THINK WE'VE HAD SOME DISCUSSION ON OTHER THINGS, POLICY VERSUS INCODE TODAY, WHAT IF PEOPLE CHANGE, ET CETERA. 
          SO WE, WE WOULD BE OKAY WITH THAT, MAKING SURE THAT PEOPLE KNOW OF THE AVAILABLE ASSISTANCE. 
          UM, SO I'M SURE WE COULD COME UP WITH SOME LANGUAGE OR IF YOU'D LIKE TO COME UP WITH SOME LANGUAGE WE CAN TWEAK AND COME BACK TO CHAIR THAT. 
          BUT I THINK I, I PERSONALLY HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THE WORD WILL BECAUSE WILL IS A STATUTORY WORD. 
          IT MEANS IT'S ABSOLUTE MANDATORY. 
          AND THERE ARE THOSE ISSUES, UH, UH, WHERE YOU HAVE AN EMERGENCY WHERE YOU JUST FLAT CANNOT DO IT. 
          IT'S, IT'S GOTTA BE DISCONNECTED RIGHT NOW. 
          UH, A A REAL QUICK EXAMPLE WOULD BE IF I'M GOING TO A FIRE, UH, I WANT THE ELECTRICITY CUT OFF BEFORE I PUT ANY WATER ON THE FIRE IF I CAN. 
          UH, AND THE, THE WORD WILL MEANS I CAN'T EVEN PUT WATER ON A FIRE UNTIL IT'S DISCONNECTED. 
          THE POWER IS DISCONNECTED. 
          SO THAT, THAT IS MY ONLY CONCERN THERE. 
          AND THE ONLY REASON WHY I SAY IT'S 'CAUSE I'VE BEEN THERE . 
          AND, UM, I DID MENTION LIKE AFTERWARDS BECAUSE THAT'S WHEN, UM, THAT'S WHEN IT SAYS THAT IT, IT'S USUALLY DONE. 
          AND LIKE I SAID, SOMETIMES THERE'S , UM, IN THE OTHER INSTANCE THAT LET'S SAY SOMEONE IN THE BUILDING IS, UM, RELYING ON MEDICAL EQUIPMENT THAT REQUIRES ELECTRICITY, UM, WHAT DO YOU ALL DO IN THOSE INSTANCES? WE, WE, WE DON'T TURN IT OFF . 
          YEAH, WE'VE HAD A HANDFUL OF THOSE EXAMPLES. 
          I THINK IN MY TENURE, UH, CERTAINLY WE'LL WORK WITH THE OTHER CITY DEPARTMENTS TO TRY TO GET OTHER HELP. 
          SO THAT ONE, EITHER WE CAN MOVE OR FIND ANOTHER PLACE FOR THAT INDIVIDUAL WITH THE NECESSARY EQUIPMENT TO BE IN A SAFER LOCATION. 
          BUT, UM, I CAN THINK OF ONE AND ONE EXAMPLE I  IT WAS SEVERAL YEARS AGO, BUT EVERYTHING SAID WE SHOULD HAVE TURNED OFF, UM, THE, THE, THE, THE POWER DUE TO THE HAZARD, EXCEPT IT WAS A CRITICAL LIFE SAFETY PIECE OF EQUIPMENT. 
          SO WE, WE DID HAVE TO WORK WITH THE INDIVIDUAL OF COURSE, THAT TRUMPED THE OTHER ITEMS. SO, CHAIR, IF I COULD GO AHEAD, PLEASE, RAY. 
          UM, I THINK THE PURPOSE OF THAT CODE IS TO ENSURE PUBLIC HEALTH, SAFETY AND WELFARE. 
          AND, UM, I'VE MENTIONED THAT BEFORE. 
          AND I, I THINK THE POINT OF THIS AMENDMENT IS TO, UM, NOT, UM, DISPLACE THE OCCUPANTS FROM A POSSIBLY HAZARDOUS, UH, CONDITION TO A MUCH MORE HAZARDOUS CONDITION. 
          UM, BECAUSE, UM, IF THEY'RE NOTIFIED ABOUT, UM, UH, AVAILABLE ASSISTANCE OR RELOCATION PROGRAMS, UH, WHAT IS THE HARM IN THAT, UH, LETTING THESE FOLKS, UH, KNOW ABOUT RELOCATION AND, UH, ASSISTANCE THAT, THAT IS AVAILABLE? MR. CHAIR? YES, MA'AM. 
          UH, I WOULD, UH, UH, RECOMMEND THAT, UH, THAT NOT BE CODIFIED, UM, BECAUSE THIS SECTION ALSO ADDRESSES WHEN THE UTILITIES HAVE BEEN ILLEGALLY CONNECTED TO. 
          SO, UH, WITH THIS BEING CODIFIED, THEN THAT WOULD REQUIRE US TO, UH, OBTAIN ASSISTANCE FOR, UH, CRIMINALS WHO BROKE INTO A VACANT HOUSE AND ATTACHED POWER OR WATER. 
          UH, IT WOULD REQUIRE THE STEPS BE TAKEN REGARDLESS IF THEY'RE THERE LEGALLY OR NOT. 
          UH, UH, MY RECOMMENDATION IS, UH, IT, IT IS, UH, POLICY AND, UH, ALLOW THAT TO CONTINUE RATHER THAN CODIFYING JUST BECAUSE, UH, THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN, IT, IT WOULD ENCOMPASS ANY STRUCTURE THAT IS OCCUPIED REGARDLESS OF THEY'RE THEY'RE LEGALLY OR NOT. 
          AND, UM, YEAH, UNLESS YOU UN UN, UNLESS YOU CLARIFY THAT IN THE CODE, UNLESS YOU PUT THE LEGALLY, YOU KNOW, RESIDENCE PART IN THE CODE, WE, WE CAN, UH, DO THAT. 
          [02:15:01]
BUT WHAT ABOUT INSTANCES, UM, UH, SUCH AS WITH AN APARTMENT, UM, OR A HOUSE WHERE THE, UH, EVICTION JUDGMENT HAS COME THROUGH. 
          UH, CAN WE SAY THEY'RE LEGALLY THERE WHEN THE LANDLORD OR THE OWNER IS SAYING THEY'RE ILLEGALLY THERE? SO WHAT ABOUT IN, IN THOSE INSTANCES? BUT WE CAN, UH, CERTAINLY, UH, IF Y'ALL WILL ALLOW ME THE TIME, UM, TO LOOK AT LANGUAGE TO POSSIBLY GET YOU TO WHERE, UH, Y'ALL WANNA GO. 
          BUT I JUST, I, I HESITATE ON, UH, CODIFYING A PROCESS THAT IS GOING TO VARY DEPENDENT ON THE CIRCUMSTANCES. 
          NOTIFICATION OF THE OCCUPANTS IS A MATTER OF PROCEDURE, AND I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD PUT IT IN THE CODE ITSELF. 
          UH, SO I MEAN, IT'S, IF IT'S A DEPARTMENT PROCEDURE THAT WE NEED DISCONNECT THE UTILITIES, YOU NOTIFY THE OCCUPANTS THAT SHOULD TAKE CARE OF IT. 
          RIGHT. 
          I WAS JUST GONNA OBJECT TO THE, TO THE USE OF THE WORD CRIMINALS. 
          UH, SOME OF THESE FOLKS ARE NOT CRIMINALS. 
          UH, THEY HAVEN'T BEEN, UH, JUDGED. 
          SO, UH, I THINK, UH, THAT WAS YOUR EARLIER STATEMENT. 
          THE DOCUMENTS WERE CALLED CRIMINALS BECAUSE THEY DID SOMETHING. 
          I I, YOU KNOW, MY REPORTED THAT THEY WERE EITHER, UH, VAGRANTS AND OR CRIMINALS. 
          UH, AND WHEN I SAY CRIMINALS, UH, MOTION, THEY'RE IDENTIFIED, THEY HAVE A SSID NUMBER, THEY HAVE BEEN ARRESTED. 
          UH, PARTICULAR INSTANCE, A GANG TOOK OVER A VACANT HOUSE. 
          THEY ALL HAD RECORDS. 
          UH, SEVERAL HAD WARRANTS OUT FOR MURDER. 
          UH, SO, UH, NO, I WILL NOT ACCEPT THAT CHARACTERIZATION. 
          I SPECIFICALLY, WHEN I SAY CRIMINAL, I AM NOT CLASSIFYING AN UNKNOWN INDIVIDUAL AS A CRIMINAL. 
          WHEN I SAY CRIMINAL, I AM SAYING SOMEONE WHO HAS A DOCUMENTED CRIMINAL HISTORY AND OR IS ENGAGING IN CRIMINAL ACTIVITY SUCH AS DRUG DEALING OR A GANG OR PROSTITUTION. 
          SO I, I DO OBJECT TO THAT CHARACTERIZATION. 
          THE REASON WHY I WAS STARTED TO INTERRUPT THAT ISSUE, RAY, IS BECAUSE WE SEE IT TOO OFTEN WHERE A THEFT OF ELECTRICITY OCCURS. 
          AND THAT IS A CRIMINAL ACT, UH, AS IT GETS INTO COURT. 
          UH, AND GENERALLY SPEAKING, IT'S UPHELD, UH, MOTIONAL THE FLOOR IS TO LEGAL. 
          CAN I SAY SOMETHING REALLY QUICK? SURE. 
          UM, UH, I JUST WANTED TO NOTE THAT IF WE'RE INCLUDING, I GUESS, THE WORDS OF LIKE ILLEGAL ACTIVITY, CRIMINAL ACTIVITY, DOESN'T THAT CONSTITUTE, YOU KNOW, UM, LIKE THE CRIMINAL CASES VERSUS CIVIL CASES? AND ISN'T THAT LIKE A DIFFERENT SET OF LAWS THAT GOVERN, UM, THAT BEHAVIOR? AND IS THAT SOMETHING THAT WE ARE ALLOWED TO GOVERN IN A CODE LIKE THIS? UM, PARTICULARLY WITH THE USE OF CRIMINALS OR ILLEGAL ACTIVITY? NO, THE, THIS HAS, UH, NOTHING TO DO WITH CHAPTER 1 25, WHICH ADDRESSES, UH, COMMON NUISANCES DUE TO HABITUAL CRIMINAL ACTIVITY. 
          MY CONCERN IS, UH, ABOUT CODIFYING, UH, THE, THE REQUIREMENTS, THE, OF THE POLICY THAT'S IN PLACE, BUT, UH, THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN, IT WOULD APPLY TO PERSONS WHO ARE NOT THERE LEGALLY. 
          UH, BOARD, Y'ALL HAD A, A CASE WHERE THE, UH, THE PERSON NOTICED THE HOUSE HAD BEEN VACANT IN DISTRICT TWO, UH, TOOK POSSESSION OF IT BY CLAIMING SQUATTERS' RIGHTS, PUT SOMEONE IN THE HOUSE, LEASED IT OUT, UH, IT HAD A LOT OF DEFICIENCIES, ILLEGAL CONNECTIONS. 
          AND, AND SO WOULD THAT BE A CASE WHERE, UH, WE WOULD, IF THIS IS CODIFIED, THEN, UH, THE RESPONSIBILITY WOULD BE ON THE CITY TO EXPEND FUNDS AND, UH, PROVIDE THESE 
          [02:20:01]
ACTIONS WHEN THEY NEVER HAD THE RIGHT TO BE THERE. 
          OKAY. 
          AND YOU ALSO MENTIONED THAT YOU MIGHT NEED MORE TIME TO KIND OF ADDRESS WHAT IT IS WE'RE TRYING TO GET AT. 
          UM, YEAH, I JUST WANT TO REITERATE THAT BEFORE, UM, WE VOTE, UH, LEGAL, I, I, I, UH, I'M GONNA CALL THE MOTION, UH, LEGAL. 
          ARE YOU SPEAKING ABOUT, YOU KNOW, CRIMINALS ON VACANT HOMES THAT GO IN THERE THAT HAVE DRUG USE PROSTITUTES AND, UH, SOME AREN'T EVEN ASSOCIATED WITH THEM HOUSES AND THEY HAVE, YOU KNOW, ILLEGALLY TURN, UH, PUT THE WATER THERE, YOU KNOW, IN THE PIPES, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER, AND ILLEGALLY ON THE HOUSE, THE HOUSES WITH ELECTRICITY, RIGHT? THAT'S WHAT, AND THEY ARE SOME OF THAT. 
          AND, AND WE DO HAVE THE CITY POLICE EVEN COME OVER HERE AND SAFE OFFICERS, RIGHT, REGARDING THAT? YES. 
          I MEAN, INCLUDING THOSE, BUT ALSO, UM, UH, THEY'RE BREAKING THE LAW. 
          YEAH. 
          BUT ALSO, FOR EXAMPLE, ON, UM, UH, DISTRICT 10, UH, THERE WAS A HOUSE WE, UH, FILED, UH, A 1 25, UH, FOR THE DRUG ACTIVITY AND THE SHOOTINGS, THEY, UH, UH, UTILITIES WERE SHUT OFF BECAUSE THEY WERE NOT PAYING. 
          UH, THEY KEPT CONNECTING, UH, THEIR ELECTRICITY TO THE HOUSE NEXT DOOR. 
          UM, SO THEY KEPT GETTING CITED, KEPT, UH, UH, BEING ORDERED NOT TO DO SO. 
          UH, THEY BLEW UP THE HOUSE. 
          IT, IT BURNED TO THE GROUND. 
          I MEAN, THEY'RE OCCUPANTS OF THE HOUSE, THEIR RESIDENTS, UH, BUT THEY WERE STEALING ELECTRICITY FROM THE HOUSE, WHICH CAUSED A FIRE. 
          AND THEN THE HOUSE ADJACENT ALMOST BURNED TO THE GROUND. 
          SO THAT IT'S, IT'S BOTH, WHEN I SAY CRIMINAL, IT'S INCLUDING, UH, THE HOUSES Y'ALL HAVE SEEN THE GANG HOUSES, UH, CRACK HOUSES, BUT ALSO, UH, THE PEOPLE WERE THERE LEGALLY 'CAUSE IT'S THEIR HOUSE. 
          BUT, UH, ENGAGING IN DRUG ACTIVITY, WHICH WAS A SEPARATE ISSUE, BUT CONTINUOUSLY STEALING ELECTRICITY FROM THE NEIGHBORING HOUSE. 
          AND, UH, IT DID RESULT IN THE VERY THING WE WERE, UH, WORRIED ABOUT UL BECAUSE I CUT YOU OFF AND WAS GONNA CALL THE MOTION AND LET IT GO FURTHER. 
          I'M GONNA GO BACK TO YOU FOR YOUR COMMENT. 
          UM, YEAH, I JUST, I JUST WANNA MENTION THIS IS, WE'RE SPEAKING AS IF EVERYONE WHO HAS THEIR UTILITY, I'M SO SORRY, SHUT OFF IS A CRIMINAL. 
          UM, BUT THE REALITY IS THAT MOST OF THEM ARE NOT, RIGHT? MOST OF THEM WHO GET THEIR UTILITY SHUT OFF ARE NOT CRIMINALS AND DO REQUIRE SOME TYPE OF, UM, YOU KNOW, HELP DIRECTION TOWARDS ASSISTANT PROGRAMS AND RELOCATION PROGRAMS. UM, SO I, I CAN COMPLETELY UNDERSTAND NOT NOTIFYING THE OCCUPANTS FIVE DAYS PRIOR, BECAUSE SOMETIMES IT'S AN EMERGENCY AND IT HAPPENS LAST SECOND. 
          UM, BUT I DO THINK THAT IT WOULD BE HELPFUL, UM, TO TAKING ACTIONS, UM, TO INCLUDE TAKING SUCH ACTION TO NOTIFY OCCUPANTS OF AVAILABLE ASSISTANT PROGRAM OR REALLOCATION PROGRAMS, UM, GIVEN THAT THEY HAVE NOT COMMITTED, YOU KNOW, ANY CRIMINAL ACTIVITY. 
          UM, BUT I JUST WANNA REITERATE THAT PEOPLE, NOT ALL PEOPLE WHO HAVE THEIR UTILITY SHUT OFF ARE CRIMINALS AND WOULD CONCUR WITH THAT. 
          MS. RIVERA, YOU HAD A COMMENT? YES, SIR. 
          I JUST WANTED TO POINT OUT AND, UM, TYPICALLY WE TRY TO BE CAREFUL WITH NAMING SPECIFIC DEPARTMENTS BECAUSE DEPARTMENTS DO CHANGE RESPONSIBILITIES, DO CHANGE NAMES. 
          THE ONE THAT'S LISTED HERE IS DEPARTMENT OF HUMAN SERVICES. 
          USUALLY WE ONLY REACH OUT TO THEM THROUGH FOR THEIR HOMELESS, UM, OUTREACH. 
          THAT'S USUALLY WHAT THAT DEPARTMENT IS, IS KIND OF CENTRALIZED FOR WITH OUR COORDINATION EFFORTS. 
          HOUSING AND NEIGHBORHOOD SERVICES IS NOW THE DEPARTMENT THAT HAS BEEN OVERSEEING, UH, RELOCATION EFFORTS, REPAIR, REMEDIATION, THINGS LIKE THAT. 
          SO WHEN, WHEN WE GET INTO SPECIFIC NAMES OF DEPARTMENTS, WE, WE, WE MAY KIND OF BOX OURSELVES IN. 
          AND IT'S JUST SOMETHING I WANTED TO POINT OUT BECAUSE ROLES, RESPONSIBILITIES DO CHANGE OVER TIME AT ANY GIVEN TIME. 
          SO JUST TO MAKE SURE. 
          THANK YOU. 
          [02:25:01]
ANY OTHER COMMENT? MAKE, MAKE ONE MORE COMMENT? UM, JUST BECAUSE I, I THINK I KNOW WHERE THIS IS GOING, BUT, UH, I'D LIKE THE CONVERSATION. 
          UM, I THINK WHAT, WHAT I'D LIKE TO DO IS GRAB, UH, OUR CURRENT S O P THAT HAS SOME OF THIS LANGUAGE IN THERE BASED ON WHAT SOME OF WHAT WAS IDENTIFIED. 
          UH, MAYBE THERE'S SOME TWEAKS WE CAN MAKE TO OUR POLICY AND IT'S A LITTLE, IT GIVES US A LITTLE MORE FREEDOM TO WRITE SOMETHING LIKE, UH, UNLESS THERE'S EXTREME, UH, KNOWING CRIMINAL ACTIVITY. 
          LIKE SOME OF THESE, UH, STAFF WILL CONTINUE TO, UH, ATTEMPT TO MAKE, YOU KNOW, CONNECTION WITH RESOURCES FOR THE OCCUPANT. 
          OKAY. 
          I'M JUST GONNA AD-LIBBING HERE, BUT LET US TAKE A LOOK AT OUR CURRENT S O P. 
          LIKE I KNOW WE HAVE SOME OF THIS IN THERE, IF NOT MOST OF IT, BUT WE CAN BRING IT BACK AS A SIDE NOTE MAYBE WITH YOU ALL OR ALL OF US AT SOME POINT AND ENSURE THAT WE HAVE THE PROPER LANGUAGE YOU'RE LOOKING FOR. 
          IT MIGHT NOT MAKE IT IN THE CODE BECAUSE OF ALL THE CHALLENGES I THINK WE'VE IDENTIFIED, AND I THINK IT WOULD CAUSE SOME PROBLEMS TO BE CODIFIED IN THE MANNER THAT THAT HAS BEEN PROPOSED. 
          BUT I THINK OUR POLICY NEEDS TO ENSURE THAT WE HAVE ALL THOSE ITEMS. YOU TALKED ABOUT MOST OF THOSE ITEMS, I THINK I AGREE WITH MOST OF THEM. 
          UM, IS THAT FAIR? DOES THAT SEEM LIKE A REASONABLE NEXT STEP? YOUR PROPOSAL IS TO TABLE ITEM NUMBER SIX, NOT THE TABLE. 
          NOT THE TABLE. 
          I'M JUST SAYING. 
          AND LET, LET THE S O P ADDRESS THEY'RE ADMINISTRATIVE. 
          I STILL WANNA WORK TO ENSURE THAT SOME OF THIS IS IN OUR S O P, BUT YOU DO WHAT YOU DO WHAT YOU WILL VOTE WITH THE VOTE. 
          I THINK WE'VE IDENTIFIED A LOT OF CHALLENGING ISSUES, SO I'LL LET YOU GUYS VOTE, BUT OKAY. 
          YOU, WHAT YOU'RE DOING THEN IS YOU'RE TAKING THE STANDARD OPERATING PROCEDURES MM-HMM. 
           AND TAKE A LOOK AT THAT TO, YEAH, IT HAS A LOT OF THIS IN THERE, BUT IF THERE'S ANYTHING MISSING BASED ON THIS DISCUSSION. 
          GOT IT. 
          I'LL WORK ON THE SIDE WITH MY TEAM. 
          IF WE HAVE TIME AT THE END OF ONE OF THESE LAST MEETINGS OR IN THE FUTURE, I THINK WE CAN WORK AS A GROUP. 
          GOT THAT. 
          YOU KNOW, TO ENSURE THAT NOTIFICATION IS GOOD. 
          ALL FOR THE VOTE. 
          THE MOTION IS TO MAINTAIN THE TEXT IN 2018 CODE AS BEEN SECONDED. 
          ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION, SAY AYE. 
          AYE. 
          AYE. 
          THOSE OPPOSED SAY NAY. 
          ITEM NUMBER 76 CARRIES. 
          I DIRECT YOUR ATTENTION TO 4 0 4 0.5. 
          UH, ONE MOMENT PLEASE. 
          WE'RE LOOKING AT 3 45. 
          LET'S SEE, I THINK ITEM SEVEN, ITEM NUMBER 87. 
          WE CAN GET THROUGH. 
          SO I DIRECT YOUR, I'M SORRY, ONE, ONE MORE MEETING. 
          WE'VE GOT ONE MORE MEETING SCHEDULED. 
          THE TIME IS 3 55. 
          YEP. 
          THANK YOU. 
          UH, THE, UH, AGAIN, YOUR ATTENTION IS DIRECTED TO SECTION 4 0 4 0.5, AND THAT'S ITEM NUMBER 87 ON OUR LIST. 
          AND I, AGAIN, REPEAT MY WORD ABOUT CONCERNED ABOUT STATUTORY WORDS. 
          MR. CHAIRMAN? YES, SIR. 
          I MOVE TO REPEAT THE LANGUAGE. 
          2018, AS IS THE MOTION ON THE FLOOR IS TO MAINTAIN THE TEXT IN 2018? SECOND, YES, SIR. 
          MR. ZUNI SECOND DISCUSSION, NO DISCUSSION. 
          YOU CAN'T SAY NO DISCUSSION. 
          GO AHEAD. 
          WITHOUT, AGAIN, WITHOUT BEING A PERSON THAT HAD WRITTEN ANY OF THESE PROPOSALS, UH, JUST LIKE TO NOTE THAT IF I SEE THE, THE, THE, THE WORDS THAT ARE SCRATCHED AND REPLACED WITH WILL, IT SEEMS TO ME THAT THE INTENTION OF THE PROPOSAL WAS TO NOT LEAVE TO THE, UM, WILLINGNESS OF THE CODE OFFICIAL TO USE THE STANDARDS, BUT TO FORCE THAT TO HAPPEN, WHICH SEEMS REASONABLE TO ME NOT TO LEAVE THAT UP TO THE DECISION OF THE COURT OFFICIAL, BUT I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR MAYBE FROM MIKE OR FROM OTHER PEOPLE IN THE, IN THE TABLE TO WHY WE WOULD NOT WANT THAT TO HAPPEN. 
          TO ALWAYS USE THE STANDARDS AND LEAVE THAT TO THE DECISION OF THE COURT OFFICIAL. 
          MIKE OR DANNY WOULD REFER THAT QUESTION TO YOU GUYS. 
          ALL GOOD. 
          I'LL JUST SAY AS A STANDARD PRACTICE, WE DO UTILIZE NATIONALLY RECOGNIZED STANDARDS AND AN, UH, AN, AN OVERCROWDING OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT, UH, WE'LL USE THE INTERNATIONAL FIRE CODE, WE'LL USE THE FAIR HOUSING STANDARDS, PROPERTY MAINTENANCE, STUFF LIKE THAT. 
          UH, WE DON'T JUST MAKE IT UP AS WE GO. 
          SO I MEAN, AT THE END OF THE DAY, I THINK, UH, MAYBE 'CAUSE I'M USED TO, AND I, AND I, I KNOW WE ALWAYS DO USE THIS, THIS TYPE OF INFORMATION TO MAKE THOSE DECISIONS. 
          I'M USED TO THIS ORIGINAL LANGUAGE, BUT IF SOMEONE TOLD ME I HAD TO, I'D SAY, WELL, I'LL KEEP DOING WHAT I'M DOING . 
          [02:30:01]
SO, YOU KNOW, IF YOU SAY ALWAYS, THEN YOU WILL . 
          'CAUSE YOU DO, I THINK THE QUESTION IS WHEN WOULD, WOULD YOU, WILL LIKE TO HAVE THE, THE DISCRETION TO NOT USE THE STANDARDS. 
          IS THERE ANY CHANCE WHERE WOULD THE CITY CODE OFFICIALS WOULD NOT NEED TO USE THE STANDARDS OR WILL ONE NOT TO USE THE STANDARDS? WELL, I, I'M NOT SURE EXCEPT, YOU KNOW, WE JUST WENT THROUGH THIS SOCIAL DISTANCING, EXPERI EXPERIENCE, RIGHT? WITH THE PANDEMIC THAT HAD, WE WEREN'T USING NATIONALLY RECOGNIZED STANDARDS. 
          WE WERE USING GUIDANCE FROM THE C D C AND STATE AND LOCAL OFFICIALS, ET CETERA, ET CETERA, ET CETERA. 
          SO I'M NOT EXACTLY SURE THAT'S THE SAME THING, BUT AGAIN, I IT COULD HAPPEN. 
          I'M NOT SURE. 
          WELL, THE C D C IS, UH, UM, YES, A GOVERNMENT AGENCY, UH, THAT ISSUES RECOMMENDATIONS, BUT THEY ARE NOT MANDATORY UNTIL, UH, APPROVED BY CONGRESS. 
          UH, BUT THE, UH, THE COVID EXAMPLE, IT'S A PERFECT EXAMPLE. 
          'CAUSE THE NATIONAL STANDARDS, UH, LET'S SAY FOR THIS ROOM, UH, ALLOWED FOR, I AM JUST GONNA GUESS, UH, 200 PEOPLE, BUT, UH, TEXAS LAW, WHICH WE HAVE TO ABIDE BY, UH, IMPLEMENTED THE SOCIAL DISTANCING AND LIMITED THAT THE NATIONAL STANDARD FOR RATHER THAN GOING BY THE NATIONAL STANDARD, THE TEXAS STANDARD. 
          AND SO, UH, YOU KNOW, AND, AND ALL OF Y'ALL KNOW, UH, TEXAS IS VERY UNIQUE WHEN IT COMES TO PROPERTY RIGHTS ISSUES. 
          AND SO, UH, SOME OF THOSE, UH, STATUTES WILL DIRECT MIKE TO FOLLOW TEXAS, NOT A NATIONAL STANDARD, UH, BASED ON, UH, THE CONCERNS WITH, UH, PROPERTY RIGHTS. 
          SO, UH, WITH THE AUTHORIZATION, UH, IT GETS YOU TO WHERE IWAN, HE, HE WILL LOOK AT NATIONAL STANDARDS, BUT, UM, KEEPING IT THAT WAY WILL ALLOW FOR SITUATIONS WE NEVER THOUGHT WOULD BE POSSIBLE. 
          LIKE COVID. 
          THE, THE PROPOSED AMENDMENT, UH, INCLUDES STATE AND LOCAL LAWS. 
          SO IT'S NOT JUST TALKING ABOUT NATIONAL LAWS. 
          ACTUALLY, THAT'S A GOOD POINT. 
          SO THAT, THAT MIGHT'VE BEEN THE CATCHALL BECAUSE THEY WERE CODIFIED BY FEDERAL, I'M NOT TERRIBLE STATE AND LOCAL LAWS BY THE EMERGENCY ORDERS. 
          SO MAYBE THAT WOULD'VE BEEN, THAT WOULD'VE BEEN A, OKAY. 
          I WOULD'VE JUST, I WOULD'VE POINTED TO THAT, THAT SECOND PART OF THE SENTENCE. 
          RIGHT. 
          I THINK THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE CATCHING. 
          SO, SO IS THERE A PROBLEM, PROBLEM USING WILL BECAUSE, UH, STATUTORY THAT'S WHAT YOU DO? I'LL, I'LL JUST, I'LL JUST SAY THIS FROM MY PERSPECTIVE, I PREFER THE ORIGINAL, BUT IN REALITY I DO WHAT YOU'RE PROPOSING OR WHOEVER'S PROPOSING IT. 
          I, WE DO THAT. 
          WE FOLLOW STATE AND NATIONAL RECOGNIZED STANDARDS AND LAWS. 
          SO I, SO, SO WHY WOULD YOU WANT THAT, THAT VARIANCE? THAT THAT VARIATION OR THAT WIGGLE RIGHT, RIGHT. 
          I JUST SAID, I JUST SAID IT, IT, IT MAKES NO DIFFERENCE TO ME. 
          I SAID I THINK THERE'S MAYBE AN UNKNOWN IN THE FUTURE THAT THE FIRST ONE MAY HELP OR NOT, BUT I THINK, I THINK I'M COVERED EITHER WAY. 
          AS THE CODE OFFICIAL I, WE'RE GONNA USE EVERYTHING WE KNOW ABOUT OVERCROWDING NOW AND IN THE FUTURE. 
          IF IT'S OVERCROWDING, IT'S A HEALTH ISSUE. 
          THAT'S HOW WE'LL ADDRESS IT. 
          THE MOTION ON THE FLOOR IS TO MAINTAIN THE 2018 TEXT FOR 4 0 4 0.5. 
          ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION, SAY AYE. 
          AYE. 
          THOSE OPPOSED SAY NAYYY. 
          THE TEXT WILL BE MAINTAINED FOR 2018. 
          THE TIME IS NOW FOUR O'CLOCK. 
          WE CAN GO INTO FIVE O'CLOCK FOR MY SCHEDULE IF YOU WANT TO. 
          NOBODY WANTS TO DO THAT BY, WITHOUT OBJECTION. 
          BY UNANIMOUS CONSENT. 
          WE ARE ADJOURNED. 
          OUR NEXT MEETING WILL BE ON THE 5TH OF AUGUST CHAIR. 
          I'M SORRY, CAN I, BEFORE WE ADJOURN? ABSOLUTELY. 
          SO THE MEETING THAT WAS PROPOSED ON AUGUST 5TH, IT'S NOT GONNA TAKE PLACE UNFORTUNATELY. 
          SO I DO HAVE TWO OTHER PROPOSED DATES. 
          UH, WE CAN MEET NEXT FRIDAY, UH, JULY THE 29TH, OR WE CAN MEET AUGUST THE 19TH. 
          SAME TIME, SAME PLACE. 
          JUST THE DATES CHANGED. 
          UH, I CAN'T MEET NEXT FRIDAY. 
          I'M SORRY. 
          UH, THE 19TH. 
          THE 19TH OF AUGUST. 
          OF AUGUST. 
          I'M GOOD EITHER TO EITHER OF THE DAYS. 
          [02:35:01]
THE 19TH OF AUGUST, IF YOU'LL RESERVE IT. 
          SO, 19TH OF AUGUST, AUGUST, WE CAN'T MAKE WILL BE OUR NEXT MEETING. 
          I'M SORRY? YOU'LL NOT BE AVAILABLE. 
          OKAY. 
          AUGUST. 
          AUGUST 19TH, AVAILABLE. 
          JULY. 
          DANNY, WHAT ABOUT AUGUST 12TH? IS THAT AVAILABLE? UH, NO SIR, THERE IS THAT VOICE. 
          OKAY. 
          WERE WE NOT AVAILABLE ON AUGUST 12TH? IS THAT WHAT YOU SAID, DANNY? NO. 
          OKAY. 
          SO WE'RE BACK TO WHAT DATE AGAIN? 2029. 
          IS THAT FIRST DATE OR WE CAN PUSH TO THE 26TH IF YOU WANT TO. 
          AUGUST 26TH. 
          26TH. 
          UH, WAIT A MINUTE. 
          LET ME, LEMME GO BACK. 
          NEXT FRIDAY IS JULY 29TH. 
          29TH. 
          CAN EVERYBODY MAKE JULY THE 29TH? I THOUGHT YOU SAID, YOU SAID I'LL CHANGE MY SCHEDULE. 
          NINTH. 
          JESSE SAID I COULD VOTE FOR HIM. 
          YES. 
          YES. 
           WELL, I'M SORRY YOU CAN'T BE AVAILABLE. 
          I'M SORRY. 
          I JUST ME BACK. 
          OKAY. 
          THEN WE'RE GONNA SCHEDULE IT FOR NEXT FRIDAY. 
          I'LL CHANGE MY SCHEDULE. 
          THAT WAY WE CAN GET IT DONE IN ADVANCE OF THE DATE THAT WE HAVE TO GET TO COUNSEL. 
          SO NEXT FRIDAY WILL BE OUR NEXT MEETING, AND AGAIN, IT'LL BE ONE O'CLOCK IN THIS LOCATION. 
          DANNY, ARE YOU OKAY WITH THAT? YES, SIR. 
          WE'RE GOOD. 
          OKAY. 
          NEXT FRIDAY, ONE O'CLOCK, SAME TIME, SAME PLACE. 
          THANK YOU ALL. 
          APPRECIATE YOU.
* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.