* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting. [00:00:04] I'D LIKE [3:00 P.M. – Call to Order] TO CALL TO ORDER THE HISTORIC AND DESIGN REVIEW COMMISSION FOR WEDNESDAY, OCTOBER 18TH, 2023. MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE? GIBBS HERE. CASTILLO. SAVINO? HERE. VELASQUEZ. HERE. MOOKA? HERE. GUEVARA VASQUEZ. HERE. CERVANTES HERE. HOLLAND HERE. AND FETZER. HERE WE HAVE A QUORUM. GREAT. BEFORE WE GET STARTED, WE DO HAVE INTERPRETIVE SERVICES AVAILABLE FOR THE MEETING. IF I COULD PLEASE HAVE ONE OF MY INTERPRETERS COME UP AND, UH, GIVE AN ANNOUNCEMENT FOR THE AUDIENCE. OH, BU THANK YOU. THE HISTORIC AND DESIGN REVIEW COMMISSION IS AN ADVISORY BOARD APPOINTED BY THE CITY COUNCIL. I'M JEFFREY FETZER, CHAIRMAN AND VICE CHAIR IS MONICA SAVINO. IT IS THE FUNCTION OF THE COMMISSION TO ADVISE A CITY MANAGER IN ALL RELEVANT CITY DEPARTMENTS CONCERNING ALL APPLICATIONS FOR PERMITS FOR PROPERTIES IN HISTORIC DISTRICTS FOR LANDMARKS ON CITY PROPERTY, IN THE RIVER IMPROVEMENT OVERLAY, AND FOR DEMOLITIONS. AND CONSIDERING WHETHER TO RECOMMEND APPROVAL OR DISAPPROVAL OF AN APPLICATION FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS, THE COMMISSION SHALL BE GUIDED BY THE CITY'S UNIFIED DEVELOPMENT CODE AND DESIGN GUIDELINES AND STANDARDS THAT HAVE BEEN ADOPTED BY CITY COUNCIL. AN APPEAL OF A DECISION BY AN ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL CAN BE FILED IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE CITY'S UNIFIED DEVELOPMENT CODE. IF ANYONE PRESENT WISHES TO SPEAK IN FAVOR OR IN OPPOSITION TO ANY ITEM ON TODAY'S AGENDA, PLEASE SIGN UP ON THE PUBLIC COMMENT SHEET. IT IS NOT NECESSARY TO SIGN UP. IF YOU ARE THE OWNER OF A REPRESENTATIVE FOR A PROJECT ON THE AGENDA, YOU'LL BE CALLED ON AS THE CASE IS CALLED. CASE REST REPRESENTATIVES WILL BE GIVEN NO MORE THAN 15 MINUTES TO PRESENT THEIR CASE WITH AN ADDITIONAL TWO MINUTES TO RESPOND TO PUBLIC COMMENTS. SPEAKERS FOR, OR OPPOSED TO A CASE WILL BE LIMITED TO TWO MINUTES. EACH SPEAKERS MAY ALSO SIGN UP TO YIELD THEIR TWO MINUTES TO ANOTHER SPEAKER WHO IS SIGNED UP. ANYONE WHO IS YIELDING THEIR TIME MUST BE PRESENT AT THE TIME THE SPEAKER IS CALLED UPON. SPEAKERS WILL BE CALLED UPON IN THE ORDER IN WHICH THEY'RE SIGNED UP FOLLOWING PUBLIC TESTIMONY. ANY COMMISSIONER MAY CALL UPON ANY SPEAKER TO RESPOND TO FURTHER QUESTIONS. APPROVAL BY THE COMMISSION DOES NOT TAKE THE PLACE OF ANY TYPE OF PERMIT. PERMITS MUST BE OBTAINED FOR ALL WORK. CERTIFICATES OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR WORK APPROVED BY THE COMMISSION WILL BE EMAILED TO YOU WITHIN 10 DAYS. NO WORK OF ANY TYPE IS TO BE STARTED WITHOUT OBTAINING THE APPROPRIATE CITY PERMITS. AFTER A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS HAS BEEN ISSUED BY THE OFFICE OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION. AT THIS TIME, PLEASE SILENCE YOUR CELL PHONES AND I ASK STAFF FOR ANY, UH, FURTHER, UH, COMMENTS. ANNOUNCEMENTS? YES. THANK YOU. UM, A QUICK APOLOGY TO EVERYONE. WE'RE RUNNING A LITTLE BIT LATE TODAY. UM, OUR WORK SESSION RAN LONG, SO WE ARE ABOUT 10 MINUTES BEHIND. UH, BUT THANK YOU FOR YOUR PATIENCE. UM, I DO WANNA HIGHLIGHT ONE UPCOMING EVENT THIS WEEKEND. UM, IT'S THIS SATURDAY. UM, IT'S ON THE EAST SIDE CEMETERIES. IT'S A GUIDED FIVE K RUN AND WALK. UM, THAT'S GONNA BE, AGAIN, THE SATURDAY AT 9:00 AM AT FAIRCHILD PARK. UM, PARTICIPANTS WILL BE TAKEN BY A GUIDE THROUGH THE HISTORIC EAST SIDE CEMETERIES. UM, THE WORK OR THE TOUR WILL HIGHLIGHT SOME OF THE UNIQUE HISTORY OF THE CEMETERIES AS WELL AS THE ONGOING CONSERVATION WORK DONE BY THROUGH THE CITY'S CEMETERY STEWARDSHIP PROGRAM. UM, REGISTRATION, ADVANCED REGISTRATION IS REQUIRED FOR THIS ONE. UM, SO WE DO ASK THAT YOU FIND THAT ONLINE@SACUP.COM. YOU CAN SEARCH HISTORIC AND FIND IT. UM, AND WE'RE ABOUT FULL AS WELL, SO WE PROBABLY HAVE SPOTS FOR ABOUT 20 MORE PARTICIPANTS, BUT THAT, THAT IS AVAILABLE FOR THOSE THAT WOULD LIKE TO ATTEND. [Approval of Minutes] UM, FROM THERE, UM, I BELIEVE WE CAN TAKE ACTION ON, UH, MINUTES. SHOULD HAVE MINUTES FROM OCTOBER 4TH. MR. CHAIR, RECOMMEND APPROVAL. RECOMMEND APPROVAL FOR THE MOTION. I MOVE FOR THE APPROVAL OF THE MINUTES. A SECOND. MOTION A SECOND. CAN YOU HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE? GIBBS? AYE. SAVINO? AYE. VELAZQUEZ AYE. ZUKA. AYE. VASQUEZ. AYE. CERVANTES? YES. HOLLAND. AYE. AND FETZER AYE. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU. OKAY, IF WE CAN TURN OUR ATTENTION TO THE SCREEN. UM, WE HAVE TWO CASES, UM, THAT HAVE BEEN UPDATED. SO CASE NUMBER 11 HAS BEEN POSTPONED BY THE APPLICANT. WILL NOT BE HEARD TODAY. CASE NUMBER 16 HAS BEEN WITHDRAWN. UM, SO NO ACTION IS NEEDED ON EITHER OF THOSE CASES TODAY. UM, I DON'T BELIEVE THAT WE HAD ANY CITIZEN COMMENTS ON THOSE CASES. [CONSENT AGENDA Items are placed on the consent agenda when staff recommends approval or recommends approval with stipulations that the applicant agrees to. Any member of the public desiring to speak on a consent agenda item may sign up and be heard prior to voting on the consent agenda. Commissioners may request to remove any item from the consent agenda and have it placed on the individual consideration agenda. All items on the consent agenda will be considered for approval by one motion adopting the items with staff findings and recommendations.  ] UM, LOOKING AT THE CONSENT AGENDA, WE HAVE EIGHT ITEMS, UM, AT THIS TIME WE'LL GO AHEAD AND, UH, PROVIDE PUBLIC [00:05:01] FEEDBACK FOR THOSE ITEMS, UM, BEGINNING WITH VOICEMAILS, AND THEN WE ALSO HAVE IN-PERSON SPEAKERS. SO, UH, EDWARD, IF YOU COULD START WITH VOICEMAILS FOR ITEM FIVE, AND THEN I WILL CALL SPEAKERS FOR ITEM SIX. YES. THIS IS FOR AGENDA ITEM NUMBER FIVE, CASE NUMBER 2 0 2 3 4 1 6 3 0 2 FOR DRIVE. MY NAME IS BIANCA MALDONADO. I CHAIR THE MONTICELLO PARK ARCHITECTURAL REVIEW COMMITTEE OFFERING COMMENTS ON BEHALF OF DREA GARZA, PRESIDENT OF THE MONTICELLO PARK NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION AND OUR NINE MEMBER N P N A BOARD OF DIRECTORS, PO O BOX 1 0 0 3 1 5 7 8 2 0 1. WE SUPPORT STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION FOR APPROVAL AND THANK THE APPLICANT FOR THEIR RESTORATION AND INVESTMENT INTO THIS HISTORIC PROPERTY. SPECIFICALLY, WE NOTE THE RESTORATION OF THE 35 1 0 1 WOOD WINDOWS, THE DECONSTRUCTION AND NEW CONSTRUCTION OF THE GARAGE WITH AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT, WHICH WAS EXECUTED WITH APPROPRIATE MASSING AND SCALE TO THE PROPERTY AND NEIGHBORHOOD AND FOR FOUNDATION AND EXTERIOR IMPROVEMENTS. THE INVESTMENTS INTO THIS 1920S HOME WILL CARRY THIS PROPERTY INTO ITS NEXT 100 YEARS. THANK YOU FOR CONSIDERATION OF OUR COMMENT. OKAY, MOVING TO ITEM SIX, WE HAVE AN IN-PERSON SPEAKER, MARY ELDEN, HAR MARY ELLEN HARDY. IF YOU JUST COME UP TO THE PODIUM, YOU'LL HAVE TWO MINUTES. I JUST WANNA REGISTER. UM, BEING OPPOSED TO TAKING DOWN HISTORIC BUILDINGS IN A HISTORIC DISTRICT, UM, I UNDERSTAND THAT IT, UM, WAS EASIER TO MAKE THE DESIGN BETTER OR TO DO THE DESIGN IF THEY TOOK DOWN A HISTORIC BUILDING. AND THEY SAID THAT THE HISTORIC BUILDING NEEDED FIXING, BUT WE ALL PURCHASED BUILDING OR PURCHASED HOUSES IN A HISTORIC DISTRICT FOR A REASON. AND THEY'RE EXPENSIVE BECAUSE I KNOW THEY'RE EXPENSIVE BECAUSE I HAVE ONE. AND SO I DON'T THINK THE CITY SHOULD GET A PASS ON, ON, UM, EXPENSIVE FIXES BECAUSE THEY'RE EXPENSIVE. SO THAT'S MY MY TAKE ON THAT. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. WE ALSO HAVE ONE VOICEMAIL FOR 10 23 NORTH PINE. HELLO, MY NAME IS VALERIE CORTES AND I'M CALLING ON BEHALF OF THE GROUP THE CONCERNS CITIZENS OF DIG WITTY HILL WITH REGARD TO CASE NUMBER 2023 DASH 3 27, LOCATED AT 10 23 NORTH PINE STREET. WHILE WE DO NOT HAVE CONCERNS WITH THE DEMOLITION OF BUILDINGS ONE, TWO, OR THREE, WE DO NOT AGREE WITH THE DEMOLITION OF BUILDING NUMBER FOUR. WE'D LIKE TO REFER YOU TO SECTION 35 DASH SIX 14 IN THE U D C REGARDING DEMOLITION OF A LANDMARK OR CONTRIBUTING PROPERTY AND THE REVIEW PERIOD AND WHAT IT STATES. WHILE WE'D LIKE TO THANK THE COSA REPRESENTATIVES FOR PRESENTING AT THIS PAST MONDAY'S DIG WITTY HILL NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION MEETING, IT ONLY HAPPENED DUE TO THE REQUEST OF THE CONCERNED CITIZENS OF DIGNITY WHITTY HILL. WE WOULD ALSO LIKE TO KNOW IF A REPORT ANALYZING ALTERNATIVES TO DEMOLITION WERE PROVIDED TO THE OFFICE OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION. WE DON'T BELIEVE PROPER PROCEDURES WERE FOLLOWED. THIS IS WHY WE'RE REQUESTING THAT THE DEMOLITION OF BUILDING NUMBER FOUR NOT BE GRANTED AT THIS TIME UNTIL FURTHER INFORMATION CAN BE PROVIDED. THANK YOU. OKAY, MOVING ON TO ITEM SEVEN. WE HAVE IN-PERSON SPEAKERS MICKEY CONRAD, AND HE'LL BE FOLLOWED BY MARK, UH, HOGANSON. GOOD AFTERNOON. UH, I'M MICKEY CONRAD. I LIVE AT THREE 10 MADISON AND KING WILLIAM, AND I'M THE CHAIRMAN OF THE ARCHITECTURAL ADVISORY COMMITTEE FOR THE KING WILLIAM ASSOCIATION. UH, FIRST OF ALL, I'D LIKE TO SAY SINCE 1967, THE KING WILLIAM ASSOCIATION HAS ENDEAVORED TO PROTECT AND PRESERVE THE HISTORIC STRUCTURES IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD. AND THANKS TO THE O H P AND THE H G R C, WE'VE BEEN ABLE TO ACCOMPLISH A LOT OVER THE LAST 40 YEARS. UH, AND SO WE CONTINUE THAT EFFORT AND WE ACTUALLY THANK YOU FOR YOUR CONTINUED COLLABORATION ON THAT. UM, I, ON THIS CASE AT 5 0 6 STEERING, UH, I MUST SAY THAT THE DEVELOPER HAS BEEN VERY COOPERATIVE AND COLLABORATIVE WITH OUR COMMITTEE. SO THEY ARE APPLYING FOR THE CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TODAY. BUT THERE ARE A FEW DETAILS THAT WE WOULD LIKE FOR YOU GUYS TO CONSIDER TO ADD TO THE LIST OF STIPULATIONS FOR APPROVAL OF THAT, UH, CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS. AND IF YOU'LL BEAR WITH ME, I'LL READ, I'LL READ THE LIST. YOU HAVE THE, THE LETTER PROBABLY IN YOUR PACKET, BUT I'LL QUICKLY READ THROUGH THE LIST. ONE OF 'EM HAS TO DO, THE FIRST ONE HAS TO DO WITH SLIGHTLY ARCHITECTURALLY SHIFTING THE FRONT PORCHES, UH, TO ALIGN [00:10:01] WITH THE FRONT WALL PROJECTIONS. UM, WE FEEL LIKE THE PORCH ELEMENTS SHOULD ALL BE PAINTED THE SAME AS AS THE TRIM. UM, THE RAILING AND FENCE STYLE SHOULD BE SIMPLIFIED, UH, AS OPPOSED TO THE VERY ORNATE WROUGHT IRON FENCE TO NOT DETRACT FROM THE HISTORIC, THE DESIGN OR THE OTHER HISTORIC STRUCTURES IN THE AREA. THE DOOR STYLE SHOULD BE COMPATIBLE WITH THE, THE STYLE OF THE HOUSE. UH, THEY'VE GOT SOME KIND OF MID-CENTURY MODERN DOORS PROPOSED, AND, UH, WE RECOMMEND A, A STYLE THAT'S MORE APPROPRIATE, UH, ADJUSTING THE WINDOW LOCATION SO THAT THEY'RE OFF THE CORNER OF THE BUILDING TO ALLOW FOR WALLS TO, TO OCCUPY THE CORNER OF THE BUILDING INSTEAD OF THE WINDOW. UM, AND THEN THE WINDOW PROPORTIONS IN KING WILLIAM ARE TYPICALLY ONE TO THREE VERTICAL PROPORTION, ONE, ONE COMPONENT WIDE BY THREE TALL. SO WE ASK THEM TO RE-LOOK AT THE WINDOW PROPORTIONS. UM, THE GABLE ATTIC EVENTS IN KING WILLIAM ARE TYPICALLY RECTANGULAR AS OPPOSED TO ROUND, UM, SHIFTING THE SIDE GABLE SO THAT THEY, THE ELEVATION IS MORE COMPOSED WITH THE WINDOWS BELOW. UM, AND THEN ALSO WE'RE THANK YOU. WE NEED CLARIFICATION. IS THAT IT? THAT'S YOUR TIME. OH, OKAY. SORRY. YOU HAVE YOUR ORDER. OKAY. THANK YOU. UH, WE JUST ASK YOU TO PLEASE CONSIDER THESE ADDITIONAL STIPULATIONS TO IMPROVE THE DESIGN OF THE PROJECT. AND I MUST SAY THAT THE DEVELOPER DID AGREE TO ALL OF OUR STIPULATIONS. YOU HAVE THAT EMAIL IN YOUR PACKET SO THEY'RE NOT OPPOSED TO ANY OF THE THINGS THAT WE'RE OFFERING. THANK YOU. THANK YOU, SIR. UH, MARK HOKINSON. GOOD AFTERNOON. MY NAME'S MARK HOGANSON. UM, I LIVE AT 4 0 2 CEDAR. I AM, MY HOUSE IS THE ADJOINING PROPERTY TO, UM, CASE NUMBER 2 0 2 3 3 2 2, LOCATED AT 5 0 6 STEER. FIRST, LET ME THANK THE COMMISSION FOR THEIR DILIGENCE AND THOROUGHNESS. UM, IN THE REVIEW OF THIS PARTICULAR PROPERTY HAS BEEN UP SEVERAL TIMES NOW, AND WE'RE NOT DONE YET. UM, THERE STILL REMAINS A FEW STIPULATIONS, UM, THAT MUST BE MET. I AM PLEASED TO SEE THAT THE PROJECT DEVELOPER HAS COMPLIED WITH SEVERAL DESIGN IMPROVEMENTS REQUIRED BY THE COMMISSION. UM, I THINK WE'VE WON SOME OF THE BATTLES, UH, REDUCING IT TO TWO BUILDINGS OF FOUR, UH, FOUR UNITS. UM, PARKING, UH, THE ZONING STILL HAS NOT BEEN APPROVED, BUT I'M CONFIDENT MAYBE THAT WILL HAPPEN. IT SEEMS LIKE THE BEST SOLUTION. SO, UM, THE PARKING DESIGN THAT MICKEY MENTIONED, UH, AND, UH, THE, UH, DOORS, UM, THESE THINGS EVIDENTLY HAVE, ARE KIND OF IN THE WORKS AND TAKEN CARE OF. HOWEVER, WHEN I SAW THE INITIAL CARPORT DESIGN, I CAN'T HELP BUT WONDER HOW ENGAGED THE DEVELOPER IS WITH THIS PROPERTY, A HISTORIC DISTRICT. AND THEY TRIED TO PUT THESE SORT OF PREFAB METAL CARPORTS IN THERE AFTER GOING THROUGH ALL THESE DESIGN REVIEWS AND CHANGES BECAUSE IT'S IN A HISTORIC DISTRICT. SO IT MAKES ME WONDER JUST EXACTLY HOW ENGAGED SHE IS IN THIS. UM, THE FIVE DOOR, UH, FIVE LIGHT DOOR IS REALLY A MORE APPROPRIATE, AND AS MICKEY SAID, IN THE MID-CENTURY MODERN DESIGN. AND THEN AFTER ALL, THIS IS A NATIONALLY RECOGNIZED HISTORIC DISTRICT, YOU WOULD THINK THAT THE DEVELOPER WOULD SAVE OUR TIME BY NO. COMING UP WITH THAT FROM THE BEGINNING DOESN'T SEEM LIKE SHE'S DONE HER HOMEWORK. UM, CONCERN TO ME IS, UH, WHAT GUARANTEE WILL WE HAVE THAT ALL GUIDELINES AND MATERIAL SPECIFICS WILL BE FOLLOWED CLOSELY THROUGHOUT THE CONSTRUCTION PHASE, UM, ASIDE FROM CITY BUILDING INSPECTIONS, HOW WE, HOW CAN WE BE SURE THAT THE STIPULATIONS ARE MET TO SATISFACTION? THANK YOU. THANK YOU. I'LL END THERE I GUESS. THANK YOU. DID WE HAVE A VOICEMAIL? EDWARD? UH, NO VOICEMAIL FOR ITEM SEVEN. WE DO HAVE A VOICEMAIL FOR ITEM EIGHT, THE ITEM NUMBER EIGHT, CASE NUMBER 2 0 2 3 4 0 2 7 23 DONALDSON AVENUE. MY NAME IS BIANCA MALDONADO, OFFERING COMMENTS ON BEHALF OF DREA GARBA, PRESIDENT OF M P N A AND M P N A BOARD OF DIRECTORS. WE THANK S A I C AND FORD POWELL CARSON FOR MEETING WITH THE M P AND A ARCHITECTURAL REVIEW COMMITTEE. AND CONSIDERING OUR ADDITIONAL RECOMMENDATIONS WE SUPPORT A'S PROJECT, WHICH HAS THE GOAL TO PROVIDE A D A ACCESSIBILITY AND DEFINE THE FRONT ENTRANCE TO THIS LANDMARK SCHOOL, WE SUPPORT STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS AND RESPECTFULLY AFTER THE INCLUSION OF THE FOLLOWING ITEMS. NUMBER ONE, NO DECOMPOSED GRANITE IN THE LANDSCAPING BAY BED ADJACENT TO THE PUBLIC RIGHT OF WAY BE USED DUE TO WASHOUT AND MAINTENANCE CONCERN NUMBER TWO, THAT A SEALANT BE ADDED TO ALL STONE AND BRICK ELEMENTS OF THE SIGNAGE AND STONE RETAINING WALLS BEING PROPOSED. NUMBER THREE, FOR CONSIDERATION TO BE GIVEN IN THE PLACEMENT OF NEW TREES [00:15:01] ALONG THE WALKWAY TO THE FRONT OF THE SCHOOL AND TO THE NEW WALKWAY CROSSING IN FRONT OF THE SCHOOL TO ENSURE TWO UNOBSTRUCTED VIEW SHEDS ARE MAINTAINED OF THE LAWN AND THE TWO STORY FRONT ELEVATION OF THE SCHOOL. NUMBER FOUR, FOR THE NEW A D A RAMP AND SIDEWALK FROM THE PARKING LOT THAT THE LIMESTONE RETAINING WALL BE MINIMAL IN ITS HEIGHT LOWER THAN THE RENDERINGS PROVIDED, SO THAT IT DOES NOT SEEK TO OBSTRUCT THE VIEW OF THE BRICKWORK DETAIL UNDERNEATH THE ARROWHEAD WINDOWS OF THE CAFETERIA OR DOMINATE IN THE TOPOGRAPHY OF THE FRONT FACADE AND ELEVATION. THANK YOU FOR CONSIDERATION OF OUR COMMENTS. THAT CONCLUDES VOICEMAILS FOR THE CONSENT AGENDA. COMMISSIONERS, THERE ARE LETTERS, UH, IN YOUR PACKETS. OKAY. THANK YOU. DO ANY COMMISSIONERS WISH TO PULL ANY CASES FOR DISCUSSION? COMMISSIONER SAVINO, I'D LIKE TO PULL NUMBER SIX AND NUMBER SEVEN, PLEASE. OKAY. ANY OTHERS? OKAY. OKAY. AT THIS TIME, UH, WE'LL PULL SIX AND SEVEN. AND AT THIS TIME I AM RECUSING MYSELF FROM THE, UH, VOTE ON THE BALANCE. LET THE RECORD SHOW THAT CHAIRMAN FETZER HAS LEFT THE ROOM. I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION. MADAM CHAIR, I, UM, RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF ITEMS ONE THROUGH FIVE AND EIGHT WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS. SECOND, WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND. ANY COMMENTS DISCUSSION? THEN WE'LL GO DO A ROLL CALL. GIBBS. AYE. SAVINO AYE. VELAZQUEZ AYE. ZUKA AYE. VASQUEZ AYE. CERVANTES? YES. AND HOLLAND. AYE. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU YOUR'RE ON THE CONSENT AGENDA, AND YOUR ADDRESS IS 1210 EAST ELMIRA, FOUR 10 PROBAND, 2 0 4 EAST CAROLINA, 4 23 EAST DEWEY 3 0 2 FUR AND 7 23 DONALDSON. YOUR CASE HAS BEEN APPROVED AND YOU DO NOT NEED TO STAY FOR THE REMAINDER OF THIS HEARING. IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, PLEASE CONTACT A MEMBER OF STAFF. YOUR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS OR COMMISSION ACTION LETTER WILL BE PREPARED AND EMAILED TO YOU WITHIN 10 DAYS. [INDIVIDUAL CONSIDERATION  ] UH, 10 23 NORTH PINE. IF WE CAN HAVE OUR CITY STAFF COME UP FOR THIS CASE. AGENDA ITEM NUMBER SIX. UM, MR. CHAIR, THE REASON I HAVE PULLED THIS ITEM IS, UH, FOR THE PUBLIC COMMENTS FOR THE MOST PART, UH, I HAVE A QUESTION FOR STAFF. UH, ONE OF THE EMAIL COMMENTS IN THE LE IN THE LETTER FOLDER TALKS ABOUT, UH, THE UD C SECTION 3, 5, 6, 14 AND REVIEW PERIOD. CAN YOU TALK TO HOW THAT REVIEW PERIOD OCCURRED AND WHAT YOU CONSIDER THAT REVIEW PERIOD AND NOTIFICATION? SO I CAN ANSWER THAT? UM, SO AS YOU KNOW, FOR MOST C O A REQUESTS, WE HAVE 60 DAYS IN WHICH WE TAKE ACTION. AND SO USUALLY LIKE A NORMAL, UH, REQUEST FOR ALTERATIONS TO RESTORE PROPERTY, WHICH COMES STRAIGHT HERE. UM, SO THERE'S TIME TO REFER TO SUBCOMMITTEE AND TAKE OTHER ACTIONS WITHIN THAT 60 DAY PERIOD FOR DEMOLITION OF A LANDMARK. IT'S ACTUALLY THE OTHER WAY. SO WE DO NOT SCHEDULE IT UNTIL A 60 DAY PERIOD HAS PASSED, AND THAT'S REALLY INTENDED TO, UH, GIVE STAFF AND THE COMMISSION AND THE PUBLIC AN OPPORTUNITY TO WEIGH IN ON THAT, THAT CASE AND SEEK ALTERNATIVES FOR DEMOLITION, UH, TO MEET A REQUIRED NOTIFICATION. UM, SO UNLIKE NORMAL C A A REQUESTS, WE DO A MAIL NOTIFICATION FOR DEMOLITION OF A LANDMARK TO PROPERTY OWNERS WITHIN 200 FEET AND TO THE NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION. UM, THE OTHER THING THAT THE, UH, COMMENTS SPOKE TO IS THE REQUIREMENT FOR A MEETING WITH THE REGISTERED NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION. UM, WE DID NOT REQUIRE AN ADDITIONAL MEETING, LIKE WE KNEW THAT DOCUMENTED MEETINGS HAD OCCURRED. AND THEN AS A RESULT OF, OF THE DISCUSSION AT THE LAST HEARING, UM, IT WAS NOTED THAT THERE WAS A FEELING THAT ADDITIONAL COMMUNICATION NEEDED TO HAPPEN. AND SO THAT WAS THE ACTION OF THE COMMISSION. SO WE DO FEEL THAT ALL THE REQUIREMENTS UNDER 6 1 4 HAVE BEEN MET. OKAY. SO THE TWO, THE NOTIFICATION FOR 200 FEET WAS, UM, WHAT WAS REQUIRED AND THAT WAS SENT OUT WHEN, WHAT WAS THE APPROXIMATE? UM, THE CODE REQUIRES THAT, I BELIEVE 10 DAYS PRIOR TO THE HEARING DATE. MM-HMM. . AND SO IT WAS THE LAST HEARING, UM, SO IT WAS A COUPLE WEEKS BEFORE THAT. UM, WE DO HAVE SOMEWHERE, RACHEL, IF YOU'RE ABLE TO, UM, CHIME IN, CHIME IN AND TELL ME WHERE IT IS, BUT WE DO HAVE A COPY OF THE MAP IF YOU WANT TO SEE THE NOTIFICATION MAP THAT WAS GENERATED BY OUR G I S DEPARTMENT. OKAY. WAS THIS CASE ALSO POSTED ON THE PUBLIC PORTAL? YES. AND SO AS SOON AS WE RECEIVE THE [00:20:01] ITEMS, THEY'RE AVAILABLE FOR PUBLIC VIEW ON THE PORTAL. UM, IT WAS JUST A MATTER OF, YOU KNOW, IF YOU SET YOUR QUERY FOR ONLY THE NEXT HEARING, YOU WOULDN'T SEE IT BECAUSE IT'S KIND OF SET OUT 60 DAYS MM-HMM. . AND SO AS LONG AS YOU'RE LOOKING AT ANY UPCOMING CASE, YOU WOULD'VE BEEN ABLE TO ACCESS IT. OKAY. BECAUSE I KNOW THIS HAS BEEN GOING ON, THE PROJECT HAS BEEN PROPOSED FOR QUITE A LONG TIME AND THAT PUBLIC PORTAL IS PRETTY NEW, SO, UM, WASN'T SURE ABOUT THAT. UM, AND I DO HAVE A QUESTION FOR, UH, THE APPLICANT. AND I WANTED TO, UM, ASK YOU ABOUT THE CONDITION. I KNOW THE CONDITION OF BUILDING NUMBER FOUR IS DOCUMENTED IN THE PACKAGE. UM, AND I KNOW FROM A SITE VISIT THERE ARE SOME DRAINAGE ISSUES, WATER DAM ISSUES, WATER DAMAGE ISSUES THAT HAVE BEEN OCCURRING OVER THE DECADES. IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE THAT YOU CAN ADD TO HELP US UNDERSTAND THE CONDITION OF THAT BUILDING? CERTAINLY. SO THE, IN ADDITION TO, THERE'S, DUE TO THE DRAINAGE ISSUES OVER TIME, THE, UH, FOUNDATION HAS SETTLED AS WE DISCUSSED. UM, AND THAT IS THE MOST SIGNIFICANT DAMAGE ON THE PROPERTY REQUIRING THE ENTIRE FOUNDATION WOULD NEED TO BE REPLACED BEFORE THE PROPERTY CAN BE EFFECTIVELY USED BEFORE THE BUILDING CAN BE EFFECTIVELY USED. IN ADDITION, UM, OVER TIME FOR VARIOUS REASONS, THE ROOF HAS FAILED. UM, I BELIEVE IT'S BEEN REPAIRED, SO THE FAILURE IS NO LONGER THERE. HOWEVER, UM, CORROSION IS EVIDENT ON, UH, MANY OF THE STRUCTURAL SUPPORTS FOR THE ROOF. AND, UH, OUR STRUCTURAL ENGINEER OB OBSERVED THOSE AND HE RECOMMENDED THAT EFFECTIVELY ALL OF THOSE JOISTS WOULD NEED TO BE PATCHED OR REPLACED. UM, IN ADDITION, DUE TO THAT, UH, SCENE, UH, CORROSION, THE, WE KNOW THAT THE DECK, THE ROOF DECK WAS NOT REPLACED WHEN THAT ROOF REPAIR OCCURRED. IT WAS JUST A MEMBRANE ROOF PUT DOWN ON TOP OF WHAT'S UP THERE. SO IN ORDER TO AFFECT THAT REPAIR, THE ENTIRE ROOF WOULD HAVE TO BE REMOVED, INCLUDING THE ROOFING DECK, REPLACED THE ROOFING DECK, WHICH WILL HAVE BEEN ROTTED THROUGH AS WELL AS REPLACING MANY ROOFING JOISTS. SO THAT'S A SIGNIFICANT EXPENSE RIGHT THERE, EFFECTIVELY WHEN YOU LOOK AT IT. UM, AND WHEN WE LOOKED ON SITE, UM, WHAT WOULD BE LEFT WHEN YOU TRY TO REPAIR THIS THING IS THE WALLS. UM, AND THOSE THEMSELVES AND THE WINDOWS REQUIRE SIGNIFICANT REPAIR, UM, OR REPLACEMENT. THE WINDOWS ARE IN VERY ROUGH SHAPE. MANY OF THEM ORIGINAL, SOME OF THEM COULD POSSIBLY BE REPAIRED, BUT MOST OF THEM HAVE ROTTED OUT. UM, AND THEN THE BRICK WORK, IT'S IN ROUGH CONDITION, YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT FALLING APART, BUT IT NEEDS TO BE REPOINTED AND CLEAN SIGNIFICANTLY. SO YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT A MASSIVE GUT PROJECT TRYING TO SUPPORT ALL THESE WALLS, TEARING OUT THE ROOF, TEARING OUT THE INTERIOR WALLS, TEARING OUT THE FOUNDATION AND ATTEMPTING TO REPLACE ALL OF THOSE THINGS WHILE ALSO MITIGATING THE DRAINAGE UNDERNEATH. YOU CAN SEE WHY WITH ALL OF THOSE PARTS AND PIECES HAVING TO BE REPAIRED, THAT THAT COST ESTIMATE TO DO AFFECT ALL THAT WORK WHILE STILL MAINTAINING THOSE WALLS. SO THE BUILDING DOESN'T COLLAPSE WAS TOTALING WELL OVER $2 MILLION. AND THEN IS THAT ESTIMATE INCLUDING IMPROVEMENTS AND REPROGRAMMING? NO, MA'AM. SO THE ESTIMATE IS MERELY TO BRING IT BACK UP TO A USABLE STATE, BUT YOU CAN ASSUME THAT IT IS EFFECTIVELY AN EMPTY BOX WHEN WE'RE DONE WITH THAT ESTIMATE. IT'S NOT ASSUMING, UH, THE IMPLEMENTATION OF NEW PROGRAMS SUCH AS ADDING CASEWORK OR ADDING PLUMBING OR ANYTHING OF THAT SORT. IT'S MERELY TO GET IT BACK IN A SERVICEABLE CONDITION IN A, UH, ENCLOSED WITH HVAC AND ELECTRICAL. BUT, YOU KNOW, NOTHING REALLY ELSE THERE. I HAVE NO FURTHER QUESTIONS. OTHER COMMISSIONERS WITH QUESTIONS. DO YOU HAVE AN ESTIMATE ON WHAT IF THE 2 MILLION WAS SPENT TO BRING THE BUILDING BACK UP TO STRUCTURAL AND, UH, LIFE SAFETY, UH, CODES, WHAT IT WOULD TAKE TO DO THE FINISH OUT THEN ON TOP OF THE 2 MILLION? WE DID NOT PUT TOGETHER AN ESTIMATE FOR THAT, SIMPLY BECAUSE THE FLOOR PLATE OF THAT BUILDING DOESN'T ADEQUATELY PROVIDE A GOOD SPACE FOR PROGRAMS THE COMMUNITY HAS REQUESTED. AND SO WE WOULD BE SHOEHORNING IN PROGRAMS INTO THAT FLOOR PLATE, UM, THAT AREN'T REALLY ADVANTAGEOUS. SO WE DIDN'T DO A DESIGN EXERCISE TO SEE WHAT WE COULD NECESSARILY PUT IN THERE OTHER THAN DESIGN EXERCISES PROVING OUT IT DIDN'T, DIDN'T FIT THE DESIRED PROGRAMS SUCH AS, UM, YOU KNOW, LARGE GROUP SPACES FOR THE SENIORS, LARGE GROUP SPACES FOR YOUTH, THINGS LIKE THAT. MR. CHAIR, COMMISSIONER NA VASQUEZ? I, I, I DO, I'M REMINDED OF SOMETHING. THE REASON WHY THE, THE, UM, UH, CONTINUANCE WAS, WAS, UH, RECOMMENDED, I BELIEVE WAS TO REACH OUT TO THAT, UM, SEGMENT OF THE COMMUNITY THAT WAS SAYING THAT THEY HADN'T HAD AN OPPORTUNITY. DID YOU DO THAT? YES, SIR. WE MET WITH THEM ON MONDAY EVENING. WHAT WAS THE OUTCOME? SO, UM, WE PRESENTED THIS ENTIRE PRESENTATION HERE TO THEM AS WELL AS SHOWING THEM INTENT FOR THE FUTURE DESIGN OF WHAT WOULD BE THE REPLACEMENT PROJECT, WHICH [00:25:01] IS IN YOUR PACKAGE. UM, IN GENERAL, WE HAD A HANDFUL OF CONCERNS ABOUT, UM, THE EXTENT OF THE ANALYSIS, MUCH LIKE YOU JUST ASKED ME NOW. UM, UH, WE HAD QUESTIONS ABOUT IF THE PROJECT HAD GONE OUT TO BID, WHICH OF COURSE IT HAS NOT. UM, WE WERE ASKED QUESTIONS ABOUT THE COMMUNITY GARDEN AS AN ELEMENT OF THE OVERALL DESIGN PACKAGE. SO THAT'S KIND OF INDEPENDENT FROM THE CONVERSATION HERE. THERE WERE CONCERNS WHICH WERE RAISED, UM, BY, IN THE VOICEMAIL AND IN HERE ABOUT JUST DEMOLISHING HISTORIC BUILDINGS IN GENERAL. UM, ANYTHING ELSE THAT ADD? NO, I DON'T THINK SO. IN GENERAL, THERE WERE VARIOUS QUESTIONS THAT WERE ASKED ABOUT WHAT THE INTENT WAS, WHAT WOULD BE REPLACING IT WITH, UM, YOU KNOW, WHAT TYPES OF PROGRAMS WE WERE GOING TO BE DOING, WHO WE HAD MET WITH WHEN WE MET WITH THEM, WHAT WAS SHOWN WHEN WE MET WITH PREVIOUS GROUPS. AND SO, UM, WE SHOWED ALL OF THOSE THINGS. UM, AND THEN IT SEEMED TO BE JUST DOWN TO PERSONAL OPINIONS ABOUT WHETHER PEOPLE LIKED OR DISLIKED THE CONCEPT. OKAY. UM, MR. CHAIR, LIKE TO ASK STAFF, UM, WOULD HE BE EDWARD, EDWARD, ARE YOU THE CASE MANAGER? UH, NOT THE CASE MANAGER, BUT COREY OR MYSELF CAN ANSWER QUESTIONS. WELL, J JUST, UH, FROM THE OUTCOME, WAS THERE ANY, UM, DID ANYONE REACH OUT TO Y'ALL AND, AND, UM, SPECIFICALLY INDICATE THAT THE MEETING ? NOT SPECIFICALLY, BUT I MEAN, WE KNOW THAT THERE'S FOLKS HERE THAT ATTENDED THAT MEETING. AND MONICA, YOU ATTENDED AS WELL. IT WAS MENTIONED IN THE VOICEMAIL. MM-HMM. IN THE VOICEMAIL. OKAY. WELL, WELL, THAT BEING SAID, MR. CHAIR, I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE, AS WITH STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS. SECOND, I HAVE A MOTION SECOND. SO, DISCUSSION, JUST, JUST TO GENERALLY APPRECIATE YOU TAKING THE TIME TO, TO FOLLOW UP ON, UH, THE COMMISSION'S, UH, REQUEST. UH, WE HOPE THAT THAT ADDITIONAL INFORMATION HELPS YOU IN, IN, IN MAKING THE DECISIONS, PARTICULARLY AS, AS IT RELATES TO, UH, STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION FOR YOUR ARCHITECTURAL SALVAGE PLAN AND HOW THAT MAY BE ABLE TO HELP OTHER PROJECTS IN THE FUTURE. BUT, UH, FROM THIS COMMISSIONER, GOOD LUCK ON YOUR PROJECT. THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER SAVINO. THANK YOU. YES, I WOULD LIKE TO THANK YOU WHOLEHEARTEDLY FOR ATTENDING THE NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION MEETING. UM, AND I'M HOPING JUST THE, THE TWO WEEK DELAY ISN'T GOING TO THROW THE SCHEDULE OFF TOO, TOO BADLY, BUT I DO THINK THAT IT WAS WELL WORTH THAT EXTRA EFFORT. AND GRANTED, THERE WERE, UH, A NUMBER OF PEOPLE WHO WERE NOT FAMILIAR WITH THE PROJECT AND, AND, UM, AND THAT KIND OF GOES TO, I GUESS OUR, OUR CHARGE HERE IN LOOKING AT NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATIONS AND THE ROLE THEY PLAY. AND THERE ARE SOME NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATIONS THAT HAVE CAPACITY, HAVE RESOURCES. THEY'RE, YOU KNOW, JOHNNY ON THE SPOT AND THEY'RE REALLY, REALLY HIGHLY FUNCTIONING. AND THEN THERE ARE SOME IN OTHER NEIGHBORHOODS THAT ARE NOT, THEY'RE NOT THE SAME, THEY'RE DIFFERENT. THE DYNAMICS ARE DIFFERENT. SO BY, I FEEL LIKE WE WERE ABLE TO, AS A COMMISSION IN, IN ASKING YOU TO RETURN, IT WAS ANOTHER WAY OF US ADDRESSING AN EQUITY ISSUE IN NEIGHBORHOODS BECAUSE IT IS DIFFERENT FROM NEIGHBORHOOD TO NEIGHBORHOOD. AND, UM, I DO THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, MOVING FORWARD WHEN WE DO HAVE CITY PROJECTS, UH, PROJECTS ON CITY PROPERTY, I WOULD DOUBLE UP BELT AND SUSPENDERS THE COMMUNICATION WITH THE NEIGHBORHOOD BECAUSE IT IS PUBLIC PROPERTY, IT IS THE, THESE PROPERTY AND OUR MEANING, OUR PROPERTY. AND THEN ON THE THIRD ITEM, UM, A BOND PROJECT, WE'VE SAT HERE WITH OTHER BOND PROJECT DECISIONS THAT WERE VERY, VERY DIFFICULT. SO THERE IS A HIGHER BAR OF COMMUNICATING WITH NEIGHBORS AND CONSTITUENTS. SO JUST FOR FUTURE REFERENCE FOR ALL OF US, I THINK WE ALL OWE IT TO TAXPAYERS AND OUR NEIGHBORS TO, TO BRING THIS UP AND BE VERY TRANSPARENT. BUT, UM, I THOUGHT THE MEETING WENT WELL, UM, COVERED A LOT OF THINGS. I SAW SOME NEW THINGS TOO. AND I ALSO, UM, UNDERSTAND THE ISSUES WITH THE EXISTING BUILDING. SO OF COURSE I WILL SUPPORT THE MOTION. THANK YOU. OTHER COMMENTS? MAY HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE. GIBBS? AYE. SAVINO? AYE. VELAZQUEZ? AYE. ZUKA. AYE. VASQUEZ. AYE. CERVANTES? YES. POLL. AYE. AND FETZER. AYE. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. ITEM NUMBER SEVEN, THIS ITEM [00:30:01] WAS PULLED FOR COMMISSIONER. QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? 5 0 6. DEAR, BEFORE YOU GUYS MOVE ON, CAN I JUST MAKE ONE COMMENT? I WAS FROM THE NEIGHBORHOOD OF SOCIAL MOVE TO THE NO CHAIR. DO YOU ACKNOWLEDGE THE, UH, TWO SECONDS, TWO SECONDS COMMENTS? I WAS FROM THE NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION AND I JUST HAVE TO SAY IT REALLY WAS NOT COMMUNICATED VERY WELL. AND SO MOVING FORWARD, I REALLY WOULD STRONGLY RECOMMEND THAT A LOT MORE COMMUNITY IS INVOLVED. 'CAUSE IT HIT US ALL SIDEWAYS. NONE OF US REALLY KNEW ABOUT THIS. THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER ENO, YOU HAD QUESTIONS ON, UH, 5 0 6 STEER? UH, YEAH, I HAD, THANK YOU FOR ASKING. I HAD, UH, QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT. IS THE APPLICANT HERE? I DON'T, I DON'T THINK THEY'RE HERE. I'D LIKE, I OBVIOUSLY LATE AT WORK I'D LIKE TO TALK TO ON BEHALF OF THE NEIGHBORS. NO, SHE'S HERE VIRTUALLY. I JUST FORGOT TO ADD HER. VIRTUALLY. VIRTUALLY. OH, OKAY. MA'AM, YOU'LL NEED TO UNMUTE, PLEASE. PERFECT. WE CAN HEAR YOU. GOOD AFTERNOON. YOUR EXCELLENCES? YES, I'M ONLINE. THIS IS I. OKAY, THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER SAVINA. UM, UH, SO I'M, I NEED SOME CLARIFICATION ON THE LETTER FROM THE KING WILLIAM ASSOCIATION AND THE ITEMS THAT THEY MENTIONED AND SAID THEY HAD. MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT YOU ARE IN AGREEMENT WITH SOME OF THE POINTS THAT THEY BROUGHT UP IN ADDITION TO STAFF STIPULATIONS. IS THAT CORRECT? I'M IN AGREEMENT WITH ALL THE POINTS. UH, THEY BROUGHT UP THE STIPULATIONS FOR KING WILLIAMS AS WELL AS THE STAFF STIPULATIONS. YES. OKAY, THANK YOU. THAT'S BASICALLY WHAT I WANTED TO CONFIRM. THANK YOU. SO, YES. COMMISSIONER AZUA, DOES THAT INCLUDE THE STIPULATE THE REQUESTED STIPULATIONS THAT WERE ADDED IN THE LETTER FROM THE KING WILLIAMS? YES. OKAY. I MISSED IT. UM, YES. SO ALL THE STIPULATIONS ON, UH, THE STAFF RECOMMENDATION AS WELL AS THE STIPULATION ON KING WILLIAM ASSOCIATION'S LETTER. THEY'VE ALL BEEN ACCEPTED BY MYSELF ON BEHALF OF MY COMPANY. YES. OKAY. THANK YOU. OTHER QUESTIONS? I'D BE WILLING TO MAKE A MOTION. YES. COMMISSIONER SAVINO, I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE REQUESTS ALONG WITH STAFF STIPULATION AND ALSO TO INCLUDE ITEMS. I WOULD ALSO LIKE, UM, TO INCLUDE THE ITEMS FROM THE KING WILLIAM ASSOCIATION AND REQUEST THAT STAFF WORK WITH THE APPLICANT ON ALL OF THE STIPULATIONS. SECOND MOTION AND SECOND. ANY DISCUSSION? MR. CHAIR? I DON'T KNOW IF THERE WAS SOMEBODY THAT WANTED TO SPEAK ON BEHALF OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD. I, I THINK THEY WERE. IT'S UP TO THE CHAIR. I MEAN, WE ALREADY DID PUBLIC COMMENTS. OKAY. I STAND CORRECT. NEVERMIND. WE DID GET PUBLIC COMMENTS. DID DID YOU HAVE TIME FOR A PUBLIC COMMENT? I'M A NEIGHBOR BASICALLY ACROSS THREE PERMITS. SURE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. MM-HMM. . MY NAME IS JAMES DOER. I LIVE AT 4 0 7 CEDAR, UH, RIGHT ON, RIGHT. LESS THAN A HUNDRED FEET FROM THE DEVELOPMENT. UM, I'M VERY CONFUSED WHY WE'RE LOWERING OUR STANDARDS. KING WILLIAMS IS A VERY, VERY IMPORTANT PART OF OUR COMMUNITY, AND WE NEED TO KEEP THE HISTORIC STANDARDS. WE HAVE MANY, MANY, MANY PROJECTS. PEOPLE ARE GOING BACK IN THERE EVERY DAY AND REHABBING THE OLD HOUSES AS I HAVE. UH, THE PREVIOUS H D R C TURNED THIS DOWN UNANIMOUS. IT WAS NOT A TRANSITIONAL LOT AND IT WAS TOO HIGH DENSITY, SO I DON'T KNOW WHY WE'RE APPROVING THIS. THE OTHER THING, THE MAIN THING IS DEVELOPER, WE HAD TO FORCE THE DEVELOPER TO MEET WITH THE NEIGHBORS, AND THEY WERE, AND SHE WAS BELLIGERENT FROM THE VERY BEGINNING. AND YOU CAN TALK TO DISTRICT ONE, UH, A CHIEF OF STAFF. SHE WAS BELLIGERENT. SHE DIDN'T ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS. AND SHE SAYS THIS DIDN'T GET BUILT REGARDLESS OF WHAT THE NEIGHBORS SAY. SO SHE'S NOT TRUSTWORTHY. THERE'S ONE REQUIREMENT. PLEASE, PLEASE CHECK ON THIS DISTRICT. ONE CHIEF OF STAFF ASKED HER TO PRODUCE ONE PHOTO, ONE PHOTO ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD, WHETHER IT'S NIGERIA OR TEXAS OR WHEREVER. PRODUCE ONE PHOTO OF A COMPLETED PROJECT. WHAT DID SHE DO? SHE GAVE ZERO, ZERO PHOTOS. SHE, THIS IS YOU. AND SO I'M SORRY, I'M UPSET ABOUT IT. THE LAST THING I WANT YOU TO DO, LOOK AT THEIR PACKAGE, LOOK AT THEIR BEFORE PICTURE OF THE LOT. IT'S OVERGROWN. YOU GO BY ON YOUR WAY HOME TODAY, 5 0 6 TYING, YOU'LL SEE THE SAME STACKED UP CONCRETE. YOU'LL SEE THE SAME, UH, [00:35:01] YOU KNOW, WEEDS. THEY HAVEN'T DONE ANYTHING. THEY ARE NOT TRUSTWORTHY. PLEASE DO YOUR DUE DILIGENCE BECAUSE THIS IS NOT A DEVELOPER YOU WANT TO HANG YOUR HAT ON. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. I HAD SOME YES. QUESTIONS. UM, OKAY. FIRST THERE WAS A, THERE WAS A, A MOTION ALREADY, RIGHT? WE'RE IN DISCUSSION. YES. WELL, OKAY. THE, THE FIRST THING THAT I'M, I'M LOOKING FOR CLARITY ON OR ASKING FOR, I GUESS, IS THAT WITH RESPECT TO A LETTER FROM, LET'S SAY A THIRD PARTY, UH, RATHER THAN IT BE A MOTION THAT ASKS FOR INCLUSION, WE SHOULD HAVE THOSE ITEMS, UM, STIPULATED SO THAT WE CAN ALSO SEE THAT THEY'RE CONSISTENT ALSO WITH, WITH WHAT IS, UH, WHAT IS IN OUR PURVIEW, RIGHT? SO I, I HEARD THE LETTER, BUT I DIDN'T HEAR THE LETTER IN THE CONTEXT OF OUR DELIBERATION AND IN THE MOTION. AND, AND, UM, AND THEN SECONDLY, LOOKING AT THE DRAWINGS, THE DRAWINGS SEEM TO BE A GOOD EXAMPLE OF CONCEPTUAL, UM, FOR OUR CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL. BUT, BUT THEY'RE NOT WORKING DRAWINGS. AND I DON'T KNOW IF I'M CONFUSED BETWEEN WHAT WE WOULD NORMALLY GET OR WHETHER WE SHOULD BE GETTING THAT FAR IN TERMS OF WHAT WE APPROVE, BUT THEY'RE VERY, THEY'RE VERY, UM, YOU KNOW, KIND OF THREE D CONCEPT, UH, DRAWINGS. AND I'M HAVING A HARD TIME UNDERSTANDING THE, UM, THE PROPORTIONS OF THE TYPICAL KING WILLIAM WINDOW VERSUS THE PROPORTIONS OF THESE WINDOWS. AND WITHOUT DIMENSIONS, I MEAN, THERE'S JUST REALLY NO WAY TO KNOW WHAT IT IS THAT WE'RE APPROVING AS A CONCEPTUAL PROOF. IT MAKES PERFECTLY GOOD SENSE. IT'S, IT'S JUST AS, AS A, A CERTIFICATE FOR APPROPRIATENESS, IT GETS TO THE LEVEL OF IT BEING A FINAL PROJECT. SO THE, JUST THE TWO ITEMS, STI UH, STIPULATING THE ACTUAL ITEMS IN THE LETTER SO THAT WE'RE VERY CLEAR THAT THEY'RE WITHIN OUR JURISDICTION. AND THEN THIRD, UH, SECONDLY, THE, UH, I'M, I, I WON'T, UH, YOU CAN, YOU CAN COUNT ON MY VOTE, BE PROACTIVE, BUT, BUT I PERSONALLY DON'T, DON'T FEEL LIKE THE DRAWINGS ARE AT THE LEVEL OF A FINAL APPROVAL. UH, THANK YOU, SIR. THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER SAVINO. UM, I WOULD BE WILLING, I WOULD LIKE TO RETRACT MY MOTION AND RESTATE IT, AND I'LL DO IT AS SUCH. AND IF THE SECOND IS WILLING TO SECOND IT, UM, THAT'D BE GREAT. . UM, TO CONTINUE THIS, I WOULD LIKE TO CONTINUE THE CASE, UM, TO INCLUDE SO THAT THE APPLICANT HAS A CHANCE TO ADDRESS THE STAFF STIPULATIONS KING WILLIAM ASSOCIATION STIPULATIONS AND RETURN TO THE COMMISSION IN TWO WEEKS COMMISSIONS. WELL, YES, WITH, ALONG WITH A DIMENSION, UM, SET OF DRAWINGS THAT LOOK MORE LIKE CONSTRUCTION DRAWINGS, 80% OR JUST ENOUGH SO THAT WE KNOW WHAT HEIGHTS ELEVATIONS ARE LIKE, WHAT PLANS ARE LIKE, AND, UM, YEAH, DIMENSIONALLY, BUT WE WOULD LIKE, UM, THEM TO RETURN TO THE NEXT AVAILABLE OR THE NEXT SCHEDULED H D R C HEARING. WILL THAT WORK? DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND? YOU HAVE A SECOND FURTHER DISCUSSION, MR. CHAIR? I, YES. COMMISSIONER GIBBS. THANK YOU MR. CHAIR. UM, QUESTIONS FOR, UM, VICE CHAIR SAVINO? UM, SO THE, YOUR MOTION, UM, FOR CONTINUANCE, I'M COOL WITH THAT, BUT YOU, YOU STATED ABOUT MAKING SURE THE STAT STIPULATIONS WERE MET, YOU KNOW, WITH, UM, STAFF AS WELL AS KEN WILLIAMS. THE APPLICANT ALREADY, UM, STATED THAT SHE WAS, UM, IN AGREEMENT WITH ALL THOSE. SO MAINLY IT FOCUSES ON THE DRAWINGS TO I THINK, UM, TWO, IT'S TWO PART. THERE ARE A LOT OF STIPULATIONS BOTH ON THE STAFF STANDPOINT AS WELL AS WITH THE KING WILLIAM ASSOCIATION, AND THEY HAD SOME VERY VALID COMMENTS AND THERE ARE AN AWFUL LOT OF 'EM. IF THERE WERE MAYBE ONE OR TWO STIPULATIONS, I THINK I, I'M HAPPY TO, UM, UM, LET THE APPLICANT WORK ON THOSE. BUT THE ADDITIONAL INFORMATION REGARDING DIMENSION DRAWINGS AND ESPECIALLY ELEVATION HEIGHTS AND FLOOR PLATE HEIGHTS, UM, AND ALL OF THOSE OTHER DETAILS THAT WE NORMALLY EXPECT AN APPLICATION TO COME WITH FOR A FINAL APPROVAL, I THINK IT WOULD BE A REASONABLE REQUEST. THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER MAZUA? YEAH, SURE. THERE'S ANOTHER, OH, SORRY, I, I'M SO SORRY. YEAH, ONE MOMENT PLEASE. WE HAVE ANOTHER COMMISSIONER. SO THERE WAS A, UH, SOMEBODY MENTIONED IT AND IT WASN'T IN THE KING WILLIAM ASSOCIATION LETTER, BUT IT'S ON OUR SCREEN RIGHT NOW. A THE CARPORTS OR THE CAR COVERINGS THAT ARE IN THAT, UH, GULL WING [00:40:01] SHAPE. I AGREE THAT DOES NOT LOOK LIKE A KING WILLIAM CARPORT OR COVERED GARAGE. UM, I THINK THAT SHOULD BE ADDRESSED ALSO, BUT IT WASN'T IN THE LETTER. MAY I PLEASE SPEAK THIS AS THE APPLICANT, IF THAT'S OKAY. BY THE COMMISSIONERS, PLEASE? YES, MA'AM. OKAY. UM, THANK YOU SO MUCH. AND JUST TO, UH, STATE IN, IN THE STAFF RECOMMENDATION AND THE STIPULATION, ALL THESE THINGS WERE STATED THERE AND THERE WERE ITEMS THERE THAT IT ALSO MENTIONED THAT YOU WILL CONTINUE TO FOLLOW THROUGH EVEN AFTER APPROVAL. SO JUST LIKE I MENTIONED EARLIER, I HAVE ACCEPTED ALL THE STIPULATIONS. I AM VERY TRUSTWORTHY. THAT'S WHY I'VE WORKED WITH EVERYBODY, INCLUDING THE NEIGHBORS WHO REFUSE TO ACCEPT ENGAGEMENT, EVEN THOUGH I'VE WORKED WITH EVERYBODY AND EVEN WITH DISTRICT, WHAT THEY'RE ASKING FOR, WELL, IT'S ALWAYS IMPORTANT TO LET PEOPLE DO THEIR JOB. WHAT THEY ASK FOR, THEY'VE RECEIVED IT. I'VE WORKED WITH EVERYBODY ACROSS BOARD AND I HAVE MULTIPLE OTHER PROJECTS THAT ARE GOING ON, AND EVERYTHING HAS BEEN TO STANDARD AND UP OFF STANDARD. SO I'M ONLY MAKING, JUST SAYING THIS SO THAT THE COMMISSIONERS AND YOUR EXCELLENCES WOULD KNOW, NOT ONLY AM I TRUSTWORTHY, I'M HERE TO BE TOLD WHAT TO DO. AND THAT'S WHY I'VE ACCEPTED WHAT I'VE BEEN HACKED TO DO. ALL THESE ITEMS ARE CUSTOM MADE AND THEY WILL BE CUSTOM MADE. I'M BROUGHT ON, ON BOARD FOR CONSTRUCTION. SO WHEN I HAD THE LAST TIME I WAS HERE, I DID ASK, WOULD YOU LIKE ME TO BRING SAMPLES? WHAT EXACTLY WOULD YOU LIKE ME TO DO? BECAUSE UNTIL WE CONSTRUCT, WE CAN ACTUALLY BRING THE ITEMS ONTO THE DEVELOPMENT. WE'VE WE'VE BEEN TAKING CARE OF THE DEVELOPMENT SINCE WE ACQUIRED IT. SO, UM, I'M JUST HERE TO LET EVERYBODY KNOW I DON'T WASTE MY TIME AND I WOULDN'T LIKE TO WASTE ANYBODY'S TIME. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. ANY OTHER COMMENTS? MAY HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE. GIBBS. AYE. SAVINA? AYE. VELASQUEZ? AYE. ZUKA. AYE. VASQUEZ. AYE. CERVANTES? YES. HOLLAND. AYE. AND FETZER. AYE. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. MR. CHAIR, CAN I ASK A STAFF A QUESTION? YES. I'LL BE BRIEF CO. CORY, WHEN, WHEN ITEMS FROM A LETTER ENTER INTO THE POINTS OF RECOMMENDATION OR EXPECTATION ON THE OFFICIAL FORM, HOW DO YOU GO ABOUT TAKING ITEMS THAT HAVE BEEN ASKED BY AN ENTITY THAT COMMISSION HAS SAID, WE'RE PLACING THOSE AS STIPULATIONS, RIGHT? SO WE WOULD LITERALLY JUST COPY AND PASTE THEM INTO THE COMMISSION ACTION LETTER. YOU'VE ENDORSED THOSE RECOMMENDATIONS, SO WE'LL INCLUDE THEM IN THE ACTION. THANK YOU, CORY. AGENDA ITEM NUMBER NINE, H D R C, CASE NUMBER 20 23 3 88 16 30 EAST HOUSTON STREET. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO INSTALL SIGNAGE AT 1630 EAST HOUSTON STREET, LOCATED WITHIN THE DIGNITY HILL HISTORIC DISTRICT. THE PROPOSED SIGNAGE FEATURES AN INTERNALLY ILLUMINATED CABINET AND VINYL DOOR GRAPHICS STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THE WALL SIGN. BASED ON FINDINGS, A THROUGH H STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT THE APPLICANT PROPOSED SIGNAGE THAT FEATURES METAL CONSTRUCTION, INCLUDING METAL FACES AND EXTERNAL ILLUMINATION. STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF THE TWO VINYL DOOR GRAPHICS. ADDITIONALLY, STAFF RECOMMENDS THE DEVELOPMENT OF A MASTER SIGNAGE PLAN FOR THE PROPERTY THAT WOULD RESULT IN UNIFORM SIGNAGE FOR EACH TENANT SPACE. THE TEMPORARY WALL SIGN AND WINDOW GRAPHIC CURRENTLY LOCATED WITHIN THE STOREFRONT SYSTEM HAVE BEEN, HAVE NOT BEEN APPROVED AND HAVE NOT BEEN REQUESTED. AS PART OF THIS APPLICATION. STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT THE SIGNAGE BE REMOVED OR APPLIED FOR, UH, THE APPLICANT'S HERE IN PERSON, UH, COMMISSIONERS. UH, IF NEEDED, I CAN GIVE BRIEFCASE HISTORY. UH, THIS WAS PREVIOUSLY REVIEWED BY THE COMMISSION, I BELIEVE IN 2021, WHERE IT WAS REFERRED TO A SUBCOMMITTEE HERE, UH, SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING. UM, THE APPLICANTS? YES. HI, I AM TERRY MARTIN WITH THE DREAM WEAVER FLORIST. HELLO. OKAY. TERRY MARTIN WITH THE DREAM WEAVER FLORIST. AND THAT'S BASICALLY OUR SIGN HERE THAT WE HAVE. AND IT'S JUST LIKE OUR NEIGHBOR SIGN ACROSS THE STREET. IT IS METAL WITH A PLEXIGLASS IN FRONT. THERE'S A, OKAY. AND WE JUST WANT TO KNOW WHAT OUR NEXT STEP IS. I MEAN, IT'S A SIMPLE SIGN WITH OUR NAME AND PHONE NUMBER ON IT, ON THE WALL. UM, WE'RE WAITING FOR INSTRUCTIONS TO TELL US WHAT WE NEED TO DO TO IMPROVE IT, OR IT HAS A METAL BASING AND THE GLASS JUST LIKE OUR NEIGHBORS ACROSS THE STREET. OKAY, [00:45:02] THANK YOU. UH, THE GUIDELINES DO NOT, UM, ALLOW FOR INTERNALLY LIT, UH, PLASTIC FACE SIGNS THAT, UM, THE GUIDELINES STATE THAT, UM, UH, INDIRECT LIGHTING OR, UM, THERE'S ANOTHER ONE ACROSS THE STREET, BACKLIT LIGHTING FOR A METAL SIGN OR OTHER MATERIAL. SO THIS IS IN, UH, CONFLICT WITH THOSE GUIDELINES. I DO HAVE ONE QUESTION. THE PHOTO THAT IS IN THE APPLICATION AND SHOWS A UPLIGHT THAT'S MOUNTED ON THE CANOPY THAT WAS THERE WHEN WE GOT THERE. I'M A TENANT. I DON'T OWN THE BUILDING. IT'S BEEN THERE. OKAY, SO DO THOSE UPLIGHTS WORK? YES, SIR. THEY DO WORK. OKAY. SO THEY SHINE ON YOUR SIGN AT NIGHT? NOT ON THE SIGN, NO, NOT ON THE SIDE, JUST ON THE WALL. OKAY. BUT I CAN TURN MY LIGHT OFF IF YOU DON'T WANT IT LIT UP AT NIGHTTIME. I MEAN, THAT'S JUST TELL ME WHAT TO DO. I DON'T, I MEAN, IT'S JUST LIKE THE NEIGHBORS ACROSS THE STREET, THE DIG WITTY. IT'S THE SAME MATERIAL. OKAY. QUESTION FOR STAFF. THE SIGN THAT, UH, THE APPLICANT IS SHOWING ACROSS THE STREET, DO WE KNOW THE AGE AND WHEN THAT SIGN WAS PUT UP? I, I CAN'T SAY ONE WAY OR THE OTHER, BUT, UM, I MEAN, I KNOW THAT SIGN HAS BEEN THERE FOR PROBABLY EIGHT YEARS OR SO AT LEAST, BUT I, I'D HAVE TO LOOK. I DON'T KNOW FOR A FACT. WELL, I, THE BUSINESS IS NOT AS OLD AS THE SIGN, SO I'M PRETTY SURE THAT IT WAS A REFACE CORRECT, WHICH IS ELIGIBLE UNDER THE CODE. AND SO IF THERE'S AN EXISTING INTERNALLY LIT SIGN, YOU CAN CHANGE OUT THE FACE ADMINISTRATIVELY. UM, IT'S JUST NEW SIGNAGE AS IT GOES IN. WE'LL HAVE TO MEET THE REQUIREMENTS. OKAY. THANK YOU. OTHER QUESTION? MR. MR. CHAIR? MR. HOLLAND? THAT WAS, UM, THAT SIGN. IT WAS, UH, PAT'S BARBECUE BEFORE IN 2011, AND IT WAS, UH, IT WAS THERE IN 2008. I'M LOOKING AT HISTORICALS RIGHT NOW. SO IT'S, IT LIKE, YEAH, LIKE COREY SAID, IT'S BEEN THERE. IT JUST WAS REFACED, UH, BY DIGGY MEATS IN I WANNA SAY 2017 OR 18. OKAY. SO IS THE PROBLEM THE LIGHT IN THE SIGN? YES, I CAN, UM, WE CAN TAKE THAT OUT. I HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH THAT. COMMISSIONERS, IF IT'S HELPFUL, UH, I COULD READ THE FINDINGS. UM, SO, UM, PREVIOUS REVIEW FINDING B THE INSTALLATION OF IN INTERNALLY ILLUMINATED CABINET AND CHANNEL LETTERS WAS REVIEWED BY THE HISTORIC AND DESIGN REVIEW COMMISSION ON MAY THE 19TH OF 2021. THAT SIGN WAS REFERRED TO THE DESIGN REVIEW COMMITTEE. UM, THE APPLICANT DID NOT ATTEND THE DESIGN REVIEW COMMITTEE MEETING IN 2021. UH, SECOND D R C WAS SCHEDULED LAST MONTH IN SEPTEMBER THIS YEAR. UM, THE APPLICANT ALSO DID NOT ATTEND THAT MEETING. UH, THE UNAPPROVED CABINET SIGN AND VINYL DOOR GRAPHICS WERE INSTALLED BETWEEN MAY OF 2021 AND APRIL OF 2022. THE SIGNAGE HAS NEITHER A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FROM O H P, UH, NOR A SIGN PERMIT FROM DEVELOPMENT SERVICES DEPARTMENT. UH, UH, D S D SIGN INSPECTOR IS ACTUALLY, UM, FROM WHAT I BELIEVE, THE INDIVIDUAL THAT CITED THIS. UH, AND THAT'S HOW IT WAS BROUGHT TO O P'S ATTENTION. UM, AND THEN FOR THE ALLOWABLE SIGNAGE, UM, THE GUIDELINES FOR SIGNAGE RECOMMEND NO MORE THAN THREE SIGNS PER APPLICATION TO TOTAL 50 SQUARE FEET. THE COMMISSION HAS THE ABILITY TO PROVE ADDITIONAL SIGNAGE. UH, THE COMMISSION SEES THAT THAT'S WARRANTED. UH, AND THEN FOR THE CABINET SIGN, UH, THE PROPOSED CABINET WILL FEATURE AN OVERALL WIDTH OF EIGHT FEET AND AN OVERALL HEIGHT OF THREE FEET, SIX INCHES FOR A TOTAL SIZE OF APPROXIMATELY 28 SQUARE FEET. PER THE GUIDELINES FOR SIGNAGE. SIGNAGE WITHIN HISTORIC DISTRICT SHOULD FEATURE WOOD OR METAL CONSTRUCTION AND EXTERNAL ILLUMINATION. UH, THE PROPOSED SIGN IS NOT CONSISTENT WITH THE GUIDELINES IN REGARDS TO ITS LIGHTING AND MATERIALS. WELL, THE MATERIALS ARE THE SAME. IT'S THE METAL QUESTION FOR STAFF IS YES. WITH, WITHOUT THAT, WITHOUT THE LIGHTING INTERNALLY, IS IS THE SIGN INSIDE OF GUIDELINES? IS IT WITHIN GUIDELINES? NO. UM, THE SIGN WOULD STILL FEATURES THE PLEX FACE OR A PLASTIC FACE, WHICH ALLOWS FOR IT TO, UH, FEATURE A GLOWING CABINET AT NIGHT. UH, NOW IF THE SIGN WAS INDIRECTLY LIT, UM, AND NOT INTERNALLY LIT, THAT WOULD BE CLOSER TO BEING CONSISTENT WITH THE GUIDELINES, BUT IT STILL WOULD NOT BE FULLY CONSISTENT WITH THE GUIDELINES. IS IT? WHAT ELEMENT SPECIFICALLY? OTHER THAN THE INTERNALLY LIT PORTION MAKES IT NOT THE PLASTIC FLA THE PLASTIC FACE. THE PORTION, YES, THE, OKAY. SORRY, MR. CHAIR, THERE'S A NEW YES. COMMISSIONER GIBBS, WILL YOU FINISH? YES. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. [00:50:01] UM, SO FIRST I WANNA SAY, UM, I LOVE YOUR BUSINESS DONE MANY TIMES. I MEAN, YOU SHALL MANY TIMES. UM, BUT MY QUESTION IS, UM, SO THIS IS A VIOLATION CASE. OKAY? SO THE SIGN WAS PUT UP, UM, SOMETIME BETWEEN, LIKE I SAID, MAY AND APRIL, UM, FOR 2021 TO 2022. SO HOW DID WE GET TO THE POINT WHERE YOU PUT THE SIGN UP OR THE SIGN WAS PUT UP IN VIOLATION THERE, AND ONCE YOU SEE WHAT STAFF IS RECOMMENDING HERE, C CAN'T YOU JUST COMPLY WITH THOSE AND THEN, YOU KNOW, GET YOUR SIGN IN COMPLIANCE? ABSOLUTELY. I'M ASKING IF, IF THE LIGHTING IS A PROBLEM, WILL IT CHANGE OF TAKE IT OUT. OKAY. SO THE STIPULATIONS HERE THAT STAFF IS RECOMMENDING HERE, THAT'S TELLING YOU WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE HERE IN ORDER TO GET, GET INTO COMPLIANCE WITH THE SIGNS. SO YOU'RE, YOU'RE ASKING FOR GUIDANCE ON HOW TO GET THAT DONE, BUT STAFF IS PROVIDING THAT GUIDANCE? WELL, THIS IS THE FIRST I'VE HEARD OF IT. STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION WAS PROVIDED TO THE APPLICANT LAST WEEK. LAST WEEK, OKAY. OKAY. SO THE, THE THANK YOU, SIR. NON-COMPLIANCE WOULD BE THE INTERNALLY LIT AND THE PLASTIC FACE CORRECT. COMPLIANCE SIGN WOULD FEATURE INDIRECT ILLUMINATION IN A METAL PHASE. MR. CHAIR? YES, COMMISSIONER, I, I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE AS SUBMITTED BY THE APPLICANT, OR I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S AN APPLICANT BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW IF THE CITY'S THE ONE THAT IS THE, IS THE APPLICANT FOR A DENIAL OF THE CIRCUMSTANCE? HE'S THE APPLICANT. HE'S THE APPLICANT. WELL, I, I'D, I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE AS SUBMITTED BY THE APPLICANT. THANK YOU. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? I HAVE A QUESTION. THIS IS FOR DISCUSSION PURPOSES. YES. YES. I'LL SECOND. OKAY. DISCUSSION. SO, DISCUSSION COMMISSIONER GIBBS. THANK YOU. SO, UM, SO THAT BEING SAID, SO THE STAFF HAS PROVIDED THE INFORMATION TO YOU, UM, AS FAR AS THE WHAT NEEDED WOULD SIGN. AND THEN, UM, CHAIRMAN FEER ALSO MENTIONED THIS, THE, THE ILLUMINATION THERE. SO, UM, NOW THAT YOU UNDERSTAND, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S REQUIRED MM-HMM. , WHAT'S THE GUIDELINES REQUIRE? UM, ARE YOU ABLE TO COMPLY WITH THOSE IN ORDER TO GET YOUR YES, SIR. ABSOLUTELY. OKAY. THAT'S IT, MR. CHAIR. THANK YOU MR. CHAIR. YES. COMMISSIONER VA ON THAT, IT, IT APPEARS THAT, THAT THE ITEM THAT IS OUTSTANDING IS THAT THE SIGN IS LIT FROM BEHIND. NOW CLEARLY THE AREA HAS PRECEDENT, OR LET'S SAY CHARACTERISTICS THAT SET A VISUAL EXPECTATION THAT THERE ARE CABINETS WITH A PLEXIGLASS THAT ARE LIT FROM BEHIND. THEY'RE UN ALIEN TO THE AREA. SO THIS SIGN, UH, KIND OF FALLS WITHIN THE PARAMETERS OF WHAT IS THE NORMAL IN, IN THAT NEIGHBORHOOD. SO THERE'S NOTHING REALLY FREAKY ABOUT IT. IT, IT FITS. UH, NOW I WOULD, YOU KNOW, IF WE HAD THE POWER TO, TO, TO, TO SAY THE BUILDING WANTS A DIFFERENT KIND OF SIGN PERIOD, WHICH ISN'T EVEN WHAT, WHAT STAFF IS SAYING. YOU KNOW, PERHAPS THESE, THESE HORIZONTAL RECTANGULAR SHAPES ARE ASKING FOR THE BUILDING IN GENERAL TO HAVE HAND PAINTED SIGNS AND LIT FROM THE AWNING. BUT IT'S, IT DOESN'T HAVE THAT, AND THERE'S NO INDICATION THAT IT'S EVER GONNA HAVE THAT. SO NOW THE BUILDING MORE THAN ANYTHING IS ADAPTING. AND IN TERMS OF THAT, UM, YOU KNOW, UH, CONSIDERING THE, THE BARBECUE PLACE ACROSS THE MEATS PLACE ACROSS THE STREET, UM, IT HAS A VERY, VERY ECLECTIC AND INTERESTING, UM, UH, ATTITUDE FOR A COMMERCIAL CORRIDOR THAT IS VERY SPECIFIC TO A VERY SPECIFIC NEIGHBORHOOD. I THINK THE, THE, THE SIGN IS, IS, UM, UH, UH, OKAY, WITHOUT LIGHTS, PERHAPS IT'S OKAY WITH LIGHTS. SO MY MOTION IN SPIRIT IS TO, UH, ENABLE THIS GENTLEMAN TO, UM, RETURN TO HIS BUSINESS WITH HIS SIGN LIT AT NIGHT. AND, UH, PERHAPS THE NATURE OF THAT BUILDING HAS A PRECEDENT THAT ENABLES BACKLIT, UM, BOXES. THANK YOU, SIR. THANK YOU. OTHER COMMENTS? COMM, COMMISSIONER CERVANTES? YEAH, JUST, UH, IF, IF THOSE LIGHTS ARE THERE, I THINK THAT THOSE LIGHTS ILLUMINATING WOULD PROBABLY LOOK A LITTLE BIT MORE ELEGANT THAN, THAN, THAN A BACKLIT LIGHT. YOU KNOW, YOU, YOU DON'T, THE OLD STYLE WHAT THE, WHAT THE BUILDING CALLS FOR, AND THAT MIGHT BE SOMETHING THAT'S ACTUALLY GONNA LOOK PRETTY GOOD, PROBABLY A LITTLE BETTER. I'M WILLING TO TAKE THE INSIDE LIGHT OUT. NOT A PROBLEM. YOU'VE GOT THE TEAM. YES, SIR. COMMISSIONER HOLLAND. THANK YOU. UM, I JUST WANT TO RECOGNIZE THAT THE, IN THIS DISCUSSION TODAY, THE APPLICANT HAS, UH, AGREED TO, AGREED WITH STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS AND HAS ACKNOWLEDGED THAT THE APPLICANT [00:55:01] HAS ACKNOWLEDGED THAT, UH, THEY ARE, HAVE TAKEN NO ISSUE WITH, UM, PROPOSING SIGNAGE, FEATURING METAL CONSTRUCTION WITH METAL FACADES AND EXTERNAL ILLUMINATION. FOR THAT REASON, I WOULDN'T SUPPORT THIS MOTION. THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER SAVINO? UM, YEAH, I HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT THE DESIGN AS IT RELATES TO THE CHARACTER OF THE BUILDING AND THE TIME PERIOD DURING WHICH THE BUILDING WAS CONSTRUCTED. I DO THINK THAT THE DIGNA WITTY MEET SIGN GOES WITH THE POST-WAR BUILDING SIGNAGE. IT'S REAL LOW, UM, YOU KNOW, A LESS LONG BUILDING AND, UM, CLEARLY OF A DIFFERENT STYLE. AND I THINK THAT'S THE, THE IDEA OF EPHEMERAL, UM, ADDITIONS TO OUR, TO OUR BUILDINGS AND THAT THEY COORDINATE, THEY RESPOND TO THE STYLE AND THE TIME PERIOD. SO FOR THAT REASON, I DON'T, I WILL NOT BE ABLE TO SUPPORT THE MOTION RIGHT NOW. THANK YOU. EXCUSE ME? YES. COMMISSIONER MAZUA. I, I JUST WANTED CLARIFICATION. THERE'S TWO THINGS THAT, UM, I'M SORRY, I'VE FORGOTTEN YOUR NAME, SIR. TERRY MARTIN. TERRY MARTIN, YES, SIR. UH, HAS AGREED TO, TO ILLUMINATE THE SIGN FROM THE AWNING, BUT LEAVE IT WITH THE PLASTIC FRONT. IS THAT ACCEPTABLE TO STAFF? UM, IT WOULD, I WOULD BE AMENABLE TO THAT. OKAY. BUT I DON'T KNOW IF THE OTHER COMMISSIONERS WOULD BE. UM, I THINK IT'S A GOOD HALFWAY POINT. THE SIGN ALREADY EXISTS. UH, WE'RE NOT GONNA KNOW THAT IT'S MADE OUT OF METAL OR IT'S MADE OUT OF PLASTIC IF IT'S ILLUMINATED FROM, FROM IN FRONT. YES. MR. CHAIR? YES. COMMISSIONER O I THINK, UM, COMMISSIONER HOLLAND HAD MADE A POINT ABOUT THE APPLICANT AGREEING WITH CHANGING THE SIGNAGE. IS THAT CORRECT, SIR? THE LIGHTING? MM-HMM. THE LIGHTING. LIGHTING NOT AS, UH, WHAT STAFF RECOMMENDED. BASICALLY STAFF RECOMMENDATION IS TO REMOVE THE PLASTIC SIGN AND PUT UP A METAL PAINTED SIGN THAT WOULD BE EXTERNALLY LIM ILLUMINATED. I JUST WANNA BE SURE YOU'RE UNDERSTANDING. MM-HMM. REMOVE THE SIGN ITSELF. IT'S, IT'S IN A METAL CASING. RIGHT. BUT REMOVE THE PLASTIC FACE AND REPLACE THE PLASTIC FACE WITH A PAINTED METAL SIGN THAT STILL FITS YOUR CABINET. AND THEN EXTERNAL ILLUMINATION FROM THE CANOPY. SO WHAT ARE YOU GONNA PUT IN PLACE OF THE PLASTIC? A PIECE OF METAL THAT WOULD BE PAINTED. IT COULD BE THIS EXACT SAME SIGN, BUT RATHER THAN A PLASTIC SIGN, IT WOULD BE, THIS WOULD BE PAINTED ON METAL, A SHEET OF METAL. OKAY. AND ILLUMINATED FROM THE, THERE'S A NEW BUILDING, CANOP AT COMMERCE AND HACKBERRY, THE JASMINE BUILDING. IT HAS A PLASTIC JUST LIKE THIS, A NEW SIGN JUST PUT UP A MONTH AGO. AND IT'S THE SAME THING THAT I HAVE. IT'S NOT A HISTORIC DISTRICT. MR. CHAIR? UM, YES. MAY I RECOMMEND THAT, UH, THAT WE, UM, VOTE ON THE MOTION AT HAND AND IF WE NEED TO MAKE ANOTHER MOTION TO DISCUSS THIS WITH OTHER NUANCES, WE CAN DO THAT. THANK YOU. WELL, MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE? WELL, MR. CHAIR, INSIDE OF THAT I TO SEE IF WE CAN GET THE BALL A LITTLE FURTHER. I CAN AMEND MY MOTION TO, UH, THE EXISTING SIGN WITH A REPLACED, REPLACING THE PLEXIGLASS WITH, UH, METAL, SAME SIGN, UH, BUT METAL SIGN EXTERNALLY ILLUMINATED, BUT THE SAME, SAME FRAMEWORK AND ALL THAT. ALL HE'S DOING IS REPLACING THAT PLASTIC FACE WITH A METAL FACE AND USING THAT LIGHT THAT'S THERE TO LIGHT IT. SO WE HAVE, THAT'S CONSISTENT WITH STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS. OKAY. OKAY. OKAY. JUST SECOND CONCUR IF THAT'S IN ALIGNMENT WITH WHAT STAFF IS RECOMMENDING. YES, I CONCUR. OKAY. THANK YOU. MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE? GIBBS? AYE. SAVINO? AYE. VELASQUEZ. AYE. ZUKA. NAYYY VASQUEZ. AYE. CERVANTES? YES. HOLLAND. AYE. AND ZER AYE. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU. UHHUH FOR AS TIMEFRAME, HOW MUCH TIME DO I HAVE TO LOOK, GET THAT DONE? UM, I CAN, YOU CAN WORK WITH STAFF. DO SOMETHING ON THAT, ON YOUR TIMEFRAME. OKAY. THANK YOU. AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 10. AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 10, H D R C, CASE NUMBER 20 23 3 79, UM, FOUR 15 NORTH MESQUITE AND 1 0 5 THROUGH ONE 13 BROWN ALLEY. UH, THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT SIX TWO STORY RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURES ON THE VACANT LIGHTS ADDRESSED AS 1 0 5, 1 0 7, 1 0 9 1 11, [01:00:03] AND ONE 13 BROWN STREET AND FOUR 15 NORTH MESQUITE STREET, UH, LOCATED WITHIN THE DIGNITY HILL HISTORIC DISTRICT. THE LIGHTS ARE BOUNDED BY BROWN STREET TO THE SOUTH, NORTH MESQUITE STREET TO THE EAST BROWN ALLEY TO THE NORTH. EACH OF THE PROPOSED STRUCTURES WILL FEATURE BETWEEN APPROXIMATELY 26 AND 30 FEET IN HEIGHT. STAFF RECOMMENDS FINAL APPROVAL BASED ON FINDINGS A THROUGH BBB WITH THE FOLLOWING STIPULATIONS, ONE THAT THE APPLICANT INSTALLS WINDOWS THAT ADHERE TO STAFF STANDARDS FOR WINDOWS AND NEW CONSTRUCTION. REGARDING PRODUCT SPECIFICATIONS AND INSTALLATION METHOD AND PROFILE IS NOTED IN FINDING YOU A MOCKUP WITH THE PROPOSED WINDOW PRODUCT AND INSTALLATION IS, IS TO BE CONSTRUCTED, REVIEWED AND APPROVED BY O H P STAFF PRIOR TO PURCHASING INSTALLATION OF THE WINDOWS TWO, THAT THE PROPOSED GABLE RETURNS FROM ROOF FORMS BE ELIMINATED. AS NOTED IN FINDING Q THREE, THE FENESTRATION ALIGN ON EACH STRUCTURE BETWEEN THE FIRST AND SECOND FLOORS IS FOUND ON HISTORIC STRUCTURES THROUGHOUT THE DISTRICT. ADDITIONALLY, STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT WINDOWS SHOULD BE ADDED WITHIN THE SECOND FLOOR PORCH ON LIGHTS 24 AND 27. AND ON THE FRONT FACADES OF STRUCTURES ON LIGHTS 26 AND 28 ADDITIONAL FENESTRATION ADDED A SIDE FACING FACADES WOULD ALSO BE APPROPRIATE FOR THAT. THE PROPOSED INTERNAL PARKING BE ELIMINATED AS PARKING IS NOT FOUND INTERNAL TO THE FOOTPRINT OF HISTORIC STRUCTURES FOUND WITHIN THE DISTRICT IS NOTED IN FINDING W UH, THE APPLICANT IS NOTED THE INSTALLATION OF PARKING TO THE NORTH OF BROWN ALLEY. UH, STAFF HAS NOT YET REVIEWED DOCUMENTS THAT REFLECT THIS. ANY ADDITIONAL PARKING ASSOCIATED WITH THE PROPOSED NEW CONSTRUCTION MUST BE REVIEWED AND APPROVED BY THE COMMISSION. AND THEN A CASE COMMENT REGARDING A FOUNDATION INSPECTION IS TO BE SCHEDULED WITH THE O H P STAFF TO ENSURE THAT FOUNDATION SETBACKS AND HEIGHTS ARE CONSISTENT WITH THE APPROVED DESIGN. THE INSTALLATION INSPECTION IS TO OCCUR AFTER THE INSTALLATION OF FORM WORK AND PRIOR TO THE INSTALLATION OF FOUNDATION MATERIALS. UH, COMMISSIONERS. I WILL NOTE THE CONSTRUCTION DOCUMENTS THAT WERE INCLUDED IN STAFF'S, UH, POST AND ON THE POSTED AGENDA, UH, REFLECT TWO STORY STRUCTURES. THIS IS WHAT WAS REVIEWED BY THE COMMISSION AT THE LAST DESIGN REVIEW COMMITTEE MEETING, UH, STAFF'S COMMENTS AND RECOMMENDATIONS ARE LARGELY FOLLOWING THE RECOMMENDATIONS OR THE SUGGESTIONS GIVEN BY THE SUBCOMMITTEE. THE APPLICANT HAS SUBMITTED UPDATED CONSTRUCTION DOCUMENTS THAT, UH, ALSO ADDRESS THE, UH, COMMENTS OF THE SUBCOMMITTEE. THOSE UPDATED DOCUMENTS WERE SUBMITTED THIS WEEK, SO THEY'RE NOT INCLUDED IN STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION. HOWEVER, WE DO HAVE THOSE AVAILABLE, UH, FOR, UH, REVIEW OR FOR THE COMMISSION TO VIEW. UM, I WILL, EXCUSE ME, I WILL SAY THAT, UM, IN GLANCING THROUGH THOSE LARGELY, UM, I BELIEVE THEY ADDRESS STAFF STIPULATIONS IN REGARDS TO ALIGNING WINDOW FENESTRATION AS WE CAN SEE HERE, UH, AS WELL AS ADDING WINDOW FENESTRATION UNDER THE GABLE ON LOT 28. UM, I THINK MAYBE THE ONLY OTHER THING WOULD BE, UH, A QUICK DISCUSSION REGARDING THE INSTALLATION OF WINDOWS ON THE SECOND FLOOR PORCHES. BUT, UM, ANYHOW, THE APPLICANT LUISA IS HERE, UM, AND CAN ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS OR, UH, ADDRESS COMMENTS THAT YOU MAY HAVE. UM, CHAIRMAN, THERE IS A, OR THERE IS A VOICEMAIL AND THERE ARE LETTERS OR A LETTER IN YOUR PACKET. GOOD AFTERNOON. MY NAME IS LISA AND I JUST GO, GONNA GO VERY BRIEFLY TO THE CHANGES FROM OUR LAST MEETING. UH, BASICALLY WE REMOVE THE ENTIRE THIRD FLOOR AND THE ROOF, UH, TERRACE. SO THAT HELPS US WITH THE MASSING AND THE HEIGHT. AND, UH, WE MADE A COUPLE CHANGES AND WE REVIEW THEM, LIKE I AND WAS SAYING LAST WEDNESDAY. UM, AND WE AGREE WITH THE STIPULATIONS THAT, UH, STAFF HAS RECOMMENDED. WE ALSO SEND A COUPLE EXAMPLES OF THE WINDOWS TO, TO EDWARD OF THE WINDOWS THAT WE'RE GONNA USE. AND YES, WE ALSO INCLUDE THE FEEDBACK FROM LAST UH, MEETING OF THE ALIGNMENT OF THE WINDOWS THAT COMMISSIONER WAS WAS ASKING. SO I CAN GO OVER ALL OF THE CHANGES THAT WE'VE DONE, OR, UM, YEP. OKAY. SO ON THE LAST MEETING, WE PUT A NOTE ON THE PLANS THAT OUR NEIGHBOR FOR AT FOUR 13 NORTH MESQUITE HAS A 7.68 SETBACK, AND WE'RE GONNA HAVE A 10 EASEMENT, A 10 FOOT EASEMENT. SO OUR, OUR FOUNDATION'S GONNA BE BEHIND OUR NEIGHBOR. THE PORCH AT THE, AT FOUR 50 NORTH MESQUITE WAS CHANGED TO MAKE IT DEEPER THAT IT WA IT CHANGED FROM THREE FEET TO FIVE FEET. ALSO, WE REMOVED THE THIRD FLOOR AND THE TERRACE, THE OVERHANG ON THE SIDE OF THE NORTH MESQUITE OF THE HOUSE WAS REMOVED AS WELL, TO BE CONSISTENT WITH, UH, HISTORIC IN C**S, WE ALSO, UH, ADD THE NOTES OF THE SIDING. THE MATERIAL, THE WINDOWS, AND THE TRIM BE IN BETWEEN [01:05:01] EACH WINDOW. UH, INSTEAD OF TWO PIECES, IT'S GONNA BE, UH, SIX INCH MILLION. WE ALSO MADE, MADE ALL OF THE LOTS, 50% OR LESS ON LOT COVERAGE ON THE LOTS. ALSO, WE WERE ABLE TO ADD THE WINDOWS, UH, ON FENESTRATION. WE ARE ACCEPTING WINDOWS WITH NO NAILING FINS, NO GRILLS. THE FRAMING IS GOING TO BE TWO BY SIX ON THE SIDE OF THE HOUSES FOR THE WINDOWS. AND OUR ONLY REQUEST IS THAT WE ARE ALLOWED TO KEEP THE ONE PARKING, UH, SPOT IN ON SITE. AND WE ARE PROVIDING ADDITIONAL PARKING, UH, TWO, TWO SPACE PARKING IN FRONT OF THE, OUR LOT ON THE OWN, ON THE LOT THAT WE OWN. AND EDWARD HAS THOSE DRAWINGS AS WELL. SO I DON'T KNOW IF ANYONE HAS QUESTIONS. UH, WE DO HAVE A VOICEMAIL. UH, YES, WE DO. HELLO, MY NAME IS VALERIE CORTES, AND I'M CALLING ON BEHALF OF THE GROUP THE CONCERNED CITIZENS OF DIGNITY WOODY HILLS. WITH REGARD TO CASE NUMBER 2023 DASH 3 79, LOCATED ON NORTH MESQUITE AND BROWN STREET. WE DO NOT AGREE WITH O P'S. RECOMMENDATIONS FOR APPROVAL OF CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS, WOOD OR ALUMINUM CLAD WOOD WINDOWS SHOULD BE USED FOR THE WINDOW MATERIAL WHICH THE APPLICANT HAS FAILED TO MEET. IN ADDITION, THERE ARE STILL MAJOR CONSTRUCTION DESIGN ISSUES THAT HAVE NOT BEEN MET. PLEASE SEE OUR EMAIL FOR THAT LIST. THESE ARE ALL MAJOR ARCHITECTURAL ROADBLOCKS THAT NEED TO BE ADDRESSED BEFORE FINAL APPROVAL IS GRANTED. WE'D ALSO LIKE TO KNOW HOW THEY'RE GOING TO ADDRESS THE EXISTING STRUCTURES THAT ARE CURRENTLY THERE. PLEASE SEE THE ATTACHED PHOTOS. BROWN STREET IS BEING USED AS INGRESS AND EGRESS BY THE CURRENT HOMEOWNERS ON THE STREET TO PARK IN THEIR BACKYARD, AND THAT'S PROBABLY NOT GOING TO CHANGE. ONE 13 BROWN ALLEY IS GOING TO BE OVERWHELMED BY THE MASSING OF THE EXISTING PROPERTY TO THE EAST AND THE NEW STRUCTURE TO THE WEST. IN ADDITION, WE HAVE MAJOR CONCERNS REGARDING THE PROPOSED INGRESS, EGRESS, AND EGRESS OF VEHICLES UTILIZING BROWN ALLEY. IF YOU LOOK AT THE ATTACHED IMAGE, BROWN ALLEY, ALONG THE FENCE LINE OF THE NEW VELOCITY PARKING LOT ON NORTH CHERRY IS ANYWHERE BETWEEN 11 FEET, NINE INCHES AND 12 FEET, FOUR INCHES, DEPENDING ON THE LOCATION OF WHERE YOU'RE MEASURING FROM CHERRY STREET TO THE CENTER OF THE PARKING LOT. THERE IS AN EXISTING COSA POST AT THE BEGINNING OF THE APPROACH INTO THE ALLEY, WHICH REDUCES THE WIDTH TO EIGHT FEET. THERE IS ALSO A BOX THAT IS SIX FEET, THREE INCHES FROM THE BASE OF THE POST TO THE BOTTOM OF THE BOX, WHICH COULD POTENTIALLY PREVENT LARGE VEHICLES ENTERING OR EXISTING OR EXITING BROWN ALLEY FROM NORTH CHERRY SINCE THERE MAY BE THE CHANCE THAT THE VEHICLES WILL BE DAMAGED. THANK YOU. . CAN I COMMENT? YES. YOU'D LIKE TO COMMENT ON THOSE? YES. UH, THIS IS A PHOTO OF CHERRY, NOT NORTH MESQUITE, AND WE ARE ALREADY APPROVED BY THE STREETS. AND FOR, FOR PARKING, WE ARE IMPROVING THE ALLEY. WE ARE DEDICATING ONE FOOT OF OUR PROPERTY. THIS, I DON'T THINK THIS PHOTO REPRESENT THE ACTUAL, UH, IT'S ON THE WRONG SIDE. THIS IS AT CHERRY. WE'RE TALKING ABOUT MESQUITE AND, UM, YEAH, THAT'S ALL THE WAY TO THE LEFT. THERE'S A PARKING LOT THERE, AND THAT PHOTO IS NOT FOR MESQUITE. OKAY. BUT, UH, WE HAVE THE CITY CERTIFICATE ALREADY FROM CITY. WE MET WITH FIRE, WE MET WITH THE MARSHALS. UH, WE HAVE EVERYTHING IS TAKEN CARE OF BY STREETS AND TRAFFIC, UM, AT THE CITY SIDE. OKAY. SO YOUR IMPROVEMENT OF BROWN ALLEY IS FROM MESQUITE TO THE WEST END OF YOUR, UH, PROPERTY, CORRECT? THAT'S CORRECT. OKAY. THANK YOU. YES. COMMISSIONER VASQUEZ. SO I THINK THE, THE FILE THAT'S ON OUR MONITORS IS THE NEWEST ONE, RIGHT? 'CAUSE THE ONES THAT'S IN THE COMPUTERS? YES. CORRECT. OKAY. THE, THE FILE THAT'S HERE, UM, IS, WAS SUBMITTED BY THE APPLICANT THIS WEEK, SO I'M GLAD TO SEE THE, OR THE ALLEY, THE WINDOWS ON THE SILO LOOKING PART. UM, DID YOU RECONSIDER PUTTING WINDOWS ON THE BALCONY OF 27? THAT'S ON THE STIPULATION OF STAFF AND WE CAN ADD THEM AS WELL. OKAY. AND THEN, UM, I THINK IN D R C WE ALSO MENTIONED GREEN SPACE. THAT'S THE ONLY THING I DIDN'T SEE. IT'S DID YOU ADD? YES, YES, YES. IT'S SHOWN ON THEIR LATEST PLAN HERE. LATEST, YEAH. WE ADD GREEN SPACE AND WE ALSO DID THE [01:10:01] DRAWINGS FOR THE DRIVEWAY TO MINIMIZE THE LOT COVERAGE AND, UM MM-HMM. , IS THIS THE, IS THAT THE DRIVEWAY ON 20, THE LAST ONE BEFORE THE MESQUITE HOUSE? IS THAT A SOLID DRIVEWAY OR? WE, WE GAVE A COUPLE OPTIONS TO, TO SEE WHAT THE OPTIONS ARE. I PERSONALLY LIKE JUST THE, THE TWO LINES OF CONCRETE. I THINK IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE A RIBBON DRIVEWAY WITHIN A HISTORIC DISTRICT. SO YEP. WE CAN ADD THAT TO THE STIPULATIONS. WE AGREE. WE JUST GAVE A COUPLE OPTIONS OF HOW WE CAN MINIMIZE THE LOT COVERAGE WITH A DRIVEWAY AND ADD MORE LANDSCAPING. YEAH, IT'S COME A LONG WAY AND THANK YOU, THANK YOU FOR ELIMINATING THAT THIRD STORY. I THINK THAT WAS THE . THANK YOU. THE STICKING POINT, BUT IT LOOKS A LOT BETTER. AND, UM, IF YOU ADD THE, THE WINDOW TO, I THINK IT WAS 27 I SAID, SORRY, YES. 27 AND YOU ALREADY ADDED THEM TO 28. YES, I'D BE IN SUPPORT MR. CHAIR. THANK YOU. UH, IT WAS COMMISSIONER SNO AND THEN COMMISSIONER VASQUEZ. UM, FIRST OF ALL, YES, TAKING OFF THAT THIRD FLOOR NOW PRESENTS THESE BUILDINGS AS HOUSES MORE SO MM-HMM. THAN JUST AN ACCUMULATION OF VOLUMES AND VOLUMES TO SELL TO SOMEBODY. THIS THE, THEY BEGIN TO LOOK LIKE HOUSES. UH, ONE QUESTION IS IN YOUR WORK WITH CIVIL AND, UH, THE CITY IS BROWN ALLEY BECAUSE OF ITS NARROWNESS, UM, WILL IT BE A ONE WAY? YES. OKAY. THANKS. COMMISSIONER VELAZQUEZ. UM, WELL, MR. CHAIR, I'M WONDERING IF THERE WERE ANY OTHER COMMENTS JUST KIND OF READING THE COMMISSION HERE, THAT, THAT PERHAPS WE MAKE A MOTION TO, UH, APPROVE WITH THE, UH, CHANGES THAT HAVE BEEN MADE. UH, I WANT TO REALLY MORE THAN THINK, I WANNA COMMENT TO THEM, BUT I'D TO FIGURE DO IT BETTER IN THE COMMENTS OF OUR BOARD. YES. SO MOTION TO APPROVE AS SUBMITTED WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS. AND THAT'S CONSIDERING THAT STAFF STIPULATIONS, Y'ALL ARE IN TUNE WITH EACH OTHER ALREADY, RIGHT? OR AARON? UH, EDWARD? YEAH. I BELIEVE THE, UH, APPLICANT HAS AGREED TO ALL OF STAFF STIPULATIONS. AND, UH, COMMISSIONER, I'LL PULL THOSE, UM, TO THE SCREEN NOW. UM, THE ONE STIPULATION THAT WE HAVE, UM, THAT, UM, I DON'T THINK THE APPLICANT WOULD BE IN AGREEMENT WITH OKAY, STAFF'S CONSTANT RECOMMENDATION, UH, WHERE I BELIEVE ONLY ON THE HOUSE AT FRONTS NORTH MESQUITE AND ONE OF THE INTERNAL LOTS, THERE'S STILL THE OPPORTUNITY FOR A VEHICLE TO PARK UNDER A COVERED, UH, LOCATION AT THE REAR OF THE PROPERTY. UH, IN THE PAST, IN A D R C, MOST RECENTLY, UM, COMMITTEE MEMBERS DIDN'T VOICE THAT CONCERN. UH, AND THEN STAFF IS ASKING THE APPLICANT TO, UH, ESSENTIALLY BUILD A WINDOW OR A WALL MOCK UP TO SHOW US WINDOW INSTALLATION. UH, THE APPLICANT HAS PROPOSED A, UM, AN ALUMINUM WINDOW THAT HAS BEEN USED, UH, AND PREVIOUSLY APPROVED BY THE COMMISSION. UH, THE APPLICANT HAS NOTED THAT THEY ARE THEIR PROPOSED INSTALLATION. UH, THIS IS THE WINDOW PRODUCT THAT THEY'RE PROPOSING TO INSTALL, AND THEIR PROPOSED INSTALLATION IS TO RESULT THEIR FEATURE RESULT, UH, SIMILAR TO THESE EXAMPLES, UM, THE APPLICANT IS NOTING THAT THEY'RE FRAMING WITH TWO BY SIXES, WHICH FROM STAFF EXPERIENCE, THEY WILL BE ABLE TO ACCOMPLISH THIS. UH, BUT, UM, AS A, UM, KIND OF A, A CHECK, UH, WE ARE ASKING THE APPLICANT TO HAVE A SAMPLE WINDOW AND TO FRAME A WALL AND SHOW US HOW IT WILL BE INSTALLED SO THAT WE CAN GO AND INSPECT THAT AND GIVE THEM, UM, THE APPROVAL TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THIS SPECIFIC INSTALLATION. UM, SO THAT'S, THAT'S THE OTHER STIPULATION THAT STAFF HAS. WELL, THEN EDWARD, INSIDE OF THAT, I WOULD ADD THAT, THAT THE APPLICANT, UH, THAT, THAT, THAT THE STIPULATION INCLUDE A MOCKUP OF THE WINDOW. OKAY. YES, SIR. AND I'M SORRY, I JUST, UH, WILL A, WANT TO ASK A QUESTION ABOUT THE PARKING. 'CAUSE I KNOW STAFF IS NOT RECOMMENDING PARKING AND ON THE, IT'S THE FOURTH STIPULATION TO BE REMOVED, BUT I KNOW, UH, COMMISSIONERS WANT THE PARKING. AND I WOULD LIKE TO ASK FOR, FOR, TO PLEASE KEEP THE PARKING REMOVED IN, IN, IN THE SENSE OF IT BEING A CONS, UH, A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS. PERHAPS THAT'S SOMETHING THAT, THAT WE CAN, THAT YOU CAN CONTINUE WITH STAFF SO THAT THE GENERAL, UH, PROJECT IS NOT HELD UP BY THAT ONE. SO, TO A CERTAIN EXTENT, YOU'RE AGREEING WITH STAFF AND CONTINUE THE CONVERSATION WITH STAFF, AND IF ANYTHING, COME BACK. BUT THE PROJECT IS SUCH A MASSIVE PROJECT. I HATE TO SEE IT SIT. THANK YOU. TEETER ON A PARKING SPACE, HUH? I, I'M, I'M JUST A LITTLE BIT CONFUSED 'CAUSE I DON'T, I REALLY WANT TO KEEP AT AT LEAST ONE PARKING SPOT ON, ON EACH PROPERTY, AND I DON'T, I KNOW STAFF CAN'T RECOMMEND THAT, SO I'M [01:15:01] UNSURE IF, IF THAT STIPULATION CAN BE REMOVED. I'M GOING TO GUESS THAT IT WOULD BE BEST FOR YOU IF WE GO WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS AND YOU CONTINUE THE CONVERSATION WITH STAFF AT WHICH TIME YOU CAN ALWAYS COME BACK TO THE COMMISSION FOR A DIFFERENT AGREEMENT. OKAY. WELL, I, I WILL NOTE, UM, THE MOST RECENT SITE PLAN IS HERE ON THE SCREEN. UM, AND, UM, FROM WHAT I'M SEEING IN THIS, IT IS ONLY THE HOUSE THAT FRONTS NORTH MESQUITE THAT FEATURES A PARKING SPOT THAT'S WITHIN THE FOOTPRINT OF THE STRUCTURE. I BELIEVE ALL OTHERS HAVE BEEN REMOVED. UM, UH, MAYBE, UH, WELL ACTUALLY THE LAST LOT, SO, UH, LOT 24 AND LOT 29 ARE THE TWO. THE OTHERS HAVE BEEN ELIMINATED CONSISTENT WITH STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION. UM, SO COMMISSIONERS, UH, MAYBE THAT'S, UH, SOMETHING THAT CAN BE DISCUSSED PRIOR TO A MOTION, OR, WELL, WELL, MAYBE WE GET A SECOND. WE CAN GET INTO DISCUSSION AND IF THERE'S AN AMENDMENT TO THE MOTION, UH, I MEAN, WE, WE COULD AND, BUT WE COULD AT LEAST GET INTO IT IN DISCUSSION. I'LL SECOND THE MOTION OKAY. WITH, WITH THE SECOND MR. CHAIR. I WANNA, UH, JUST TELL YOU AS A, AS A PERSON THAT SPENT DECADES BEHIND A DRAFTING TABLE, I APPRECIATE AS A, AS AN OLD DRAFTSMAN THAT THEY WENT BACK TO THE DRAWING BOARD AND THEY REALLY, REALLY, UH, UH, YOU KNOW, YOU, YOU GET PUT THE WORK IN FRONT OF YOU. YOU DON'T LET THE, LET THE ANXIETY OF WHAT YOU'VE GOTTA DO FROM HERE TO THEN GET IN YOUR WAY. AND THEY CLEARLY ARE WARRIORS OF THE, OF THE DRAFTING INDUSTRY. BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY, I LIKE THE WAY THE HOUSES ALONG THE LINES OF WHAT COMMISSIONER SABINO SAID, THEY BECOME HOUSES BECAUSE WHEN, WHEN THE NARROWNESS FORCES ITSELF UP, IT CREATES THESE WEIRD FORMS THAT THEY DON'T EXIST, YOU'RE NOT GONNA FIND 'EM IN HISTORIC CONTEXT. RIGHT. SO, UM, UH, JUST TO GIVE MY REGARDS TO WHOEVER HAD TO GO TO WORK ON THESE THINGS, AND THANK YOU FOR, FOR, UM, BEING SO PROACTIVE ABOUT HOW YOU'LL ADDRESS THIS. OKAY. THANK YOU. THANK YOU SO MUCH. YES, COMMISSIONER VASQUEZ. I JUST WANTED TO ASK ABOUT THAT. UM, IN THE LAST T R C, REMEMBER THAT LITTLE, UH, SECTION OF PARKING THAT YOU HAD INCLUDED AT THE TOP OF THE LOT? YEAH, IT'S, IS IT STILL THERE? YES. AND THERE'S ANOTHER, THERE'S LIKE A LITTLE COUCH. CAN YOU GO TO THE SECOND PAGE THAT I SENT IN THE EMAIL? IT WAS ACROSS THE STREET AND THEN THERE WAS LIKE A LITTLE, YEAH, IT'S OFFSHOOT, IT'S THERE, IT'S TWO PARKING SPACE AVAILABLE AND A LITTLE, UH, GREEN SPACE AS, SO WE'RE GONNA UTILIZE THAT, UM, LOT THAT WE HAVE IN FRONT OF THE PROPERTIES. OKAY. COMMISSIONER SAVINA. THANK YOU. UM, QUESTION FOR STAFF OR FOR APPLICANT, WHAT IS THE DEVICE THAT WILL MAINTAIN THAT LOT AS REMOTE PARKING FOR THE NEAR FUTURE? MAYBE NOT FOREVER, BUT FOR THE FORESEEABLE FUTURE. I AM ASSUMING YOU'RE ASKING IN REGARDS TO WHO PARKS THERE, HOW DO YOU CONTROL WHO PARKS THERE? UM, I MEAN THAT THE U D C DOESN'T SPECIFICALLY TASK O H P STAFF WITH THAT. UM, I WOULD ASSUME THAT WOULD BE WITHIN THE DEVELOPERS' AGREEMENT WITH WHATEVER, UH, HOMEOWNER ASSOCIATION THEY SET UP, OR CONDO ASSOCIATION OR, OR HOWEVER THAT'S DEVELOPED. UM, FROM A STAFF STANDPOINT, UM, OBVIOUSLY WE WOULD REVIEW IF THERE WAS A PROPOSED COVER THERE OR, UH, LANDSCAPING, UH, SITE PAVING, THINGS LIKE THAT. UM, I MEAN, GENERALLY FROM WHAT I SEE, AND THIS STAFF HASN'T OFFICIALLY REVIEWED THIS, AND THAT'S WHY WE HAD THE PREVIOUS STIPULATION, BUT FROM WHAT I SEE, I MEAN, IF THIS IS UNCOVERED, IT LOOKS PRETTY CONSISTENT WITH IT LOOKS APPROPRIATE. YEAH, I'LL SAY THAT. THANK YOU. AND IS THERE AN H O A NO. NO. THIS IS ALL FEE SIMPLE, UH, SALE YES. PER THAT'S CORRECT. OKAY. OKAY. WELL, THAT THERE IS ONE OF THE, THE CONCERNS I HAVE, BUT, UM, THE OTHER THING, OTHER NOTE THAT I WANNA MAKE, AND YES, THESE BEGAN TO LOOK LIKE HOUSES. I CAN'T BELIEVE IT. UM, , THANK YOU THERE. IT'S, IT'S QUITE, IT'S QUITE AN IMPROVEMENT. IT'S QUITE A CHANGE. UM, YEAH, THE OTHER THING IS, UM, YOU'VE USED IN YOUR PACKAGE A PRECEDENT THAT WAS ON MESQUITE STREET, RIGHT AROUND THE CORNER THERE. AND I WOULD SAY REG, IN REGARDS TO THAT PROJECT, THIS LOOKS SO SIMILAR. I WOULD SUGGEST FOR THE CONSTRUCTION OF THIS PROJECT THAT LESSONS BE LEARNED FROM THAT PROJECT. I THINK THE NOTE THAT STAFF HAS ABOUT FOUNDATION HEIGHTS MM-HMM. BEING APPROPRIATE AND BEING A LITTLE BIT HIGHER, I THINK WOULD BE VERY, VERY VALUABLE. I THINK THAT NEEDS TO BE PURSUED. THE, THE ONES ON MESQUITE HAVE A, BECAUSE THERE IS A MINIMAL, IF ANY, ELEVATION, SIX INCHES MAYBE OFF THE GROUND, THE CHARACTER OF THOSE HOUSES LOOK AS IF THEY BELONG IN A DIFFERENT NEIGHBORHOOD. [01:20:01] RIGHT. SO, UM, THAT'S JUST ONE EXAMPLE OF HOW THE LESSONS ON THOSE PROPERTIES, PROPERTIES CAN BE USED TO IMPROVE THE THIS ONE. YES. AND I JUST WANNA NOTE THAT WE HAVE THE CIVIL DRAINAGE PLAN AND, UH, IT'S STIPULATED THAT IT'S NOT GONNA BE HIGHER THAN 12. WE JUST HAVE TO CASCADE THE HEIGHT ON THE PROPERTIES BECAUSE OF THE DRAINAGE. BUT YEAH, IT'S NOT GONNA BE HIGHER THAN 12. AND BECAUSE THOSE ROADS ARE UNDEVELOPED ON EITHER SIDE, BROWN ALLEY AND STREET, AT SOME POINT, IF THE CITY DOES COME IN, CHANCES ARE THAT, UH, TOPOGRAPHY, THAT RESULTS WILL NOT BENEFIT THOSE PROPERTIES. OKAY. IT COULD EASILY CAUSE A PROBLEM. SO BEING HIGHER WOULD BE BETTER. OKAY. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. OTHER COMMENTS? I, I DO WANT TO, UH, THANK THE APPLICANT FOR LISTENING TO THE NEIGHBORHOOD, LISTENING TO THE COMMISSION AND STAFF, AND BRINGING FORWARD, UH, STRUCTURES THAT ARE MORE IN KEEPING WITH THE HISTORIC, UH, RESIDENCES. THANK YOU. SO, UM, NO OTHER COMMENTS MAY HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE. I'M SORRY. UM, TO BE CLEAR, TO MAKE SURE THAT I HAVE MY NOTES CORRECT, COULD THE MOTION BE REPEATED, UM, MOTION TO APPROVE AS, UM, SUBMITTED WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS THAT RECOMMENDATIONS? IT'S RECOMMENDATIONS? RIGHT. UH, YEAH, JUST CLARIFICATION. UM, I THAT I THINK THAT MAY CONTRADICT, UM, THE AS SUBMITTED PART WOULD INCLUDE THE APPLICANT'S PROPOSED SITE PLAN THAT I HAVE HERE. UM, ARE THERE A LOT LAYOUT THAT INCLUDES PARKING WITHIN THE FOOTPRINT OF LOTS OR THE STRUCTURES ON LOTS 28 AND OR 24 AND 29? UM, STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION WOULD CONTRADICT THAT. SO I JUST ON THAT, WELL, ON ON THAT, IT WOULD, IF, IF WE'RE STILL INSIDE OF THE MOTION, THEN LET ME JUST A ASK FELLOW COMMISSIONERS HERE, I, IS THERE A DISCUSSION THAT WE CAN HAVE SPECIFIC TO THE TWO PARKINGS ON 24? AND THE ONE ON THE FURTHER END, PARTICULARLY WITH RESPECT TO THE ONE ON THE FURTHER END IS NOT RELATED TO THE BUILDINGS REALLY, AND THEN THE ONE ON 24 MAY BE, UM, UH, MORE WITHIN THE CONTEXT OF THE BUILDING, UH, CLOSE, CLOSE PROXIMITY. D D DOES THE COMMISSION HAVE, UH, UH, AN OPINION ABOUT WHETHER A MOTION WOULD BE BEST TO ENABLE THOSE PARKING SPACES OR BEST TO CONTINUE? HA HAVE THE APPLICANT CONTINUE THAT CONVERSATION WITH STAFF AND DETERMINE IF THEY WANT TO BRING THOSE TWO ITEMS BACK FOR DISCUSSION AT ANOTHER TIME OR FOR DECISION AT A DIFFERENT TIME? WELL, I THINK MY OPINION IS THAT IF WE COULD, UH, GIVE STAFF AND THE APPLICANT DIRECTION ON THE PARKING ON ALL OF THE LOTS, WHETHER THEY ARE, UH, I THINK THE RIBBON DRIVES ARE MORE APPROPRIATE THAN THE, THE LARGE CONCRETE SLABS OR EVEN THE, THE HORIZONTAL, UH, LARGER LOOKING PAVERS. UH, I THINK RIBBON DRIVES ARE MORE APPROPRIATE. AND ALSO THAT WOULD IN INCREASE OR DECREASE THE IMPERVIOUS COVER ON THE LOTS, UM, ON THE TWO THAT HAVE, UH, THE STRUCTURES BUILDING OVER PARKING AREAS. UM, IT'S A LITTLE, I'M A LITTLE CONFLICTED ON THAT SINCE IT'S OUT OF CHARACTER TO THE NEIGHBORHOOD, BUT I'M ALSO COGNIZANT THAT OF THE FACT THAT PARKING IS AN ISSUE, UH, IN THIS, UH, PARTICULAR DEVELOPMENT AND ALLOWING THOSE TWO HOUSES TO HAVE A PARKING AREA WITH SOME STRUCTURE OVERHEAD, UM, I THINK WOULD BE, UM, A BETTER SOLUTION THAN HAVING, UH, MORE ON STREET PARKING. OTHER COMMENTS, COMMISSIONER VASQUEZ, I'M NOT SURE HOW TO WORD IT, BUT HOW WOULD YOU INCLUDE, UH, REQUIRING, REQUIRING THAT THERE ARE RIBBON DRIVEWAYS AND THEN JUST LEAVING IT AS IS? UM, IT WOULD JUST BE A SIMPLE AMENDMENT TO, FOR THAT ALL DRIVEWAYS BE RIBBON STRIPPED CONCRETE RIBBON STRIP E EXCEPT FOR THE TWO OR INCLUDING THE TWO THAT ARE UNDER BUILDING. I, I THINK, UH, COMMISSIONER VASQUEZ ALL DRIVEWAYS RIBBON STRIP TO INCLUDE PARKING UNDER THE STRUCTURES ON LOT 24 AND 29. OKAY. SO THEN I WOULD AMEND THE MOTION TO APPROVE AS SUBMITTED BY APPLICANT WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS THAT INCLUDE PARKING AS SUBMITTED AS RIBBON [01:25:01] DRIVEWAYS TO INCLUDE THE TWO THAT ARE UNDER STRUCTURE. AND A MOTION DOES THE SECOND CONCUR. CONCUR. OKAY. FURTHER DISCUSSION. MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE? GIBBS? AYE. SAVINO? AYE. VELASQUEZ AYE. ZUKA. AYE. VASQUEZ. AYE. CERVANTES? YES. HOLLAND. AYE. AND FETZER AYE. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 12. ITEM 12 ON THE H D R C AGENDA, CASE NUMBER 2023 DASH 4 11 23 0 5 ROOSEVELT AVENUE, 2300 ROOSEVELT AVENUE, THREE 10 EIDS AVENUE AND THREE 11 EIDS AVENUE. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO ONE INSTALL ONE DOUBLE-SIDED APPROXIMATELY SEVEN AND A HALF BY 19 FOOT. MONUMENT SIGN AT 2305 ROOSEVELT TOTALING APPROXIMATELY 285 SQUARE FEET. UM, ITEM TWO HAS ACTUALLY BEEN WITHDRAWN FROM THE REQUEST. UM, ITEM THREE INSTALL AN APPROXIMATELY SEVEN AND A HALF BY 19 FOOT SINGLE-SIDED MONUMENT SIGN AT THREE 10 EIDS TOTALING APPROXIMATELY 142 SQUARE FEET. UM, AND THE EXISTING MONUMENT SIGNS ON SITES WILL BE REMOVED. STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF ITEMS ONE THROUGH THREE BASED ON FINDINGS A THROUGH E WITH THE FOLLOWING STIPULATIONS THAT THE SIGN PROPOSED FOR 2305 ROOSEVELT BE REDUCED TO 50 SQUARE FEET PER FEET, TOTAL PER SIGN, AND LESS THAN FIVE FEET. AND HEIGHT IS NOTED IN FINDING C TWO THAT BOTH BASES, UH, THE BASES OF BOTH SIGNS PROPOSED FOR 2305 ROOSEVELT BE CONSTRUCTED OR FACED WITH REGIONALLY SOURCED SANDSTONE OR LIMESTONE OF DIFFERENT SHADES AND COLORS. UM, WE DON'T HAVE ANY VOICEMAILS OR LETTERS FOR THIS AND THE APPLICANT, CARTER THURMOND IS HERE IN PERSON. UH, MR. THURMOND WOULD LIKE TO INTRODUCE YOURSELF. CARTER THURMAN COMMENT SIGNS. DO YOU WANNA TAKE US THROUGH YOUR REQUEST? I'M SORRY? DO YOU WANNA TAKE US THROUGH YOUR REQUEST? SURE. SO, UH, LIGHTHOUSE FOR THE BLIND HAS CHANGED THEIR NAME TO FABRIC WORKS AND THEY'RE INTERESTED IN GETTING A WHOLE NEW SET OF SIGNS. UM, AND WHAT, WHAT THEY'RE WE'RE PLANNING ON DOING AT THE 2305 ROOSEVELT IS, THERE ARE TWO SIGNS WE'RE TAKING DOWN. ONE IS 30 FOOT LONG BY EIGHT FOOT TALL, WHICH IS, UH, A HUNDRED, EXCUSE ME, 168 SQUARE FEET. AND THEN THERE'S A SMALLER ONE WE'RE TAKING DOWN, WHICH IS 19 SQUARE FEET. SO IT'S A TOTAL OF 180 7. THE NEW SIGN WE'RE PROPOSING IS 1 44 SQUARE FEET ACROSS THE STREET AT 2300. WE'RE GONNA REMOVE A SIGN THAT IS, UH, 40 SQUARE FEET AND INSTALL ONE THAT IS 48, UH, EXCUSE ME, 41 SQUARE FEET ON EIDS AT 3 1 1 EIDS. WE ARE REMOVING A SIGN THAT IS 84 SQUARE FEET, AND THEN ACROSS THE STREET AT THREE 10, WE'RE REMOVING ONE THAT'S A HUNDRED, UH, 12 SQUARE FEET. AND THAT ONE WILL BE REPLACED WITH A SIGN THAT IS SEVEN FOOT SEVEN BY 19. SO TOTAL WE'RE REMOVING MORE SIGNAGE THAN WE'RE PUTTING UP, BUT THE NEW SIGNS ARE LIT, BUT THEY ARE LIT WITH REVERSE LIT LETTERS. OKAY, THANK YOU. UM, QUESTION ABOUT STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION ABOUT LOWERING THE MONUMENT SIGNS TO NO MORE THAN FIVE FEET. YOUR THOUGHTS ON THAT? UM, THEY COULD PROBABLY GET LOWERED A LITTLE BIT, BUT THERE'S A LOT OF, THERE IS A LOT OF SPARE, UH, ROOM UNDERNEATH THE LETTERS AND I JUST HAVE TO GO BACK TO THEM TO SEE IF THEY'RE INTERESTED IN DOING THAT. OKAY. THANK YOU. IF YOU LOOK AT THEIR OLD SIGNS, THEY'VE, THEY'VE LIVED WITH THESE SIGNS FOR, I DON'T KNOW, A HUNDRED YEARS AND THEY'RE JUST TRYING TO SPRUCE IT UP A LITTLE BIT. RIGHT. AND CAN YOU SPEAK TO THE, UM, MATERIALS THAT YOU'RE PROPOSING, ESPECIALLY FOR THE BASE, UH, STAFF IS RECOMMENDING THAT, UH, PERHAPS A SANDSTONE OR LIMESTONE, [01:30:01] UH, BASE BE USED AND YOUR, UH, YOUR THOUGHTS AND YOUR CLIENT'S THOUGHTS ON THE, UH, MATERIAL YOU'RE PROPOSING? THE MATERIAL THAT WE'RE USING IS ALUMINUM AND IT'S PAINTED. UM, WE CAN PO PAINT IT A FAUX LOOKING STUCCO THAT COULD RESEMBLE A, UH, A SANDSTONE. IT, IT'S NOT PERFECT, BUT IT, IT IS JUST BETTER THAN A ALUMINUM FINISH. OKAY. THANK YOU. OTHER QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? HAVE Y'ALL, COMMISSIONER VA? SORRY SIR. HAVE Y'ALL THOUGHT ABOUT, UH, REUSING SOME OR RECREATING SOMETHING SIMILAR TO THE LARGER SA LIGHTHOUSE FOR THE BLIND SIGN WITH THE NICE DETAIL TO IT AND NOTHING THAT STICKS OUT SO MUCH LIKE THIS NEW VIBRANT WORKS THING? WE'RE, WE'RE GOING ON THE INSTRUCTIONS OF, UH, VIBRANT WORKS AND SO THIS WAS A LOT OF THEIR IDEAS WITH THEIR ARCHITECT, BUT ARE THEY AWARE OF THE BEING WITHIN A RIO AND BEING WITHIN THE HISTORIC? YES, SIR. OTHER QUESTIONS? COMMISSIONER HOLLAND, DID YOU, WHAT, DO YOU KNOW WHAT THE SIZE IS OF THE, THE CURRENT SIGN? I, THE ONE ON ROOSEVELT IN FRONT OF THE BUILDING, THE ONE THAT HAS THE ALAMO FACADE, IT'S 30 FOOT WIDE BY EIGHT FOOT TALL, ALTHOUGH IT HAS SOME CURVATURE. IT'S 30 FOOT WIDE. YES. SORRY, THERE'S NOT A GOOD PICTURE. ARE WE SURE. I MEASURED, IT'S THE ONE ON E'S. ALRIGHT, ON 2305. YEAH, 20. I'M LOOKING AT THE ONE ON 2300. I'M SORRY, 2300 IS, UM, JESS, THERE'S A PICTURE SOMEWHERE IN THE PACKET MAYBE FURTHER UP. I ALSO HAVE DIMENSIONS, JUST LET ME OPEN THEM UP REAL QUICK. THE ONE ON THREE 10 EADS IS A GOOD EXAMPLE. OKAY. THAT ONE RIGHT. IF YOU, WHERE, WHERE I'M GOING IS TRYING TO KEEP WITH THE SAME SIZE AS AS WHAT IS THERE, ASSUMING THAT IF IN DISCUSSION THE COMMISSION DECIDED THAT, UM, AND I'M NOT SURE HOW TO GET THERE JUST YET, BUT WELL, 2300 HAS A 40 FOOT SQUARE FOOT SIGN AND WE WERE GONNA REPLACE IT WITH THE 1 41 SQUARE FOOT SIGN. OKAY. UM, MR. CHAIR TO MAKE A MOTION AND WE CAN GET INTO DISCUSSION. UH, UH, ONE MOMENT. COMMISSIONER SAVINO HAS A QUESTION. YES, SIR. I HAVE ONE OTHER QUESTION, AND THIS WAS ASKED EARLIER BY ANOTHER COMMISSIONER, BUT I'M GONNA ASK IT MAYBE IN A LITTLE DIFFERENT WAY. DO YOU THINK YOU AND YOUR CLIENT CAN BE AMENABLE TO, UH, A REDESIGN OF THE SIGNS TO TAKE INTO ACCOUNT THE MASONRY REQUIREMENT FROM THE GUIDELINES AS WELL AS TO ADDRESS THE HEIGHT CONCERNS AND THEN BEGIN TO, AND RATHER THAN US SORT OF, YOU KNOW, PINCH AND PULL HERE, MAYBE YOU AND YOUR CLIENT CAN WORK ON THAT? SURE. WE COULD MAKE SOME CHANGES. OKAY. OKAY. SO VELAZQUEZ KIND OF A SPECIFIC MOTIONS. I'M WANNA MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE WITH STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS. ONE FOR THE ROOSEVELT LOCATION AND ONE IN TWO FOR THE, UM, LOCATION WITH THE BUILDING THAT IS A STUCCO BASED BUILDING. SO THERE, THERE ARE TWO ON ROOSEVELT, ONE ACROSS THE STREET FROM EACH OTHER. UH, WELL, ROOSEVELT DIFFERENT THAN THE EIDS. YES. SO THOSE ARE THE TWO DIFFERENT LOCATIONS. SECOND MOTION AND SECOND DISCUSSION. OKAY. MR. CHAIR LOOKING AT THE BUILDINGS AND YOU, YOU KNOW, DISTRICT THREE IS WHERE THIS PROJECT IS LOCATED, AND THERE THERE'S ALWAYS BEEN, YOU KNOW, UM, A CONTRADICTION IN, IN THE, THE MODERN MASONRY BUILDING AND THE ALAMO ESQUE SIGN, THEY'VE ALWAYS KIND OF JARRED WITH EACH OTHER. UM, THE, THE MODERNNESS OF THE BUILDING, I CAN SEE PARTICULARLY WITH THE COMMON, UH, OR, OR THE DIRECTION THAT COMMISSIONER SAVINA WAS GOING IN, IN THE LACK OF MASONRY IN THE DETAIL OF THE, UH, SIGN IN THE ROOSEVELT ENVIRONMENT BECAUSE OF THE BRICK, THE HEAVY BRICK AND ALL THOSE THINGS. BUT THAT'S NOT ADDRESSED IN THE RECOMMENDATION, SO I DIDN'T WANT TO TOUCH IT IN THE, IN THE MOTION. NOW IN THE OTHER LOCATION WHERE THERE'S A STUCCO BASE, UH, OR A STUCCO BASED BUILDING, IF YOU LOOK AT THE AWNING, THE AWNING HAS MUCH OF THE SAME FEEL OF THAT LIGHTWEIGHT ALUMINUM. SO, SO THEY CAN WORK TOGETHER, BUT PROVIDED THAT [01:35:01] THERE'S SOME WAY TO BRING IN, EVEN IN THE SENSE OF THE BASE, RIGHT, THAT PERHAPS THAT'S THE STUCCO, BUT THAT THAT BROWN ALUMINUM IS STILL ABLE TO FIND ITS WAY TO RELATE WITH THE, I DON'T KNOW IF THERE ARE AUTO AWNINGS OR PEDESTRIAN AWNINGS ON THE BUILDING. SO THOSE ARE MY THOUGHTS. I JUST, YOU KNOW, TO, TO GET US OFF THE GROUND IN TERMS OF, UH, OF HAVING A DISCUSSION ABOUT IT, UH, IT'S PERHAPS THAT THERE IS SOME ADDRESSING MASONRY ON THE ROOSEVELT LOCATION THAT'S NOT IN THE STAFF'S, UH, RECOMMENDATIONS. AND THEN ON THE OTHER THAT, UM, THAT, THAT THE SECOND ITEM OF THE RECOMMENDATION STANDS, AND THAT ON BOTH THE HEIGHT, IT, IT'S A SIGN NOT A WALL, RIGHT? SO WHEN WE GET TO EIGHT, SEVEN FEET, IT, IT'S A WALL. SO, YOU KNOW, WE, WE NEED TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO HELP GET THIS THING DOWN TO A, A A A GROUND SIGN HEIGHT. THOSE ARE MY COMMENTS. THANK YOU. OTHER COMMENTS? CAN I JUST ASK A POINT OF CLARIFICATION TO MAKE SURE I WROTE IT DOWN CORRECTLY? YES. SO YOU WANT BOTH STIPULATIONS FOR THE ROOSEVELT, OR I'M SORRY, THE FIRST STIPULATION ABOUT HEIGHT ONLY FOR THE ROOSEVELT SIGNS AND THEN THE CLADDING FOR THE EID SIGNS? NO, NO, THE, THE, THE STIPULATION FOR HEIGHT ON BOTH THE, THE, YOU KNOW, THE FIVE FOOT, UH, UH, THE MATERIALITY ON THE ROOSEVELT SIDE, UH, THE BRICK IS NOT REALLY, UH, COVERED IN THE, UM, UH, STIPULATION TWO. AND, AND THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT, YOU KNOW, LIMESTONE IS NOT NECESSARILY THE APPROPRIATE MATCHING PARTNER FOR BRICKS. SO, YOU KNOW, BUT IT'S NOT ADDRESSED. SO I DIDN'T ADDRESS IT. BUT ON THE OTHER WHERE YOU MENTIONED LIMESTONE AND WE KNOW THAT THE BUILDING IS A STUCCO, UH, MAJORITY THAT, THAT, THAT MAKES SENSE. SO, SO THE MOTION IS FOR ONE ON BOTH AND TWO ON JUST THE LOCATION OTHER THAN ROOSEVELT. DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? WOULD YOU CONSIDER I WORK BACKWARDS. WOULD YOU CONSIDER ALTERING OR AMENDING THE SECOND STIPULATION TO JUST REFER TO MASONRY APPROPRIATE, MASONRY APPROPRIATE? AH, YES. THAT, THANK YOU. THAT, THAT MAYBE THE TERMINOLOGY OR THE TERMINOLOGY THAT WE WOULD USE FOR THE STIPULATION ON BOTH. IT WOULD BE, UH, NUMBER ONE FOR BOTH AND NUMBER TWO FOR BOTH. BUT THE LANGUAGE WOULD CHANGE FROM THE SPECIFICITY THAT YOU USED TO MASONRY. SECOND STANCE. OKAY. ANY OTHER DISCUSSION? HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE. GIBBS? AYE. SAVINA? AYE. VELASQUEZ? AYE. ZUKO? AYE. VASQUEZ. AYE. CERVANTES? YES. HOLLAND. AYE. AND FETZER. AYE. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU. AGENDA ITEM 13. ITEM 13 ON THE AGENDA. H D R C CASE NUMBER 2023 DASH 4 0 6 4 24 EAST COURTLAND PLACE. THE APPLICANT REQUESTED CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO REMOVE A BRICK CHIMNEY STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF CHIMNEY REMOVAL BASED ON FINDING. C. STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT CHIMNEY BE RETAINED AND REPAIRED IN PLACE. UM, I JUST WANTED TO NOTE, UM, THE APPLICANT DIDN'T CONFIRM ATTENDANCE AT THE HEARING, BUT HE DID CONFIRM IN WRITING HIS INTENT TO, UH, SALVAGE THE BRICKS AND RECONSTRUCT THE CHIMNEY IN KIND, WHICH IS ELIGIBLE FOR ADMINISTRATIVE APPROVAL. OH, AND WE HAVE, OH, JUST KIDDING. I'M SORRY. ARE YOU GILBERT? YEAH. OKAY. PROTRACT WHAT? I SAID. UM, SO, UH, GILBERT PERLES IS HERE IN PERSON. UM, I BELIEVE WE HAVE ONE, UH, LETTER ON FILE AND ONE PERSON SIGNED IN TO SPEAK. GOOD AFTERNOON, GILBERT PERALES. UH, SIX 14 WISHING STAR, UH, SAN ANTONIO. UH, YEAH, I, I OVERREACTED WHEN I, WHEN I SAID REMOVE THE CHIMNEY, UH, MY INTENT HAS ALWAYS BEEN TO REPLACE IT TO, TO REPAIR IT. UH, AND I KNOW THAT I, I SENT, UH, ADDITIONAL INFORMATION, UH, TO THE OFFICE. NEVER DEALT WITH YOU GUYS BEFORE. SO, YOU KNOW, IT'S A, IT'S A NEW GAME FOR ME, BUT, UH, MY INTENT HAS ALWAYS BEEN TO, TO REBUILD AND, AND, UH, AND REPAIR IT. UH, THE INTENT TO, UH, TO REPLACE TO, TO, TO TEAR IT DOWN WAS REALLY BECAUSE OF THE WAY IT'S LEANING. I DON'T KNOW IF YOU HAVE ANY PICTURES, BUT AFTER, UH, ABOUT A MONTH AGO, WE HAD A, A PRETTY STRONG, UH, RAIN. THE HOUSE HAS BEEN FOUNDATION HAS BEEN WORKED ON ABOUT 10 YEARS AGO. DID NOT INCLUDE OBVIOUSLY THE, UH, THE FIRE, THE FIRE STRUCTURE. IT'S A REALLY TALL, UH, HOUSE AND YOU CAN SEE HOW IT'S LEANING. MY BIGGEST CONCERN WAS THAT, UH, IT WOULD FALL INTO THE HOUSE, DAMAGE MORE PROPERTY AND, UH, AND OR HURT SOMEBODY THAT LIVES IN THERE. THAT'S WHY MY REACTION INITIALLY. BUT, UH, I CONCUR WITH STAFF. [01:40:01] I, I DO WANNA REPLACE IT. I MEAN, I DO WANNA REPAIR IT AND, UH, STRAIGHTEN IT UP . SO THAT'S, THAT'S REALLY IT. OKAY. THANK YOU. AND WE HAVE, UH, PERSON TO BE HEARD. YEAH. RICKY KUSHNER. HAVE A SEAT. THANK YOU. I HOPE THE APPLICANT WILL. UH, OH. FIRST OF ALL, I'M FREDERICA KUSHNER . I LIVE AT 4 0 5 EAST MERLE STREET, 7 8 2 1 2. I HOPE THE APPLICANT WILL, UM, ACCEPT MY APOLOGY. I'M GOING TO READ THIS AND IT WAS WRITTEN BEFORE WE KNEW ABOUT, UH, THE RECENT ANNOUNCEMENT ABOUT THE REBUILDING. UH, BUT I WOULD LIKE TO READ THE STATEMENT BECAUSE I'VE TOLD MY PEOPLE THAT I WOULD DO THAT. . UM, THIS, UH, CONCERNS, UH, H D R CASE 20 23 4 0 6, UH, 4 2 4 EAST, UH, COURTLAND. UM, THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMITTEE HAS NOT BEEN APPROACHED BY THE OWNER CONCERNING THIS PROPOSED PROJECT. MOST HOUSES BUILT BEFORE 1940 AND TOBIN HILL HAD CHIMNEYS. THEY MAKE A STATEMENT ABOUT THE ARCHITECTURAL STYLE AND PERIOD IN WHICH THE HOUSE WAS BUILT AND ARE A PART OF THE PICTURE A HOUSE PRESENTS. THIS WAS THE NORM IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD, BUT SOME HOUSES HAVE BEEN BADLY MAINTAINED AND HAVE LOST IDENTIFYING CHARACTERISTICS SUCH AS PORCH COLUMNS, RAILINGS, EXTENDED OR DECORATIVE RA RAFTER TAILS AND CHIMNEYS. THE HISTORIC DESIGN GUIDELINES EMPHASIZE RETAINING ORIGINAL MATERIALS AND FEATURES WHEREVER POSSIBLE. AND CHIMNEYS ARE NO EXCEPTION. WITH THIS IN MIND, WE ASK THE COMMISSION TO ANAI THE REQUEST TO REMOVE THE CHIMNEY AT 4 24 EAST CORTLAND PLACE. WE BELIEVE IT CAN BE STABILIZED AND BECOME AN ASSET TO THIS BUILDING. AND I WOULD ADD HERE, NOT ON THE LETTER, BUT, UM, IF THE CHIMNEY IS RECONSTRUCTED WITH THE ORIGINAL BRICKS, WE WOULD CERTAINLY, CERTAINLY APPROVE OF THAT. THAT'S, THAT'S IDEAL. UM, SO AS ALWAYS, WE THANK O H P STAFF FOR THEIR WORK ON THIS REQUEST AND WE THANK THE H D R C FOR THE CONSIDERATION OF THIS STATEMENT. THANK YOU. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. WITH THAT, CAN WE ENTERTAIN A MOTION? YES. I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS. SECOND. MOTION TO SECOND. ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? JUST FOR STIPULATIONS? INCLUDE A TIMELINE, I THINK. NO, THEY DO NOT. I THINK I WOULD ASK IF YOU'RE, IF YOU'RE COMFORTABLE JUST APPLYING A TIMELINE, UM, LIKE WITHIN SIX MONTHS OR THAT WAY WE CAN ENFORCE IT WELL WITH THE APPLICANT HERE. UH, YEAH. MR. PARA, DO YOU HAVE IDEA? DO YOU HAVE AN IDEA OF WHAT TIMELINE YOU REQUIRE? WELL, I ACTUALLY HAVE SOMEBODY COMING IN TOMORROW TO GIVE ME AN ESTIMATE ON, ON THE REPAIRS. 12 MONTHS. 12 MONTHS WOULD BE GOOD. THAT'D BE A LOT LESS, BUT YEAH, IT'D BE 12 MONTHS. THANK YOU, JUDGE. I CONCUR. HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE. GIBBS. AYE. SAVINA? AYE. VELAZQUEZ? AYE. ZUKA. AYE. VASQUEZ. AYE. CERVANTES? YES. HOLLAND. AYE. AND ZER. AYE. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. AGENDA ITEM 14. ITEM 14 ON THE AGENDA FIVE OH OH, I'M SORRY, H D R C CASE NUMBER 2023 DASH 4 12 5 0 1 FUR DRIVE. THE APPLICANT REQUESTS A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO ONE DEMOLISH THE DETACH GARAGE. TWO. CONSTRUCT A 757 SQUARE FOOT DETACHED GARAGE. THREE, CONSTRUCT A REAR COVERED PORCH. FOUR. REPLACE THE EXISTING METAL BACKYARD FENCE WITH A STUCCO CLAD C M U WALL FIVE. CONSTRUCT A CONCRETE FRONT PORCH WITH CONCRETE BALUSTRADE. SIX. REPLACE THE EXISTING SINGLE 15 LIGHT DOOR WITH FRENCH DOORS AND SEVEN, INSTALL AWNINGS AND SHUTTERS ON THE PRIMARY SOUTH AND EAST ELEVATIONS. STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF ITEM ONE, THE REQUEST TO DEMOLISH THE DETACHED GARAGE BASED ON FINDING C THROUGH F. SHOULD THE H D R C FIND DEMOLITION OF THE DETACHED GARAGE APPROPRIATE, THE APPLICANT MUST COMPLY WITH THE CITY'S DECONSTRUCTION ORDINANCE AND SELECT A CERTIFIED DECONSTRUCTION CONTRACTOR TO COMPLETE DECONSTRUCTION FORM SUBMISSION AND PERMITTING IN ACCORDANCE WITH U D C CHAPTER 12. ARTICLE TWO. AS NOTED IN FINDING G REGARDING ITEM TWO, NEW CONSTRUCTION OF A DETACHED GARAGE. SHOULD THE HT R C FIND DEMOLITION OF THE EXISTING GARAGE APPROPRIATE, THEN STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT ONLY CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL BE GRANTED AT THIS TIME BASED ON FINDING H WITH THE FOLLOWING STIPULATIONS. ONE THAT THE APPLICANT SUBMITS FULL MEASURED DRAWINGS AND MEASURED SITE PLAN IS NOTED IN FINDING H TWO THAT THE APPLICANT SUBMITS COMPLETE MATERIALS INFORMATION, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO MANUFACTURER'S SPECIFICATIONS FOR THE GARAGE DOOR AND PEDESTRIAN DOORS AS NOTED [01:45:01] IN FINDING H THREE, THAT THE APPLICANT REDUCES THE OVERALL FOOTPRINT OF THE PROPOSED GARAGE AS NOTED IN FINDING H FOUR THAT THE APPLICANT PROPOSES A SPLIT BAY GARAGE DOOR AS NOTED IN FINDING I FIVE, THAT THE APPLICANT MEETS ALL SETBACK STANDARDS AS REQUIRED BY CITY ZONING REQUIREMENTS AND OBTAINS A VARIANCE FROM THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT OF APPLICABLE, A DEMOLITION PERMIT WILL NOT BE APPROVED UNTIL REPLACEMENT PLANS ARE REVIEWED AND APPROVED BY THE H D R C H D R C VIA APPLICATION FOR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS AND CONSTRUCTION. PERMITS ARE PULLED FOR THE SCOPE OF WORK. STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF ITEM THREE, ADDITION OF A REAR COVERED PORCH BASED ON FINDING J WITH THE FOLLOWING STIPULATIONS. ONE THAT THE APPLICANT SUBMITS FULL MEASURED DRAWINGS FOR THE PROPOSED COVERED PORCH TO STAFF FOR REVIEW. TWO, THAT THE APPLICANT SUBMITS FULL MEASURE DRAWINGS FOR THE TREATMENT OF THE NORTH ELEVATION BEYOND THE PROPOSED COVERED PORCH. THREE, THAT THE FENESTRATION PATTERN, INCLUDING DOORS AND WINDOWS, IS RETAINED ON THE NORTH ELEVATION BEYOND THE PROPOSED COVERED PORCH. STAFF. DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF ITEMS FOUR THROUGH SEVEN BASED ON FINDINGS K THROUGH M. UM, I DON'T BELIEVE WE HAVE ANY VOICEMAILS OR LETTERS FOR THIS ONE. UM, WE HAVE ARCHITECT CHARLES TODD HILTON AND OWNER OF DEBBIE SANDS WITH US VIA WEBEX. MR. HILTON, CAN YOU UNMUTE YOURSELF? HELLO? YES SIR, WE CAN HEAR YOU. HEY, NICE TO TALK TO YOU GUYS. UM, I'M CHARLES AND DEBBIE, THE HERE WITH ME. HOW ARE Y'ALL? I CAN'T SPEAK FOR EVERYONE, BUT I THINK WE'RE GOOD. OKAY. UM, I GUESS ON THE OPTION, WHAT I WANTED TO KNOW ON THE, UM, ON THE NUMBER ONE, THE DEMOLITION OF DETACHED GARAGE, UM, ARE, ARE Y'ALL SAYING THAT WE, WE ARE NOT ALLOWED TO DEMOLISH IT EVEN WITH A PERMIT? OR, OR ARE YOU SAYING THAT IF WE HAVE THE, THE, THE BUILDING PERMITS, WHICH WE WILL GET THAT WE'LL BE ABLE TO DEMOLISH THE GARAGE AND, AND THEN THE, OF COURSE BUILDING A NEW GARAGE IS SEPARATE, BUT I'M JUST, UH, CURIOUS ABOUT THE DEMOLITION PART SINCE THE, UM, THE EXISTING GARAGES, YOU KNOW, OF A DIFFERENT MATERIAL AND COLOR AND THE, YOU KNOW, THE EXISTING STONE HOME AND IT'S ACTUALLY, YOU KNOW, THE, THE SIDING IS FALLING APART. IT HAS A, A CRACK IN THE FOUNDATION. AND ANYWAY, THAT, THAT'S THE, THAT'S THE FIRST PART I WAS GONNA ASK. SO I'M CURIOUS ABOUT THE DEMOLITION PART. WELL, STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND DEMOLITION OF THE GARAGE, AND THAT IS ONE OF THE ITEMS THAT, UH, THE COMMISSION HERE WILL DISCUSS. I ALSO, I'M SORRY TO INTERRUPT, BUT THERE IS ONE LETTER ON FILE AND A VOICEMAIL AS WELL. I JUST DIDN'T UPDATE MY NOTES. SO STAFF WILL DISCUSS, UH, THE PROS AND CONS OF DEMOLITION OF THE, UH, GARAGE. AND DEPENDING ON, UH, SHOULD THE COMMISSION APPROVE DEMOLITION, THEN, UH, UH, THE OTHER STIPULATIONS THAT STAFF HAD, UH, RECOMMENDED WOULD COME INTO PLAY. JUST TO CLARIFY STAFF'S POSITION, UM, IT'S, THE ISSUE IS A DOCUMENTATION ONE. UM, SO ANY PROPERTY IN A STORE DISTRICT THAT COMES FOR DEMOLITION, THERE HAS TO BE SOME SORT OF EFFORT MADE TO PROVE ECONOMIC HARDSHIP. WITH ACCESSORIES LIKE THIS, AT A MINIMUM, WE ASK FOR EITHER A CONTRACTOR'S ESTIMATE FOR REPAIRS OR SOMETHING FROM, YOU KNOW, AN EXPERT IN THE FIELD THAT SPEAKS TO THE DIFFICULTY TO REUSE OR ADAPT OR REPAIR THE STRUCTURE. AND IN THIS CASE, WE JUST DON'T HAVE IT. WE HAVE REPLACEMENT PLANS ONLY. AND MR. CHAIR, I HAVE A QUESTION FOR STAFF. UH, JUST A MOMENT. UH, LET THE APPLICANT FINISH THEIR, UH, PRESENTATION AND THEN WE DO HAVE A VOICEMAIL. OH, OKAY. UM, SO THAT WAS FOR THE DEMO, THE DEMOLITION, AND I CAN, I'M SURE I CAN COME UP WITH, UM, YOU KNOW, A HARDSHIP FOR THAT. BUT, AND THEN ON THE CONSTRUCTION OF A, THE NEW DETACHED GARAGE IN PLACE OF THE, THE ONE WE WOULD HOPE TO DEMOLISH, UM, WE UNDERSTAND THAT WE, WE'VE GONE OVER THE ALLOTTED SQUARE FOOTAGE FOR IT. UM, WE COULD MAKE THAT SMALLER, BUT WE WERE, WE WERE LOOKING TO TRY TO AT LEAST GET A 25 BY 25 FROM MODERN SIZED, UM, NEW GARAGE AND THEN OF COURSE MAKE IT LOOK LIKE IT MATCHES THE HOME IN BOTH, YOU KNOW, ROOF STYLE AND A STUCCO COLOR. UM, LET ME SEE. AND THEN, YOU KNOW, WE WERE ASKED ABOUT HAVING TWO SEPARATE GARAGE DOORS. WE'RE FINE WITH TWO GARAGE DOORS VERSUS THE ONE THAT'S, THAT'S NO BIG DEAL. UM, WE'RE, WE'RE FINE WITH THAT, BUT I GUESS THE SIZE OF IT AND THEN THE REPLACEMENT AND THEN OF COURSE, CAN WE PUT IT BACK IN THE SAME LOCATIONS THAT EXISTING GARAGE WAS, THAT, THAT'S KIND OF WHERE WE WERE ON THE, ON THE ISSUE NUMBER TWO. UM, AND THEN OF COURSE, ISSUE NUMBER THREE, THE CONSTRUCTION OF A, OF A REAR COVERED PORCH THAT WAS, YOU KNOW, APPROVED WITH A FEW ITEMS. YEAH, WE'RE FINE WITH THAT. WE JUST SAID WHEN WE FINISHED THE CONSTRUCTION DRAWINGS, WE WILL, WE'LL TURN IT IN ALL THAT DOCUMENTATION WITH IT. [01:50:01] AND THEN, LET'S SEE, NUMBER FOUR, REPLACE THE EXISTING METAL BACKYARD FENCE WITH STUCCO CLAD C M U WALL. I'LL LET, I'LL LET, UM, THE OWNER DEBBIE ADDRESS THAT. YEAH. UM, I'M ACTUALLY, I'M OKAY WITH NOT HAVING A STUCCO CLA C M U WALL, BUT I, WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO DO IS MATCH SEVERAL OF MY NEIGHBORS THAT HAVE, UM, LIKE STONE POSTS THAT MATCH THE STONE OF THE HOME WITH, UH, WROUGHT IRON IN BETWEEN THE POSTING SAYING THAT YEAH, YOU'RE SAYING THAT RIGHT? YEAH. YEAH. AND I HAVE MY NEIGHBOR RIGHT BEHIND ME HAS A FENCE THAT I WOULD LIKE TO COPY ACTUALLY, AND IT'S LIKE STONE POST AND IT HAS WROUGHT IRON IN BETWEEN THE POSTS. OKAY. AND THEN, LET'S SEE, NUMBER FIVE, UM, CONSTRUCT A CONCRETE FRONT PORCH WITH CONCRETE BATTLE STRING. UM, I WILL, I WILL TALK ABOUT WHAT'S EXISTING THERE. SO THE, THE EXISTING HOUSE HAS A, A SIDE, A PORTION OF A SIDE FRONT PORCH, AND THE FRONT PORCH HAS THE STEPS GOING UP, AND BOTH OF THEM ARE, THEY HAVE CRACKS IN THEM. AND WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO IS JUST, YOU KNOW, REMOVE THOSE, JUST THOSE FRONT STEPS AND THAT THERE'S A PORTION OF THE SIDE THAT YOU'LL SEE THAT, THAT LITTLE PIECE OF CONCRETE THAT'S KIND OF ON THE CORNER AND THEN RE YOU KNOW, THEN AFTER WE DO THAT, REBUILD A NEW MUCH BETTER LOOKING, UM, UNCOVERED FRONT PORCH IN FRONT OF THE HOUSE THERE TO, TO TIE IN THOSE TWO AREAS. AND AGAIN, SEVERAL OF MY NE MY NEIGHBORS, NEIGHBORS ACROSS THE STREET AND BEHIND ME HAVE UNCOVERED FRONT PATIOS THAT LOOK REALLY NICE. AND THEY ALSO HAVE, UH, EITHER WROUGHT IRON RAILING OR STONE POST WITH WROUGHT IRON IN BETWEEN. UH, BUT THERE ARE SEVERAL HOMES IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD THAT HAVE THE TYPE OF PORTS THAT I WOULD LIKE TO COPY. AND THEN, UM, NUMBER SIX, REPLACE THE EXISTING SINGLE 15 LIGHT DOOR OF THE FRENCH DOORS. DEBBIE, I'LL LET YOU HANDLE THIS ONE. UH, THAT'S THE FRIDGE DOORS ON THE, ON THE UPPER DECK. OH, ON THE TOP? YEAH. UH, I'M OKAY WITH THAT. I, I ACTUALLY LIKE THAT DOOR, ALTHOUGH, UM, I, I, I WOULD LIKE TO KEEP THAT SAME LOOK, BUT MAYBE HAVE TWO SEPARATE DOORS BECAUSE ON THE INSIDE I'D LIKE TO BE ABLE TO HAVE ENOUGH ROOM TO OPEN THE, TO KEEP THE DOORS OPEN AND HAVE A LITTLE BLANK SEATING AREA THERE. HMM. UM, YEAH, SO IT WOULDN'T, IT WOULDN'T CHANGE THE, IT WOULDN'T CHANGE THE STYLE OR LOOK, IT WOULD JUST BE TWO SEPARATE DOORS WITH, WITH, YOU KNOW, THE SAME TYPE OF WINDOWS IN THEM. YEAH, THE SAME LOOK JUST, BUT TWO NARROWER DOORS. AND THEN ITEM NUMBER SEVEN, INSTALL AWNINGS AND SHUTTERS IN THE PRIMARY SOUTH AND EAST ELEVATIONS. LET'S SEE. I'LL LET YOU SCROLL THROUGH. I CAN, YEAH, I CAN FURTHER THAT TOO, ACTUALLY. OH, OKAY. OKAY. I MEAN, I, I THINK SHUTTERS DRIVING AROUND THE NEIGHBORHOOD THERE ARE HOMES WITH SHUTTERS AND I THINK SHUTTERS ARE PRETTY, BUT, UM, I COULD TAKE THOSE OR LEAVE THOSE ACTUALLY . OKAY. BUT THAT'S ALL, I THINK THAT'S ALL THAT WE HAVE, UM, DECIDED, BUT THERE YOU GO. OKAY. THANK YOU. UH, CAN WE HAVE THE, YOU'RE WELCOME. CAN WE HAVE THE VOICEMAIL PLEASE? AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 14, CASE NUMBER 2 0 2 3 4 1 2 5 0 1 FUR DRIVE. WE THANK THE APPLICANT FOR SPEAKING TO INVEST IN THEIR HISTORIC HOME AND NOTE THAT THIS IS A DUPLEX BEING CONVERTED TO A SINGLE FAMILY HOME FOR ITEM ONE THROUGH SEVEN. NUMBER ONE, WE DISAGREE WITH STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION ON ITEM ONE FOR DEMOLITION OF THE GARAGE. ITEM TWO, WE SUPPORT CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL OF NEW CONSTRUCTION OF THE GARAGE. IF STAFF STIPULATIONS I THROUGH V ARE MET, WE ASK FOR CONSIDERATION THAT THE EXTERIOR WOULD CLADDING MATERIAL BE EITHER REUSED OR NEW, NO STUCCO AND A NEW TILE ROOF BE INSTALLED. NUMBER THREE, THE REAR COVERED PORCH. WE SUPPORT STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION, BUT ASK FOR CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL DUE TO THE LACK OF CONSTRUCTION DOCUMENTS FOR HOW THE ADDITION WILL TOUCH THE EXISTING HOME AND THE INACCURATE LOCATION OF THE REAR EXTERIOR DOORS ON THE ELEVATION SUBMITTED ONE OF THE DOORS HAS BEEN MOVED AND ITS LOCATION ENCLOSED. NUMBER FOUR THROUGH SEVEN, WE SUPPORT STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION FOR DENIAL OF ITEMS FOUR THROUGH SEVEN C M U WALLS, CONCRETE FRONT PORCH WITH A BALUSTRADE ALTERED THE FENESTRATION PATTERN ON THE FRONT ELEVATION OF A HOME. AND THE INTRODUCTION OF NIES ON THE FRONT ELEVATION DIRECTLY CONTRADICT THE HISTORIC DISTRICT FUNDAMENTAL GUIDELINES AND SEEKS TO ALTER THIS HOUSE TO ANOTHER TIME AND STYLE, WHICH IS NOT IN KEEPING WITH THE MONTICELLO PARK HISTORIC DISTRICT. THANK YOU FOR CONSIDERATION OF OUR COMMENTS. THANK YOU. SO QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT. COMMISSIONER VELAZQUEZ? [01:55:01] WELL, WELL, I I DON'T HAVE A QUESTION FOR STAFF ON THE, UH, GARAGE. LOOK, LOOKING AT THE CHARACTERISTICS OF THE GARAGE, IT APPEARS THAT IT'S ALREADY BEEN ALTERED MANY TIMES. SO THE SIDING IS NOT HISTORIC S SIGHTING, RIGHT? IT MAY BE THE SAME, IT MAY BE THE SAME SIZE BUILDING, BUT THE BUILDING ITSELF HAS ALREADY, LIKE, WHAT, WHAT IS REALLY LEFT OUTSIDE OF THE SHAPE OF THE HISTORIC INTEGRITY OF WHAT WOULD BE THERE OUTSIDE OF THE SHAPE. I DON'T, I DON'T THINK WE REALLY KNOW HOW IT'S BEEN ALTERED OVER TIME. UM, AND JUST TO REITERATE, SO THE CODE, UM, PROMPTS THE COMMISSION TO CONSIDER ECONOMIC HARDSHIP, BUT IF THAT CANNOT BE SUBSTANTIATED THROUGH DOCUMENTATION, THE COMMISSION CAN ALSO CONSIDER A LOSS OF SIGNIFICANCE. SO THAT IS ALSO SOMETHING YOU CAN CONSIDER IF YOU FEEL THAT ORIGINAL MATERIALS HAVE BEEN REMOVED OVER TIME. WELL, THAT, AND THAT'S, THAT'S WHY I'M GETTING AT IT'S, UH, BUT, BUT LOOKING FOR KIND OF AN EXPERT OPINION THAT, THAT Y'ALL ARE, BECAUSE I MEAN, THE SIDING IS, UM, SOMETHING THAT WE WOULDN'T APPROVE ON A NEW HOUSE. THE SIDING IS ON THE GARAGE, RIGHT? THE WOULD, EXCEPT THE LATTICE IS AN ENCLOSURE OF, UM, LIKE A LITTLE SIDE PORCH OR SOMETHING, BUT THE FORM OF THE, THE STRUCTURE, BUT THE WIDTH, THE WIDTH OF THE, THE VERTICAL WIDTH OF THE SIDING IS A, IS A, IS A WIDTH THAT IS FOUND IN HISTORIC MM-HMM. . YEAH, THIS IS LIKE A 19, UH, HISTORIC 1930S BUILDING. OKAY. I DON'T, UH, NECESSARILY AGREE WITH IT, BUT, UH, I ACCEPT YOUR, UH, TESTIMONY. I'LL PASS THE FLOOR. MR. CHAIR. THANK YOU. OTHER QUESTIONS? QUESTION FOR THE APPLICANT. UM, YOU'VE AGREED TO SOME OF STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS. YOU'VE MADE SOME, UH, SUGGESTED ALTERNATIVES TODAY. UH, SPECIFICALLY THE, THE FENCE AND, UH, UH, THE TWO GARAGE DOORS AND, AND, UH, THE FRENCH DOORS. UH, WOULD YOU BE AMENABLE TO ASKING FOR A CONTINUANCE SO THAT YOU CAN UPDATE YOUR DRAWINGS AND NOTES TO, UH, COINCIDE WITH WHAT YOU'VE, UH, AGREED TO TODAY? OH, OF COURSE. SURE. JUST SO WE'RE ALL CLEAR ON, UH, WHAT STAFF IS RECOMMENDING AND WHAT YOU'RE, UH, AGREEING TO. AND THEN, SO WE'VE GOT A, A FULL, UH, KNOWLEDGE OF WHAT, WHAT Y'ALL PROPOSE. MR. CHAIR, CAN I ASK A QUESTION LIKE, YES. COMMISSIONER HOLLAND, LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION? YES. UH, MAKE A MOTION TO CONTINUE THIS AND, AND HAVE THE APPLICANT WORK WITH STAFF ON THE PROPOSED RECOMMENDATIONS. SECOND. SECOND. CAN YOU, UH, PUT A WITH A, WITHIN A, UH, WITHIN A MONTH? OKAY. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND, YES. SECOND. ANY DISCUSSION? YES, SIR. I'D LIKE TO. WELL, UNLESS THE MR CHAIR, I JUST, JUST WANNA, UH, DO MY BEST TO, TO TO BE AS, UM, FORTHRIGHT AS POSSIBLE. YOU KNOW, WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THE DISCRETION OF COMMISSION WITH RESPECT TO WHAT OUR PURVIEW IS IN HISTORICAL CONTEXT, UM, CLEARLY THE EASIEST, UH, UH, PROCESS IS ONE THAT'S ADDRESSING AN EXISTING HISTORIC STRUCTURE THAT MEANS A BUILDING THAT IS ACTUALLY THERE AND THE PARTS AND PIECES THAT EXIST, THEY'RE, THEY'RE KIND OF THE GUIDELINE FOR WHAT DO WE DO NEXT? RIGHT? WE KINDA TALK TO THE BUILDING AND TALK TO THE BUILDING'S MATERIALITY, AND IT, IT'S, IT, IT TALKS BACK VERY EASILY WHEN IT CAN SAY, JUST LOOK AT ME. RIGHT? AND THIS IS ONE OF THOSE CIRCUMSTANCES WHERE I THINK WE HAVE TO BE VERY UPFRONT WITH THE APPLICANT THAT THE BUILDING HAS A PARTICULAR CHARACTERISTIC. THE COMMENTS THAT WERE MADE BY THE COMMUNITY THERE ARE SPOT ON. BUT BECAUSE THE BUILDING IS THERE AND THAT THAT SHOULD SET, YOU KNOW, UP, UH, YOU KNOW, SCENARIO FOR DISCUSSIONS IN THE FUTURE LOOKING AT THIS PROJECT, THAT THERE ARE SOME ASKS THAT, THAT CHANGE THE NATURE OF THIS BUILDING, WHICH IS, I MEAN, FOR, FOR ME, THE HARDEST SCENARIO BECAUSE IF THE BUILDING IS THERE AND IT HAS ITS CHARACTERISTICS, THEN EVERY EFFORT SHOULD BE MADE TO VALUE THOSE CHARACTERISTICS, TO RETAIN AT LEAST SPIRITUALLY RIGHT, TO RETAIN, UH, THE IDENTITY OF THIS, OF THIS PROJECT. SO IN, IN THE PROCESS [02:00:01] MOVING FORWARD, I, I, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT THE APPLICANT IS, IS, IS, UM, PREPARED FOR THAT LEVEL OF, I THINK, UH, INSPECTION OF, OF THE EXISTING STRUCTURE, THE EXISTING DESIGN, AND ITS CHARACTERISTICS WITHIN THE HISTORIC CONTEXT. THANK YOU, SIR. THANK YOU. OTHER COMMENTS? COMMISSIONER VASQUEZ. MR. CHAIR, THANK YOU FOR RE UM, SUGGESTING THE CONTINUANCE. I THINK THAT WOULD BE MOST APPROPRIATE BECAUSE IT SEEMS LIKE THERE'S A LOT OF INCOMPLETE INFORMATION AND I THINK, UH, THE CONTINUANCE WOULD ALLOW IT TO, UH, COME TOGETHER MORE CLEANLY. AND, UM, I DON'T AGREE WITH THE, OR I AGREE WITH STAFF ABOUT THE, I THINK THAT WAS WHAT IT WAS, UM, TO NOT DEMOLISH THE BUILDING. UH, IT COULD BE RESTORED, BUT WE'LL LET THE, I GUESS THE ENGINEERS, WHOEVER GO LOOK AT IT, UH, TO VERIFY. UM, BUT OTHERWISE I'M GLAD IT'S A CONTINUANCE AND LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING THAT HOME, UM, BECOME, UH, SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTS. THANK YOU, COMMISSIONER SINO. SORRY. OTHER COMMENTS? OKAY. AND, UH, ENCOURAGE THE APPLICANTS TO, UM, TALK TO THE NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION OR AT LEAST LISTEN TO THEIR, THEIR CONCERNS AS YOU, UH, UH, FINALIZE YOUR, UH, PROPOSAL. MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE? GIBBS? AYE. SAVINO? AYE. VELASQUEZ. AYE. MAZUA. AYE. VASQUEZ. AYE. CERVANTES? YES. HOLLAND. AYE. AND ZER. AYE. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU. WE LOOK FORWARD TO YOU COMING BACK. THANK YOU. AGENDA ITEM 15. ITEM 15 ON THE H D R C AGENDA, CASE NUMBER 2023 DASH FOUR OH. UM, THREE 10 EAST CAROLINA STREET. THE APPLICANT REQUESTS A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO ONE, REPLACE ONE WOOD AND ONE MODERN FRONT DOOR WITH TWO STEEL DOORS WITH DECORATIVE GLASS. AND TWO, REPLACE THE EXISTING STUCCO CLAD BRICK FRONT PORCH COLUMNS WITH WOOD POSTS ON STUCCO CLAD PIERS. STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF ITEM ONE, REPLACING TWO FRONT DOORS BASED ON FINDING C WITH THE FOLLOWING STIPULATION THAT THE APPLICANT PROPOSES A DOOR PRODUCT THAT CONFORMS TO HISTORIC DESIGN GUIDELINES, NAMELY A WOOD CRAFTSMAN STYLE DOOR FOR ALL REPLACEMENT DOORS. STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF ITEM TWO, REPLACING THE STUCCO CLAD BRICK FRONT PORCH COLUMNS WITH WOOD POSTS ON STUCCO CLAD PIERS BASED ON FINDING D STAFF RECOMMENDS THE COLUMNS BE RETURNED TO THEIR PREVIOUS CONDITIONS. AND WE HAVE, UH, THE APPLICANT, YVONNE BENTON, HERE IN PERSON. MY NAME IS YVONNE BENTON, UH, APPLICANT FOR THREE 10 EAST CAROLINA. I WANNA PREFACE THIS CONVERSATION IN SAYING THAT THIS IS MY FIRST GENERAL CONTRACTING, UH, JOB IN ABOUT, HMM, I'M GONNA DATE MYSELF ABOUT 25 YEARS. I STARTED IN THE COMMERCIAL REALM, WENT INTO EDUCATION, AND THAT'S WHERE I STILL LIVE. AND NOW I'M REENTERING THIS, UH, REALM HOPEFULLY TO RETIRE INTO, UH, REAL ESTATE AND GENERAL CONTRACTING SERVICES. UM, I AM REPRESENTING, OH, YOU CAN JUST, YEAH, THERE YOU GO. UH, THE INVESTORS THAT BOUGHT THE PROPERTY, UM, THEY ARE IN WASHINGTON STATE AND, UM, WE HAVE BEEN REMODELING THIS PROPERTY SINCE JUNE. I HAVE TWO EXISTING CERTIFICATES OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR THIS PROJECT. AND, UM, I'LL SAY IGNORANCE WAS PART OF ME NOT HAVING THIS PARTICULAR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS BECAUSE I WAS NOT SPECIFIC ENOUGH IN THE FIRST TWO OBTAINED. I WANNA ALSO SAY THANK YOU TO JESSICA AND COREY FOR ALLOWING ME TO BE PRESENT HERE, UM, BECAUSE OF THIS REVELATION. UM, I'M HERE NOW AT THE FEET OF YOUR DECISION MAKING PROCESSES. THIS IS ALL NEW TO ME, SO THANK YOU. THANK YOU. AND THE PHOTO YOU'RE SHOWING HERE? CORRECT. SO WE, WE DID THE PORCH POST BASED ON CONFORMANCE OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD. WE DIDN'T REALLY KNOW, WE HAD TO ASK. SO THIS PARTICULAR HOUSE IS IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD. IT'S THREE HOUSES DOWN ON THE SAME SIDE OF THE STREET. OKAY. THANK YOU. UH, QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? QUESTION FOR STAFF? YES. COMMISSIONER VA. UM, WHAT WAS, WHAT WERE THE OTHER TWO CFAS FOR? LET ME PULL THEM UP FOR YOU. HOLD ON ONE MOMENT. [02:05:02] YOU WANT ? OH, SO THERE WERE TWO RECENT CERTIFICATES OF APPROPRIATENESS, UM, THAT WERE APPROVED. UH, THE FIRST ON JUNE 21ST IS FOR, UM, REPAIRING THE REAR ACCESSORY STRUCTURE IN KIND, REPAINTING TRIM AND BODY OF REAR ACCESSORY AND REPLACING THE ROOF WITH IN KIND MATERIALS, EXCUSE ME. UM, AND THEN ANOTHER ISSUED ON JUNE 26TH. THAT IS FOR FOUNDATION REPAIR, REMOVING SECURITY BARS, REPAIRING STUCCO CLADDING, PREPARING TRIM OR REPLACING IN KIND, UM, PAINTING THE EXTERIOR, REPLACING THE COMPOSITION SHINGLE ROOF IN KIND AND REPLACING GUTTERS IN KIND. THANKS JESSICA. UM, WERE THE WINDOWS REPLACED AS WELL? NO, NO. THE APPLICANT RESTORED THE WINDOWS RATHER THAN REPLACING THEM. THOSE WERE EXISTING WINDOWS. OKAY. SO GOING BACK TO THE, THE PILLARS, I'M GONNA PULL UP AN OLDER PHOTO. UM, SO THIS WAS, UM, APPLICATION MATERIALS FROM THE, FROM YVONNE'S PREVIOUS APPLICATIONS FOR CFAS. UH, SO THIS WAS THE CONDITIONS, UM, PRIOR TO THE REPLACEMENT OF THE COLUMNS AND FRONT DOORS. SO THEY'RE ALREADY WITH THE, THE TIMBERS NOW. YES. THIS IS A, A POST-WORK REQUEST, SO THERE'S NO WAY IN, IS THERE A WAY TO BRING 'EM BACK LIKE THIS? UH, THEY'RE STUCCO CLAD BRICK, SO YES. MR. CHAIR, I HAVE A QUESTION. COMMISSIONER SAVINO FOR THANK YOU FOR THE APPLICANT. UM, OF THE STIPULATIONS OR RECOMMENDATIONS OF STAFF TO THE RECOMMENDATIONS OF STAFF, UM, ARE YOU ABLE TO FULFILL IT? NO. EITHER ONE OF THOSE. UH, AS FAR AS REPLACING THE COLUMNS TO THEIR EXISTING FORM IN OR THE DOORS REGARD THE DOOR, BOTH OF 'EM AS FAR AS, UM, ARE YOU ABLE TO, UH, REPLACE THE DOOR, UH, WITH A PRODUCT THAT IS, THAT CONFORMS TO THE HISTORIC DESIGN GUIDELINES? I WILL SAY THAT WE THOUGHT THAT THEY WERE REPLACED WITHIN THE GUIDELINES. WE DIDN'T. HISTORIC DESIGN GUIDELINES, UM, RECOMMEND DOORS BASED ON THE STYLE OF THE HOUSE, UM, AND ALSO RECOMMEND CLEAR GLASS FOR THE FRONT DOOR, FENESTRATION FRONT DOOR LIGHTS. CORRECT. AND, UM, IS, UH, A SELECTION OF DOOR STYLE OR GIVING THE APPLICANT DIRECTION TO THE STYLE OF THE HOUSE AND THE ERA IN WHICH IT WAS BUILT, IS THAT SOMETHING THAT STAFF CAN DO? YEP, THAT'S PART OF THE RECOMMENDATION ALREADY. OKAY. OKAY. UM, IS THAT SOMETHING THAT CAN BE FULFILLED? I, I GUESS I, I, I WOULD HATE TO SAY NO OUTRIGHT, BUT THOSE WEREN'T FREE AND THE DOORS THAT WERE IN PLACE WERE NOT USABLE, IF THAT MAKES SENSE. THEY WERE PRETTY RAGGEDY. SURE. UM, OFTENTIMES WHAT WE'LL DO IS WE'LL REPLACE WITH SALVAGE IF WE, IF WE'RE NOT, UH, WANTING TO BUY A BRAND NEW DOOR, UM, THERE ARE MANY SOURCES FOR SALVAGE DOORS THAT WILL PROBABLY BE CLOSER IN STYLE, UM, THAN THE ONES YOU'VE INSTALLED. SO THAT WOULD BE AN OPTION. UH, FOR THE COLUMN, THE COLUMN MODIFICATIONS THAT YOU'VE MADE. UM, WOULD YOU BE ABLE TO REVERT THOSE BACK TO THE ORIGINAL? UH, I WOULD SAY PROBABLY NOT THE EXACT, UM, WE DIDN'T MAKE 'EM IN THE FIRST PLACE, IF THAT MAKES SENSE. UM, WE COULD TRY, BUT WE'RE REALLY UP AGAINST THE TIMELINE AS FAR AS HAVING TO BE DONE WITH THIS PROJECT. UM, AND THESE MODIFICATIONS HAPPENED A LITTLE WHILE AGO, SO I, WE HAVE TO BE DONE WITH THIS PROJECT LIKE NEXT WEEK. OKAY. THANK YOU. YOU'RE WELCOME. MR. CHAIR? YES. COMMISSIONER CERVANTES. I HAVE A QUESTION FOR STAFF. SO STAFF, LOOKING AT THE PICTURES OF WHAT THE DOORS LOOKED LIKE PREVIOUSLY, WHICH ONE OF THOSE TWO DOORS MOSTLY CONFORMS TO THE GUIDELINES, IN YOUR OPINION? THE ONE ON THE LEFT, I THINK IT'S, UM, ALSO A HISTORIC AGE. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. YES. COMMISSIONER GIBBS. THANK YOU. SO, UM, VIOLATION CASES ALWAYS CATCH MY ATTENTION, AND SOMETHING YOU SAID, UM, WHEN YOU FIRST STARTED TO SPEAK WAS THAT YOU DIDN'T KNOW WE NEEDED PERMISSION. SO, UM, HELP ME TO UNDERSTAND THAT. SO YOU DIDN'T KNOW THAT THIS WAS HISTORIC OR, OR WHAT? SO YES AND NO. UH, ONCE WE, I FOUND OUT WHEN I CAME TO PULL THE BUILDING PERMIT THAT IT WAS HISTORIC, I IMMEDIATELY CONFORMED AND, AND ACTED. I FELT LIKE ACCORDINGLY IN, IN OBTAINING THE FIRST TWO CERTIFICATES. GOTCHA. AND I DO SEE THAT, YOU KNOW, ONCE THE VIOLATION WAS ISSUED THAT, YOU KNOW, YOU IMMEDIATELY APPLIED FOR IT, JUST LIKE YOU SAID THERE. SO, UM, [02:10:02] WITH THE, THE DOORS, YOU ALSO MENTIONED THAT, YOU KNOW, IT'S KIND OF FUNNY TO ME WHEN YOU SAY, WELL, YOU NOT, THEY'RE NOT CHEAP, YOU KNOW, THEY'VE ALREADY BEEN PAID FOR THINGS OF THAT NATURE, BUT, BUT THE THING IS, IS THAT, YOU KNOW, BEING THAT THEY, YOU ARE IN HISTORIC DISTRICT, WE HAVE TO FIND A WAY TO, YOU KNOW, REVERT THESE BACK, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE, UM, IF THE COMMISSION HERE, UM, DOESN'T APPROVE THAT. THEN YOU HAVE TO, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, YOU CAN ALWAYS APPEAL OUR DECISION, BUT YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE TO FIND A WAY TO KNOW TO MOVE THIS BACK. SO I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE YOU ARE AWARE OF THAT. SO AWARE THAT THERE'S AN APPEAL PROCESS? NO, NO, NO. NOT NECESSARILY APPEAL PROCESS. I'M SURE YOU PROBABLY DO KNOW THAT, BUT THAT THINGS SHOULD GO BACK TO WHERE THEY WERE BECAUSE YOU KNOW THAT YOU ARE IN THE STORY DISTRICT, AND SO THINGS NEED SHOULD BE CHANGED. I MEAN, MEET THE TIME PERIOD OF THE HOME IN THE AREA THAT YOU'RE IN. I, I HEAR YOU. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION IF THERE ARE. YES SIR. I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE WITH STAFF RECOMMENDATION, STIPULATION ONE AND TWO THAT ENABLES THE APPLICANT TO REPLACE THE COLUMN WITH THE ENCLOSURE SHAPE OF A COLUMN, NOT NECESSARILY THE BRICK MASONRY DESIGN THAT WOULD ENABLE THE APPLICANT TO USE A METAL PIPE AND TO FRAME OUT THAT SHAPE WITH PARTICULAR CONSIDERATION THAT IT WAS A STUCCO FINISH AND NOT A BRICK FINISH. SECOND MOTION AND A SECOND. ANY DISCUSSION? WELL, MR. CHAIR, LOOKING AT THE PICTURE OF THE FRONT, YOU KNOW, IT'S, IT'S, IT'S HARD TO SAY THAT THOSE COLUMNS ARE THE ORIGINAL COLUMNS. THERE'S SOMETHING ODD ABOUT 'EM, SOMETHING ODD ABOUT THE WAY THAT THEY'RE, THEY'RE PROPORTIONED AND THEN THE TWO DOOR SECTIONS, THEY, THEY CLEARLY HAD ALREADY HAD MODIFICATIONS TO THE DOORS. I DO AGREE THAT THE DOOR, YOU KNOW, THE WAY THAT YOU BUY DOORS NOWADAYS, THEY'RE, THEY'RE TYPICALLY ALL OF A PARTICULAR QUALITY AND NO MATTER WHAT THEY COST, THEY STILL LOOK LIKE THOSE DOORS. UH, BUT I DO, I DO AGREE. UH, YOU COULD PROBABLY FIND AN OLDER DOOR, AN OLD DOOR THAT WOULD GIVE YOU, THAT WOULD BRING BACK SOME OF THE TEXTURE THAT FRONT OF THAT HOUSE, BUT ALSO LOOKING AT SOME OF THE OTHER CHANGES THAT THERE HAVEN'T BEEN RED FLAGS ABOUT ANYTHING ELSE? I THINK THIS IS A VERY LIGHT ASK. UM, IF YOU GET RID OF THOSE WOODEN COLUMNS AND YOU, YOU RESHAPE THOSE COLUMNS, I THINK YOU'LL LIKE IT EVEN MORE, YOU KNOW? BUT WHEN YOU'RE, WHEN YOU'RE SAYING NOT TO INTERRUPT YOU, BUT WHEN YOU'RE SAYING RESHAPE, WHAT DO YOU MEAN? WELL, YOU, YOU TAKE THE DIMENSIONS AT THIS POINT, THEY MAY BE A, A GOOD GUESS OF THE DIMENSIONS, OF THE, UM, OF THE SHAPE OF THAT COLUMN. BE AND RECON RECONSTRUCT THEM NOT OUT OF BRICK, BUT THAT PROBABLY YOUR STRUCTURE COULD BE A PIPE INSIDE AND THAT YOU'RE, YOU'RE FRAMING AND YOUR STUCCO IN YOUR FRAMING. YEAH. I DON'T KNOW ANOTHER WAY TO SAY THAT EXCEPT TO, YOU KNOW, DRAW IT, BUT YOU, YOU'RE REALLY FRAMING THE SHAPE AND STUCCOING THE SHAPE. AND I DON'T WANT TO TELL YOU THAT YOU CAN DROP YOUR LOAD WITH A SHAPE, BUT YOU, YOU MAY DROP IT WITH A, WITH A PIPE. I DON'T KNOW. IT'S, THAT'S IT. THAT'S UP TO Y'ALL'S STRUCTURAL DECISION MAKING. OKAY. I'M GONNA PASS IT DOWN. OTHER COMMENTS, COMMISSIONER? YEAH. I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. UM, , HE'S SAYING THAT THERE'S NOT A REQUIREMENT TO PUT BACK BRICK SUPPORTS, BUT THE MOTION WOULD REQUIRE COLUMNS TO BE INSTALLED THAT LOOK LIKE THIS AND, AND DIMENSION AND SHAPE AND STUCCO AND, YEP. SO IT CAN BE ENC CASE. YOU CAN PUT, YOU CAN PUT AN ENCASEMENT AROUND IT AND THEN STUCCO IT, AND IT WOULD MATCH THE PARAMETERS OF THE ANGLES THAT ARE, EVEN IF THE ORIGINAL COLUMNS AFTER YOU REMOVE WHAT YOU SEE WAS A COLUMN OF BRICK, I THINK THEY'RE JUST TRYING TO GIVE YOU OPTIONS FOR RECREATING THE SHAPE OF THE PREVIOUSLY EXISTING COLUMNS. I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND. RIGHT. SO THEN IT WOULD KEEP YOU FROM HAVING TO TEAR THE WHOLE THING DOWN AND RE RUBRIC IT. YOU JUST BUILD ON IT AND COVER IT UP, AND IS THAT WHAT I'M UNDERSTANDING? YES. NO, COMMISSIONER SAVINO, UM, IT WOULD, THERE'S SOMETHING VERY DISTINCTIVE ABOUT THESE CHAMFORD COLUMNS OR THESE TILTED COLUMNS AND HOW THEY THEN OPEN UP WITH THE ARCH AT THE TOP. IT'S REALLY KIND OF DISTINCTIVE AND THAT'S WHAT'S BEING, WHAT'S MISSING. SO WITH THE MOTION THAT WAS MADE, ONE COULD STABILIZE THE TOP, TAKE AWAY [02:15:02] YOUR, THE COLUMNS THAT YOU HAVE BUILT AND REINSTATE THE STRUCTURAL REQUIREMENT FOR THAT PORCH, AND THEN CREATE A SHAPE OUT OF IT COULD BE WOOD FRAMING, IT COULD BE METAL LATH, IT COULD BE WHATEVER, AND THEN STUCCO THEM. BECAUSE WHAT WE'RE INTERESTED IN SEEING IS THIS UNIQUE ENTRYWAY. NOW YOU PROBABLY HAD A, DID YOU HAVE AN ENGINEER OR CONTRACTOR WORK WITH YOU ON THE COLUMNS THAT YOU HAVE OR THE SUPPORTS YOU HAVE NOW? CORRECT. GIVE THEM A CALL BACK THAT, THAT WOULD BE THE INDIVIDUAL THAT YOU WOULD COLLABORATE WITH TO RECREATE THE PHOTO ON PAGE 15. AND THEN HOW Y'ALL PUT IT TOGETHER IS UP TO YOU. OKAY. AND IT MAY BE THAT, UM, THE DIMENSIONS OF THE CANTED COLUMNS MIGHT BE THAT IT BASICALLY IN CASES WHAT YOU'VE ALREADY BUILT, UH, WITH SOME ADDITIONAL FRAMING AND LATH AND PLASTER TO GET THE SHAPE OF THE SLOPED COLUMNS. OKAY. THANK YOU. OTHER COMMENTS? YEAH. YEAH. I, I HAVE, I HAVE A QUESTION ON, I'M GOING BACK TO THE DOOR JUST SO THAT I UNDERSTAND. ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT THE, THE, THE, THE, THE, THE FRAMING OF THE DOOR STAFF? ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT THOSE THREE WINDOWS OR THE COLOR? WHAT, WHAT ARE YOU, WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT WHEN YOU SEE THAT LEFT DOOR? OH, FOR THE ORIGINAL ONE? YES. YEAH, THAT'S A CRAFTSMAN STYLE DOOR. IT'S, UM, SORT OF A, A CHARACTER DEFINING STYLE OF CRAFTSMAN HOUSES, THE THREE HIGH DIVIDED LIGHTS, AND THEN SORT OF THE PROPORTIONS OF THE LIGHTS TO THE REST OF THE DOOR AS WELL. UM, CRAFTSMAN DOORS ARE PRETTY COMMONLY FOUND AT BIG BOX STORES, UM, AND ALSO AT RESALE SHOPS. RIGHT. I JUST, I GUESS I DON'T SEE THE DESIGN ON THE ORIGINAL, 'CAUSE THE PICTURE'S KIND OF BLURRY. I'M TRYING TO SEE WHAT, UH, HOW THAT DIFFERS OTHER THAN THE WINDOWS, UH, FROM THE, WHAT'S ALREADY ON THERE? THE MATERIALS ALSO A CONCERN. SO STAFF IS STIPULATING. IT'D BE A WOOD DOOR. UM, AND SO THE DOORS INSTALLED ARE, ARE THEY STEEL OR FIBERGLASS? SO THAT'S, THAT'S ONE OF THE ISSUES AS WELL. OKAY, GOT IT. I ASSUMED, I THOUGHT THE ONE, THE ONES INSTALLED WERE WOOD. THAT'S WHY I WAS ASKING THAT THEY WERE BROWN IN COLOR. SO THEY'RE NOT WOOD. NO. OKAY. OKAY. COMMISSIONER VASQUEZ? YES, SIR. OH, I WAS JUST GOING TO, IT WAS ALREADY MENTIONED, BUT ABOUT RECONSTRUCTING THE, THE COLUMNS AND, OKAY. THANK YOU. I'M IN AGREEMENT WITH MY COLLEAGUES. ANY LAST COMMENTS? HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE. GIBBS? AYE. SAVINA? AYE. VELASQUEZ? AYE. ZUKA. AYE. BASQUEZ. AYE. CERVANTES? YES. HOLLAND. AYE. AND FETZER. AYE. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU. SO MS. BIDDEN, IF YOU WORK WITH, UH, STAFF AND SO WE CAN GET THE COLUMNS RIGHT? SURE. WHAT IS THE TIMELINE? I GUESS IT'S NOT GONNA BE DONE IN THE NEXT COUPLE WEEKS. WE'RE PROBABLY GONNA GET THE HOUSE, PROBABLY YES. WHEN THE TIMELINE TIMELINE WAS NOT AS, AS SOON AS YOU WANT. WE'RE, WE'RE NOT GONNA DEL I MEAN, AS FAST AS YOU CAN DO IT, WE'RE HERE TO GET, I, I DON'T KNOW HOW FAST I CAN GET IT DONE WITH OTHER, UH, THINGS GOING ON ON THE PROPERTY. I'M JUST NOT, OKAY. SO JUST TO STATE THIS, UM, SO STAFF WON'T BE ABLE TO APPROVE ANY OTHER SCOPES OF WORK ON THE HOUSE UNTIL THOSE ARE BROUGHT INTO COMPLIANCE. UM, AS SOON AS YOU GIVE US PLANS TO REPLACE THE FRONT COLUMNS AND THEN, UH, UPDATED SPECIFICATIONS FOR A REPLACEMENT DOOR PRODUCT, WE CAN APPROVE. THANK YOU. AGENDA ITEM 16 WAS WITHDRAWN BY THE APPLICANT. SO AGENDA ITEM 17. AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 17, H D R C CASE 2023 DASH 4 0 4, UM, SEVEN 16 SHERMAN STREET. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO REMOVE AND REPLACE ALL EXISTING WOOD WINDOWS WITH ALUMINUM AND VINYL WINDOWS. MY APOLOGIES, WOOD AND ALUMINUM WINDOWS WITH VINYL WINDOWS. ONE SECOND. STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THE REPLACEMENT OF WOOD WINDOWS BASED ON FINDINGS B THROUGH G. STAFF RECOMMENDS APPLICANT REPAIR THE WOOD WINDOWS, THE WOOD WINDOWS WITH IN-KIND MATERIALS. THIS WOULD INVOLVE THE RECONSTRUCTION OF WINDOWS USING SALVAGE PARTS OR FULLY WOOD UNITS. THE HT R C MAY ALSO FULLY APPROVE, APPROVE OF FULLY WOOD REPLACEMENT PRODUCTS, WHICH MEETS STAFF STANDARDS, INCLUDING INSETS AND WINDOW TRIM. THE APPLICANT BELIEVED YOU IS HERE IN? YES. HELLO EVERYONE. UM, UH, I'M THE MANAGER FOR THE PROJECT AND, UM, WHEN WE'RE WORKING ON IT, I GUESS IT'S A VIOLATION BECAUSE WE DIDN'T KNOW THAT WAS IN THE, HIS HISTORICAL. BUT ANYWAY, OUR PROCESS IS ALMOST [02:20:01] FINISHED UNTIL, WHICH IS MOST OF THE WINDOW HAS BEEN REPLACED TO THE CURRENT, TO THE VINYL WINDOWS UNTIL, YES. AND THEN, UH, WE WERE NOTIFIED BY THE CITY THAT, UH, WE NEED TO STOP AND CHANGE IT. UM, BUT HOWEVER, TODAY, UM, I WAS PASSING BY THE HOUSE TO GET THAT SIGN AND NOTICE ONE OF OUR NEIGHBORS, ABOUT FOUR HOUSES DOWN, UH, 7 0 2 SHERMAN, THAT HOUSE WAS, UH, RE UH, I GUESS, UH, RE RENOVATED, RECOLORED REPAINTED. AND I NOTICED THAT WINDOWS IS ALSO SIMILAR TO OURS. SIMILAR. THE COLOR IS A DARKER ONE. I HAVE PICTURES. MM-HMM. , THAT HOUSE IS NEW CONSTRUCTION. UH, IT'S A NEW CONSTRUCTION. IT WAS BUILT WITHIN THE PAST FIVE OR SIX YEARS. OKAY. BUT THEY USED THE SAME SIMILAR WINDOWS LIKE US. SO IF THEY'RE BUILT IN THE SAME HISTORICAL INDUSTRY, DONATE, SUPPOSED TO FOLLOW THE SAME RULES OR NO, YOU JUST BUILD WHATEVER NEW ONES YOU WANT? RIGHT? NO NEW CONSTRUCTION DOES ALLOW FOR SOME, UH, DIFFERENT MATERIALS. OKAY. HISTORIC HOUSES. UH, THESE, THIS ONE HAD WOOD WINDOWS, SO IT'S, UH, REPAIR OR REPLACE IN KIND OR THE GUIDELINES. OKAY. AND THEN OF COURSE, UH, THE STEP TO US THAT WE CAN, IF WE USE THE SALVAGE PART TO USE IT, UM, SOME WAS DESTROYED BY THE FIRES, BUT THE REST OF THE, MY CHECK WITH OUR CONTRACTOR ON THE PROCESS, THEY ALREADY, I GUESS UN UNSALVAGEABLE, I GUESS. SO WHAT WILL BE THE RECOMMENDATIONS? OKAY, BEFORE WE GET TO QUESTIONS, UH, I BELIEVE WE HAVE A VOICEMAIL. YEAH, WE PLAY IT NOW. HELLO, MY NAME IS VALERIE CORTES, AND I'M CALLING ON BEHALF OF THE GROUP THE CONCERNED CITIZENS OF IGN WOODY HILL WITH REGARD TO CASE NUMBER 2023 DASH 4 0 4, LOCATED AT SEVEN 16 SHERMAN STREET. AGREE WITH O H P'S RECOMMENDATIONS. VITAL WINDOWS DO NOT MEET O H P GUIDELINES AND SHOULD NEVER BE ALLOWED. THE ALUMINUM WINDOW SHOULD BE REPLACED WITH A WOOD OR ALUMINUM CLAD WOOD WINDOW. AND ALL WOOD WINDOWS SHOULD BE REPLACED WITH ANY KIND WOOD WINDOWS OR ALUMINUM CLOUD WOOD WINDOWS BASED ON HOW DAMAGED THE ORIGINAL WOOD WINDOWS WERE THINKING. THANK YOU. UH, A QUESTION, DO YOU HAVE, UH, HOW MANY OF THE ORIGINAL WINDOWS WHEN YOU STARTED WORKING ON THE HOUSE? UH, WERE WOOD. AND HOW MANY WERE ALUMINUM? DO YOU KNOW HOW MANY OF EACH? UM, FROM MY HOUSE, THERE'S THREE OR FOUR OF THEM IS IN, UH, ALUMINUM ONES. AND THEN 1, 2, 3, I THINK ABOUT FIVE IS IN WOOD, AND TWO OF THEM IS, UH, ONE OF 'EM IS, WAS DESTROYED. AND, AND, YEAH. AND THERE'S ONE SMALL WINDOWS. UH, SORRY. SO IF YOU CAN CUT THAT ONE'S SIX, SIX WOODEN WINDOWS AND YES. FOUR ALUMINUM. FOUR ALUMINUM? YES. OKAY. AND GOOGLE. THERE'S A PREVIOUSLY ENCLOSED FRONT PORCH THAT HAS THE ALUMINUM WINDOWS, AND SO YOU CAN KIND OF, YOU KNOW, TELL WHAT'S ORIGINAL TO THE HOUSE AND WHERE THAT PORCH EDITION WAS CLOSED IN. AND SO WE THINK THAT MOST OF THE ORIGINAL HOUSE HAD ITS ORIGINAL WINDOWS STILL. OKAY. AND THE WOOD WINDOWS THAT WERE REMOVED, THEY'RE NO LONGER ON SITE? NO, NO, SIR. OKAY. OTHER QUESTIONS? COMMISSIONER HOLLAND, DO YOU, WOULD, WOULD YOU BE, UM, WOULD YOU BE OPEN TO REPLACING WINDOWS WITH WOOD WINDOWS? UM, I HAVE TO CHECK WITH MY, UM, CONTRACTOR AND SEE WHAT WE CAN FIND SOMETHING SIMILAR TO IT OR CLOSE IN WOOD TO REPLACE THE ONES. UM, BUT, UH, WE WOULD, I MEAN, WE WILL HAVE TO COMPLY WITH THE, WHAT THE COMMISSION YOU GUYS WOULD DECIDE FOR US TO DO. MR. CHAIR? YES. COMMISSIONER GIBBS. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. UM, JUST AS YOU KNOW, SOME PREVIOUS CASES, I'M ALWAYS CURIOUS MM-HMM. , WHEN APPLICANTS SAY THAT THEY DIDN'T REALIZE THAT THEY WERE IN HISTORIC DISTRICT, AND SO YOU START DOING WORK ON SOMETHING AND YOU THEN YOU FIND THAT YOU'RE, YOU'RE IN WHEN YOU GET A VIOLATION NOTICE. SO I'M CURIOUS MM-HMM. AS TO HOW THAT HAPPENS IN THIS SITUATION. UM, WE, WE OWN, UH, ANOTHER HOUSE, UH, TWO HOUSE RIGHT NEXT TO THEM. AND THEY WERE OUR NEIGHBORS FOR ALMOST TWO YEARS, AT LEAST AFTER WE PURCHASED THE LOCATION. SO ONE DAY WE REALIZED THIS, LIKE THAT'S, YOU KNOW, THE BOAT HOUSE. AND IT'S KIND OF WEIRD THAT, THAT, UH, BECAUSE THEY USED TO HAVE WEEKEND PARTIES. WHEN I DRIVE BY, UH, I ALWAYS SEE HI, SAY HELLO TO THEM. SO I [02:25:01] ASK MY, MY TENANTS SAY, HEY, WHAT HAPPENED TO THE NEIGHBORS? THEY JUST DISAPPEAR. YOU KNOW, THEY BOUGHT THE HOUSE, WHAT HAPPENED? YOU KNOW? AND THEY SAY THAT THEY CAUGHT A SMALL FIRE AND THEN THEY HAVE TO MOVE TO THEIR SONS. BUT ANYWAY, LONG STORY SHORT IS WHEN WE TALK TO THEM AND SAY, HEY, UH, DO YOU, WE JUST APPROACH 'EM AND JUST, JUST CHIT-CHATTING AND SAY, HEY, DO YOU WANT TO, YOU WANT TO PURCHASE YOUR HOUSE IF YOU WANT TO SELL THEM? THEY SAY, NO, THEY WANT TO, THEY WANT TO GET A LOAN AND REPAIR THE HOUSE. SO I SAID, OKAY. THEN THEY APPROACHED US BACK ABOUT SIX MONTHS LATER AND SAYING THAT THEIR CONTRACTOR TOOK THEIR MONEY AND LEFT. SO NOW THEY, UH, HALFWAY DOWN, WELL, BASICALLY NOTHING WAS DONE. THEY JUST GET SOME WIRES AND THAT'S IT. SO THEY FIND A LITTLE BIT OF FINANCIAL HARDSHIP. THEY SAID THEY COULDN'T DO MUCH ABOUT IT. THEY DECIDE TO SELL IT TO US. I SAY, AND ONLY, ONLY THING THEY WANNA ASK FROM US IS TO PROMISE TO KEEP THE HOUSE THE WAY IT IS, AND JUST STILL AS RESIDENTIAL HOME, YOU CAN RENT IT TO THE PEOPLE OR YOU LIVE YOURSELF. BUT THEN THAT'S THE ONLY REQUIREMENT FROM THEM. AND I'M ASSUMING FOR US, IF YOU'RE DOING RENOVATION YOURSELF AS A HOMEOWNER AND YOU LIVE THERE FOR 20 YEARS, IT'S A COMMON SENSE THAT YOU KNOW WHERE YOU ARE LIVING. YOU KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON IN YOUR NEIGHBORHOOD. RIGHT? SO, AND ASSUMING WHEN WE BUY FROM EACH OTHER, YOU SHOULD BE DISCLOSE YOURSELF A HUNDRED PERCENT. AND WE ARE JUST BUYING EXACTLY THE WAY IT IS. SO NOW, AFTER, AND THEN WE TOOK OVER, AND THEN WE WAITED FOR A COUPLE MONTHS BEFORE WE REALLY DOING THE WORK TILL NOW. AND SUDDENLY WE GOT A PHONE CALL FROM, FROM ONE OF THE STAFF, BRIAN, SAYING THAT, HEY, YOU GUYS WERE IN THE, IN THE, YOU'RE IN THE, IN A, UH, HISTORICAL HISTORY AND YOU CAN DO THIS. AND I SAY, YES, I'LL CALL IN, CALL MY CONTRACT TO STOP RIGHT AWAY. AND THAT'S THE WAY IT IS. OKAY. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. THANK YOU. YES. OTHER COMMISSIONER SAVINO, IF THERE ARE NO OTHER QUESTIONS, I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION AND WE CAN DISCUSS IT FURTHER. YES, PLEASE. UM, I THINK STAFF IS ACCURATE AND CORRECT ON THIS. SO I'D LIKE TO, UM, MOTION THAT WE ACCEPT, WE DENY, DENY THE REQUEST AND, UM, BASED ON STAFF STIPULATIONS OR APPROVE REPLACEMENT OF WINDOWS FOLLOWING STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND, A SECOND. YEAH. DISCUSSION. AND THE, THE REASON WHY IS IT, IT IS EVERY OTHER ASPECT OF THE HOUSE SEEMS TO BE STILL IN ITS CHARACTER DEFINING FORM. IT STILL HAVE THE PORCH VOLUME, THE ROOF FORMS, AND, UH, LOOKS LIKE SOME OF THE WINDOWS ARE STILL IN THEIR ORIGINAL ROUGH OPENING DIMENSIONS OR CLOSE TO THEM. AND, UM, THE OPTION OF BEING ABLE TO USE SALVAGED WINDOWS FROM ANOTHER SOURCE, WHETHER IT'S AN ARCHITECTURAL SALVAGE STORE, OF WHICH THERE ARE SEVERAL AROUND HERE, OR, UM, USING A A FULLY WOOD WINDOW THAT MATCHES THE ROUGH OPENING SIZE THAT THAT 1930S HOUSE WOULD'VE HAD IS PRETTY, PRETTY STANDARD FARE. AND YOUR CONTRACTOR, UM, SHOULD PROBABLY KNOW HOW TO, I'M ASSUMING, KNOWS HOW TO DO THAT AND WOULD BE ABLE TO ADAPT THIS HOUSE FOR THAT PURPOSE. UM, THE VINYL WINDOWS COULD BE PERHAPS USED ON ANOTHER PROJECT, NOT IN A HISTORIC DISTRICT. OKAY. THANK YOU. OTHER COMMENTS? UM, MR. CHAIR, I WANT TO JUST, JUST, UH, ADD THAT I, I I THINK THAT THE APPLICANT'S, UH, TESTIMONY IS A PRETTY COMPELLING, YOU KNOW, THEY FIND THEMSELVES IN A CIRCUMSTANCE TO COMPLETE SOMETHING THAT HAD ALREADY BEEN STARTED, RESULTS FOR FIRES, ONE BAD STORY AFTER ANOTHER BAD STORY AFTER ANOTHER BAD STORY. AND IN THE END, WE HAVE THE OPTION TO UNROLL ANOTHER BAD STORY OR, OR TO, TO ENABLE THIS PROJECT TO GET COMPLETED AND TO BE A PROJECT THAT HAS BEEN RENOVATED. UM, THE, UM, THE, YOU KNOW, SHOULD THE MOTION PASS, I KNOW THAT, AND THE APPLICANT SHOULD ALSO BE, BE INFORMED THAT THEY COULD GO TO THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT AND REQUEST A, UH, A, A HEARING FROM THEM WITH RESPECT TO INVESTMENT ALREADY MADE. BUT MY EYE GOES DIRECTLY TO THE INTERIOR, THE SHEET ROCK, AND THEN ANTICIPATING WHAT THE DESTRUCTIVE, UM, OUTCOME WILL BE TO HAVING TO CHANGE ALL THESE WINDOWS. UH, I, I DON'T SEE THAT THAT, THAT THAT CONSEQUENCE KIND OF IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN, YOU KNOW, THE, THE, THE, THE WORK THAT'S ALREADY BEEN DONE, TAKING INTO CONSIDERATION THE PREDICAMENT THAT THIS APPLICANT FOUND HIMSELF IN, WHICH [02:30:01] I, I, I, I DO BELIEVE, UM, SO TO SPEAK, OF NO FAULT OF, OF THEIR OWN. UM, SO I, I, I WON'T, UH, BE SUPPORTING THE MOTION. I, I DO RESPECT, UH, THE, THE MOTION, UH, BUT, BUT I WON'T SUPPORT IT IN, IN HOPES THAT THIS APPLICANT IS ABLE TO COMPLETE THIS PROJECT CONSIDERING ALL THE WORK THAT'S BEEN DONE ALREADY. THANK YOU, SIR. THANK YOU. HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE. GIBBS. AYE. SAVINA? AYE. VELAZQUEZ. NAYYY. ZUKA. AYE. VASQUEZ. AYE. CERVANTES? NO. HOLLAND AYE. AND FETZER AYE. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU. THANK YOU, SIR. SO YOU, UH, WORK WITH STAFF ON THE, UH, REPLACEMENT WINDOWS. THANK YOU. AGENDA ITEM 18. AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 18 H D R C CASE 2023 DASH 409 27 NORTH OLIVE STREET. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO CLA THE EXISTING WOODEN COLUMNS, CAPITALS, AND BASE WITH ONE BY EIGHT SOFTWOOD BOARDS. CAN YOU INTRODUCE YOURSELF? UM, HOLD ON, LET ME READ THE RECOMMENDATION TO THE MINUTES, PLEASE. . OKAY, SURE. STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THE PORCH COLUMN MODIFICATIONS BASED ON FINDING. B STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT THE APPLICANT INSTALL A REPLACEMENT COLUMN THAT MEETS THE GUIDELINES WITH THE FOLLOWING STIPULATIONS. THE PROPOSED WOOD COLUMN SHOULD BE NO WIDER THAN SIX, UH, FEET SQUARE. UM, FEATURE BOTH CAPITAL AND BASE TRIM WITH TAMED CORNERS. GOOD AFTERNOON, I'M DANTE LOPEZ. I'M HERE FOR THE 9 27 PROPERTY. OH, OKAY. I'M SORRY. YES. UH, GOOD AFTERNOON. I'M DANTE LOPEZ. I'M HERE FOR 9 27 NORTH OLIVE. UM, I'M ASKING FOR A, A POST-WORK CER CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS. UM, I KNOW I'M GONNA GET ASKED WHY WE DIDN'T, UH, APPLY FOR IT BEFOREHAND. UM, I, I MOVED TO OREGON EIGHT YEARS AGO. UH, WE'VE BEEN LIVING IN THE HOUSE FOR 30 YEARS, SO I CAME BACK THIS JANUARY. AND BACK THEN BEFORE THE, EVEN THE, THE BROWN SIGNS WERE UP AND IT WAS BLUE SIGNS AND IT WASN'T HISTORIC OR ANNOUNCING, IT WAS HISTORIC. MY DAD WOULD USUALLY JUST GET A, A PERMIT FROM THE CITY, AND THEN HE NEVER GOT A WORK ORDER OR A STOP WORK ORDER TO ACTUALLY STOP WORK. AND WE DON'T DO UPGRADES ON THE HOUSE, UH, VERY OFTEN. SO IT'S BEEN ABOUT 10 YEARS SINCE HE'S DONE ANY SERIOUS PROJECT. 'CAUSE WE JUST DON'T HAVE THE MONEY TO ALWAYS DO THINGS. AND, UM, SO WE GOT BACK, I GOT BACK AND HE, AND, AND HE WANTED TO DO THIS PROJECT. I DIDN'T KNOW THAT NOW THERE WAS A WHOLE, THIS WAS A WHOLE THING. I LEFT BACK EIGHT YEARS AGO BEFORE THAT NEIGHBORHOOD. I HAD A MAGNIFYING GLASS ON IT, AND ALL THIS GENTRIFICATION WAS GOING ON. SO, UM, I'M NEW TO THIS PROCESS. I SAY THAT TO SAY THAT I WANNA DO THINGS THE RIGHT WAY. I WANNA HELP MY PARENTS BUILD UP THE HOUSE, ADJUST, KEEP UP WITH THE NEIGHBORHOOD, MAKE IT LOOK GOOD, NOT MAKE IT LOOK BAD. BUT, UH, I APOLOGIZE THAT I DIDN'T DO RESEARCH AHEAD OF TIME. AND, UM, I'M JUST ASKING THAT WE CAN KEEP THE, THE PORCH COLUMNS THE WAY THEY ARE. I WAS, UH, LOOKING AT THE LAWS AND, UM, UH, IN SECTION 35 DASH 6 43, ALTERATION, RESTORATION AND REHABILITATION, UH, SECTION, UH, E IT SAYS THAT, UM, TO KEEP THE, THE ORIGINAL MATERIAL THERE INSTEAD OF REMOVING IT OR REPLACING IT, WHICH THEY'RE STILL THERE. WE ENCASED THEM WITH A DIFFERENT KIND, KIND OF WOOD, WITH JUST WOOD. AND IT MADE 'EM A LITTLE BIT WIDER THAN THE FOUR INCHES. BUT I MEAN, IN ORDER TO KEEP THEM FOUR INCHES, WE WOULD JUST HAVE TO HAVE LIKE NON-EXISTENT WOOD, VERY THIN. UM, AND IT WOULDN'T ACT ANY, ADD ANY STRUCTURAL INTEGRITY OR REINFORCE IT BECAUSE THEY'RE SO OLD. WE KNOW THESE AREN'T ORIGINAL TO THE HOME THAT WAS BUILT IN 1909, BUT THEY'VE BEEN THERE A WHILE. AND ALSO HERE IN THIS SECTION, IT, IT IS SOMEWHERE, UH, ONE OF THESE SECTIONS STATES THAT, UH, CHANGES WHICH HAVE, MAY HAVE TAKEN, UH, IT'S 35 DASH 6 43. UH, THE CHANGES WHICH HAVE MAY HAVE TAKEN PLACE IN THE COURSE OF TIME ARE EVIDENCE OF THE HISTORY AND [02:35:01] DEVELOPMENT OF A BUILDING STRUCTURE, AN OBJECT OR SITE IN ITS ENVIRONMENT. THESE CHANGES MAY HAVE ACQUIRED SIGNIFICANCE IN THEIR OWN RIGHT, AND THE SIGNIFICANCE SHALL BE RECOGNIZED AND RESPECTED. SO THEY'RE NOT THE ORIGINAL, WHICH VICTORIANS WOULD BE LIKE ROUND WITH SQUARE UP TOP, SQUARE BOTTOM, AND HAND CARVED WITH DESIGNS. THESE ARE OBVIOUSLY BEEN REPLACED LATER ON IN THIS CENTURY THAT THE HOUSE HAS BEEN THERE, BUT SINCE THIS LAW OR CODE MAKES 'EM NOW, UM, HISTORIC, WE LEFT THEM AND THEY'RE STILL THERE. THEY JUST GOT ENCASED. THE HOUSE IS A LOT MORE STABLE. WE HAVE NIECES AND NEPHEWS RUNNING AROUND. WE CAN'T HAVE THE PORCH FALLING OVER, A COLUMN FALLING OFF. THERE'S STILL WOOD FROM THE CEILING TO THE, TO THE, TO THE FLOOR. THERE'S NO, WE DIDN'T, WE DIDN'T ALTER THE LOOK. IT IS JUST A LITTLE BIT WIDER. OKAY. THANK YOU. QUE COMMISSIONER VASQUEZ. SO YOU JUST PUT VENEERS AROUND THOSE EXISTING BEIGE COLORED ONES? YEAH, THOSE WERE, UH, GETTING ROTTEN AND ONE OF 'EM WAS LIKE CUT AT THE BOTTOM WHERE WHEN THEY BUILT IT, THEY ACTUALLY LIKE USED TWO PIECES OF WOOD TO KIND OF PUT IT TOGETHER. SO IT WAS, UH, TWO PIECES OF WOOD LIKE THIS WITH SCREWS GOING UP INTO EACH OTHER. AND, UM, WE JUST BASICALLY ENCASED, THEY VEERED IT WITH TWO BY SIXES BECAUSE IT WAS THE ONLY, UH, SIZE OF WOOD THAT WOULD OVERLAP EACH OTHER FOR IT TO BE EVEN. SO THE WOOD WOULDN'T STICK OUT LIKE THIS ON EVERY SIDE. UM, BUT I DON'T THINK THERE ARE ANY KIND OF HELPING WITH SUPPORT THE STRUCTURE THOUGH. RIGHT? UM, THEY'RE ADDING JUST BECAUSE THEY'RE SO THIN, THEY'RE JUST A VENEER. WELL, IT'S TWO, IT'S, IT'S TWO INCHES ON EACH SIDE, SO IT'S GOTTA ADD SOME KIND OF SUPPORT. SO THOSE ARE TWO BY SIX BOARDS CLADDING IT? YES. CEDAR, UH, JUST IN CASE THE, THE, THE HISTORIC BEAM IS STILL ON THE INSIDE. IT'S JUST GOT A LOT OF SCREWS IN IT NOW. OKAY. SO THE OVERALL DIMENSIONS ARE WHAT NOW? THERE ARE SEVEN INCHES, SEVEN AND A QUARTER, UH, SQUARED. SO SEVEN AND A QUARTER, SEVEN AND A QUARTER, SEVEN AND A QUARTER, QUARTER SEVEN AND A QUARTER. AND THE EARLIER COLUMNS WERE, THEY'RE ABOUT FOUR AND A HALF INCHES. OKAY. THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER SAVINO. OH, I WAS JUST GONNA ASK FOR CLARIFICATION ON WHAT EXACTLY IS THE CONSTRUCTION OF IT. SO YOU'RE SAYING THERE'S A FOUR BY FOUR INSIDE? YES. UM, I NEED TWO HANDS TO TALK. AND YOU HAVE TWO BY FOUR, TWO BY SIXES AROUND IT. YES. SO, UM, THIS IS THE, THE ORIGINAL COLUMN, IT WAS FOUR AND A HALF MM-HMM. , UH, DIMENSION ON EACH SIDE. AND WHAT WE DID WAS, UM, WE JUST PUT A BOARD ON EACH SIDE. YEP, YEP. RIGHT, BECAUSE WE DON'T WANNA REPLACE 'EM. WE WANT TO KEEP THE HISTORIC NATURE OF THE HOUSE NOW WITH ALL THESE BRAND NEW HOMES GOING UP ACROSS THE STREET. SO, AND THEN THE ANO MY SECOND QUESTION IS THEN IF YOU HAD ISSUE WHAT YOU THOUGHT MIGHT BE COSMETIC ISSUES BECAUSE OF THE, THE SPLICING OF THE POSTS, WHICH IS A COMMON WAY TO REPAIR HISTORIC POSTS, UM, UM, WOULD YOU BE OPEN TO CLADDING WITH A ONE BUY INSTEAD? UM, RATHER THAN THE TWO BUY, JUST A ONE BUY? AND I ASK THAT BECAUSE I FEEL THAT THE ENLARGED POST YOU HAVE NOW IS VERY OUT OF CHARACTER WITH THAT REALLY MODEST, UM, COTTAGE THAT YOU HAVE. YES. CONSIDERING HOW MANY POSTS YOU HAVE AS WELL. UM, IT'S, UH, FOUR OR FIVE POSTS ONLY, BUT, UM, I MEAN, WE COULD LOOK INTO IT IF THEY MAKE, IF THEY MAKE THAT, THAT, UH, THAT WOOD WE'RE WILLING TO COMPROMISE. BUT THE ONLY THING IS, UM, IS THERE ANY KIND OF, UH, HELP WE CAN GET BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE MONEY TO KEEP SPENDING MONEY OR HAVING SOMEBODY TAKE IT DOWN, REDO IT AND ALL THAT. THAT'S, THAT'S, THAT'S AN ASIDE. SO WE'LL DISCUSS THAT FURTHER. OKAY. THANK YOU. OKAY. YES. COMMISSIONER CERVANTES, DON'T SHE ACTUALLY ANSWER? OKAY. THANK YOU, COMMISSIONER. IF WE WANT DO THINGS THE RIGHT WAY AND COMPROMISE WHERE WE HAVE TO, NOW THAT I KNOW THIS PROCESS, I HAVE CLAUDIA'S NUMBER. I'LL CONTACT HER EVERY TIME BEFORE WE DO ANYTHING TO THE EXTERIOR OF THE HOME. BUT, UH, I DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT THIS WHEN I CAME BACK FROM OREGON AND THINGS HAVE CHANGED SO DRASTICALLY IN THIS NEIGHBORHOOD. COMMISSIONER MOOKA, I THINK FOR ME, THE, THE THING THAT REALLY STANDS OUT, AND YOU SEE IT IN A LOT OF ADDITIONS TO HISTORIC HOUSES, IS THE CEDAR LOOK TO THE COLUMNS, WHICH IS DEFINITELY NOT WHAT WOULD'VE BEEN THERE BEFORE IT WOULD'VE BEEN PAINTED. SO I THINK PAINTING IT, AND I KNOW IT WOULD BE A LOT OF WORK TO CAMP FOR THE CORNERS, IF THAT'S THE RIGHT WORD. UH, CHAFER CHAFER, WELL, WE WERE GONNA ASK IF WE COULD, UM, GIVE 'EM AN EST, UH, A VICTORIAN AESTHETIC IF WE WERE ALLOWED TO KEEP 'EM AS FAR AS THE DESIGNS AND THE CORNERS, HOWEVER YOU GUYS WOULD SPECIFY [02:40:01] HE WOULD LIKE IT, LIKE THE CAPS UP TOP OR THE DESIGN IN THE MIDDLE. WE WERE, WE'VE BEEN RESEARCHING IN THE VICTORIAN ERA, AND, UH, WE'RE OPEN TO SUGGESTIONS. UM, WE'RE NOT SAYING WE ARE NOT GONNA DO IT. WE JUST WANNA KNOW THAT WE, WE DIDN'T WASTE OUR MONEY AND TIME. WE, I I, I WAS IGNORANT TO THIS, THIS PROCESS. AND NOW THAT I, UM, I DON'T WANNA SOUND LIKE A BROKEN RECORD, BUT NOW THAT I KNOW, UM, I'M GONNA BE IN, IN CLAUDIA OR MS. ENO'S DEER, UM, MY FAMILY HAS BEEN, UH, THERE FOR A LONG TIME, SO I WANNA BE PART OF THE COMMUNITY. AND, UH, FURTHER IT, I HAVE ONE LAST QUESTION. UM, OH, ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? COMMISSIONER VASQUEZ? I WAS JUST GONNA SAY, IF REALLY AND TRULY YOU WANTED TO, YOU COULD JUST TAKE OFF THE VENEERS AND RETURN IT TO WHAT IT WAS, RIGHT? YEAH, BUT IT'S DOESN'T LOOK GOOD. AND I MEAN, AND MAYBE WITH A, A GOOD STANDING AND A NICE COAT OF PAINT, THEY, THEY'RE ALL, THEY'RE OLD. SOME ARE LOPSIDED. ONE OF 'EM IS CUT HALFWAY WITH SCREWS GOING IN. IT'S BEEN LIKE THAT SINCE THEY CHANGED THE PORCH WHENEVER THEY DID. WE DON'T HAVE RECORD OF IT. BUT ALSO, LIKE, WHAT, WHAT ABOUT THE HOUSES ACROSS THE STREET? THAT, THAT THEY JUST BUILT THE 12 HOUSES. THEY DON'T HAVE THESE, WHY, WHY IS IT, WHY IS THE, THE HYPO HYPOCRISY THERE? WHY ARE WE BEING TOLD TO DO SOMETHING AND THESE PEOPLE ARE BEING ALLOWED TO DO WHATEVER THEY WANT? THE, THE, THE, THE, THE DEVELOPERS, AND I'M SAYING THIS WITH ALL DUE WITH RESPECT. I'M NOT TRYING TO COME OFF ANY KIND OF WAY, I'M JUST ASKING QUESTIONS. CLAUDIA, WHAT'S THE, THE HISTORIC BACKGROUND ON THIS? HAS IT ALWAYS BEEN WITH THIS FRONT PORCH LIKE THIS? YES. UM, WHEN I DID RECEIVE THIS, I WENT BACK AS FAR AS I BELIEVE, 2007 ON GOOGLE IMAGES, AS FAR BACK AS IT ALLOWS YOU TO GO, AND YOU CAN SEE IT. THIS HAS BEEN THE PORCH THAT'S BEEN THERE. UM, ADDITIONALLY, I DO WANNA JUST COMMENT THAT IF YOU WERE, WERE TO REMOVE THE VENEER AND REPAIR OR REPLACE WITHIN KIND, THAT'S ALSO ELIGIBLE FOR ADMINISTRATIVE APPROVAL. SO HE WOULDN'T HAVE TO COME BACK HERE. WELL, AND JUST TO BE CLEAR, THE PORCH HAS BEEN MODIFIED. SO THESE ARE NOT THE ORIGINAL COLUMNS, LIKE THE, THE DECKING HAS GONE. UM, SO WE'RE SIMPLY SAYING THE WORK THAT HAS BEEN DONE IS NOT CONSISTENT WITH THE GUIDELINES. THE COLUMNS COULD BE REPLACED WITH SOMETHING MORE CONSISTENT. COMMISSIONER SAVINA, I WAS GOING TO ALSO ASK, UM, IS THERE AN INTENT TO REPLACE THE GUARDRAILS? NO, NO. THOSE WEREN'T ORIGINAL. THOSE WERE ADDED AROUND THE EARLY TWO THOUSANDS. AND, UH, WE WANT TO GIVE THE HOUSE BACK. IT'S IT'S CHARACTER NOW THAT WE'RE, THEY'RE ME AND MY SIBLINGS ARE GROWING UP, AND WE, WE CAN SEE, UH, RESEARCH. AND SO YOU BELIEVE THAT THE CHARACTER WOULD'VE BEEN A, A, A LARGE CEDAR POST THEN? UM, THE CHARACTER IS CHANGING. THE NEIGHBORHOOD IS CHANGING. IT'S NOT HISTORIC, IT'S GENTRIFIED. SO WHY CAN'T WE MOVE WITH THE TIMES AND ADAPT? I'M JUST, THIS IS, THIS ISN'T MR. CHAIR. YES. COMMISSIONER S VELAZQUEZ. UH, WELL, YOU, YOU, YOU KNOW, OUT OUTSIDE OF THE CONTEXT OF THE GUIDELINES AND ALL THAT, THE, I THINK THE, THE YOUNG MAN MAKES A, A POINT THAT IS WORTH THE COMMISSION HEARING, UH, PARTICULARLY WITH RESPECT TO THE FACT THAT HE LEFT AND HE'S COMING BACK. AND THESE INNER CITY COMMUNITIES, THEY HAVE EXISTED IN THEIR OWN REALM WITHOUT ANY ATTENTION, NEGLECTED IN SOME CASES FALLING DOWN. AND THE PEOPLE HAVE NOT RECEIVED REALLY ANY REAL RECOGNITION OF THEIR PERSEVERANCE AND THEIR, THEIR SURVIVAL OF ALL OF THE, THE, THE VERY LOW ECONOMICS. AND, YOU KNOW, CONSIDERING THAT IN, IN GEN THE AGE OF GENTRIFICATION, THERE ARE PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE, LET'S JUST SAY, A LITTLE MORE MONEY THAN OTHERS. AND THAT THE HISTORY OF THESE COMMUNITIES ARE THAT WHEN THEY WERE MAJORITY MINORITY PERSONS, THAT THEY WERE REDLINED. SO THEY HAD NO ACCESS TO CAPITAL. AND A LOT OF THOSE OLD PEOPLE STILL LIVE IN THOSE COMMUNITIES, AND THEIR HOUSEHOLDS ARE NOW RUN BY THEIR GRANDCHILDREN OR THEIR NEPHEWS AND NIECES. SO NOW THEY FIND THEMSELVES IN AN ENVIRONMENT WHERE THEY SEE IMPROVEMENT OCCURRING IN THE AREA THAT IS AT THE HANDS OF PEOPLE THAT, FOR THEM, ARE INVESTMENTS. AND THEY LOOK ACROSS THE STREET AND THEY SEE A HOUSE AND THEY SAY, HEY, WHY CAN'T I HAVE A COLUMN LIKE THAT? AND THEY SAY, MIJO, GO BUY ME A COLUMN LIKE THAT. AND THEY PUT IT ON THEIR HOUSE. SO, SO THAT IN TERMS OF CULTURAL APPROPRIATENESS, IT REALLY DOES RAISE A QUESTION THAT HERE AND THERE WE WOULD REQUIRE TO UNDERSTAND THAT WHEN WE LOOK AT THINGS FROM THE PERSPECTIVE OF CULTURAL APPROPRIATENESS, SOMETIMES IT BRINGS FORTH OUR POWER TO LOOK AT THINGS THROUGH, UH, AN ECONOMIC LENS. IN, IN THIS CASE, I THINK COREY SAID SOMETHING THAT IS VERY IMPORTANT TO THE, THEIR FINDINGS. THAT THE, THAT [02:45:01] THE PORCH IS NOT THE SAME PORCH. THE THE GUARDRAIL IS NOT THE SAME GUARDRAIL AND MUCH OF THE CHARACTERISTICS OF THAT HOUSE HAVE BEEN ALTERED. AND IT DOES RAISE A QUESTION OF THIS HIGH HYBRID, UH, FACTOR IN THE FACADE OF THIS, THIS BUILDING AND YOU, AND, AND JUST TO, TO BRING IT BACK HOME. WE FIND OURSELVES LISTENING TO THIS YOUNG MAN IN THE COLLISION OF CULTURES THAT ALL OF THAT IS VALID. AND EVEN THE COLLISION IS VALID IN TERMS OF HOW WE LOOK AT WHAT IS THE HISTORIC CHARACTER OF A COMMUNITY THAT ONCE WAS ONE PEOPLE'S COMMUNITY AND IS QUICKLY BECOMING SOMEONE ELSE'S COMMUNITY THAT MAYBE WANTS IT TO BE DIGNIFIED. YOU KNOW, A, A MEMORY OF THE GOOD OLD DAYS WHEN OF COURSE, MINORITY PEOPLES DIDN'T LIVE IN THESE COMMUNITIES. RIGHT? SO PERHAPS WHAT WE'RE SEEING HERE IS, IS UM, IS, UH, A, A, A HOUSE SPEAKING ABOUT THE CHANGING TIMES. AND OUR QUESTION IS REALLY, DO WE WANNA MAKE OUR PURVIEW CONSEQUENTIAL TO PEOPLE WHO MAY NOT HAVE THE MEANS, OR, OR, OR, OR, OR, OR REALLY WHAT ARE THE CONSEQUENCES OF WHAT WE'RE DOING? BUT I DO HAVE ONE QUESTION. YOU, YOU KNOW, THERE'S A POSSIBILITY THAT ONE SINGLE COLUMN WOULD BE LESS EXPENSIVE THAN FOUR FOUR BY SIX SEAT POSTS. SO IF YOU FIND YOURSELF IN A SITUATION WHERE YOU HAVE TO GET RID OF THE, THE CEDAR GO PRICE OUT THE FOUR BY FOURS OR THE, OR THE, OR THE FIVE BY FIVES, IF THEY CAN, IF YOU CAN GET CLOSER TO THAT. 'CAUSE I DON'T THINK THOSE ARE TRUE FOUR BY FOURS AND REPLACE THEM ONE BY ONE, AND PERHAPS THE BOARD WOULD BE OPEN TO ENABLING THAT TO HAPPEN ONE AT A TIME, ONE COLUMN AT A TIME OVER THE COURSE OF TWO YEARS. OKAY. UM, ALSO, THIS WAS, THIS HAS BEEN MY MOM'S DREAM FOREVER. WE, LIKE I SAID, WE HAVEN'T HAD MONEY TO ALWAYS MAKE IMPROVEMENTS ON THE HOUSE. SHE'S BEEN LIVING THERE FOR 30 YEARS. YOU KNOW, MOM ALWAYS TAKES, TAKES HOME REALLY SERIOUS AND HOW IT LOOKS. SO THIS HAS BEEN A DREAM OF MINE TO COME HOME AND GIVE HER HER DREAM. AND THIS IS REALLY, UM, IT'S HARD. SO, WELL, IT'S VERY CLEAR, JUST LOOKING AT THE PICTURE OF THE HOUSE, IT'S A BEAUTIFUL HOUSE. IT'S WELL KEPT AND IT'S, IT'S CLEARLY A LOVED HOUSE, OKAY. REGARDLESS OF WHAT WE SAY. YES. UM, SOMEONE LOVES THE HOUSE AND IT'S GOTTA BE ALL. YES. UM, YOU DRIVE THROUGH THAT NEIGHBORHOOD NOW, THERE'S NOTHING LIKE HISTORIC. I MEAN, YOU SEE ONE SIDE OF THE STREET, THEY'RE NEW, THE OTHER SIDE OF THE STREET ARE DILAPIDATED. WHEN I GREW UP THERE, IT WAS HORRIBLE. PEOPLE THAT LIVE THERE NOW WOULDN'T EVEN DRIVE THROUGH THERE. OKAY. THANK YOU MR. CHAIR. I HAVE MR. SAVINA. OH, I'M SORRY. UM, IF THERE ARE NO OTHER QUESTIONS, I HAD A QUESTION. OKAY. I'LL BE READY TO MAKE A MOTION. WHEN YOU'RE, SO YOU DID THE RESEARCH ON WHAT IS APPROPRIATE FOR THAT STYLE OF HOUSE, RIGHT? YES. BUT GO AHEAD. SORRY, GO AHEAD. AFTER WE GOT THE STOP WORK ORDER WHEN RIGHT. IT WAS ALREADY DONE. NO, NO, I, I GOT IT. BUT YOU UNDERSTANDING NOW, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN CHAFER YOU CAN PUT MAYBE SUGGESTION, MAYBE TAKE A LITTLE THIN, THIN PIECE, RIGHT? YOU'RE UNDER, YOU, YOU'RE WILLING TO WORK WITH WHAT THE CHARACTER OF YOUR HOUSE KIND OF DESERVES AND, AND, AND FIGURE THAT OUT. WHETHER IT BE ONE COLUMN AT A TIME OR YOU, YOU'RE GETTING A COUPLE DIFFERENT OPTIONS, RIGHT? YES. YOU TALK, WE WE'RE TALKING THROUGH THIS, RIGHT? SO YOU'RE UNDERSTANDING YES. WHAT YOUR HOUSE IS CALLING FOR. AND, AND I UNDERSTAND YOU GOT A BUDGET, I TOTALLY SYMPATHIZE WITH THAT AND MAYBE THAT'S MM-HMM. YOU KNOW, EVERYBODY DOES. BUT I TOTALLY UNDERSTAND THAT. BUT I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT YOU'RE, YOU'RE SEEING WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT. YES. YEAH. OKAY. COMMISSIONER SAVINO, I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION THAT WE ACCEPT THE REQUEST WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS. SECOND MOTION AND SECOND, WOULD YOU LIKE? YEAH. DISCUSSION. THE STAFF STIPULATIONS GIVE YOU A LIMIT OF SIX INCHES IN, UM, DIMENSION ON ALL SIDES. THAT WILL ALLOW YOU TO TAKE OFF THE TWO BUYS AND PUT A ONE BY AND CLAD IT WITH A ONE BY TO COVER UP THE INCONSISTENCIES. WHAT THAT'LL DO IS IT'LL, IT'LL MATCH YOUR COLUMN SIZE TO YOUR HOUSE AND TO YOUR PORCH. RIGHT NOW IT'S KIND OF A LITTLE OVERSIZED, SHALL I SAY. UM, I HAVE, I KNOW THIS HOUSE PRETTY WELL. I'VE TAKEN MANY PICTURES OF, OF THE CHRISTMAS LIGHTS THERE EVERY YEAR. , IT'S ONE OF MY FAVORITES, UM, BECAUSE I'M A SMALL HOUSE FAN. SO, UM, I REALLY APPRECIATE THE DELICACY OF THAT FRONT PORCH. AND, UM, I THINK THERE ARE OTHER SOLUTIONS TO GET YOU CLOSER TO WHAT YOU HAD BEFORE, BUT ALSO TO BE REASONABLY, UH, TO BE ECONOMICALLY REASONABLE AS WELL. OKAY. YEAH. IF YOU'RE NOT PUTTING UP THE, THE GUARDRAILS, THAT'S, UM, I GUESS THAT'S FINE SINCE, UM, STAFF, IS THAT FINE THAT THE GUARDRAILS DON'T GO BACK UP? YES, THOSE ARE FINE. OKAY. OKAY. BUT, UM, UH, THERE ARE LOTS OF HOUSES THAT ARE BEING REHABBED IN STYLISTICALLY APPROPRIATE WAYS. AND YOU'LL BE PART OF THAT GROUP. YES, I PLAN TO BE, I PLAN TO JOIN, UH, MY NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION AND BEING PART OF ALL THIS BECAUSE LIKE EARLIER ELLA [02:50:01] AUSTIN BEING DEMOLISHED, WE NEVER GOT FLYERS FOR THAT AND WE LIVE WITHIN 50 FEET. SO THERE'S A LOT GOING ON THAT WE'RE NOT BEING INFORMED ABOUT. THANK YOU. OTHER COMMENTS? YES. SO, SO DOES, SO DOES THAT MEAN HE'LL BE ABLE TO CHAFER IT DOWN OR PUT A COVER ON IT? I MEAN, WHAT ARE HIS OPTIONS SPECIFICALLY WITH, WITH WHAT WE'RE SEEING HERE, HE COULD EITHER TAKE IT ALL DOWN AND REPLACE IT WITH A NEW FOUR BY FOUR THAT LOOKS CLEAN, UH, TO HIS LIKING, SOMETHING, YOU KNOW, TREATED. OR HE COULD TAKE THE FOUR BY FOUR THAT'S ALREADY IN THERE, CLAD IT WITH A ONE BY, AND THEN ADD THE CAPITAL AND ADD THE BASE. OKAY. OKAY. SO JUST TO BE SPECIFIC, THIS IS WHAT I'M GONNA DO. I'M GONNA TAKE THE BOARDS OFF. I'M GONNA GO TO A WOOD WOOD SHOP. I'M GONNA HAVE 'EM, UH, PLAIN THEM TO HAVE TO ONLY BE ONE INCH WIDE AND THEN I'M GONNA PUT 'EM BACK UP AND CROWN 'EM IN AND, AND GIVE 'EM THE FOOTING. YOU ARE GOING TO DO WHAT YOU WANT TO DO SO THAT IT MEETS STAFF STIPULATIONS OKAY. OF A SIX INCH OVERALL DIMENSION. AND IF THAT'S A HA, YOU CAN GO SMALLER IF YOU'D LIKE, A ONE BY WILL BE ONLY THREE QUARTERS OF AN INCH. OKAY? YEAH. SO WHATEVER YOU, HOWEVER YOU WISH TO DO IT. OKAY? YES, SIX INCHES. SIX INCHES IS, IS THE THRESHOLD. IF THIS MOTION PASSES, THEN YOU CAN WORK WITH CLAUDIA ON HOW YOU PROPOSE TO, UH, MAKE THE MODIFICATION. THANK YOU. THANK YOU SO MUCH. OKAY. THANK YOU. SO HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE. GIPPS. AYE. SAVINA? AYE. VELAZQUEZ? AYE. ZUKA? AYE. VASQUEZ. AYE. CERVANTES? YES. HOLLAND. AYE. AND FETZER AYE. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU. THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. AGENDA ITEM 19 I, YES. BRIAN WILL READ IN THE UH, CASE FILE AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 19 H D R C, CASE NUMBER 2023 DASH 3 98 1 0 7 MADISON STREET. THE REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO INSTALL AN AIR CONDITIONER UNIT IN THE FRONT YARD OF THE PROPERTY AND TO INSTALL SCREENING FOR THE PROPOSED AIR CONDITIONER UNIT. THE STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF THE REQUEST BASED ON FINDINGS A THROUGH C WITH THE FOLLOWING STIPULATION, ONE THAT THE APPLICANT INSTALL THE AIR CONDITIONER UNIT AT THE REAR OR SIDE OF THE STRUCTURE. IF THE H D R C APPROVES INSTALLATION IN THE FRONT YARD, STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT THE ADDITION STIPULATION THAT ENHANCED SCREENING BE DESIGNED AND SUBMITTED TO STAFF THAT IS CONSISTENT WITH THE STYLE AND MATERIALS OF THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE. THE APPLICANT, DONALD NOBLE, IS HERE IN PERSON. THERE'S ONE LETTER FOR THE COMMISSION TO REVIEW. IN ADDITION, THE APPLICANT'S CONTRACTOR SUBMITTED A LETTER DETAILING THE REASON FOR THE REQUEST. THIS LETTER IS IN THE LEAD SUBMISSIONS FOLDER. I'M SHOULD BE A BUTTON THERE. OH, OKAY. . UH, I'M DON NOBLE. UM, YOU ARE MY, UH, I LIVE AROUND THE CORNER AT 1 0 2 TURNER STREET. AND, UM, SO I'M HERE BASICALLY AS A MATTER OF NECESSITY 'CAUSE IT IS MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THIS UNIT IS NOT GOING TO FUNCTION PROPERLY IF THE, UH, CONDENSER IS PUT IN THE BACKYARD BECAUSE OF THE EXTREMELY LONG, UM, LINE RUNS THE, UM, REFRIGERANT LINES AND OTHER LINES THAT HAVE TO RUN TO THE UNIT. SO JUST TO GIVE YOU A LITTLE HISTORY ON THIS HOUSE. SO, UM, I BOUGHT THIS HOUSE IN 1994. IT WAS IN PRETTY BAD CONDITION AND DID PRETTY MUCH A TOTAL RESTORATION REHAB OF IT AT THAT. SO THE HOUSE HAS THREE CENTRAL HEAT AND AIR UNITS, AND AT THAT TIME THE HOUSE ON HAS ON THE SIDE A LITTLE INSET. AND I PUT THE CONDENSERS THERE. I WAS ABLE TO DO THAT BECAUSE THE NEIGHBORING HOUSE WAS SORT OF, UH, VERY DERELICT. IT HAD BEEN CUT INTO LITTLE ONE ROOM, SORT OF TENEMENT LEVEL APARTMENTS. AND, UM, SO THE OWNER DIDN'T LIVE THERE AND THERE WAS NO FENCE. AND SO WE ARE, YOU KNOW, I WAS ABLE TO DO THAT. SO THE OWNER OF THE PROPERTY THEN LATER MOVED INTO THAT AND MADE IT HIS RESIDENCE. AND, UM, I BELIEVE WHEN HE MOVED IN, HE BASICALLY SHOVED THE CONDENSERS UP AGAINST THE WALL OF MY HOUSE AND PUT UP A FENCE. AND SO THEY BASICALLY TOUCHED THE FENCE ON ONE SIDE [02:55:01] AND VIRTUALLY TOUCHED THE BRICK WALL ON THE OTHER, THE OTHER SIDE AT THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE, A DIS DISTANCE BETWEEN THE BRICK WALL OF THE HOUSE AND THE FENCE IS ABOUT TWO FEET, AND AT THE BACK IT'S ABOUT ONE FOOT. SO, UH, THIS UNIT NOW NEEDS TO BE REPLACED AND THERE'S REALLY NO WAY TO GET THE EQUIPMENT IN AND OUT OF THERE. AND IN ADDITION, IT CANNOT BE PROPERLY SERVICED WITH IT IN THAT SPACE. UH, WHEN THE OTHER TWO EXISTING UNITS, UM, NEED TO BE REPLACED, THEY WILL BE PUT IN THE BACKYARD. UM, BECAUSE WHERE THE EQUIPMENT IS IN THE HOUSE, IT, THEY SHOULD FUNCTION PROPERLY WITH CONDENSERS PUT IN THE BACKYARD. UM, BUT YOU CAN SEE THAT THE LENGTH OF THE HOUSE IS BASICALLY ABOUT 70 FEET. AND THE PROBLEM IS THAT THIS EXISTING UNIT IS IN AN ATTIC SPACE THAT IS AT THE VERY FRONT OF THE HOUSE IN THAT PROJECTING BAY. SO THE GAS FURNACE, ALL THE DUCTING, EVERYTHING GOES TO THAT SPOT. AND, UM, TO RUN THE REFRIGERANT LINES FROM THERE, YOU KNOW, THEY'LL HAVE TO DROP LIKE, I DON'T KNOW, PROBABLY A RUN OF 20 FEET OR SO TO GET IT DOWN TO THE GROUND. AND THEN, UM, ROUGHLY 70 FEET TO THE BACK OF THE HOUSE. AND THEN THE VERY BACK OF THE HOUSE BACK THERE IS A WATER HEATER CLOSET WITH DOORS THAT OPEN OUT. SO IT'LL HAVE TO GO AND THAT HAS LIKE A FLAGSTONE PLACE IN FRONT OF IT, SO THEY WOULD HAVE TO GO BEYOND THAT. AND MY CONTRACTOR SAYS THAT EVERY TIME IT'S IN THE LETTER THAT'S IN THE PACKET THERE, APPARENTLY EVERY TIME YOU DO A 90 DEGREE BEND IN THE REFRIGERANT LINE, IT'S LIKE AN ADDITIONAL 10 FEET OF COPPER BECAUSE I GUESS THE 90 DEGREE TURN, YOU KNOW, DECREASES THE FLOW OF EVERYTHING, SLOWS IT DOWN, MAKES IT LESS EFFICIENT. SO, UM, THAT IS WHERE WE ARE. SO I WANTED TO ADDRESS, UM, THE KING WILLIAM ARCHITECTURAL COMMITTEE, UM, PUT A LETTER IN THERE. UM, I DID NOT KNOW THEY WERE HAVING ANYTHING TO DO WITH IT OR MEETING, BUT YESTERDAY AFTER THEIR MEETING, ONE OF THE MEMBERS CALLED ME, UH, TO LET ME KNOW THEY HAD MET AND WHAT THEIR RESULT WAS AND RECOMMENDED THAT I CALL MICKEY CONRAD, WHO WAS JUST HERE EARLIER, AS YOU KNOW. UM, WHICH, SO I DID. AND WE HAD A VERY LONG CONVERSATION. HE SAID THAT UNFORTUNATELY THEY WERE NOT SUPPLIED WITH THE REASON WHY I WAS REQUESTING THE UNITY BE PUT IN THE FRONT YARD. AND HE SAID, YOU KNOW, AS A MATTER OF POLICY, THEY DON'T, DON'T WANT THEM PUT IN THE FRONT YARD. I, YOU KNOW, EXPLAINED EVERYTHING TO HIM, YOU KNOW, THE SITUATION WITH THE SIDE OF THE HOUSE. AND HE SAID HE UNDERSTOOD CLEARLY THE SIDE WAS NO LONGER AN OPTION. AND I EXPLAINED THE SITUATION WITH PUTTING IT IN THE BACK. UM, AND I, I ASKED HIM, YOU KNOW, HE'S AN ARCHITECT, UM, SO HAS SOME KNOWLEDGE OF THIS. AND I SAID, YOU KNOW, IT'S, THERE ARE LIMITATIONS ON HOW LONG THOSE LINES CAN BE. AND HE SAID, YES, HE THOUGHT LIKE 50 TO 75 FEET WAS ABOUT THE MAXIMUM THAT THEY COULD GO FOR THE UNIT TO WORK EFFICIENTLY. UM, HE SAID BASICALLY THEIR ARCHITECTURAL COMMITTEE'S POSITION IS THEY'RE NOT REALLY TAKING A POSITION EITHER WAY. THEY SUPPORT THE DECISION OF THE H D R C. SO WHATEVER Y'ALL COME UP WITH, THEY SUPPORT. THE ONE THING HE ADDED WAS, PERSONALLY THEIR PREFERENCE WOULD BE FOR SCREEN. IF IT'S IN THE FRONT YARD FOR SCREENING, THEY WOULD PREFER TO HAVE PLANTINGS. UM, THE HOUSE HAS A WOOD FENCE, YOU KNOW, THAT I HAD BUILT. IT HAS A BOXWOOD HEDGE RIGHT INSIDE THAT YOU CAN SEE THE PICTURE. UM, AND HE SUGGESTED PLANTING MORE BOXWOODS AND HAVING LIKE AN ADDITIONAL HEDGE AROUND IT. SO IF THAT WAS THE DECISION, I TOLD HIM THAT WOULD BE FINE. I'D BE HAPPY TO DO THAT. IF, YOU KNOW, THAT WAS PREFERABLE TO FENCING IT, I THINK HE THOUGHT FENCE WOULD KIND OF DRAW ATTENTION TO IT RATHER THAN HAVING IT GO AWAY. UM, SO I, I AGREE. I THINK, UH, PLANTINGS WOULD BE A NICE WAY TO DEAL WITH THAT. BUT, UM, THE REALITY IS THE UNITS, YOU KNOW, FROM THE STREET WOULD BE COMPLETELY NOT VISIBLE. UM, TO SEE IT, YOU REALLY WOULD HAVE TO BE ON THE SIDEWALK RIGHT NEXT TO THE FENCE AND LOOKING OVER THAT HEDGE AND IT'LL KIND OF TUCK INTO A LITTLE PLACE RIGHT NEXT TO WHERE THAT BAY PROJECTS, WHICH, UH, YEAH, YOU CAN ACTUALLY SEE IT, IT WILL, IT WILL SCREEN THE GAS METER, WHICH IS RIGHT BEHIND IT. SO THAT'S, THAT'S ALREADY THERE IN THAT SPACE ON THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE. SO THAT'S THE PROPOSED LOCATION. UM, I KNOW, I MEAN, I AGREE FROM AN AESTHETIC STANDPOINT, I THINK THE BACKYARD WOULD BE BETTER, BUT, UH, MY UNDERSTANDING [03:00:01] IS JUST THAT THE UNIT IS NOT GONNA WORK CORRECTLY. UM, IF IT'S PUT BACK THERE. THE CONTRACTOR, YOU KNOW, HIS LINE, HIS LETTER KIND OF GOES THROUGH THIS IN DETAIL, BUT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WOULD BE A RESULT OF IF, IF IT EVEN WORKED IN THE BACKYARD, UM, IS YOU'LL LOSE BTS, WHICH OF COURSE MEANS THE UNIT'S GONNA HAVE TO RUN FOR MUCH LONGER, YOU KNOW, USING A LOT MORE ENERGY. UM, YOU KNOW, I KNOW THIS SUMMER I WAS GETTING URGENT EMAILS EVERY DAY FROM C P S DESPERATELY ASKING THAT WE, YOU KNOW, ELIMINATE ALL ELECTRICAL USE THAT'S POSSIBLE. AND OF COURSE THIS WOULD GO THE OPPOSITE WAY. IT MEANS IT WOULD, YOU KNOW, USE A LOT MORE ELECTRICITY. UM, OF COURSE THERE HAVE GIVEN REBATES FOR YEARS URGING PEOPLE TO GET MORE EFFICIENT EQUIPMENT AND THIS WILL, YOU KNOW, DRAMATICALLY REDUCE THE EFFICIENCY OF THE EQUIPMENT IF IT HAS TO BE BACK THERE. ASIDE FROM THE FACT HE SAID IT'LL RUN, WEAR THE COMPRESSOR OUT EARLIER, WHICH I, I ASSUME THAT MEANS IT'S BASICALLY DAMAGING THE EQUIPMENT OVER TIME. THERE'S AN ISSUE WITH THE OIL BEING ABLE TO RETURN BACK TO THE COMPRESSOR PROPERLY ANYWAY. UM, YOU PROBABLY UNDERSTAND ALL OF THOSE THINGS. SO, UM, I, I GUESS MY, MY OPINION IS I, I THINK THE UNIT COULD GO THERE IN THE CORNER OF THE FRONT YARD AND BE, YOU KNOW, UH, VERY SLIGHT, UH, DEGRADATION OF THE, UH, AESTHETICS OF THE PROPERTY, BUT RESULT IN, YOU KNOW, ESSENTIAL EQUIPMENT WORKING PROPERLY. SO THAT'S, THAT'S WHY I'M MAKING THIS REQUEST. THANK YOU. QUESTIONS FROM THE COMMISSIONER, COMMISSIONER HOLLAND IS, UH, HAVE YOU TALKED TO YOUR CONTRACTOR ABOUT UPSIZING, THE H V A C UNIT? WELL, THIS IS ALREADY A FIVE TON UNIT, SO IT'S LIKE THE BIGGEST ONE. WELL, YOU, THEY'RE LARGER UNITS THAN FIVE TON. UM, YOU KNOW WHERE I'M GOING IS, YOU KNOW MM-HMM. , WHAT IF YOU HAVE TO PUT IT IN THE BACK? UM, DID HE TELL YOU IT'S POSSIBLE? UH, WELL, I, I DON'T KNOW. I DON'T REALLY KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT. I THINK IT'S NOT GOOD. IT'S NOT GONNA WORK PROPERLY, IT'S NOT GONNA WORK THE WAY IT'S SUPPOSED TO. IT'LL HAVE TO WORK A LOT LONGER. I DON'T, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, I GUESS OVER TIME IT'S GONNA DAMAGE THE EQUIPMENT BECAUSE OF HAVING TO TRY TO PUMP EVERYTHING THAT FAR WITH BOTH THE OIL RETURNING TO THE, UM, COMPRESSOR AS NECESSARY AND ALL OF THAT STUFF. AND, AND HOW FAR DID YOU SAY THE LINE SET WAS FROM THE REAR TO THE FRONT OR THE REAR OF THE HOUSE AND TO THE ENTRY POINT? WELL, HE SAID, UH, IN HIS LETTER, THE PROBLEM IS ALL OF THE 90 DEGREE BINS AS WELL. 'CAUSE THEN THE LINE WILL HAVE TO RUN BACK, IT'LL HAVE TO CURVE WITH THE HOUSE, NOT CURVE, GO SURE. INTO THAT INSET. SO THAT WILL BE FOUR 90 DEGREE BINS TO GET IN AND OUT OF THAT INSET AND THEN OUT THE BACK. SO HE WAS SAYING IN HIS LETTER, IT'S EFFECTIVELY AN 160 TO 180 FOOT RUN IS WHAT IT ENDS UP BEING BECAUSE OF ALL THE BINS. WHAT, WHAT IS IT ACTUALLY THOUGH? JUST, UH, SO THE, THE DEPTH OF THE HOUSE IS ABOUT 70 FEET. IT'D PROBABLY HAVE TO GO ABOUT 10 FEET PAST THAT. SO ABOUT 80 FEET PLUS ABOUT 20 FROM THE GROUND UP TO THE ATTIC. SO WHAT'S THAT? UM, A HUNDRED FEET. OKAY. THANKS. YES. QUESTION MR. SAVINA. UM, COUPLE OF QUESTIONS. THE, UH, UNIT THAT YOU'RE SHOWING, THE COA UNIT YOU'RE SHOWING IN THE PACKAGE, IS THAT ACCURATE? IS THAT THE UNIT AND HOW TALL? YEAH, THAT'S THE ONE THAT'S, HOW TALL IS IT? IT IS 45 INCHES. SO, UH, SO THREE FEET, NINE INCHES. WOW. SO I IT'S ABOUT LIKE HERE. YEAH, IT'S PRETTY, PRETTY HIGH, PRETTY TALL BOX HEDGES. RIGHT? UM, THE ONLY THING IS THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE, YOU KNOW, IS VERY TALL. MM-HMM. MM-HMM. . 'CAUSE THE FLOOR OF THE HOUSE, OF COURSE STARTS, I DON'T KNOW, ABOUT FOUR FEET OFF THE GROUND AND THEN THE MM-HMM. THE CEILINGS ARE 12 FEET, YOU KNOW, AND IT'S GOT A HIGH PEAKED ROOF ON IT. SO YOU HAVE A, YOU HAVE A TALL FACADE. I THINK THE TOP OF THE UNIT WOULD BE ACTUALLY BELOW THE WINDOW SILLS MM-HMM. IN THE FRONT. MM-HMM. AND YOU CAN SEE THERE'S KIND OF ARUM SHRUB THERE. SO IT'D BE ON THE LEFT. YEAH. BETWEEN THAT SHRUB AND THE FENCE. OKAY. AND THEN RIGHT NOW WHERE ARE YOUR, WHERE'S YOUR AIR HANDLER? SO ALL OF THAT'S IN THAT ATTIC ALLEY IN THE VERY FRONT. SO THE, THOSE FRONT WINDOWS ON THAT BAY, YOU SEE IT'S THE ATTIC DIRECTLY ABOVE THAT. THE RIGHT IN THE FRONT. AND DID YOU SAY YOU HAD THREE SEPARATE UNITS? YEAH, THEY'RE THREE, UH, UNITS. SO THERE'S ANOTHER ONE IN THE ATTIC SPACE AT THE VERY BACK OF THE HOUSE, SO THAT'LL BE PERFECT TO PUT THAT, YOU KNOW, CONDENSER IN THE BACK. [03:05:01] AND THEN THERE'S ONE ABOUT MIDWAY IN THE HOUSE TOO. AND I ASSUME THAT ONE UNDER THE, COULD GO IN THE BACK UNDER THE FLAT PORTION OF THE ROOF. IT'S ACTUALLY ON THE SECOND FLOOR, KIND OF MIDWAY BACK THE HOUSE. OKAY. AND, UM, DO YOU HAVE THE THREE, BECAUSE THERE, THERE ARE THREE SEPARATE UNITS. MM-HMM. , THIS UNIT DOES ABOUT TWO THIRDS OF THE GROUND FLOOR, THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE. MM-HMM. . UM, ANOTHER ONE DOES THE BALANCE OF THE FIRST FLOOR BACK OF THE HOUSE AND THE THIRD UNIT DOES THE SECOND FLOOR. OKAY. OKAY. THANK YOU. SURE. AND CAN YOU CLARIFY WHERE THE EXISTING CONDENSING UNIT IS FOR THIS? SO ALL THREE OF THEM ARE IN THAT LITTLE INSET THAT YOU SEE ON THE, ON THE PLAN AND THE SURVEY. UM, THIS ONE IS CLOSEST TO THE FRONT OF THOSE THREE AND THEY'RE ALL KIND OF MASHED IN THERE. AND, UM, YOU KNOW, IT'S A TERRIBLE PROBLEM 'CAUSE THE SERVICE PEOPLE CAN'T GET IN THERE TO SERVICE 'EM, TO CLEAN 'EM OUT AND ALL THE STUFF, YOU KNOW, THAT YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO DO AT LEAST TWICE A YEAR TO KEEP 'EM RUNNING PROPERLY. UM, THE REASON THIS ONE IS BEING REPLACED, IT'S OLD, IT'S, IT HAS A REFRIGERANT LEAK, SO THE AIR CONDITIONING IS NOT REALLY WORKING ANYMORE. IT'S NOT REALLY NOT WORKING ANYMORE. AND IT'S R 22, WHICH IS THE OLD DISCONTINUED REFRIGERANT THAT YOU CAN'T EVEN GET ANYMORE. AND THAT'S WHY THEY'S SAID, YOU KNOW, YOUR CHOICE IS TO REPLACE IT. THAT'S IT, MR. CHAIR, I WOULD MAKE A MOTION. ONE OTHER QUESTION. OH, UM, DID YOU AND YOUR MECHANICAL CONTRACTOR TALK ABOUT MOVING ONE OR BOTH OF THE BACK UNITS NOW AND PUT THIS LARGER NEW UNIT IN THAT, UH, CURRENT LOCATION? WELL, I, I REALLY DON'T WANT, I MEAN, I WANT TO MOVE ALL OF THOSE UNITS OUT OF THAT CURRENT LOCATION. NUMBER ONE, YOU, YOU THIS, IF YOU SAW ON THE SPECS THIS UNIT WEIGHS MORE THAN 300 POUNDS AND THERE ISN'T SPACE. I MEAN THERE ARE, YOU CAN'T GET IT INTO THE SPACE TO GET IT BACK THERE. UM, ASIDE FROM THE, SO RELOCATING, I'M SORRY, RELOCATING THE TWO, UM, ALL OF THEM WILL BE RELOCATED WHEN THEY HAVE TO BE REPLACED. THE LAW WILL BE RELOCATED. OKAY. THANK YOU. YEAH. GOT IT'S, THAT PLACE IS, IS NOT A GOOD PLACE ANYMORE. COMMISSIONER VELASQUEZ? YES SIR. I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE A SUBMITTED BY THE APPLICANT WITH THE, THE RECOMMENDATION. THAT IS THE RECOMMENDATION IF THE H D R C APPROVES INSTALLATION IN THE FRONT YARD, STAFF RECOMMENDS THE ADDITIONAL STIPULATION TO ENHANCE SCREENING BE DESIGNED AND SUBMITTED TO STAFF THAT IS CONSISTENT WITH THE STYLE AND MATERIAL OF THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE. SO I IMAGINE THAT MOTION MEANS THAT THE APPLICANT WILL WORK WITH STAFF TO WORK ON SCREENING AND THAT THE MOTION IS TO ENABLE IT IN THE FRONT. AND THEN I KNOW WE'LL HAVE DISCUSSION ABOUT IT AFTER. THAT'S MY MOTION. SECOND MOTION IS SECOND. WELL, WELL, MR. CHAIR, THERE ARE TWO FOR ME COMPELLING REASONS. I MEAN, I DO QUESTION WHETHER OR NOT Y'ALL HAVE CONSIDERED AN ENTIRE UNIT UPSTAIRS AND WHERE THAT OTHER UNIT IS, BUT THAT HAS THE FURNACE AND EVERYTHING ALL. YOU'RE STILL NOT GONNA GET AWAY FROM HAVING THE COMPRESSOR. RIGHT. SO THE COMPRESSOR IS NOT SOMETHING THAT IS INTERRUPTING YOUR BUILDING. IT'S SOMETHING THAT'S REVERSIBLE OR THE FUTURE, SAY YOU BUY THE PROPERTY NEXT DOOR, YOU'RE ABLE TO PUT YOUR AIR CONDITIONING UNITS WHEREVER YOU WANT. RIGHT, RIGHT. BUT IT, BUT, BUT IT DOES MEAN THAT IF TECHNOLOGY CHANGES AND PROVIDES, UM, DIFFERENT OPTIONS, UM, THAT AT THAT TIME HE CAN ADDRESS THAT. BUT IT, IT DOESN'T SEEM THAT THIS IS ANYBODY'S FAULT THAT THE UNIT'S GOTTA GO SOMEWHERE. AND WE ALL KNOW THAT PLACEMENT OF A, OF A COMPRESSOR UNIT HAS EVERYTHING TO DO WITH VENTILATION. RIGHT. IT'S GOTTA BE ABLE TO GET AIR MM-HMM. , UH, IN, IN THE 360 AROUND THE, THE COMPRESSOR, IT IS UNFORTUNATE THAT IT ENDS UP IN THE FRONT, BUT I MEAN, GOOD ARGUMENT COULD BE MADE. THIS HOUSE WAS NEVER INTENDED TO HAVE A AIR CONDITION IN IT. SO REALLY THE REAL SOLUTION IS DON'T PUT AN AIR CONDITION IN THE HOUSE, BUT OBVIOUSLY, YOU KNOW, WE'LL PUT AN AIR CONDITION IN HOUSES. SO, UH, IT SEEMS TO BE THE MOST REASONABLE SOLUTION FOR THIS TIME AND PLACE. THANK YOU SIR. THANK YOU COMMISSIONER VASQUEZ. I WAS JUST WONDERING WHY DO YOU HAVE THREE UNITS? IS IT A AIRBNB OR, UH, SO WHEN I, UH, REDID THE HOUSE, WE OPENED IN EARLY 1995 AS A BED AND BREAKFAST. AND UM, IT STILL ESSENTIALLY IS, I MEAN WITH C O V I D, YOU KNOW, THAT WRECKED EVERYTHING AND WE STARTED JUST RENTING IT AS A WHOLE HOUSE. 'CAUSE PEOPLE DIDN'T WANT INDIVIDUAL ROOMS 'CAUSE THEY THOUGHT THEY'D GET SICK AND DIE. UM, THAT'S STILL WHAT WE'RE DOING. BUT ANYWAY, I MEAN IT'S, IT'S ALWAYS BEEN BEEN AIR CONDITIONED. I'M SORRY, DID I ANSWER YOUR QUESTION OR KIND OF YEAH, YEAH. UM, BUT IT'S NOT [03:10:01] YOUR, YOU DO LIVE THERE OR I LIVE RIGHT AROUND THE CORNER. I LIVE ABOUT FOUR HOUSES AWAY. OKAY. I'M FINE WITH THE, YOU PUTTING IT IN IT, PUTTING IT IN THAT KIND OF CORNER AREA WHERE THE, I GUESS THE GAS METER IS AND RIGHT. SCREENING IT WITH SOME NICE OR SOME THICK BOX WOOD OR SOMETHING. RIGHT. OTHER COMMENTS? COMMISSIONER SAVINO? YEAH, I GUESS THIS IS A QUESTION. UM, I'M LOOKING AT A GOOGLE STREET VIEW AND I SEE WHAT COULD BE SKYLIGHTS ON, ON THE SECOND FLOOR. MM-HMM. IS THE SECOND FLOOR A HABITABLE? YEAH, SECOND FLOOR. IT'S A FINISHED AD. IT'S FINISHED AS A SECOND FLOOR. CORRECT. OKAY, THANKS. OKAY. I JUST MAY I HAVE A, OH, I'M SORRY. SORRY I MR. HOLLAND? YEAH, I JUST, I JUST WANNA SAY THAT, UM, YOU CAN RUN A LINE SET 250 FEET. UM, YOU JUST CAN, UH, THERE ARE LONG LINE SET APPLICATIONS. SO YOUR CONTRACTOR SAYING THAT IT WON'T WORK ISN'T ENTIRELY ACCURATE. UM, THERE IS A WAY TO MAKE IT WORK. YOU MIGHT NOT HAVE TO MAKE THEM WORK FOR IT A LITTLE BIT. UM, FOR THAT REASON, I WON'T BE SUPPORTING THE MOTION. THANK YOU. WE HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE. GIBBS. AYE. SAV NAY VELASQUEZ? AYE. ZUKA? AYE. VASQUEZ. NAYYY CERVANTES? YES. HOLLAND NAY AND FETZER NAY. SPLIT VOTE. SPLIT VOTE. DO WE HAVE ANOTHER MOTION? DO DO WE DO DO WE HAVE, CAN WE, CAN WE HAVE A COMMENT AS WELL OR? NO, WE HAVE TO WAIT FOR A MOTION IF THERE'S QUESTIONS. YEAH, YEAH. WELL, LET, LET ME, LET ME ASK A QUESTION FOR STAFF. UM, IN, IN TERMS OF THE, THE ATTACHING OF LINES, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE THINGS, ONE OF THE CONSIDERATIONS ABOUT GOING FAR WITH THESE LINES IS I KNOW THEY'VE GOT A HOOK TO THE BRICK AND THEY GOTTA KIND OF FIND THEIR WAY TO BE SOMETHING THAT, THAT YOU DON'T ALWAYS KNOW IS ATTACHED TO THIS BUILDING THAT HAS A HOT, COLD, UH, UM, PROCESS. A SWEATING PROCESS. YOU, YOU KNOW, TO ME IT JUST SEEMS THAT HAVING SOMETHING THAT CAN BE, THAT IS REVERSIBLE. HOW DO YOU LOOK AT, HOW DOES STAFF LOOK AT NEW LINES ON THE FACADE, WHETHER IT'S A SECONDARY FACADE OR A PRIMARY FACADE? HOW DO YOU FEEL OR TREAT THAT INTRUSION ONTO SUCH A PRISTINE BUILDING? PRISTINE WALLS? BRICK. THIS WOULD BE IN THE ATTIC, CORRECT? WELL, BUT DON'T, DON'T THEY HAVE TO, DON'T THE LINES HAVE TO TRAVEL OUTSIDE THE BUILDING TO GET TO UP, OR YOU'RE IMAGINING THAT THEY GO UP DIRECTLY AND THAT THE LINES ONLY TRAVEL INSIDE THE ATTIC, RIGHT. THEY WOULD GO FROM THE CONDENSER TO WHEREVER THEY'RE ENTERING THE HOUSE. AND SO, YES. I MEAN, THE LESS INTERVENTIONS THAT ARE PHYSICAL ATTACHMENTS TO THE BUILDING, THE BETTER. UM, BUT THE QUESTION TODAY WAS ABOUT VISIBILITY FROM THE FRONT. SO STAFF, WHEN YOU MAKE A RECOMMENDATION, UM, HOW DO YOU GUYS FACTOR IN FEASIBILITY? I MEAN, I THINK A COMMISSIONER, FEDERAL COMMISSIONER MAKES A GOOD POINT ABOUT IT. IT CAN BE DONE. UM, YEAH, WHAT I, WHAT WE ALWAYS SAY IS, OUR JOB AS STAFF IS TO INTERPRET THE GUIDELINES. AND THERE'S A LOT OF VARIABLES THAT GO INTO EVERY SINGLE PROJECT. AND THAT'S WHAT YOU ALL ARE HERE FOR, IS TO HEAR THOSE KIND OF, UM, UH, ADDITIONAL CONDITIONS AND VARIABLES AND, UH, JUST DIFFERENT SITUATIONS THAT PEOPLE FIND THEMSELVES IN AND FIND THE BEST SOLUTION FORWARD. RIGHT. SO I GUESS THE QUESTION WOULD BE, AND I DON'T HAVE AN ANSWER, IS, IS THE FEASIBILITY OF PUTTING IT BACK THERE, IS IT A, IS IT A BIGGER UNIT? IS IT A COMMERCIALS SIZE UNIT? ARE YOU TALKING COMMERCIAL LINES? WHAT ARE WE LOOKING AT, I GUESS WOULD BE, WELL, I'M SORRY. WAS THAT A QUESTION TO ME? OR, OH, OKAY. I GUESS IT'S AN OPEN QUESTION TO MY LITTLE COMMISSIONER. 'CAUSE I DON'T KNOW ABOUT THE FEASIBILITY. I MEAN, ONE OF THE PROBLEMS WITH THE BIGGER UNIT IS GONNA BE EXPENSE. I MEAN, THIS THING IS ALREADY ENORMOUSLY EXPENSIVE AND I WOULD LOVE TO AVOID IT, BUT I, YOU KNOW, I DON'T REALLY HAVE A CHOICE. 'CAUSE THE EXISTING UNIT USES THE REFRIGERANT THAT YOU CAN'T EVEN GET ANYMORE. IT'S BANNED AND OUTLAWED AND WON'T, YOU KNOW, CAN'T EVEN BE MANUFACTURED. SO, I MEAN, I'M, YOU KNOW, RELUCTANTLY DOING THIS BECAUSE IT'S NECESSARY. I MEAN, ONE OF THE OTHER ISSUES, I DIDN'T REALLY GO INTO IT, BUT I MEAN, THERE'S LIMITED SPACE AT THE BACK OF THE PROPERTY TOO, BECAUSE BEYOND THAT WATER HEATER CLOSET, THERE'S A SMALL SPACE. AND THEN WE [03:15:01] HAVE A POOL IN THE BACK THERE, AND THERE'S ALL OF THE POOL EQUIPMENT. SO THERE'S PROBABLY BARELY ENOUGH SPACE TO PUT THE TWO CONDENSER, THE OTHER TWO CONDENSERS, IF AND WHEN THEY HAD TO BE MOVED. UM, YOU'RE RUNNING OUTTA SPACE. 'CAUSE THEN, UM, THE POOL HAS A HEATER AND A FILTER AND TWO PUMPS AND A ELECTRICAL PANEL THAT ALL ARE ALL LINED UP ALONG THE PROPERTY LINE THERE, YOU KNOW, ALL THE LINES ARE UNDERGROUND AND EVERYTHING. SO, UM, IF YOU HAD TO HOP SCOTCH THAT YOU'RE GETTING REALLY, REALLY, REALLY FAR FROM THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE, I'M, UM, SAYING THAT THE LINES CAN BE RUN 250 FEET. I MEAN, I, I, I, LET'S SEE. I DON'T KNOW. I'M NOT, LET'S SEE IF WE CAN GET TO, I HAVE A, I HAVE A MOTION, MR. CHAIR. I THINK I HAVE A MOTION. YEAH, I'D LIKE TO, I'D LIKE TO MOVE FORWARD CONTINUANCE, JUST SO THAT WE CAN KIND OF RE RE-LOOK AT THIS WITH SOME MORE DATA ON, ON FEASIBILITY. I THINK, UH, YOU KNOW, BUT THAT'S WHY I'D LIKE TO BE, AT LEAST FOR DISCUSSION, I'D LIKE TO MOVE FOR CONTINUANCE ALSO WITH A, UH, TIME CERTAIN TO COME BACK NEXT, NEXT MEETING. THIS SHOULDN'T BE HARD TO, YEAH. NEXT, NEXT, UH, MEETING. I'LL, I'LL SECOND THAT MOTION TO SECOND. YEAH. YOU KNOW, GOING BACK TO THE FEASIBILITY, RIGHT? AND I'M NOT TRYING TO DISPARAGE MY, MY FELLOW COMMISSIONER HERE. IF, IF, YOU KNOW, IF YOU CAN PUT IT IN THE BACK WITH A LITTLE EXTRA LINE, AND THE COST IS MAYBE OPERATING COST IS FIVE, 10 BUCKS A MONTH MORE, WELL, YOU KNOW, IT'S, YOU HAVE A HISTORIC HOME. THAT'S, THAT'S KIND OF SOME OF THE, SOME OF THE, UH, PITFALLS GOING ALONG WITH IT. IF THE COST IS DOUBLE RIGHT, YOUR OPERATING COST THEN DOUBLES, WELL THEN I WOULD KIND OF THINK, WELL, THE FEASIBILITY IS NOT REALLY THERE. WE KNOW CAN, KIND OF MAKES MORE SENSE ENVIRONMENTALLY FROM USING ENERGY, YOU KNOW, PUTTING IT UP FRONT AND TRY AND COVER IT. SO, UH, I'D LIKE TO KNOW MORE ABOUT, YOU KNOW, HOW FEASIBLE IS IT, YOU KNOW, HOW MUCH MORE IS IT GONNA COST? NOT JUST INSTALLATION, BUT OPERATING, YOU KNOW, YOU, YOU'RE BURNING ENERGY, YOU'RE USING POWER, UH, AND THAT'S A COMMODITY NOWADAYS, RIGHT? SO YEAH, THAT'S, THAT'S WHERE I'M AT. DO YOU HAVE ANY RECOMMENDATIONS ON WHERE THAT INFORMATION CAN BE OBTAINED? 'CAUSE WHAT, WHAT I WELL THINK, I, I, I, MY MY AIR CONDITIONING GUY, I MEAN HE RESEARCHED ALL KINDS OF STUFF AND WAS HAVING A VERY DIFFICULT TIME FINDING. I MEAN, I DON'T, RIGHT? YOU SHOULD BE, HE SHOULD BE ABLE TO FACTOR IN, YOU KNOW, THE, THE AMOUNT OF ENERGY PER SQUARE FOOT, RIGHT? OF RUNNING THE LINES BETWEEN TWO DIFFERENT, BE ABLE TO PULL UP TWO DIFFERENT OPTIONS AND SAY, HEY LISTEN, THIS, THIS LOCATION WOULD HAVE THIS MANY 90 DEGREES. MM-HMM. OPERATING COST WOULD BE X, RIGHT? MM-HMM. , THIS LOCATION IN THE BACK WOULD HAVE THIS MANY BINS AND THIS MUCH LINE OPERATING COST WOULD BE INSTALLATION COST AND OPERATING COST WOULD BE X. YOU KNOW, AND, AND YOU KIND OF PUT THAT ON A LITTLE, LITTLE SPREADSHEET AND KIND OF SEE, SEE WHERE IT'S AT, YOU KNOW? OKAY. WHAT DOES A BIGGER UNIT, IT WOULD HAVE TO BE A BIGGER UNIT IN THE BACK. IF THAT UNIT THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT IS, IS, IS, IS THE CAP FOR RESIDENTIAL? WELL NOW YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT A COMMERCIAL UNIT. WHAT DOES THAT COST? RIGHT? RIGHT. SO, AND, AND, AND I'M NOT PUTTING IT ON YOU, I'M JUST SAYING THESE ARE THE QUESTIONS THAT WOULD HAVE TO KIND OF LOOK AT, TO KIND OF SEE WHERE WE CAN MAKE A DECISION. BECAUSE IF IT IS A COMMERCIAL UNIT, IF YOUR GUY SAYS, HEY, IT'S, IT'S A COMMERCIAL UNIT, NOW YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT A UNIT THAT RUNS A MUCH BIGGER BUILDING JUST TO COMPENSATE FOR THE LENGTH. WELL WHAT'S THAT GONNA COST? YOU KNOW? AND THEN WE, WE WEIGH THAT. WE FACTOR THAT IN. THANK YOU COMMISSIONER VASQUEZ. SO IS THE REASON WHY YOU'RE GETTING THREE UNITS BECAUSE YOU'RE AIRBNB UNIT IT OR, OR WHAT IS IT? NO, NO, THERE, THE, THERE THREE UNITS HAVE BEEN THERE SINCE 1995. I MEAN, SINCE THE HOUSE WAS REHABBED AND IT WAS ALL HEATED AND AIR CONDITIONED, IT TOOK THREE UNITS TO HEAT AND COOL THE WHOLE HOUSE. THEY'VE ALWAYS BEEN THERE HOUSE AS JUST ONE FAMILY. OR I'M SORRY, YOU RENT THE HOUSE TO ONE FAMILY. IT, 'CAUSE I LOOKED IT UP ON BCAT AND IT'S 2200 SQUARE FEET. I HAVE A FOUR TON UNIT THAT, UH, COOLS A 2,400 SQUARE FEET. YEAH, THAT, THAT, OH, THAT'S JUST THE FIRST FLOOR. YEAH. UM, AND THEN ONE UNIT IS UPSTAIRS. YEAH, ONE UNIT DOES THE WHOLE UPSTAIRS AND THEN TWO UNITS DO THE DOWNSTAIRS. UM, THIS IS THE LARGEST UNIT. IT'S A FIVE TON. THE OTHER TWO UNIT UNITS ARE NOT AS LARGE. THEY'RE NOT TINY. I DON'T KNOW. I DON'T KNOW. I HAVEN'T CHECKED. THEY'RE PROBABLY, I DUNNO, THREE TON OR FOUR TON OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. LET'S SEE HOW THIS VOTE GOES. MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE? GIBBS? AYE. SAVINA? AYE. VELAZQUEZ AYE. ZUKA AYE. VASQUEZ. AYE. CERVANTES? YES. HOLLAND. AYE. AND FETZER AYE. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. SO YOU CAN WORK WITH BRIAN, UH, ON CLARIFICATION OF THE, THE MOTION. THANK YOU. ALRIGHT, THANK YOU. AGENDA ITEM 20. ARE YOU FOR NO, I THOUGHT YOU SAID 5 31 DIVIDE. NO, I'M SORRY. OH. AGENDA [03:20:01] ITEM NUMBER 20 H D R C CASE 2023 DASH 3 72 1 0 2 HERMINE BOULEVARD. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO DEMOLISH THE REAR ACCESSORY AND CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL OF NEW CONSTRUCTION OF A 455 SQUARE FOOT STRUCTURE. STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF THE DEMOLITION OF THE REAR ACCESSORY STRUCTURE BASED ON FINDINGS A THROUGH E STAFF RECOMMENDS CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL OF THE REPLACEMENT STRUCTURE BASED ON FINDINGS A AND F THROUGH J WITH THE FOLLOWING STIPULATIONS, ONE THAT THE HARDY SIDING BE INSTALLED WITH THE MAXIMUM SIX INCH REVEAL IN THE SMOOTH SIDE FACING THE OUTWARD FOR THE REAR ACCESSORY STRUCTURE. AND TWO, THAT THE APPLICANT INSTALL WINDOWS THAT MEET STAFF STANDARD, UH, WINDOW STIPULATIONS AND SUBMITS UPDATED SPECIFICATIONS TO STAFF FOR REVIEW AND APPROVAL. UM, I ALSO WOULD LIKE, UM, THE APPLICANT, ALBERT INSIGNIA IS HERE VIRTUALLY. UM, I WOULD ALSO LIKE TO NOTE, UM, UH, TODAY WHEN I TALKED WITH THE APPLICANT, THEY HAD EXPRESSED THAT THEY ARE WILLING TO AGREE WITH ALL THE STAFF STIPULATIONS. MR. CHAIR, I HAVE A MOTION. I DON'T BELIEVE THERE'S ANY PUBLIC COMMENTS. UH, MR. INIA, DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD? UM, NO SIR. NOTHING TO ADD. WE'RE JUST GONNA GO AHEAD AND FOLLOW THE STIPULATIONS THAT THEY HAVE ON A HARDY SIDING. UM, BUT WE'RE GONNA GO AHEAD AND, UH, DO WOOD SIDING TO MATCH THE EXISTING HOME. OKAY? YEAH. AND THEN, UM, JUST FOLLOW WHATEVER STIPULATIONS THEY HAVE FOR THE NEW, NEW CONSTRUCTION. WE DO HAVE A ENGINEER AND A DESIGNER WORKING WITH US, SO WE WILL MAKE CHANGES ACCORDINGLY. UM, BEFORE WE CAN WE BEGIN TO BUILD. OKAY. THANK YOU MR. CHAIR. I MOVE FOR APPROVAL WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS. SECOND. YOU HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND? ANY DISCUSSION? I HAVE A QUESTION. MR. CHAIR? YES. COMMISSIONER GIBBS QUESTION FOR THE APPLICANT. SO, UM, ACTUALLY FOR STAFF FIRST AND TO THE APPLICANT, SO, UM, THIS IS A VIOLATION. SO, UM, STAFF WENT TO, UM, TO VISIT A PROPERTY, BUT, UM, WERE INFORMED THAT THE STRUCTURE WAS REMOVED. SO WE'RE, UM, STAFF IS RECOMMENDING APPROVAL, UM, BASED ON THE FACT THAT IT WAS ALREADY REMOVED AND THIS APPROVING A NEW CONSTRUCTION. IS THAT WHAT WE'RE DOING? UH, CORRECT. SO, UM, I HAD REACHED OUT OR STAFF HAD REACHED OUT TO THE APPLICANT TO DO A SITE VISIT AS COMMON FOR THESE TYPES OF REQUESTS. UM, THE APPLICANT NOTED THAT THE STRUCTURE HAD BEEN REMOVED. UM, THE, UM, UH, THE APPLICANT NOTED, UH, LOSS OF STRUCTURAL INTEGRITY. UM, THE FOUNDATION WAS FAILING, UM, THE, UH, FRAMING WAS FAILING AS WELL. UM, AND SO STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS WOULD BE THAT, UM, TO RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THE REMOVAL OF THE STRUCTURE AS IF IT HADN'T HAPPENED YET. AND THEN THE, UM, APPROVAL FOR CONCEPTUAL, UM, OR CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS FOR THE NEW CONSTRUCTION. UH, BUT THIS APPLICATION WILL COME BACK FOR FINAL APPROVAL, UM, BEFORE A C O A IS ISSUED FOR THAT. THANK YOU. AND FOR THE APPLICANT. SO, CURIOUS AS TO THE, UM, DEMOLITION. SO WHY DID, WHY DID THAT HAPPEN? I UNDERSTAND WHAT STAFF JUST MENTIONED, BUT WHY DID YOU MOVE FORWARD WITH THAT WITHOUT, YOU KNOW, CHECKING WITH O H P AND SEEING WHAT NEEDED TO BE DONE? WELL, ACTUALLY THE HOMEOWNERS HAD ALREADY BEEN, UM, GETTING, SO WHEN I WENT PRIOR, THEY HAD ALREADY KIND OF D DONE SOME HOMEWORK. UM, THEY HAD VISITED THE CITY AND THE CITY SAID, TOLD 'EM, AS LONG AS THEY DEMOED BELOW 300 SQUARE FEET, THEY DON'T NEED A PERMIT. THEY CAN DO IT THEMSELVES AS A HOMEOWNER. UM, SO THEY DID LEAVE A REMAINING PART BACK THERE FOR LIKE, I GUESS FOR THEIR STORAGE, A LITTLE BIT OF STORAGE AND WHAT ELSE? OKAY, SO WHEN I WENT, I WENT OUT, UH, TO VIEW THE PROPERTY. UH, THE FOUR BY FOURS WERE FLOATING, LIKE, UM, YEAH, SO WHEN THEY WENT TO DEMO, I WENT TO HELP. UM, 'CAUSE THE STRUCTURE WAS PRETTY BAD. UM, SO THEY HAD FAMILY OVER BROTHERS, SISTERS, UNCLES, THEY BARBECUED AND THEY WERE DEMOING THE PLACE AND YOU KNOW, I, I WENT TO HELP 'CAUSE WELL, I'M A PROFESSIONAL AND UM, YOU KNOW, THEY, WHEN I GOT THERE, THEY WERE TRYING TO GET UP ON THE ROOF AND THERE'S NO WAY I GOT 'EM DOWN. SO WE LITERALLY TORE EVERYTHING DOWN FROM THE BOTTOM UP BECAUSE THE STRUCTURE WAS, YEAH, HE COULDN'T HOLD ANYBODY, YOU KNOW, THEY WERE TRYING TO GET ON TOP TO DEMO THAT ROOF AND YEAH, I JUST WASN'T GONNA LET THAT HAPPEN. BUT JUST TO CLARIFY, IT, IT DIDN'T TRIGGER A [03:25:01] PERMIT FROM D S D AND SO THE HOMEOWNER THOUGHT THEY WERE GOOD TO GO. THAT DOESN'T MEAN THEY DIDN'T NEED APPROVAL FROM HISTORIC. OH, OKAY. SO THAT WAS ANOTHER THING SHE DID. UM, SO WHEN SHE WENT TO THE CITY, THEY SAW THE YEAR THE SHED WAS BUILT. SO THE CITY TOLD THEM IT'S NOT A HISTORIC, SO THAT WAS ANOTHER THING THAT KIND OF CONVINCED HIM THAT THEY COULD DEMO. WE'RE, WE'RE TRYING WHAT? YEAH, WE DO TRAINING WITH THE D S D DEPARTMENT RIDERS ALL THE TIME. UM, AND SOMETIMES THESE THINGS HAPPEN, UNFORTUNATELY. OH, OKAY. YEAH. UM, YEAH, THE, THE, THE BEAR COUNTY, UM, UH, OCCASIONALLY THE BILL DATES ARE INCORRECT AND SO THAT WOULD I'M SURE LED TO THE MISUNDERSTANDING AS WELL. OKAY. OKAY. THANK YOU. OTHER QUESTIONS? YOU HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE? GIBBS? AYE. SAVINA NAY. VELAZQUEZ AYE. MOOKA AYE. VESQUEZ. NAYYY CERVANTES? YES. HOLLAND. AYE. AND FETZER NAY. MOTION CARRIES. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. AGENDA ITEM 21. AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 21 H G R C CASE, CASE NUMBER 2023 DASH 4 0 1 5 31 DIVINE STREET. THE APPLICANT'S REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT A 12 FEET TALL METAL CARPORT. STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF THE REQUEST BASED ON FINDINGS A THROUGH D WITH THE FOLLOWING STIPULATIONS. ONE, THAT THE APPLICANT REDUCED THE HEIGHT OF THE CARPORT TO BE SUBORDINATE TO THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE. TWO, THAT THE APPLICANT MOVE THE CARPORT FURTHER TOWARDS THE REAR OF THE PROPERTY AWAY FROM THE FRONT FACADE OF THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE AND SEND TO STAFF AN UPDATED SITE PLAN FOR APPROVAL. THREE. THAT THE APPLICANT CONSTRUCT A CARPORT WITH WOOD MATERIALS. FOUR, THAT THE APPLICANT INSTALL A STAINING SEA METAL ROOF ON THE CARPORT WITH STAFF STANDARD STIPULATIONS AS LISTED. FIVE. THAT THE APPLICANT MEET ALL SETBACK STANDARDS AS REQUIRED BY CITY ZONING REQUIREMENTS AND OBTAIN A VARIANCE FROM THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT IF APPLICABLE. THE APPLICANT, TINA PALMER IS HERE IN PERSON. THERE'S NO LETTERS AND NO VOICEMAILS TO REVIEW. THANK YOU. YES MA'AM. HI, MY NAME'S TINA PALMER. I LIVE AT 5 31 FINE STREET. OKAY. OKAY. UH, I HAD THIS CARPORT BUILT TWO YEARS AGO, , AND NOW THEY'RE TELLING ME THINGS. UM, I HAD IT BUILT, I HAD SOMEONE BUILD IT FOR ME. I THOUGHT THEY GOT PERMITS, WHICH OBVIOUSLY THEY DIDN'T. UM, AND WHEN I HAD THIS BUILT, I WAS ON CEDAR STREET AND THERE WAS A CARPORT BUILT THERE AND I LIKED IT AND I SAID, THIS IS WHAT I WANT, BUT I WANTED IT METAL. THE GUY SAID, I I CAN DO IT. OKAY. SO I HAD IT DONE. UM, THOUGHT HE HAD GOTTEN PERMITS, BUT OBVIOUSLY NOT. AND, UM, THE, WHERE IT'S BUILT, IT IS NOT IN FRONT OF THE HOUSE AT ALL. UM, I WAS TOLD I WAS ABLE TO BUILD FROM THE PA THE PATIO THAT I HAVE IN THE FRONT. UM, AS LONG AS IT'S NOT IN FRONT OF THAT, IT HAD TO BE AT THE CORNER OF MY HOUSE. AND IT'S NOT EVEN AT THE CORNER OF MY HOUSE. IT'S BACK EVEN FURTHER. AND, UM, WHEN I ASKED TO HAVE IT BUILT, I HAVE AN RV SO I NEEDED IT HIGHER THAN A REGULAR CARPORT BECAUSE THE RV HAD TO COVER THE CARPORT, HAD TO CARRY, COVER THE RV, WHICH IS NOT MUCH HIGHER THAN WHAT THE RV IS BECAUSE IT HAS AN AC ON IT. SO I HAD TO MAKE SURE THAT THE AC WOULD COVER, YOU KNOW, I DIDN'T WANT IT TO HIT WHEN THEY WOULD BRING IN THE RV, AS YOU CAN SEE, YOU COULD SEE IT THERE AND YOU CAN SEE WHERE IT STARTS. IT STARTS WHERE THAT WINDOW IS. IT'S BEHIND ALL THE ELECTRICAL AND THAT'S FAR COMPARED. IT'S NOT IN FRONT OF THE HOUSE AT ALL. AND, UM, I CHOSE METAL BECAUSE MY NEIGHBORS DOWN THE STREET, THERE'S THREE OTHER HOUSES, THEY ALL HAVE METAL. I DROVE UP AND DOWN THAT STREET AND I SAID, WELL, I [03:30:01] GUESS I CAN HAVE METAL 'CAUSE EVERYBODY HAS A METAL CARPORT ON MY STREET. EVERY SINGLE PERSON, I DON'T KNOW ANYBODY THAT HAS A WOOD, A WOOD CARPORT ON MY STREET. AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO DO. NOW I'M ASKING FOR THE VARIANCE FOR THE, THE, FOR THE AIR CONDITIONER OF THE RV. I, I MEAN, THERE'S THE RVS IN THE BACK AND I NEEDED A VARIANCE FOR IT, I GUESS. OKAY, THANK YOU. QUESTIONS FROM THE COMMISSION? YES, MR. CHAIR, I HAVE A QUESTION FOR STAFFS. MONTES? YEAH. STAFF. WHAT IS, I DON'T WANT TO USE THE WORD STATUTE, BUT WHAT ARE THE LIMITATIONS WHEN, UH, LOOKING AT, UH, VIOLATIONS? IS IT SIX MONTHS, 12 MONTHS, YEARS? CAN YOU GO BACK AND PICK A HOUSE THAT HAS A VIOLATION FROM 10 YEARS AGO? WHAT, HOW DO YOU GUYS FACTOR THAT IN? WE GENERALLY DO A COUPLE OF YEARS. IF WE CAN DOCUMENT TWO YEARS SEEING I'VE HAD IT . THAT'S HOW IT'S, UM, THIS REQUEST ALSO CAME IN AS A 3 1 1 REPORT. AND SO THAT'S WHAT INITIATED STAFF TO CONTACT THE PROPERTY OWNER AS WELL. MA'AM, WOULD YOU HAPPEN TO KNOW THE DATE THAT THIS WAS BUILT? UH, I KNOW IT WAS TWO YEARS AGO. RIGHT? BUT BECAUSE TWO YEARS, OCTOBER, TWO YEARS, SUMMERTIME. TWO YEARS. WINTERTIME, TWO YEARS EARLY SPRING. WHEN WAS IT? EARLY SPRING. EARLY SPRING. HE REMEMBERS MORE THAN I DO. OKAY. SO IT WAS SPRING OF 2021. MM-HMM. . SO THAT THE LATEST MAY, JUNE. THANK YOU. BRIAN. IF YOU CAN PUT ON THE GOOGLE STREET VIEW. UM, APRIL, 2022. IT HASN'T BEEN BUILT YET. OKAY. YEAH. COMMISSIONER SAVINO? UH, YES. QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT. DO YOU STILL OWN THE RV? YES, I DO. YOU STILL OWN THE RV? YES. DO YOU LIVE IN THIS HOUSE? YES, I DO. YOU LIVE IN THIS HOUSE. UM, SO YOU KNOW, YOU DIDN'T HAVE A BUR BUILDING PERMIT, BUT NOW YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO GO TO THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT FOR, AND I'M LOOKING AT IT AND I'M ASSUMING IT'S FOR THE SIDE SETBACK BECAUSE YOU'RE BUILT INTO THE SIDE SETBACK. IS THAT, COULD THAT BE THE REASON THAT YOU'RE GOING TO BE O A WELL, I WAS GOING TO ASK FOR A VARIANCE FOR THE HEIGHT. I THOUGHT IT WAS THE HEIGHT BECAUSE THAT THE ONE I SAW IN CEDAR. IT'S LIKE I HAVE A PICTURE OF THE ONE THAT'S ON CEDAR. YOU THINK IT MIGHT BE THE HEIGHT. OKAY. UM, I MEAN THE SIDES OF, I, I DIDN'T THINK I WAS IN ANY, ANY IN THE WRONG ON THE SIDES OF THE, OF THE STRUCTURE. I MEAN, I PUT IT RIGHT ON THE, ON THE, UH, DRIVEWAY. OKAY. I MEAN, IT'S NOT, AND, AND, BUT YOU ARE AWARE THAT YOU'RE IN A HISTORIC DISTRICT AND YOU YES. WHEN YOU PURCHASED YES. THAT THERE WERE REQUIREMENTS AND THERE'S A PROCESS, RIGHT? OH, AT THE BEGINNING. AT THE BEGINNING, YEAH. I'VE DEALT WITH HISTORIC AND AT THE BEGINNING WHEN I FIRST MOVED HERE, UHHUH , I DIDN'T KNOW AT THE BEGINNING. WELL, I HAD SOME INCIDENTS THAT HAPPENED AND I WAS LIKE, WAIT A MINUTE, EVERYBODY HERE IS DOING WHATEVER THEY WANT. IT GOT BAD. IT GOT REAL UGLY. AND BECAUSE EVERYBODY WAS DOING WHATEVER THEY WANTED AND THEY'RE STILL DOING IT. I CAN NAME SO MANY HOUSES ON MY STREET, BUT I DON'T WANNA DO THAT. 'CAUSE I DON'T NEED TO DO THAT. IT'S NOT RIGHT. I DON'T WANNA BE THAT WAY. SURE. I KNOW OTHER PEOPLE ARE DOING IT, BUT I DON'T WANT TO DO IT BECAUSE I KNOW THAT IF I SAY SOMETHING, YOU GUYS ARE GONNA HAVE TO MAKE PEOPLE KNOCK HOUSES DOWN, KNOCK WINDOWS DOWN, KNOCK. LIKE YOU DID THE POST. I MEAN, I COULD GO ON. SO IT WAS THE INCONSISTENCIES OF THINGS THAT MOTIVATED YOU OR MADE YOU FEEL OKAY ABOUT IT? YEAH, I DIDN'T THINK IT WAS, I THOUGHT OKAY, AS LONG AS IT'S SET BACK, AS LONG AS THE SIDES ARE THE WAY IT SHOULD BE, SHOULD HAVE TURNED THE PAGE IN THE GUIDELINE. THE REST WAS THERE. I HAVE A QUESTION FOR STAFF. UM, PER THE ORDINANCE, CAN AN RV BE PARKED ON THE PROPERTY LIKE THIS? I HAVEN'T SEEN ONE. I HAVE, I HAVE PICTURES. I'VE SEEN THEM IN THE BACKYARD, BUT NOT IN, NO, I'VE SEEN THEM ON THE SIDE. WHAT IS, WHAT DOES THE CITY SAY ABOUT THIS? I, I DON'T KNOW THAT I HAVE CAN ANSWER THAT. I BELIEVE IT HAS ALLOWED. YEAH, CERTAIN HOES, CERTAIN HOES THAT YOU PAY INTO WON'T, BUT THE CITY DOES. OKAY. I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION. I I, I THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER GIBBS HAS SOMETHING HE SAID. YES, COMMISSIONER GIBBS. THANK YOU MR. CHAIR. SO YOU STATED THAT THE CAR PARADE HAD BEEN THERE FOR TWO YEARS, BUT I CLEARLY THAT IN APRIL, 2022 IT WASN'T. SO THAT WAS, THAT WAS NOT TRUE. SO IT'S BEEN, UM, A LITTLE OVER A YEAR. UM, AT LEAST, WELL, AT THE MOST I WOULD SAY THAT IT'S BEEN THERE. SO, SO THAT WASN'T TRUE. SO THE THING IS, IS THAT [03:35:01] THE, THIS IS AGAIN A VIOLATION AND IT SEEMS LIKE WE HAVE A LOT OF THESE TODAY. SO, HUH. SO WITH THIS VIOLATION HERE, WHEN YOU WENT INTO THE POINT WHERE YOU SAID YOU KNEW YOU LIVED IN A HISTORIC NEIGHBORHOOD, YOU UNDERSTOOD THAT, UM, BUT THEN YOU WENT TO RATIONALIZE MENTIONING THAT, YOU KNOW, OTHER HOMES WERE DOING THIS, BUT THEN YOU TRIED TO COMPENSATE, BUT THEN SAYING, WELL, I GOT A PERMIT, TRIED TO GET A PERMIT, YOU KNOW, WELL THEN, YOU KNOW, YOU SAID, OH, WELL, YOU KNOW, I NEEDED IT BECAUSE OF THE AIR CONDITIONING ON THE TOP RV AND CENTER, THINGS OF NATURE. BUT THE BOTTOM LINE IS THAT IT'S A VIOLATION. AND, AND THEN, BUT YOU TRIED TO, Y'ALL TRIED TO DECEIVE US BY SAYING THAT IT WAS OVER TWO YEARS WHEN IT WASN'T. IT WAS LITTLE OVER A YEAR AT THE MOST. NO, IT'S BEEN LONGER THAN THAT. WHEN I STARTED GOOGLE OUR STATES APRIL, 2022. SO WHEN, GO AHEAD. WHEN I STARTED IT, I STARTED TO BUILD THAT AND I STOPPED. 'CAUSE I HAD AN EMERGENCY, I HAD TO GO BACK TO MY COUNTRY. AND THEN THEY CONTINUED IT, BUT IT HAD ALREADY BEEN STARTED. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. COMMISSIONER VELASQUEZ, I WANNA MAKE A MOTION, BUT I THINK CORY, 'CAUSE PROBABLY INCUMBENT ON STAFF TO, TO MAKE SURE THAT I'VE HEARD CORY SAY BEFORE THAT WE CAN USE GOOGLE EARTH AS A REFERENCE, BUT MM-HMM. , GOOGLE EARTH IS NOT A SOURCE THAT WE CAN CITE BECAUSE WE DON'T KNOW WHEN THE PICTURE WAS TAKEN. RIGHT? I MEAN, I REMEMBER ONE TIME YOU, YOU HAD MADE A VERY CLEAR STATEMENT AND I STUCK IN MY HEAD, BUT IT WAS ALONG THE LINES OF, OF WHAT WE WERE USING AS OFFICIAL DOCUMENTATION OF SOMETHING, IT CAN INFORM US, BUT IT ISN'T PART OF OUR PROCESSES. IT'S THERE. BUT JUST BECAUSE IT'S THERE DOESN'T MEAN THAT WE ARE GONNA TRUST GOOGLE EARTH. RIGHT. BECAUSE WE, WE KNOW THAT THE PHOTO MIGHT EXIST ON THAT DATE, BUT WE DON'T KNOW WHEN THE PHOTO WAS POSTED. IT'S DATE OF IMAGERY OR DATE OF POSTING IS THE DIFFERENCE. HOW LONG? THEY DON'T, THEY DON'T CHANGE THE PICTURES EVERY DAY. GOOGLE'S EARTH IS NOT TAKING PICTURES EVERY DAY. CORRECT YOUR MOTION, SIR. WELL, I WANNA MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE AS SUBMITTED BY THE APPLICANT. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? YEAH, I'LL SECOND. SO A SECOND DISCUSSION? YES, SIR. MR. CHAIR SIDE OF THAT, I MEAN, I, I WANNA MAKE NOTE THAT THE, THAT TRU IS PAINTED THE BLUE TO MATCH THE HOUSE. THE COLUMNS ARE PAINTED YELLOW TO MATCH THE HOUSE. I THINK THERE'S BEEN EVERY EFFORT TO LOOK AT THIS AS A HOLISTIC YES SIR. SOLUTION. BALANCED AND, AND, AND FITTING, FITTING, CONSIDERING THAT, WELL, YOU, IF YOU HAVE A WINNEBAGO, WHAT ARE YOU GONNA DO? FIND SOMEBODY TO A PLACE TO PARK IT. YOU WANNA PARK IT IN YOUR DRIVEWAY. IT SETS A LIMIT. THAT'S BASED ON SOMETHING REALLY FUNCTIONAL. I I IT DOESN'T DETRACT FROM THE HOUSE. IT'S, IT'S, IT'S A, IT'S A PRETTY, UM, KIND OF GRACEFUL, MINIMALIST CARPORT AS FAR AS HOW IT RELATES TO THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENTS OR THE ZONING COMMISSION. THAT'S NOT OUR PURVIEW. I DON'T THINK THAT WE'RE BEING ASKED TO, TO, TO, UH, UH, UH, DIVE INTO THAT, UM, UH, YOU KNOW, THOSE DISCUSSIONS OR, OR RAISE THOSE FLAGS. I THINK IT'S SPECIFIC TO THIS CIRCUMSTANCE. I APPRECIATE THAT IT'S NOT ATTACHED TO THE HOUSE. YEAH, I THINK THAT'S, THAT'S, THAT'S VERY, THAT'S THAT THOUGHTFUL, THE FACT THAT IT'S SET BACK AND, UM, I, I DO ACCEPT THAT IF YOU SAY THAT IT WAS AT THE PERIOD PRIOR TO, UM, THE, IN THE TWO YEAR RANGE THAT I TRUST IT, THAT, THAT, YOU KNOW, WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT. I AM, UM, I DON'T SEE ANYTHING THAT'S IN, IN THE, IN THE, UM, STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS, MR. CHAIR, THAT DOESN'T AMOUNT TO A FULL, UH, UH, RECONSTRUCTION, PARTICULARLY SOMETHING OF THIS, UM, HEIGHT OUT OF WOOD. HOWEVER, IF IT PLEASES THE BOARD TO, TO, TO FIND A, UH, UM, UH, SOME COMPROMISE, UM, THAT I CAN SEE THAT IF, IF, IF THE, IF THE COMMISSION SAW THAT A STANDING SEAM, UH, ROOF FINISH WAS MORE APPROPRIATE, THAT PERHAPS THAT MIGHT BE, UM, A PLACE TO FIND A FURTHER, UH, COMPATIBILITY, WHICH IS JUST A ROOF MATERIAL. BUT OUTSIDE OF THAT, UM, MY MOTION WOULD BE AS SUBMITTED, BUT I, I WOULD BE OPEN TO, UM, UH, AMENDING THAT MOTION TO INCLUDE, UH, SOME OTHER MATERIALITY. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. THANK YOU. OTHER COMMENTS? I GO AHEAD. MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE? GIBBS? NAYYY. SAVINA NAY VELAZQUEZ AYE. MOOKA AYE. VASQUEZ. NAYYY [03:40:02] CERVANTES. YES. HOLLAND NAY AND FETZER NAY. MOTION FAILS. DO WE HAVE ANOTHER MOTION, MR. OH, I WAS JUST GONNA MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE REQUEST. WELL, WITH ALL OF STAFF STIPULATIONS, DO WE HAVE A SECOND, SECOND, SECOND DISCUSSION. I'M SORRY. COMMISSIONER ZUKA. SO DOES THIS, THE RECOMMENDATION TO, UM, REDUCE THE HEIGHT OF THE CARPORT, DOES THAT MAKE IT UNUSABLE? I CAN'T DO THAT BECAUSE OF THE AC UNIT. AS YOU COULD SEE, THE STEPS ON THE BACK, YOU, I CAN'T LOWER IT. IF I COULD, I WOULD'VE, BUT I CAN'T. AND I USED THAT, THAT, UM, METAL ROOF BECAUSE EVERYBODY ELSE HAS THAT METAL ROOF. I'M NOT USING ANYTHING ANY DIFFERENT THAN WHAT OTHER PEOPLE'S HAVE ON MY STREET AND IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD. AND I HAVE PEOPLE ALL THE TIME DRIVE BY MY HOUSE AND TELL ME I HAVE THE BEST LOOKING HOUSE ON THE STREET. AND IN THE BLOCK I GET MORE COMMENTS AND PEOPLE TELLING ME, STOPPING AND TELLING ME HOW NICE OF A HOUSE I HAVE. AND I HAVE KEPT, KEPT IT HISTORIC THE BEST I CAN. AND YOU CAN SEE THAT IT, IT'S, IT'S NOT ANY DIFFERENT. THE SIDING, THE PAINTING, I, I MEAN, EVERYTHING IS PERFECT AT MY HOUSE. I I CAN SHOW YOU PICTURES OF CARPORTS FALLING DOWN ON MY STREET AND THEY'RE STILL HANGING THERE AND IT LOOKS HORRIBLE AND THEY'RE MADE OUTTA METAL. THEY'RE FALLING, THEY'RE LEANING IT, IT'S HORRIBLE. I MEAN, I, I'M, I JUST CAN'T BELIEVE THAT THIS IS HAPPENING TO ME. AND IT'S A BEAUTIFUL PIECE. IT'S BEAUTIFUL. I'D RATHER HAVE THAT THAN WHAT'S ON MY STREET. APPRECIATE YOUR SENTIMENTS, MA'AM. MR. CHAIR. YES. YOU KNOW, I, I I UNDERSTAND THE MOTION, I UNDERSTAND THE SPIRIT OF ENFORCEMENT AND, AND NOT TO CONTRADICT THAT. I THINK THERE'S QUITE A BIT OF VALUE IN THAT. HOWEVER, THE, YOU KNOW, WHERE, WHERE THERE'S SOMETHING THAT EXISTS ALREADY, IT'S WELL DONE. UM, IT WAS DONE, UM, BEYOND THE, THAT STATUTE OF LIMITATIONS THAT, THAT WE JUST DISCUSSED A SECOND AGO. UM, YOU KNOW, THIS, THIS AREA IS AN AREA THAT, THAT LET'S SAY BEGINS FROM THE PUREST, SAY KING WILLIAM. AND THEN IT, IT, UM, EVOLVES TO HIGHWAY 2 81. AND WE HAVE SOME PROJECTS THAT WE'VE PASSED THAT ARE METAL PROJECTS THAT ARE ACCESSORY TO HISTORIC DWELLINGS, COMPLETELY OUTTA CHARACTER. BUT WITHIN THE CONTEXT OF, OF, UH, CREATIVITY, UH, THE BOX CAR STRUCTURES THAT ARE RIGHT DOWN THE STREET THAT ARE ACCESSORY TO ONE OF THE HISTORIC HOUSES THAT'S ON 2 81. THIS IS NOT SO FAR OUT IN TERMS OF THE WAY THAT THE MATERIALS START TO EVOLVE OR DEVOLVE AS WE GET TO THE HIGHWAY. IT'S TRUE. I DON'T WANNA FIND A MILLION DIFFERENT EXCUSES FOR WHY THIS IS, THIS IS APPROPRIATE. BUT IF WE LOOK AT WHAT THE CRITERIA IS, WHAT THE, WHAT THE CARPORT HAS TO SOLVE FOR THE HOMEOWNER, AND THE FACT THAT WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT IS THE CREATION OF A HOME. THIS IS NOT A HOUSE THAT EVERYBODY DRIVES BY AND JUST SAYS, OH, LOOK AT THE BEAUTIFUL AREA THAT THIS IS, AND LOOK AT THAT HOUSE AND THIS, THERE ARE PEOPLE LIVING IN THIS COMMUNITY AS THERE HAVE BEEN. AND THIS KIND OF SCRUTINY IN THIS COMMUNITY HAS REALLY BEGUN AT, AT THE PERIOD WHERE THIS NOW BECOMES THIS HISTORIC DISTRICT. AND IT'S LOSING SOME OF THAT CHARACTER THAT I THINK WE ALL STRIVED FOR, UM, THROUGH, THROUGH THE MAYOR'S, UM, UH, COMMISSION TO, TO PROTECT AND PRESERVE, UM, UH, COMMUNITY. SO IT'S, IT'S NOT JUST TO PROTECT AND PRESERVE THE BUILDINGS. I THINK WE FORGET WHEN WE HAVE PEOPLE THAT ARE LIVING IN THEIR HOUSES, THEY'RE TAKING CARE OF THEIR HOUSES, THEY'RE MAKING ADDITIONS THAT FACILITATE THEIR, THEIR, THEIR DAILY LIVES. AND CERTAINLY SOMETIMES THAT IS MORE IMPORTANT IN THE CONTEXT OF THE AESTHETICS THAT WE'RE, THAT OUR PURVIEW IS. THANK YOU. SO I IMPLORE THIS COMMISSION TO RECONSIDER. THANK YOU, SIR. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. YES. COMMISSIONER GIBBS. THANK YOU, MA'AM. I, UM, I JUST WANNA STATE THAT I, I AGREED SOMEWHAT WITH WHAT MY FELLOW COMMISSIONER SAID, AND I UNDERSTAND THAT IN [03:45:01] THE NEIGHBORHOOD, AND THIS HAPPENS CONSTANTLY, THAT THERE ARE THINGS THAT OTHER PEOPLE DO. NEIGHBORS THAT WHO HAVE NOT FOLLOWED GUIDELINES AND THINGS THAT JUST NOT BEEN CAUGHT. YOU'RE NOT, I JUST WANNA MAKE IT CLEAR YOU'RE NOT, WE AS WE AS A COMMISSIONER, WE'RE NOT SINGLING YOU OUT. IT IT, IT WAS BROUGHT BEFORE US. WE HAVE TO ADDRESS IT AND THINGS OF THAT NATURE. SO, UM, IT'S, IT'S NO DOUBT YOU DO HAVE A BEAUTIFUL HOME. WE UNDERSTAND THAT. BUT YOU KNOW, WHEN THINGS ARE BOUGHT BEFORE US, WE HAVE TO FOLLOW, YOU KNOW, THE CERTAIN GUIDELINES THERE. SO, UM, I, I UNDERSTAND YOU SAY YOUR EMOTION AND HOW YOU FEEL, WHATEVER PROBABLY WOULD FEEL THE SAME WAY, BUT I JUST WANNA LET YOU KNOW THAT WE'RE NOT, YOU KNOW, SEEING WHEN YOU, OR, OR BEATING YOU DOWN OR WHATEVER, BUT IT'S JUST THAT WE HAVE TO FOLLOW WHAT'S BEFORE US. THANK YOU MR. CHAIR. THANK YOU. UM, MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE? GIBBS? AYE. SAVINO? AYE. VELAZQUEZ. NAY. MOOKA NAY. VASQUEZ. AYE. CERVANTES? NO. HOLLAND AYE. AND FETZER AYE. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU. AND MS. PALMER, YOU DO HAVE, YOU DO HAVE THE ABILITY TO APPEAL TO THE B O A OF THIS DECISION IF YOU WISH. OKAY. THANK YOU. THAT WAS THE LAST AGENDA ITEM. WE ARE ADJOURNED. MR. CHAIR? YES. I HAVE A, I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO RECONSIDER. I MADE A MO SECOND. SEE WHAT IT IS. . I MADE A, A ROOKIE MISTAKE AND WHEN, UH, THINGS WERE GOING FOR CONSENSUAL APPROVAL EARLIER, UM, I TOTALLY MISSED, UH, AGENDA ITEM EIGHT, AND I'D LIKE TO RECONSIDER THAT. NOT WHAT I REGULARLY DO IS I, AGENDA ITEM EIGHT WAS ON CONSENT, SO HE WANTED TO PULL THAT ITEM. YOU HAD RECUSED ON THE VOTE, SO YOU WEREN'T HERE, BUT HE WANTED TO PULL THAT ITEM BUT WAS CONFUSED ABOUT THE NUMBERING AND SO IT WASN'T PULLED AND THE ITEM WAS PASSED ON CONSENT. OKAY. SO ALMA, WHAT IS OUR, WHAT CAN WE DO? SO GIVEN THAT YOU DID NOT VOTE ON CONSENT AND YOU RECUSED, YOU CAN TAKE UP COMMISSIONER SAVINO AS THE VICE CHAIR CAN TAKE UP THE ITEM TO CONSIDER. FIRST, THIS FIRST STEP WOULD BE TO CONSIDER WHETHER OR NOT, UM, YOU SHOULD RECONSIDER THE MOTION. AND IF THAT PASSES BY A MAJORITY, THEN UM, YOU CAN DISCUSS THE MOTION, AS IT WERE OR WHATEVER'S PRESENTED AS IF IT WERE AN ORIGINAL MOTION. AND, AND MY SECOND WAS FOR DIVINE STREET. I APOLOGIZE, , I THOUGHT YOU WANTED TO RECONSIDER THE DIVINE STREET ONE. SORRY. NO, THIS IS, UH, REGARDING OH 7 23 DONALDSON. SO THIS IS FOR SOMETHING ELSE. SORRY, MA'AM. THIS IS SOMETHING ELSE. . OH, OKAY. SO ON MINE, WHAT DO I NEED TO DO? BRIAN, WHY DON'T Y GO OUT THE HALLWAY AND THEN WE'LL DEAL WITH THIS ITEMS NEED TO STEP OUT. YES, YOU DO. OKAY. GOOD LUCK. OH, I THANK YOU. LET THE RECORD SHOW THAT CHAIRMAN FETZER HAS LEFT THE ROOM. OKAY. THERE IS A DISCUSSION FOR RECONSIDERATION OF AGENDA ITEM NUMBER EIGHT EIGHT TO BE PULLED FROM THE CONSENT AGENDA AND RECONSIDERED, CORRECT? UM, SO I AM LOOKING FOR A MOTION. THE MOVEMENT, MR. VASQUEZ HAS MADE IT ALREADY, YOU MADE THE MOTION. OKAY. THE MOTION IS TO, THE MOTION IS, IS TO RECONSIDER AGENDA. AGENDA ITEM NUMBER EIGHT. OKAY. IS THERE A SECOND? IT DOES NOT NEED A SECOND. WELL, THEN WE'LL GO INTO DISCUSSION. THE DISCUSSION IS WHETHER OR NOT TO RECONSIDER, OKAY, SO THE, THE MAKER OF THE MOTION. WOULD YOU LIKE TO YEAH, THERE'S LOTS OF POINTS TO MAKE ABOUT THIS. UH, THE NEIGHBORHOOD HAD MANY RESERVATIONS. UM, I HAD SOME, UH, DISCUSSION POINTS THAT NEEDED TO BE BROUGHT UP, BUT THE APPLICANT'S NO LONGER HERE, [03:50:01] SO, UM, I THINK IT WOULD BE FAIR TO DO A CONTINUANCE. SO I, I'M WAITING TO SEE IF THIS MOTION PASSES TO BE RECONSIDERED, BUT I DO HAVE THE APPLICANT VIRTUALLY. ALLISON, WE SHOULD BE ASKING ANY QUESTIONS UNLESS THE MOTION TO RECONSIDER IS APPROVED. ALLISON, I GOTTA MAKE A, AN EXPLANATION AS TO WHY I WANTED TO MAKE A MOTION TO RECONSIDER, YOU KNOW, I'M NEW TO THE COMMISSION, SO I THOUGHT I WAS GONNA PULL Y'ALL EARLIER FROM THE CONSENT AGENDA, UM, BECAUSE THERE WAS CONCERNS ABOUT THE NEIGHBORHOOD OR THAT THE NEIGHBORHOOD HAD BROUGHT UP. AND THEN I HAD SEVERAL POINTS THAT I WANTED TO BRING UP AS WELL. OKAY? NO, NO, NO DISCUSSION ON THE ITEM ITSELF YET. SO YOU'RE JUST EXPLAINING YOUR REASONING FOR THE MOTION TO RECONSIDER, WE WILL TAKE UP ACTION ON THE MO MOTION TO RECONSIDER. IF IT PASSES, THEN WE WILL TAKE UP THE ITEM INDIVIDUALLY PER THE MOTION. WELL, I HAVE A QUESTION FOR THE MAKER OF THE MOTION, AND IS THAT, UM, UH, CAN YOU BE TIME SPECIFIC? WOULD YOU, ARE YOU WANTING TO DISCUSS IT NOW OR WOULD YOU IT WOULD BE NOW. IT WOULD HAVE TO BE NOW. OKAY. YOU CAN CALL FOR A VOTE IF THERE'S NO DISCUSSION ON THAT. WELL, LET'S SEE. ANY DISCUSSION, ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT IT? ANY THOUGHTS ABOUT REAM CHAIR CONSIDERING THIS? MADAM CHAIR, MADAM CHAIR? UM, SO I, I JUST NEED, YOU WANNA RECONSIDER, SO YOU HAVE TO EXPLAIN TO US, YOU KNOW, WHY YOU WANTED TO RECONSIDER, AND THEN, SO WE MAKE A MOTION. I MEAN, ONCE YOU, WE DECIDE THAT, THEN WE MAKE A MOTION AS TO WE, WE APPROVE THE HEARING AND THEN WE'LL HEAR FROM THE APPLICANT. SO, SO TO EXPLAIN TO US WHY, OH, SO THERE'S, UM, CAN SOMEBODY BRING IT UP? IS THERE A SPECIFIC SHEET OR PAGE NUMBER THAT YOU WOULD LIKE STAFF TO REFER TO? SCROLL DOWN TO THE PROPOSED ENTRYWAY FROM DONALDSON. SO AGAIN, COMMISSIONER, I DON'T WANNA PUT WORDS IN YOUR MOUTH, BUT MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT YOU SIMPLY INTENDED TO PULL THIS FOR INDIVIDUAL CONSIDERATION. SO JUST SIMPLY EXPLAIN WHY YOU INTENDED TO, TO DO THAT. NOT NECESSARILY WHAT YOUR ISSUES ARE WITH THE APPLICATION, BUT JUST YOU HAD QUESTIONS OR YOU HAD CONCERNS. THAT'S ALL WE'RE REALLY NEEDING RIGHT NOW. I HAVE QUESTIONS, CONCERNS BOTH. MADAM CHAIR. I, I THINK IF I, I, SO, UH, TO THE, TO THE D SEVEN COMMISSIONER, I THINK NOW IS YOUR OPPORTUNITY TO TELL EVERYBODY WHY ALL THE COMMISSIONERS, WHY THEY SHOULD RECONSIDER THIS. OKAY? UH, SO SCROLL DOWN TO, I, I'M, I'M NOT FAMILIAR WITH THE PACKAGE. IS THERE A SPECIFIC PAGE NUMBER THAT YOU CAN REFER TO? LET ME GET THERE. IS THIS IT ON THE SCREEN? NOW, COMMISSIONERS, JUST TO BE CLEAR, THIS, THIS PROCESS IS TWO STEPS. BEFORE YOU START LOOKING AND RE DELIBERATING ON THE ACTUAL ITEM, YOU HAVE TO ASK YOURSELVES, GIVEN THE EXPLANATION THAT HE WAS NOT FAMILIAR WITH OR THERE WAS A CONFUSION WITH THE NUMBERING OF THE AGENDA ITEMS, HE INTENDED TO PULL IT, BUT BECAUSE HE MISUNDERSTOOD WHICH ITEMS WERE PULLED, HE WOULD LIKE, FOR YOU GUYS, HE WOULD LIKE FOR THE COMMISSION TO CONSIDER THIS, TO RECONSIDER THIS ITEM. THAT'S IT. SO WITHOUT GOING INTO DETAILS AS TO WHAT HIS SPECIFIC CONCERNS WERE OR ANY OF THAT, THE QUESTION BEFORE YOU IS WHETHER OR NOT YOU AGREE TO RECONSIDER THIS ITEM AND NOT KEEP IT ON CONSENT, BUT HAVE INDIVIDUAL DELIBERATION ON IT. NO, AL ALMA, IF IT, BECAUSE YOU KNOW, ON ONE HAND IT'S COURTESY, RIGHT? WHICH IS IMPORTANT. BUT ON THE OTHER HAND, THERE'S [03:55:01] ALSO THAT IF WE, OR LIKE SAY MY, UH, LEMME SPEAK FOR MYSELF, LOOKED AT THE PROJECT AND, AND KINDA WEIGHED AGAINST, UM, ITS VALUE AND INDEPENDENT, UH, CONSIDERATION VERSUS CONSENT FOR MY PART, I, YOU KNOW, WAS INTENTIONAL, RIGHT? THE VOTE TO, TO, TO ENABLE IT AND CONSENT. I, I DON'T SEE WHAT WOULD CHANGE MY OPINION IN THE, IN THE GENERAL VOTE, RIGHT? UM, I MEAN, I'M, I'M ALL RIGHT TO HOLD ONTO THAT, THAT DELIBERATING PROCESS OF MY OWN, RIGHT? MM-HMM. , I MEAN MM-HMM. . MM-HMM. . YEAH. RIGHT, RIGHT. THAT WOULD COME OUT DURING A DISCUSSION, DURING A DISCUSSION, BUT A DISCUSSION OF THIS VOTER OR A DISCUSSION OF, SO, YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN? WE HAVE A FIRST. YEAH, YEAH. SO, SO DOES THE, WHAT IS THE ACTION? AT WHAT POINT IS A VOTE TAKEN FOR RECONSIDERATION OF THIS RIGHT NOW? RIGHT NOW? I MEAN, WHAT IS THE OTHER, WHAT ARE THE OTHER STEPS OR OTHER REQUIREMENTS YOU REQUIRE THIS? SO AT THIS POINT, WHAT YOU'RE ASKING YOURSELF IS, DO WE WANNA HAVE THIS ITEM PULLED FROM THE CONSENT AGENDA? AND THAT, AND THAT'S, BUT, BUT THAT, AND THAT'S, UH, UH, WITH PERMISSION OF OF, OF, UH, VICE CHAIR HERE, I'M HAVING, I'M GONNA HAVE A HARD TIME UNDERSTANDING WHERE, WHERE I'M, WHERE I'M SUPPOSED TO THINK ON WHAT SIDE OF WHICH WALL I'M SUPPOSED TO DELIBERATE, BECAUSE, SO ALL YOU'RE THINKING RIGHT NOW IS, DO I AGREE TO PULL IT FROM CONSENT OR NOT? YEP. MM-HMM. SHE WILL HAVE DISCUSSION ON THE ITEM. SO DO I AGREE TO UNDO, TO, TO UNDO WHAT WE'VE DONE AND START OVER IS WHAT WE'RE DOING. WE'LL HAVE A SEPARATE SPECIFIC ITEM WITH, YOU'LL HAVE A SEPARATE DISCUSSION, ONE ITEM ITEM. SO LET'S ASK, ARE THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS ABOUT THE CONTENT OF, UM, THE COMMISSIONER'S REQUEST FOR RECONSIDERATION? RIGHT. SO IN RECONSIDERING, UH, I, I WOULD THINK THAT THERE HAS TO BE SOMETHING GRAVELY SIGNIFICANT TO PULL, TO UNDO, TO UNDO A, A, A VOTE THAT WE'VE ALREADY DONE AND THEN REHASH IT OUT AGAIN, AND THEN, YOU KNOW, GO FORWARD AGAIN, HEARING THE, THE COMMENTS FROM THE APPLICANT, HEARING THE COMMENTS FROM THE COMMUNITY, HEARING THE COMMENTS FROM ALL OF US GOING AND, AND, AND PEELING THE ONION BACK ON THAT. SO I GUESS MY QUESTION RIGHT NOW TO MY FELLOW COMMISSIONER, IS IT SIGNIFICANT ENOUGH TO DO ALL OF THAT? THAT, IS THIS LIKE A HUGE DEAL OR IS IT LIKE THE HEIGHT OF A HEDGE OR SOMETHING? I, I, TO ME, YES. IT'S, IT'S THE DISTRICT I REPRESENT ON THE COMMISSION AND YES, I THINK IT IS. THANK YOU. AND MAD CHAIR. UM, UM, IF I MAY, I MEAN, THIS IS PRETTY SIMPLE RIGHT NOW. WHERE WE ARE YES. IS DO WE WANT TO RECONSIDER OR NOT? SO LET'S JUST HAVE A VOTE. LET'S TAKE ON WHETHER WE CAN RECONSIDER AND, AND FOR MY FELLOW COMMISSION. AND IF YOU DON'T AGREE WITH THAT, JUST VOTE. NO. I MEAN, SO WE, LET'S MOVE FORWARD WITH THAT SO WE CAN DECIDE. SO WE'LL HAVE A ROLL CALL. GIBBS. AYE. SAVINA. AYE. VELASQUEZ NAY. MOOKA AYE. VASQUEZ AYE. CERVANTES NO. AND HOLLAND. AYE. MOTION CARRIES. OKAY, SO BRIAN'S GONNA PULL UP THE CASE FILE. WE HAVE THE APPLICANT, ALLISON CHAMBERS HERE TO ANSWER QUESTIONS. WE CAN DELIBERATE AND TAKE ACTION ON THE CASE ITSELF NOW. THANK YOU, ALMA. SO COMMISSIONER VASQUEZ, YOU CAN BEGIN. ALLISON, ARE YOU THERE? I'M HERE. ALL RIGHT. SORRY, I'M KEEPING YOU. UM, SO APPRECIATE THE GREAT, UH, ILLUSTRATIONS YOU PUT. UM, THERE WERE A FEW THINGS I WANTED TO BRING UP ABOUT THE DESIGN. UM, WOULD, DID Y'ALL CONSIDER REMO PUTTING THE 1932 SOMEWHERE ELSE? UM, AS IT LOOKS LIKE, UH, THE ADDRESS, UH, TO THE, UM, TO THE SCHOOL? UM, COULD IT BE PUT ON A PLAQUE OPPOSITE OF WHERE IT HAS THE INTERNATIONAL BACCALAUREATE WORLD SCHOOL ON A SEPARATE PLAQUE OPPOSITE? WE EXPLORED DIFFERENT OPTIONS WITH THE 1932. IT'S, UH, JEFFERSON HIGH SCHOOL, AS YOU KNOW, IS A VERY HISTORIC, UH, PROUD SCHOOL. THEY'RE PROUD OF THE FACT THAT THEY'VE BEEN AROUND, UM, SINCE 1932. AND, AND THEY REALLY WANTED TO INCLUDE THAT. UM, THE REASON WE INCLUDED IT, HOW WE DID WITH THE STONE WAS TO KIND OF MAKE, UM, THE TEXT EVEN ON EACH SIDE. UM, SO , COULD IT BE JUSTIFIED? I, I THINK IT WAS THE, THE GOAL WAS TO HAVE IT KIND OF SPACED EQUALLY ON EACH SIDE. [04:00:01] HMM. I WANTED TO, I WAS HOPING IT COULD BE, UM, PUT IN THERE SOME, SOME OTHER WAY. THE YEAR 1932 AS AGAIN, IT LOOKS LIKE AN ADDRESS IN, UM, THAT'S FAR FROM THE ADDRESS. AND YES, OF COURSE, I, I LIVE FOUR BLOCKS FROM HERE, SO WITH, UH, GREAT RESPECT TO THE SCHOOL AND I LOVE THE CAMPUS AND EVERYTHING, BUT, UM, I JUST THINK IT, IT SHOULD GO SOMEWHERE ELSE, UM, POSSIBLY WITH THE PAVERS UNDER THE TJ OR ON A SEPARATE PLAQUE OPPOSITE THE INTERNATIONAL BACCALAUREATE WORLD SCHOOL. WELL, SO WE DID TALK TO THE NEIGHBORHOOD, UH, YESTERDAY, THE NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION AND THEIR ARCHITECTURAL REVIEW COMMITTEE. AND THEY ALSO MENTIONED SOMETHING ABOUT THE ADDRESS AND THAT THERE'S NO ADDRESS ON THE SCHOOL ANYWHERE. SO WE WILL BE LOOKING AT THAT WITH THE DISTRICT ABOUT A, A SENSITIVE PLACE TO PLACE THE ADDRESS, WHICH OBVIOUSLY WE'LL COME BACK TO YOU ALL FOR APPROVAL ON. UM, BUT I THINK THIS IS A MONUMENTAL SIGN. UM, THE IDEA IS TO HELP PEOPLE BETTER UNDERSTAND WHERE THE MAIN OFFICE IS. UM, AND SO THE IDEA IS THAT IT'S KIND OF A GATHERING PLACE. IT'S A PLACE FOR CELEBRATION. UM, SO I THINK THAT WAS THE INTENT BETWEEN, AND WITH HAVING THE 1932, UM, YEAR, THERE WAS THE NEIGHBORHOOD, I THINK IT OKAY. WITH THE 32 THERE THEY WERE. OKAY. AND THEN, UM, LET'S SEE, WHAT WAS THE OTHER ONE? DID YOU CONSIDER USING ROD IRON INSTEAD OF THE, THE BRICK OR THE STONE THAT THE LETTER IS? UM, WE TALKED ABOUT DIFFERENT, UH, OPTIONS AND OUR, UH, THOUGHT ON METAL LETTERS IS THAT THEY WERE, THEY WOULD BE EASIER TO DAMAGE AND REMOVE AND THAT THEY, UM, YOU KNOW, COULD RUST AND, AND THINGS OVER YEARS. WE'RE TRYING TO HAVE A VERY DURABLE PRODUCT THAT REQUIRES VERY LITTLE MAINTENANCE, UH, FROM THE DISTRICT. AS WE KNOW, THE SCHOOL DISTRICT IS, UM, STRAPPED FOR CASH OFTENTIMES AND NOT THE BEST AT MAINTENANCE. SO WE'RE TRYING TO KEEP THAT IN MIND WITH THIS DESIGN. UM, BUT WE DID CONSIDER DIFFERENT OPTIONS. AND METAL WAS, UH, SPECIFICALLY GONE AWAY FROM ON THE LETTERS THEMSELVES BECAUSE OF, OF THE MAINTENANCE AND THE POSSIBILITY THAT THEY COULD BE STOLEN AND, UH, THAT WE COULD HAVE NEGATIVE WORDS THAT STUDENTS COULD GET CREATIVE WITH . THANK YOU. UM, NOT EVEN OUTLINING THEM IN BLACK OR, OR SOMETHING WITH WR IRON, JUST SO IT GOES WITH THE, THE SPANISH STYLE OF THE SCHOOL? NO, THE IDEA WAS TO HAVE IT BE SENSITIVE, UM, THROUGH THE USE OF THE SAME CASTSTONE COLORS AND MATERIAL AND THE SAME BRICK THAT YOU FIND ON THE HISTORIC SCHOOL, BUT HAVE IT BE A LITTLE BIT MORE OF ITS TIME, UM, SO THAT IT'S NOT CONFUSED WITH THE ORIGINAL ARCHITECTURE. OKAY. IT LOOKS LIKE A, THE 32 LOOKS LIKE A ADDRESS TO ME, AND I THINK THE, THE THOMAS JEFFERSON HIGH SCHOOL COULD BE STAND OUT BETTER WITH, UM, WR IRON. UM, ALSO WANTED TO ASK ABOUT, UH, THE IRRIGATION FOR THE, THE NEW LANDSCAPING THAT'S PROPOSED. MM-HMM. IS, YES, NEW IRRIGATION SYSTEMS GONNA BE PUT IN IN LIKE THIS? YES. WE'LL HAVE HALF CIRCLE AT THE ENTRY AND THEN ALONG ALL THE NEW, UM, STUFF ALONG THE ARCADE. YES. ANY NEW LANDSCAPING WILL HAVE NEW DRIP IRRIGATION INSTALLED AS PART OF IT. OKAY. THANKS. THAT'S, UH, THAT SEEMS TO BE A PERENNIAL PROBLEM WITH THE, THIS PROPERTY. UM, AND THEN I WANTED TO ASK ABOUT THE CHOICE OF A CHINESE PIST FOR THE LANDSCAPE GOING ON THE SEPARATE SIDEWALK. WELL, YOU'RE REALLY GETTING INTO THE DETAILS. OF COURSE. I'M NOT THE LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT, SO, UH, I CAN'T REALLY COMMENT ON THAT. I GUESS THEY FELT, UH, IN THEIR PROFESSIONAL JUDGMENT OF NATURAL LANDSCAPES THAT IT WAS AN APPROPRIATE SELECTION FOR THIS LOCATION. IF, IF YOU HAVE A DIFFERENT OPINION, I'M GLAD TO HEAR IT AND LET THEM KNOW ABOUT IT. SURE. UM, AND THEN ARE THERE, IS THERE LANDSCAPING GOING BACK IN FRONT OF THE ARCADE ONCE THE, THE RAMP WORK IS DONE? UM, THAT IS, UH, YET TO BE DETERMINED. WE'RE TRYING TO PULL A LOT OF THE LANDSCAPING THAT'S UP AGAINST THE BUILDING AWAY FROM THE BUILDING BECAUSE IT'S CAUSING DAMAGE. UM, AND IT, A LOT OF IT IS OVERGROWN AND OUT OF DATE AND PAST ITS USEFUL LIFE. UM, SO WE'RE TRYING TO REMOVE A LOT OF THE OLDER SHRUBS AND THINGS AWAY FROM THE BUILDING FOR THE [04:05:01] BUILDING'S HEALTH. ALRIGHT. AND THEN, UM, SO THE NEW ACCESSIBLE AREA THAT'S RIGHT OFF THE PARKING LOT NEAR THE SCHOOL, THE FRONT SCHOOL SIGN, CORRECT? YES. IS THE DUMPSTER STILL GOING THERE? UM, THE DUMPSTER IS NOT IN OUR SCOPE. UH, THE DUMPSTER IS, UH, IS MY UNDERSTANDING. WE'LL STAY IN THAT LOCATION FOR NOW. ALL RIGHT THEN I THINK, UH, UNLESS THERE'S ANY OTHER COMMISSIONERS, I, I THINK YOU ADDRESSED ALL MY QUESTIONS. GREAT. OTHER QUESTIONS? COMMISSIONER HOLLAND? NO, I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION. YES, PLEASE, UH, MOVE TO ACCEPT THE, UH, THE PROPOSAL, UH, WITH, UH, AS, AS PROPOSED OR WITH STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS OR HOW WHATEVER WE ACCIDENTALLY APPROVED EARLIER. SECOND. SECOND. SO WE HAVE A MOTION. A SECOND. ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? SECOND. HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE. GIBBS. AYE. SAVINO? AYE. VELAZQUEZ. AYE. ZUKA. AYE. VASQUEZ. AYE. ERVS? YES. HOLLAND. AYE. AND FETZER. AYE. MOTION CARRIES. MOTION CARRIES. NOW WE ARE, THANK YOU. THANK YOU. * This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.