* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting. [00:00:03] ALL RIGHT, WELL, I THINK WE ARE SET UP, READY TO GO? GOOD MORNING. JEREMY MCDONALD DEVELOPMENT SERVICES DEPARTMENT. UH, THIS KICKS OFF OUR 2024 CODE UPDATE PROCESS. UH, THIS IS OUR FIRST SUBCOMMITTEE. THIS IS A BUILDING RELATED FIRE CODES, APPEALS AND ADVISORY BOARD MEETING OF THE PLUMBING CODES SUBCOMMITTEE. TODAY IS SEPTEMBER 10TH, 2024. UH, WE'LL START OFF WITH OUR, UM, INTERPRET INTERPRETERS AVAILABLE INFORMATION. OKAY, WELL, I THINK, I THINK WE ONLY GOT ONE, SO I WOULD JUST, I'M NOT GONNA, UH, BUT WE DO HAVE SPANISH TRANSLATION AVAILABLE FOR ANYBODY THAT MIGHT NEED THAT SERVICES EITHER TODAY OR IN THE FUTURE. NO, THAT'S FINE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. AND ALSO, IF REQUESTED, WE ALSO HAVE A SL, UH, INTERPRETERS AVAILABLE FOR ANY OF THESE MEETINGS IN THE FUTURE. SO IF WE RECEIVE REQUESTS, UH, FOR THEM, UH, WE WILL DO THAT. SO BEFORE WE MOVE INTO AGENDA ITEM NUMBER ONE, WE'LL DO A QUICK ROLL CALL. GREG MCFARLAND. MICHAEL RUST HERE. GEORGE HAVA. HERE. SCOTT BERGER. HERE. JEFF BYER, SPENCER ROMMEL, MARK ROSS. SO WE HAVE THREE OF THE FOUR PRIMARY IN PRESENT, SO WE HAVE A QUORUM. WE ALSO HAVE AN ADDITIONAL ALTERNATE, UH, MARK ROSS FOR MICHAEL RUSS. SO ANY DECISIONS, ANY VOTES WILL GO TO MICHAEL RUSS WHILE HE'S STILL PRESENT, BUT WE DO HAVE QUORUM. UH, SO FIRST AGENDA IS FOR Y'ALL TO, UH, NOMINATE CHARLES ITSELF, A CHAIR AND A CO-CHAIR. IF Y'ALL WOULD LIKE TO GO AHEAD AND DO A CO-CHAIR AS WELL. UH, GEORGE LEVI, I GUESS I'LL BE CHAIR SECOND. OKAY, GEORGE. UH, A MOTION. ALL RIGHT. UH, IF Y'ALL WANNA VOTE. ALL IN FAVOR? AYE. ALL AGAINST. ALRIGHT, GEORGE, I'LL HAND OVER THE REST OF THE FORMALITIES TO YOU. UM, BUT WE'RE MOVING INTO, OH, YOU KNOW WHAT? WE CAN, UH, I THINK WE DON'T HAVE ANYBODY HERE THAT WE WANT TO ADD OR CHANGE. THIS IS MORE JUST A FORMAL IF WE NEED TO. UH, MOSTLY IF SOMEBODY CAN ONLY GIMME FIVE MINUTES AND THEY CAN SHOW UP AND VOTE SOMEBODY ELSE ON AND GET OUT AND WE STILL MEET A MEETING, THAT'S KIND OF WHY I'M GONNA HAVE THESE ON THE AGENDA. BUT THERE'S NO REASON TO, UH, MODIFY THAT. SO THERE'S NO ACTION TO TAKE ON. AGENDA ITEM NUMBER TWO. SO WE'LL MOVE TO AGENDA ITEM NUMBER THREE, WHICH WE ARE STARTING THE DISCUSSION OF THE 2024 INTERNATIONAL PLUMBING CODE AND PROPOSED CHANGES TO CURRENT AMENDMENTS FOUND IN CHAPTER 10, SECTION 10 DASH 82 AMENDMENTS TO THE ADOPTED CHAPTERS AND APPEND OF THE INTERNATIONAL PLUMBING CODE. I'LL TURN IT OVER TO ASSISTANT DIRECTOR, CRYSTAL GONZALEZ, UH, TO GO OVER THE TECHNICAL REVIEW. GOOD MORNING. I'M MCCHRYSTAL GONZALEZ, ASSISTANT DIRECTOR OVER THE PLAN REVIEW DIVISION. UM, SO YOU GUYS SHOULD ALL HAVE A PRINTOUT OF WHAT WE'RE VIEWING ON THE SCREEN. THERE'S A COUPLE EXTRA THERE IF ANYBODY DOESN'T HAVE ONE. UM, BUT WE'LL START WITH OUR CURRENTLY ADOPTED AMENDMENTS. WE HAVE A COUPLE OF PROPOSED CHANGES, UH, TO THE AMENDMENTS. UM, AND WE'LL KIND OF JUMP BACK AND FORTH, RIGHT? SO WE'LL GO THROUGH, UH, THE AMENDMENTS AS THE SECTIONS COME UP IN THE, UH, COURSE OF THE IPC. SO THE FIRST AMENDMENT, UM, CHANGE THAT WE ARE PROPOSING, UH, IS FOR THE DEFINITION OF, UM, PLUMBER'S APPRENTICE. SO WE ARE PROPOSING TO STRIKE OUT GENERAL IN THAT DEFINITION AND REPLACE IT WITH DIRECT, THAT'S JUST TO MATCH THE LANGUAGE OF THE STATE BOARD. AND WE HAVE ALSO PROPOSED AN ADDITIONAL SENTENCE THERE IN BOLD IN THAT FIRST, UM, FIRST ROW DIRECT SUPERVISION IS DEFINED AS ON THE JOB OVERSIGHT. SO THE PLUMBING BOARD IS PROPOSING TO CHANGE THEIR DEFINITION OF DIRECT SUPERVISION TO INCLUDE, UH, VIRTUAL OPTIONS. UM, AND WE DID NOT FEEL THAT WAS APPROPRIATE. SO WE WANTED TO ADD SOMETHING IN THE DEFINITION. NOW THAT DIRECT SUPERVISION IS ON THE JOB OVERSIGHT IN PERSON. CHRIS, LISTEN, MARK, I HAVE A QUESTION. SO, DIRECT IS YOUR MIC ON MIKE? YES. DIRECT SUPERVISION TO ME MEANS THAT THE MASTER PLUMBER AT THAT POINT NEEDS TO BE ON THE JOB WATCHING WHAT'S GOING ON. AND I JUST, YOU KNOW, I'LL, I'LL DEFER TO SOMEONE WHO HAS A PLUMBING COMPANY, BUT THAT'S PROBABLY NOT PRACTICAL. UH, GEORGE SLIVA. SO THE WAY THAT WORKS, MARK, IS, UH, DIRECT SUPERVISION WAS TO HAVE A LICENSED MAN ON THE JOB THAT WOULD OVERSEE ANYBODY THAT WAS NOT LICENSED. OKAY. THE R AND P OR THE MASTER WOULD OWN THE COMPANY AND WOULD OVERSEE ALL HIS [00:05:01] LICENSED PEOPLE. OKAY. NO, CORRECT. BUT THE WAY THIS READS IS THE MASTER PLUMBER IS GOING TO HAVE TO BE ON THE JOB SUPERVISING BECAUSE DIRECT SUPERVISION MEANS YOU'RE THERE. AND, AND I JUST, YOU KNOW, I, I DON'T KNOW, BUT I'VE NEVER SEEN THE MASTER PLUMBER ON THE JOB, EVER. AND, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE IN THE OFFICE RUNNING THE COMPANY TYPICALLY. AND, UH, BUT THEY DO HAVE A LICENSED PLUMBER SUPERVIS SUPERVISING ON THE JOB, WHICH IS WHAT THE DELET DEFINITION SAID ORIGINALLY. SO MY QUESTION IS, WHAT'S THE THOUGHT ABOUT HAVING THE MASTER ON THE JOB AND IS THERE A PROBLEM? SO IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THAT'S CURRENTLY THE REQUIREMENT. THE REQUIREMENT PER THE STATE BOARD IS THAT DIRECT SUPERVISION, THEY'RE PROPOSING NOW TO EXPAND THE DEFINITION OF DIRECT SUPERVISION. RIGHT. SO RIGHT NOW, TODAY, DIRECT SUPERVISION MEANS THAT THE MASTER PLUMBER, THE RESPONSIBLE MASTER PLUMBER, IS ON SITE. UM, BELIEVE THAT'S A TRUE INTERPRETATION. DO WE HAVE THAT FROM THE STATE? OH, OKAY. SHOULD THAT BE, I THINK IT READS. OKAY. UM, MIKE MORALES, UH, PLUMBING SUPERVISOR, THE LANGUAGE IS OKAY. 'CAUSE IT'S SAYING, UH, THE USE OF A, I'M SORRY, UH, SUPERVISION OF A LICENSED RESPONSIBLE MASTER, WHICH IS THE OWNER OF THE COMPANY OR THE RMP OF THE COMPANY, AND THE DIRECT SUPERVISION OF A LICENSED PLUMBER. MEANING YOU HAVE A JOURNEYMAN PLUMBER, YOU HAVE A TRADESMAN PLUMBER, EITHER OR THAT TRADESMAN HAVE AN APPRENTICE, UH, WORKING ON A SINGLE FAMILY HOUSE OR, UH, THE DIRECT SUPERVISION OF A LICENSED JOURNEYMAN PLUMBER WORKING ON RESIDENTIAL OR COMMERCIAL. BUT THAT'S NOT WHAT IT'S NOT. OR IT'S, AND THE, THE, AND THAT'S WHAT, IN OTHER WORDS, WITH THE WORD DIRECT IN THERE TWICE AND HAVING THE WORD AND BETWEEN IT, YOU HAVE TO HAVE BOTH THE MASTER PLUMBER AND A LICENSED JOURNEYMAN PLUMBER SUPERVISING THE APPRENTICE ON THE JOB. AND THAT'S BECAUSE IT'S NOT AN OR. IT'S, YOU KNOW, SO IF YOU WANT, YOU WANT TO CHANGE IT TO, OR I'M FINE, BUT WHAT THIS IS WHAT THE ORIGINAL INTENT WAS, IS THAT THE MASTER PLUMBER'S RESPONSIBLE FOR SUPERVISING EVERYBODY. BUT TO HAVE AN APPRENTICE ON THE JOB, YOU HAVE TO HAVE A LICENSED PLUMBER. AND SO IF THE STATE DOESN'T REQUIRE IT, I'M SUGGESTING WE LEAVE IT LIKE IT WAS BECAUSE NOBODY IS, YOU KNOW, IF, IF YOU WANT TO HAVE A MASTER PLUMBER ON EVERY SINGLE FAMILY HOME, YOU'VE JUST RAISED THE PRICE, YOU KNOW, EXORBITANTLY BECAUSE THE MASTER, THE OWNER OF THE COMPANY BASICALLY COULD HAVE TO BE ON THE JOB SITE THE WHOLE TIME. I AGREE. I THINK THAT CAN BE AN OR. YEAH. SO WE CAN MODIFY THAT AND TO BE, OR, OKAY. GEORGE, EVA, IF Y'ALL ARE, IF THE, IF THE INTENT IS TO OFFSET WHAT THE STATE'S GETTING READY TO TRY TO DO, I BELIEVE YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TO, SINCE THEY'RE GONNA REDEFINE, OR WHAT THEY'RE TRYING TO DO IS EXPAND OR REDEFINE DIRECT SUPERVISION, YOU MIGHT WANT INCLUDE THE VERBIAGE THAT THEY'RE ACTUALLY GONNA USE TO TRY TO GET AROUND IT. AND THAT WOULD BE THAT AUDIO VISUAL. UH, YOU, YOU, I WOULD THINK YOU'D WANT TO SAY SOMETHING LIKE, UH, DIRECT SUPERVISION IS DEFINED AS ON THE JOB OVERSIGHT NOT TO INCLUDE, YOU KNOW, VIRTUAL. I DON'T KNOW. THAT WOULD HAVE TO BE A JOSEPH THING. I BELIEVE. UH, I'VE GOT THE ACTUAL STUFF THAT THE STATE'S TRYING TO DO. UH, NOT TO INCLUDE AUDIO VISUAL OR REAL TIME COMMUNICATION. I'M GOOD WITH THAT. I MEAN, THE WAY IT READS, DIRECT SUPERVISION, UM, DEFINED AS UPON THE JOB. IF YOU WANT TO ADD MORE TO IT, I THINK IT WOULD BE GREAT, UH, SAYING, HEY, YOU KNOW, THIS IS WHAT, UH, THE STATE BOARD IS SAYING, UH, THIS IS WHAT THE CITY OF SAN ANTONIO IS REQUIRING THAT, UH, IT IS, UH, DIRECT SUPERVISION WITHOUT THE USE OF, UH, ANY TECHNOLOGY. SO, SO THE STATE IS SAYING THAT YOU CAN HAVE LIKE [00:10:01] FACETIME OH YEAH. AN APPRENTICE PLUMBER. AND THAT'S THE, THAT'S THEIR OH YEAH. FOR THEY WANT APPRENTICES WITH 4,000 HOURS, UH, WHAT TO DO, EXACTLY WHAT A TRADESMAN OR A JOURNEYMAN CAN DO. THI THIS IS, UH, JOSEPH HARNEY, CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. UH, YEAH, THE LANGUAGE THAT THE STATE'S PROPOSING RIGHT NOW, THERE, THERE'S A MAY IN THERE. AND SO IT'S A, IT'S A PRETTY, UM, SIMPLE STATEMENT. WE DON'T KNOW YET THE IMPACT OF THAT. IF IT'S AN OPTIONAL THING. UH, IF, IF, YOU KNOW, CITIES CAN, UM, BECAUSE OF THE MAY, WE, WE JUST DON'T KNOW THE IMPACT OF THAT. THEY'RE, THEY'RE TAKING COMMENTS RIGHT NOW AND, AND, UM, WE'RE GONNA SUBMIT SOMETHING SPECIFICALLY ON ANY KIND OF LIKE PREEMPTION. IF, IF WE, IF THE, IF WE LEAVE THE LANGUAGE LIKE THIS, IT'S A LITTLE MORE, A LITTLE MORE MANEUVERABILITY. IF YOU SAY SOMETHING SPECIFIC, UH, TO THEIR RULE, THERE MAY BE SOME KIND OF PREEMPTION ISSUE. WE, WE JUST DON'T KNOW AT THIS POINT. BUT, UM, WE'RE GONNA FOLLOW UP ON, ON THAT PART OF IT. SO I WOULD LIKE TO SUGGEST THAT WE LEAVE THE LANGUAGE LIKE IT IS, BUT ADD THE SENTENCE, DIRECT SUPER VISION, UH, DOES NOT INCLUDE VIRTUAL SUPERVISION OF A JOB OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. WELL, I FEEL LIKE JOSEPH'S POINT ABOUT THE, THE PREEMPTION, WHAT WE DON'T WANNA DO IS WRITE SOMETHING THAT WE CAN'T ENFORCE. SO IF WE LEAVE IT KIND OF VAGUE AND THEN, YOU KNOW, THE INSPECTOR SHOWS UP AND THERE'S NOT, LIKE AT THE MOMENT, LIKE YOU, I FEEL LIKE WE CAN ENFORCE AROUND IF THIS, IF THE STATE WANTS TO ALLOW VIRTUAL SUPERVISION THAT, YOU KNOW, PERSONALLY DON'T THINK IS PROBABLY GREAT. UM, I JUST DON'T WANNA PUT IT IN SOMETHING IN WRITING THAT ALLOWS US TO BE AT, AT THIS POINT. YEAH, THAT WOULD BE PROBABLY BE MY RECOMMENDATION TOO. AND, AND YOU, YOU NEVER KNOW. AT SOME POINT, IF WE HAVE ANOTHER CIRCUMSTANCE WHERE WE MIGHT WANT TO DO A VIRTUAL FOR, FOR A CERTAIN SHORT PERIOD OF TIME, THAT WOULD STILL GIVE YOU THE OPTION. DO Y'ALL FEEL COMFORTABLE THAT YOU COULD ENFORCE AROUND THAT? I MEAN, 'CAUSE I DON'T FEEL COMFORTABLE WITH DEALING WITH THE STATE THESE DAYS. I DON'T FEEL COMFORTABLE. ANYTHING THAT YEAH, NO, I MEAN, FOR WRITING IT, I, I I TEND TO AGREE. UM, YEAH, SOMETIMES FOR THE GOOD THOUGH, FROM WORTH SAYING, UM, BUT TO THE INSPECTORS, UM, I FEEL LIKE THERE'S ENOUGH, UH, AMBIGUITY ABOUT WHAT DIRECT SUPERVISION IS, UM, WHETHER IT BE VIRTUAL OR NOT, THAT IF YOU WALK ONTO A SITE AND THERE'S NOT AN ACTIVE FACETIME LOOP OPEN THAT YOU COULD, YOU KNOW, NO MATTER WHAT THE STATE SAYS, YOU COULD, I DON'T KNOW, MAYBE I'M TRYING, MAYBE I'M TRYING TO DIG INTO IT TOO DEEP FOR, FOR THE PURPOSES OF THIS, BUT WELL, THE INSPECTORS ARE ALWAYS GONNA HAVE THE OPTION TO DO A VISUAL INSPECTION OR A VIRTUAL INSPECTION. THEY'RE NOT APT TO DO IT. THEY'RE TALK, THIS IS ACTUALLY SAYING THAT I CAN SIT AT HOME AND IF MY PLUMBERS DECIDE THEY NEED HELP, THEY CAN CALL ME AND I CAN, NO, I, I ZOOM IN AND I, I GET THAT. AND THAT'S, I THINK THAT'S GOOD. I THINK WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS AN UNLICENSED APPRENTICE WHO, UH, WHOSE PRIMARY JOB IS TO GET STUFF OFF THE TRUCK AND DRILL HOLES. USUALLY IF, IF, IF MEMORY SERVES, UM, BEING THERE SUPERVISED ONLY BY, ONLY BY, UH, A FACETIME I'M HOLDING BY NOBODY, YOU KNOW? OH, YEAH. YEAH. AND SO, AND THEN, AND THE ENFORCEMENT MECHANISM IS NOT NECESSARILY THAT THE, THAT YOU'RE INSPECTING THE WORK, BUT IF YOU SHOW UP ON SITE AND THERE'S AN UNLICENSED PERSON DOING, YOU KNOW, THAT'S UNSUPERVISED DOING WORK, THAT'S, THAT'S WHERE THIS MATTERS. RIGHT? I FEEL LIKE I'M, YEAH. OKAY. BUT I WOULD STILL LIKE THE LANGUAGE LEFT GENERAL SUPERVISION OF THE MASTER, BECAUSE IF THE MASTER IS ON THE JOB, HE IS THE LICENSED PLUMBER. SO IT, IT'S BASICALLY THE SAME. AGREED. YEAH. THAT WAS THE INTENT. IS THE THE OR NOT? NOT THE, AND, WELL, I DON'T THINK IT, I DON'T THINK IT NEEDS TO BE, I THINK, I THINK IT SHOULD BE LEFT AND, AND LEAVE THE WORD GENERAL. SO THE MASTER PLUMBER NEEDS TO BE SUPERVISING EVERYBODY THAT WORKS FOR HIM BECAUSE IT'S HIS LICENSE. AND IF YOU HAVE A APPRENTICE ON THE JOB, YOU WANT THAT PERSON SUPERVISED BY SOMEBODY THAT HAS A LICENSE, WHICH COULD BE A MASTER, IT COULD BE A JOURNEYMAN, IT COULD BE SOMEBODY ELSE. AND, AND THAT IS ACTUALLY STRONGER THAN WHAT YOU HAVE NOW BECAUSE IT MANDATES THAT THE MASTER PLUMBER BE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE PEOPLE WHO WORK UNDER HIM OR HER. I SEE WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. SO, UM, WE SHOULD SAY IN THE WORK UNDER THE GENERAL SUPERVISION OF THE RMP OR THE DIRECT SUPERVISION OF A LICENSED PLUMBER, IS THAT, NO, I THINK YOU LEAVE THE WORD. AND IN OTHER WORDS, BOTH NEED TO, BOTH NEED TO SUPERVISE THE PEOPLE THAT ARE WORKING UNDER THEIR LICENSES AND THE DIRECT SUPERVISION IS BY THE LICENSED PLUMBER. AND THAT COULD BE A MASTER PLUMBER ON THE JOB. YOU KNOW, IT'S INCLUDED IN LICENSED PLUMBER. YEAH. ARE YOU GUYS GOOD WITH THAT, MIKE? DANNY? [00:15:01] I THINK WE'RE GOOD JUST BECAUSE WE'RE ON ITEM NUMBER ONE. AND I WANNA BEAT IT ABSOLUTELY TO DEATH. WHERE DO WE LAND? WHERE DID WE LAND ON THE RED LINE? DIRECT SUPERVISION IS DIVINED AS JOSEPH, I THINK WE'RE TAKING THAT OUT. IS THAT, OR IS THAT SOMETHING WE WANTED TO LEAVE IN? ARE WE COMFORTABLE? NOT COMFORTABLE. UM, BUT MY UNDERSTANDING IS WE'RE LEAVING THE DEFINITION AS IT'S WRITTEN IN THE BOOK WITH NO CHANGES. UH, GEORGE SLEEP AGAIN, UM, THE WAY THAT THE BOLD LETTERS, DIRECT SUPERVISION IS DEFINED AS ON THE JOB OVERSIGHT ON THE JOB OVERSIGHT IS GOING TO BE MOVED TO VIRTUAL AND AUDIO. THAT SEEMS TO BE THIS POSITION THAT THE STATE IS MOVING TO. I'M STILL CONCERNED THAT IF WE JUST LEAVE DIRECT SUPERVISION, THAT THE INTERPRETATION IS, IS GONNA BE A CHALLENGE FOR, FOR, FOR Y'ALL ON THE JOB. OVERSIGHT, I DON'T THINK IS CLEAR ENOUGH TO OFFSET WHAT THE STATE'S GONNA DO OR IS TRYING TO DO WHEN THERE'S ONLY ONE PERSON ON THAT STATE BOARD THAT'S CONCERNED WITH THIS, AND IT'S THE PLUMBER. SO, UM, THAT'S NOT ENOUGH TO PASS IT. BUT ANYWAY, IF THE CITY ATTORNEY IS GOOD WITH IT, I'M GOOD WITH IT. ALSO. IT'S GONNA BE A CHALLENGE FOR EVERYBODY, I THINK. UM, OVERSIGHT ON SITE, UM, AS LONG AS I THINK THAT DEFINITION WOULD SAY ONSITE, YOU KNOW, THEY NEED TO BE, UH, SUPERVISED BY A LICENSED PLUMBER. SO IS IT, IS IT FAIR TO SAY THAT WE TEND TO SEEM TO BE IN AGREEMENT THAT, UM, THE DIRECTION THAT THE CITY'S WANTING TO GO, WHICH IS A LIVE HUMAN BEING, IS A SUPERVISOR, THAT THE WORDING AND HOW WE GET THERE MAYBE CAN BE REFINED JUST SO WE CAN MOVE ALONG? IS THAT MAKES, I THINK DIRECTIONALLY WE AGREE AND WE'RE JUST CONCERNED ABOUT BEING PREEMPTED. I MEAN, I THOUGHT WHAT JOSEPH WAS SAYING IS TO TAKE IT OUT AND LET THEM DEAL WITH IT CASE BY CASE. CASE BY CASE. AND THEN MIKE OR SOMEBODY, AMIN CAN JUST ISSUE THAT, THAT A ORDER SAYING DIRECT SUPERVISION MEANS THIS AND OR HE BRINGS IT TO THE BOARD. AND WE CAN JUST, YOU KNOW, I, I, THIS IS JOSEPH. I, I, I THINK WE SHOULD, WE CAN HAVE SOME KIND OF, UH, YOU KNOW, DEFINITION IN THERE, OR OR FAULT EXPLANATION. I, UM, BUT KEEPING IT A LITTLE MORE OPEN-ENDED IS, WOULD BE LIKE, LIKE IT IS, IS, UM, THE RECOMMENDATION. OKAY. SO EVERYBODY'S IN AGREEANCE WITH THE RED, UNDERLINED TEXT STAYS AS THEY UPDATE TO THE AMENDMENT. OKAY. SO I GUESS WE'LL DO A LITTLE VOTE. EVERYBODY AGREE ON IT BEING LEFT IN PLACE AS STATED? DIRECT SUPERVISION IS DEFINED AS ON THE JOB OVERSIGHT. YES. JUST AN FYI, THE STATE BOARD HAS ITS DEFINITION OF WHAT THE APPRENTICE CAN DO. SO RIGHT NOW, AGAIN, THEY'RE LOOKING AT THEIR OPTIONS. THERE'S A TOWN HALL GOING ON TODAY THAT'S GETTING PUBLIC INPUT, BUT AS OF TODAY, THE STATE BOARD HAS ITS DEFINITION OF WHAT AN APPRENTICE CAN DO. BUT AGAIN, MIKE, THEY HAVE A SPECIFIC, UH, DEFINITION FOR DIRECT SUPERVISION. THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE GOING AFTER. IT HASN'T BEEN WRITTEN YET, BUT YES, UNLESS Y'ALL WANT TO ADD INTO YOUR, UM, CHAPTER 10, A DEFINITION FOR DIRECT SUPERVISION. THINK THAT ONE. WE'RE GOOD. THAT'S KIND OF WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO HERE. YEAH, NO, YOU'RE ONLY DEFINING WHAT THE APPRENTICESHIP CAN, UH, OR THE APPRENTICE CAN DO. I MEAN, I THINK IT'S OKAY THE WAY IT IS AND WE'LL, WITH THE LANGUAGE ADDED, AND THEN SOMEBODY CAN, AS TIME GOES NOW THIS, WE AS WE DEAL. YEAH, BECAUSE I, I, I JUST THINK AS TECHNOLOGY GETS BETTER, YOU MAY SAY IT'S OKAY TO HAVE A VIDEO DEAL. AND DEPENDING ON WHAT THE APPRENTICE IS DOING, IF THE APPRENTICE [00:20:01] IS, IS, FOR EXAMPLE, DIGGING A HOLE OR A TRENCH OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, IT LEAVES IT A LITTLE LOOSE WHERE, YOU KNOW, ON THE STUFF THAT MATTERS, YOU NEED SOMEBODY WATCHING, YOU KNOW, TO MAKE THE CONNECTIONS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. BUT YOU DON'T WANT THE APPRENTICE RUNNING A GAS LINE OR SOMETHING THAT'S DANGEROUS. AND SO I THINK OVER TIME YOU WILL FIGURE OUT WHAT THAT DIRECT SUPERVISION MEANS. OKAY. AGAIN, WE'LL TAKE A VOTE THEN. UM, ALL IN FAVOR OF LEAVING, UH, THE VERBIAGE AS IT IS. AYE, AYE. ALL AGREE. I GUESS WE'LL MOVE ON TO THE NEXT, OKAY. THE NEXT ITEM IS A PROPOSED AMENDMENT TO THE DEFINITION OF RESPONSIBLE MASTER PLUMBER. SO WE HAVE PROPOSED TO ADD IN THAT LAST SENTENCE, AS YOU SEE ON THE SCREEN, IT'S UNDERLINED, A RESPONSIBLE MASTER PLUMBER CANNOT CONTRACT DIRECTLY TO A PLUMBER'S APPRENTICE. I HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH IT. UH, I, I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHY IT'S BEING ADDED. I'VE NEVER SEEN ANYTHING LIKE THIS. , IS IT SO THAT A CAN'T HIRE A MASTER PLUMBER JUST TO GET THE PERMIT POOL? IS THAT THE, IS THAT THE IDEA? MIKE MORALES, UM, WE HAD A CASE A COUPLE OF MONTHS AGO, A CONTRACTOR, UH, RESIDENTIAL CONTRACTOR, NEW HOMES, UH, GOT CAUGHT WITH NO LICENSED PLUMBER ON SITE. AND HE SHOWED ME A CONTRACT, EXCUSE ME, THAT HE WAS CONTRACTING OUT TO LICENSED PLUMBER, LICENSED PLUMBERS, UH, HAD INSURANCE FORMS, ALL THAT GOOD STUFF. I GAVE HER, WHAT THE HECK? YOU KNOW, ARE WE DOING THIS NOW? CAN THIS BE DONE? I CALLED THE STATE BOARD AND THEY GAVE ME THE GUY'S CRAZY. SO WE FELT IT WAS JUST SOMETHING TO ADD ON THERE. 'CAUSE EITHER THIS GUY WAS PULLING OUR LEG AND SAYING THAT IT WAS ALLOWED. UH, BUT IT'S NEVER BEEN ALLOWED. AND WE JUST WANT TO ADD IT TO THE DEFINITION SAYING, HEY, YOU CAN'T CONTRACT, UH, YOUR, UH, YOUR WORK TO APPRENTICES BUILDING NEW HOMES OR ANY KIND OF HOMES. BUT ISN'T THAT WHAT WE JUST WENT THROUGH? PRETTY MUCH OF SUPERVISION? GEORGE LEE, OF COURSE, THEY'RE, THEY'RE GOING TO GREAT DETAIL TO, TO BE SURE THAT EVERYBODY UNDERSTANDS THIS. YET WE'RE NOT GONNA DEAL WITH DIRECT SUPERVISION ON THE ONE BEFORE WITH DETAIL. SO ALL THIS IS DOING IS BASICALLY JUST SAYING THEY CAN'T SUBCONTRACT. THERE YOU GO. WELL, WHEN, WHEN DEALING WITH SUBCONTRACTORS, THEY CAN'T USE A A, AN APPRENTICE AS THEIR SUBCONTRACTOR. THE APPRENTICES HAVE TO BE DIRECT HIRE. SO DOES THAT, WE'VE GOT A DEFINED SUBCONTRACT. I MEAN, IF YOU'RE PAYING SOMEBODY THAT'S UNDER YOUR SUPERVISION, WHAT, WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE HERE? WELL, THIS IS, UH, AGAIN, THE MASTER IS SUPPOSED TO OVERSEE A LICENSE THAT OVERSEES THE APPRENTICE. OKAY. SO IF HE CONTRACTS WITH A LICENSED MAN, HVAC DOESN'T HAVE QUITE THE DETAIL OF, OF LICENSES AND THE CONTROL THAT THE LICENSE HAVE PER JOB. SO WE DON'T HAVE IN, WE DON'T NECESSARILY HAVE INSTALLERS, WE HAVE APPRENTICES. SO I DON'T NECESSARILY HAVE AN I A PROBLEM WITH IT, IT'S JUST THAT WE'RE GOING TO A LOT OF, A LOT OF WORDS TO, TO BE SURE THAT WE UNDERSTAND THAT, UH, MASTER CAN'T SUBCONTRACT DIRECTLY WITH AN APPRENTICE, BUT WE'RE NOT GONNA CONTROL THE DIRECT SUPERVISION. RIGHT. SO A QUESTION THAT I HAVE IS, IS THE PROBLEM IS THAT THE APPRENTICE CONTRACTED WITH SOMEBODY TO DO THE WORK AND THEN USED THE MASTER PLUMBER TO PULL A PERMIT? OR DID THE PLUMBING COMPANY HIRE A SUBCONTRACTOR THAT WAS A APPRENTICE ONLY THE PLUMBING COMPANY? YES. WENT OUT, HIRED, UH, APPRENTICES TO DO THE WORK WHERE THE PLUMBING COMPANY SHOULD, WE WE'RE TALKING SUBCONTRACTORS. THE, THE PLUMBING COMPANY SHOULD HAVE WENT OUT AND HIRED LICENSED PLUMBERS, LICENSED JOURNEYMAN PLUMBERS, UH, AS SUBCONTRACTORS TO DO THE WORK OUT THERE. BUT INSTEAD, LIKE I SAID, THESE APPRENTICES, AGAIN, I DON'T KNOW HOW IT WENT THROUGH INSURANCE COMPANIES OR WHAT HAVE YOU. THEY WENT OUT [00:25:01] AND SAID, THIS IS OUR BUSINESS. THIS COMPANY WENT OUT WITH THESE, UH, APPRENTICES HAD THEIR BOND ON THERE, AND THE COMPANIES HIRED THEM. SO IF A MASTER PLUMBER HIRES A SUBCONTRACTOR TO GO OUT AND DO A JOB, AND HE HAS A LICENSED PLUMBER ON THE JOB, IS THAT STILL ACCEPTABLE? AS LONG AS THE LICENSED PLUMBER, JOURNEYMAN PLUMBER, UH, MASTER PLUMBER, YES. THAT'S ACCEPTABLE. I COULD BE A PLUMBER AND HAVE, UH, A FEW APPRENTICES, UH, UNDER ME WORKING FOR ME. YEAH, BUT THAT THIS IS NOT WHAT, THAT THIS IS SAYING THAT YOU CAN'T DO IT NO MATTER WHAT IS WHAT I'M READING IT. EXACTLY. YOU CANNOT CONTRACT THE WORKOUT TO, UH, APPRENTICES. I GUESS MY QUESTION IS, DO WE NEED THIS? IF YOU ALREADY, IF YOU ALREADY FLAGGED IT AS, AS BEING OUT, YOU KNOW, OUTRAGEOUSLY WRONG, LIKE IS THIS REQUIRED? CAN YOU PLEASE YOUR MIC? I I'M HOLDING IT. I'M SORRY. YEAH, I, MY QUESTION IS, IF YOU, LIKE, WHEN THE PERSON SAID THAT TO YOU, YOU KIND OF HAD THIS REACTION, HE CALLED THE STATE BOARD, LIKE, NO, THEY CAN'T DO THAT. SO IF, IF, IF WE ALREADY KNOW THEY CAN'T DO THAT, DO WE NEED TO CHANGE THE LAW? YOU KNOW, IT'S ONE OF THOSE THINGS THAT YOU PICK UP A BOTTLE OF POISON AND SAY, DO NOT INGEST, YOU KNOW, SAYING, HERE IT IS, YOU CANNOT DO IT. UH, PEOPLE ARE STILL GONNA FIND WAYS OF, YOU KNOW, FINAGLING, YOU KNOW, WIGGLING TO BEND THE LAW. WE'RE JUST SAYING RIGHT HERE, YOU CANNOT DO IT. WE'RE SPELLING IT OUT. YOU CANNOT CONTRACT WORK OUT TO APPRENTICES. THEY EITHER HAVE TO BE ADJO, JOURNEYMAN, MASTER, UH, PLUMBER. BUT IF THE, IF THE COMPANY WHO HIRES THE SUBCONTRACTOR SUPERVISES THE WORK OF THE APPRENTICES, WHY WOULD THAT, THAT'S LEGAL. I'M SORRY, HOW WAS THAT AGAIN? SO IF I'M A PLUMBING COMPANY AND I GO TO A THIRD PARTY AND SUBCONTRACT, I WANT 10 APPRENTICES OUT THERE ON MY JOB TO HELP DO THIS, AND I'M GONNA BE OUT ON THE JOB WITH THEM SUPERVISING, THAT WOULD BE LEGAL AS LONG AS YOU'RE, UH, THE PLUMBER, UH, UH, ASSIGNED TO THAT, THAT, UH, THAT PROJECT. RIGHT? SO, BUT THIS, THIS BASICALLY WOULD MAKE THAT ILLEGAL IN SAN ANTONIO, THE WAY IT'S DRAFTED, BECAUSE IT'S NOT TALKING. AND I THINK THAT'S THE POINT YOU RAISED, IS THAT IT'S NOT, IF YOU'RE GONNA LEAVE IT IN LIKE IT IS, YOU NEED TO LESS AND LESS SUPERVISED BY A LICENSED PLUMBER OR YOU KNOW THAT. BECAUSE I THINK WHAT THIS SAYS IS YOU CAN'T DO IT. AND WHAT THE REAL DEAL IS, IS THEY CAN'T DO IT UNLESS THE PERSON IS SUPERVISED BY SOMEBODY WHO IS, WHO HAS A LICENSE, WHO WOULDN'T, WHO AND WHO IS UNDER A MASTER, BECAUSE THAT IS REQUIRED. AND SO I THINK YOU MAKE IT, LEAVING IT IN MAKES IT HARDER, YOU KNOW, THAN IT DOES JUST TAKING IT OUT AND SAYING APPRENTICES HAS TO BE SUED, SUPERVISED BY A MASTER PLUMBER AND DIRECT SUPERVISED BY A LICENSED PLUMBER. SO THE STATE LAW, THE ONLY WAY THE APPRENTICES CAN BE ACCUMULATE THEIR 4,008,000 HOURS IS TO BE UNDER SUPERVISION OF A RMP, NOT NECESSARILY A MASTER, AND DEFINITELY NOT A JOURNEYMAN. CAN YOU THEN HIRE DIRECTLY AS A SUBCONTRACTOR, A APPRENTICE? HE IS NOT IN YOUR PAYROLL. NO. IF YOU HIRED A, WHERE AM I GOING NOW? I I'M SEEING THAT THIS, THAT IT STILL DOESN'T WORK. UM, I MEAN, I, I'M, I'M THINKING THAT MARK IS NOT CORRECT BECAUSE THE STATE LAW REQUIRES THAT THE APPRENTICE BE UNDER THE SUPERVISION OF AN [00:30:01] RMP, NOT NECESSARILY THE MA A MASTER. DO WE UNDERSTAND THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE RMP AND A MASTER? SO THE RMP IS THE RESPONSIBLE MASTER PLUMBER IN THE SHOP. LIKE I'LL HAVE, I HAVE THREE OTHER MASTERS, BUT I'M THE RMP. YEAH, CORRECT. BUT, BUT WHAT IT SAYS IN THE DEFINITION THAT WE JUST WORKED ON, IT SAYS GENERAL SUPERVISION OF THE RESPONSIBLE MASTER PLUMBER AND, AND THEN THE DIRECT SUPERVISION OF A LICENSED PLUMBER. AND I JUST THINK ADDING WHAT YOU'RE PUTTING IN HERE COULD MAKE SOMETHING ILLEGAL. THAT WOULD BE, YOU WOULD FIND OPEN. 'CAUSE THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN, I CAN'T SAY I'M A MASTER PLUMBER AND I HAVE, YOU KNOW, FIVE JOURNEYMEN AND, BUT I CAN'T FIND APPRENTICES IN THE LABOR MARKET. THIS SAYS I CAN'T HIRE APPRENTICES REGARDLESS OF HOW THEY'RE SUPERVISED THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN. UM, I CAN'T SUB I, WELL, IT SAYS I CAN'T SUBCONTRACT DIRECTLY TO A PLUMBER'S APPRENTICE. SO I, IF I'M A PLUMBER'S APPRENTICE COMPANY WHERE I'M BASICALLY JUST, YOU KNOW, APPRENTICE LABOR, THIS SAYS I CAN'T CONTRACT WITH A MASTER PLUMBER TO, TO DO WORK. I TEND TO AGREE WITH WHAT'S BEING SAID, WHICH IS THE SUPERVISION REQUIREMENTS ALREADY EXIST. WHETHER THEY'RE SUBCONTRACTOR OR MY OWN PLUMBERS, A PLUMBER CAN'T DO WORK ON MY SITE WITHOUT DIRECT SUPERVISION OF AT LEAST A LICENSED PLUMBER, REGARDLESS OF HOW I GOT 'EM. UM, SO MAYBE WE JUST LEAVE THIS OUT. I MEAN, I SEE WHAT YOU'RE TRYING TO DO, BUT I THINK IT'S, YOU KNOW, I THINK A, YOU ALREADY FLAGGED IT AS, THAT DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE TO ME. SO, YOU KNOW, I FEEL LIKE IT MIGHT BE, YOU KNOW, NOT NECESSARY. AND THEN THIS ALSO, THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN SAYS I CAN'T, AS A MASTER PLUMBER EVEN JUST SUBCONTRACT WITH A GROUP OF APPRENTICES REGARDLESS OF SUPERVISION, UM, THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN. SO MY SUGGESTION WOULD BE TO JUST, WE, WE TAKE THIS CHANGE OUT. OKAY. I'M COOL WITH THAT. UM, LIKE I SAID, IT SOUNDS MORE DIFFICULT THAN WHAT IT REALLY IS. UH, KEYWORD SUBCONTRACT. UM, IF SOMETHING WAS ADDED ON THERE, AGAIN, IT'S JUST GETTING THE WORD OUT. I AGREE WITH YOU. YOU KNOW, IT, IT'S A TWISTING OF THE WORDS. UM, WE JUST THOUGHT IT WOULD BE BENEFICIAL TO PUT IT OUT THERE, SPELL IT OUT THERE, UH, WHERE YOU CANNOT DO THIS. UH, AGAIN, I AGREE WITH WHAT Y'ALL ARE SAYING ABOUT THIS. IF Y'ALL WANNA STRIKE IT, I'M GOOD WITH THAT. SO WHERE IN THE STATE LAW DOES IT SAY THAT YOU CANNOT SUBCONTRACT WITH THE APPRENTICE? I KNOW YOU CALLED THE STATE AND HAD LISA OR SOMEBODY INTERPRET THAT, UH, SIDNEY. SIDNEY, WHERE THAT SECTION IS. I COULDN'T, I COULDN'T TELL YOU. UM, I THINK IT'S ALL UNDER THE ASSUMPTION THAT A, AN APPRENTICE IS ALWAYS GONNA BE HIRED. HE'S ONLY GONNA GAIN HIS TIME WORKING UNDER THE RMP, NOT WORKING WITH A JOURNEYMAN. SO IT MUST BE IN THAT, IN WAY THAT THEY'RE LOOKING AT THE WAY THEY ACCUMULATE HOURS TO GET THEIR LICENSES. AGAIN, IT IS JUST ONE OF THOSE THINGS. IT'S JUST A OLD, IT WOULD BE WOULD DEPENDS ON HOW CLEAR, HOW IT WOULD BE UNDER THE LICENSING. UH, WHO'S RESPONSIBLE FOR, FOR WHAT. YOU KNOW, AS A JOURNEYMAN, I COULD BE RESPONSIBLE FOR X AMOUNT OF, UH, APPRENTICES. UH, BUT AGAIN, CONTRACTING WITH AN APPRENTICE, WHICH PRETTY MUCH IS NO LICENSE, UM, YOU KNOW, TO CONTRACT ANYTHING. NO. WELL, IF SOMEBODY CAN INTERPRET THAT, THEY CAN HIRE A SUBCONTRACT WITH, UH, YOU KNOW, A PLUMBER'S APPRENTICE, THEY'RE GONNA BLOW RIGHT THROUGH THIS, UH, DIRECT SUPERVISION CLAUSE THAT Y'ALL GOT IN HERE. SO I'M GOOD WITH IT EITHER WAY, YOU KNOW, UH, MARK, ANY ANY THOUGHTS? I MEAN, I JUST THINK YOU TAKE IT OUT. I THINK IT, IT COMPLICATE, IT'S FOR THE APPRENTICE TO DO WORK ON A JOB, THEY MUST BE UNDER THE GENERAL SUPERVISION OF AN RPM AND, UH, ALSO UNDER THE DIRECT SUPERVISION OF SOMEBODY THAT HAS A LICENSE PERIOD. SO IF YOU CAN MEET THAT QUALIFICATION AND SUBCONTRACT, GREAT. AND IF YOU CAN'T, YOU SHUT THE JOB DOWN. YES. IN OTHER WORDS, IT'S, YOU KNOW, RATHER THAN PUTTING SOMETHING IN THAT MAKES IT MORE COMPLICATED, YOU ALREADY HAVE THAT AUTHORITY. LESS WORDS IS ALWAYS BETTER. IN MY TIME HERE AT DEVELOPMENT SERVICES, THIS WAS THE FIRST TIME THAT WE ACTUALLY CAME ACROSS THIS COMPANY, UH, THAT ADMIT IT. THIS IS WHAT WE DO. WELL, AGAIN, WE'RE GONNA HAVE PEOPLE WORK AROUND THE VERBIAGE NO MATTER WHAT WE DO. SO, UH, THEN [00:35:03] I GUESS, UH, I CAN'T MOVE, BUT I SUGGEST SOMEBODY MOVE THAT WE, WE LEAVE THIS AMENDMENT OUT. YOU MAKE A MOVE TO STRIKE THAT. OKAY. OKAY. ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE TO STRIKE THE CLAUSE. WE, WE DON'T HAVE TO DO THIS. NO, NOT FOR EACH. NOT FOR EACH ONE. WE CAN AT THE END PROPOSE TO, UM, MOVE FORWARD. UH, AS, AS DISCUSSED, YOU CAN DO ONE MOTION AT THE END, THEN LET'S MOVE FORWARD TO THE NEXT ONE. ALRIGHT. THE NEXT ONE IS, UM, ALSO AN AMENDMENT. THIS IS THE SEPARATION FROM ELECTRICAL LINES IN A DITCH. SO WE HAVE PROPOSED TO UPDATE THIS AMENDMENT TO SPECIFY THAT THAT 36 INCH SEP HORIZONTAL SEPARATION IS JUST FOR COMMERCIAL INSTALLATIONS. AND THAT RESIDENTIAL INSTALLATIONS, UM, ONLY HAVE TO BE 12 INCHES, UM, SEPARATED HORIZONTALLY. UH, THIS WAS COORDINATED WITH OUR ELECTRICAL. ACTUALLY, THIS CAME FROM OUR ELECTRICAL, UM, AND CPS. SO WHAT IS IT CURRENTLY? CURRENTLY IT IS 36 INCHES FOR BOTH COMMERCIAL AND RESIDENTIAL. SO EVERYTHING THAT YOU SEE IN BLACK, UM, WAS PREVIOUSLY THERE. AND THE RED IS WHAT WE ARE PROPOSING TO ADD. SO IT HAS ALWAYS AND FOREVER BEEN 36 INCHES, UH, REQUIRED THAT HORIZONTAL SEPARATION OF 36 INCHES. SO WE ARE MAKING IT BETTER, RIGHT? IT'S A LOT OF TIMES IT'S DIFFICULT TO GET THAT SEPARATION IN A RESIDENTIAL, UM, USE. SO COORDINATING WITH CPS, UM, THEIR REQUIREMENT IS, IS 12 INCHES FOR BOTH HORIZONTAL OR FOR, UH, COMMERCIAL AND RESIDENTIAL. SO, UH, WE WANNA KEEP THE 36 INCH SEPARATION FOR COMMERCIAL AND DROP IT DOWN TO 12 FOR RESIDENTIAL. AND, UH, I'M GOOD WITH IT. UH, MARKETING PROBLEMS. SCOTT, I DON'T, IS THERE ANY IMPACT ON THIS? UM, GONNA RAISE COST OR ANYTHING? ACTUALLY, IT SHOULD REDUCE COSTS BECAUSE THE CURRENT REQUIREMENT IS A SEPARATION OF THREE FEET. YEAH. CURRENTLY SHE COULD DIG ONE DITCH AND, AND I'VE BEEN IN SITUATIONS ON RESIDENTIAL WHERE WE COULD NOT GET THAT 36 INCH BETWEEN THE BUILDINGS AND PROPERTY LINES AND THINGS. AND SO IT WAS, IT'S ALWAYS A CHALLENGE ON RESIDENTIAL. SO WHY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN COMMERCIAL AND RES? IF IT'S GOOD ENOUGH FOR A HOUSE, WHY ISN'T IT GOOD ENOUGH FOR A, UM, JUST THE, THE, I MEAN, I'M JUST A YOU HAVE LARGER LINES, YOU YEAH. HIGHER VOLTAGE. UH, AND YOU'LL SEE THIS SAME AMENDMENT COPIED OVER TO THE FUEL GAS, UM, BECAUSE WE ALSO HAVE THIS IN THE FUEL GAS. UM, AND THEN OBVIOUSLY THIS WILL BE UPDATED. UH, ACTUALLY I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S IN OUR N EEC REQUIREMENTS, BUT IF IT IS, THAT DEFINITION WILL BE UPDATED OR THAT WERE, THAT SECTION WILL BE UPDATED THROUGHOUT. OKAY. OUR NEXT ITEM SECTION, WE ARE IN THE IPC NOW SECTION 3 0 6 2 4. THIS IS A NEW SECTION, UH, FOR TRACER WIRE AND WE ARE PROPOSING TO, UH, DELETE IT IN ITS ENTIRETY. SO FOR PLA FOR PLASTIC SEWER PIPING AND INSULATED COPPER TRACER WIRE OR OTHER APPROVED CONDUIT SHALL BE INSTALLED. UH, WE FOR SEWER PIPING, WE FEEL THIS IS AN OVERKILL AND WE'LL JUST ADD ADDITIONAL COST. UM, AND THOSE ARE, UH, THOSE ARE ALREADY RE SEWER LINES ARE ALREADY REQUIRED TO BE SEPARATED FROM ELECTRICAL, UH, BY THAT THREE FEET WE JUST TALKED ABOUT. SO THE RISK IS, UH, SMALL FOR THE REWARD AND FOR THE COST. SO JUST FOR US, LAYING A TRACER WIRE IS SOMETHING THAT YOU CAN HOOK SOMETHING UP AND RUN SOMEWHERE ON TOP OF IT TO TELL WHERE THE SEWER LINE RUNS? YES. WITH THE CAMERA TECHNOLOGY AND YEAH, THEY CAN DO THE SAME THING FROM INSIDE. MM-HMM. PUTTING A CABLE DOWN IT AND GO WALK ON. YEAH. IS EVERYBODY GOOD WITH STRIKING THIS SECTION COMPLETELY TRACER WIRE? UM, IT'S ALREADY RE OTHER THAN THE FACT, OTHER THAN THE FACT THAT YOU'VE GOT OTHER VERBIAGE HERE THAT SAYS, UH, THE SEWER IS REQUIRED. ARE YOU, YOU ARE EVEN STRIKING ALL THIS, THE, THE STATEMENT THAT YOU HAVE SEWERS REQUIRED TO BE HORIZONTALLY SEPARATED FROM ELECTRICAL. THAT'S, THAT'S JUST A SUMMARY. UM, WE JUST TALKED, THAT'S JUST A SUMMARY. YEAH, THAT'S JUST A SUMMARY OF [00:40:01] UH, WHY WE THINK THAT THIS OKAY. LANGUAGE SHOULD BE STRUCK. I WAS WONDERING WHY WE THAT WAS GONNA BE LEFT IN, IF THAT WAS GONNA BE LEFT IN. SO, GOTCHA. THAT'S FINE. GO AHEAD AND MOVE ON. ALRIGHT, . OKAY. THE FIRST ONE'S ALWAYS STARTED. YEAH, WE GOT THROUGH THE HARD ONES. OKAY. THAT'S WHY THEY STARTED WITH, YEAH. UH, NUMBER FIVE. SO THIS IS, UM, CHANGED TO EXISTING SECTIONS. YOU SEE THAT 3 0 7 0.2 AND 3 0 7 0.3 FOR CUTTING NOTCHING AND BORING. THEY JUST REMOVED THOSE REQUIREMENTS AND REFERENCED BACK TO THE A ISI STANDARDS. UM, YOU'LL SEE THIS CONSISTENT THROUGHOUT ALL OF THE CODES. UH, IT WAS PREVIOUSLY REFERENCING, I THINK THE IBC, UM, SECTION OR IDENTIFYING THE REQUIREMENTS FOR THE CUTTING AND NOTCHING. IT JUST REFERENCES BACK TO THE STANDARDS FOR ALL THE I CODES NOW. SO ARE OUR, UH, IBC REFERENCES THE SAME A-I-S-I-S TWO 20 STANDARD? YES. OKAY. OKAY. THE NEXT ITEM NUMBER SIX, THIS IS OUR, UH, COSA AMENDMENT TO 3 12, 12 0.2 FOR DRAINAGE AND VENT WATER TESTING. SO WE ARE PROPOSING TO REVISE OUR LANGUAGE AND STRIKE OUT THE STATEMENT THAT THIS TEST CAN BE CONDUCTED AT TOP OUT. AND YOU PUT THREE 12, THAT'S, NO, NO, NO. CAN YOU EXPLAIN THIS? THIS ONE, MILTON. I KNOW WE SPENT LIKE AN HOUR AT LAST TIME. WE ADOPTED THIS ON WHEN YOU COULD DO THIS. SO BEFORE WE GET RID OF IT, I'M SORRY, I I DIDN'T GET THAT. I'M SORRY. ROSS, I, CAN YOU JUST EXPLAIN WHAT THIS DOES? OUR INSPECTIONS ARE A ROUGH IN START, ROUGH IN PREPO, UH, BEFORE THE CONCRETE IS PLACED, UH, THE TOP OUT, UH, WHEN THE CONCRETE'S PLACED, UH, THE FRAME IS, IS GOING IN THE WAY THIS WAS WRITTEN YEARS AGO. UM, I THINK IT WAS EITHER TO GET AWAY BEING THE MANPOWER OF THE INSPECTIONS WEREN'T HERE. WE WEREN'T GETTING TO, TO THE PREPORT INSPECTION WHERE THIS IS STATING THAT IF YOU MISS THE PREPORT INSPECTION, EVEN THOUGH THE VERBIAGE OF PRIOR TO ANY CONCEALMENT WAS THERE, IF YOU POURED THAT SLAB, AS LONG AS IT HAD A A WATER TEST ON IT, WE CAN CLEAR THE PREPO INSPECTION. WE MISSED THIS ON THE LAST CODE CYCLE WHERE PEOPLE WERE ABUSING, UH, THE PREPO INSPECTION, NOT CALLING THEM IN, GOING WITH THIS SECTION, UH, AND CLEARING THAT PREPO. SO NOW WE JUST WANT TO STRIKE OUT THAT SECTION SAYING THIS INSPECTION MAY ALSO BE ATTAINED BY RETESTING, UH, THE FIRST FLOOR UNDERGROUND WASTE, UM, AND THE TOP OUT, UH, TO ENSURE THERE'S NO BROKEN LINES. WELL, THEY DO, UH, A WATER TEST ON THE ROUGH END TO MAKE SURE IT IS HOLDING, BUT WE ALSO LOOK FOR GRADE ON THE PIPING. WE ALSO LOOK FOR THE SLEEVING ON THE BUILDING DRAIN. UM, THERE'S A NUMBER OF THINGS THAT WE DO LOOK AT, AT THAT PRE POUR. AND WITH THIS SECTION, UH, THAT WE STRUCK OUT, WE'RE HOPING THAT AGAIN, PEOPLE, WELL, WE GOT HOLD OF IT. UH, PEOPLE AREN'T ABUSING THIS, UH, AS THEY WERE, YOU KNOW, TWO OR THREE YEARS AGO. SO, BUT WE JUST WANTED TO STRIKE THAT VERBIAGE OUT BECAUSE OF THAT PREPORT INSPECTION. SO IN THE CITY OF SAN ANTONIO, THE PREPORT INSPECTION IS IT, ARE TWO INSPECTORS COMING OUT, THE PLUMBER INSPECTOR AND SOMEBODY TO LOOK AT THE ACTUAL, UM, CONSTRUCTION OF THE SLAB AND THE CABLES AND ALL THAT. IS IT TWO DIFFERENT INSPECTIONS OR IS IT ONE PERSON DOING BOTH? PLUMBING WILL LOOK AT PLUMBING AND NORMALLY AN ENGINEER WILL COME LOOK AT THE FOUNDATION. RIGHT? SO FOR THE PRE, IS IT POSSIBLE TO GET A PREPORT INSPECTION PASS WHERE THE SLAB HAS BEEN LOOKED AT AND ALL THE CABLES AND THE CHAIRS AND ALL THAT STUFF IS, ARE APPROVED BUT THE PLUMBER HASN'T COME OUT TO, OR THE PLUMBING INSPECTOR HASN'T COME OUT TO CHECK THE, THE WATERTIGHT OR, OR IS IT ONE PERSON THAT DOES BOTH? AND I'M JUST THINK NO, THE, THE CITY DOESN'T USUALLY DO THE FOUNDATION INSPECTION. THEY, YOUR ENGINEER COMES OUT AND LOOKS AT IT. OH, THE CITY OF SAN ANTONIO DOESN'T DO A PRE, THE ONLY, WELL, PART OF THE PRE WELL, NO, THEY CAN, BUT NORMALLY THEY DON'T. OUR EXPERIENCE IS IS THAT YOU BASICALLY HAVE AN ENGINEER COME OUT, SIGN A LETTER, GIVE IT TO THE CITY, YOU'RE DONE , I THINK 10 TIMES OUTTA 10. UM, YEAH, I MEAN WE, WE, WE COULD DO THOSE INSPECTIONS, [00:45:01] BUT IF THEY HAVE ANY DEVIATION WHATSOEVER FROM THE CONTRACT DRAWINGS OR IF IT'S RESIDENTIAL AND IT'S JUST NOT VERY WELL DEFINED OUT, THEN IT'S HARD FOR US TO MAKE THOSE DECISIONS SINCE WE DON'T HAVE THE STRUCTURAL EXPERTISE. SO THE DEFAULT MOST CONTRACTORS USE IS TO JUST HIRE AN ENGINEER AND PROVIDE A FOUNDATION LETTER AFTER THE POOR, UH, TO US. BUT IF WE, IF THEY REQUESTED US TO GO OUT THERE AND DO THAT INSPECTION, WE WOULD DO THAT, BUT WE WOULD HAVE TO INSPECT IT AGAINST THE DRAWINGS. AND ANY DEVIATION WOULD RESULT IN THE ENGINEER HAVING TO ISSUE A LETTER ANYWAY. SO THAT'S KIND OF THE DEFAULT FOR MOST CONTRACTORS. SO THE PREPO INSPECTION IS JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT AFTER THEY BUILT THE SLAB AROUND THE, THE ROUGH END, THAT IT'S STILL HOLDING WATER. THAT'S THE, THE SOLE PURPOSE OF THE, AND THAT THE, THE, THERE'S SLOPE TO THE SEWER. SO YOU DON'T HAVE A BELLY LINE IN THE SEWER LINE OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, THAT THERE'S THE PROPER YEAH, I MEAN, THAT, THAT SHOULD BE DONE AT THE ROUGH END. SO THAT WE'RE BASICALLY, THE PREPO IS JUST SAYING THAT THE SLAB CONSTRUCTION DIDN'T CHANGE ANYTHING. WELL, SO ROUGH END IS AFTER THE POUR. SO PREPO, OR I'M SORRY, UM, ROUGH IN IS BEFORE THE WATER OR THE UNDER, WHAT IS THE UNDERGROUND AND WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN UNDERGROUND AND ROUGH END? I THINK THAT'S WHAT WE NEED TO DEFINE YOUR ROUGH IN IS YOUR SANITARY UNDER THE SLAB UNDERGROUND IS YOUR UNDERGROUND WATERLINE. UM, AND THEN SEWER. UH, BUT YES, LIKE JEREMY WAS SAYING, WE LOOK AT THE ROUGH IN AFTER THE FOUNDATION'S BEEN BAGGED, UH, CONTRACTORS TEND TO, TO BREAK THE PIPES, UH, DROP THE PIPES FOR THE SLOPE OF THE PIPE. UM, SO AGAIN, SLOPE SLE ON THE BUILDING DRAIN FOR PIPE PROTECTION, UH, THE WATER LUBE COMING IN, MAKING SURE THAT IT HAS ITS DEPTH AND SEPARATION FROM THE SLAB, UH, AND IT HOLDING A WATER TEST. I MEAN, I'M, I'M GOOD. I THINK IT PROTECTS, IT SEEMS CRAZY TO ME TO, TO POUR FOUNDATION WITHOUT A TOP OUT SPACE. IT ACTUALLY PROTECTS THE CONSUMER, WHICH I THINK IS A GOOD THING. ACTUALLY. IT'S PROTECTING THE PLUMBING COMPANY BECAUSE LATER ON, IF THEY FIND OUT THAT THERE'S A PIECE OF REBAR, SHOV THROUGH THE PVC, THEN THE PLUMBING CONTRACTOR'S ACTUALLY BLOWING SLAB OR TO GO AFTER IT TO FIX IT. SO IN ADDITION TO THIS, I MEAN, WE CAN ALWAYS, IF SOMEBODY WERE TO POUR BEFORE THIS INSPECTION, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE THESE MEANS TO GO BACK AND DO THAT. WE JUST DON'T WANT THIS TO BE THE DEFAULT WRITTEN INTO THE CODE THAT SOMEBODY CAN SAY, OH, THAT'S THE ONE I WENT WITH. AND IT, IT BECOMES THE DEFAULT OUT THERE OF, HEY, WE'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE YOU COME OUT, WE'RE JUST GONNA DO THIS AFTER THE FACT. BUT IF FOR SOME REASON SOMETHING HAPPENS AND THE POOR HAPPENED AND IT COMES TO US, UM, YOU KNOW, THEY COME TO US, LET US KNOW, HEY, CONTRACT REPORT, I WASN'T READY. IT HAPPENS. WE HAVE, WE CAN STILL GO BACK TO THIS. WE JUST DON'T WANT THIS TO BE THE DEFAULT. OKAY, WE'LL MOVE FORWARD WITH STRIKING THAT SENTENCE IN OUR AMENDMENT. THE NEXT ITEM IS, UM, NUMBER SEVEN, SECTION THREE, 12.4 FOR DRAINAGE AND VENT VACUUM TEST. SO WE ARE PROPOSING TO ADOPT THAT NEW SECTION AS WRITTEN. IT ADDS THE VACUUM TESTING AS AN OPTION. AND, AND THIS PROVIDES CONSISTENCY WITH THE IRC. SO THIS WAS ALREADY IN THE IRC AND THEN YOU'RE JUST ADDING IT TO THE PLUMBING CODE AS AN OPTION. WHAT, WHAT IS IT AN OPTION? WHAT'S THE OTHER OPTION? OTHER IS THAT WHAT, JUST FIVE A WATER TEST AND LEAK. I'M SORRY. IT WAS ALWAYS A WATER TEST WITH A 10 FOOT HEAD. UH, BUT IN THERE VERBIAGE IN THE STATE THAT ALLOWS AIR PRESSURE TEST OR DID THEY STRIKE IT? THE, THE IP STRUCK IT. UH, SO THERE USED TO BE WHERE THEY COULD RUN AIR PRESSURE, BUT I GUESS IN LIEU OF NOT BEING ABLE TO FILL OR HAVE ACCESS TO WATER, THEY NEEDED ANOTHER OPTION. SO I, THE, THE PIPE WOULD BE VERY DIFFICULT TO IMPLODE, BUT IT WAS ALWAYS EASY TO EXPLODE. SO I'M GOOD WITH IT. ANYBODY ELSE? ALRIGHT, THE NEXT ITEM IS TABLE 4 0 3 0.1 FOR MINIMUM NUMBER OF REQUIRED PLUMBING FIXTURES. SO THEY'RE WE'RE PROPOSING TO ADOPT AS WRITTEN, ADOPT ALL THE CHANGES. THEY MODIFIED THE EXISTING TABLE, UM, TO BREAK DOWN THOSE OCCUPANCY TYPES, THOSE CLASSIFICATIONS. SO JASMINE WILL SHOW YOU HERE, OH, TABLE 4 0 3, ALL THE BLUE, UM, TEXTS, KEEP SCROLLING DOWN AGAIN, THEY JUST BROKE OUT THOSE OCCUPANCY TYPES. UM, NOT REALLY SIGNIFICANT CHANGE. YOU'RE NOT GONNA BE [00:50:01] REQUIRED TO HAVE ADDITIONAL PLUMBING FIXTURES. THIS IS JUST EASIER TO SAY WHICH OCCUPANCY TYPE ARE YOU. UM, RATHER THAN IDENTIFYING THE CLOSEST ONE YOU ARE IS, IS IS VERY MINUTE. WE ARE NOT PROPOSING ANY CHANGES TO THOSE REQUIRED PLUMBING FIXTURES PER THIS TABLE. GOOD. THAT'S JUST AN UPDATE. WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN UNIT AND A SLEEPING UNIT? A DWELLING UNIT INCLUDES PROVISIONS, UH, PERMANENT PROVISIONS FOR COOKING, BATHING, SLEEPING, LIVING. UM, YOU THINK OF A, A TYPICAL DWELLING UNIT, AN APARTMENT VERSUS A SLEEPING UNIT IS A HOTEL. SO ANY OF THOSE ITEMS THAT ARE REMOVED, TYPICALLY THE PROVISIONS FOR COOKING, UH, ARE NOT PRESENT IN A SLEEPING UNIT. AND YOU'LL SEE THROUGHOUT THEY'VE, THEY'VE ADDED DWELLING UNIT OR SLEEPING UNIT. SO YOU SEE A LOT OF THESE, UM, UM, LONG STAY, UH, LONG STAY HOTELS. NOW, UM, THAT JUST MAKES THIS, MAKES IT EASIER TO IDENTIFY THOSE AS DWELLING UNITS BECAUSE THEY DO HAVE ALL OF THE PROVISIONS OF A DWELLING UNIT AND THEY MAY ALSO HAVE SLEEPING UNITS IN THE SAME FACILITY. YEAH, NO, I, IN THE HOTEL, I GOT IT IN THE APARTMENT HOUSE. I WAS TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT A SLEEPING UNIT IS BECAUSE I DON'T, IF, IF I AS AN INDUSTRY PERSON HAVE NO CLUE WHAT THAT MEANS, THE AVERAGE JOE ISN'T. AND I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE IT'S NOT TRIGGERING SOME EXTRA, YOU KNOW, FOR EXAMPLE, A UH, IS A DORMITORY THAT RENTS TO STUDENTS, THAT IS AN APARTMENT HOUSE THAT HAS, THAT'S RENTING PER, PER BEDROOM. IS THAT A SLEEPING DEFINED AS A SLEEPING? EACH BEDROOM IS A SLEEPING UNIT BECAUSE THAT'S HOW IT'S BEING RENTED, WHICH WOULD REQUIRE YOU TO HAVE A TWO BEDROOM, TWO BATH OR THREE BEDROOM, THREE BATH OR FOUR BEDROOM, FOUR BATH VERSUS TWO BATHROOMS BECAUSE IT, IT, IT EXCEEDS ONE. SO I JUST THINK I I, THAT WAS MY ONLY CONCERN AS WELL IS WHEN YOU HAVE THOSE KIND OF OCCUPIES, YOU, THE STUDENT HOUSING YOU IS WHERE YOU'VE GOT THE FOUR ONE KITCHEN, FOUR SEPARATE BEDROOMS SO THEY CAN RUN 'EM OUT TO FOUR SEPARATE KIDS AND, AND ONE BATHROOM SHARED. DO WE CONSIDER THAT THAT WHOLE THING A DWELLING UNIT? AND AS LONG AS THE CITY CONSIDERS THAT A DWELLING UNIT AND NOT FOUR SEPARATE SLEEPING UNITS, I THINK WE'RE GOOD. WELL, THERE'S A SPECIFIC CLASSIFICATION FOR DORMITORY DORMITORIES, AND THAT HASN'T CHANGED. IT'S NOT A DORM, IT'S NOT A DORMITORY, IT'S AN APARTMENT. SO, SO IT IT'S IN AN APARTMENT COMPLEX. IT'S NOT, IT, IN OTHER WORDS, IT'S THE NEW WAY. IN OTHER WORDS, THERE'S ALL THESE STUDENT HOUSING PLACES AND THAT ARE RENTING BY THE BEDROOM. SO IS THE BEDROOM IN THAT CASE A SLEEPING UNIT WHICH WOULD REQUIRE EXTRA BATHROOMS? OR IS IT ONE DWELLING AND I THINKS ALL DWELLING AS LONG AS, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE ON THE RECORD OR SOMETHING THAT SAYS THAT IS A DWELLING UNIT. WE DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM IF, IF, BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW WHAT A SLEEPING UNIT WOULD BE IN AN APARTMENT, YOU KNOW, HOUSE. SO IF THERE'S ONE ENTRANCE INTO THAT ENTIRE UNIT THAT'S A DWELLING UNIT, IT INCLUDES PROVISIONS FOR COOKING, BATHING, UM, SO IT WOULD BE ONE PER DWELLING UNIT. SO IF I HAVE THREE SEPARATE ENTRANCES INTO THAT UNIT, YOU KNOW, WHERE EVERYBODY HAS A ENTRY INTO THEIR, INTO THEIR, FROM THE OUTSIDE TO THEIR, AND I'M BEING SERIOUS BECAUSE THAT'S HOW THEY'RE BEING DESIGNED FOR PRIVACY SOMETIMES IS THAT, YOU KNOW, THEY HAVE A PATIO ENTRY OR A FRENCH DOOR THAT HAS A LOCK ON IT THAT THEY CAN GET INTO. I MEAN, WHICH BY STATE LAW IS DEFINED AS AN ENTRY INTO THE BUILDING OR ENTRY AT GRADE, YOU KNOW, WOULD IN THE FIRE COAT. SO I JUST, I THINK THAT BECAUSE IT SHARES THE KITCHEN, IT SHARES LIKE THE LIVING ROOM AREA, I THINK, UM, A CASE EVEN IF, I DON'T THINK THE CITY WOULD WANTS TO, TO REQUIRE THAT. SO EVEN IF IT DID COME UP, I THINK THERE'S A LEGAL CASE TO BE MADE. LIKE NO, THIS IS ACTUALLY DWELLING IN, I THINK, I THINK WE'RE PROBABLY, I THINK WE'RE PROBABLY ALL RIGHT. YEAH. IF IT IS ALL SHARED, YOU'RE RIGHT. EVEN IF THERE IS A SEPARATE ENTRANCE, IF THEY'RE ALL STILL ABLE TO ACCESS THE, THE COOKING AND BATHING, UM, FACILITIES, THEN IT WOULD BE A DWELLING UNIT OVERALL. AND THEN WAS THIS TABLE IN HERE LAST TIME? YES. ONLY THE ITEMS IN BLUE, UM, WERE ADDED. [00:55:01] SO LIKE ON AN APARTMENT HOUSE WHERE IT SAYS YOU HAVE TO HAVE ONE AUTOMATIC CLOSED WASHER CONNECTION FOR 20 DWELLING UNITS THAT WAS ALREADY IN THERE. YEAH, NO, I KNOW, BUT I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT, BECAUSE I'M TELLING YOU TODAY, THEY DON'T PUT THOSE IN LIKE THAT, YOU KNOW, SO ON A, ON, SO APARTMENTS THAT ARE BEING BUILT, UH, THAT DON'T PROVIDE WASHER AND DRYER CONNECTIONS ARE NOT PUTTING IN ONE PER 20, YOU KNOW, SO I THINK IF WE CAN JUST, UH, RESERVE THE RIGHT TO COME BACK AND LET ME CALL THE LAUNDRY COMPANY AND FIND OUT WHAT THEY'RE ACTUALLY DOING PER, BECAUSE THE WASHERS ARE NOW, UH, EXTRACTING THE WATER AND THE CYCLES ARE QUICKER. AND SO IF WE CAN JUST, UM, BUT MARK, IF, IF THIS IS DEFINING WHAT IS REQUIRED, WOULDN'T THEY HAVE TO CHANGE THE WAY THEY DESIGN? YEAH, BUT THE REALITY IS, IS THEY'RE PUTTING IN THEIR, THEY'RE, THEY HAVE A FORMULA BASED UPON WHAT PEOPLE'S USE OF THE EQUIPMENT ARE. AND SO TO HAVE A LAUNDRY ROOM THAT HAS, LIKE ON A 200 UNIT PROPERTY TODAY, THEY MAY ONLY PUT SIX OR EIGHT WASHERS AND SIX OR EIGHT DRYERS IN THERE AND, AND AS WELL AS UTILIZE OFFSITE UH, FACILITIES TO USE THEIR WASHER AND DRYER, YOU KNOW, LAUNDROMATS. SO I DON'T KNOW THAT HAVING WASHER AND DRYERS IN APARTMENT HOUSES IS, YOU KNOW, SHOULD BE REQUIRED. I MEAN, IT JUST ADDS TO THE COST OF, OF DEVELOPING THE PROPERTY. BUT, SO I THINK WE CAN ADOPT IT, BUT RESERVE THE RIGHT TO COME BACK AND JUST HAVE A SECOND MEETING. AND LET ME MAKE THE PHONE CALL, UM, IF YOU WANT TO PROPOSE AN AMENDMENT TO THE CHANGE. AGAIN, THIS IS, IS FOR NEW CONSTRUCTION. THIS HAS BEEN IN THE CODE FOR SEVERAL CYCLES THAT I, I RECALL, UM, THERE HAVEN'T BEEN ANY UPDATES OR CHANGES TO THIS REQUIREMENT. BUT MY QUESTION IS ON THE PLANS THAT ARE BEING REVIEWED, ARE YOU CHECKING FOR NUMBER OF WASHERS CONNECTIONS ON THE PROPERTY? WE SHOULD BE JASMINE CONFIRMED, YES. OKAY. NO, THAT, THAT THEY'RE MEETING THIS ONE PER 20 DWELLING UNITS. DO YOU WANT TIME? DO YOU WANT TO BRING THIS BACK UP? YOU CAN GO ADOPT IT AND IT'S, IT NEEDS I'LL, OKAY. AND WE ALWAYS, UH, ENTERTAIN A CODE MODIFICATION TO SAY, HEY, WE'RE NOT MEETING THE LETTER OF THE CODE. UM, BUT THIS IS HOW WE ARE MEETING THE INTENT. UH, SO IF THERE WAS SOMETHING THAT SAID, YOU KNOW, WE ARE NOT PUTTING IN ONE ONE PER 20 AND THIS IS WHY, UH, WE WOULD REVIEW THAT ON A CASE BY CASE BASIS. OKAY. OKAY. THE NEXT ITEM IS THAT FIXTURE CALCULATION. SO I ITEM NUMBER NINE. SO THIS WAS OUR AMENDMENT TO SECTION 4 0 3 1 1. WE'RE PROPOSING TO REMOVE THIS AMENDMENT BECAUSE THE 2024 UPDATED THE LANGUAGE AND IT DID NOT SPECIFY URINALS IN A STALL. UM, AS YOU GUYS MAY REMEMBER, IN THE 2021, THEY ADDED THE, THE GENDER NEUTRAL, UM, HOW DO THEY CALL IT? SERVE ALL GENDERS. UM, AND THEY ADDED IN THIS, UM, THAT EACH URINAL THAT'S PROVIDED SHALL BE LOCATED IN A STALL WHERE WE DID NOT, WE WANTED THOSE FIXTURES LOCATED, UM, IN A, IN A ROOM WITH, UM, WALLS AND A DOOR. SO AGAIN, THIS SECTION IS FIXTURE CALCULATIONS, AND THEY REMOVED THAT LANGUAGE THAT SAYS, LOCATED IN A STALL, URINALS LOCATED IN A STALL. SO WE DON'T NEED THIS AMENDMENT AT ALL. WE STILL WILL RETAIN OUR AMENDMENT FOR, UM, FOR SEPARATE FACILITIES WHERE WE HAVE THAT LANGUAGE THAT SAYS URINALS AND OTHER FIXTURES WILL BE, UH, WILL BE ENCLOSED WITH WALLS AND A DOOR. SO THE, THE 2024 LANGUAGE, UH, REMOVED THE REQUIREMENT TO HAVE THIS AMENDMENT. SO IPC DEALT WITH THE FACT THAT IT TO NOT PUT IN THE URINAL IN THERE, THEY JUST, THEY DIDN'T ADD THE LANGUAGE. UM, EACH URINAL SHALL BE IN A STALL IN THIS FIXTURE CALCULATION SECTION. SO JASMINE HAS IT UP ON THE SCREEN AND IT WAS IN THE, UM, IN THE EXCEPTION NUMBER TWO, WHERE MULTI, WHERE MULTIPLE USER FACILITIES ARE DESIGNED TO SERVE ALL GENDERS, THE MINIMUM FIXTURE COUNT SHALL BE CALCULATED [01:00:01] A HUNDRED PERCENT BASED ON TOTAL OCCUPANT LOAD IN E IN EACH, IN SUCH MULTIPLE USER FACILITIES. EACH FIXTURE TYPE SHALL BE IN ACCORDANCE WITH ICCA ONE 17. RIGHT. THEY DON'T, I THEY DON'T CALL OUT URINALS ANYMORE IN A GENDER NEUTRAL BATHROOM. IT COULD HAVE A URINAL IN THERE, BUT BECAUSE IT'S A SINGLE USE FACILITY, IT WOULDN'T MATTER. RIGHT. FOR A SINGLE USE. CORRECT. THIS IS JUST AGAIN, FIXTURE CALCULATIONS. SO THE NEXT SECTION IS FOR SINGLE USER FACILITIES, AND THEN IF YOU, UM, FOR UH, 4 0 3 2, THAT'S WHERE SEPARATE FACILITIES COMES IN. AND THAT'S WHERE WE UPDATED THE LANGUAGE THAT THOSE URINALS AND FIXTURES SHALL BE IN A ROOM, UH, WITH WALLS IN THE DOOR. GOOD. EVERYBODY GOOD? OKAY. ITEM TEN FOUR. OH 3.3 0.6 FOR DOOR LOCKING. SO THE 2024 ADDED A NEW EXCEPTION THAT GIVES THE OPTION TO ALLOW THE TOILET FACILITY EGRESS DOOR TO BE LOCKED. SO WAS PREVIOUSLY NOT INCLUDED, AND NOW JUST ALLOWS FOR THOSE DOORS TO BE LOCKED. CAN YOU EXPLAIN THAT EGRESS FROM THE BATHROOM? FROM THE BATHROOM? YES. EGRESS FROM THE BATHROOM FACILITIES. IT'S A MAY, CORRECT? IT'S A MAY. YEAH. IT'S, IT'S AN OPTION. SO NORMALLY THEY DON'T ALLOW THOSE BATHROOMS TO BE LOCKED BECAUSE THEY DON'T WANT, IF IT'S MULTI-USER, YOU KNOW, IF YOU HAVE FOUR STALLS, UM, THEY DON'T WANT ONE PERSON GOING IN THERE AND LOCKING EVERYBODY ELSE OUT WHILE THEY USE THE FACILITIES. AND AGAIN, THIS IS FOR MULTI-USER, SINGLE USER. YES, OF COURSE YOU HAVE THAT LOCKING OPTION. CAN YOU EXPLAIN WHY YOU WOULD, UM, IF YOU HAVE A BATHROOM THAT HAS 10 STALLS IN IT, WHY YOU WOULD WANT TO ALLOW THE DOOR TO THE OUTSIDE WHERE NOBODY ELSE CAN COME INTO THE BATHROOM TO BE LOCKED OR SOMEBODY TO BE MOLESTED OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT? UM, IT, THIS, THE LOCKING OPTION REQUIRES A KEY AND YOU HAVE TO, IT'S A KEY LOCK FROM THE INSIDE AND OUTSIDE. YOU CAN SEE THE EXCEPTIONS THERE. UM, FOR THE LOCKING, ALL OF THOSE ITEMS HAVE TO BE MET. OH, SO IT'S, IF YOU WANNA LOCK THE BATHROOM DOWN, YOU CAN LOCK THE BATHROOM. YES. IT WOULD TAKE AN EMPLOYEE TO DO THAT, CORRECT? YEAH. OKAY. BUT WHAT IF SOMEBODY LOCKS THE BATHROOM FROM THE OUTSIDE NOT KNOWING THAT SOMEBODY'S INSIDE AND THEN THE PERSON INSIDE THE BED? I, I, I KNOW THAT'S WEIRD, RIGHT? YEAH, BUT WE'VE LIVED THIS LONG WITHOUT BEING ABLE TO LOCK THE BATHROOM AND I DON'T SEE THE BENEFIT OF, TO ME IT'S ALL DOWNSIDE IS WHAT I'M SAYING. I DON'T SEE THE, I DON'T SEE THE UPSIDE OF ALLOWING THE BATHROOM TO BE LOCKED. WE SURVIVED IN 2024. UM, HEY, WE'VE SURVIVED TO THE YEAR 2024 WITH, UH, LOCKABLE UNLOCKABLE BATHROOMS AND THERE MIGHT BE A GOOD REASON FOR IT. I DON'T, I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT, WHY, WHY CHANGE AND WHAT THE BENEFIT IS. IT COULD GO EITHER WAY. UH, A LOCKDOWN, UH, ISOLATION MAINTENANCE, UH, IT COULD GO EITHER WAY ON IT. IF SAY A WATER LEAK AND YOU HAVE TO ISOLATE THAT ONE BATHROOM GROUP, YOU DON'T WANT THAT TRAFFIC GOING INTO THE RESTROOM. SO YOU'RE GONNA, YOU KNOW, LOCK THAT RESTROOM. THAT'S WHERE NO ONE'S GONNA GO IN THERE. WE, WE REALLY DON'T HAVE, UH, A DOG IN THIS FIGHT. YOU'RE RIGHT. I MEAN, THEY'VE ALWAYS BEEN ALLOWED. WE WERE JUST BRINGING THIS UP AS ADDITIONAL OPTIONS FOR NEW CONSTRUCTION. YEAH. WHAT IS, CAN'T SAY I CARE THAT MUCH EITHER. I WHAT IS 10, 10.2 WHEN IT'S TALKING ABOUT THE EGRESS STORE SHOULD BE READILY OPENABLE FROM THE TOILET ROOM. DOES THAT MEAN IT HAS TO HAVE PANIC HARDWARE ON THE INSIDE? NO. NO. NOT PANIC HARDWARE. IS THAT TALKING ABOUT LIKE THE STALL 10 10, UM, IN THE IBC IS JUST LOCKING ARRANGEMENTS? UM, LET ME BRING IT UP. MM-HMM. , [01:05:15] I MEAN, IF YOU'RE GONNA LEAVE IT, I THINK ON THE INSIDE OF THE BATHROOM DOOR, IT HAS TO HAVE SOME KIND OF PANIC HARDWARE THAT IT CAN BE OPENED. IF YOU GET STUCK, THAT WOULD BE TERRIBLE, YOU KNOW? WELL, I MEAN, IF YOU THINK ABOUT THE SIZE OF A BATHROOM, RIGHT? YOU JUST KIND OF POKE YOUR HEAD IN AND SEE IF ANYBODY'S IN THERE. MAYBE THERE'S SOME PROTOCOLS FOR CHECKING EACH STALL. WE DON'T GET INTO THAT, RIGHT? THIS WAS AGAIN, JUST BRINGING UP THE OPTION NOW THAT THESE, UH, LOCKS ARE PERMITTED, KEYED LOCKS ARE PERMITTED. MANUAL BOLTS. 10, 10.2 SAYS MANUAL BOLTS ARE NOT PERMITTED. IT'S ALWAYS FUNNY, LIKE THESE, THESE THINGS COME OUT OF THE, THE I CODE COMMITTEES AND THERE'S ALWAYS LIKE, THERE'S ALWAYS SOMEBODY WITH LIKE A, WITH A MISSION SOMEHOW. AND THAT'S, THIS IS WHERE YOU END UP WITH STUFF LIKE THIS. WE HAVE NO IDEA WHERE THIS COMES FROM. BUT I MEAN, CRYSTAL, TO YOUR POINT, I, YOU KNOW, IS ANYBODY GONNA PUT A LOCK ON A BATHROOM? WHY WOULD I PAY EXTRA MONEY TO PUT LOCK AND HARDWARE ON A, ON A BATHROOM WHEN I COULD JUST PUT A CONE UP THAT SAYS DON'T COME IN, YOU KNOW, IF IT MATTERS. SO I GUESS I'M FINE WITH LEAVING IT IN. I, I DON'T UNDERSTAND IT, BUT IT DOESN'T SEEM, I, I, YEAH, THE FIRE DEPARTMENT COULD COME BREAK X THE DOOR . ALRIGHT, WE WILL LEAVE THAT AS WRITTEN. OKAY, THE NEXT OPTION, THE NEXT ITEM NUMBER 11, THIS IS OUR, UM, CITY OF SAN ANTONIO AMENDMENT TO WATER FOUNTAINS. SO AMENDMENT FOUR, 10.4. SHOULD WE, YOU BRING, PUT THAT ONE OVER THERE. SO WE GET A LOT OF CODE MODIFICATION REQUESTS FOR DRINKING FOUNTAINS. SO ALREADY IF YOU ARE, I THINK IT OCCUPANT LOAD IS 30 OR LESS. YEAH, THE DRINKING FOUNTAINS AREN'T REQUIRED. UM, BUT IT'S THAT, YOU KNOW, THOSE SMALL USES THAT DON'T WANNA PUT THE DRINKING FOUNTAINS IN, UM, ARE CONSISTENTLY NOW REFERENCING COVI AND OTHER, YOU KNOW, ILLNESSES TO AVOID PUTTING IN DRINKING FOUNTAINS, BUT OFFER THE WATER, DRINKING WATER FREE OF CHARGE. SO YOU CAN SEE HERE ON THE SCREEN THAT ORIG OUR ORIGINAL AMENDMENT TO FOUR 10.4 FOR SUBSTITUTION. UM, SO THOSE A TWO USES, THOSE ARE RESTAURANTS. UM, B USES FOR CLINICS, UH, DAYCARES, NURSING HOMES, UM, R THREE AND R FOUR. WE SAY THAT YOU DON'T HAVE TO PROVIDE THE DRINKING WATER IF YOU HAVE, UH, IF YOU PROVIDE DRINKING, YOU DON'T HAVE TO PROVIDE THE DRINKING FOUNTAIN IF YOU PROVIDE DRINKING WATER FREE OF CHARGE. SO WE TOOK A STAB AT THAT, UH, A NEW AMENDMENT THERE HIGHLIGHTED IN YELLOW THAT SAID, WHERE YOU HAVE DRINKING WATER IN A CONTAINER FREE OF CHARGE, YOU DON'T HAVE TO PUT IN A DRINKING FOUNTAIN REGARDLESS OF THE USE. SO NOT LIMITED TO JUST THOSE ORIGINAL USES THAT WE HAD IN THE AMENDMENT. IS THIS UNDERSTOOD TO APPLY ONLY TO USES WHERE A WATER FOUNTAIN IS OTHERWISE REQUIRED. SO WE'RE NOT CREATING A REQUIREMENT FOR ANY, YOU KNOW, BUILDING USE THAT DIDN'T ALREADY HAVE A WATER FOUNTAIN REQUIREMENT. SO THIS IS SAYING WHERE YOU, IT DOESN'T, YOU DON'T NEED A WATER FOUNTAIN ANYMORE IF YOU'RE DRINKING FOUNTAIN, IF YOU'RE PROVIDING WATER IN A CONTAINER FREE OF CHARGE. BUT WHAT HAPPENS IF NO DRINKING FOUNTAIN WAS REQUIRED? PERIOD. THAT'S WHAT I'M ASKING. DO, DO I A REQUIREMENT TO GIVE PEOPLE TO REQUIRED THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT I'M JUST CLARIFYING STILL. IF THERE WASN'T A REQUIREMENT PREVIOUSLY, I, I'M NOT NOW REQUIRED TO GIVE PEOPLE A CUP OF WATER. CORRECT. GOTCHA. I UNDERSTAND. YEAH. WE STILL HAVE THAT EXCEPTION FOR SMALL OCCUPANCIES, DRINKING FOUNTAINS AREN'T REQUIRED FOR AN OCCUPANT LOAD OF 30 OR FEWER. YOU GUYS LIKE THIS? YEAH. I JUST WANNA SAY I APPRECIATE THAT WE'RE SIMPLIFYING SOME OF THESE THINGS. LIKE IS A CONTAINER WOULD BE A, I COULD HAVE A WATER LIKE BOTTLE THAT HAS, AND IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE CHILLED OR ANYTHING. CORRECT. A CONTAINER WOULD BE JUST A PLASTIC CUP. MM-HMM, . OKAY. YOU CAN HAVE THE, A PLASTIC WATER BOTTLE. YOU'LL SEE THIS A LOT AT DENTIST'S OFFICE. RIGHT. THEY ALWAYS, THEY, THEY DO NOT WANT DRINKING FOUNTAINS THERE. UM, OR YOU CAN HAVE A WATER COOLER WITH A PAPER OR A PLASTIC CUP. YES. AS LONG AS IT'S FREE OF CHARGE. OKAY. SO WE WILL MOVE FORWARD WITH THE LANGUAGE THERE IN YELLOW AND WE'LL STRIKE THE PREVIOUS LANGUAGE THERE. UM, AND THAT IS ITEM NUMBER 12. [01:10:03] SO ITEM 13. GO AHEAD. I'M SORRY. SO ITEMS 11 AND 12 REFERENCE THE SAME AMENDMENT? YES. SO OUR FIRST, UM, ITEM NUMBER 11 WAS TO SAY, HEY, WE DON'T WANNA REQUIRE DRINKING FOUNTAINS AS LONG AS WATER IS PROVIDED. SINCE YOU GUYS ARE GOOD WITH THAT. WE DON'T NEED TO MOVE ON TO OUR SECOND PROPOSAL FOR THAT SAME AMENDMENT. GOTCHA. YEAH. SORRY, I'M SLOW. ITEM NUMBER 13 FOR SECTION FOUR, 12 POINT 12, THIS IS A NEW SECTION WE ARE PROPOSING TO ADOPT AS WRITTEN FOR ELECTRICALLY HEATED OR COOLED WATER DISPENSERS. IT JUST PROVIDES SOME REGULATIONS, UM, AND WHAT'S ALLOWED IN THE PLUMBING SYSTEM? 4 12, 12. CAN YOU PUT THAT UP ON THE SCREEN? YES. IT'S JUST REFERENCING, UM, THE STANDARD A SSE 10 23. BUT THEY'RE NOT REQUIRED TO BE COOLED. THEY'RE NOT REQUIRED, BUT WHERE YOU DO INSTALL 'EM, THEY'RE REQUIRED TO COMPLY WITH THIS STANDARD. SO MY QUESTION IS, OKAY, SO MY QUESTION IS, IS IF IT IS A STANDALONE FACILITY THAT YOU'RE GETTING FROM SOMEBODY THAT YOU HAVE NO CLUE, IT'S NOT REALLY A BUILDING CODE ISSUE. THESE ARE ONES THAT ARE ACTUALLY TIED INTO THE PLUMBING SYSTEM. OKAY, PERFECT. THANK YOU. OUR, GO AHEAD. NOT AS A FIT, NOT, NOT AS LIKE A, A FIXTURE IS WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. THAT ARE THAT IS HARD. THAT HARD. THAT WAS MY QUOTE. HARD PIPED. YEAH, HARD PIPED TO THE PLUMBING SYSTEM. DIRECT WATER FROM THE PLUMBING SYSTEM. I MEAN, I DON'T WANNA BE PEDANTIC, BUT ISN'T ALL WATER YOU GET OUT OF THE NO, THE HOUSE, LIKE DIRECTLY. UM, DIRECTLY CONNECTED. NO, I WAS TALKING ABOUT A, A LIKE A WATER COOLER THAT HAS HOT WATER OR COLD WATER IN THE COOLER THAT THIS DOES NOT APPLY TO THAT. WHERE YOU HAVE THE JUG THAT YOU PUT ON TOP THAT'S NOT PLUMBED TO THE PLUMBING SYSTEM. RIGHT. YOU JUST, YOU JUST PLUG IT INTO THE ELECTRICAL SYSTEM TO HEAT OR COOL THE WATER. SO WHAT IS THIS STANDARD? IS THIS A PRETTY COMMON STANDARD THAT LIKE ANY FIXTURE YOU BUY IN THE MARKET'S PROBABLY GONNA BE, THIS IS A STANDARD SPECIFICALLY FOR HEATING, UH, HEATING ELECTRICALLY HEATED OR COOL DISPENSERS SPECIFICALLY FOR, RIGHT. SO THAT JUST, MY QUESTION IS LIKE A, A COFFEE, UM, YOU KNOW, LIKE A, A ESPRESSO MAKER OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT, THAT YOU PLUMB DIRECTLY INTO THE, TO THE WATER LINE. UM, DOES THIS CHANGE OR IS IT LIKE A CER LIKE THE A SSE 20, WHATEVER THAT IS, I 10 23, IS THAT KIND OF LIKE A, A STANDARD FOR THE FIXTURE ITSELF OR DOES THAT CHANGE HOW THE WATER IS DISPENSED THROUGHOUT THE, THE BUILDING? WHAT IS THAT STANDARD CHANGE WATER? I, I'M NOT SURE IF I'M BEING CLEAR ABOUT WHAT MY QUESTION IS. IS IT A, IS IT A, IS IT A STANDARD FOR THAT FIXTURE ITSELF, THE AFTERMARKET FIXTURE? OR IS IT A STANDARD FOR THE PLUMBING SYSTEM? FOR THE FIXTURE ITSELF? YES. AND IS THIS A PRETTY STANDARD, UM, STANDARD ? UM, THAT, UH, MOST, MOST, UH, AFTERMARKET FIXTURES ARE PROBABLY ALREADY REPUTABLE. AFTERMARKET FIXTURES ARE PROBABLY, UM, ALREADY ADHERING TO YOU SAY FIXTURE, BUT THIS IS SPECIFIC, THIS STANDARD IS ONLY FOR ELECTRICALLY HEATED OR COOLED WATER DISPENSERS. SO IT DOESN'T IMPACT INCLUDE ANY OTHER FIXTURE AT, AT STARBUCKS WHERE THE FIXTURE IS PLUMBED INTO THE WATER? OR IS IT A, IS IT A WATER DISPENSER? IT'S A COFFEE MACHINE. THE NO, THIS IS FOR WATER DISPENSERS. THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE ASKING. LIKE, SHOULD WE YES, BUT THERE'S, THERE, THEY HAVE STANDALONE, UM, AND JUST LIKE IN A COFFEE SHOP THAT, THAT JUST SHOOTS OUT HOT WATER AND IT ALSO WILL SHOOT OUT COLD, LIKE COOL COOLED WATER. I, I, I MIGHT BE GETTING TOO MUCH IN THE WEEDS. I JUST DON'T, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE STANDARD IS. AND SO THAT MAY YEAH, THAT I, THAT'S WHAT SHE JUST BROUGHT UP. SO IT'S LIKE A DIS DIRECT DISPENSE. YOU PLUMB IT IN AND IT, IT HAS LIKE A LITTLE WATER HEATER TANK, YOU KNOW, SO IF YOU WANT TO SHOOT OUT HOT WATER, YOU, YOU PUSH ONE BUTTON AND IF YOU WANNA SHOOT OUT COLD WATER, YOU KNOW IT, YOU PUSH A DIFFERENT BUTTON, UM, YOU CAN HOOK UP A GAS TANK AND IT'LL SHOOT OUT CO2 WATER. I'M ASSUMING THAT THAT FIXTURE, LIKE WHOEVER SELLS IT, KNOWS THAT THE STANDARD IS OUT THERE AND IS TRYING TO, TO ADHERE TO IT. I, I, I DON'T KNOW. I JUST, I JUST WANNA BE SURE BEFORE WE SAY YES. SO I WAS TRYING TO READ THE STANDARD, THE, BUT IT, THEY, THEY SLID PAST IT. SO IS THIS DIRECT, IS THIS JUST PRIMARILY RESIDENTIAL OR IS THIS DEALING WITH THE HOT WATER DISPENSERS AND NOT A COMMERCIAL APPLICATION? WELL, IT'S BOTH. I MEAN, YEAH, THIS IS COMMERCIAL APPLICATIONS CO. SO [01:15:01] IT COMMERCIAL ALSO IS RESIDENTIAL BECAUSE IF YOU PUT A HOT, IF YOU PUT A HOT WATER DISPENSER ON TOP OF A SINK, IT HAS TO MEET THIS COAT. AND WHAT IS, WHAT IS THE STANDARD, WHAT ARE WE TRYING TO MEET? THAT'S WHAT, I GUESS MY QUESTION IS WHAT IS A SS YEAH, SO IT HAS REQUIREMENTS FOR THE TEMPERATURE AND PRESSURE RANGES, BACKFLOW PROTECTION, COOLING CAPACITY FITTINGS. IT HAD, IT HAS ALL OF THAT. WE DIDN'T PAY TO, TO DOWNLOAD THE STANDARD. THIS IS JUST, UM, SOME OF THE GENERAL REQUIREMENTS IMO HAS, UH, HAS ON THEIR SITE. SO IF WE DON'T, AGAIN, I DON'T WANT TO, THIS IS GONNA SOUND WORSE THAN, THAN IT THEN I'M INTENDING IT. BUT IF WE DON'T, YOU KNOW, WE HAVEN'T DOWNLOADED THE STANDARD. WE DON'T KNOW THE STANDARD, HOW ARE WE GONNA FORCE IT AND WHY SHOULD WE ADOPT? I MEAN, YOU KNOW, MAYBE AMEND THIS, THIS OUT OF, OUT OF OUR CODE. SO WE WOULD LOOK AT THE MANUFACTURER'S INSTALLATION INSTRUCTIONS. SO THE, UM, THE PACKET, THE INFORMATION THAT COMES WITH THIS APPLIANCE, UM, AND IDENTIFY THAT IT MEETS THE STANDARD. YEAH, IT'S CONFORMING TO, UH, CONFORMING TO THE PRODUCT, UH, OF WHAT THAT FIXTURE IS. AGAIN, YOU COULD CALL PRETTY MUCH A DISPENSER, A FIXTURE, UH, BUT ANYTHING HOOKING UP TO THE FIXTURE, A WATER SOURCE WOULD HAVE TO CONFORM TO, AGAIN, THE BACKFLOW DEVICE, LITTLE CHECK VALVES, UM, UH, WHATEVER IS IN, UH, THAT PRODUCT. SO FOR A HOT WATER DISPENSER ON TOP OF THE SINK IN A RESIDENTIAL KITCHEN, YOU'D HAVE TO HOOK UP A BACKFLOW THROUGH PREVENTER TO THAT , OR WOULD THAT HAVE TO BE BUILT? I HAVE HOT WATER COMING OUTTA MY FAUCET. I'M SORRY. WELL, NO, BUT I'M, NO, THEY HAVE, THEY HAVE HOT WATER LIKE DISPENSERS FOR LIKE COFFEE THAT YOU CAN IN REAL EXPENSIVE HOUSES YOU HAVE IN THE SINK, AGAIN, WHICH YOU HAVE TO HOOK THE BACKFLOW PREVENTER TO THE, NOT NECESSARILY, BUT WHAT THAT FIXTURE SHOULD HAVE, UH, IS A 10 20, 10 19, UH, CHECK IN THERE THAT WON'T, WON'T ALLOW, UH, ANYTHING TO GET INTO THE POTABLE. SO AGAIN, WHATEVER YOU HAVE IN YOUR HOUSE OR BUSINESS, UH, SHOULD HAVE THE PROPER LISTINGS FOR IT. SO, SO YOU'RE SAYING THAT A HOT WATER DISPENSER IS GONNA HAVE A CHECK VALVE AND NO THERMAL EXPANSION? NO. IS THAT WHAT THE, IS THAT THE STANDARD , ARE YOU TELLING ME THAT? I AM NOT SAYING THAT, BUT IF YOU WANT TO PUT AN EXPANSION TANK ON THERE, BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO LOOK AT IT. UH, NO. IT'S JUST EVERYTHING THAT'S ASSOCIATED WITH THAT PRODUCT GOES THROUGH THE TESTING AGENCY. UH, I KNOW WE'RE PROBABLY GETTING OFF A TRACK ON IT, BUT IT'S JUST SAYING THAT IT HAS TO COMPLY, UH, WITH, CAN WE TABLE THIS? THAT A, THAT'S A GOOD IDEA. GO BACK TO THIS AND LET ME READ THIS STANDARD. I'LL PULL THE STANDARD UP THIS AFTERNOON AND LOOK AT, IT'S AT A SS, UH, 10 62. YES. 10 23. I AGREE WITH YOU. OKAY, NEXT ITEM NUMBER 14, SECTION FOUR, 19.6 FOR SOAP DISPENSERS. THIS IS A NEW SECTION THAT WE ARE PROPOSING TO ADOPT AS WRITTEN THAT SAYS SOAP DISPENSERS ARE NOW REQUIRED. SOAP DISPENSERS SHALL BE PROVIDED FOR PUBLIC LABORATORIES. I HAVE NO COMMENT OTHER THAN LIKE, THAT WASN'T ALREADY IN THERE . SO WOULD A, LIKE YOU GO INTO A LOT OF BATHROOMS THAT HAVE LIKE PLASTIC BOTTLES ON THE, UH, THING. WOULD THAT BE A SOAP DISPENSER? YES. OKAY. SO THERE'S NO STANDARD REQUIREMENT FOR THIS ONE. OKAY. IT'S VERY GENERAL, JUST SAYS SOAP DISPENSERS. OKAY. ITEM 15, SECTION 5 0 1 0.9 OR LEAD CONTENT. WE, THIS IS A NEW SECTION WE'RE PROPOSING TO ADOPT AS WRITTEN. UM, THAT WATER HEATERS THAT ARE PART OF THE POTABLE WATER DISTRIBUTION SYSTEM SHALL COMPLY WITH NSF 3 72 AND SHALL HAVE A WEIGHTED AVERAGE LEAD CONTENT OF 0.25% OR LESS. 5 0 1 9. YOU'RE THERE. [01:20:02] AND IS THIS JUST CODIFYING SOMETHING THAT WAS ALREADY KIND OF STANDARD? I MEAN, DID, YES, THIS WAS THIS, THIS DOESN'T MEAN THAT LIKE WE HAVE TO, YOU KNOW HOW, LIKE WITH HVAC THEY CHANGE THE, THE COOLING EVERY COUPLE YEARS AND WE HAVE TO, YOU KNOW, RE REPOPULATE THE ENTIRE WORLD OF COOLING. IS THIS SOMETHING SIMILAR OR DO MOST WATER HEATERS ALREADY? THIS WOULD APPLY TO NEW WATER HEATERS ONLY, CORRECT? CORRECT. AND ICC IDENTIFIED THIS AS A NO-COST INCREASE BECAUSE THAT IS ALREADY, UH, IN REQUIRE, IT IS ALREADY REQUIRED. UM, THAT WATER HEATERS ARE THIRD PARTY CERTIFIED AND LEAD FREE. OKAY. ITEM 16. NUMBER 16. THIS IS A CHANGE TO AN EXISTING SECTION 5 0 4 0.7 FOR REQUIRED PAN. WE'RE PROPOSING TO ADOPT AS WRITTEN, UH, THAT THIS SECTION NOW ALLOWS THE USE OF A PLASTIC PAN IF IT MEETS THE FLAME SPREAD INDEX AND SMOKE DEVELOPED INDEX OH FOUR SEVEN GAS. CORRECT. ALRIGHT, NUMBER 17. SO TABLE 6 0 4 4. THIS IS A NEW FOOTNOTE TO TABLE 6 0 4 0.4 FOR THE MAXIMUM FLOW RATES AND CONSUMPTION FOR PLUMBING FIXTURE FITTINGS. UH, REQUIRES THE SHOWER HEADS TO COMPLY WITH THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE A SME STANDARD. IE YOU HAVE NO WATER COMING OUT OF THE SHOWER. I'LL SHOW YOU HOW PUT LITTLE PLASTIC SLEEVE UP. OH, REALLY? YEAH, BUT THEY, THEY, THE, ACTUALLY IT, IT WAS TWO AND A HALF NOW, THEN IT'S TWO. SO WE'RE LOSING A HALF A GALLON A MINUTE, BUT, BUT OUR AMENDMENTS HAD ALREADY, UM, STRUCK THAT AS A REQUIREMENT TO BE TWO. ARE YOU LOOKING AT THE, THE SHOWER HEAD MAX FLOW RATE? IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, GEORGE? THAT IT WAS TWO AND A HALF, NOW IT'S TWO, CORRECT. THE MAX WAS TWO AND A HALF BY PROMISE. UH, THE CITY OF SAN ANTONIO HAD A MAX OF TWO. OH, REALLY? YEAH. YEAH. SO WE HAD AMENDED THAT AND NOW THE, UH, 2024 HAS CAUGHT UP AND IDENTIFIES TWO AS WELL. SO WE CAN TAKE THAT OUT OF OUR AMENDMENT. OKAY. TABLE 6 0 5 3. OKAY. ITEM 18, TABLE 6 0 5 0.360 5.4 AND 6 0 5 0.7 FOR WATER SERVICE PIPE. UH, THERE'S A NEW ITEM IN THESE TABLES THAT ADDS STAINLESS STEEL TUBING, UM, FOR BOTH PIPE AND TUBING MATERIALS. SO IT INCREASES THE OPTIONS FOR MATERIALS. STAINLESS STEEL TUBING. STAINLESS STEEL TUBING. YEAH. I'M SORRY. SO JUST GOING BACK TO THE ONE BEFORE, YOU SAID YOU ARE GONNA, WE ARE GONNA CHANGE OUR AMENDMENT TO MATCH THIS. WELL, IT ALREADY, IT ALREADY DOES MATCH. SO WE DON'T NEED AN AMENDMENT BECAUSE NOW THE 2024, I GUESS THAT'S WHAT I MEAN. LIKE DELETE THAT AMENDMENT OUT. YES, YES. WE'LL DELETE THAT AMENDMENT. SO, I'M SORRY, IT LOOKS LIKE WE CHANGED A COUPLE OTHER THINGS IN THE AMENDMENT. I I GUESS I CAN FLIP BACK. DID THAT, DOES EVERYTHING MATCH DOWN? NO, NOT EVERYTHING. SO WE'LL STILL KEEP THE AMENDMENTS FOR THE LA PRIVATE LABORATORY. THE URINAL IN THE WATER CLOSET. SORRY. ALL RIGHT. WE READY FOR ITEM 19. OKAY. SECTION 6 0 7 2 1. JUST ADDED A REFERENCE TO THE ENERGY CODE REQUIRING THE, UM, LIMITED DEVELOPMENT LENGTH OF HOT WATER TEMPERED WATER PIPING. THIS HAS ALWAYS BEEN, OR NOT ALWAYS, BUT THIS HAS BEEN AN EN ENERGY CODE FOR SEVERAL CYCLES AND IT'S JUST ADDING, UH, KIND OF A POINTER TO THE I-C-C-I-E-C-C. AND CAN WE JUST CLARIFY THAT C 4 0 4, 5 1 AND 5 2, 1 OF THE IECC THAT WE'RE NOT MESSING WITH HAVE NOT CHANGED FROM LAST. SO LIKE WHAT? IT'S IT'S IN ACCORD OF WHAT WE'VE ALREADY ADOPTED. CORRECT. [01:25:04] OKAY. ITEM 20, TABLE SEVEN. OH 2.6. SO THIS WAS A NEW SECTION THAT ADDED MATERIALS FOR CHEMICAL WASTE. SO THIS IS A GOOD SECTION THAT THIS IS A GOOD AD BECAUSE, UH, WE, WE OFTEN STRUGGLED WITH, UM, THE REQUIREMENTS FOR THIS CHEMICAL WASTE. AND NOW WE HAVE GUIDANCE HERE THAT IDENTIFIES A TYPE, UH, PIPE MATERIAL. THIS SEEMS PRETTY SPECIALIZED TO BUSINESSES THAT SPECIALIZE IN SOMETHING LIKE THIS. YES. YEAH. OR, UM, LABORATORIES, THAT KIND OF CHEMICAL WASTE. ALL RIGHT. ITEM 21, SECTION 7 0 5 2 4 AND SEVEN OH FIVE TEN FIVE. WE'RE PROPOSING TO ADOPT THESE SECTIONS AS WRITTEN. SO THIS REQUIRES THE SHIELDED COUPLINGS AND ELIMINATES THE RUBBER FITTINGS. UH, WE FEEL THIS IS A GOOD ADD AND IT'LL INCREASE, IT WILL INCREASE CRAFTSMANSHIP AND AVOID, UM, FIELD FAILURES IN THE FIELD. SO CAN YOU EXPLAIN THIS ONE? SO DOES THIS MEAN LIKE IF WE HAVE TO REPLACE PIPE ABOVE GROUND, THAT YOU CAN NO LONGER USE LIKE A RUBBER FITTING TO DO THAT? WHAT, WHAT WOULD BE THIS APPLICATION PIPE? WELL, IT'S NOT NECESSARILY ABOUT THE PIPE. IS THIS GONNA EXCLUDE YOUR, THE STANDARD NO HUBS? IS THAT THE INTENT? YOUR, YOUR FERN COES, UM, YOUR RUBBER ADAPTERS, YOUR SHIELDED COUPLINGS, WHICH, UH, HAVE YOUR RUBBER ADAPTER ON THE INSIDE AND THEN A STAINLESS STEEL BAND AROUND THEM. THOSE ARE YOUR SHIELDED COUPLINGS. SO WE'RE ELIMINATE, WE'RE THEY'RE ELIMINATING, UH, THE USE OF THOSE, UH, RNCO, UH, TO BE BANNED ABOVE GRADE. UM, ALSO THE USE OF ELBOWS. THEY HAVE THESE PLASTIC ELBOWS. UH, UM, ANYTHING MADE OF PLASTIC IS THE ELIMINATION OF RUBBER. UH, YOU, YOU'VE SEEN AT HOME DEPOT THE RUBBER FITTINGS WITH THE HOSE CLAMPS AROUND THAT YOU CAN YES. THAT'S WHAT IT'S, I I MEAN THEY'RE USED FOR MOSTLY FOR REPAIR. CORRECT. AND SO NOW IT WOULD HAVE TO BE A SHIELDED THAT HAS SOME KIND OF STAINLESS STEEL ON THE OUTSIDE OF THE RUBBER TO CONNECT TO PROTECT THE RUBBER. THE COUPLINGS. YES. SHIELDED. COS IT'S CO YOU CAN'T, THEY DON'T DO IT IN A 90 OR A T OR ANYTHING. BUT IS THE INTENT TO DROP OUT THE STANDARD? NO HUBS, THE OLD STYLE TWO CLAMP. ARE YOU GONNA DEFINE FOUR CLAMP AND TWO CLAMP? AND WHAT ARE WE GONNA DO AGAIN? THE NO HUBS. IT'S STATE AND SHIELDED. YOU KNOW, I KNOW SOME OF THE PLUMBING COMPANIES HAVE DROPPED ME SOME LITERATURE ON WHAT THEY CONSIDER SHIELDED AND IT CONFORMS TO THE STANDARDS. SO I DON'T KNOW WHERE THE NO HUBS ARE THESE DAYS, UH, OF WHERE THEY'RE AT, UH, AS FAR AS LISTING GOES. SO I REALLY DON'T HAVE AN ANSWER FOR THAT. ARE WE GONNA ELIMINATE THE USE OF, UH, THE NO HUBS? BECAUSE THE CODE, THE CODE, THE CODE STATES SHIELDED COUPLING. DIDN'T THE PLUMBING CODE DEFINE SHIELDED BY FOUR CLAMP? NOT NECESSARILY. THERE'S, UH, SOME SHIELDED GLANDS. WHERE DID I READ THAT? OKAY, SO YOU'RE STILL GONNA ALLOW THE STANDARD NO HUBS ABOVE SLAP. SO CAN YOU, ON THE SCREEN PUT UP WHAT A, A PICTURE OF A SHIELDED COUPLING, WHAT IT IS VERSUS WHAT IS BEING BANNED NOW? WELL, WHAT, WHAT'S REALLY, WHERE DID I READ HERE THAT IT SAID SOMETHING ABOUT WIDEBAND, I MEAN, OR WIDE WAS THAT DEFINING THE, THE SHIELDED COUPLINGS AND THE LONGER COUPLINGS? 'CAUSE IT SEEMS LIKE THE INDUSTRY IS CONSIDERING THE SHIELDED COUPLINGS AS THE LONGER FOUR BAND COUPLINGS. I THINK THAT'S WHAT THE VERBIAGE DID READ. UH, A WIDE BANDAGE SHIELDED COUPLING. UM, SO IT'S THE BOTTOM LINE. [01:30:01] LIKE THOSE ARE SHIELDED CUTS. SO IF YOU LOOK AT, UH, SECOND ONE MORE SECOND. ONE MORE SECOND, SECOND. ONE MORE. THERE YOU GO. THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT. SO THAT'S WHAT YOU CALL THEM, THAT IS THE NON SHIELD. CORRECT. IT WAS SHIELDING FROM WHAT UV RAYS OR WHAT GROUND SHIFT. SO YOU PUT THESE UNDERGROUND, THE GROUND SHIFTS AND THEY WOULD TEAR AND BREAK BECAUSE OF THE HEAVY RUBBER HE'S SAYING ABOVE GROUND. ABOVE GROUND. CORRECT. THESE WERE DISALLOWED BELOW GROUND. NOW THEN THEY'RE TRYING TO TAKE 'EM OUT ABOVE GROUND. THEY WERE BEING USED AND IT WAS A REAL WEIRD SITUATION BECAUSE IT WAS, YOU COULDN'T USE THEM IN A CONCEALED AREA, BUT YET YOU COULD STILL USE 'EM ABOVE SLAB. THIS I DON'T THINK IS, IS A GOOD REPRESENTATION. I MEAN, THIS SHOWS YOU THE RUBBER AND THE TWO BAND CLAMP WITH NO SHIELD AROUND IT. GO, GO BACK TO THAT, UH, WHERE YOU HAD ALL THE PICTURES. SO, UH, WHERE THEY WANT YOU TO USE ONE THAT HAS METAL ALL THE WAY AROUND IT. YES. THE SHIELD AND TO PROTECT. OKAY. UH, YES. AND THAT'S IN NEW CONSTRUCTION ONLY. WELL, THAT'S, THAT'S ALL THE WAY, ALL THE WAY AROUND. ALL THE WAY AROUND THE USE OF, UH, GEORGE, THAT SECTION, UH, UH, 7 0 5 0.24. IT DOESN'T MENTION WIDE, UH, WIDE BAND. UH, IT JUST HAS, UH, MECHANICAL JOINT COUPLING SHALL BE USED, UH, ABOVE GROUND, UH, TO CONNECT. THIS IS DEALING WITH THE A BS, UH, AND SHE SHALL BE A SHIELDED TYPE AND MARKED BY THE MANUFACTURER. SO I KNOW IN THE PAST IT HAD, UH, SPECIFIED WIDE BODY. SO YOUR STANDARD NO HUB HAS ALWAYS BEEN SHIELDED. EH, THE ONLY DISTINCTION WAS THE LENGTH OF THE COUPLING. YEAH. SO WHAT GEORGE IS TALKING ABOUT THE THIRD ONE FROM THE, THE THIRD ROW DOWN FROM THE SECOND, YOU KNOW, DO THEY CONSIDER THAT A SHIELDING? NOTHING. I DON'T THINK THEY EVER HAVE. I THINK THAT'S ONLY A BIG BUS. I'M SORRY. I THINK THEY'VE ALWAYS CLASSIFIED THAT AS A WELL, THE, THE BOTTOM RIGHT CORNER THAT WAS THE STANDARD. YEAH. AT ONE TIME. NOW THEN THEY, WHERE'S A GOOD REPRESENTATION OF THE, SO IF YOU GO TO THE VERY BOTTOM ROW, 1, 2, 3, 4, FIFTH, ONE FROM THE LEFT, THAT IS A NON SHIELDED COUPLING. YES. CORRECT. AND SO THE ONE TO, ON EACH SIDE OF IT THAT HAS METAL ALL THE WAY AROUND IT IS SHIELDED. SO WHAT THEY'RE DOING IS TELLING YOU YOU NEED TO PROTECT THE PIPE. YES. AND ONE, YOU KNOW, ONE THING THAT WE COME ACROSS IS WHEN THE BUILDING IS 20 AND 30 YEARS OLD AND YOU CUT THE PIPE AND FOR WHATEVER REASON WHAT LINED UP WHEN IT WAS CONNECTED DOESN'T LINE UP THE, THE ONES THAT ARE ALL RUBBER WERE BETTER AT MAKING THE CONNECTIONS VERSUS I UNDER. I UNDERSTAND, BUT THAT'S NOT THE INTENTION OF, THAT'S WHY I GUESS THEY'RE DOING AWAY IS BECAUSE WHEN I KNOW WHAT YOU'RE SAYING ABOUT LINING UP MIS LINE PIPES, YOU KNOW, YOU COULD ALWAYS GET THIS GOING ON ONE OF THOSE, UH, RUBBER ADAPTERS WHERE THE INTENTION'S NOT THERE BECAUSE YOU HAVE AN OBSTRUCTION IN THE FLOW. SO AGAIN, THAT'S WHERE THE FAILURE COMES IN, IS SOMETHING LIKE THAT. THAT THAT'S WHY WE BANNED THEM, UH, YEARS AGO WHEN THEY WERE PUT IN THE GROUND A SHIFTING OF THE GROUND AND, AND DOING THE SAME ACTION. SO AGAIN, I GUESS THAT INTENT OF IT IS WHY THEY PROBABLY WANNA REMOVE IT. GIMME SOME LITERATURE ON THOSE. GIMME SOME LITERATURE ON THOSE FERN COES THAT SEEM LIKE WE'RE GONNA ALLOW . THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING. IS THE FERN CO LISTED AS, UH, AS THE, IS THE NO HUB LISTED AS A SHIELDED COUPLING? GIMME SOME LITERATURE LITERATURE. GEORGE, I'M LOOKING AT A, I'M LOOKING AT A FERN CO. I MEAN, JUST ON, BECAUSE I JUST GOOGLED THE SAME THING THAT, THAT Y'ALL PUT UP HERE. PUT ON AMAZON.COM FERN CO SHIELDED PVC PIPE COUPLING. THAT WOULD BE A SHIELDED, BUT IT'S MADE BY RNCO AND THE CLAMP HALL. [01:35:01] BUT I'M TELLING, I MEAN, I KNOW THE PEOPLE THAT, THAT DO THE INSPECTIONS OVER IN ALMONDS PARK AND ALMA HEIGHTS, THEY HAVE GOTTEN TO WHERE IT'S FOR BAND ONLY. THAT'S ALL THEY ACCEPT. SO IS THAT, AND THEREBY THE BOOK, THEY READ IT AND IT'S THEIR INSPECTIONS FOLLOW THAT VERBIAGE AND THEY, THEY CLAIM THAT IT'S A FOUR BAND. THAT'S WHERE I GOT IT. IS DEFINING A SHIELDED COUPLING. I HAVE SEEN TWO BANDS. I'VE SEEN FOUR BANDS. THE CODE DOESN'T SPECIFY A FOUR BANDED SHIELDED COUPLING. AGAIN, IT JUST SAYS, UH, SHALL BE OF THE SHIELDED TYPE. IT DOESN'T SPECIFY TWO OR FOUR OR THREE. YEAH. SO IS THIS PICTURE THAT'S UP ON THE SCREEN, IS THAT SHIELDED MANUFACTURER SHIELDED? NO, IT SAYS PC BUT THE DEFINITION SAYS SHIELD THE DEFINITION IN THE BOOK DOESN'T PUT A STANDARD, IT'S CERTIFIED MANUFACTURERS SHIELD. SO IF SAYS IT, SHIELD IT SHIELDED, NO, THERE'S NO SHIELD ON THERE. GO BACK TO THAT. IT SAYS SOME PRODUCTS, SOME PRODUCTS ARE SHIELDED BY, BY THE WAY, THEY'RE THE, IT COULD BE A PAINT THAT'S ON THERE THAT'S SHIELDED. MAYBE IT'S THE WAY IT'S, IT DON'T HAVE TO BE A METAL. OR MAYBE IT'S THE THICKNESS OF THE RUBBER OR I THINK THEY'RE SHIELDING IT FROM UV RAYS IF IT'S BEING EXTERNAL, IS WHAT I'M THINKING. I DON'T, I DON'T THINK IT'S MORE ABOUT HOW IT'S, UM, STRENGTHENED ANYTHING. I THINK IT'S ABOUT UV RAYS IS WHAT I'M THINKING. I COULD BE WRONG, BUT THAT, THAT'S THE WAY, UM, BECAUSE THERE IS PRODUCTS OUT THERE THAT ARE SHIELDED FROM UV RAYS, JUST BY THE WAY THEY ARE MANUFACTURED. THEY HAD SOMETHING IN IN THE PLASTIC LIKE METAL PLASTIC? NO, NOT NECESSARILY METAL. IT, IT COULD BE, UM, IT COULD BE JUST WHAT IT'S MADE OUT OF THAT THEY MAKE A, A PAINT THAT'S A UV PROTECTANT THAT YOU COULD PUT ON TOP OF A, OF A FITTING AND CALL IT SHIELDED FROM UV RAYS. AND I, I THINK THAT'S DEPENDS ON WHAT THAT MANUFACTURER STATE THE CODE SECTION. SO IN OTHER WORDS, IF THE MANUFACTURER MARKS IT AS SHIELDED FOR THAT APPLICATION, IT'S APPROVED. SO, SO IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE, IT'S WHETHER THE MANUFACTURER SAYS OUTSIDE OF THE BOX SAYS IT'S SHIELDED, YOU KNOW? YEAH. UH, THAT'S WHAT I'M READING. MUST BE OF THE SHIELDED TYPE AND SHALL BE MARKED BY THE MANUFACTURER AS BEING RECOMMENDED FOR THAT APPLICATION. SO DO I SEE IT, GEORGE AND I GREW UP WITH A SHIELDED COUPLING BEING SHIELDED AROUND NOT SOME KIND OF YES METAL, A STAINLESS STEEL METAL AND NOT A COATING ON A PIECE OF RUBBER. UM, SO I THINK IT'S FINE. IT'S EASY. WELL, I MEAN, WELL I, I'M SEEING A CONFLICT OF WHAT WE'VE ALWAYS KNOWN AND WHAT WE'RE, WHAT THIS IS IMPLYING, THIS IS IMPLYING THAT WE CAN NOW USE STANDARD NO HUB COUPLINGS, WHICH ARE SHIELDED UNDERGROUND. I CAN'T SAY NO HUB. I NEED TO SEE THE SPECS ON IT. UH, YOU'RE SAYING NO HUBS, YOU KEEP SAYING NO HUBS. UH, LET'S GET RID OF YOUR STOCK. GEORGE. GEORGE, THIS SAYS THAT THE HEADING OF THE SECTION SAYS ABOVE GROUND. CORRECT. SO THIS ONLY APPLIES TO SOMETHING THAT IS ABOVE THE GROUND. I'VE BEEN FAILED FOR USING STANDARD NO HUBS ABOVE GROUND. I'M SORRY, I'VE BEEN FAILED FOR USING STANDARD NO HUBS ABOVE GROUND STANDARD. NO, THE TWO CLAMP SHORTER ABOVE GROUND. ABOVE GROUND IN THE WALLS. NO, THOSE ARE, WE ALLOW THOSE. I'M JUST SAYING, YOU'RE SAYING NO HUB. I'M READING THIS NEW CODE, UH, CODE THAT'S SAYING SHIELD. IS THERE ANY WAY WE CAN GET THIS, UH, RECORDED SO I CAN SHOW THE INSPECTORS? ? WE, WE ARE RECORDING THIS. [01:40:01] SO I'M SORRY WE ARE RECORDING THIS. DO YOU HAVE UM, MILTON'S NUMBER? RIGHT? SO NEXT TIME YOU GET ONE OF THOSE FAIL FAILED INSPECTIONS AND AND WHO WAS THAT? INSPECTOR ? WELL HE WAS, HE IS RETIRED NOW. YES. SO I BELIEVE IT WAS BOEN GAVE ME A HARD TIME. SO GEORGIA ON VENT, I THINK IT'S OKAY. OKAY. YEAH. REAL QUICK. TECHNICALLY THE FERN COES WERE ALLOWED ABOVE GROUND. UH, NO HUBS WERE ALLOWED ABOVE GROUND. SO AGAIN, WHAT THIS IS SAYING IS ABOVE GROUND SHIELDED COUPLING. SO YEAH, WE USE THEM, ALL OF THEM IN SEALED SPACES. OKAY. WE CAN MOVE FORWARD. I'M SORRY. MOVE OVER. THAT'S ALRIGHT. I WAS JUST GIVING HIM A HARD TIME. NEXT ITEM, ITEM 22. THIS IS, UM, A NEW EXCEPTION TO SEVEN OH FIVE TEN TWO, UH, FOR SOLVENT CEMENTING AND ADDS AN OPTION TO UTILIZE ONE STEP GLUE. THE PLUMBERS WERE REAL EXCITED ABOUT THIS. GEORGE, YOU DON'T SEEM, ARE YOU HAPPY ABOUT THIS ONE? THIS ONE STEP GLUE? NO, MAN, THEY WERE LIKE, WE WERE, THEY WERE ABOUT TO THROW A PARTY. WELL, I'M NOT REAL, UH, EXCITED ABOUT NEW THINGS. I'LL LET SOMEBODY ELSE TRY IT AND SEE IF IT FAILS. FIRST . WELL AGAIN, THIS IS AN OPTION. YEAH, IT IS AN OPTION. I MEAN, IF, IF, IF THE CHIEF'S HAPPY WITH IT, THEN WE CAN MOVE FORWARD. IT'S ONLY APPLICATION, IT'S ONLY PROCESS OF ASSEMBLY. I'M LIKE YOU GEORGE. YOU KNOW, I STILL EAT AT THE SAME FIVE RESTAURANTS. SO . OKAY, NEXT ITEM. UH, NUMBER 23. THIS IS A NEW SECTION. SO WE TALKED ABOUT THE CHEMICAL WASTE DRAIN VENTS. SO THIS SEC OR, UM, WASTE, UH, DRAINAGE SYSTEMS. THIS IS FOR THE VENTING OF THOSE CHEMICAL WASTE DRAINAGE SYSTEMS. AGAIN, JUST ADDS, UM, OPTIONS FOR ENFORCEMENT, BETTER OPTIONS FOR ENFORCEMENT. ALL RIGHT, EVERYBODY. GOOD? GOOD. THE NEXT ITEM, LAST ITEM FOR THE IPC IS A CHANGE TO OUR LICENSING REQUIREMENTS. SO THIS IS IN THE VERY BACK OF OUR CHAPTER 10 AMENDMENT SECTION 10 DASH 17. SO THIS LINE ITEM SAYS THAT THE CITY PLUMBING INSPECTOR SHALL DOCUMENT ON THE INSPECTION RECORDS THE STATIC PRESSURE AND THE WATER SOURCE OF THE IRRIGATION SYSTEM. UM, WE HAVE NOT BEEN DOING THAT, SO WE ARE JUST PROPOSING TO TAKE THAT OUT AS PART OF OUR INSPECTION. YOU CAN SEE ON THE SCREEN THAT RED, UM, LANGUAGE IS STRUCK THROUGH. LOOKS GOOD TO ME. SO THERE'S ONLY ONE ITEM THAT WE HAVE A GO BACK ON, WHICH IS THE WATER DISPENSERS. YEAH, THE WATER DISPENSERS. CAN I, CAN I ASK CRYSTAL, LET THIS, AND I MIGHT BE GOING BACK TWOS, I'M NOT SURES NOT, NOT ANYTHING THAT'S ON HERE. WE HAD THE, THE PRESENTATION, I THINK IT WAS, IT MUST HAVE BEEN AROUND PANDEMIC TIME. IT WAS THE PRESENTATION ABOUT REQUIRING SOME KIND OF, WAS IT LEAD WA WATER TEST EVERY TIME YOU TOUCHED THE PLUMBING? IS THERE, IS THAT IN AN AMENDMENT ANYWHERE? WHERE ARE WE WITH THAT? 'CAUSE I, I REMEMBER IT ALL BEING VERY QUESTIONABLE. I CAN, IT HAD SOMETHING TO DO WITH LIKE A, A LETTER WITH THE EPA OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. EPA. SO THIS WAS A REQUEST THAT CAME IN FROM SAS ON ANYTIME THAT, UH, UNDERGROUND WATER WATERLINE WAS EXPOSED, THE REQUEST THAT THE CONTRACTOR RUN A, A LEAD TEST ON THAT EXPOSED PIPE TO SEE WHERE LEAD TYPE PIPING MIGHT BE THROUGHOUT, WHICH IS A MANDATE FROM THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT TO SAWS TO KIND OF CREATE THIS DATABASE. SO THEY WERE HOPING TO USE THAT. SO WE ADDED THE A, THE REQUIREMENT IN OUR CODE THAT IF YOU PULL A PERMIT, YOU EXPOSE ANY OF THE UNDERLINE GROUND WATER LINE SIX, THAT'S GONNA REMAIN. YOU JUST DO THAT TEST AND YOU PROVIDE THAT RESULTS TO SAWS. IT DOESN'T GO THROUGH OUR DEPARTMENT. IT'S NOTHING WE REALLY OVERSEE. IT'S MORE JUST, THIS IS A REQUIREMENT SIMILAR TO SOME OTHER SAWS REQUIREMENTS THAT ARE IN OUR, IN OUR CHAPTERS. BUT ALL THAT'S HANDLED THROUGH THE CONTRACTOR TO, TO SAS IS THIS, IS THIS, I MEAN, I GET YOU SAID YOU DON'T OVERSEE IT, SO WE HAVE NO IDEA IF IT'S HAPPENING OR WHAT THE RESULTS ARE OR ANY, ANYTHING. I WONDER IF WE SHOULD TAKE IT OUT. UM, OR IS THAT JUST A POLITICAL MESS THAT WE DON'T WANNA WADE [01:45:01] INTO? I MEAN, I'M HAPPY TO REACH OUT TO SAS AND SEE IF WE CAN GET SOME DATA ON HOW MUCH INFORMATION THEY'VE GARNERED OVER THE LAST TWO YEARS SINCE WE ADOPTED THIS. UM, AND NOBODY'S FEED THAT BACK TO Y'ALL. NOBODY'S DOING IT. I BET YOU THEY'RE NOT. CAN WE GET, UH, I I THINK WE HAVE SOME PEOPLE THAT ARE ABUSING IT. YES, BUT ALL IN ALL THEY NEED IT IN THERE. IN THE, IN THERE. I'D GO AHEAD AND LEAVE IT IN THE CHAPTER 10 BECAUSE SAS HAS TO SHOW THAT THE CITY MADE SOME EFFORT TO DICTATE IT. I, I'M GOOD WITH THAT. I WOULD, I WOULD BE INTERESTED TO KNOW, UH, YOU KNOW, I, OR MAYBE MAYBE SLEEPING DOGS ARE BETTER LEFT. I'M, I JUST SCREWED UP THAT, UH, PHRASE, BUT YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN. UH OH. YEAH. IF WE, IF WE REACH OUT TO 'EM, THEY MIGHT SAY, OH, YOU'RE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE PROCESS AND THEY MIGHT COME AND, AND TALK TO US ABOUT SOMETHING ELSE. SO JUST FORGET I SAID ANYTHING. UNDERSTAND. LET'S MOVE ON THE GAS QUESTION. WE CALL THIS THE GEORGE BILL, BY THE WAY, . SO EVERYBODY EXPLAIN. WE, WE WROTE A, AN IB ON IT ALSO. UH, IT'S JUST A ROADMAP TO SAWS INDICATING THIS IS WHAT SAWS IS PROPOSING. THIS IS WHAT TCQ WANTS, UH, AND PRETTY MUCH A WEBSITE OF, UH, OF SAWS WHERE IT'S GOING, WHAT THEY NEED, UH, JUST BECAUSE TCQ IS PRETTY MUCH ON THEM TO GET IT DONE. SO, NO, THAT'S OKAY. UM, THE AMENDMENT LANGUAGE IS THERE ON THE SCREEN. WE ADDED A NEW SECTION, 6 0 5 0.3 0.2 TO IDENTIFY THAT THOSE LEAD TESTING REQUIREMENTS, IT ONLY APPLIES TO GEORGE GEORGE'S PROJECTS. IT'S UP TO YOU GUYS. I MEAN, WE HAVE THE ROOM TECHNICALLY TILL LIKE NOON, RIGHT? OR YES, WE DO HAVE THE ROOM. I MEAN, I WOULD RATHER, MY PREFERENCE IS WE FINISH, BUT I MEAN, WE CAN TAKE A BREAK, BUT THEN WE JUST NO, LET'S, LET'S TAKE, LET'S TAKE FIVE AND THEN WE HAVE NINE ITEMS. ONE WE'VE ALREADY COVERED. UM, ONE IS JUST KIND OF LETTING YOU GUYS KNOW, I THINK THERE ARE SO SEVEN ITEMS THAT WE MAY WANNA TALK ABOUT. SO GEORGE, IF YOU JUST WANNA CALL A RECESS FOR FIVE MINUTES. OKAY, WELL, WE'LL RECESS THIS, UH, MEETING FOR ABOUT FIVE MINUTES. OKAY, WE'RE ALL BACK. WE'LL GO AHEAD AND CALL THE MEETING BACK TO ORDER. OKAY, SO FOR THE FUEL GAS, YOU'LL SEE ITEM NUMBER ONE IS OUR LOCAL AMENDMENT TO SECTION 3 0 1 POINT 16 FOR THAT. SO THAT'S THAT SEPARATION FROM ELECTRICAL LINES IN A DITCH. WE ARE PROPOSING TO UPDATE THIS ITEM, UM, AS WE DID FOR THE IPC TO SPECIFY THAT THAT 36 INCHES IS REQUIRED FOR COMMERCIAL AND 12 INCHES IS ALLOWED FOR RESIDENTIAL. GOOD. ALL RIGHT. AS YOU SCROLL THROUGH THE DIGITAL FUEL GAS CODE, YOU'LL SEE THAT SECTION 3 0 4 0.1 IS ALL BLUE. UM, BUT THAT LITTLE RED E IS FOR RA AND THAT ARRA TELLS US THAT THIS SECTION WAS INCORRECTLY UPDATED. CLICK ON, WE CAN PROBABLY ZOOM THIS IN SO EVERYBODY CAN SEE THAT THAT WAS AN ERROR AND IT SHOULD HAVE ACTUALLY BEEN ADDED TO A LATER SECTION. SO DOES THAT MEAN WE'RE TAKING IT OUT? WE'RE NOT TAKING IT OUT WITH THE FIRST PRINTING. UM, IT WAS INCORRECTLY PRINTED. SO THEY WILL UPDATE THAT, UM, IN FUTURE PRINTINGS TO SHOW WHAT, WHAT IT SHOULD HAVE ACTUALLY READ. THE ONLY CHANGES THE, THE ONLY CHANGES THAT SECTION REFERENCE, CORRECT. SO FOR THE 2024, IT'S JUST UPDATING THAT SECTION REFERENCE FROM SIX POINT 14.6 TO [01:50:01] SIX 14.7. AND IS THAT, UM, IN THE BOOK THE CITY GAVE US? IS THAT WRONG IN THAT BOOK? YES. YOU DON'T HAVE TO ORDER ME A SECOND. COPY . THANK YOU, MIKE. OKAY, NEXT. ITEM NUMBER THREE, SECTION 3 0 4 POINT 12. WE WERE PROPOSING TO ADOPT, ADOPT THIS REVISED SECTION AS WRITTEN. UM, IT WAS JUST REWRITTEN TO EXCLUDE A LIST OF SPECIFIC GASES. 3 0 4 12. THIS IS ACTUALLY THE SECTION THAT WAS UPDATED. UM, WE SAW IT IN 3 0 4 1, BUT IT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE 3 0 4 12. SO THIS SAYS PROTECTION FROM FUMES AND GASES AND IT CALLED OUT SOME OF THOSE FUMES OR GASES TO INCLUDE CARBON MONOXIDE, HYDROGEN SULFIDE, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH. AND SO THE REVISION JUST ELIMINATED THAT LIST OF SPECIFIC GASES. NO REAL CHANGE TO THAT SECTION. EVERYBODY GOOD? YEP. ALL RIGHT. NUMBER FOUR, SECTION 3 0 6 0.5. WE ARE PROPOSING TO DO ADOPT AS WRITTEN IF THERE ARE CHANGES TO THIS SECTION FOR THE LADDER REQUIREMENTS. WHEN THERE'S EQUIPMENT OR APPLIANCES ON THE ROOF OR ELEVATED STRUCTURES, UH, YOU'LL SEE THAT BLUE TEXT THERE, UH, IN THE SPREADSHEET. JASMINE, WE HAVE A DIAGRAM IN THE SPREADSHEET, CORRECT? SO AN INCREASE OF SIDE RAILING EXTENSION FROM 30 INCHES TO 42 INCHES. AND THIS IS ALL PER, PER THE OSHA STANDARD ADDED THE RUNG SPACING. YOU WILL SEE THIS IN THE MECHANICAL CODE AS WELL. . YOU GUYS GOOD WITH THAT ONE? JUST KIND OF LET YOU KNOW WITH SCHMOS. YEAH. LETTING YOU KNOW THE UPDATES. JUST GIVE ME A SIGN IF THIS IS ONE OF THOSE ONES THAT YOU THINK WE'RE SUPPOSED TO TALK ABOUT MORE. ? NO, UH, SERIOUSLY. THE, SO THIS IS NEW CONSTRUCTION, BUT IF, UM, IF I'M DOING A MAJOR REHAB THAT TRIGGERS, YOU KNOW, LIKE IEBC OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, IS THIS GONNA BE, AND THE ONLY REASON I ASK IS BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THINGS YOU CAN'T REALLY DO IS LIKE ADD, YOU KNOW, CHANGE THE KIND OF THE ARRANGEMENT OF SOME OF THE MAIN STRUCTURE POINTS, UM, ON FLAT ROOF, OLD, OLD BUILDINGS. UH, WHY I'M CONCERNED ONLY IF YOU ARE ADDING NEW EQUIPMENT THAT WAS NOT PREVIOUSLY THERE. IF YOU'RE ADDING NEW EQUIPMENT TO THE ROOF, THEN THE LADDER REQUIREMENTS WOULD KICK IN EQUIPMENT. SO IF I'M ADDING SOLAR PANELS, IS THAT CONSIDERED EQUIPMENT? UM, I DON'T THINK THAT THAT'S COVERED IN EQUIPMENT, NO. OKAY. EVERYBODY GOOD? ITEM FOUR. YEAH. SO YOU SAID EQUIPMENT, UM, ON A REMODEL, LIKE ADDING OR CHANGE IN AIR CONDITIONING OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT? NO, NO. CHANGE OUT WOULD NOT, UM, KICK IN THIS REQUIREMENT. AND IF YOU'RE CHANGING OUT TO A LARGER SIZE OR SMALLER SIZE, IF IT WAS THERE BEFORE, WHATEVER YOU CHANGE WOULD BE OKAY BECAUSE A LOT OF TIME, LIKE IN OUR TWO OCCUPANCIES, YOU WOULDN'T, THERE'S NO PLACE TO PUT THE LADDER EXCEPT IN AN AREA THAT'S NEXT TO THE WINDOW SECTION BECAUSE THAT TYPICALLY GOES, YOU KNOW, IS IN A AREA. AND I DON'T THINK, UH, LADIES WOULD LIKE A CLIMBING LADDER NEXT TO THEIR BEDROOM WINDOWS WOULD NOT BE A GOOD THING. NOT FOR ANY MAIN MAINTENANCE OR, UH, CHANGE OUT. THIS IS, THIS BUILDING IS NOW A RESTAURANT AND NOW I HAVE TO PUT MY VENT HOOD AND, YOU KNOW, YOU ARE ADDING EQUIPMENT, [01:55:01] NEW EQUIPMENT, UM, TO THE ROOF. AND AGAIN, THESE WERE JUST MI I SAY MINOR. THESE WERE JUST SOME UPDATES TO THIS SECTION THAT WAS ALREADY IN PLACE. THE ONE THAT REALLY CONSERVATIVE IS JUST THE LANDING REQUIRED BECAUSE YOU CAN DO A LOT OF THINGS, BUT ADDING A LANDING MIGHT NOT BE AMONG THEM. BUT I GUESS IF, IF IT IS A, IF IT'S A REMODEL THAT IF POSES SOME CHALLENGES, I'M SURE THERE'S A, A CODE MODIFICATION REQUEST THAT COULD BE PUT IN OR SOME KIND OF EXCEPTION REQUEST THAT MIGHT GO TO THE BIG BOARD THAT THAT WOULD ACCOMMODATE. AND THEN WE TRUST THE CITY TO BE REASONABLE. AND IT'S EXECUTION. SOMETHING LIKE THIS, CORRECT? YES. OKAY. ITEM NUMBER FIVE. THIS IS, UH, OUR COSA AMENDMENT TO, TO ADD 4 0 3 0.5 0.5. WE'RE PROPOSING TO REMOVE THAT AMENDMENT FOR THE CORRUGATED STAINLESS STEEL TUBING. UM, IT CALLS OUT THAT ARC RESISTANT JACKET OR COATING SYSTEM, WHICH IS A PART OF THE STANDARD. SO THIS AMENDMENT IS NO LONGER NEEDED. IS THIS RELATED TO THAT? A COUPLE YEARS OR A COUPLE CYCLES AGO WE HAD THE ISSUE WITH THE, UM, THE MANUFACTURER OR THERE WAS SOMETHING ABOUT THE MANUFACTURER OF CERTAIN PIPINGS AND WE, WE HAD A, AND FORGIVE ME, I CAN'T REMEMBER OTHER THAN HAVING THE CONVERSATION, WHAT IT WAS SPECIFICALLY ABOUT, IS THIS RELATED TO THAT ABOUT, UM, MAKING LIKE THE YELLOW PIPING REQUIRED OR NOT ALLOWED OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT? THIS WAS CARRIED OVER FROM THE 15 CODE, UH, SOMETHING THAT WAS OVERLOOKED ON THE, ON THE 18, UH, WHAT IT WAS, WAS WRITTEN THAT AN ARC RESISTANT JACKET, YOU KNOW, BE ADDED TO IT NOW EVERYTHING IS PRETTY MUCH THERE. THE CSST AND ALONG WITH A HOUSE BILL. UH, THERE WAS NO NEED FOR THIS SECTION IN THE CODE IN THE CHAPTER 10, BUT YES, I JUST REMEMBERED LIKE IT MOTIVATED SOME OUTSIDERS TO COME AND PRESENT AT THE MEETING, SO I'LL JUST MAKE SURE WE'RE NOT GLOSSING OVER IT IF IT, SO WE'RE GOOD. OKAY. ITEM NUMBER SIX. WE ARE PROPOSING TO ADOPT THIS REWRITTEN SECTION, UH, 4 0 3 0.6. UM, OH, THIS, UH, THIS ITEM WAS JUST REWRITTEN INTO A LIST FORMAT FOR 4 0 3 0.6. SO IT'S ALL THE SAME LANGUAGE IN THERE, JUST IN A LIST FORMAT. WE GOOD? ALL RIGHT. ITEM NUMBER SEVEN FOR FLANGES 4 0 3 POINT 12.1, THIS IS A NEW SECTION FOR FLANGES FOR GAS PIPING INSTALLATION. WE ARE PROPOSING TO ADOPT AS WRITTEN. SO THEY BASICALLY ADDED COMMON SENSE INTO THE CODE ITEM NUMBER EIGHT. THAT IS A NEW SECTION FOR ABANDONED PIPE ABANDONED FUEL GAS PIPING 4 0 6 0.7 0.3 0.1. JUST REAL QUICKLY, ON THE ONE ONE ABOVE WHERE IT SAID INSPECT THE FLANGE, THAT'S NOT CREATING A CITY INSPECTION, THAT'S JUST SAYING THAT WHAT THAT IS INSTRUCTING THAT THE, THE PERSON DOING THE WORK HAS TO INSPECT THAT FLANGE. MAKE SURE WE'RE NOT CREATING A NEW CITY INSPECTION HERE. 4 0 3 12 1 MIKE. YES. NO INSPECTION. YEAH, UNLESS SOMETHING DOESN'T LOOK LIKE IT WOULD BE AN INSPECTION UNLESS CPS HAD CUT OFF THE GAS FOR A GAS LEAK, UH, THEN WOULD PROBABLY GO OUT FOR AN OVERALL TEST, BUT COULD NOT BE NOT, YEAH, NOT FOR THIS RIGHT HERE. COMMON TO HAVE A IN INSPECT. LIKE I ALWAYS THOUGHT OF CODE AS BEING, UM, SOMETHING THAT'S ENFORCEABLE, RIGHT? UM, HOW DO YOU ENFORCE WHETHER OR NOT SOMEBODY'S INSPECTED A FLANGE THAT'S NOW BEEN PUT BACK TOGETHER? AND, AND THAT'S, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, I'M NOT JUST TRYING TO BE DIFFICULT, IT JUST, BUT [02:00:01] IT JUST, YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU PUT IT IN THE BOOK, IT, IT HAS MEANING TO IT. UM, BUT THAT MIGHT JUST, THAT MIGHT BE SOMETHING THAT'S REPEATED THOUSANDS OF TIMES IN ALL THE CODES AND I JUST DIDN'T, YOU KNOW, READ THE YEAH, THAT'S A GOOD POINT. AND, AND THAT WE'RE A HUNDRED PERCENT CERTAIN THAT IT'S NOT TALKING ABOUT A CITY INSPECTION, IT'S TALKING ABOUT THE INSTALLER INSPECTION, CORRECT? JUST FOR THE RECORD, SO CORRECT. YEAH, WE WOULD NOT REQUIRE THAT. THEY LET US COME OUT AND INSPECT ALL THE FLANGES FOUR CONNECTIONS THAT, THAT AND WE HAVE IN UNDER OUR CHAPTER 10, UH, INSPECTION REQUIREMENT TYPES THAT WE WOULD HAVE TO PUT IT THERE FOR, FOR THAT TYPE OF OF ENFORCEMENT. ALL RIGHT. THAT NEW SECTION FOR, UM, ABANDONED FUEL GAS PIPING JUST SAYS THAT IT SHALL BE PURGED. EXPLAIN WHAT PURGED MEANS, PLEASE. THAT THERE'S NO, UM, GAS LEFT IN THOSE PIPES. EXACTLY. UH, PUMPING AIR INTO THE SYSTEM, PURGING OUT THE LINE, NOT LEAVING ANY STAGNANT GAS LINE WHERE SOMETHING DID HAPPEN AN A, UH, PLACE EXPLODE. BUT AGAIN, JUST ELIMINATING ANY NATURAL GAS FROM. UH, SO BASICALLY IF WE TAKE A FITTING OFF ONE END AND JUST PUT AIR INTO THE SYSTEM, THAT IS PURGED. THAT'S IT. PERFECT. THANK YOU. ALRIGHT, LAST ITEM NUMBER NINE. THIS WAS A REVISED 4 0 7 0.2 WAS REVISED TO REMOVE THE WORD METAL BEFORE ALL THE SUPPORTS. SO PIPING SHALL BE SUPPORTED WITH PIPE HOOKS, PIPE STRAPS, BANDS, IT USED TO SAY METAL PIPE, HOOK HOOKS, METAL PIPE STRANDS, METAL BANDS. IT JUST TOOK OUT METAL. THE, WITH THE NEW CODE, IT'S REALLY DIFFICULT TO SEE THE ITEMS THAT WERE REMOVED WITH THE NEW, UM, WAY THAT THEY ARE IDENTIFYING CHANGES. SO JUST WANTED TO CALL THAT OUT. AND THAT'S A WRAP. ANY, WE HAVE ONE ITEM THAT WAS TABLED WAS THE STANDARD FOR THE, UH, WATER COOLERS. WATER DISPENSERS. WELL, I THINK WHAT I'LL DO WITH THAT, UM, WELL IT WAS A REFERENCE TO THE A SSE STANDARD. YEAH. YES. UM, I THINK WE'LL GO AHEAD AND IF YOU WANT TO TAKE THE TIME, WE'LL GO AHEAD AND READ THROUGH IT AND THEN ADD A RECOMMENDATION OR A SUGGESTION MADE BY, UH, ONE OF THE CITY STAFF IS THAT WE BRING IT BACK TO THE, MAYBE THE MAIN BOARD FOR DISCUSSION. RIGHT? SO I'LL MAKE A, UM, WE WILL CONSIDER THAT, UH, UH, THAT ITEM AS YOU KNOW, RECOMMENDED FOR APPROVAL AS WRITTEN. AND THEN I'LL MAKE A MOTION THAT, UH, WE ADOPT ALL THE CHANGES AS, AS WE ADJUSTED THEM DURING THE PROCESS TODAY. UM, AND THEN WHEN WE GET TO THE FULL BOARD, IF WE HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT A SE 10 23 STANDARD, WE'LL BRING IT UP THERE AND MAYBE ADJUST IT THERE. THAT WAY WE DON'T HAVE TO COME BACK FOR MEETING THIS GROUP. OKAY. ALRIGHT. WELL IN THAT CASE, I'LL, I'LL MAKE A MOTION THAT WE APPROVE THE IPC AND, UH, FIRE GAS CODE, UM, ADOPTION AND AMENDMENTS. UH, AS, AS WE WORK THROUGH TODAY, WE WILL NEED TO DO THREE MOTIONS. WE HAVE THREE AGENDA ITEMS. SO, UH, IT'LL BE A MOTION TO APPROVE ALL RECOMMENDED CHANGES AND AS PRESENTED FOR THE IPC AND THE SEPARATE MOTION FOR THE FUEL GAS CODE. AND THEN A SEPARATE MOTION FOR THE ITEMS THAT WERE PERTINENT TO CHAPTER 10, NOT REALLY FALLING UNDER THE IPC, SUCH AS THE, UH, RESIDENTIAL SPRINKLER OR THE, UH, THE, UH, IRRIGATION REQUIREMENT. BUT I APOLOGIZE. JEREMY, COULD YOU SPELL THAT OUT PRETTY SPECIFICALLY DURING THE BREAK AND I WOULDN'T WRITE IT AND JUST MESSED IT RIGHT UP. HEY, IT'S LUNCHTIME. I GET IT. NOT A PROBLEM AT ALL. I, I, YOU KNOW, . SO THEN I'LL MOVE TO, UH, HAVE A VOTE TO ACCEPT ALL THE UH, IPC OR INTERNATIONAL PLUMBING CODE, UH, CHANGES, RIGHT? SO, YEAH, I'LL MAKE THAT, I'LL MAKE THAT MOTION. ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE. AYE. SECOND. OH YEAH, SECOND. SO YOU NEED MOTIONS OR YOU JUST NEED NO, YEAH, WE NEED A FULL MOTION. SO I HAVE, UH, MICHAEL RUSS MAKING THE MOTION FOR THE IPC APPROVING AS AS PRESENTED. UH, SCOTT AS THE SECOND I YOU WANT ME TO MAKE THE MOTION? OH NO, HE ALREADY DID. AND THE MOTION'S ON THE BOARD. WE HAVE THE SECOND FOR THE IPC. CORRECT. OKAY. ALL IN FAVOR? AYE. AYE. SAY AYE. OKAY. [02:05:02] UM, I MAKE A MOTION TO ADOPT THE IFGC AS, UH, AS AMENDED TODAY. SECOND. ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. UH, I MOVE TO MAKE THE ADOPT THE CHANGES TO CHAPTER 10 AS WE, UH, ADJUSTED THEM AS WE'RE PRESENTED AND ADJUSTED TODAY. SECOND WHOOP. ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. GREAT. UM, I'M JUST GONNA PULL UP, THIS IS FOR ANYBODY COMING BACK TO WATCH THE RECORDINGS. UH, THEY CAN SEE THIS INFORMATION IF THEY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS AS WE CONTINUE THIS. UH, BUT WHAT WE'LL BE DOING, UH, WE WILL CANCEL NEXT WEEK'S MEETING. UH, IT SOUNDS LIKE WE'VE WRAPPED UP THE PLUMBING CODE COMMITTEE UNLESS FOR SOME REASON, UH, THE CHAIR REVIEWS THAT AND DECIDES TO COME BACK AROUND. WE'LL REACH OUT TO EVERYBODY FINDS A TIME THAT WOULD WORK, WHETHER IT BE NEXT WEEK OR SOMETIME IN THE NEXT SIX TO SEVEN WEEKS BEFORE WE GET TO THE FULL BOARD. IF NOT, THEN WE CAN PRESENT, UH, ANY RECOMMENDATIONS AS THE CHAIR TO THE FULL BOARD WHEN STAFF PRESENTS, UH, ALL THE SUMMARIES TO THE BOARD CHAIR. . WELL, HE IS, I THINK YOU'RE ON THE MECHANICAL ONE, RIGHT? IS RIGHT? YEAH. WE'LL, WE'LL ADD YOU HIS CHAIR ON THAT ONE. I'LL GO AHEAD AND DEFAULT IT. UM, BUT YEAH, ANYBODY THAT'S, UH, WATCHING THE RECORDINGS OR WATCHING THIS FROM HOME, UH, SA SPEAKUP.COM, A 54 24, UH, THEY CAN USE THAT AS A REFERENCE TO KIND OF TRACK ALL THE PROPOSED CHANGES, UH, IN THIS WHOLE PROCESS AS WE MOVE INTO ALL THE SUBCOMMITTEES AND THEN INTO THE FULL BOARD AND PCDC IN THE FUTURE. UH, THEY CAN REACH OUT TO STAFF THROUGH BUILDING CODE UPDATES@SANANTONIO.GOV. AND THAT IS EVERYTHING. ALRIGHT, THANK Y'ALL VERY MUCH. THANK YOU. * This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.