* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting. [3:00 PM – Call to Order] [00:00:03] GOOD AFTERNOON EVERYONE. I'D LIKE TO CALL TO ORDER THE HISTORIC DESIGN REVIEW COMMISSION FOR WEDNESDAY, DECEMBER 18TH, 2024. MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE? CASTILLO? HERE. SAVINO? HERE. VELAZQUEZ. HERE. GALLOWAY MOOKA? HERE. GRO CERVANTES. HERE. HOLLAND. HERE. FETZER HERE. AND GIBBS HERE WE HAVE A QUORUM. THANK YOU. MAY I HAVE TRANSLATION SERVICES, PLEASE? GOOD AFTERNOON. THANK YOU SO MUCH. THANK YOU. THE HISTORIC DESIGN AND REVIEW COMMISSION IS AN ADVISORY BOARD APPOINTED BY THE CITY COUNCIL. I AM JAY MAURICE GIBBS CHAIRMAN AND THE VICE CHAIR IS JEFFREY FETZER. IT IS THE FUNCTION OF THE COMMISSION TO ADVISE THE CITY MANAGER AND ALL RELEVANT CITY DEPARTMENTS CONCERNING ALL APPLICATIONS FOR PERMITS FOR PROPERTIES IN HISTORIC DISTRICTS, FOR LANDMARKS ON CITY PROPERTY AND A RIVER IMPROVEMENT OVERLAY. AND FOR DEMOLITIONS. AND CONSIDERING WHETHER TO RECOMMEND APPROVAL OR DISAPPROVAL OF AN APPLICATION FOR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS, THE COMMISSION SHALL BE GUIDED BY THE CITY'S UNIFIED DEVELOPMENT CODE AND DESIGN GUIDELINES AND STANDARDS THAT HAVE BEEN ADOPTED BY CITY COUNCIL. AN APPEAL OF A DECISION BY AN ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL CAN BE FILED IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE CITY'S UNIFIED DEVELOPMENT CODE. IF ANYONE PRESENT WISHES TO SPEAK IN FAVOR OR AN OPPOSITION TO ANY ITEM ON TODAY'S AGENDA, PLEASE SIGN UP ON THE PUBLIC COMMENT SHEET. IT IS NOT NECESSARY TO SIGN UP. IF YOU ARE THE OWNER OF OR REPRESENTATIVE FOR A PROJECT ON THE AGENDA, YOU WILL BE CALLED ON AS THE CASE IS CALLED. CASE REPRESENTATIVES WILL BE GIVEN NO MORE THAN 15 MINUTES TO PRESENT THEIR CASE WITH AN ADDITIONAL TWO MINUTES TO RESPOND TO PUBLIC COMMENTS. SPEAKERS FOUR OR OPPOSED TO A CASE WILL BE LIMITED TO TWO MINUTES. EACH SPEAKERS MAY ALSO SIGN UP TO YIELD THEIR TWO MINUTES TO ANOTHER SPEAKER WHO HAS SIGNED UP. ANYONE WHO IS YIELDING THEIR TIME MUST BE PRESENT AT THE TIME THE SPEAKER IS CALLED UPON. SPEAKERS WILL BE CALLED UPON IN THE ORDER IN WHICH THEY'RE SIGNED UP FOLLOWING PUBLIC TESTIMONY. ANY COMMISSIONER MAY CALL UPON ANY SPEAKER TO RESPOND TO FURTHER QUESTIONS. APPROVAL BY THE COMMISSION DOES NOT TAKE PLACE OF ANY TYPE OF PERMIT. PERMITS MUST BE OBTAINED FOR ALL WORK. CERTIFICATES OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR WORK APPROVED BY THE COMMISSION WILL BE EMAILED TO YOU WITHIN 10 DAYS. NO WORK OF ANY TYP IS TO BE STARTED WITHOUT OBTAINING THE APPROPRIATE CITY PERMITS. AFTER A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS HAS BEEN ISSUED BY THE OFFICE OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION AT THIS TIME, PLEASE SILENCE YOUR CELL PHONES. WELL, GOOD AFTERNOON EVERYONE. THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE AND HAPPY HOLIDAYS. UM, THIS IS OUR LAST HEARING OF THE YEAR AND SO WE WANNA TAKE A MOMENT TO THANK YOU ALL FOR YOUR SERVICE. IT'S BEEN ANOTHER BUSY YEAR HERE AT THE HCRC. UM, YOU ALL HAVE REVIEWED OVER 327 CASES. THAT'S NOT INCLUDING TODAY'S AGENDA. UM, AND THE C TO HAVE US REVIEWED IN ADDITIONAL 55 CASES. AND SO IT'S BEEN A DIFFERENT YEAR FOR US WORKING WITH THIS NEW BOARD AND SENDING CASES IN MULTIPLE DIRECTIONS, BUT WE THINK IT'S BEEN WORKING WELL. WE THANK YOU FOR YOUR PATIENCE AND YOUR YOUR DEDICATION. UM, WE HAVE GIVEN YOU ALL A, UH, SMALL TOKEN OF OUR GRATITUDE. UM, AND IF YOU'RE VIRTUAL, WE WILL GET YOUR PREFERRED MAILING ADDRESS AND MAKE SURE YOU GET YOURS AS WELL. UM, SO AGAIN, THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE. UM, AT THIS TIME WE NEED APPROVAL OF MEETING MINUTES FOR DECEMBER 4TH. THANK YOU. MAY I HAVE A MOTION FOR MEETING MINUTES APPROVAL? I'LL MOTION TO APPROVE THE MEETING MOMENTS, THE MEETING MINUTES AS PRESENTED. SECOND. IT'S BEEN MOVED AND PROPERLY. SECOND. MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE? CASTILLO? AYE. SAV AYE. VELAZQUEZ. AYE. GALLOWAY AYE. ZUKA. AYE. CERVANTES? YES. POLLEN. AYE. FETZER AYE. AND GIBBS? AYE. MOTION CARRIES. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU. OKAY, WE HAVE A NEXT SPECIAL ITEM, WHICH IS APPROVAL OF NEXT YEAR'S MEETINGS, UH, SCHEDULE. SO I'LL ASK EDWARD TO QUICKLY PULL UP IF HE CAN. THE, UM, 2025 PROPOSED MEETING SCHEDULE. THERE WE GO. UM, JUST NOTE, THE JANUARY 15TH DATE IS ALREADY ON THE SCHEDULE AND SO THIS IS FEBRUARY MOVING FORWARD IS PROPOSED. WE DO NEED A MOTION IN ACTION ON THIS SCHEDULE, PLEASE. I MOVE FOR APPROVAL OF THE 2025, UH, HDRC MEETING SCHEDULE AS PRESENTED. SECOND. IT'S BEEN MOVED. I PROPERLY SECONDS. MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE? CASTILLO? [00:05:02] AYE. SAVINO? AYE. VELAZQUEZ AYE. GALLOWAY AYE. ZUKA AYE. CERVANTES? YES. HOLLAND. AYE. FETZER AYE. AND GIBBS AYE. MOTION CARRIES. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. AND I WILL NOTE THAT THE CTAP WILL ALSO APPROVE THEIR DATES IN JANUARY WHEN THEY MEET. UM, AT THIS TIME WE CAN MOVE FORWARD TO OUR CONSENT [CONSENT AGENDA Items are placed on the consent agenda when staff recommends approval or recommends approval with stipulations that the applicant agrees to. Any member of the public desiring to speak on a consent agenda item may sign up and be heard prior to voting on the consent agenda. Commissioners may request to remove any item from the consent agenda and have it placed on the individual consideration agenda. All items on the consent agenda will be considered for approval by one motion adopting the items with staff findings and recommendations.] ITEMS. WE HAVE 11 ITEMS ON THE CONSENT AGENDA. ITEM THREE. UM, WE WILL NOTE THAT HAS BEEN POSTPONED BY THE APPLICANT AND WILL BE HEARD IN JANUARY. UM, WE HAVE NO VOICEMAILS OR PUBLIC SPEAKERS FOR ANY ITEMS. YOU DO HAVE A FEW LETTERS IN YOUR PACKET. THANK YOU. DO ANY COMMISSIONERS WILL SUPPORT ANY ITEMS FROM THE CONSENT AGENDA? YES, I'D LIKE TO, UH, TO PULL ITEM ONE, SILK ROAD CULTURAL HERITAGE DISTRICT. THANK YOU. ITEM NUMBER ONE. ANY OTHER ITEMS? IF NOT, MAY I HAVE A MOTION FOR THE BALANCE OF THE CONSENT AGENDA? YES, I MOVE FOR APPROVAL OF CON UH, ITEMS 2, 4, 5 6 7 8, 9, 10, AND 11 WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS THERE. SECOND. SECOND. THANK YOU'S BEEN MOVED AND PROPERLY SECOND. ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? MAYOR A ROLL CALL PLEASE. CASTILLO. AYE. SAV AYE. VELAZQUEZ. AYE. GALLOWAY AYE. MOOKA. AYE. CERVANTES? YES. HOLLAND. AYE. FETZER AYE. AND GIBBS AYE. COMMISSIONER GROUP IS PRESENT NOW AS WELL. APOLOGIES. COMMISSIONER GROUP. AYE. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU. IF YOU'RE ON THE CONSENT AGENDA AND YOUR ADDRESS IS 4 22 PARATA 300 CONVENT 1 25 CAMARON 2,900 SAN PEDRO ONE 14 DEWEY THREE 12 PARATA 2 26 ARMY 360 2 EAST ATCH IN 2015 WEST ATCH. YOUR CASE HAS BEEN APPROVED AND YOU DO NOT NEED TO STAY FOR THE REMAINDER OF THIS HEARING. IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, PLEASE CONTACT A MEMBER OF STAFF. YOUR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS OR COMMISSION ACTION LETTER WILL BE PREPARED AND EMAIL TO YOU WITHIN 10 DAYS. SO COMMISSIONERS ITEM ONE IS ACTUALLY AN ITEM, UH, PROPOSED BY OHP. IT'S THE, UH, PROPOSED SILK ROAD CULTURAL HISTORIC, UH, HERITAGE DISTRICT. EXCUSE ME. UM, SO MYSELF AND THEN OUR CULTURAL HISTORIAN, GLORIA, ARE HERE TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU HAVE. SURE. I DON'T REALLY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS. IT WAS JUST, I JUST PULLED IT TO COMPLIMENT THE CITY OF SAN ANTONIO AND OHP FOR HONORING THE CULTURAL CONTRIBUTIONS AND DIETARY CONTRIBUTIONS OR CULINARY CONTRIBUTIONS OF OUR, UH, OF, OF OUR IMMIGRANT POPULATION. AND IN PARTICULAR THAT AREA. UH, IT REPRESENTS SO MANY DIFFERENT ASPECTS OF OUR CITY AND HELPS US BE A MORE COSMOPOLITAN CITY. AND, UM, I JUST THINK THAT'S FANTASTIC. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. I WILL SAY LIKE IT HAS BEEN A, A PUBLIC PROCESS AND THERE'S BEEN A FEW STAKEHOLDERS THAT HAVE BEEN GREATLY INVOLVED IN THE CREATION OF THAT REPORT THAT YOU ALL, UM, SAW ON THE AGENDA. AND SO IT'S BEEN REALLY EXCITING TO SEE KIND OF ALL THOSE CONTRIBUTIONS OF THOSE GROUPS. THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF KIND OF SYNERGY, UH, AROUND THIS, THIS RECOGNITION. AND SO IT'S BEEN A REALLY POSITIVE EXPERIENCE. SURE. I'M SURE THEY ALL GO TO ALIBABA. UM, ANY OTHER COMMISSIONS HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, COMMENTS? I JUST WANNA REITERATE WHAT MY FELLOW COMMISSIONER SAYS THANK YOU TO FOR PUTTING THIS TOGETHER. THERE'S A LOT OF SIGNIFICANCE, I THINK BEYOND JUST THE, THE FOOD AND THE CULTURAL IMPACTS HERE IS, IS ONE OF THE THINGS I WANTED TO POINT OUT IS THAT YOU HAVE A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT ARE LIVING IN THIS ZONE THAT ACTUALLY HELPED OUT THIS COUNTRY OVERSEAS AND HAS SINCE MIGRATED HERE. UM, AND IT CAN BE A SHOCK, IT CAN BE A CULTURAL SHOCK. YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE THEM TRYING TO INTEGRATE HERE TO THE US RIGHT? AND SOME OF THE VALUES AND NORMS MIGHT BE DIFFERENT AND CAN, IT CAN BE HARD FOR THEM COMING IN AND, UM, GIVING THEM A LITTLE BIT OF A, A TASTE OF HOME, A FEEL FOR HOME ACTUALLY HELPS, UH, HELPS THEM INTEGRATE, RIGHT? 'CAUSE WE DON'T WANNA ASSIMILATE AND WE WANT TO INTEGRATE INTO THE CULTURE. UH, THERE ARE SOME NORMS AND VALUES AND LAWS THAT ARE DIFFERENT OVER THERE FROM HERE, BUT THIS ACTUALLY GOES A LONG WAY TO SHOW AN APPRECIATION TO THOSE OF WHO HAVE FOUGHT AND WORKED IN SUPPORT OF THIS COUNTRY, ESPECIALLY THOSE WHO RECENTLY MIGRATED HERE, UM, OVER THE LAST 10, 20 YEARS. SO THANK YOU TO EVERYONE THAT WORKED ON IT. I DO APPRECIATE IT. AND, UM, THAT'S A GOOD THING GOING FORWARD. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. ANY OTHER COMMISSIONERS? I MOVE FOR APPROVAL OF THE PROPOSED SILK ROAD CULTURAL HISTOR HERITAGE DISTRICT. SECOND. THANK YOU. IT'S BEEN MOVED IN PROPERLY. SECOND. ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? NOT MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE? CASTILLO? AYE. SINA? AYE. VELAZQUEZ? [00:10:01] AYE. GALLOWAY AYE. MAZUA AYE. GROUP. AYE. ANTES? YES. HOLLAND. AYE. FETZER. AYE. AND GIBBS? AYE. MOTION CARRIES. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU. AND THANK YOU. JUST A QUICK SHOUT OUT TO GLORIA. THIS HAS BEEN A YEAR LONG PLUS PROCESS AND SO THIS IS A HUGE ACCOMPLISHMENT TO HAVE THIS ONE DONE AND SHE'S OFF THE NEXT ONE. SO [INDIVIDUAL CONSIDERATION] THANK YOU. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. ITEM NUMBER 12, PLEASE. ITEM NUMBER 12 ON THE HISTORIC AND DESIGN REVIEW COMMISSION AGENDA CASE NUMBER 2 0 2 4 DASH 4 0 5 2 2 4 6 QUENTIN DRIVE. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO RELOCATE EXISTING WINDOW FROM THE LEFT SIDE OF THE FRONT DOOR TO THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE CHIMNEY ON THE FRONT FACADE FENESTRATION OPENING TO LEFT OF FRONT DOOR TO BE ENCLOSED WITH INKIND SIDING. STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND THE REMOVAL OF THE WINDOW BASED ON FINDINGS A AND B. HOWEVER, STAFF DOES FIND THE INSTALLATION OF A HISTORIC WOOD WINDOW TO THE RIGHT OF THE CHIMNEY APPROPRIATE AS A WINDOW WAS PRESENT HISTORICALLY IN THE PROPOSED LOCATION. OUR APPLICANT, JAVIER GOULD, IS HERE TODAY. PRESENT YOUR CASE. UH, MY NAME'S JAVIER GOUL AND I AM REQUESTING, UH, THAT THE, UM, REMOVAL OF THAT WINDOW, IT SITS DIRECTLY UNDER THE STAIRCASE. UM, IT DOESN'T, AESTHETICALLY IT SERVES A PURPOSE, BUT REALISTICALLY THAT IT'S UNDER THE STAIRCASE. UH, WHEN YOU OPEN THE WINDOW, YOU SEE THE STAIRCASE AND I WAS JUST ASKING TO MOVE THAT WINDOW SINCE THE OTHER ONE WAS MISSING, UM, TO BE ABLE TO MOVE THAT WINDOW AND ACTUALLY PLACE IT TO THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE, OF THE, UH, CHIMNEY THERE. GOOD QUESTION, MR. CHAIR. IS THAT IT, SIR? THAT, THAT WAS IT. THAT'S IT. THANK YOU. UM, ANY QUESTIONS FROM THE COMMISSION? YES. NO SIR. YEAH. WAS THAT AT ONE POINT A DOOR AND WAS CONVERTED TO A WINDOW? WAS THIS A DUPLEX AT ANY TIME? NO. OKAY. NO, NOT THAT I KNOW OF. NOT STAFF. ANY IDEAS? NO. PER THE SANBORN, UM, IT LOOKED TO ALWAYS BE A SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENCE. OKAY. THANK YOU. YEAH, IF I COULD, WHAT'S SITTING THERE IS ACTUALLY THE, IT WAS ON THE DOOR AND WE JUST MOVED IT TO THE SIDE, SO MM-HMM . UM, I HAVE ANOTHER QUESTION FOLLOWING UP FROM THAT. IS, DO EITHER ONE OF, YOU KNOW, IF THE WINDOW THAT'S IN PLACE NOW, IS IT AN ORIGINAL WINDOW LOCATION? I DO NOT KNOW, MA'AM. I'M ASSUMING THAT IT IS JUST BECAUSE THE SYMMETRY OF THAT FACADE IS QUITE STRONG UHHUH. UM, WHICH MAKES ME BELIEVE, YES, THAT'S IT. IT WAS THAT IT VERY, VERY LIKELY WAS. AND THEN MY SECOND QUESTION IS FOR, UM, FOR YOU, MR. GOUL, YOU MENTIONED THAT IT MAKES SENSE AESTHETICALLY, BUT FUNCTIONALLY IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE, RIGHT? SO MIGHT YOU BE OPEN TO KEEPING THE WINDOW ON THE BUILDING BUT THEN REFERRING IT IN ON THE INSIDE OF THE HOUSE WITH SOME SHEET ROCK, WOULD THAT BE AN OPTION THAT YOU COULD PURSUE SO THE WINDOW WOULD STAY IN PLACE? YES. YES. OKAY. THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER GROUP. I WAS GONNA DO A MOTION TO MOVE TO DISCUSSION ALONG WITH THE IDEA, UH, THAT COMMISSIONER MONICA JUST, UH, PROPOSED. OKAY. WE'LL TAKE YOUR MOTION. I MOVE TO, UM, APPROVE. WELL ACTUALLY IT'LL BE A DENIAL OF THE REQUEST, WHICH WITH THE OPTION OF, UM, THE APPLICANT TO, UM, SEAL FROM THE INSIDE THE WINDOW TO CLARIFY. COMMISSIONER GROUP, WOULD THIS ALLOW THE, UM, THE ADDITION OF THE PROPOSED WINDOW AS WELL SHOWN? LET, LET'S, YEAH, YOU'RE RIGHT. SO, UM, MOVE TO APPROVE WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS, I GUESS. WOULD THAT BE A BETTER MOTION INDICATING THAT YEAH, I THINK WE SEE IN A RECOMMENDATION THAT THEY COULD ADD A WINDOW, JUST NOT REMOVE THE PROPOSED REMOVAL. SO THAT WOULD, THAT WOULD SOLVE IT. OKAY. SECOND, THANK YOU. MOVED AND PROPERLY SECOND DISCUSSION. YEAH, AND I JUST WANTED TO TELL THE APPLICANT IT, I DON'T KNOW. MONICA MEANT SAY IT'S, IT'S NOT FUNCTIONAL, BUT AESTHETICALLY THAT'S THE RIGHT THING. IT IS THE RIGHT THING. AND I THINK, UH, STAFF HAD IT RIGHT ON THAT ONE TOO. IS THERE'S JUST A LOT OF, LIKE, YOU CAN JUST SEE IT, RIGHT? IT'S REALLY AESTHETICALLY PERFECT. YOUR HOUSE . YEAH. EVERYTHING FROM THE TOP IS MATCHING ON THE BOTTOM. SO I THINK, UM, WE'VE SEEN IT MANY TIMES, UH, BE A SUCCESS. IS THAT YOU UM, YOU CAN SHEET ROCKET FROM THE INSIDE. I MEAN THE STAIRS MUST BE NOT [00:15:01] ORIGINAL THERE EITHER, RIGHT? THEY HAVE PROBABLY BEEN MOVED 'CAUSE THEY PROBABLY ORIGINALLY WASN'T THERE WITH THE WINDOW. UM, ? HONESTLY, I'M NOT SURE. UM, 'CAUSE WE WANTED TO MOVE A DOOR TOO, REMEMBER, BUT YEAH, IT WOULD BE RIGHT UNDER THE STAIRCASE. SO GOTCHA. FURTHER DISCUSSION. I HAVE A QUESTION. SURE. GO AHEAD. SIR. SIR, SIR, THE, THE, THE, UM, THING THAT'S SITTING IN FRONT OF THE WINDOW, WAS THAT ON THE WINDOW? NO, IT WAS ACTUALLY ON THE DOOR. IT'S UH, IT'S A, IT'S, IT IS A SCREEN DOOR THAT WE MOVE OH, OKAY. TO GET INTO THE DOOR. OKAY. YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE, WHAT THE, THE RULES WOULD SAY, BUT IF, IF THERE WAS A LOUVRE THAT YOU PUT ON THE WINDOW INSTEAD OF SHEET ROCKING IT, I MEAN IT MIGHT BE AN EQUAL OPTION TO YOU TO, TO GET A PERMANENT WOOD LOUVRE ON THE INSIDE SO THAT, SO THAT YOU'RE NOT COVERING SOMETHING AND ACTING LIKE IT'S NOT THERE. 'CAUSE THAT'S ESSENTIALLY WHAT YOU'D END UP HAVING TO DO. YOU'D HAVE TO TREAT THE SHEET ROCK SO THAT WHEN THEY LOOK THROUGH THE WINDOW, THEY, THEY'RE GONNA SEE SHEET ROCK, RIGHT? 'CAUSE IT'S A BIG WINDOW. BUT IF YOU GOT, UM, A LOUVRE WOOD LOUVRE INSTALLED IT ON THE INSIDE SO THAT WHEN SOMEONE LOOKS THROUGH THE WINDOW, THEY SEE A WOOD LURE, IT LOOKS NORMAL, BUT YOU GET THAT SOLID PRIVACY, THAT'S COULD BE A REALLY STRONG, UM, ALSO KIND OF DETERRENT. YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN? LOOK AT I, I THINK SO. LOOK AT A WOOD LURE. YEAH, BECAUSE THAT LOOKS LIKE IT WAS A METAL LURE SITTING IN FRONT. LIKE MAYBE ORIGINALLY IT HAD A METAL LURE ON THE OUTSIDE OF THAT WINDOW. YEAH, NO, THAT WAS ACTUALLY THE, UM, A, A DOOR FOR THE DOOR. OKAY. A SCREEN DOOR SORT OF. WELL THANK YOU SIR. MM-HMM . ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE? CASTILLO? AYE. SAVINO? AYE. VELASQUEZ AYE. GALLOWAY AYE. MOOKA AYE. GROUP. AYE. CERVANTES? YES. HOLLAND. AYE. FETZER AYE. AND GIBBS? AYE. MOTION CARRIES. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. ITEM 13 PLEASE. AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 13, HDRC. CASE NUMBER 2024 DASH FOUR 13, UH, 7 0 3 OSA. THE APPLICANT'S REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO INSTALL SIGNAGE AT 7 0 3 OSA. WITHIN THIS REQUEST, THE APPLICANT'S PROPOSED THE FOLLOWING INSTALL ONE. INTERNALLY ILLUMINATED CABINET SIGNED REED ACADEMY AND CAREER SERVICES WITH THE GOODWILL LOGO TO BE LOCATED AT THE REAR OF THE STRUCTURE FACING THE PARKING LOT. UM, THE TOTAL SIZE OF THE SIGN WILL BE APPROXIMATELY, UM, THERE'S ACTUALLY BEEN A CORRECTION. THE APPROXIMATE SIZE WILL BE 31 SQUARE FEET. UH, THIS SIGN IS IDENTIFIED AS SIGN BEING THAT APPLICATION DOCUMENTS INSTALL ONE INTERNALLY ILLUMINATED HANGING CABINET SIDE TO READ ACADEMY AND CAREER SERVICES WITH THE GOODWILL LOGO BE LOCATED UNDER THE AWNING RUNNING PARALLEL TO LAROSA. THE PROPOSED SIGNAGE WILL FEATURE AN OVERALL WIDTH OF FOUR FEET AND OVERALL HEIGHT OF TWO FEET. THE TOTAL SIZE OF THE SIGN WILL BE APPROXIMATELY, UM, AND THERE'S A CORRECTION HERE AS WELL AT 12 AND A HALF SQUARE FEET. THIS SIGN IS IDENTIFIED AS SIGN C IN THE APPLICATION DOCUMENTS, STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL BASED ON FINDING A THROUGH G WITH THE FOLLOWING STIPULATIONS. ONE THAT THE A, THAT THE PROPOSED CABINET SIGNS FEATURE EITHER INDIRECT LIGHTING OR DIM INTERNAL LIGHTING IF INTERNAL ILLUMINATION IS USED. TWO. THAT ALL SIGN FEATURE, ALL SIGNS FEATURE LIGHTING THAT DOES NOT RESULT IN A LAYER. AND THREE THAT THE APPLICANT INCORPORATE A DARK BACKGROUND WITH LIGHT LETTERING. THE APPLICANT, JEANETTE MANGA MANGU IS HERE IN PERSON. AND JEANETTE, IF YOU'D LIKE TO APPROACH AND, UH, PRESENT YOUR CASE TO THE COMMISSION. GOOD AFTERNOON. MY NAME IS JEANETTE MANGU WITH AETNA SIGN GROUP AND I'M HERE ON BEHALF OF GOODWILL. UM, OUR PROPOSED SIGNAGE, THE REASON THAT THE APPLICANT WANTED TO PROPOSE IT AS DESIGNED WAS TO STAY CONSISTENT WITH THE STORE THAT'S RIGHT NEXT DOOR. UM, THE LOGO THAT SITS ON THEIR STORE, UM, IS A SAME TYPE OF FACE AND THEN THEY ALSO HAVE A BLADE SIGN AROUND THE CORNER THAT'S SIMILAR TO WHAT WE HAD, UM, REQUESTED. SO, UM, THAT WAS THE DESIGN INTENT BEHIND, UM, OUR ORIGINAL APPLICATION. UM, AT THE END OF THE DAY, THE APPLICANT NEEDS THE SIGN TO LIGHT AND WOULD BE WILLING TO MAKE SOME CONCESSIONS. UM, BUT IT IS IMPORTANT TO THEM THAT THE SIGN IS VISIBLE AND, AND IS CONSISTENT WITH THEIR BRAND STANDARD. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. OKAY. , WHAT I, I WAS GONNA SAY IF THERE IS, IF THERE AREN'T ANY COMMENTS, I ASSUME A MOTION SO THAT WE [00:20:01] CAN GET INTO DIALOGUE. IT SEEMS LIKE STAFF'S RECOMMENDING IT, SO IT PROBABLY IS A MORE SIMPLE DISCUSSION THAN TYPICAL. OKAY. I DON'T SEE ANY QUESTIONS FROM ANYONE, SO I'LL TAKE YOUR MOTION, SIR. I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE, UH, WITH, UH, STAFF STIPULATIONS. OKAY. IT'S BEEN MOVED AND PROPERLY. SECOND DISCUSSION. OKAY. WELL, MR. CHAIR, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I THINK IS, IS, IS, IS NOT BEING PRESENTED, BUT, UH, GOODWILL IS A, A VERY OLD ORGANIZATION. IT'S, IT'S IT'S BRANDING AND IT'S, IT'S LOGO IS A WELL-KNOWN, UM, UH, SIGNAGE. THE WHITE, THE BLUE. I THINK NO MATTER WHERE YOU ARE IN THE GOODWILL ENVIRONMENT, IT'S, IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE SEE COMMON. SO WHILE THERE WOULD BE A CONTRADICTION TO THE MOTION THAT I MADE, UH, IF, IF, UM, IF IT WAS THE PLEASURE OF THE, OF THE, UM, UM, HDRC TO TO ALLOW, UM, THE, THE, THIS THIS APPLICANT, UH, APPLICATION TO BE APPROVED AS REQUESTED BY THE APPLICANT, I THINK THAT WITH THAT IS WITHIN THE, THE SCALE OF, OF, UM, OF WHAT STAFF IS, IS, UH, REQUESTING. BUT PART, I THINK PART OF WHAT WE WOULD SEE IS SOMETHING THAT WE'RE ALL KIND OF TRAINED TO SEE WITH RESPECT TO GOODWILL. SO IT, SO WHILE IT MAY BE AN ANOMALY WITH RESPECT TO LIGHTING STYLE AND, AND, AND, UH, CABINET AND ALL OF THAT, BUT, BUT IT'S STILL, UM, REALLY MORE REMINISCENT OF, OF AN IMPORTANT, NOT JUST AN ANCHOR THROUGHOUT THE CITY, BUT BUT EVEN AN ANCHOR IN THIS LOCATION. 'CAUSE IT'S PRETTY WONDERFUL THAT GOODWILL IS THERE, THEY'VE BEEN THERE AND THAT THEIR COMMITMENT IS STILL THERE. SO THEY, THEY, THEY'RE A REALLY STRONG ANCHOR IN THAT AREA OF THE WEST END OF DOWNTOWN. IT SEEMS THAT THEIR COMMITMENT IS EXPANDED AND IS POSITIVE, UH, IMPACT WOULD WARRANT, UM, THE APPROVAL OF THIS APPLICATION AS REQUESTED BY THE APPLICANT. THANK YOU SIR. THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER GROUP. YEAH, SO I HAD A QUESTION. UM, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE, I MEAN, NOT, I, I, I UNDERSTAND THE STIPULATION OF KEEPING THE LOGO AS IS. UM, WHAT, JUST TO KEEP CONSIST IS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE PURPOSE OR THE MISSION OF GOODWILL. THERE'S A GOODWILL DOWNTOWN, RIGHT? WHICH IS WITHIN THE RIO DISTRICT. WHERE ELSE, LIKE, DO WE HAVE, LIKE WHAT ARE THE SIGNS THAT WE ALREADY KNOW FROM THIS ORGANIZATION THAT ARE IN HISTORIC DISTRICTS ARE WITHIN OUR, OUR PURVIEW? DO WE HAVE WE LOOKED AT THAT AND SEE, OKAY, CAN WE DO SOMETHING SIMILAR OR EXACT LIKE THAT? SO THE, THE STORE IS RIGHT NEXT DOOR TO THE, THE CAREER AND ACADEMY. UM, AND THE STORE ITSELF HAS THE SIGNS SIMILAR TO WHAT WE'RE PROPOSING AND THAT'S WHY WE WERE TRYING TO KEEP THEM CONSISTENT WITH EACH OTHER IS BECAUSE THEY ARE SHARING THE SAME PARKING LOT AND THE, AND I UNDERSTAND THAT. SO, UM, AND WHAT ABOUT OTHER PLACES AROUND TOWN? AS FAR AS OTHER HISTORIC YEAH, HISTORIC OR GOODWILL PERIOD, BECAUSE THIS, UH, ACADEMY AND CAREER SERVICES, THIS IS THE ONLY LOCATION THAT'S GONNA FALL IN HISTORIC, BUT THEY'RE GONNA HAVE THIS SAME, UM, LOOK AND BRANDING ACROSS THEIR OTHER LOCATIONS. I BELIEVE YOU HAVE 10 OTHER NINE OTHER LOCATIONS. WE HAVE 15 OTHER DIGITAL STORES WITHIN . OKAY. THIS IS PART OF, OKAY, SO IT WOULD BASICALLY JUST BE THIS SIGN AND THEN WE ARE THE LIGHTING YOU'RE OKAY WITH, RIGHT? THE LIGHTING REQUEST. WELL, I MEAN OF, OF COURSE WE WOULD LIKE IT AS PROPOSED. UM, WHICH I, I FEEL LIKE THE, THAT'S THE FIRST ASK, BUT IF WE NEEDED TO MAKE A CONCESSION WITH THE LIGHTING, WE WOULD, IT WOULD CHANGE THE LOOK OF IT. UM, AND WE'RE TRYING TO KEEP A BRAND CONSISTENCY, BUT THEN AGAIN, IT'S MORE IMPORTANT TO US THAT IT LIGHTS UP AT NIGHT, UM, THAT PEOPLE THAT ARE, YOU KNOW, AROUND CAN FIND IT. UM, THEY, THEY ARE HAVING TROUBLE WITH PEOPLE, BUT IT'S NOT ABOUT NOT BEING LIGHT, IT IS JUST MAYBE, UH, A DIMED INTERNAL LIGHTING. YES. THAT WAS GOING TO BE MY QUESTION. YEAH. I'M LIKE, AREN'T YOU OKAY WITH DIMED INTERNAL LIGHTING? ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT BLUE LIGHTS? IS THIS LIGHTING DIMMABLE? LIKE, LIKE IS THE LIGHTING DIMMABLE? YOU CAN PUT DIMMERS ON ANY LED LIGHTING. OKAY. SO ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT SO THE LUMENS, THE COLOR THAT IT LIGHTS OR JUST THAT IT DIMS AT NIGHT THAT IT WOULD DIM AT NIGHT SO THAT YOU DON'T END UP WITH THE GLARE OF A BRIGHT WHITE BACKGROUND. MM-HMM . IT WOULD STILL BE . LET'S JUST BUT BE DIMMED DOWN. CLARIFY. IT'S NOT LIT [00:25:01] DURING THE DAY. SO IT'S IT'S NOT ABOUT BEING DIMMABLE, IT IS JUST ONE LIGHT. IT'S NOT NEEDED DURING THE DAY. RIGHT, RIGHT. IT WOULDN'T LIGHT UP EXCEPT FOR WHEN IT TURNS DARK OUTSIDE. EXACTLY. SO BASICALLY WHAT WE'RE ASKING FOR, IT'S A DIM, NOT A DIMMABLE INTERNAL LIGHTING, A DIM INTERNAL LIGHTING SO THAT IT DOESN'T CLEAR UP BEING, AND I'M PRETTY SURE YOU ALREADY HAVE THAT IN THE EXISTING SIGN SOMEWHERE AROUND DOWNTOWN. THAT'S KIND OF WHERE I'M GOING WITH. OKAY. I COMPLETELY IN THE GOOD. WOULD THAT BE SOMETHING YOU'RE OKAY WITH? ARE Y'ALL OKAY WITH THAT? IT SOUNDS LIKE THEY ARE OKAY WITH THAT . SO CAN I AMEND THE CURRENT MOTION? YES, GO AHEAD MA'AM. SO MOVE TO APPROVE FOR STAFF STIPULATION ONE AND TWO. THANK YOU. DOES THE SECOND CONCUR DO? YES. IS OKAY. THANK YOU. IS THAT AN ALTERNATE MOTION? OH, I, THE MOTION MAKER WAS COMMISSIONER VELAZQUEZ. SO HE WOULD HAVE TO EITHER AMEND HIS MOTION OR WE WOULD USE IT, TREAT IT LIKE AN ALTERNATE MOTION. WELL, AND AND WHAT WHAT, WHAT I DIDN'T HEAR IN ANY OF IT WAS THIS, THE, THE DIALOGUE ABOUT BLACK AS OPPOSED TO WHITE BECAUSE, UH, I'M, I'M HOPING THAT WHAT WE'RE DISCUSSING, SO KEEPING, KEEPING THE SIGN AS PRESENTED DESIGN-WISE WITH COLORS WERE ONLY, THE STIPULATIONS ARE ONLY REGARDING THE LIGHT, WHICH IS INDIRECT. A DIM INTERNAL LIGHT, ONE INDIRECT LIGHTING, GIVING THEM BOTH THE OPTION AND THE LIGHTING THAT DOES NOT RESULT IN A GLARE. SO CLOSER TO WHAT YOU WANT. IF, IF THAT WAS A FRIENDLY AMENDMENT, I ACCEPT THE FRIENDLY AMENDMENT. THE SECOND CONCURS. YES. OKAY. THANK YOU. UM, FURTHER DISCUSSION? NOT, MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE? CASTILLO? AYE. S AYE. VELAZQUEZ AYE. GALLOWAY AYE. ZUKA AYE. GROUP. AYE. CERVANTES? YES. HOLLAND. AYE BET SIR. AYE. AND GIBBS? AYE. MOTION CARRIES. MOTION CARRIES. THANK YOU. ITEM 14 PLEASE. AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 1414 HGRC, CASE NUMBER 2024 DASH 3 98 13 31 SOUTHEAST MILITARY DRIVE. THE APPLICANT'S REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO INSTALL SIGNAGE AT 1331 SOUTHEAST MILITARY DRIVE. WITHIN THIS REQUEST, THE APPLICANT HAS PROPOSED THE FOLLOWING, ONE, INSTALL ONE INTERNALLY ILLUMINATED CABINET SIGN TO READ VERNAL TO BE LOCATED ON THE FRONT FACADE. THE PROPOSED SIGNAGE WILL FEATURE AN OVERALL WIDTH OF SIX FEET, 11 INCHES IN THE HEIGHT OF SIX FEET. THE TOTAL SIZE OF THE SIGN WILL BE APPROXIMATELY 42 SQUARE FEET. TWO, INSTALL ONE INTERNALLY ELIMINATED CABINET SIGN TO READ, DRIVE THROUGH MARGARITAS, MARGARITAS, DAIQUIRIS, MICHELADAS SHOTS, CHAMOIS SNACKS TO BE LOCATED ON THE FRONT FACADE. THEIR PROPOSED SIGNAGE WILL FEATURE AN OVERALL WIDTH OF 41 FEET, SIX INCHES, AND AN OVERALL HEIGHT OF FIVE FEET, FIVE INCHES. THE TOTAL SIGN OF THE SIZE OR THE TOTAL SIZE OF THE SIGN WILL BE APPROXIMATELY 210 SQUARE FEET. THREE. INSTALL ONE INTERNALLY ILLUMINATED CABINET. SIGN TO READ MARGARITA DRIVE THROUGH TO BE LOCATED UNDER THE PREVIOUSLY APPROVED REPHRASED POLE SIGN. THE PROPOSED SIGNAGE WILL FEATURE AN OVERALL WIDTH OF SEVEN FEET TWO INCHES, AND OVERALL HEIGHT OF THREE FEET EIGHT INCHES. THE TOTAL SIZE OF THE SIGN WILL BE APPROXIMATELY 56 SQUARE FEET. STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL. THE FOLLOWING MODIFICATIONS ARE NECESSARY TO CONFORM WITH THE DESIGN GUIDELINES. ONE, THAT THE APPLICANT REDUCE THE TOTAL SQUARE FOOTAGE AT THE PROPOSED SIGNAGE TO 50 SQUARE FEET OR LESS. TWO, THAT THE APPLICANT INCORPORATE DURABLE MATERIALS FOR THE REQUESTED SIGNAGE AS NOTED FINDING E AND THREE THAT THE APPLICANT INCORPORATE EXTERNAL LIGHTING AS NOTED IN FINDING F THE PROPERTY OWNER OF BETH AND OR HARDEST HERE IN PERSON. UM, AND BEFORE WE WOULD BEGIN, UM, PLEASE NOTE THAT, THAT THE PROPERTY OWNER IS PROVIDED A PRESENTATION THAT IS AVAILABLE IN YOUR LATE FOLDER. BETH ANN, IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO APPROACH AND, UH, GO AHEAD AND WALK THE COMMISSIONERS TO YOUR REQUEST. GOOD AFTERNOON. GOOD AFTERNOON. UM, I ACTUALLY AM, I'M SO SORRY. ONE SECOND. LET ME PULL UP YOUR PRESENTATION. OKAY. I APOLOGIZE FOR THAT. GO AHEAD AND THAT'S OKAY. START WHENEVER YOU'RE READY. OKAY. UH, WELL FIRST OF ALL, THANK YOU FOR ALLOWING US TO COME AND PRESENT OUR, UH, MA'AM BUSINESS. BEFORE YOU GET STARTED, PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME. I'M BETH ANN EARHART, MY HUSBAND MARK ERHARDT, AND I [00:30:01] OWN THE AL BUSINESSES. THANK YOU. I'M ALSO HERE WITH, UH, MY, OUR SON PERSON, UH, TONY SANCHEZ IN CASE HE NEEDS TO WEIGH IN. UM, SO, UH, A LITTLE BIT ABOUT US. WE'VE, UH, BEEN A BUSINESS, THE, THE BUSINESS STARTED IN 2005, BUT MY HUSBAND AND I PURCHASED IT IN MAY OF 2008. AND WE HAVE WORKED SUPER HARD TO REALLY ESTABLISH A BRAND IN SAN ANTONIO. WE HAVE THREE LOCATIONS. MILITARY HAS KIND OF BEEN OUR HUB. UH, WE LOVE THE SOUTH SIDE. AND, UM, THEN WE ALSO HAVE ONE AT WEST AVENUE IN JACKSON, KELLER, AND ALSO SAN PEDRO NEAR, UH, LIKE THE SAN ANTONIO COLLEGE AREA RIGHT THERE. SO A LITTLE CONTEXT ABOUT WHY I'M HERE. WE HAD, UH, UNFORTUNATELY A MISCOMMUNICATION BETWEEN THE SIGN BROKER AND THE SIGN COMPANY AND, AND US. SO WE DID NOT ACTUALLY FIND OUT THAT WE WERE, UH, IN VIOLATION UNTIL SATURDAY WHEN Y'ALL THE SIGN GOT PUT ON OUR PROPERTY. AND SO WE WERE SCRAMBLING. SO OUR SIGNAGE IS UP ON, AT ALL THREE OF OUR STORES. AND, UH, YOU KNOW, IGNORANCE IS NOT REALLY AN EXCUSE AS I TELL MY STAFF FOR NOT KNOWING THE RULES. BUT WE ARE, UM, WE ARE SUPER SORRY THAT IT CAME DOWN THIS WAY. UM, A LITTLE BIT ABOUT OUR, OUR SIGNS. I'M GONNA SHOW YOU SOME PICTURES AND I WILL NOT, TERRY, I KNOW YOU CAN LOOK AT YOUR, UM, POWERPOINT, UH, FOLDER THERE IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO. BUT JUST HERE WE ARE AT BERNAL. THOSE, I'M, I'M SURE MOST OF YOU KNOW THIS, BUT WE'RE ON THE VERY EDGE OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. AND I GUESS THAT, UM, WE WEREN'T, UH, FAMILIAR WITH THE DIFFERENT, UH, HOW THAT, HOW MUCH THAT MATTERED TO OUR CHOICES IN OUR SIGNAGE. UM, THIS IS WHAT THE SIGN LOOKS LIKE AT THIS POINT. AND WE WANT TO, YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY WE WANNA DO THIS RIGHT? WE, UH, WE WANNA JUST KIND OF TELL YOU WHAT OUR THOUGHT PROCESS WAS SO YOU CAN SEE WHERE WE ARE AS A BUSINESS. AND WE'VE BEEN THIS, WE'RE GOING INTO OUR 16TH YEAR, AND, UH, SO WE'VE LEARNED QUITE A BIT ALONG THE WAY, BUT HERE I AM LEARNING ONE MORE THING. SO, UH, WHEN WE PURCHASED THIS FROM THE ORIGINAL OWNERS IN 2008, THIS WAS KIND OF HOW THE STORE LOOKED BACK THEN. SO WE CALLED IT THE BARNEY STORES BECAUSE IT WAS PURPLE AND GREEN AND NOT THAT REALLY APPEALING, BUT, UH, A GOOD BUSINESS AND A GOOD CONCEPT. YOU CAN SEE THAT THE CONCEPT WAS, UH, VERY SIMILAR AT ALL THREE OF OUR STORES. UH, WE HAVE A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT LOCA, YOU KNOW, ONCE AT WEST AVENUE WE'RE ON THE POINT, SO THERE'S A FEW ON THE POINT. SO THERE'S A FEW THINGS THAT ARE DIFFERENT, BUT FOR THE MOST PART, UH, THE SAME, UH, SETUP OVER THE YEARS, WE'VE TRIED TO JUST GRADUALLY GET THE LOOK BETTER, IMPROVE IT. SO YOU CAN SEE IN 2007, AND THEN IN 2011, UH, MOVING ON TO AUGUST OF 2014, WE, WE THOUGHT, OKAY, THIS IS, UH, GOING TO BE A LOT BETTER LOOK WITH THE RED AND WHY IT FIT INTO THE, UH, SCHEME MORE. AND SO WE BEGAN TO LOOK AT WAYS WE COULD DO JUST LITTLE SMALL THINGS TO IMPROVE THE SIGNAGE AND THE LOOK OF THE STORE. HERE WE ARE IN 2019 AND, UH, AND THEN 2024 TODAY. UH, PART OF THE, UH, THING THAT'S HARD ABOUT ONE OF THE THINGS YOU PROPOSED IS THAT THE, THE SMALL SIGN AT THE TOP, AND I'M, I'M ON PAGE NINE RIGHT NOW. THE, UH, THERE, THAT'S A VERY SMALL SIGN TO PUT, UH, OUR ENTIRE, WELL, YOU CAN SEE THE SIGN BECAUSE WE, UH, MARKET AND BRAND OURSELF AS BEER ALL DRIVE THROUGH MARGARITAS. UM, AFTER COVID, EVERYBODY IN THE WORLD IS SELLING MARGARITAS TO GO. SO BEER AND ALL DIDN'T EXACTLY SAY WHAT WE ALL THAT WE OFFER. WE DO HAVE SNACKS AND ALL KINDS OF THINGS, BUT, UH, SO WE WANTED TO EXTEND OUR SIGN ACROSS THE BUILDING SO THAT PEOPLE WOULD ACTUALLY BE ABLE TO FIND US AND, AND KNOW THE OTHER TWO LOCATIONS HAVE ALSO GONE OVER, UH, MAKEOVERS. I'M ON PAGE 10 NOW, AND SO WE'RE NOT, YOU KNOW, BUSH'S CHICKEN OR WALMART OR MCDONALD'S, BUT WE'RE A, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE THREE STORES WE'RE, UH, HOPING TO ACQUIRE MORE OR TO POSSIBLY FRANCHISE. SO IT'S OUR DESIRE TO KEEP THE CONSISTENT IN HOW WE LOOK AND TO, UM, REALLY IMPROVE THE LOOK OF OUR, OUR STORES. WHEN IT COMES TO THE STREET SIGN PROJECT, YOU'LL SEE THIS, UM, THE, UH, ONE IN QUESTION IS THE MARGARITA DRIVE THROUGH. AND THE, ACTUALLY OUR THOUGHT WAS, THIS IS OUR STORE AT SIM UH, AT WEST AVENUE ON PAGE 12. SO WE WERE JUST, WHEN WE BOUGHT THE, WHEN WE LEASED THE WAREHOUSE SPACE IN 2019, THAT FREED UP THAT, UH, THE SPACE ON THE SIGN SO THAT WE COULD USE THAT. I'LL SHOW YOU, UH, AS IT GOES ON. BUT THE MILITARY SIGN WAS PEELING AND COMING DOWN AND WE [00:35:01] WERE OBVIOUSLY NEEDING TO UPGRADE IT AND UPDATE IT. AND, UH, AND THAT WAS THE GOAL BEHIND THIS PROJECT. NOT JUST HERE, NOT JUST AT MILITARY, BUT AT ALL OF OUR STORES. UH, BUT IN 2019, SO THIS SIGN IN THE MIDDLE, I'M ON PAGE, WHAT PAGE ARE WE ON HERE? I THINK IT'S PAGE 14. UM, THE, THERE WAS MULTIPLE AUTO SHOPS AND DIFFERENT, UH, IT KEPT TURNING OVER THE BEHIND US AND OUR BUSINESS WAS KIND OF AFFECTED BY IT BECAUSE IF YOU KNOW, HOW ABOUT DRIVE-THROUGHS? AND MILITARY IS SUPER BUSY, OBVIOUSLY WE HIRE SECURITY, WE HIRE, HAVE HIRED A LOT OF SECURITY THROUGH THE YEARS JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE OFF OF MILITARY, NOT IN THE WAY AND FLOWING THROUGH. SO WE GOT THE OPPORTUNITY TO RENT THE WAREHOUSE AND THAT'S WHAT THAT SIGN, THAT'S WHAT WAS BACK THERE. AND SO NOW OUR THOUGHT WAS WE HAVE THAT SIGN SPACE AND WE HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY WHEN WE DECIDED TO REMODEL ALL THE SIGNS TO UTILIZE THAT SPACE. SO WE'VE DONE THE WAREHOUSE, WHICH WE, UH, LEASED. WE HAVE, UH, PUT A LOT OF EFFORT AND IMPROVEMENT INTO THAT TO MAKE IT A STORAGE, NOT JUST STORAGE PLACE, BUT A MEETING PLACE. A OUR OFFICES, WE EMPLOY 40 PEOPLE DEPENDING ON THE SEASON. AND, UM, SO WE STAY PRETTY BUSY. WE'RE INVOLVED IN A LOT OF COMMUNITY, UH, EVENTS AS WELL. SO IT WAS HELPFUL TO BE ABLE TO HAVE THAT SPACE. SO HERE YOU SEE THAT OUR NEW SIGN ON PAGE 16, THE NEW SIGN ON MILITARY MATCHES THE OLD, THE SIGN THAT WE CURRENTLY HAVE AT WEST AVENUE. SO WE'RE GONNA GIVE YOU JUST A FEW BEFORE AND AFTER SHOTS. THIS MAY BE MORE INFORMATION THAT YOU WOULD WANT, BUT HEY, I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, IT'S BETTER FOR YOU TO KNOW KIND OF WHAT WE'RE DEALING WITH, UH, 'CAUSE WE'RE NOT INTERESTED JUST IN OUR STORE, BUT WE, WE LOVE THE, THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND THIS AREA. AND SO OUR THOUGHT HAS BEEN, QUITE FRANKLY, WE'RE REALLY HELPING BECAUSE WE'RE, YOU KNOW, WE'RE MAKING IT CLEANER, BRIGHTER, SAFER. AND SO THAT WAS OUR GOAL. UM, HERE IT IS ON, ON MILITARY BEFORE AND THEN AFTER, SO YOU KINDA GET THE BEFORE AND AFTER SHOTS ON PAGE 18, THERE'S A LITTLE, THE PART OF THE PROBLEM IS, IS THAT, UH, IT'S HARD TO SEE. IT'S HARD TO SEE US WHEN YOU'RE DRIVING. UH, THE, SOME OF IT'S THE BUSHES AND SOME OF IT'S JUST WE'RE SET BACK. AND WITH NO SIGNAGE, IT WAS JUST DIFFICULT FOR PEOPLE TO SEE US. EVEN OUR EMPLOYEES WOULD DRIVE PAST AND SAY, OH WOW, I KIND OF MISSED, UH, AT LEAST THEY SAID THAT'S WHY THEY WERE LATE FOR WORK, YOU KNOW, THAT THEY DROVE PAST. I'M NOT EXACTLY SURE ABOUT THAT. BUT ANYWAY, UH, YOU CAN SEE FROM THE AUTO DEALERSHIP SHIP, UH, BEFORE AND AFTER SHOT OF KIND OF, THIS IS HOW WE LOOK. THIS IS HOW THE STORE LOOKS FROM THESE ANGLES. SO ON THE TOP ONE YOU CAN SEE, YOU CAN, IT IS REALLY KIND OF HARD TO TELL WHAT THE, THE STORE IS. BUT OBVIOUSLY IPRO IMPROVED. THERE'S QUITE A FEW COMPANIES AT A SURROUNDING BEER AND ALL, BECAUSE AS I SAID, WE ARE ON THE EDGE OF THE, OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. SO IT'S COMMERCIALLY RICH. OBVIOUSLY THERE'S A LOT OF SIGNS IN EVERY DIRECTION. AND STRAIGHT ACROSS THE STREET FROM US IS BUSH'S CHICKEN. SO LIKE THIS ONE PICTURE IS TAKEN FROM RIGHT ACROSS THE STREET, SO YOU CAN KIND OF SEE THE WHAT, UH, WE ARE DEALING WITH THEIR SIGN. AND I'LL SHOW YOU THE NIGHT SIGN. IT'S QUITE A BIT LARGER THAN, UH, THAN THAN THE BEER AND ALL SIGN. ALSO NEXT DOOR IS, UH, THE WALMART, WHICH OBVIOUSLY IS, UH, JUST RIGHT ALSO RIGHT ACROSS THE STREET FROM US. SO THERE'S MORE LIGHTING ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE STREET BEFORE OUR SIDE OF THE STREET. IT'S, IT'S PRETTY DARK AND WE'VE HAD SOME NEAR, UH, COLLISIONS BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE TRYING TO GET IN AND OUT OF OFF A MILITARY. AND SO WE HAVE A QUITE A BIG EFFORT JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT OUR CUSTOMERS AND OUR STAFF ARE SAFE. UM, WELL YOU ALL KNOW THIS, THE MCDONALD'S IS THERE AND DOWN THE STREET. SO WE THOUGHT, WELL, LET'S GET A LITTLE IDEA OURSELF OF WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT. SO WE TOOK PICTURES OF ALL OF VARIOUS BUSINESSES UP AND DOWN OUR SURROUNDING AREA AND HERE'S A FEW OF THEM. UH, PAGE 27 SMOKERS PARADISE, PAGE 28, PLANET FITNESS, THE AUTO SHOP, AND THEN THIS ANYTIME AUTO GROUP, WHICH IS, I THINK ONE OF THE CONCERNS WAS THAT OUR SIGNAGE EXTENDS TOO FAR ON THE FRONT OF OUR STORE. AND, UH, YOU CAN SEE THAT ANY TIME, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE OTHER STOR, UH, BUSINESSES THAT HAVE SIGNS THAT EXTEND THE ENTIRE WIDTH OF THEIR BUILDING AS WELL. MISSION BURIAL PARK. AND THEN THESE ARE JUST SOME ADDITIONAL SIGNS ON PAGE 32 THAT, YOU KNOW, JUST IS KIND OF WHAT IS SURROUNDING US, WHAT WE ARE LOOKING AT. AND YOU CAN, ON THE LITTLE MAP, YOU CAN KIND OF SEE WHERE WE ARE. SO ONE OF THE THINGS THAT, UH, IS [00:40:01] A CONCERN IS NOT JUST FOR BUSINESS, BUT FOR SAFETY IS THE LIGHTING. SO, UH, WHAT HAS HAPPENED, WHEN WE FIRST STARTED, IT WAS A PRETTY WELL LIT MILITARY WAS COMING FROM BROOKS CITY BASE AND YOU KNOW, THERE'S A LOT DOWN THERE, BUT THEN THERE'S A STRETCH WHERE A LOT OF THE BUSINESSES HAVE EITHER CLOSED OR, UH, IT'S KIND OF AUTO SHOPS AND THAT KIND OF THING. SO WHEN YOU'RE COMING FROM BROOKS, THERE'S JUST NOTHING, NOTHING, NOTHING. AND THEN, AND THEN, UH, SO THERE'S VERY LITTLE, AND I THINK THAT'S BEEN PART OF THE PROBLEM THAT WE FELT LIKE, UH, THE, YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT THAT SAFE FOR THE TRAFFIC. IT'S NOT THAT SAFE FOR, UH, PEOPLE COMING IN AND OUT. AND IT'S ALSO DIFFICULT FOR US 'CAUSE THEY DON'T SEE IT UNTIL THEY'RE ALREADY PAST IT. SO HERE'S WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE DRIVING WEST ON MILITARY DURING THE EVENING. SO YOU'RE COMING FROM BROOKS AND HEADING TO I 35. SO IT'S, IT'S, THIS IS 0.1 MILES AWAY. SO, YOU KNOW, EVEN WITH THE, THE LIGHTING THAT WE NOW HAVE THAT'S IN QUESTION, IT'S, IT'S NOT, YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT VERY EASY TO, TO SEE BECAUSE OF THE SURROUNDINGS. UH, SAME THING, WE'VE KIND OF OVERDONE IT ON ALL OF OUR SHOTS HERE, BUT YOU GET THE IDEA 482 FEET AWAY, STILL DRIVING. AND THEN EVEN WHEN YOU'RE 322 FEET AWAY, YOU DON'T SEE THAT. WELL, THAT'S THE PROBLEM WITH THE SIGN AS YOU PROPOSE IT, IS IT'S NOT JUST THE SIZE, IT'S THAT IT'S JUST DIFFICULT TO SEE. 'CAUSE IT'S ON THE LEFT SIDE AND IT'S, UH, AND WE'RE ALREADY BACK FROM THE STREET. SO THERE'S NOT, UH, IT WOULD, IT'S KIND OF A DIFFICULT, UH, UH, SIGN TO SEE TO EVEN IDENTIFY THE BUSINESS, WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE DRIVING EAST. SO HERE WE ARE, UM, AND YOU CAN SEE NOW, NOW WE'RE DRIVING FROM 35 OUTTA WALMART THE OTHER WAY. AND THERE'S, UH, SOME ISSUES THAT WE FELT LIKE WERE PART OF WHAT MOTIVATED US TO, UH, GET BUSY TRYING TO FIGURE OUT A, A WAY TO GET, BE MORE VISIBLE. THESE ARE JUST MORE LOOKS AT THAT. AND THAT'S REALLY IT. I, I APPRECIATE YOUR TIME THIS MORNING. I KNOW THAT YOUR JOBS AND YOUR AS, AS BOARD MEMBERS IS IMPORTANT TO PRESERVE THE INTEGRITY OF THE AREA. AND SO, UH, WE'VE ALWAYS FELT LIKE WE WANNA BE A BIG HELP TO THE SOUTH SIDE AS WELL, AND OUR CUSTOMERS AND OUR STAFF AND PROVIDE A GREAT EXPERIENCE. SO APPRECIATE YOUR, UH, CONSIDERATION AND I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS OR CONCERNS. THANK YOU. UH, QUESTIONS FROM THE COMMISSION. GREAT. THERE WE GO. UM, THANK YOU FOR THAT PRESENTATION AND FOR THE PRINT PRESENTATION. ALSO, A QUESTION FOR STAFF. THE POLE LIGHTING OUT AT THE STREET IS EXISTING, SO I'M ASSUMING THAT'S GRANDFATHERED OR, UM, PLACING A SIGN OVER THAT IS PERFECTLY FINE FOR THE TOP PORTION. YES. SO THE TOP PORTION IS CONSIDERED A REFACE UHHUH, YES. THE, IN THE, IN THE POLL SIGN EXISTING. SO THAT'S THE WORD REASE. YES. UM, BUT IT'S THE ADDITIONAL PIECES. TWO QUESTIONS QUESTION FOR YOUR SIGN COMPANY PERSON HAVING TO DO WITH, CAN YOU TALK ABOUT THE, HOW THIS SIGN IS CONSTRUCTED? 'CAUSE WE HAVE THE MAIN CURSIVE PORTION AND THEN WE HAVE THE PRINT BELOW IT, THE SUBTITLE, SUB CAPTIONS. AND THE SECOND QUESTION I HAVE FOR YOU IS TO EXPLAIN WHAT A SIGNAGE BROKER DOES AND HOW THAT FALLS INTO THE LINE OF RESPONSIBILITY AND CUSTODY OF THE PROJECT. THAT MAY NOT BE THE CORRECT TERM. OUR, OUR, WE HIRED THIS, UH, ONE MAN SHOP WHO DOES ALL OF OUR INTERNAL SIGNAGE. WE HAVE A LOT OF SIGNS INSIDE THE STORE. AND SO BASICALLY HE TOOK THE PROJECT AND CONTRACTED IT OUT WITH, UH, TONY'S COMPANY. BUT SOMEWHERE ALONG THE WAY, WHEREVER THE COMMUNICATION GOT DROPPED, THAT IS WHY WE FIND OURSELF HERE. . OKAY. SO TONY'S SHOP DID OR DID NOT PURSUE A PERMIT FOR THIS? YES. UH, MY UNDERSTANDING, SO MY UNDERSTANDING WITH THIS IS THAT, SIR, SIR, IDENTIFY YOURSELF PLEASE. OH, I'M SO SORRY. UH, MY NAME'S TONY SANCHEZ. I WORK FOR A COMPANY CALLED ECONOMY SCIENCE. UM, SO MY UNDERSTANDING WITH ALL THIS WAS THAT WE GOT, WE PURSUED A PERMIT AND IT WAS A PARTIAL APPROVAL. UM, SOMEWHERE ALONG THE LINES, THEY DROPPED THE BALL AND THEY DIDN'T READ IT CORRECTLY AND THEY WENT AHEAD AND INSTALLED EVERYTHING. UM, GO AHEAD. THEY BEING, OH, OURS, US, OKAY. THE, UM, THE ACTUAL INSTALL PART, UH, PORTION OF OUR COMPANY. OKAY. BECAUSE THERE A FABRICATION AND THEN INSTALL COMPANY SIDE. AND THEN AT WHAT POINT IN TIME WERE YOU NOTIFIED THAT? OR DID I DON'T, I THINK IT WAS A FEW DAYS. YOU DIDN'T HAVE A PERMIT AFTERWARDS? UH, WELL I KNOW THAT WE GOT A NOTICE AND I WAS LIKE, WELL, WE HAD ALREADY, YOU KNOW, PAID FOR THE PERMIT AND WE'RE [00:45:01] ASSUMING, AND WE GOT A NOTICE. I, I DIDN'T WORK WITH TONY, HE'S, BUT I DID WORK WITH, UH, JOSE THAT GOT THROUGH. BUT SO WE WERE TOLD NO, WE'RE GETTING THE PERMIT, UH, YOU KNOW, WE'RE GETTING IT, UH, RE RESOLVED AND WE SENT A $300, UH, LATE FEE, YOU KNOW, A FEE TO TAKE CARE OF THAT. BUT WE STILL DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT THE FACT THAT THE HISTORICAL COMMISSION NEEDED TO BE APPROVED. WE BEING ME THE OWNER, UH, WE DIDN'T KNOW THAT UNTIL SATURDAY. AND I'M NOT SURE WHEN, UH, YOUR COMPANY, I THINK THEY GOT A NOTE, OBVIOUSLY A NOTICE AT SOME POINT, RIGHT? BECAUSE BEFORE THAT, IF YOU DON'T PAY FOR YOUR PERMIT, YOU DON'T HAVE YOUR PERMIT. RIGHT. SO, SO THAT WOULD BE A SIGN. AND THE PERMIT WAS, MY UNDERSTANDING, UM, IS THAT THE PERMIT WAS PAID FOR, IT WAS JUST A PARTIAL APPROVAL, WHICH WAS THE REFACE, UM, THE ONE THAT WAS ALREADY THERE. AND THEN WHO WOULD'VE PAID FOR THAT PERMIT? UM, ECONOMY SIGNS WOULD'VE PAID FOR THE PERMIT ECONOMY SIGNS. OKAY, THANK YOU. THE OTHER THING, THE OTHER THING ABOUT THE REFACE, I'M SORRY, BUT THE, THERE WAS A SIGN IN TERMS OF WHAT'S GRANDFATHERED, THERE WAS ANOTHER SIGN THERE IN THE SECOND SLOT, WHICH IS, UH, WAS AN AUTO SIGN. SO THAT'S WHY WE THOUGHT IT WAS OKAY SINCE WE BOUGHT THE AREA THAT, THAT SIGN RELATED TO THAT WE COULD UTILIZE THAT SIGN AS WELL, BECAUSE NOW IT'S OUR SIGN. ANYWAY. SO, UM, I HAVE A COUPLE QUESTIONS FOR YOU. SO IN YOUR PRESENTATION, YOU, UM, GAVE EXAMPLES OF WALMART, BUSH'S CHICKEN, UM, AND THEN OF COURSE YOU PUT YOURS UP THERE AND YOU SHOWED, YOU KNOW, YOUR OTHER LOCATIONS. SO ONE FIRST QUESTION I HAVE IS THAT ABOUT THE HISTORIC, UM, AREA. 'CAUSE WE, AS YOU CAN IMAGINE, A LOT OF PEOPLE COME BEFORE US AND YOU KNOW, OH, I DIDN'T KNOW I WAS IN A HISTORIC DISTRICT. I DIDN'T KNOW I WAS IN A HISTORIC DISTRICT. SO, SO I, I WANNA HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT THAT. HOW DID YOU NOT KNOW THAT YOU WERE THERE TOO WHEN IT COMES TO THE WALMART SIGN THAT YOU, UM, ILLUSTRATED, THAT'S A BILLBOARD. SO THAT'S GOT IT. TOTALLY DIFFERENT. IS THE BUSHES SIGN A BILLBOARD BECAUSE NO, IT WASN'T, YEAH. 'CAUSE THAT'S A LARGE SIGN. IT'S JUST A, UM, IT'S ON A POLL. SO THAT ONE IS DIFFERENT. AND ALSO YOUR SIGN PROTRUDES ABOVE YOUR BUILDING, SO, YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU'RE LOOKING AT THE EXAMPLES THAT YOU GAVE TRUE THAT THEY'RE NOT REALLY TRUE EXAMPLES. SO I JUST REALLY, I WANNA ADDRESS THE VIOLATION FIRST BECAUSE THAT I, I DON'T GET THAT PART THERE. SO HELP ME WITH THAT. WELL, AND COMMISSIONERS, I'LL JUST ALSO ADD FOR INFORMATIONAL PURPOSES, THERE'S SORT OF A DOG LEG IN THE DISTRICT HERE, AND SO BUSHES AND WALMART AND SOME THINGS THAT ARE KIND OF CATTY-CORNERED FROM YOU ARE NOT IN THE DISTRICT. UM, THE SHOPPING CENTER THAT YOU, WITH THE PLANET FITNESS AND A FEW OTHER SIGNS THAT IS. AND SO THAT CAME AS A MASTER SIGNAGE PLAN. UM, JUST KNOW THAT SOME OF THE EXAMPLES ARE, SOME AREN'T. THANK YOU. GOOD MA'AM. SORRY. UM, WELL, IN TERMS OF NOT KNOWING, UH, I WOULDN'T SAY I THOUGHT THE PERMIT HAD COVERED ALL THAT WAS NECESSARY TO PUT THE SIGNS UP. SO I WASN'T SHOCKED THAT WE WERE ON THE EDGE OF THE HISTORICAL AREA BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, I KNOW WHERE THE MISSIONS ARE AND, BUT, UH, CERTAINLY WAS UNINTENTIONAL TO DO ANYTHING OUT IMPROPERLY. COMMISSIONER. OKAY, SIR. YES, A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS. UM, IF YOU COULD GO TO, UH, PHOTO EIGHT OF THE ORIGINAL SUBMITTAL, THAT ONE OR THE ONE BEFORE. UM, THERE WAS AN EXIST, OR SORRY, THE ONE AFTER THERE WAS AN EXISTING BEER AND ALL DRIVE THROUGH, SIGN ON THERE, THAT LOOKS LIKE IT'S SORT OF A LITTLE BIT OF AN AWNING. YES. YES. UM, WAS THAT INTERNALLY ILLUMINATED? YES, IT IS. OKAY. OR I MEAN, NOT WELL, BUT RIGHT. IT'S SUPER OLD. UH, DO YOU KNOW HOW MANY SQUARE FEET THAT PARTICULAR SIGN WAS? NO. SO IF THEY HAD COME, THIS IS A QUESTION FOR STAFF. IF THEY HAD COME TO BASICALLY REFACE, THAT AWNING SIGN, THAT WOULD'VE BEEN ADMINISTRATIVELY APPROVED. YEAH. SO, UM, FOR EXISTING SIGNAGE LIKE THAT, IF THEY WERE WANTING TO, UM, YOU KNOW, REMOVE THE AWNING FABRIC AND DO SOME TYPE OF ALTERNATIVE DESIGN, IT WOULD BE CONSIDERED A REASE. UM, BUT WE WOULD STILL USE THE HISTORIC DESIGN GUIDELINES TO INFORM STAFF ABOUT LIKE LIGHTING. OKAY. UH, COLOR USE, UM, THINGS OF THAT NATURE. OKAY. UM, ANOTHER QUESTION. THERE'S A, IT LOOKS LIKE A PAINTED SIGN ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE BUILDING IN THIS PHOTO, THE DRIVE THROUGH ON THE ABOVE, THE DRIVE THROUGH THE OL IT'S AL IT'S PAINTED. IT'S PAINTED, YES. IS THAT, DOES THAT HAVE LIGHTING ON IT? [00:50:01] YEAH, IT HAS THAT ONE LIGHT UP THERE THAT IS, IT'S EXTERNALLY LIT, EXTERNALLY LIT EXTERNAL. THERE'S NO LIGHTING. NO, NOT MUCH LIGHTING. YEAH. BUT IS THAT A SPOTLIGHT OR IS THAT, DOES THAT LIGHT FACE THE SIGN? IS THAT A I THINK IT'S KIND OF BOTH. IT LOOKS LIKE, UM, I DON'T THINK IT FIXES THE SIGN. I THINK IT DOESN'T FACE THE SIGN. I THINK SO THAT'S MORE A SECURITY LIGHT SIDE. IT'S OF A SEC. SEE WHAT HAPPENS IS WHEN THEY DRIVE, THEY DRIVE THROUGH THE FRONT AND AROUND AND COME BACK OUT AND, UM, IT CAN BE SUPER, UH, YOU KNOW, BUSY. SO WE TRY TO KEEP THAT LIGHT SO THAT PEOPLE CAN NAVIGATE AROUND THE BUILDING. RIGHT. AND, AND ALSO ANOTHER ANOTHER POINT THAT I WANTED TO MAKE IS THAT, UM, IT IS, I'M, SHE ALREADY MENTIONED IT, IT IS A LITTLE BIT RECESSED, BUT ALSO THE SPEED LIMIT ON MILITARY DRIVE, IT'S 45 MILES AN HOUR. UM, SO, YOU KNOW, THAT'S ANOTHER REASON WHY THEY WERE TRYING TO GET A LITTLE BIT BIGGER TO GET, MAKE IT MORE EASILY VISIBLE TO, UH, POTENTIAL CUSTOMERS COMING THROUGH OR WHATNOT. AND ALSO THE REASON FOR THE LIGHTING. UM, SO THEY COULD SEE IT A LOT EASIER WHILE THEY'RE PASSING BY. OKAY. AND THEN, UH, Y'ALL NOW OWN THE BUILDING BEHIND IT, IS THAT CORRECT? WE DO NOT OWN EITHER BUILDING. WE LEASE BOTH THE BUILDINGS FROM THE SAME LANDLORD. OKAY. WE WOULD LOVE TO OWN IT, BUT HE DOESN'T WANNA SELL. SURE. UM, SO IF ANOTHER QUESTION FOR STAFF, SINCE THAT WAS A SEPARATE BUSINESS AT ONE TIME BEHIND THEIR, UH, VERNAL MAIN DRIVE THROUGH AND IT HAD ITS OWN SIGN, WOULD THEY BE, SINCE THEY'RE NOW LEASING THE BUILDING BEHIND IT, WOULD THEY BE ALLOWED TO HAVE A SIGN FOR THAT, WHICH WOULD SORT OF COMPENSATE FOR WHAT THEY PUT ON THE, THE POLE SIGN SINCE IT IS A SEPARATE BUILDING? WELL, I, I MEAN THE, WITH THE SIGNAGE GUIDELINES TO SAY IS THAT, YOU KNOW, PER BUSINESS, IT ALLOWS ONE MAJOR, TWO MINOR SIGNS, UM, 50 TOTAL SQUARE FEET AND SUCH. UM, I, I BELIEVE THAT THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING AWARE IF THE APPLICANT WANTED TO PROPOSE ADDITIONAL SIGNAGE FOR TWO BUILDINGS ON THE SAME PROPERTY THAT ARE SAME BUSINESS, UM, YOU KNOW, WE WOULD LOOK THAT AT THAT AS A TEAM. BUT, UH, IT, IT WOULD LIKELY REQUIRE REVIEW BY THE HISTORIC AND DESIGNER VIEW COMMISSION. OKAY. THANK YOU. OTHER QUESTIONS, MR. CHAIR? MR. CHAIR, SO WE CAN GET INTO THE OTHER SIDE OF DIALOGUE. I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS. THANK YOU. FIRST AND FOREMOST. THERE A SECOND. SECOND. THANK YOU. IT'S BEEN MOVED AND PROPERLY. SECOND DISCUSSION. WELL, UH, PART OF THE DIFFICULTY OF IT IS THAT IT'S, UM, IT'S A, AT THIS POINT IT SEEMS THAT IT'S AN ISSUE BETWEEN THE SIGN COMPANY AND THE OWNER OF THE PROPERTY, RIGHT? SO THERE'S SOME RESOLUTION INSIDE OF ALL OF THAT THAT EXISTS. THAT'S AN OPPORTUNITY THAT HASN'T BEEN DISCUSSED, RIGHT? SO THAT'S SOMETHING THAT SHOULD BE ON THE TABLE. I THINK. UM, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT IS, IS ODD IS THE, IS THE SIZE OF THE SIGN COMPARED TO THE BUILDING. SO WE'RE LOOKING AT A 41 FOOT, SEEMS THAT IT'S ABOUT A 41 FOOT LONG SIGN. UH, AND THEN THE HEIGHT, UM, AND LOOKING AT THE BUILDING, IT, YOU KNOW, EVEN, EVEN LOOKING AT THE, AT THE, THE WAY THAT IT IS NOW, EVEN IF THE, IF THE BEER AND ALL WAS DROPPED, I MEAN THAT, I MEAN THERE'S, THERE'S ALL KINDS OF, OF SCENARIOS THAT SHOW THAT, THAT THERE ARE BETTER BALANCED OPPORTUNITIES HERE. UM, BUT, BUT CLEARLY THE WAY THE BUILDING HAS BEEN CLEANED UP, ASSIGNED, DONE THE RIGHT SIZE WOULD, WOULD GIVE THE SAME IMPACT. YOU'D, YOU KNOW, WOULD STILL BRING PEOPLE. AND IT'S A BUILDING. I'M, I MEAN, I'M VERY FAMILIAR WITH MILITARY DRIVE. IT'S IN THE DISTRICT OF, OF THE, OF THE AREA THAT I REPRESENT, RIGHT? OR THAT MY COUNCIL PERSON REPRESENTS. UM, ONE OF THE THINGS, UH, EXCUSE ME, BUT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE MIGHT CONSIDER, SO YOU SEE THAT OUR, AT OUR OTHER STORES, THERE'S THE DRIVE THROUGH MARGARITAS, AND THEN UNDERNEATH IT IS, WE MIGHT BE ABLE TO, CAN YOU EXPAND IT A LITTLE BIT OR NO? YOU, WE, YOU KNOW, THAT'S WHERE WE LIST SNACKS, CHIMO, LEMME SEE HERE, MARGARITAS DAIQUIRIS. THAT IS ANOTHER SEPARATE SIGN. YOU KNOW, IT KIND OF IS UNDERNEATH THAT SIGN. SO WHAT WE MIGHT BE ABLE TO DO IS REMOVE, YOU KNOW, WE WOULD JUST GIVE THAT UP AND MOVE DOWN THE SIGN IF THAT WOULD BE ACCEPTABLE. WELL, MY, IN TERMS OF A CRITICISM, IT IS JUST THIS A GIGANTIC SIGN. I MEAN, IT'S, IT'S FORCED THERE AND IT'S ALMOST ALL SIGN. AND I UNDERSTAND THAT. LIKE, IF I WAS, IF I WAS SELLING SOMETHING, I'D, YOU KNOW, I'D WANT IT TO BE, IF I SOLD UMBRELLAS, I'D LIKE A BIG THING THAT SAYS I SELL UMBRELLAS. YOU KNOW, SO EVERYBODY KNOWS THESE ARE UMBRELLAS. [00:55:01] BUT, UM, I DON'T KNOW THAT THAT'S NECESSARY BECAUSE THE PEOPLE IN THE AREA, THEY KNOW WHAT HAPPENS THERE. THEY, THEY, THEY KNOW WHAT'S SOLD THERE. THAT'S THE GENERAL MARKET IS THE PEOPLE THAT ARE ON MILITARY DRIVE. UM, WELL, WE DO HAVE, SO IT JUST SEEMS, YEAH, I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. YOU HAVE THE SIGN THAT FACES THE STREET AS WELL, UH, THAT'S TURNED. UH, SO THERE'S A LOT OF GREAT OPPORTUNITY FOR THERE TO BE BALANCED. BUT THIS, THIS SIGN IS JUST GIGANTIC. I MEAN, FOR, FOR CONSIDERING WHAT THE, WHAT THE GUIDELINES ARE. THIS GOES WAY BEYOND THE GUIDELINE TO JUDGE. I'LL PASS IT OVER TO FELLOW COMMISSIONERS. THANK YOU. OTHER QUESTIONS? I MEAN, DISCUSSION? YES. YES. UM, THERE'S TWO PARTS TO THIS. ONE. YOU KNOW, IT'S BEEN MENTIONED THAT THE VIOLATION, RIGHT, ALL OF US HERE ON THIS COMMISSION DON'T LIKE THE VIOLATION PERIOD. UM, AND I DO AGREE WITH MY COMMISSIONER, FELLOW COMMISSIONER HERE, THAT THAT SIGN IS, IS PRETTY BIG. BUT WHEN YOU ZOOM OUT AND YOU LOOK AT THAT SIGN IN THE CONTEXT OF THE REST OF THE TRAFFIC AND THE REST OF THE BUILDINGS IN THAT, IN THAT ZONE OR IN THAT STREET THERE, I, I, I, IT DEFINITELY EXCEEDS THE GUIDELINES, BUT, BUT, AND I DON'T THINK IT EXCEEDS THE SURROUNDING AREA DESIGN FEATURES OR LIGHTING, UH, COMPETITION THAT YOU HAVE THERE. I, I DON'T THINK IT EXCEEDS THAT BY MUCH. IT IS STILL A BIG SIGN, BUT, UM, I MEAN, LOOK AT WHAT YOU'RE, WHAT YOU'RE COMPETING WITH ON, ON MILITARY DRIVE. I MEAN, IT'S ALL LIGHTS AND SIGNS. I MEAN, THERE USED TO BE A BIG COWBOY WAVING THERE WITH A SIGN ON ONE OF THOSE CAR DEALERSHIPS. I THINK HE'S GONE NOW, BUT, SO I, I SEE WHERE YOU'RE COMING FROM. I, I THINK THE SIGN MIGHT BE A LITTLE TOO BIG, BUT I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S THAT MUCH OUT OF PLACE IN THE SURROUNDINGS. THANK YOU. UM, ONE MOMENT. GO AHEAD, MA'AM. UH, THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. UM, MY THOUGHTS ON THIS IS YES, THE, OBVIOUSLY THE SIGN IS TOO BIG AND, YOU KNOW, TOP HEAVY ON A SMALL BUILDING, BUT THAT ASIDE, YOUR LOCATION IS REALLY KEY TO UNDERSTANDING. YOU'RE ON THE EDGE OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. YOU'RE JUST A SLIVER OR JUST A PORTION, BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT'S BACKING UP TO THE SAN ANTONIO RIVER. MM-HMM . FLOODPLAIN, RIGHT. THE FLOODWAY AND THE FLOODPLAIN PARKS. THE CEMETERIES. AND THAT EXPLAINS THE, YOUR, YOUR OBSERVATION OF GOING EASTWARD AND NOTICING THAT THERE'S NOTHING THERE. WELL, THERE ARE THINGS THERE, THERE ARE SMALL BUSINESSES, SMALL BUILDINGS THAT WERE THERE. UM, BUT I'M GUESSING THEY'RE NOT REDEVELOPING BECAUSE OF THEIR LOCATION IN THE FLOODPLAIN. UM, SO THAT HAS TO BE TAKEN INTO ACCOUNT ALSO AS ONE DRIVES. THAT WAY YOU ARE ENTERING THE ZONE OF THE PARKS AND OF THE MISSION TRAIL AND OF THE RIVER BED. AND IT NATURALLY WILL, YOU KNOW, SURRENDER ITSELF FROM THIS CRAZY COMPETITION OF SUBURBAN LIGHTING AND SIGNAGE INTO SOMETHING VERY DIFFERENT. AND I THINK THAT'S THE INTENT OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT, IS TO BE ABLE TO PRESERVE THAT. AND SO WHEN YOU TRAVEL FROM ONE TO THE OTHER, UM, YOU WANNA KNOW THAT, AND THIS IS WHERE I HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT WHAT YOU'VE, UM, PRESENTED. SO, UM, ON THE BACK OF MY HEAD, I'M THINKING MAYBE THIS IS SOMETHING FROM A DESIGN STANDPOINT THAT COULD BE ADDRESSED WITH A DRC ALSO OR AS ANOTHER OPTION. BUT I'LL JUST THROW THAT OUT THERE. A DESIGN REVIEW COMMITTEE. THANK YOU COMMISSIONER, MISS ZUKA. SURE. THIS, THIS BRINGS ALL KINDS OF CONFLICTS TO MY HEAD. UM, I'VE BEEN ON MILITARY DRIVE AND IT IS A CAR ORIENTED STREET. UM, I REMEMBER AN OBSCURE BOOK, LEARNING FROM LAS VEGAS WHERE THE ARGUMENT IS MADE FOR, UM, SEEING THINGS FROM THE VANTAGE POINT OF YOUR CAR AND BEING ABLE TO RECOGNIZE AN IDENTIFIABLE SIGN. AND I KNOW THAT'S WHAT Y'ALL WANTED TO DO, BUT IT IS IN CONTRAST TO THE AIMS THAT COMMISSIONER, UH, SAVINO JUST MENTIONED THAT IT'S, THIS IS A HISTORIC DISTRICT. SO I'M OFTEN AT ODDS WITH THAT MYSELF. BUT, UM, I WOULD BE, UH, BE IN AGREEMENT WITH AS PROPOSED THE, THE WHAT YOU'VE PROPOSED. BUT, UM, I THINK A DESIGN, UH, REVIEW MIGHT BE A GOOD THING TO CONSIDER. UH, THERE MIGHT BE OTHER WAYS OF DOING THE VERY SIMILAR THING WITH THE SIMILAR RESULTS THAT IS NOT TAKING DOWN THE SIGN, BUT MAYBE CHANGING A LITTLE BIT. YEAH. IF YOU CONSIDER THAT. UM, AND, AND EVEN, UM, AS, AS WE PROPOSED, UM, MAYBE DROPPING THE SIGN OR, UM, I'M NOT SURE IF THIS WOULD BE FEASIBLE, BUT ADDING A FACADE OVER. SO DOES IT SEEM LIKE IT'S OVER THE BUILDING ANYMORE? UM, BEHIND THE SIGN? UM, BUT YEAH, THERE'S ALL KINDS OF THINGS WE, WE, WE CAN DO TO, TO GET IT DONE. ONE OF THE REASONS, LIKE I SAID EARLIER, THE, THE, [01:00:01] JUST THE SPEED OF TRAFFIC. UM, IF YOU DON'T SEE IT WITH ENOUGH TIME, YOU'RE EITHER GONNA PASS IT UP OR YOU'RE GONNA TRY TO GET IN THERE AND IT'S GONNA BE A LITTLE BIT, UH, DANGEROUS FOR, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE, UH, THAT ARE TRYING TO GO IN OR, OR PEOPLE BEHIND YOU OR WHATNOT. UM, SO THAT WAS THE IDEA BEHIND THE CONCEPT OF A LITTLE BIT BIGGER SIGN. I'VE BEEN ON THAT STREET. YEAH. IT'S CRAZY. I KNOW. YEAH, IT'S PRETTY CRAZY. WE'VE SPENT A LOT OF MONEY ON SECURITY, JUST WAVING PEOPLE IN AND OUT. SO, AND UNFORTUNATELY WE'VE HAD, WE'VE PUT UP ALL OF, ALL OF THE SIGNAGE, SO IT'S JUST REALLY LIKE, WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE AND HOW DO WE, UH, YOU KNOW, HOW DO WE, UH, MAYBE MAKE A REVISION OR WE, OUR OTHER TWO STORE, THE SIGNS ARE UP EVERYWHERE, BUT, UM, YES, WE CAN LISTEN TO ANY RECOMMENDATIONS, TRY TO, SO, UM, I AM, I'M SYMPATHETIC TO, UM, WHAT YOU WERE MENTIONING AS FAR AS WHERE YOU'RE LOCATED AND BEING AT NIGHT AND NOT BEING ABLE TO SEE. BUT THE, THE ISSUE THAT, UM, PLAGUES YOU, THE REASON WHY YOU'RE HERE IS BECAUSE YOU'RE IN A HISTORIC AREA. AND THEN, SO I KNOW THAT THESE SIGNS ARE ON YOUR OTHER BUILDINGS, BUT THEY'RE NOT NO, I UNDERSTAND. IN, IN THAT AREA. AND THE, THE VIOLATION ITSELF, THAT, THAT REALLY STICKS WITH ME BECAUSE, UM, WE HAVE TO FIND A WAY, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, I UNDERSTAND THE MONEY'S BEEN SPENT AND THINGS OF NATURE, BUT IT'S, IT'S NEITHER HERE OR THERE, UNFORTUNATELY, BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE TO COME TO SOME TYPE OF UNDERSTANDING OR SOME TYPE OF AGREEMENT IN THIS. SO I THINK THAT WHAT COMMISSIONER SABINO SUGGESTED IS THE DESIGN REVIEW, UM, MEETING, UM, COMMITTEE MEETING, YOU KNOW, WHICH WILL HELP SEE IF WE CAN COME TO SOME TYPE OF UNDERSTANDING THERE, BECAUSE THE, THIS IS NOT A WORD, BUT THIS IS GINORMOUS AND IT JUST DOESN'T, YOU KNOW, FIT, YOU KNOW, THE, THE DESIGN GUIDELINES FOR THE AREA. SO, UM, THAT WOULD, I MEAN, YOU CAN REQUEST THAT AT ANY TIME. AND, AND WELL, MAYBE OUR, UH, FELLOW COMMISSIONS MAY SUGGEST THAT IN AMENDED MOTION, BUT THAT PROBABLY WOULD BE VERY HELPFUL FOR YOU, YOU KNOW, FOR THE DESIGN MEETING. SO, THANK YOU. OTHER DISCUSSION, MR. CHAIR? SURE. IF THE MOTION ADDED A REQUEST FOR A DESIGN, A REVIEW, UM, A DRC, DO YOU STILL CALL IT DRC? RIGHT. IT'S A DESIGN REVIEW COMMITTEE. UH, BUT I, YOU KNOW, I, I JUST WANT TO BE, YOU KNOW, UH, VERY, UH, UM, TRANSPARENT ABOUT IT. UM, I IMAGINE THE DISTRICTS THAT WE'RE ALL IN, UM, WE KNOW OUR DISTRICTS VERY WELL, SO, YOU KNOW, AND, AND I DON'T, YOU KNOW, I DON'T NECESSARILY SAY I TAKE OFFENSE, BUT LIKE MILITARY DRIVE IS A VERY IMPORTANT STREET. IT'S NOT A WIDE STREET. IT'S NOT A LONG STREET. IT'S MILITARY DRIVE. IT LINKS OUR, OUR AIR FORCE BASES. IT'S AN IMPORTANT STREET. AND AS IT GOES TO THE RIVER, IT CHANGES, ITS, ITS CONTEXT. THE APPLICANT DOESN'T OWN THE BUILDING, SO THAT MEANS POSSIBLY THAT THEY DON'T HAVE THE BUILDING, SOMEONE ELSE HAS IT. THEY HAVE A SIGN THAT BIG, AND THEN THEY GO BACK AND THEY WANNA MAKE A REPLACEMENT OF A SIGN. AND THERE'S THAT EXISTING SQUARE FOOTAGE THAT'S THERE. WHETHER OR NOT IT HAS TO ADHERE TO THE REGULATION AT THAT TIME, OR WHETHER OR NOT THEY HAVE A KIND HDRC THAT SAYS, NO, WE WILL OF RESPECT THE SQUARE FOOTAGE AND VOTE BASED ON THAT. AND LET'S SAY AT THAT TIME, IT'S A VAPE SHOP, YOU KNOW? UM, SO THE, SO THERE, THERE'S A LOT OF REASON, I THINK, TO, TO REALLY LOOK AT, NOT THAT THIS SIGN IS A LITTLE BIG, BUT THIS SIGN GOES WAY BEYOND. AND IT, AND IT ALSO HAS THE SIGN THAT'S BEER AND ALL, AND THEN IT HAS A SENTENCE OF SOMETHING THAT THEY DO, WHICH IS DRIVE THROUGH MARGARITAS, AND THEN IT ADDS MARGARITAS, DAIQUIRIS, MICADA SHOTS, AND CHAMOIS SNACKS, RIGHT? SO THIS IS NOT JUST, THIS IS THE MENU, YOU KNOW, SO, SO IT SEEMS THAT THIS, THIS IS A REALLY NICELY DESIGNED BUILDING. IT HAS THE TWO GARAGE DOORS, AND THEN THERE'S AMPLE SPACE FOR THERE TO BE WELL DESIGNED SIGNAGE THAT'S LIT, THAT GETS THAT ATTENTION. AND THEN AT THE SAME TIME, IT, IT BRINGS BALANCE TO THIS ENVIRONMENT. IT PROBABLY ENHANCES IT MUCH BETTER THAN, THAN, THAN A COMMON PERSON MIGHT THINK. THAT'S NOT A DESIGNER. SO IT IS FOR DESIGN REVIEW COM COMMITTEE, I THINK THAT, THAT THE APPLICANT SHOULD ALSO KNOW GOING INTO THAT, THAT THERE'S A POSSIBILITY THAT THERE'S NOT MUCH THAT'S GONNA RESOLVE HOW FAR OVER THE SQUARE FOOTAGE THIS SIGN WENT. I JUST, YOU KNOW, JUST WANT TO BE, YOU KNOW, TRANSPARENT ABOUT IT. I DON'T WANT TO CREATE ANY FALSE, UH, EXPECTATIONS, UH, BECAUSE IT TO, TO ME, IT'S JUST A GIGANTIC SIGN, YOU KNOW? THANK, THANK YOU COMMISSIONER SNO. UM, YEAH, RESPOND TO THAT. MAYBE WE CAN HAVE OUR CAKE AND EAT IT TOO. PERHAPS. UM, SHOULD THE REQUEST BE DENIED, UM, THE APPLICANT CAN RETURN WITH A NEW DESIGN AND WE CAN START WITH A DRC IN THAT WAY. SO THAT [01:05:01] MIGHT SOLVE A NUMBER OF THESE CONCERNS. UNDERSTOOD, BECAUSE I, I UNDERSTOOD. AGREE WITH YOU. I HAVE A QUESTION, MR. CHAIR. GO AHEAD, SIR. HOW MODULAR IS THAT SIGN THAT YOU HAVE UP THERE? WHAT DO YOU MEAN? UM, AS FAR AS TAKING APART? YEP. UM, SO THE BOTTOM CAN BE TAKEN OFF. MM-HMM . ALL THE BOTTOM CAN BE TAKEN OFF. UM, SO WITH REGARDS TO THE, UH, HOW DO I DO THIS ? SORRY. SO THE, THE DRIVE THROUGH IS ONE PIECE. YEAH, I THINK THE DRIVE THROUGH IS ONE PIECE. UM, BUT THE BOTTOM, THE TMO SNACKS, UH, THE MI THE SHOTS, THINGS LIKE THAT, UM, WE CAN REMOVE THAT IF, IF THAT'LL HELP. UH, UH, SO WE WOULDN'T HAVE TO COMPLETELY MAKE A WHOLE NEW SIGN OR WHATNOT. THE MAR THE DRIVE THROUGH AND THE MARGARITAS, IT LOOKS LIKE THERE'S TWO DIFFERENT SIGNS, RIGHT? AND THEN YOU HAVE THE BEER AND ALL. I THINK ONCE WE REMOVE THE BOTTOM PARTS OF THE SIGN, WE CAN ACTUALLY DROP IT. IF GOING OVER THE, THE BUILDING OR FACADE IS A, YOU KNOW, IS POINT OF CONTENTION, WE CAN DROP THAT. AND I THINK WE HAVE AMPLE SPACE TO DO SO AND ALSO DROP THE BE A BEER AT ALL. UM, SO WE DON'T HAVE TO GO INTO THE WHOLE FABRICATION OF THE WHOLE NEW SIGN AND, AND GET THE EXPENDITURES OF THAT THING. BUT, UM, WE, WE CAN DEFINITELY DO THAT. BUT YES, UH, WE CAN, WE CAN TAKE OFF THE MICELLA SHOTS, MARGARITAS, DAIQUIRIS AND ASPECT OF IT. SO TAKE THE MENU OFF. THANK YOU, COMMISSIONER, PASTOR. YES. AT THIS POINT AND LISTENING TO EVERYTHING THAT'S BEEN SAID, AND I WOULD BE IN SUPPORT OF THE ORIGINAL MOTION, WHICH IS DENYING THE APPLICATION AND THEN, UH, REQUESTING THAT, UM, Y'ALL COME BACK WITH A REVISED SIGNAGE PLAN FOR THE BUILDING, UH, TAKING INTO ACCOUNT THE, UH, THE FACT THAT IT IS IN HISTORIC DISTRICT, THAT THERE ARE GUIDELINES AND WORKING WITH STAFF TO, UH, CLARIFY OR ANSWER YOUR QUESTIONS AS TO, UH, WHAT THE GUIDELINES ARE FOR, FOR THE, UH, DISTRICT. THE MOTION ON IS APPROVAL WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS, IS WHAT THE MOTION IS, I BELIEVE? YES. YEAH, THAT'S THE MOTION. SO WE WOULD, THE, THE, THE MOTION IS TO APPROVE SIGNAGE. IS TO APPROVE SIGNAGE WITHIN THE PARAMETERS THAT STAFF RECOMMENDS. OKAY. SO AS THEY'VE, AS THEY'VE OUTLINED IT. OKAY. SO STAFF RECOMMENDED DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL, BUT YOUR MOTION IS TO RECOMMENDING APPROVAL WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS, IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING? NO, THE WAY THAT IT'S WRITTEN STAFF IS RECOMMENDING APPROVAL WITH THEIR STIPULATION STAFF DOES NOT, DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL. STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL. OH, YEAH. AND THEN THEY LIST SEVERAL, UM, MODIFICATIONS THAT WOULD BE REQUIRED FOR THEM TO COME. OKAY. WELL, I WOULD AMEND MY MOTION TO, TO, TO BE, AS STAFF HAS WRITTEN. UH, SHE JUST, BUT I WOULD THINK IT'S THE SAME THING. EITHER WAY, IT IT AMOUNTS TO THE SAME THING, BUT, BUT YES, AS STAFF RECOMMENDS IS WHAT MY MOTION IS. SO LET ME BE CLEAR. SO STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL. SO IS YOUR MOTION THE SAME THAT YOU DID NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL? I, I WOULD AMEND IT TO, TO, TO SAY IT THE WAY THAT STAFF IS SAYING IT, ALTHOUGH I DO LIKE IT BETTER THE WAY THAT I SAID IT, BECAUSE IT MEANS THAT THEY HAVE A SIGN THAT'S APPROVED, BUT THEY HAVE TO MAKE IT MEET THE REQUIREMENTS OF STAFF, BUT THE OTHER WAY AROUND, THEN IT'S A DENIAL. THEN THEY ACTUALLY HAVE A DENIAL AND THEY HAVE TO COME BACK. EITHER WAY, I JUST LIKE IT CLEANER WITH THEM HAVING AN APPROVAL, SO THEY KNOW THEY'VE GOT A SIGN, BUT IT HAS TO CONFORM. OKAY. SO I'M, I'D RATHER, YEAH, SO I'M NOT GOING TO, YOU KNOW, MAKE YOU OR ASK YOU TO CHANGE YOUR MOTION. I JUST WANNA BE CLEAR SO WE KNOW WHAT WE'RE ABOUT TO VOTE ON. SO, SO YOUR RECOMMENDATION, RESTATE YOUR MOTION SO WE CAN MAKE SURE WE'RE CLEAR AND THEN WE KNOW WHICH WAY WE'RE GONNA GO ON THIS VOTE. UH, OKAY, LET ME SAY I RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF SIGNAGE CONFORMING TO STAFF STIPULATIONS. I MEAN, I MAKE MOTION. WELL, OKAY. IT'S EASIER FOR ME JUST TO MAKE A RECOMMENDATION AS STAFF, UH, UH, MOTION TO NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL. I THINK WHAT WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS, WHICH IS A LITTLE WEIRD. EXCUSE ME, ME, I JUMP IN. I THINK WHAT'S ODD ABOUT THIS IS TYPICALLY THIS IS NOT HOW IT'S WORDED. IT'S USUALLY WORDED STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL. SHOULD THE COMMISSION CHOOSE TO APPROVE THE SIGN, THE FOLLOWING MODIFICATIONS AND STIPULATIONS FALL INTO PLACE. SO THAT'S WHERE IT'S A LITTLE ODD. YEAH. SO WE ARE BASICALLY APPROVING IT, BUT WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS LEGAL, DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? I MEAN, DOES THAT FALL IN, BECAUSE YOU, YOU'RE ALL RIGHT. OKAY. AS I UNDERSTAND IT, APPROVAL WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS IS EFFECTIVELY A DENIAL OF THE REQUEST UNTIL [01:10:01] THEY MEET STAFF STIPULATIONS, THEN THAT SIGNAGE IS APPROVED. THANK YOU FOR CLARIFICATION. SO, UM, FURTHER DISCUSSION, I RAISE, IS EVERYONE CLEAR ON THE MOTION AS IT STANDS? THIS MOTION? SO I GUESS YOU HAVE A STATEMENT, SIR. I QUESTION AND, AND OTHER TIMES Y'ALL HAVE SAID MOVE TO ACCEPT STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS, AND THAT'S ALSO THE SAME THING. OKAY. THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT I MEAN. SO WITH THIS, WHAT ARE THEIR OPTIONS WITH COMING TO A DRC WITH WHAT'S WRITTEN ON THIS? THAT'S WHY THEY, HERE, THEY WILL ALWAYS HAVE THAT OPTION TO, IF THEY WANT TO USE THE DRC AS A TOOL TO EVALUATE A REVISED DESIGN, UM, THAT WOULD BE AFTER TODAY'S ACTION. UM, I WILL NOTE THAT, I'M SORRY I'M SO LOUD. , WE DO NEED ACTION ON THIS ITEM DUE TO THE 60 DAY PERIOD. AND SO A REFERRAL TO DRC IS NOT AN OPTION. IT WOULD BE AUTOMATICALLY APPROVED AFTER THAT. SO, I'M SORRY, GO AHEAD, SIR. I WAS GONNA SAY, SO TO GET A DRC, WE'D HAVE TO, UH, STRIKE THIS MOTION. DISAPPROVE THIS MOTION. NO, UM, I'M SAYING SO, UM, THAT IF YOU REALLY WANTED A DRC TO HAPPEN, YOU COULD ENCOURAGE THEM TO RETURN TO YOU WITH A REVISED DESIGN TO SHOW HOW THEY'RE MEETING THE STIPULATIONS. I THINK IF EVERYBODY WAS HAPPY THAT IT WAS MOVING TOWARDS THE STIPULATIONS, YOU PROBABLY WOULDN'T NEED TO SEE IT IN A DRC. UM, BUT WHAT I WANTED TO POINT OUT IS THAT A MOTION THAT WAS SOLELY REFERRAL TO DRC OR A CONTINUANCE WOULD NOT BE ACCEPTABLE BECAUSE IT WOULD EXCEED THE 60 DAY, UH, PERIOD FOR ACTION ON THIS ITEM. UM, CAN MR. CHAIR SIR, GO AHEAD, SIR. MAYBE THIS IS HELPFUL. CAN I JUST MAKE A SUBSTITUTE MOTION WE'LL ENTERTAIN THAT. GO AHEAD, SIR. GO AHEAD. I, UH, SUBSTITUTE MOTION TO DENY THE APPLICATION SECOND. SO I, BEFORE YOU GIVE A SECOND, SO I WANNA BE CLEAR 'CAUSE I'M, I THINK THAT WE WERE ON THE PATH WHERE WE WERE. IF WE WENT AND DECIDED, YOU KNOW, BASED ON WHAT STAFF RECOMMENDED HERE, THAT THAT WOULD, IF IF IT PASSES, THEN IT WOULD BASICALLY BE A DENIAL ANYWAY, CORRECT? IT'S SIMILAR. UM, THEY WOULD STILL NEED TO RETURN TO STAFF WITH WHAT THEY ARE PROPOSING FOR SIGNAGE. THEY SEE WHAT THE PREVIOUS RECOMMENDATIONS FROM STAFF WERE, SO THEY CAN GO AHEAD AND INCORPORATE THAT. UM, BUT THIS SENDS A PRETTY CLEAR MESSAGE THAT THEY WOULD HAVE TO REVISE, UM, IN ORDER TO GET THAT COA, UM, EITHER WAY WITH THE PREVIOUS MOTION, UM, TO ACCEPT STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS, THERE WOULD HAVE TO BE REVISION TO MEET THOSE. SO CAN I ASK A QUESTION? THE, THE TWO STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS, I THINK ONE INVOLVED THE STREET SIGN, THE SECOND PART OF IT THAT WE, AND THEN THE OTHER WAS THE STORE SIGN. SO, UM, DOES THIS APPLY TO BOTH THOSE OR ARE WE, ARE WE SURE THAT IT WOULD BE, OR THE STREET SIGN WOULD BE ACCEPTABLE SINCE IT REPLACED UH, A SIGN THAT LEAVES THE BACK SPOT? YES MA'AM. WE WOULD STILL APPROVE THE REFACE PORTION. ADMINISTRATIVELY. OKAY. SO YOUR MOTION, UM, FOR DENIAL, DO YOU WANT KEEP GOING FORWARD WITH THAT? COULD WE NEED TO GET A SECOND? I WOULD, I THOUGHT, I THOUGHT I HEARD COMMISSIONER FETZER SECOND IT, BUT I'M, I'M THOUGHT I DID. OKAY. ALRIGHT. I WAS, I SORRY, I DIDN'T HEAR THAT PART. SO IT'S BEEN MOVED AND PROPERLY SECOND FOR THIS SUBSTITUTE MOTION. SO NOW WE WILL VOTE ON THE SUBSTITUTE MOTION. SO MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE? CASTILLO? AYE. SAVINO? AYE. VELAZQUEZ AYE. GALLOWAY AYE. ZUKA AYE. COMMISSIONER GRU IS NO LONGER HERE. UH, CERVANTES? YES. HOLLAND. AYE. FE AYE. AND GIBBS? AYE. MOTION CARRIES. MOTION CARRIES. SO, UM, WE'RE GOOD SINCE, UM, IT WAS A DENIAL SO WE DON'T NEED TO GO BACK TO THE ORIGINAL MOTION, CORRECT? CORRECT. THAT THAT WAS SUCCESSFUL. UM, AND SO TO CLARIFY, UM, WE WILL NOT ISSUE A COA AS IT'S BEEN DESIGNED. IT'LL HAVE TO BE REVISED. YOU HAVE THE PREVIOUS RECOMMENDATION TO CONSIDER. THEN AS MENTIONED, YOU ALSO HAVE THE SUBCOMMITTEE OF THE DRC, UM, THAT YOU CAN UTILIZE TO GET FEEDBACK, UM, FOR AN ALTERNATE PROPOSAL. UM, EITHER WAY BRIAN CAN HELP YOU WITH THOSE DETAILS AND FUTURE DATES. IS THERE A TIMEFRAME? I MEAN, ON HOW LONG WE HAVE TO GET THE REVISED PLANS? UM, IT'S UP TO YOU. UH, WE WILL WORK WITH YOU ON THAT COMPLIANCE, UH, TIMELINE SINCE IT IS ALREADY INSTALLED, BUT, UH, NOTHING IS SET IN STONE AT THIS TIME. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. THAT WAS THE LAST CASE ON THE AGENDA, SO WE ARE ADJOURNED. THANK YOU EVERYONE. MERRY CHRISTMAS. HAPPY HOLIDAYS. THANK YOU. * This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.