[00:00:01]
[Roll Call]
HISTORIC AND DESIGN REVIEW COMMISSION FOR WEDNESDAY, OCTOBER 2ND.MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE? FERNANDEZ FISH.
HARRIS VELAZQUEZ MARTINEZ FLORES.
UM, WE HAVE TRANSLATION SERVICES AVAILABLE FOR THE MEETING.
UM, WE'RE GONNA PLAY A QUICK VIDEO.
[Chairman’s Statement]
HISTORIC AND DESIGN REVIEW COMMISSION IS AN ADVISORY BOARD APPOINTED BY THE CITY COUNCIL.I'M JEFFREY FETZER, CHAIRMAN AND VICE-CHAIR OF SCOTT CARPENTER.
IT IS A FUNCTION OF THE COMMISSION TO ADVISE THE CITY MANAGER AND ALL RELEVANT CITY DEPARTMENTS CONCERNING ALL APPLICATIONS FOR PERMITS FOR PROPERTIES IN HISTORIC DISTRICTS FOR LANDMARKS ON CITY PROPERTY AND THE RIVER IMPROVEMENT OVERLAY.
IN CONSIDERING WHETHER TO RECOMMEND APPROVAL OR DISAPPROVAL OF AN APPLICATION FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS, MISSION WILL BE GUIDED BY THE CITY'S UNIFIED DEVELOPMENT CODE AND DECIDE AND GUIDELINES AND STANDARDS THAT HAVE BEEN ADOPTED BY CITY COUNCIL.
AN APPEAL OF A DECISION BY AN ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL CAN BE FILED IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE CITY'S UNIFIED DEVELOPMENT CODE.
IF ANYONE PRESENT WISHES TO SPEAK IN FAVOR OF OR IN OPPOSITION TO ANY ITEM ON TODAY'S AGENDA, PLEASE SIGN UP ON THE CITIZENS TO BE HEARD SHEET.
IT IS NOT NECESSARY TO SIGN UP.
IF YOU ARE THE OWNER OF A REPRESENTATIVE FOR A PROJECT ON THE AGENDA, YOU'LL BE CALLED ON AS THE CASE IS CALLED.
CASE REPRESENTATIVES WILL BE GIVEN NO MORE THAN 20 MINUTES TO PRESENT THEIR CASE WITH AN ADDITIONAL THREE MINUTES TO RESPOND TO PUBLIC COMMENTS.
SPEAKERS FOUR OR OPPOSED TO A CASE WILL BE LIMITED TO THREE MINUTES EACH CITIZENS MAY ALSO SIGN UP TO YIELD THEIR THREE MINUTES TO ANOTHER SPEAKER WHO HAS SIGNED UP.
ANYONE WHO IS YIELDING THEIR TIME MUST BE PRESENT AT THE TIME THE SPEAKER IS CALLED UPON.
SPEAKERS WILL BE CALLED UPON IN THE ORDER IN WHICH THEY ARE SIGNED UP FOLLOWING PUBLIC TESTIMONY.
ANY COMMISSIONER MAY CALL UPON ANY SPEAKER TO RESPOND TO FURTHER QUESTIONS.
APPROVAL BY THE COMMISSION DOES NOT TAKE THE PLACE OF ANY TYPE OF PERMIT.
PERMITS MUST BE OBTAINED FOR ALL WORK.
CERTIFICATES OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR WORK APPROVED BY THE COMMISSION WILL BE EMAILED TO YOU WITHIN 10 DAYS.
NO WORK OF ANY TYPE IS TO BE STARTED WITHOUT OBTAINING THE APPROPRIATE CITY PERMITS.
AFTER A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS HAS BEEN ISSUED BY THE OFFICE OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION THIS TIME, PLEASE SILENCE YOUR CELL PHONES.
[Announcements]
YOU.UM, WE DO HAVE A COUPLE OF ANNOUNCEMENTS.
UM, THE NEXT INSTALLMENT OF THE HISTORIC RUN CREW, UM, IS HALLOWEEN THEMED.
IT'S A TOUR OF THE EAST SIDE CEMETERIES.
UM, WE'RE PARTNERING WITH LOCAL VOLUNTEERS WHO, UM, DRESS IN, UM, COSTUMES OF SOME OF THE FOLKS THAT ARE BURIED AT THE EAST SIDE CEMETERY.
AND SO IT'S INTERACTIVE, UM, AND IT'S FUN.
UM, THE COST IS $10, UM, AND PARTICIPANTS, UM, ARE ENCOURAGED TO WEAR COSTUMES.
UM, SO IT'S GONNA BE 9:00 AM ON OCTOBER 19TH AT FAIRCHILD PARK.
AND AGAIN, IT'S THE EAST SIDE CEMETERIES.
AND WE ALSO DO HAVE A STAFF ANNOUNCEMENT.
UM, WE HAVE A NEW HISTORIC PRESERVATION SPECIALIST THAT'S BEEN HIRED AND WE'LL BE WORKING WITH THE H C R C, RACHEL ADA.
UM, SHE'S BACK HERE IN THE PINK.
UM, SO WE WELCOME HER TO THE CREW.
UM, WE DON'T HAVE ANY CITIZENS THAT BE HEARD ON GENERAL ITEMS AND SO WE'RE WELCOME TO LOOK AT THE, UM,
['A' CONSENT AGENDA]
CONSENT AGENDA.UM, FOR A ITEMS, WE HAVE A ITEMS A ONE THROUGH A SIX ON CONSENT.
DO WE HAVE ANY CITIZENS? NO CITIZENS ARE SIGNED IN.
FOR THOSE ITEMS, I MOVE ITEM ONE A, ONE A, 2, 3, 4, 5, AND A SIX.
YOUR'RE ON THE CONSENT AGENDA.
SO AD ONE 12 EAST PECAN TWO 12 COLLEGE 3 0 1 EAST HOUSTON, THREE 18 WEST HOUSTON AND FIVE 14 WEST VALS.
YOU DO NOT JUST STAY FOR THE REMAINDER OF THIS HEARING.
IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, PLEASE CONTACT A MEMBER OF STAFF.
YOUR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS OR COMMISSION ACTION LETTER WILL BE PREPARED AND EMAILED TO YOU WITHIN 10 DAYS.
IF YOU HAVE NOT YET RETURNED THE PUBLIC NOTICE, YARD SIGN PLACED ON THE PROPERTY, PLEASE DO SO AT THE O H P COUNTER ON THE FIRST FLOOR.
[A-7 19-7336 Address/Description: 2015 BROADWAY HDRC Case No.: 2019-549 RIO District: RIO-1 Applicant: Ashley Schriedel/Alamo Sign Solutions Request: Signage City Council Dist.: 1]
AGENDA ITEM A SEVEN H D R C, CASE NUMBER 20 19 5 49 20 15 BROADWAY.THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO ONE INSTALL, ONE WALL MOUNTED CABINET SIGNED TO FEATURE AND OVERALL WIDTH OF 13 FEET NINE INCHES.
AND AN OVERALL HEIGHT OF THREE FEET, SEVEN
[00:05:01]
INCHES FOR A TOTAL SIZE OF 49.27 SQUARE FEET.THE PROPOSED SIGN WILL FEATURE A VINYL FACE AND INTERNAL ILLUMINATION TO AND INSTALL ONE VINYL GRAPHIC ON THE PRIMARY ENTRANCE TO FEATURE 24 INCHES IN WIDTH AND SEVEN INCHES IN HEIGHT.
FOR AN OVERALL SIZE OF APPROXIMATELY ONE SQUARE FOOT, STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL BASED ON FINDINGS A AND B WITH THE STIPULATION THAT ONLY THE PROPOSED LOGO AND LETTERING SHOULD BE ILLUMINATED AND THAT THE REMAINDER OF THE BLACK VINYL FACE SHOULD NOT BE ILLUMINATED TO AVOID PRODUCING A GLARE.
UH, DO YOU HAVE COMMENTS ON, UH, OR RESPONSE TO STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS SIGN? UH, THE BLACK BACKGROUND, UM, IS REALLY JUST A SOLID PIECE OF METAL WHERE THE LETTERS ARE KIND OF ATTACHED TO SO IT WON'T BE LIT UP.
ONLY THE LETTERS AND THE LOGO WILL BE LIT.
THAT ESSENTIALLY MATCHES WHAT STAFF IS RECOMMENDING.
STAFF SIMPLY DIDN'T RECEIVE CLARIFICATION FROM THE APPLICANT THAT THAT WAS THE CASE.
SECOND MOTION AND A SECOND TO APPROVE.
[A-8 19-7436 Address/Description: 726 S SANTA ROSA HDRC Case No.: 2019-564 Applicant: Ashley Schriedel/Alamo Sign Solutions Request: Signage City Council Dist.: 1]
AGENDA ITEM A EIGHT H D R C CASE NUMBER 20 19 5 64 7 26 SOUTH SANTA ROSA.THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO INSTALL A CABINET WALL SIGN ON THE FRONT FACADE OF THE EXISTING STRUCTURE.
THE PROPOSED SIGNAGE WILL FEATURE A HEIGHT OF FOUR FEET AND A WIDTH OF EIGHT FEET FOR A TOTAL SIZE OF 32 SQUARE FEET.
THE PROPOSED SIGNAGE WILL FEATURE A WHITE ACRYLIC FACE, BLUE LETTERING AND INTERNAL ILLUMINATION.
STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL BASED ON FINDINGS A AND B WITH THE STIPULATION THAT THE PROPOSED SIGN FEATURE OF BLUE FACE WITH WHITE LETTERING WHERE ONLY THE WHITE LETTERING IS ILLUMINATED AT NIGHT.
THE BLUE FACE, THE BLUE, EXCUSE ME, THE BLUE SIGNAGE FACE SHOULD BE OPAQUE.
THE APPLICANT HERE PLEASE, UM, INTRODUCE YOURSELF, PLEASE.
I, I'M BRIAN LU WITH BRASFIELD AND GORY.
SO THAT IS OUR SIGN THEY'RE PUTTING UP.
I WAS HOPING THEY'D HAVE A PICTURE UP AS IT'S SITTING ON.
SO OUR MARKETING DEPARTMENT IS WHO PUTS OUT THIS AND THIS IS OUR STANDARD MARKETING BRASSFIELD AND GORY FOR OUR SIGNS THAT WE PUT UP ON BUILDINGS.
AND WE HAVE INVERSE COLORS, BUT NOT FOR SIGNAGE THAT GOES UP ON BUILDINGS LIKE THIS.
AND SO, UM, IT'S JUST A FLAT SIGN AND IT IS BACKLIT, BUT IT, WE DON'T HAVE TO BACKLIGHT IT, IT, WE CAN JUST LEAVE IT UNPLUGGED.
UH, WE ALREADY HAVE THE SIGN AS THAT IS RIGHT THERE.
WE HAVE NOT INSTALLED IT BECAUSE WE DIDN'T REALIZE THAT THE INVERSE COLORS WERE GONNA BE AN ISSUE, BUT IT IS SITTING, READY, READY TO GO UP.
FROM A STAFF STANDPOINT, THE OVERALL SIZE AND LOCATIONS APPROPRIATE, OUR PRIMARY CONCERN IS REGARDING THE, UH, PRODUCTION OF A GLOW FROM LIGHTING, WHICH THE U D C SAYS TO AVOID.
UM, SO IF THE APPLICANT WANTED TO SELF-IMPOSE THAT THE SIGN WOULD BE NON ILLUMINATED STAFF WOULD GENERALLY BE OKAY WITH THAT.
MOTION TO APPROVE WITH A STIPULATION THAT HAS NO ILLUMINATION.
[A-9 19-7400 Address/Description: 4007 S FLORES ST/202 PLEASANTON RD (Toudouze Building) HDRC Case No.: 2019-508 Applicant: Office of Historic Preservation Request: Finding of Historic Significance City Council Dist.: 3]
AGENDA ITEM A NINE H D R C CASE NUMBER 2019 DASH 5 0 8 4,007 SOUTH FLORES STREET.THE OFFICE OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION IS REQUESTING A FINDING OF HISTORIC SIGNIFICANCE FOR THE PROPERTY LOCATED AT 4,007.
SOUTH FLORES STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF A FINDING OF HISTORIC SIGNIFICANCE AND THAT THE HISTORIC AND DESIGN REVIEW COMMISSION SHOULD RECOMMEND APPROVAL FOR THE LANDMARK ME SIR, WE'LL CALL YOU UP HERE IN A MOMENT.
AS THE PROPERTY OWNER STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF A FINDING OF HISTORIC SIGNIFICANCE AND THAT THE HISTORIC AND DESIGN REVIEW COMMISSION SHOULD RECOMMEND APPROVAL FOR THE LANDMARK DESIGNATION OF 4,007 SOUTH FLORES TO THE ZONING COMMISSION AND TO THE CITY COUNCIL BASED ON FINDINGS A THROUGH F.
I'M, UH, JENNY HAY, THE SCOUTS A PROGRAM MANAGER.
UM, WE'RE ACTUALLY GONNA BE REQUESTING A CONTINUANCE FOR THIS CASE.
SIR, WE'RE GONNA CALL YOU UP IN JUST A MINUTE.
WE WE'RE GONNA WE'LL CALL YOU UP IN JUST A MOMENT, SIR, WE'RE GOING TO BE REQUESTING A CONTINUANCE FOR THIS CASE UNTIL
[00:10:01]
THE NEXT HEARING.THERE ARE, UM, IN ADDITION TO THE PROPERTY OWNER, THERE ARE TWO CITIZENS TO BE HEARD WHO HAVE SIGNED UP TO SPEAK TODAY.
UM, WE DON'T HAVE ANY OBJECTION TO ALLOWING THOSE PEOPLE TO, UM, TO SHARE THE INFORMATION THAT THEY CAME TO SHARE TODAY.
UM, BUT AGAIN, WE'D LIKE TO REQUEST A CONTINUANCE UNTIL THE NEXT MEETING.
WOULD WE LIKE TO HAVE THE PROPERTY OWNER UP RIGHT NOW? YES.
AND THEN CITIZENS TO BE HEARD.
WOULD YOU LIKE TO APPROACH THE PODIUM? VERY FIRST THING YOU SAW TODAY, RIGHT THERE? A NINE.
IT REFERENCES PROPERTY 4 0 0 7 NORTH FLORES SLASH 2 0 2 PLEASANTON.
PLEASANTON HAS NEVER BEEN DESIGNATED AS PART OF THE APPLICATION PROCESS.
THIS PROPERTY RIGHT HERE, NOT THIS ONE.
AND IT'S OWNED BY A DIFFERENT OWNER.
SO THIS IS STAFF TRYING TO BACKDOOR SOME RESTRICTIONS ON A PROPERTY THAT THEY'RE NOT EVEN TELLING ME ABOUT, WHICH I THINK STAFF, STAFF SHOULD BE SANCTIONED FOR.
THAT THE APPLICATION ON ITSELF IS FLAWED.
SECONDLY, THE U D C REQUIRES FOR THIS PROCESS TO BE INITIATIVE THAT THERE BE AN APPLICATION.
I'VE NEVER SEEN AN APPLICATION.
SO CAN STAFF PRESENT THE APPLICATION? SIR, CAN YOU PLEASE SPEAK INTO THE MICROPHONE FOR THE RECORD AND THE STAFF PR PRESENT IT US WITH THE APPLICATION? UM, SIR, WE, WE WILL BE HAPPY TO VERIFY THE ADDRESS QUESTION THAT YOU RAISED AND BUT AS, AS JENNY STATED, WE ARE REQUESTING A CONTINUANCE.
SO THIS ITEM ISN'T GOING TO BE HEARD TODAY.
NO, WELL WE, THE STAFF HAS ALREADY REQUESTED A CONTINUANCE AND, AND I'M GONNA ASK THEM TO VOTE, NOT CONTINUE IT.
BUT I WANNA ASK YOU IS WHERE'S THE APPLICATION? WE HAVE AN APPLICATION.
I'M JUST ASKING, IS THERE AN APP FORMAL APPLICATION THAT WAS FILED? SIR, LET ME SAY AGAIN, WE'RE REQUESTING A CONTINUANCE.
THIS ITEM ISN'T GOING TO BE VOTED ON TODAY.
WHAT WHAT'S GOING ON HERE IS THEY DON'T HAVE AN APPLICATION, WHICH MEANS THE PROCESS CAN'T BEGIN.
THEY DON'T GET THE RIGHT TO THEN GO START AN APPLICATION AND BACKDATE IT TO, TO MEET THE CODE.
IT HAS TO BE INITIATED BY AN APPLICATION.
EVEN A HISTORIC COMMISSION WANTS TO DO IT THEMSELVES.
THEY STILL HAVE TO FILE THE APPLICATION.
AND I SIMPLY WANNA SEE THE APPLICATION.
YOU HAVE AN APPLICATION, YOU DON'T HAVE ONE, DO YOU STAFF CAN PROVIDE THAT.
SO THAT'S WHAT WE HAVE ON THE SCREEN.
MOTION TO MOVE FOR CONTINUANCE? NO.
DO THEY? DO YOU HAVE AN APPLICATION OR NOT? MOTION AND A SECOND FOR CONTINUANCE.
I DESERVE THE RIGHT IF THEY DON'T HAVE AN APPLICATION, THIS PROCESS IS FLAWED.
SO DO YOU HAVE AN APPLICATION? THAT'S ALL I'M ASKING.
DO YOU HAVE AN APPLICATION? POINT OF ORDER ACTION HAS BEEN TAKEN.
DO YOU HAVE AN APPLICATION? THE FACT SHE CAN'T PRODUCE IT, SIR, I'D BE HAPPY TO TALK WITH YOU OUT IN THE HALLWAY.
NO, THEY DON'T HAVE THE APPLICATION ON THE NEXT ITEM, WHICH MEANS THE PROCESS IS FLAWED.
BUT WE HAVE PASSED ON A CONTINUANCE ON THIS IF YOU WOULD TALK, I DON'T WANT A CONTINUANCE.
I WANNA BE HEARD TODAY, BUT WE'VE UH, PASSED IT A CONTINUANCE ON THIS CASE.
SO BASICALLY THEY DIDN'T FALL PRO PROCEDURE, SO THEY WANT A SECOND CHANCE TO, TO DO SOMETHING THEY SHOULD HAVE DONE IN THE FIRST PLACE.
Y'ALL ARE ALLOWING THEM TO DO IT ALL.
THIS IS A DIRECT VIOLATION OF MY DUE PROCESS RIGHTS UNDER BOTH STATE AND FEDERAL LAW.
SO BEFORE WE CAN EVEN START THIS PROCESS, THEY NEED TO AGREE THEY'RE GONNA COMPLY WITH THE PROCESS.
THE PROCESS IS IT NOT ME? THIS U D C HISTORIC HAS TO FILE AN APPLICATION.
WHERE IS IT? THEY WILL GET IT FOR YOU SIR.
NO, THEY DON'T GET TO GET IT POST FACT.
THEY CAME HERE TODAY TO START A PROCESS AND THEY DON'T EVEN HAVE THE APPLICATION TO START THE PROCESS.
THEY'RE TRYING TO ZONE OTHER PROPERTY THAT I DON'T EVEN OWN.
THIS WHOLE THING IS BASICALLY, BUT A DISGUISED ZONING CASE, WHICH IS UNETHICAL AND AGAINST STATE LAW.
I'M HERE, I'M READY TO ARGUE ALL THE POINTS AND I FEEL IT'S MY RIGHT TO BE HEARD.
THE APPLICATION WAS PUT IN BY THE OFFICE OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION.
OKAY, WHERE IS THE APPLICATION? AND THEY HAVE REQUESTED A CONTINUANCE, WHICH WE HAVE VOTED ON AND APPROVED.
WHERE IS THE APPLICATION? THAT'S ALL I WANNA SEE.
AS I MENTIONED, I'M HAPPY TO TALK WITH YOU ABOUT THIS IN THE HALLWAY.
THE APPLICATION IS POSTED ONLINE AND IT IS AVAILABLE TO BE, WE WE'RE MORE THAN HAPPY TO PRINT THE STATEMENT OF SIGNIFICANCE AND THE, THE REQUEST FOR A FINDING OF HISTORIC SIGNIFICANCE FOR YOU.
SO YOU, YOU'VE SENT THIS TO ME, WHICH INCLUDE CONCLUDES ALL THIS INFORMATION, BUT YOU NEVER SENT ME THE APPLICATION.
[00:15:01]
THIS DOES NOT SAY APPLICATION.YOU WON'T EVEN FOLLOW YOUR OWN RULES, THEN YOU TRY AND ZONE OTHER OF MY PROPERTIES SIMPLY TO BACKDOOR ME.
OKAY? UM, MR. CHAIRMAN, ALL COMPLETELY FAILED.
THE PROCESS WOULD SUGGEST THAT YOU ALL MOVE ON TO THE, TO THE NEXT ITEM.
STAFF ISN'T, NEEDS TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.
THIS DOES NOT SAY APPLICATION.
AND IT'S VERY CLEAR IN THE ORDINANCES THAT THERE HAS TO BE AN APPLICATION AND YOU HAVE FIVE DAYS FOR THE DIRECTOR TO APPROVE THE APPLICATION.
WHERE'S THE LETTER FROM THE DIRECTOR APPROVING THE APPLICATION.
CHAIRMAN, DO WE MOVE TO ADJOURN? WE CAN, WE CALL TO SEE THOSE DOCUMENTS WE HAVE COMPLETED WITH, UH, AGENDA A.
THE NEXT AGENDA ITEMS B WILL UH, START AT FOUR 30.
SO WE ARE TEMPORARILY ADJOURNED.
I'D LIKE TO CALL TO ORDER, UH, THE HISTORIC AND DESIGN REVIEW COMMISSION FOR OCTOBER 2ND, 2019.
WE DO HAVE TRANSLATION SERVICES AVAILABLE FOR THE MEETING.
UM, WE HAVE A QUICK VIDEO WE'RE GONNA PLAY WELL.
I UM, WOULD YOU LIKE THE LIGHTS ON, UM, TO THE TRANSLATORS? CAN YOU FLIP ON THE LIGHT SWITCH PLEASE? THANK YOU.
UM, OKAY, ANOTHER ITEM OF BUSINESS BEFORE WE PROCEED.
UM, WE DO HAVE A RECUSAL OF THE CHAIR FOR AN ITEM ON THE CONSENT AGENDA.
SO, UM, WE WILL NEED AND WE ALSO HAVE, UM, ABSENCE OF OUR VICE CHAIR TODAY.
UM, SO FOR THAT RECUSAL, WE'LL NEED TO ELECT AN ACTING VICE CHAIR.
AND SO I'LL TAKE NOMINATIONS AT THIS TIME.
THERE'S A SECOND FROM MR. LACOON.
UM, WE DO HAVE A COUPLE OF CITIZENS TO BE HEARD ON GENERAL ADAMS, SO I'LL CALL THEM UP TO SPEAK AT THIS TIME.
THIS IS REGARDING THREE 17 WIX.
THE KING WILLIAM ASSOCIATION ARCHITECTURAL ADVISORY COMMITTEE REVIEWED THIS PROJECT AND STAFF FINDINGS.
WE CONCUR WITH THE RECOMMENDATION TO APPROVE THE REQUEST FOR STIPULATIONS.
HOWEVER, WE DID SEE THAT THE PERGOLAS STRUCTURE NOTED OVER THE DRIVEWAY WAS NOT INCLUDED IN THE APPLICATION OR DISCUSSED BY STAFF.
IF IT IS THE APPLICANT'S INTENT TO CONSTRUCT A PERGOLA, THE DESIGN SHOULD BE SUBMITTED FOR APPROVAL.
ADDITIONALLY, WE REQUEST THAT THE DRIVEWAY BE A RIBBON TYPE DRIVE TO LESSEN THE IMPACT OF STORMWATER RUNOFF.
BARBARA GARCIA, GOOD AFTERNOON.
I LIVE AT 9 32 NORTH PINE STREET, INDIGNITY HILL.
THE DITY HILL NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION'S NEIGHBORHOOD DEVELOPMENT ADVISORY COMMITTEE HAS REVIEWED THE PROPOSAL SUBMITTED FOR TODAY'S CASES.
THE D H N A BOARD OF DIRECTORS CONCURS WITH THE FOLLOWING RECOMMENDATIONS.
THE OFFICIAL D H N A LETTER IS IN THE CASE FILES AND IS SIGNED BY THE DH A'S PRESIDENT.
IN CONSIDERATION OF EVERYONE'S TIME, WE HAVE CONSOLIDATED OUR ASSESSMENTS AND COMMENTS AS FOLLOWS.
FIRST CASE NUMBER 2019 DASH FIVE 50 FOR THREE 19 BURLESON, WE SUPPORT THIS PROJECT AS PRESENTED AND THE N A C WOULD ALSO LIKE TO ACKNOWLEDGE THE APPLICANT FOR MEETING WITH OUR COMMITTEE IN REGARDS TO THE PROJECT CASE NUMBER 2019 DASH 4 4 9 FOR FIVE 19.
NOLAN WE SUPPORT THE CASE AS PRESENTED.
CASE NUMBER 2019 DASH 5 26 FOR 10 12 DAWSON, WE SUPPORT THIS PROJECT WITH STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS.
THE ONE CONCERN N DECK HAS WITH THE WINDOWS C ON THE REAR ADDITION, WHICH IS LABELED AS A FIXED WINDOW ON THE APPLICANT'S DOCUMENTATION.
AND THE LAST ONE IS CASE NUMBER 2019 DASH FOUR 80 FOR FOUR 15 NORTH MESQUITE STREET AND 1 0 5 THROUGH ONE 13 BROWN STREET.
[00:20:01]
EITHER SUPPORT OR OPPOSE THE PROJECT UNTIL THE APPLICANT HAS PRESENTED TO A FULL D H N A MEETING PER OUR COMMITTEE STANDARD OPERATING PROCEDURES.THE DECK DOES, DOES NOTE THAT THE APPLICANT DID REACH OUT AND MEET WITH THE DECK COMMITTEE PRIOR TO CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL AS A PROJECT CURRENTLY STANDS THE END DECK WOULD LIKE TO ACKNOWLEDGE THE APPLICANT'S MODIFICATIONS AND REVISIONS ON THE PROJECT.
HOWEVER WE AGREE WITH STAFF FINDINGS ON THIS CASE.
UM, SO NOW LET'S DRAW OUR ATTENTION TO THE ITEMS
['B' ITEMS CONSENT AGENDA]
ON THE SCREEN.UM, WE HAVE A CONSENT AGENDA WITH, UM, 19 ITEMS WITH SOME CHANGES.
UM, ITEM B THREE IS GONNA BE MOVED TO INDIVIDUAL AT THE REQUEST OF THE APPLICANT.
UM, WE ALSO HAVE A CITIZEN BE HEARD FOR ITEMS B FOUR AND B 10.
UM, COMMISSIONER, UM, PROFESSOR'S RECUSING HIMSELF FOR ITEM B 15.
UM, SO THAT'LL REMAIN ON CONSENT AGENDA SINCE HE HAS LEFT THE ROOM.
APPROVE THE CONSENT AGENDA THAT DOES THAT INCLUDE STAFF'S STIPULATIONS WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS.
THOSE OPPOSED THE OPPOSITE SIGN.
YOUR ON THE CONSENT AGENDA AND YOUR ADDRESS IS FIVE 19 NOLAN ONE 20 CALLAHAN 2 0 9 MADISON THREE 17 WIX 4 0 8 DIVINE.
1115 WEST KINGS HIGHWAY 16,000 HICKORY WELLS DRIVE.
5 0 5 EAST TRAVIS 3 0 1 WEST MAGNOLIA 1 0 7 WEST CRAIG PLACE, ONE 19 WEST MAGNOLIA 2 22 ADAMS 2 68.
THE RAIN AND 3 35 WEST GRAMERCY.
YOUR CASE HAS BEEN APPROVED AND YOU DO NOT NEED TO STAY FOR THE REMAINDER OF THIS HEARING.
IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, PLEASE CONTACT A MEMBER OF STAFF.
YOUR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS OR COMMISSION ACTION LETTER WILL BE PREPARED AND EMAILED TO YOU WITHIN 10 DAYS.
IF YOU HAVE NOT YET RETURNED THE PUBLIC NOTICE, YARD SIGN PLACED ON YOUR PROPERTY, PLEASE DO SO AT THE O H P COUNTER ON THE FIRST FLOOR.
NOW WE'RE GONNA GO SLIGHTLY OUT OF ORDER,
[B-27 19-7372 Address/Description: 302 ADAMS ST HDRC Case No.: 2019-544 Landmark Name: Meerscheidt, Paul / Davis - House Historic District Name: King William Applicant: Daniel Sexton/Buffalo Contracting Services Request: Installation of rear concrete parking pad City Council Dist.: 1]
SO BEAR WITH ME.UM, WE HAVE ITEM B 27, WHICH IS 3 0 2 ADAMS. UM, THE APPLICANT HAS AGREED TO STAFF STIPULATIONS AND SO WE WOULD LIKE TO TAKE ACTION ON THAT EARLIER IN THE AGENDA SO THEY DON'T HAVE TO WAIT.
UM, CAN WE HAVE THE APPLICANT UP AT THIS TIME? HELLO? DANIEL BUFFALO.
CONTRACTING HERE FOR MY CLIENT AT 3 0 2 ADAMS. AND, UM, Y'ALL HAVE AGREED TO ALL OF STAFF STIPULATIONS, CORRECT.
WOULDN'T MOVE FOR APPROVAL WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS.
[B-3 19-7448 Address/Description: 323 LEIGH ST HDRC Case No.: 2019-574 Historic District Name: Lavaca Applicant: Desiree Williams/ProSource Wholesale Request: Window replacement City Council Dist.: 1]
ITEM B THREE H T R C CASE NUMBER 2019 DASH FOUR SEVEN.THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO REPLACE NINE ONE OVER NONE.
ONE OVER ONE WOOD WINDOWS WITH NEW WINDOWS.
UM, STAFF IS RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF THE WINDOW REPLACEMENT.
THE APPLICANT WOULD LIKE TO ADVOCATE FOR ALUMINUM CLAD WOOD WINDOWS IN LIEU OF FOLEY WOOD.
HOW ARE Y'ALL TODAY? INTRODUCE YOURSELF PLEASE.
ERIC PEREZ WITH SCENERY, DOORS AND WINDOWS.
IS THAT ON A SITE PLAN THAT THOSE, UH, BENIGN WINDOWS ARE KIND OF LIKE THE FRONT AND THE FRONT TWO SIDES? YES MA'AM.
SO BASICALLY WHAT IT IS, IT'S A, UM, PELLA LIFE LIFESTYLE NEW WINDOW.
IT MEETS ALL THE CRITERIA, THE STYLES, THE DEPTH.
IF WE, I KNOW Y'ALL PROVE THAT, BUT I KNOW THERE WAS A STIPULATION IN THERE THAT YOU WANTED US TO GO AHEAD AND GO USE ALL WOOD.
THE ALL WOOD WINDOW DOES NOT MEET THE REQUIREMENTS THAT ARE ON THE SITE, NOR DOES THE MARVIN WINDOW.
SO THAT'S WHY WE CHOOSE, THAT'S WHY WE CHOSE THE COLLAB WINDOW.
'CAUSE IT MEETS EVERY GUIDELINE.
UM, THE APPLICANT IS PROPOSING TO RESTORE THE FRONT FOUR WINDOWS.
SO THE WINDOWS THAT THEY WOULD BE REPLACING ARE ALL ON THE SIDE.
UM, AGAIN, STAFF IS RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF THE REPLACEMENT.
IT'S JUST A MATTER OF THE CLADDING.
PULL UP THE SITE PLAN SO YOU CAN TELL US WHAT NUMBERS THOSE WINDOWS.
SO NUMBERS 5, 6, 7, AND EIGHT WILL BE RESTORED.
[00:25:04]
ABOUT THE WINDOWS ON THE BACK? ARE THOSE WOOD? NO, MA'AM.ACTUALLY, THE BACK OF THE HOUSE I ALREADY HAD PREVIOUSLY, UH, ACQUIRED NEW WINDOWS BY SOMEBODY ELSE.
SO THE HISTORIC WOOD WINDOWS THAT ARE INTACT ARE BEING RESTORED.
AND THE CLAD WINDOW IS PROPOSED REPLACEMENT FOR NON-ORIGINAL WINDOWS THAT ARE NOT CURRENTLY WOOD? NO.
SO THE WINDOWS ON THE SIDE ON THIS SITE PLAN ARE ORIGINAL WOOD WINDOWS.
STAFF HAS FOUND THAT THEY'RE ELIGIBLE FOR REPLACEMENT BECAUSE THEY'VE BEEN REPAIRED, THEY'VE BEEN ALTERED INAPPROPRIATELY, UM, OVER THE YEARS.
SO THEY'RE ELIGIBLE FOR REPLACEMENT.
UM, THE ONLY CONCERN IS THE FULLY WOOD VERSUS CLAD WOOD ON THE ADDITION.
YOU ALREADY HAVE, YOU ALREADY HAVE ALUMINUM WINDOWS ALL ALUMINUM? NO MA'AM.
DO CLAD WITH WOOD? NEW CLAD WITH WOOD? YES, MA'AM.
I THINK BASED ON THE LOCATION OF THESE AND THE FACT THAT YOU ALREADY HAVE THE ALUMINUM CLOUD, WOULD I, I THINK IT WOULD MAKE SENSE IN THIS SITUATION, BUT I WOULD DEFER TO MY, UH, OTHER COMMISSIONERS.
I THINK THAT, UH, THEY OFFER A GOOD IMPROVEMENT TO, TO THE INTERIOR ATMOSPHERE, UH, ADD FOR PERMANENCE IN THE WINDOW.
CAN YOU, CAN YOU DESCRIBE THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN, UH, YOU SAID THAT THE WOOD WINDOWS DON'T MEET THE REQUIREMENTS.
CAN YOU, UH, BASICALLY THE YES SIR.
THE BA THE STYLES ARE A LOT THICKER THAN WHAT IS ORIGINALLY.
SO IF WE DO AN AL WOOD WINDOW, THE SIGHT LINE, THE SET, UH, THE MEDIAN, THE MEDIAN BAR AND THE SIGHT LINE IS GONNA BE A LOT THICKER THAN THE REST OF THEM ON THE, ON THE HOUSE.
AND IF YOU WERE LOOKING AT THE HOUSE AT A 45, YOU WOULD KNOW JUST THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE ALWOOD WINDOW AND THE WINDOW THAT ARE, YOU WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO SEE IT.
BUT IF YOU WERE TO WALK AROUND THE HOUSE, THE CLAD WINDOWS ARE ACTUALLY LOOK MORE TRADITIONAL LIKE THE WINDOWS ARE IN THE HOUSE NOW.
SO THE CLAD WINDOWS ARE NOT MEETING OUR REQUIREMENTS? NO.
THE CLAD WINDOWS MEET THE REQUIREMENTS.
THE ALL WOOD WINDOWS DOES NOT.
I THINK THE APPLICANT IS STATING THAT THE, UM, OUR STIPULATIONS REGARDING, UH, DIMENSIONS CAN BE MET BY THE CLOUD PRODUCT.
UM, BUT WE JUST ADVOCATE FOR A FULLY WOOD WINDOW.
I MEAN, OUR GUIDELINES DO STAY, WE PREFER WOOD OR REPLACE, YOU KNOW, REPLACE WITH THE SAME MATERIAL.
AND THAT'S WHAT THIS IS BASED ON.
UM, I THINK I COULD SUPPORT, UM, COMMISSIONER BOWMAN'S JUST, UM, ALSO BECAUSE OF WHAT'S ALREADY EXISTING, UM, AND THE FACT THAT YOU'RE RESTORING THE FRONT, UM, I WOULD JUST MAKE SURE THAT THE FRONT WINDOWS ARE NOT GONNA BE REPLACED BASED ON, ON THIS.
I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO, UH, APPROVE WITH ALL OF STAFF STIPULATIONS.
UH, WITH A CAVEAT THAT, UM, THE ALUMINUM CLOUD WOOD WINDOWS CAN BE APPROVED FOR THE FOUR SIDE, UH, WINDOW LOCATIONS.
UM, MAKING SURE THAT THE FOUR FRONT WINDOW LOCATIONS ARE TO BE, UH, REPAIRED IN PLACE.
IT'D BE FOUR ON EACH SIDE 'CAUSE THERE'S A TOTAL OF EIGHT REPLACEMENTS AND THE FOUR IN THE FRONT ARE TO BE RESTORED.
[B-4 19-7340 Address/Description: 162 GREENLAWN HDRC Case No.: 2019-547 Historic District Name: Greenlawn Estates Applicant: TRINIDAD LOUIS A & LINDA F Request: Construction of a rear addition City Council Dist.: 1]
THANKS.THIS ITEM B 4 1 62 GREEN LAWN.
UM, THERE ARE CITIZENS THAT BE HEARD OF WITH THIS CASE.
WALTON WINSELL DEAR MEMBERS, UM, I'M WALTON WINSELL.
I'M, UH, HAVE A PROPERTY ON GREEN LAWN AND GONE TO, UH, LARGE.
OR CAN YOU MAKE SURE YOU, YOU'RE SPEAKING TO THE MIC.
UH, HOW MUCH TIME WOULD I HAVE? THREE MINUTES.
THAT'S WHAT HAPPENED AT THE ORIGINAL HEARING.
I'M HERE TO OPPOSE THE DESIGNATION OF HISTORIC DISTRICT.
WE HAVEN'T RECEIVED ANY NOTICES.
UH, THE, UH, PERIOD HAS LAPSED.
[00:30:02]
THEN IT SHOWED THE FOLLOWING CASE, UH, CITIZENS APPEARED TO SPEAK.AND THEN THE, UH, ZONING, UH, COUNCIL PASSED IT UNANIMOUSLY.
THERE'S FROM THE, UH, ZONING, UH, BOARD THAT, UH, THERE'S OPPOSITION EVEN THEY DIDN'T APPROVE IT.
SO, UH, THE OTHER ISSUE WAS THIS, UH, ISSUE OF THE BALLOT TEAM.
DOES ANYONE KNOW THAT? NOT BY MAIL BUT BY HAND.
THIS IS CALLED BALLOT STUFFING.
SO THIS IS HOW THEY HAVE THE UNUSUALLY HIGH 75%.
DOESN'T THAT PUT YOU ON NOTICE? THERE'S SOMETHING WRONG.
MAYBE YOU GET TWO OR THREE BALLOTS IN THE MAIL.
75% THESE WERE HAND DELIVERED.
UH, IS THAT ENOUGH? DO I KEEP GOING? WE HAVE THREE MINUTES.
YOU HAVE MORE TIME, SIR? MORE TIME? OKAY, WE'LL LET YOU KNOW.
OKAY, SO THESE ARE SOME OF THE ISSUES.
OH, ANOTHER LITTLE ISSUE IF I MAY.
HERE'S MY NOTICE TO THE CITY COUNCIL HEARING.
FEBRUARY 20TH, MY MAIL WAS PIFER PILFER.
THIS WAS TAKEN OUT OF MY MAILBOX.
I DID NOT ATTEND, I DID NOT KNOW ABOUT.
SO I'M BRINGING THIS TO YOUR ATTENTION.
AND, UH, SO I'M PURSUING THE LEGAL ASPECT OF THIS, BUT I WANTED YOU TO KNOW, THIS IS WHY I POS WHAT'S THAT? WE WERE NOT, THERE WAS NO CONTACT THE WHOLE PERIOD, WHOLE ONE YEAR.
THERE WASN'T A 30 DAY PHONE CALL.
AND THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO BE KEEPING, YOU KNOW, TABS OF HOW EVERYBODY FEELS ABOUT IT.
SO, UH, NOW IF I CAN GO, UH, A LITTLE BIT FURTHER.
WHEN I WAS AT THE, UH, PLANNING, NO, AT THE, UH, WHAT IS THIS? AT THE HISTORIC, EXCUSE ME.
I SPOKE AND I TRIED TO RAISE THE ISSUE THAT THIS WAS, UH, A GRUDGE ISSUE.
THE APPLICATION, UH, FOR A HISTORIC BECAUSE THE NEIGHBOR ON, ON THE, UH, UPPER END OF BENCH JACKSON, UH, HAD THIS EGREGIOUS ZONING CASE.
IT WAS A MF 25 ON A HALF ACRE TRASH VACANT PARTS.
SO AT THE, UH, PLANNING, UH, THEY AGREED TO MAKE IT A SINGLE STORY INSTEAD OF A TWO STORY.
AND MY OBJECT, I SAID IT WAS IMPOSSIBLE.
YOU CAN'T EVEN HAVE A TWO STORY.
AND THE PLANNING COMMISSION PASSED IT.
TWO, CAN I HAVE A LITTLE MORE TIME? THAT'S YOUR TIME.
UM, I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER QUESTIONS ABOUT THE DESIGNATION STATUS FOR THE DISTRICT.
UM, IF NOT, WE HAVE THE APPLICANT AVAILABLE TO ANSWER QUESTIONS.
IF YOU WOULD DESCRIBE THAT PROCESS.
UM, SO ONCE WE HAVE A VALID APPLICATION FOR A HISTORIC DISTRICT, UM, WE DO A MAILED NOTICE TO ANYONE IN THE AFFECTED BOUNDARIES, UM, AS WELL AS AN INVITATION TO PARTICIPATE IN A PUBLIC INFORMATIONAL MEETING.
UM, ALONG IN THAT, THAT MAIL NOTICE IS A BALLOT WHERE, UM, PROPERTY OWNERS CAN INDICATE SUPPORT OR OPPOSITION TO THE PROPOSED DISTRICT.
UM, I BELIEVE, I DON'T HAVE THE EXACT NUMBERS, BUT WE, WE DID VERIFY SUPPORT FROM A LARGE MAJORITY OF PROPERTY OWNERS IN THE DISTRICT.
AND IT WAS ULTIMATELY APPROVED BY COUNSEL IN MARCH OF THIS YEAR, I BELIEVE.
COULD WE HAVE THE APPLICANT APPEAR PLEASE? I, MY NAME IS LOUIS TRINIDAD.
UM, I THOUGHT MY NEIGHBOR WAS GONNA OPPOSE AT MINE AT MY HOUSE, BUT HE'S ACTUALLY OPPOSING THE WHOLE STREET.
AND, AND I THINK THERE WAS A MISUNDERSTANDING ON THAT PART.
SO I'M JUST HERE TO HOPEFULLY GO AHEAD AND GET EVERYTHING APPROVED.
I HAD A VISIT FROM JEFFREY AND MS. ANN MARIE, UH, AND ALSO MR. HUEY.
THEY, THEY GAVE ME SOME REALLY GOOD ADVICE, REALLY GOOD DIRECTION ON WHAT WE NEEDED TO DO TO GO AHEAD AND CORRECT THE ISSUES THAT WE HAVE AT OUR HOME.
UH, I'M JUST HERE TO GO AHEAD AND ASK FOR THE APPROVAL PLEASE.
HERE, YOU UNDERSTAND THE STAFF STIPULATIONS, UM, ABOUT VERTICAL TRIM PIECE IN THERE, WHICH I'M SURE ISN'T A PROBLEM FOR YOU.
MY WIFE AND I, WE HAD TALKED, TALKED ABOUT THAT AND UH, BASICALLY IT'S, YOU'RE LOOKING JUST FOR A TRIM, CURTIS JUST GO STRAIGHT UP AND DOWN.
THAT WILL SEPARATE THE OLD FROM THE NEW.
AND I BELIEVE THERE WAS ONE OTHER STIPULATION THAT WE, COULD YOU EXPLAIN THE SECOND ONE PLEASE? THAT, THAT ANY SETBACK, ENCROACH ENCROACHMENT WOULD BE REQUIRED BY ZONING TUBE.
CAN YOU, UH, BRIEFLY EXPLAIN THAT TO ME, SIR? SETBACK, UH, I'LL ASK STAFF TO, WELL, WE ACTUALLY DISCUSSED THAT, UM, BECAUSE DO YOU REMEMBER YOU HAVE SECTION THAT'S
[00:35:01]
ALREADY, IT DOESN'T HAVE THE FIVE FEET FROM THE FENCE MIND, RIGHT? THAT US APPROVING THIS MAY REQUIRE YOU TO GO AND GET A VARIANCE AT A BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT.I UNDERSTAND THAT WITH OUR RECOMMENDATION.
I MOVE FOR APPROVE OF STAFF STIPULATION.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH MR. THANK YOU.
[B-10 19-7344 Address/Description: 431 E FRENCH PLACE HDRC Case No.: 2019-546 Historic District Name: E French Place Applicant: Carlos Jaquez Request: Front porch modifications City Council Dist.: 1]
OKAY.UM, NEXT IS ITEM B TEN FOUR THIRTY ONE EAST FRENCH PLACE.
UM, WE HAVE A CITIZEN TO BE HEARD ON THIS CASE.
I LIVE AT 4 0 5 EAST MYRTLE STREET IN TOBIN HILL.
UM, AND BEFORE I READ THE STATEMENT, I JUST WANNA SAY THAT WE ARE, WE REALLY, REALLY DO LIKE THE IDEA THAT PEOPLE ARE WORKING ON THE HISTORIC HOMES, UH, IN TOBIN HILL.
HOWEVER, WE REALLY HOPE THAT THEY DO IT RIGHT AND THAT'S WHERE THIS COMES FROM.
THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMITTEE HAS NOT MET WITH THE APPLICANT, BUT WE HAVE REVIEWED THE EXHIBITS AND DISCUSSED THE CASE FOR RECONSTRUCTION OF THE FRONT PORCH, INCLUDING TAPERED COLUMNS WITH SQUARE BASES, TONGUE AND GROOVE DECKING, AND A NEW SQUARE SQUARE BASE HALF COLUMN AND RAILING OF THE PROPERTY AT 4 31 EAST FRENCH.
WE COMMEND THE OWNER FOR WORKING TO IMPROVE THE HISTORIC BUN BUNGALOW.
HOWEVER, WE WOULD LIKE TO COMMENT ON SOME DETAILS OF THE REQUESTED MODIFICATION.
THERE SEEMS TO BE NO EVIDENCE PHOTOGRAPHIC OR OTHERWISE OF THE PRESENCE OF A HALF COLUMN AND RAILING ON THE PORCH.
ALTHOUGH THERE ARE A FEW HOUSES WITH SIMILAR PORCH CONFIGURATIONS IN THE 400 BLOCK, NONE OF THAT SIZE FRONT PORCH SEEM TO HAVE THE HALF COLUMN AND RAILING.
WE RECOMMEND THAT THE HALF COLUMN AND RAILING NOT BE INCLUDED IN THE PORCH MODIFICATION.
WE ALSO RECOMMEND THAT THE PROPORTIONS, MATERIALS, CONFIGURATION AND DETAILS OF THE RECONSTRUCTED TAPERED COLUMNS WITH SQUARE BASES SHOULD NOT APPROXIMATE THE DIMENSIONS OF THE ORIGINALS, BUT SHOULD MATCH THEM AS CLOSELY AS POSSIBLE.
THIS HOUSE IS AN EXAMPLE OF THE WORK OF DEVELOPER, OF DEVELOPER H C THORMAN, AS ARE THE OTHERS.
ON THE 400 BLOCK OF EAST FRENCH PLACE, THORMAN WAS KNOWN FOR CONSTRUCTING ENTIRE MIDDLE INCOME NEIGHBORHOODS WITH VERY FEW HOUSES BEING IDENTICAL.
AND FOR HIS ATTENTION TO DETAIL AND HIS USE OF QUALITY BUILDING MATERIALS, WE WOULD LIKE TO STAY TRUE TO HIS VISION.
AGAIN, WE'D LIKE TO THANK THE APPLICANT FOR HIS EFFORTS TO PRESERVE ONE OF TOKEN HILL'S HISTORIC HOUSES.
AND WE THANK YOU THE COMMISSIONERS FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION OF OUR RECOMMENDATIONS.
HELLO, MY NAME IS CARLOS HAKES.
I'M THE OWNER OF 4 3 1 EAST FRENCH.
AND YOUR REASON FOR WANTING TO ADD THE, UH, HALF COLUMN AND RAIL? YES, EVEN THOUGH THERE IS NO EXISTING PICTURES, ABOUT 90% OF THE HOUSES ON THAT BLOCK AND ABOUT A HUNDRED PERCENT OF 'EM THAT HAVE A PORCH OUR HAUL, THIS STYLE.
UM, WHEN I GOT THE HOUSE, IT WAS IN REALLY TOUGH, ROUGH SHAPE.
UM, YOU COULD LOOK AT THE PICTURES ON GOOGLE, UM, WHO KNOWS WHAT WAS TAKEN APART.
WHO KNOWS IF ANY OF THE PICTURES THAT WE HAVE TODAY ARE ORIGINAL.
UM, I'M TRYING MY BEST TO RESTORE THIS THING.
AND FROM MY UNDERSTANDING, THIS IS A STYLE.
LIKE I SAID, THE WHOLE BLOCK HAS A SIMILAR LOOK TO IT.
ALL I'M DOING IS ADDING THE RAILING AND THAT CENTER COLUMN, WHICH IS A FREE FLOATING COLUMN.
IT'S, IT'S MORE LIKE A PLANTER.
UM, AND JUST FOR CLARITY AND TO KIND OF REPEAT WHAT MR. KUSHNER SAID, WE, WE DON'T KNOW FOR SURE IF THAT MIDDLE POST WAS THERE ORIGINALLY.
IN FACT, WE THINK IT PROBABLY WASN'T.
UM, BUT THERE'S A LOT OF VERY SIMILAR HOMES, UM, THAT HAVE THE SAME DETAIL.
AND SO WE FIND IT APPROPRIATE FOR THE STYLE.
IT'S, IT'S REALLY KIND OF HOW YOU WANNA INTERPRET THE GUIDELINES.
YOU CONSIDERED NOT ALL OR YOU WOULD LIKE IT? I WOULD LIKE IT 'CAUSE WITHOUT
[00:40:01]
IT I CAN'T PUT THE NICE LITTLE RAIL.SO, SO IT LOOKS LIKE SOME OF THE OTHER WAYS THAT THIS HAS BEEN DEALT WITH ON THE SIDE IS JUST A LOW WALL ALL THE WAY ACROSS FROM THAT COLUMN.
UM, IS, IS THAT A COMPROMISE THAT YOU WOULD BE WILLING TO MAKE? I JUST WOULDN'T PUT ANYTHING THERE.
IT WOULD JUST EITHER BE ONE BEAM ON EACH SIDE OR PUT THE COLUMN.
THAT WAY I COULD PUT THE, THE RAIL.
ARE YOU OKAY WITH THE STIPULATIONS? YES MA'AM.
DO YOU KNOW HOW HIGH THE PORCH IS OFF THE GROUND? IT'S ABOUT, PROBABLY ABOUT THREE FEET OFF THE GROUND, MAYBE FOUR FEET.
IT LOOKS LIKE, IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S GREATER THAN 30 INCHES.
AND WHETHER THERE'S EVIDENCE OF A RAIL ASSEMBLY THERE.
AND A WAY TO RESOLVE THE RAIL ASSEMBLY, UM, IS, IS, THAT'S ANOTHER THING, YOU KNOW, KIND OF A SIGNIFICANT ISSUE.
I I CAN UNDERSTAND THE JUSTIFICATION OF NEEDING TO PUT A RAIL THERE AND I DO THINK THAT THE ADDITION OF THE CENTER HALF COLUMN IS A REASONABLE WAY TO TERMINATE THE RAIL JUST FOR SAFETY'S SAKE.
UM, GIVEN THAT, GIVEN THAT, UH, YOU'VE AGREED TO ALL THE OTHER STIPULATIONS, I WOULD, I WOULD MOVE TO APPROVE WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS AND I'D ADD, UM, A FIFTH STIPULATION THAT THE TAPERED COLUMNS, UH, CLOSELY MATCH THE DIMENSIONS, UH, THAT WERE THERE.
[B-20 19-7328 Address/Description: 1943 N IH 35 HDRC Case No.: 2019-551 Historic District Name: Government Hill Applicant: Joseph Smith/JMS Architects Request: Construction of multi-family development City Council Dist.: 2]
AGENDA ITEM B 20 H D R C, CASE NUMBER 20 19 5 51 19 43 NORTH INTERSTATE HIGHWAY 35.APPLICANT IS REQUESTING CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT TWO, TWO STORY RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURES ON THE VACANT LOT ADDRESSES.
1943 NORTH INTERSTATE HIGHWAY 30.
THE LOT IS BOUNDED TO THE SOUTH BY INTERSTATE 35.
FRONTAGE ROAD NORTH PALMETTO TO THE WEST AND GLAD STREET TO THE NORTH.
PROPOSED NEW CONSTRUCTION AND WILL FEATURE AN OVERALL HEIGHT OF 25 FEET ZERO INCHES.
THERE ARE FIVE STIPULATIONS THAT STAFF RECOMMENDS THE APPLICANT ADDRESS PRIOR TO RECEIVING CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL FOR CONSIDERATION OF TIME.
I WON'T READ ALL OF THOSE, BUT THEY INCLUDE SETBACKS, FOUNDATION, HEIGHTS, MATERIALS, PORCH, MASSING, AND UH, SCREENING OF MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT AND OTHER SITE RELATED ELEMENTS.
WE'LL HAVE THE APPLICANT UP AT THIS TIME FOR A BRIEF PRESENTATION, UM, AND THEN WE ALSO HAVE A CITIZEN BE HEARD, THE APPLICANT HERE.
PLEASE COULD YOU GIVE US A BRIEF DESCRIPTION OF THE PROJECT AND, UM, YOUR COMMENTS TO STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS? UH, MY NAME IS JOSEPH SMITH WITH J M SS ARCHITECTS.
UH, WE CAME BEFORE YOU, UH, SOMETIME AGO WITH A THREE STORY STRUCTURE THAT HAS BEEN REDUCED IN SCALE AND HEIGHT TO TWO STORY, UH, BUILDINGS ALSO.
UM, THE MASSING HAS BEEN CHANGED TO BE A LITTLE MORE, UH, CONGRUENT WITH THE REST OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
UH, SO CURRENTLY WE, THIS IS, UH, CURRENT RENDITION OF THE PROJECT.
SO AGAIN, THERE ARE FOUR UNITS THAT FACE, UH, I 35 TO THE UNITS ON EACH END WOULD, THE FRONT WOULD BE ON PALMETTO AND THEN THERE'S FOUR UNITS THAT ARE ON THE BACK WITH THE CENTER DRIVE THAT FACE ROCHESTER TO THE REAR.
UM, IN TERMS OF THE STIPULATIONS, WE REVIEWED THE STIPULATIONS WITH THE OWNER.
UH, WE, AND WE HAVE SENT THIS DRAWING, WHICH IS, UH, WE MOVED THE BUILDINGS BACK FOUR FEET FROM I 35.
UH, THE BUILDINGS WERE STEPPED TO, UH, UH, IS HOMAGE TO THE HISTORIC HOUSE, TO THE, UH, JUST TO THE EAST, WHICH IS ACTUALLY QUITE, HAS QUITE A BIT OF A SETBACK.
UM, THAT THAT HOUSE WHICH IS RIGHT TO THE EAST OF OUR PROJECT, IS SET BACK FURTHER THAN EVERYTHING ELSE ON THE BLOCK.
UH, AGAIN, THIS IS ONE WAY TRAFFIC ON 35, SO IT WILL STILL BE VIEWED, UH, FROM THE INTERSTATE ON THE ACCESS ROAD.
BUT AGAIN, IN THIS RENDITION, WE'VE, UH, IN TERMS OF STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS, WE HAVE MOVED THE BUILDINGS BACK IN ADDITIONAL FOUR FEET.
UH, ALSO, UH, WE HAVE SOME, AGAIN, A COUPLE OTHER RENDERINGS THAT WE DEVELOP, WHICH ON THE FLOOR HEIGHTS I TALKED TO THE DEVELOPERS.
THEY'RE FINE WITH RAISING THE FLOOR HEIGHTS.
APPROXIMATELY TWO FEET, WE WOULD HAVE STEPS INTO THE GARAGE SO THAT AGAIN, THE FLOOR HEIGHTS WOULD BE A LITTLE MORE APPROPRIATE, UH, TO A HISTORIC NEIGHBORHOOD.
SO IN THIS DRAWING, YOU CAN KIND OF SEE THE, THE DECK THAT IS RAISED OFF, OFF THE GROUND.
AND THEN, UM, WE'VE ADDED MORE DETAIL WOOD, UH, FRAMING MEMBERS ON THE PORCHES AS
[00:45:01]
WELL, WHICH AGAIN, ARE MORE, UH, FOUND PREVALENT IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD.I DO HAVE IT ON THE, SORRY, IT SHOULD BE ON THE ONES THAT ARE
UH, THE OTHER STIPULATIONS WERE THE, UH, THE WIDTH OF THE DRIVE.
THAT'S SOMETHING THAT AGAIN, UH, WE'RE GONNA WORK WITH OUR CIVIL ENGINEER ON WHAT THAT MINIMUM WIDTH WOULD END UP BEING.
CURRENTLY WE HAVE ABOUT 20 FOOT DRIVE 'CAUSE IT IS TWO-WAY TRAFFIC TO, UH, ENTER INTO THE UNITS.
UM, BUT WE WOULD HAVE THE CENTER PORTION, WE CAN GO DOWN TO 10 FEET AND CHANGE OF MATERIAL SO THAT, AGAIN, IT LOOKS LIKE MORE OF A HISTORIC, UH, DRIVE OF THE 10 FOOT WIDTH.
UM, I THINK OTHER THAN THAT IT WAS SCREENING OF EQUIPMENT, UH, WINDOW DETAILING.
THE WINDOWS WOULD BE RECESSED INTO WALLS, WOULD BE A WOOD CLAD, UH, WINDOW SYSTEM THAT CORRESPOND WITH THE STAFF STIPULATIONS HAVE, UH, CITIZENS TO BE HEARD.
UH, MY NAME'S ROSE HILL, PRESIDENT GOVERNMENT HILL ALLIANCE.
UM, UH, SINCE THE PROJECT BEGAN, UM, THE, UH, WE HAVE A PROCESS IN WHICH WE FOLLOWED AND, UH, UP UNTIL NOW, UH, THE ONLY CONCERN THAT THE, THE COMMUNITY HAD WAS THE DESIGN.
AND, UM, AS YOU KNOW, THIS IS A SECOND, UH, DESIGN THAT'S COME THROUGH GOVERNMENT HILL AND WE WE'RE THE FIRST ONE, UH, WE WENT UP AND DOWN HILLS FOR A WHOLE YEAR AND WE LEARNED A LOT OF LESSONS, BELIEVE ME, OR A LOT OF LESSONS.
UM, I'M ASKING THAT WE NOT APPROVE THIS TODAY AND THAT WE DO A CONTINUANCE FOR THE FOLLOWING REASONS.
UM, WE HAVE THE CHANGES THAT HAVE BEEN EXPLAINED TODAY.
WE'RE NOT OPPOSED TO THE DEVELOPMENT, BUT THE COMMUNITY HAS NOT SEEN ANY CHANGES AND WE'VE HAD NO COMMUNICATION WITH THE APPLICANT SINCE THE VERY FIRST TIME THAT THEY'VE COME HERE.
UH, WE NEED TO TAKE THIS BACK TO THE COMMUNITY TO MAKE SURE WE FOLLOW THE PROCESS.
UH, AS HE EXPLAINED TODAY, I WOULD LIKE FOR HIM TO COME TO OUR MEETING ON THE 28TH SO THAT THEY CAN EXPLAIN THAT TO THE COMMUNITY IF THEY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS.
UM, THEY DID HAVE QUESTIONS REGARDING THE ALLEY AND I, HE EXPLAINED A LITTLE BIT TODAY ABOUT, ABOUT THAT AND I, THE OTHER STIPULATIONS.
BUT I THINK WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT WE DO GET INPUT FROM THE COMMUNITY AND THAT THE COMMUNITY AS FAR AS THE HEIGHT, UM, IS CONCERNED THAT WE, THAT IT FITS IN WITH THE COM, UH, WITH THE, THE, IF IT'S IN THE CONFORMITY OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION AND THE HOUSING AREA.
'CAUSE YOU, AS YOU NOTICE THAT THERE'S, THERE WAS A LITTLE CONCERN OF THAT LITTLE HOUSE IS RIGHT NEXT TO IT AND YOU HAVE THIS BIG PROJECT NEXT TO IT.
SO EVEN WITH THAT IN HAND, I DON'T THINK THE COMMUNITY HAD A PROBLEM.
BUT THEY DO HAVE A PROBLEM WITH A CHANGE OF DESIGN.
THEY HAVE NOT SEEN ANY, UH, UH, SEEN IT.
AND I THINK THAT THEY HAVE A RIGHT TO ASK QUESTIONS AND BE ABLE TO HAVE A LITTLE BIT MORE OPEN LINE OF COMMUNICATION WITH THE APPLICANT.
ANY OTHER CITIZENS? THAT'S ALL WE HAVE.
I'D LIKE TO RESPOND TO, UH, MS. HILL.
UH, WE DID ACTUALLY HAVE A DESIGN REVIEW COMMITTEE MEETING ON AUGUST 13TH, AND WE DEALT WITH MR. HALL AND ASKED HIM TO INVITE, UH, THE COMMUNITY.
I THINK, UH, ONE TOBIN, I MEAN, I'M SORRY, UM, GOVERNMENT HILL GROUP DID ATTEND THAT MEETING.
WE HAD, UH, THREE REPRESENTATIVES FROM THAT GROUP.
I DON'T KNOW THAT ANYBODY FROM MS. HILL'S GROUP ATTENDED THAT MEETING.
WE DID ATTEND A MEETING BACK IN JANUARY WITH THE PREVIOUS DESIGN.
TO BE HONEST, IT WAS A VERY CONTENTIOUS MEETING WITH TWO GROUPS THAT WAS VERY UNPRODUCTIVE.
UM, SO THAT'S WHY WE ASKED TO DO IT AT, IN A DESIGN REVIEW COMMITTEE, UM, FORUM SO THAT WE COULD HAVE PRODUCTIVE DIALOGUE.
UM, AND SO I, I, MR. HALL CAN FINDING C UM, IN STAFF'S FINDINGS ADDRESSES THE DESIGN REVIEW COMMITTEE MEETING WHERE THERE WERE THREE OR FOUR MEMBERS FROM THE COMMUNITY OR FROM THE NEIGHBORHOOD THAT ATTENDED.
THEY WERE ABLE TO PROVIDE FEEDBACK AND ASK QUESTIONS AS NECESSARY.
UH, WELL, I WOULD LIKE TO COMMEND THE, THE JUST DIRECTION THAT YOU GUYS TOOK WITH THE DESIGN.
I THINK IT WAS APPROPRIATE AND IT MET A LOT OF THE THINGS THAT WE DISCUSSED IN THE DRCS AND, AND THE, UH, THE LAST TIME YOU WERE AT THE COMMISSION.
SO I, I REALLY APPRECIATE THE, THE DIRECTION THE PROJECT TOOK.
AND I THINK IT, IT LOOKS, IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT PROJECT.
UM, AND SO I ALSO THINK THAT THIS IS A PUBLIC FORUM AND I THINK THAT THIS IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR THE PUBLIC TO SPEAK ON THIS PROJECT.
SO I THINK THAT THIS IS ANOTHER MISSED OPPORTUNITY FOR THAT GROUP FOR THEM TO SPEAK.
UM, BUT I, I THINK THAT, UH, I, TO ME, I THINK THEY HAVE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO SEE THE PROJECT IN MY OPINION.
[00:50:01]
I WOULD APPROVE THIS WITH STAFF'S IONS.UM, I JUST WANTED TO, UM, WELL BEFORE SECOND, HAS STAFF SEEN THESE NEW SETBACKS? THESE DOCUMENTS WERE UPDATED, UM, AND SENT TO STAFF TODAY.
UH, REGARDING THE, THIS, THE UPDATED SETBACKS, I'LL ZOOM IN THIS AND SPEAK A LITTLE BIT.
STAFF'S PRIMARY CONCERN IN REGARDS TO WHAT ORIGINALLY WAS SUBMITTED WAS THE, UM, THE DIFFERENCE IN SETBACK BETWEEN THE EXISTING HISTORIC STRUCTURE TO THE EAST AND WHAT WAS PROPOSED, UH, STAFF RECOMMENDED TO THE APPLICANT THAT THE APPLICANT INCREASE OR, UH, SHIFT, UH, PORTION OR A UNIT TO THE REAR OR TO THE NORTH TO, UM, MITIGATE THAT SETBACK.
SOME, UM, I DON'T BELIEVE THAT WE, UH, WE GAVE A SPECIFIC AMOUNT TO PUSH BACK.
SO CERTAINLY WHAT THE APPLICANT HAS DONE, UM, IS, IS BETTER.
UM, I THINK STAFF WOULD PROBABLY AGREE IF YOU PUSHED IT BACK MORE, THAT WOULD BE MUCH BETTER.
BUT, UM, THIS IS CERTAINLY A STEP TOWARD WHAT STAFF WAS HOPING WOULD BE ACCOMPLISHED.
AND, AND, AND I GUESS I'M ALSO SECOND THAT MOTION BECAUSE I WOULD LIKE THAT STIPULATION TO STAY.
I DON'T THINK IT'S BEEN, YOU KNOW, COMPLETELY MET YET.
I DO AGREE THAT THERE MAY BE, I MEAN, I THINK THEY'VE WORKED, I AGREE WITH MY COMMISSIONER.
I MEAN, THIS IS A COMPLETELY MUCH BETTER PROJECT, MUCH BETTER PROJECT THAN WHAT WE STARTED AT.
UM, I DO THINK THAT MAYBE EITHER YOU ANALYZE THE SETBACK OR MAYBE SHOW US MORE HOW THIS CANNOT BE DONE, UM, BUT ANALYZE IT, GO BACK AND ANALYZE THAT WOULD KEEP THAT STIPULATION ON THERE ON THE CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL.
I MEAN, WE DO, IF YOU CAN GO TO THE, A LITTLE FURTHER UP IN THE SCREEN.
SO WE'RE AT, ON THE, UH, NORTH SIDE, WE ARE, UH, RIGHT AT THE 10 FOOT SETBACK, UH, FROM THE ADJACENT PROPERTY.
AND THAT'S MORE TO RUN UTILITIES DOWN THE SIDE OF THE PROPERTY.
AND SO TO GO FURTHER BACK AND ALSO THERE'S A LARGE PECAN TREE THAT IS IDENTIFIED, UH, THAT CIRCLE THAT'S ON THE NORTH.
AND THEN SO THAT TREE, WE WOULD BE GETTING INTO THE, UH, CANOPY OF THAT TREE FURTHER IF WE PUSH THE BUILDINGS ANY FURTHER TO THE NORTH.
ALSO IN THIS CONFIGURATION, WE HAVE HIGH HOPES THAT THAT TREE THAT'S IN THE CENTER OF THE DRIVE COULD PERHAPS BE SAVED AS WELL, WHICH WOULD, UM, IS CURRENTLY SHOWN TO BE TAKEN OUT BY MOVING.
WE DO HAVE MAYBE AN OPPORTUNITY TO SAVE THAT TREE.
SO WE HAVE SOME SITE CON, UM, CONSTRAINTS THAT WOULD PREVENT IT FROM REALLY MOVING MUCH FURTHER BECAUSE THESE UNITS ARE, AS THEY ARE, THEY'RE JOINED TO THE HIP.
AND SO TO MOVE ONE, YOU'RE MOVING, UH, SEVERAL AND HAVING CLEARANCES AND BACKUP SPACES FOR THE DRIVEWAY.
SO WE DID EXPLORE THAT AND AGAIN, IT WAS, UH, MOVED BACK FROM THE PREVIOUS PROJECT, UH, YOU KNOW, IN, IN THE FIRST PASS ON THIS PROJECT.
AND THEN AGAIN, ANOTHER FOUR FEET SINCE, UH, STAFF MADE THOSE RECOMMENDATIONS.
I GUESS THE APPLICANT HAS A CHOICE.
UM, I SUPPORT THE STIPULATION, I KEEP SUPPORTING THE STIPULATION STAYS THERE FOR THE CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL.
SO, UM, WE'LL CONTINUE TO WORK ON THE PROJECT AND YES, SIR, WE'RE, WE'RE LOOKING TO MOVE FORWARD AND SO, YOU KNOW, THEY'LL, WE'LL WE WILL LOOK AT EVERY OPPORTUNITY TO, WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS, UH, IN HAND, YOU CAN, UH, STUDY IT FURTHER AND YES, ONE COMMENT ON MY PART IS THAT, UH, THE BUILDING FOUNDATION RAISING AT TWO FEET, UH, MIGHT BE A LITTLE MUCH, I THINK, UH, STAFF SPECIFICALLY TAKES ABOUT A, OR RECOMMENDS ABOUT A FOOT, UH, FOUNDATION.
THE GUIDELINES SAY SHOULD BE WITHIN A FOOT OF THE ADJACENT STRUCTURES.
UM, WHAT THE APPLICANT HAS PROPOSED IS, UM, CERTAINLY A STEP TOWARD THAT.
UM, ONE THING THAT STAFF FINDS THAT MAY BE ABLE TO BE IMPLEMENTED IS, UM, IF THERE WAS MORE SUBSTANCE OR STRUCTURE TO THAT RAISED PORCH ELEMENT, UM, SO THAT IT READ MORE AS A, A PORCH ELEMENT ITSELF RATHER THAN A, A RAISED DECK MAYBE BEAT THE MODERN OUTTA ME.
SO AGAIN, FURTHER DEVELOPMENT ON THIS.
UM, DO YOU HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND, MR. CHAIR? I JUST, I'D LIKE TO MAKE A, A COMMENT, UH, ON, ON THE, THE SPACE BETWEEN THE BUILDINGS, IT'S THE DRIVEWAY.
UH, I WOULD THINK THAT YOU SHOULD KEEP THAT AS, AS, UH, LARGE AS AS IS AVAILABLE.
I KNOW YOU TALKED ABOUT MAYBE NARROWING IT EARLIER ON IN YOUR, YOUR POSITION.
WELL, WERE THE VEHICLES NO, NO SIR.
SO I, I THINK THE, WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT WAS THAT HATCHED AREA, UH, WE WOULD REDUCE THAT, UH, MATERIAL AND WIDTH DOWN TO 10 FEET TO LOOK LIKE A HISTORIC DRIVEWAY.
WELL, BUT THE W BUT THE WIDTH OF DRIVEWAY WOULD STILL BE AT LEAST 20 TO 25 FEET IN FRONT OF THE UNITS FOR BACKUP SPACE.
AT LEAST THE APPEARANCE TO, UH, YOU KNOW, THAT IT, IT IS UNDERSTOOD.
AND THEN, AND THEN THE, THE ONLY OTHER THING
[00:55:01]
IS TO, TO BE MINDFUL THAT IT'S ODD, RIGHT? THAT A VEHICLE GOES STRAIGHT IN, IN THE DIRECTION OF THE SIDE OF A HOUSE, THAT CLOSE, RIGHT? WHERE YOU'RE, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT 10 FEET.IF THERE WAS, UH, SOME SPECIAL ATTENTION YOU COULD PLACE TO, TO CREATING A BARRIER THAT'S BEYOND SCREENING, THAT IF A VEHICLE LOSES CONTROL THAT IT'S NOT GONNA RUN IT INSIDE OF THAT HOUSE.
OR AT LEAST TO GIVE THE PEOPLE THERE THAT, THAT, THAT, UH, COMFORT, RIGHT? PEACE OF MIND, WHETHER IT'S BEEN THROUGH BOLLARDS OR THROUGH A HIGHER CURB AT THAT AREA OR WHATEVER.
IT'S PROBABLY BE SOMETHING THAT IS, IS THAT Y'ALL WOULD BE HELD TO.
YEAH, NO, THAT'S VERY GOOD POINT.
ANY DISCUSSION? ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE.
[B-21 19-7420 Address/Description: 335 TRAIL HDRC Case No.: 2018-533 Historic District Name: River Road RIO District: RIO-1 Applicant: Katie Bingham, AIA/Mark Odom Studio Request: Construction of a multi-family residential development City Council Dist.: 1]
AGENDA ITEM B 21, H D R C CASE NUMBER 20 18 5 33 3 35 TRAIL.THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT A MULTI-FAMILY, MULTI-UNIT RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT ON THE VACANT LOT AT 3 35 TRAIL.
THE PROPERTY FEATURES LOTS THAT ARE LOCATED WITHIN THE RIVER IMPROVEMENT OVERLAY ONLY, AS WELL AS THOSE THAT ARE LOCATED WITHIN BOTH THE RIVER IMPROVEMENT OVERLAY AND THE RIVER ROAD HISTORIC DISTRICT.
THE, THE APPLICANT HAS PROPOSED FOR THE RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURES TO FEATURE TWO AND THREE STORIES IN HEIGHT.
ACCESS TO THE SITE WILL BE PROVIDED FROM TRAIL STREET AND ATCH STREET.
AT THIS TIME, STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL BASED ON FINDING Q, WHICH NOTES THE INCLUSION OF STREET FACING, FRONT LOADED GARAGE DOORS AND ARCHITECTURAL ELEMENT THAT IS NOT PRESENT WITHIN THE RIVER ROAD.
HISTORIC DISTRICT STAFF FINDS THIS DETAIL TO BE INAPPROPRIATE AND INCONSISTENT WITH THE GUIDELINES.
IF THE HISTORIC AND DESIGN REVIEW COMMISSION FINDS THE SUBMITTED DESIGN TO BE APPROPRIATE, STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL WITH THE NUMBER OF STIPULATIONS, UM, FOR THE SAKE OF TIME, I WILL NOT READ THROUGH ALL OF THOSE.
HOWEVER, I WILL NOTE THE APPLICANT HAS NOTED TO STAFF THAT THEY EITHER HAVE OR PLAN TO COMPLY WITH ALL OF THOSE STIPULATIONS.
THOSE STIPULATIONS ARE IN REGARDS TO ARCHITECTURAL ELEMENTS AS WELL AS ARCHEOLOGICAL ELEMENTS THE APPLICANT COME FORWARD PLEASE.
I'M DAVID MORIN, JAMES MCKNIGHT, 1 1 2 EAST PECAN.
AND UH, JUST WANT TO THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME TONIGHT.
UM, WE HAD, WE WERE ASKED TO, UH, PROVIDE SOME, THERE WAS SOME CONCERN IN THE LAST HEARING ABOUT, UH, POTENTIAL DETENTION POND BEING VISIBLE FROM WE SAT STREET AND UM, THAT'S ONE OF TWO OPTIONS THAT WE KIND OF HAVE PRESENTED FOR OUR DETENTION POND.
UH, THE ALTERNATIVE WOULD BE LESS DISPLAY ON WEAT STREET, AND WE JUST WANTED TO UPDATE THE COMMISSIONERS WITH, UM, SOME RENDERINGS AND SOME PLANS, UH, THAT SHOW THAT POND.
SO THE POND, YOU CAN SEE IT THERE.
IT'S KIND OF IN THE CORNER OFF OF ATCH.
THIS IS, THIS IS FACING, UM, WE'RE LOOKING WEST RIGHT NOW.
UH, THIS IS FACING EAST AND OUR, YOU CAN SEE OUR WALKING TRAIL CONNECTING TO THE COMMUNITY GARDEN.
AND THIS IS, THIS IS FROM THE COMMUNITY GARDEN.
UM, WE WERE TRYING TO CREATE AN ARCHITECTURAL ELEMENT WITHIN THIS TWO FOOT STONE, UM, JUST TO KIND OF MAKE IT LOOK MORE SIMILAR TO THINGS FOUND IN THE AREA NEAR THE RIVER.
AND THIS JUST SHOWS THE DETAIL FROM OUR CIVIL ENGINEER.
THANK YOU FOR BRINGING THESE RENDERINGS.
IT'S, UM, HELPFUL TO SEE WHAT YOU HAD ENVISIONED.
UM, ONE QUESTION I HAVE IS, UM, YOU'D STILL WORK THROUGH ALL THE CITY DEPARTMENTS INCLUDING, UH, STORM WATER AND SARAH AND, UH, ALL THE REQUIRED, UM, REVIEW PROCESS.
SO AT THIS TIME YOU DON'T HAVE A, A DEFINITIVE, UH, DRAINAGE PLAN.
YOU HAVE WAYS TO, UH, ACCOMPLISH
[01:00:01]
THE, THE ISSUES.WE, UM, WE'VE SUBMITTED, UH, TO FOR BUILDING PERMIT, UM, BUT WE'RE WORKING WITH, WITH THE STORMWATER DEPARTMENT ON THAT.
SO BEFORE WE GET INTO FURTHER, UH, QUESTIONS FROM THE COMMISSION, WE DO HAVE CITIZENS TO BE HEARD.
UM, THE FIRST IS VIRGINIA VAN CLEVE.
MY NAME IS VIRGINIA VAN CLEVE.
I LIVE AT 91 18 FAIRLAND SAN ANTONIO, TEXAS.
AND I'M HERE FROM THE CONSERVATION SOCIETY REGARDING THE DEVELOPMENTS AT 3 35 TRAIL.
THE CONSERVATION SOCIETY OF SAN ANTONIO SUPPORTS THE RECOMMENDATION OF THE OFFICE OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION THAT THE STREET FACING FRONT LOADED GARAGE DOORS NOT BE APPROVED AS THEY ARE OUT OF CHARACTER.
WITH THE DESIGN OF THE RIVER ROAD HISTORIC DISTRICT, THE CONSERVATION SOCIETY FURTHER SUPPORTS THE SEVERAL STIPULATIONS THAT THE DEVELOPER HAS AGREED TO IN ORDER TO OBTAIN FINAL DESIGN APPROVAL.
THANK YOU, CONSERVATION SOCIETY, OUR PRESIDENT, PETTY ZZZ.
MR. WOOD WILL RECEIVE NINE MINUTES TOTAL.
ARLENE FISHER AND KIM WOULD'VE YIELDED THEIR TIME.
I LIVE AT 1 0 9 LINDELL IN THE RIVER ROAD NEIGHBORHOOD.
OKAY, UM, I'M HERE TODAY TO REQUEST THAT FINAL APPROVAL FOR THIS PROJECT BE DENIED UNTIL TWO AREAS OF CONCERN ARE ADDRESSED.
AND FIRST BEING BUILDING HEIGHT, WHICH WE FEEL IS TOO HIGH FOR THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
AND THE SECOND BEING THE APPLICANT'S FAILURE TO SOLVE THE DRAINAGE ISSUES WHICH, UH, RESULT IN WATER CONTINUING TO FLOW INTO THE LAVO SEIA IN RESIDENTIAL DISTRICTS, THE HEIGHT AND SCALE OF NEW CONSTRUCTION SHOULD NOT EXCEED THAT A MAJORITY OF THE HISTORIC BUILDINGS BY MORE THAN ONE STORY.
THIS IS ESSENTIALLY A THREE STORY PROJECT PROPOSED FOR A ONE STORY HISTORIC DISTRICT.
95% OF THE HOUSES IN RIVER ROAD ARE ONE STORY AND NO BUILDING EXCEEDS TWO STORIES.
WE FEEL THAT IF APPROVED, THIS GOES AGAINST THE CHARACTERISTICS OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND SETS A BAD PRECEDENT FOR HISTORIC DISTRICTS IN THE CITY.
THEY WANNA SHOW YOU SOME OF THE CHARACTERISTIC HOUSES.
THIS IS A 17 HUNDREDS HOUSE THAT'S ADJACENT TO THE PROPOSED PROJECT IS ANOTHER HOUSE ON WOODLAWN THAT'S CHARACTERISTIC OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND ANOTHER ON EAST MAGNOLIA, WHICH IS ADJACENT TO THE PROJECT ALSO.
I JUST WANTED TO SHOW THOSE SO YOU COULD SEE THE OVERALL HEIGHT AND KIND OF THE, THE MASS OF THESE BUILDINGS.
AT THE LAST PRESENTATION, JOHN HERTZ PRESENTED THIS, WHICH SHOWED BUILDING ONE AND TWO OF THE PROPOSED PROJECT, WHICH ARE ON SATCH AVENUE.
AND THERE ARE TWO EXISTING ONE STORY STRUCTURES THAT ARE NEXT TO THEM.
AND THAT AGAIN IS TO GIVE AN OVERALL COMPARISON OF THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A ONE STORY STRUCTURE AND A THREE STORY STRUCTURE.
I WENT DOWN TO THE PEARL THIS MORNING, TOOK SOME PICTURES.
AGAIN, THERE'S SOME DIFFERENCES IN GRADE HERE AND, BUT IF YOU LOOK AT THE GRAYER PART OF THE THREE STORY STRUCTURE AND COMPARE THAT TO THE ONE STORY STRUCTURE, YOU CAN KIND OF SEE A DIFFERENCE THERE.
I MEAN THESE ARE PRETTY DERELICT BOTH OF THEM STRUCTURES, BUT AGAIN, A COMPARISON OF THE ONE STORY TO THE THREE.
ANOTHER COMPARISON OF A, WHAT A THREE STORY STRUCTURE APPEARS AGAINST A ONE STORY STORY STRUCTURE.
THE APPLICANT IN HIS, UM, REVISED PROPOSAL, WHICH I, I NEEDED TO SAY WE JUST RECEIVED TODAY.
IT'S NOT WHAT WE RECEIVED ON FRIDAY, SO WE DIDN'T REALLY HAVE TIME TO REVIEW IT.
BUT AGAIN, HE HAS, UH, SOME PRETTY, VERY ATTRACTIVE DESIGNS, YOU KNOW, OF THE TREES AND FOLIAGE SURROUNDING THE PROJECT.
UH, I JUST WANT TO COMMENT THAT
[01:05:01]
THE PROJECT IS ESSENTIALLY A CLEAR CUT OF, OF THE LAND.IT REMOVES 11 SIGNIFICANT AND HERITAGE TREES.
AND I WANTED TO PRESENT THIS PICTURE AS TO BE, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE MAJOR HERITAGE TREES THAT WOULD BE REMOVED, WHICH IS PROBABLY, I DON'T KNOW, I'D GUESS A HUNDRED TO 200 YEARS OLD.
AND THEY, TO ME, THAT'S ONE OF THE REASONS I THINK THAT IT'S A PROBLEM WITH THIS DESIGN IS THE DESIGN IS BASED ON MAXIMIZING THE NUMBER OF UNITS FOR THE AREA, NOT PAYING ATTENTION TO THE CHARACTERISTICS OF THE SITE.
AND I THINK THIS IS WHERE PROBLEMS WITH THE NEXT AREA DRAINAGE COME IN.
THE CURRENT PLANS FOR DRAINAGE ARE NOT COMPLETE.
UM, THE APPLICANT NOTES THAT, UM, AT THE LAST TWO MEETINGS HERE, COMMISSIONERS HAVE INSTRUCTED THE APPLICANT WHEN HE RETURNS TO HAVE A COMPLETE DRAINAGE PLAN THAT HASN'T HAPPENED.
UM, PLAN CONTINUES TO DRAIN WATER INTO THE LABORA SEIA.
WE ALSO FEEL THAT THE, THE DRAINAGE IS AN ISSUE THAT NEEDS TO BE SETTLED HERE BEFORE FINAL APPROVAL BECAUSE WE BELIEVE THAT SOME OF THE STEPS THE APPLICANT MAY HAVE TO TAKE TO REMEDY THE DRAINAGE MAY IMPACT THE SITE DESIGN.
IN PARTICULAR AS STAFF AT THE SAN ANTONIO RIVER AUTHORITY HAVE INDICATED THEY MAY HAVE TO, MAY RESULT IN THEM LOSING OR HAVING TO CUT DOWN A UNIT OR SO ON THEIR PROJECT.
CURRENT PLANS CONTINUE TO ALLOW WATER TO DRAIN IN THE, INTO THE ASAKIA.
ACCORDING TO SARAH, GENERAL MANAGER SUZANNE SCOTT, THE APPLICANT HAS TO MEET THE CITY'S RULE.
NO WATER FROM THE SITE IS TO GO INTO THE ASAKIA.
IF YOU INHERIT A NON-COMPLIANT CONDITION, YOU'RE RESPONSIBLE FOR FIXING IT.
WE FEEL THE APPLICANT NEEDS TO DO THAT BEFORE FINAL APPROVAL IS GIVEN.
IN CONCLUSION, WE FEEL THAT THE PROJECT IS TOO TALL FOR THE HISTORIC DISTRICT AND NEEDS TO BE REDUCED TO TWO STORIES ON TRAIL STREET.
THE DRAINAGE PLAN IS INCOMPLETE AND CONTINUES TO DRAIN STORM WATER INTO THE ASSIA, AND WE REQUEST THAT FINAL APPROVAL BE DENIED UNTIL THESE AREAS CAN BE ADDRESSED.
MR. NASH RECEIVED SIX MINUTES.
MIKE MARTINEZ HAS YIELD AT HIS TIME.
I LIVE AT 8 42 EAST MAGNOLIA AVENUE IN THE RIVER ROAD NEIGHBORHOOD.
I'D LIKE TO TAKE ONE OF MY MINUTES TO REMEMBER A PERSON WHO HAD GREAT RESPECT FOR ALL OF YOU AS A COMMISSION AND HAD A ALMOST A LIFETIME OF INTEREST IN HISTORIC PRESERVATION IN SAN ANTONIO AS JIM CULLUM, UH, MY FIRST COUSIN AND, UM, MY ASSOCIATE IN CERTAIN PROJECTS, UH, RENOVATION IN RIVER ROAD.
AND JIM PASSED AWAY VERY SUDDENLY ON AUGUST THE 11TH.
AND IT'S REMOVED A MAJOR VOICE THAT WE HAD, WHO MANY OF YOU HAVE HEARD HERE AT THIS COMMISSION, UM, NUMEROUS TIMES.
UH, JIM OWNED A HIGHLY HISTORICAL, SIGNIFICANT PROPERTY, THE OLD RIVER ROAD SCHOOL ON ANASTASIA PLACE.
IT'S NOW IN THE, IN THE CUSTODY OF HIS DAUGHTER, WHO'S ALSO A RIVER ROAD RESIDENT.
AND, UH, I TALK WITH HER ABOUT WHAT I WOULD SAY HERE TODAY THAT'S BLANKIE TO SULLIVAN, AND ALSO HIS NEIGHBOR WITH, WITH WHOM HE IS SO CONCERNED FOR MANY YEARS.
MRS. ROSENGREN, WHO HAS THE MOST HISTORICALLY SIGNIFICANT HOUSE, THE 1785, UH, HOUSE THAT BACKS ONTO THIS PROPERTY.
NOT TO MENTION, UH, LARRY CLARK AND JOHN HERTZ, WHO BOTH HAVE HOUSES THAT
[01:10:01]
BACK ONTO THE ASAKIA.AND I WANT TO JOIN, UH, RALEIGH WOOD IN OPPOSING THE HEIGHT, HOW THEY GOT AWAY WITH SPLITTING HISTORIC.
THAT'S THE FOUR LOTS THAT WERE ON TRAIL STREET TO THE LOTS ON ATCH, WHICH ARE NOT HISTORIC, BUT HOW THOSE LOT, THOSE, UH, HOUSES PROPOSED ON TRAIL CAN BE HIGHER THAN TWO STORY.
I ALREADY FEEL THAT, UH, SOMEONE HAS, YOU KNOW, DROPPED THE BALL AND LET US DOWN BY ALLOWING THAT.
UM, SO I'M OPPOSED TO THE HEIGHT.
I AND, UH, MY COUSIN JIM CULLUM WERE VERY OPPOSED TO THE DENSITY, BUT WE PROBABLY CAN'T DO ANYTHING ABOUT THAT NOW.
THIS IS TOO DENSE FOR THIS NEIGHBORHOOD.
IT'S TOO DENSE FOR TRAFFIC SAFETY THAT'S BEEN POINTED OUT SEVERAL TIMES, AND IT'S GONNA RESULT IN A DRAINAGE PROBLEM.
SO THAT'S THE MAIN THING THAT SEEMS TO BE UP TODAY IS DRAINAGE.
AND I JUST WANT TO ASSURE YOU, I PROMISE YOU, IF THERE IS A RAIN EITHER EQUAL TO OR CLOSE TO THE OCTOBER, 1998 RAIN, IT'S GOING TO GO INTO THE ASSIA.
NO MATTER WHAT HOLDING PONDS YOU HAVE, IT'S GOING TO GO FROM THIS NEW, UH, COVER NEW PARKING SPACES, THE REDOING OF TRAIL STREET.
IT'S GOING TO GO INTO THE ASSIA AND INTO MRS. ROSEN'S PROPERTY AND PROBABLY HER HOUSE, AND PROBABLY AT LARRY CLARK'S HOUSE, THERE WILL BE FLOODING EXACERBATED BY THIS PROJECT.
SO I KNOW THAT YOU, YOU GOOD FOLKS CANNOT LEGISLATE GREED, BUT THIS PROJECT FROM THE GET-GO HAS BEEN GOVERNED BY FIRST THE PROPERTY OWNER, MR. PRICE.
WE DON'T BEGRUDGE HIM WANTING TO MAKE A LOT OF MONEY FROM HIS PROPERTY, BUT THE ONLY WAY HE COULD DO IT WAS TO SELL IT TO THIS GROUP WHO WANT TO MILK IT JUST AS MUCH AS THEY POSSIBLY CAN.
UH, WITH THESE THREE STORY STRUCTURES, UH, OVERBUILDING THE NEIGHBORHOOD BY FAR.
SO WE'RE CONCERNED ABOUT, UH, THE, HIS HISTORY AND COMMUNITY AND AESTHETICS AND SAFETY, AND ALL OF THESE HAVE BEEN IMPACTED OR WILL BE IMPACTED BY THIS PROJECT.
SO I URGE YOU NOT TO APPROVE, UH, THE, THE FURTHER PROGRESS OF THIS PROJECT.
I RESIDE AT ONE 30 MAGNOLIA DRIVE IN RIVER ROAD NEIGHBORHOOD.
I'M ONE OF THE NEW RESIDENTS THERE.
THIS MONTH I WILL BE CELEBRATING TWO YEARS AS A RESIDENT.
I WANT TO THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE ON THIS BOARD WITH RAPID GROWTH WE ARE CURRENTLY EXPERIENCING, YOU HAVE A VERY GRAVE RESPONSIBILITY AND A SPECIAL OPPORTUNITY TO ENSURE THAT SAN ANTONIO MAINTAINS THE HISTORICAL NEIGHBORHOODS THAT WE SOW, TREASURE, AND THAT PROVIDE MUCH OF THE CITY'S RICH HISTORY.
I WANT TO RAISE TODAY A CONCERN THAT AROSE FOR ME LAST TIME AND APPARENTLY WITH A NUMBER OF OTHER PEOPLE.
AS YOU KNOW, RIVER ROAD IS PRIMARILY MADE UP OF THE ONE STORY HOMES WITH, UH, TWO STORIES SCATTERED THROUGHOUT.
SINCE IT'S NOT ALWAYS BEEN DESIGNATED A HISTORICAL DISTRICT, SOME HOMES MAY HAVE BEEN, HAVE HAD MODIFICATIONS THAT MIGHT NOT BE APPROVED TODAY.
HOWEVER, DURING THAT TIME, NO HOME WAS BUILT OR REMODELED TO EXCEED TWO STORIES.
NOW WE ARE ON THE THRESHOLD OF SEEING APPROVAL OF THE FIRST THREE STORY BUILDINGS.
IT SEEMS TO ME THAT SUDDENLY ALTER THE INTEGRITY OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD'S HISTORICAL SIGNIFICANCE.
I FEEL CERTAIN THAT ONCE SUCH NEWS IS MADE KNOWN DEVELOPERS WILL BE SEEKING EMPTY SPACES WITHIN RIVER ROAD READY TO BUILD THREE STORY OR MORE OR MORE SMALL APARTMENT BUILDINGS.
I MOVED HERE FROM STONE OAK WHERE MOST HOMES ARE AT LEAST TWO.
STORIES AND LARGE APARTMENT BUILDINGS ARE SPRINGING UP EVERYWHERE.
DEVELOPERS WANT EVERY SQUARE FOOT OF SPACE TO PRODUCE AS MANY SQUARE FEET AS POSSIBLE FOR THEIR PROFIT.
OFTEN BEAUTIFUL NATIVE TREES AND NEIGHBORHOOD QUALITY OF LIFE PAY THE PRICE.
WHAT POSSIBLE FUTURE OBJECTION CAN THE NEIGHBORHOOD MAKE IN PROTEST IF THIS PROJECT IS ALLOWED TO STAND AS PRESENTED? THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.
I RESIDE AT 7 0 6 EAST WOODLAWN AVENUE.
[01:15:01]
UH, AS YOU KNOW, RIVER ROAD IS A VERY UNIQUE PLACE AND IT CELEBRATES UNIQUE ARCHITECTURE.UM, I WISH TO, I HOPE THAT YOU WILL DENY OR OR NOT ALLOW THIS PROJECT TO MOVE FORWARD AS IT IS, UH, ESPECIALLY THE THREE STORY ELEMENT.
UM, A TWO, WHAT WAS FORMERLY A SINGLE FAMILY LOT NEXT TO ME IS NOW A TWO STORY.
AND, UM, I FEEL QUITE UNDERWHELMED BY THIS GREAT PRESENCE NEXT TO ME.
AND I REALLY LOATHE THE PROSPECT THAT IT MIGHT GIVE THE GREEN LIGHT TO DEVELOPERS TO COME IN AND GO, YAY, PRECEDENT.
I HOPE YOU'LL HEAR MY VOICE AT THE END OF THIS GOING, PLEASE DENY THIS PROJECT.
UM, WHAT I HAVE NOTICED WHEN, WHEN MY, UH, MY NEIGHBORS WERE FIGHTING FOR THE HISTORICAL HOME THAT I RESIDE IN, UH, IS TOWARDS THE END OF THIS PROCESS, THE APPLICANT BEGINS WITH HIS, UH, CASE.
AND THEN WE GET TO RESPOND, AND THEN THE APPLICANT RESPONDS, I INFINITUM, RESPOND, RESPOND, RESPOND.
AND THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE LEFT WITH RINGING IN YOUR EARS WHEN IT'S TIME TO MAKE YOUR DECISION.
SO I HOPE YOU'LL HEAR MY VOICE AT THE END.
UH, MR. CLARK RECEIVES NINE MINUTES.
UH, BILL SIBLEY AND EMILY FERRY HAVE YIELDED THEIR TIME.
UM, AND AGAIN, THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME TODAY.
REALLY APPRECIATE YOU HEARING US.
WE'VE BEEN BACK HERE MANY TIMES.
WE'VE MET WITH THIS GROUP MANY TIMES.
UM, BUT OUR GOAL HERE TODAY IS TO NOT ALLOW FINAL APPROVAL FOR THIS FRESH.
UM, IT'S NOT READY FOR FINAL APPROVAL.
NOT ENOUGH INFORMATION'S BEEN PROVIDED STILL, AND IT'S NOT A PROBLEM OF ANYTHING WITH TO DO WITH THE SITE.
IT HAS TO DO WITH THE SITE DESIGN.
THERE'S NOTHING THAT'S CHANGED SINCE THE LAST TIME WE MET HERE, EXCEPT FOR A FEW PERSPECTIVE SKETCHES THAT HAVE BEEN MADE, UH, PRETTIER PICTURES, UH, PUT INTO THE PRESENTATION.
SO I WANT TO, I DON'T WANNA KEEP REITERATING WHAT EVERYBODY ELSE HAS SAID ABOUT THE DRAINAGE ON THIS SITE AND WHAT WE'VE TALKED ABOUT FOR OVER A YEAR.
BUT, UM, ONLY NOW IS THE APPLICANT REALLY DRILLING DOWN ON THE DRAINAGE AND IT'S TROUBLING, PARTICULARLY WITH RESPECT TO THE HISTORIC RESOURCES.
DIPLY PUT, YOU CANNOT APPROVE A PLAN THAT SHOWS ANY WATER DRAINING INTO AND HAVING IMPACT ON THE ASA.
IN THE U D C, IT SAYS, ASS SHALL NOT BE USED FOR ANY TYPE OF DRAINAGE.
OKAY? AND THIS NEEDS TO BE REPEATED.
ASCHES SHALL NOT BE USED FOR ANY TYPE OF DRAINAGE, OKAY? UM, BUT, AND THAT HAS TO DO WITH WATER RUNNING OFF OF PARKING LOTS, SPECIFICALLY IN THE U D C AND HARDSCAPE AND OTHER, UM, IMPERVIOUS SERVICES, AS WELL AS IMPERVIOUS SURFACES.
BUT THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT THE APPLICANT HAS GOT ON THIS PROPERTY.
DRAINAGE IS FUNDAMENTAL TO THE SITE DESIGN OF THIS PROJECT, AND THE EXISTING PATTERN OF RUNOFF IS A NON-COMPLIANT CONDITION.
LONG STORY SHORT, THEY HAVE A PATTERN OF DRAINAGE THAT'S BROAD AND WIDE THAT RUNS INTO THE 1776 ASAKIA.
THE LAW DOESN'T SAY THAT YOU CAN CONTINUE TO RUN STORM WATER OFF THE SAME RATE AS THE CURRENT CONDITION.
OKAY? THEY ARE PROPOSING TO RUN THEIR CONCENTRATED FLOW FROM ALL OF THEIR HARDSCAPE INTO THE YIA.
AND I'VE SPOKEN TO A NUMBER OF CIVIL ENGINEERS ABOUT THIS, AND I HAVE OVER 30 YEARS IN PRACTICE AS A LICENSED LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT DEALING WITH DRAINAGE.
I KNOW WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT.
EVEN IF THIS WAS AN UNDEVELOPED SITE IN STON OAK WHERE LUCY CAME FROM, UM, IT WAS IN, IT WAS IN THE SUBURBS, AND IT HAD A NATURAL DRAINAGE FLOW ACROSS IT.
UM, YOU CAN'T CONCENTRATE FLOW AND DUMP IT INTO YOUR NEIGHBOR'S PROPERTY.
THEY CAN'T, THEY WON'T ACCEPT THAT WITHOUT A SUITABLE CONVEYANCE AND AN EASEMENT THAT WOULD TAKE THAT WATER TO A SUITABLE CONVEYANCE DOWNSTREAM.
OKAY? THE SITE HAS NO SUCH SUITABLE CONVEYANCE.
EVEN IF THIS SITE WASN'T ON THE ASA, IT WOULD NEED A VARIANCE TO GET THEIR WATER OFF THE SITE.
THERE'S NO SUITABLE OUTFALL AVAILABLE.
UM, SO THE APPLICANT SHOWS A PROPOSED 22 FOOT WIDE EASEMENT ALONG THE ASSIA ON THE UPHILL SIDE DUMPING WATER INTO THE ASSIA.
[01:20:01]
LAW.IT'S ALSO, OF COURSE, NOT THE PROPER THING TO DO WITH THE 1776 HISTORIC RESOURCE.
SO THE SECTION THAT WE GOT THIS MORNING, WHICH I THINK IS A LITTLE UNFAIR TO TRY TO REACT TO PLANS THAT WE GOT THIS MORNING, AND I THINK IT'S UNFAIR FOR YOU, I DON'T THINK THAT DESIGN REVIEW IS A PERFORMANCE ART THAT SHOULD BE DONE HERE.
WE NEED TIME TO LOOK AT THESE THINGS, BUT THEY ARE PROPOSING WALLS IN KNOW, BUILDING A NARROW CHUTE ALONG THE ASA.
AND NOTE THAT THE RETAINING WALLS WILL ALSO NEED TO BE OVER EXCAVATED.
THOSE WALLS ARE SHOWN WITHIN FOUR AND A HALF FEET OF THE ASA.
OKAY? THOSE FOOTINGS ON THOSE WALLS ARE GONNA HAVE A BIG IMPACT.
AND I THINK THE WALLS ARE OBJECTIONABLE, BUT WE STILL DON'T KNOW WHAT IT'S GONNA LOOK LIKE.
WE HAVE ONLY A FEW PRETTY PICTURES.
IT'S NOT APPROPRIATE TO PLACE THESE WALLS ALONG THE ASSIA OR ALONG ATCH AND ALONG ATCH.
THEY'RE RIGHT UP AGAINST THE PROPERTY LINE ON BOTH CORNERS.
THEY'RE NOT SET BACK AS THE BUILDINGS ARE.
IF THE BUILDINGS ARE SET BACK, WHY WOULDN'T THE UTILITY, UH, ALSO BE SET BACK ON THE EDGE? UM, IF THE ASI WASN'T THERE, THEN THE APPLICANT WOULD STILL HAVE A PROBLEM WITH CONCENTRATING RUNOFF ON THAT SOUTH, ON THAT EDGE OF THE PROPERTY.
BUT SINCE THE ASI IS THERE, THERE'S NO WAY THEY CAN BE ALLOWED BY THIS COMMISSION.
IT'S REALLY CLEAR IN THE RIO AND IN THE U D C U D C, AGAIN, AS SEKIS SHALL NOT BE USED FOR ANY TYPE OF DRAINAGE.
BUT THE BIG PROBLEM REALLY IS THIS DESIGN PROCESS.
THIS APPLICANT, IN MY PROFESSIONAL OPINION, IS COME TO DRAINAGE WAY LATE IN THE GAME, AS WAS STATED.
THEY CONSIDERED THE PROPERTY EDGES AND HOW MANY UNITS THEY COULD PUT ON THE SITE WITHOUT CONSIDERING TREES OR DRAINAGE OR OTHER NATURAL CONDITIONS ON THE SITE.
THEY HAVE A PLAN THAT'S NOT AT ALL FLEXIBLE.
THEY'RE GONNA NEED TO GET FLEXIBLE TO ACCOMMODATE THESE LARGE DRAINAGE FEATURES ON THEIR SITE.
UM, I THINK THAT HAD THEY CONSIDERED THESE ELEMENTS A YEAR AGO, WE'D BE IN A LOT DIFFERENT PLACE TODAY.
WE WOULD HAVE A PLAN THAT MAYBE WAS RESPONDING BACK TO THE GRADING AND DRAINAGE OF THE SITE.
WE REPEATEDLY ASKED FOR A BETTER SITE PLAN, AND ALL OF THE THINGS THAT WE'VE ASKED FOR HAVE FALLEN ON DEAF EARS.
BOUNDARY OF THIS LOT WAS JUST FILLED UP WITH AS MANY UNITS AS THEY COULD POSSIBLY CRAM INTO IT.
THEY PUT 40 POUNDS INTO A 20 POUND BAG, AND NOW THEY'RE TRYING TO FIND OTHER PLACES IN THE BAG TO PLACE THE DRAINAGE FEATURES.
THEIR LAYOUT WASN'T DEVELOPED WITHOUT A CONCERN FOR TREES OR DRAINAGE.
THEY WERE TRIVIAL MATTERS, AND THEY WEREN'T REALLY THINKING ABOUT HOW THEY MIGHT ADJUST THE PLAN AS, AS THESE THINGS NEEDED TO BE RESPONDED TO.
UM, AGAIN, THEY NEED TO ANALYZE THE EFFECT OF THIS DRAINAGE.
THEY NEED TO TELL US HOW LARGE IT'S GONNA BE, WHAT IT'S GONNA LOOK LIKE, AND THEY NEED TO ANALYZE WHAT'S HAPPENING.
THIS SITE IS WITHIN 600 FEET OF THE RIVER.
AND THE, AND THE REQUIREMENT IS A 2000 FOOT DOWNSTREAM LOOK AT, UH, AT DRAINAGE.
SO THIS IS NOT READY FOR APPROVAL.
THEY HAVE OPTIONS AND THEY SAY THE SIZE AND THE VOLUME ARE NOT FINAL.
LAST TIME WE WERE HERE, WE HEARD YOU SAY, I NEED TO UNDERSTAND THE DESIGN OF THE ESTR PLAN BEFORE I CAN APPROVE THIS.
NOTHING'S CHANGED SINCE THE LAST TIME OR THE TIME BEFORE THAT.
WE HAVE A CONTINUED FAILURE TO SOLVE DESIGN ISSUES, AND WE WANT TO SEE FINAL PLANS FOR FINAL APPROVAL, NOT A BUNCH OF OPTIONS THAT ARE UNDEFINED.
I FURTHERMORE THINK THAT IT'S UNFAIR OF THE APPLICANT TO PUT PLANS IN THERE THIS MORNING THAT WE CAN'T BE EXPECTED TO LOOK AT.
AND AT A REVISED PACKAGE THAT WAS PUT IN TODAY, THE DRAWINGS ARE EVEN DATED WITH TODAY'S DATE.
WHEN I GO TO FINAL TO, FOR A FINAL APPROVAL AT HT R C, I EXPECT YOU TO SEE FINAL PLANS, BUT ALSO TO HAVE SOME TIME TO EVALUATE THOSE PLANS BEFORE THEY'RE APPROVED.
I THINK IT'S DISRESPECTFUL AND I WOULD REALLY URGE YOU TO NOT APPROVE THIS PROJECT AT THIS TIME.
LUCY, WHO IS A NEW NEIGHBOR, PUT TOGETHER THE, UH, THE, UH, NATIONAL NIGHT OUT LAST NIGHT.
AND WE ALL MET UNDER THAT GREAT BIG OAK TREE THERE ON THE, ON THE LOWER LEFT AND, UH, DIEGO BERNAL'S OFFICE.
AND THE, AND OUR COUNCILMAN AND POLICE CAME AND WE HAD A GREAT TIME IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND EVERYBODY CAME TOGETHER.
I ONLY WISH THAT WE HAD HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO COME TOGETHER WITH THIS DEVELOPER A LONG TIME AGO AND REALLY DEVELOP A PLAN THAT RESPONDS TO
[01:25:01]
ALL THE CONCERNS THAT WE HAVE IN THIS NEIGHBORHOOD ABOUT THIS PROJECT.I REALLY APPRECIATE YOUR TIME.
OH, WE'RE NOT GONNA SEE THE FILM AGAIN.
WHITE WATER RAPIDS COMING DOWN.
THE ASI ASAKIA IS UNDERSIZED RIGHT NOW FOR THE VOLUME OF WATER.
AND WHAT THE APPLICANT SHOWS IS A WALL AGAINST THE ASAKIA WITH HOLES IN IT IN ONE LOCATION THAT WILL DUMP WATER OUT OF THAT POND.
IT'S REALLY NARROW, A LITTLE POND AS IT NARROWS DOWN.
THOSE HOLES ARE SIX INCHES IN DIAMETER.
THEY COULD CLOG WATER WILL DUMP OVER THE TOP OF THAT WALL.
IF THEY DO, THAT'S TIME AND CRASH ONTO THE, THE ASAKI ITSELF.
HOW BARBARA HERE? UM, LOUISE TRINIDAD.
HEY, I THINK THAT'S ALL WE HAVE.
SO, UM, AS I SAID, MY NAME IS JAMES MCKNIGHT AND I'M, I'M HERE TO ANSWER OR TRY TO ANSWER SOME OF THE QUESTIONS ABOUT THE DRAINAGE ISSUE.
UM, YES, IT'S TRUE THAT PART OF THE CODE 6 72 SAYS THAT NO TYPE OF DRAINAGE INTO THE ASSIA.
THE NEXT SECTION OF THE CODE SAYS, WHERE ARCHEOLOGICAL EVIDENCE INDICATES A SITE CONTAINS OR HAS CONTAINED A SPANISH COLONIAL SEIA INCORPORATE THE ORIGINAL PATH OF THE ASA AS A NATURAL DRAINAGE WAY OR LANDSCAPE FEATURE INTO THE SITE.
IT SEEMS LIKE THERE IS IN THE CODE A WAY FOR YOU TO USE THE ASSIA AS SOME KIND OF DRAINAGE.
SO YOU'VE GOT ONE SECTION THAT SAYS NO DRAINAGE AT ALL, AND THE NEXT SECTION THAT SAYS YOU CAN USE IT FOR DRAINAGE AS LONG AS YOU'RE USING IT THIS WAY.
THE ONLY WAY I CAN AND TRY TO RESOLVE THAT, IS TO TRY TO LOOK AT THE LARGER PICTURE.
6 72 SAYS THAT THERE ARE, THERE'S NO DRAINAGE ALLOWED UNDER THE PARKING AREA.
AND THEN YOU HAVE THE SITE DESIGN THAT ALLOWS YOU TO HAVE DRAINAGE AS LONG AS YOU'RE USING IT IN THIS NATURAL FLOW.
LOOK AT THE LARGER CONTEXT OF THE WATER CODE ITSELF.
SECTION 11.086, THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN.
THE, THE, THE GENERAL RULE IN TEXAS IS THAT YOU CAN'T DIVERT OR IMPOUND WATER TO HAVE AN ADVERSE IMPACT ON YOUR NEIGHBOR.
I MEAN, THAT'S THE, AND, AND USUALLY THAT'S, THAT'S INTERPRETED TO MEAN THAT YOU CAN'T INCREASE THE FLOW.
SO WHAT WE'RE SAYING IS THAT FROM OUR PERSPECTIVE, WE'RE NOT INCREASING THE FLOW.
THE CODE, THE U D C ITSELF HAS CONTRADICTING PASSAGES ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT YOU CAN DRAIN.
SO IT MUST MEAN SOMETHING ELSE.
IF YOU TAKE THAT INTO CONTEXT WITH, YOU CAN'T DIVERT OR IMPOUND IF YOU'RE IMPOUNDING, WHICH WE, YOU WOULD BE ASKING US TO DO, IS WE'VE GOT WATER THAT'S FLOWING OFF THIS SITE AS IT IS INTO THE SAIA.
NOW YOU'RE SAYING YOU CAN'T DO ANYTHING LIKE THAT.
THAT'S GENERALLY NOT THE RULE.
BUT IF THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, THEN THAT MEANS THAT WE HAVE TO DIVERT THE WATER SOMEPLACE ELSE.
AND THAT'S PART OF THE WATER CODE THAT DOES THAT SAYS YOU MIGHT HAVE THE ADVERSE IMPACT NOW SOMEPLACE ELSE.
SO I BELIEVE THAT THE WAY THAT THE, THE CODE IS WRITTEN IS TO SAY THAT PARKING AREA, THE WAY THAT YOU DRAIN OFF OF A PARKING AREA, CAN'T BE RELEASED INTO THE ASSIA, BUT YOU CAN RELEASE INTO THE ASSIA AS LONG AS YOU ARE NOT INCREASING THE DRAINAGE FLOW AS IT WAS.
AND AS LONG AS IT'S NOT A DIRECT FLOW OFF OF YOUR PARKING.
SO, I MEAN, IT'S JUST A WAY TO TRY TO RESOLVE WHAT THESE TWO THINGS MEAN.
BUT I I DO BELIEVE THAT YOU CAN, AND, AND ALL OF THIS, THIS ALSO IS UNDER THE CONTEXT OF THE APPROVAL OF T C I, I MEAN, WE CANNOT GET A A, A PERMIT IF ANOTHER DEPARTMENT IS REVIEWING THIS AND SAYS, YOU CAN'T DO THAT.
SO I THINK THAT THE, THE, THE ROLE OF THE HT R C WHEN WE'RE LOOKING AT THE DESIGN IS HOW WE ARE HANDLING MOSTLY THE BUILDINGS.
THE DRAINAGE COMES INTO EFFECT HERE BECAUSE OF ITS RELATIONSHIP TO THE ASAKIA.
BUT I THINK YOUR ROLE WOULD BE MORE TO SEE WHETHER OR NOT WE HAVE SOLUTIONS THAT COULD BE APPROVED, THAT SOLUTIONS THAT ARE APPROPRIATE FOR THE ASAKI IS ITS IN ITS LOCATIONS AS FAR AS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THE WATER OVERFLOWS.
THAT'S A DIFFERENT DEPARTMENT.
AND THEY SAY WHETHER OR NOT YOU CAN DO THAT OR NOT DO THAT.
AND WE OBVIOUSLY, WE'D NEVER BE ABLE TO GET AWAY FROM THAT IF THEY DID, IF THEY CAME BACK AND SAID, YOU CAN'T DO THIS, THAT YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TO HAVE A LARGER POND.
AND THAT'S THE OTHER PART, THE SIZE OF THE POND AND THE SIZE OF THE WALLS.
THOSE ARE ALL GOVERNED BY THESE, THESE NUMBERS THAT THE ENGINEERS CAN'T GET AROUND.
AND THE THE SAME NUMBERS THAT THE ENGINEERS OF THE CITY ARE REVIEWING AND SAYING, YES, THIS WILL WORK, OR NO, IT WON'T.
AND IF THEY SAY IT DOESN'T, YOU CAN'T GET YOUR PERMIT THAT YOU HAVE TO CHANGE YOUR SITE DESIGN, YOU HAVE TO MAKE THE POND BIGGER.
WELL, THAT MIGHT CHANGE THE DESIGN OF THE
[01:30:01]
PROJECT.WELL, THEY WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO BUILD THAT, AS IT WERE.
IF YOU GET CONCEPTUAL, IF YOU GET FINAL APPROVAL AND THEN YOU HAVE TO CHANGE IT, YOU WOULD HAVE TO COME BACK HERE TO, TO SEE THAT.
SO THERE'S NO, THERE'S NO WAY THAT WE COULD BUILD SOMETHING THAT WOULDN'T MATCH THAT FINAL APPROVAL EITHER.
UH, THE CITY IS GONNA SAY, YEAH, YOU CAN GET YOUR PERMIT AND YOU CAN BUILD, OR THEY SAY, NO, YOU HAVE TO DESIGN SOMETHING ELSE AND WE'D HAVE TO COME BACK.
BUT EITHER WAY, THERE'S OVERSIGHT HERE, MAKING SURE THAT WE ARE DOING THE CORRECT OUTFLOW.
UM, I WANT TO INTERRUPT IF I CAN, I DON'T WANT, UH, IF YOU'RE, IF YOU'RE ON A ROLL, KEEP IT.
UM, SO I HAVE A QUICK QUESTION.
UH, CAN YOU BRING UP THE, UM, IMAGE OF THE SECTION OF THE RETAINAGE POND? AND THEN ALSO CAN YOU HAVE READY THE IMAGE OF THE RENDERING, BECAUSE I WANNA MAKE SURE, UH, THE CONVERSATION, THE, THE, THE STATEMENT THAT YOU JUST MADE IS VERY IMPORTANT.
AND I THINK THAT FOR US TO MAKE A DETERMINATION ON WHAT, UH, UH, I WOULD AGREE WITH YOUR MOST OF YOUR UNDERSTANDING OR OUR PURVIEW.
BUT THE, UM, QUESTION I HAVE IS THAT THIS SECTION, WHAT, AS GENERIC AS IT SEEMS, IT'S AN ENGINEERING SECTION, I GET IT.
UM, IT DOESN'T MATCH THE ARCHITECTURAL RENDERINGS IN SIZE, SCALE, OR, UM, MY OPINION, UM, FAILING.
COULD I INVITE OUR LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT WHO COORDINATED WITH THE CIVIL ENGINEER UP TO, HI, I'M MARK PADILLA WITH MP STUDIO.
SO IN OUR COORDINATION WITH CIVIL ENGINEER, WHAT WE WERE LOOKING AT AND STUDYING IS THE, UH, FINISH HEIGHT ELEVATION OF THE WALL.
THAT WOULD BE, UM, ALLOWING THE FREEBOARD FROM THE BOTTOM OF THE, THE, UH, OF THE POND AS IT'S COLLECTING WATER, HOW MUCH WATER WOULD BE NECESSARY TO COME UP, AND THEN WHAT THAT TOP OF ELEVATION ENDS UP BEING.
UM, OUR, UH, OUR BIG, UM, UH, PUSH TO THE CIVIL ENGINEER, UM, AS A, A DESIGN AESTHETIC APPLICATION WAS SAYING WE DIDN'T WANT THAT WALL TO HAVE A DROP MORE THAN 30 INCHES, UH, FOR THE, FOR THE IDEA THAT WE DIDN'T WANT A HANDRAIL TO THEN HAVE TO BE SCREENED OR SOMETHING TO BE PUT AROUND POND AS WELL FOR THE STREET VIEW AESTHETIC, UH, APPLICATION.
UM, SO WITH THAT, THEN HE HAS TO DETERMINE, OKAY, WELL HOW WIDE THEN DOES MY POND HAVE TO BE? OR, OR CAN I MAKE THIS WORK? UM, AND SO, UM, HE GAVE US THESE, UH, THESE CUT SECTIONS IN SAYING, YOU KNOW, OUR WALL CANNOT BE MORE THAN 24 INCHES TALL.
UM, AND SO WE TOOK THAT, UM, AND, AND AFTER HE GAVE US THE SITE PLAN, UM, LAYOUT AND, AND APPLICATION, THEN WE TOOK THAT AND KIND OF SAID, OKAY, IF THE WALL HAS TO BE 24 INCHES TALL, UH, FOR HIM TO BE ABLE TO HAVE A FREEBOARD INSIDE THAT POND OR DETENTION AREA, UM, THEN WE, WE WOULD BE LOOKING AT, OKAY, WELL HOW DOES THAT APPLY INTO ACTUAL SITE? AND SO WE PUT IT INTO THREE D TO EVEN GET AN UNDERSTANDING OURSELVES WITH SAYING WHAT'S GONNA HAPPEN ON THE, UM, ON THE WEST END AND WHAT'S GONNA HAPPEN ON THE EAST END OF THIS POND, BECAUSE WE KNOW THAT GRADE IS FALLING FROM ONE END TO THE OTHER WHERE IT'S GONNA BE HIGHER ON THE, UH, SIA SIDE ON THE EAST SIDE.
UM, AND SO THAT'S WHERE THAT THREE D UH, RENDERING THEN COMES INTO PLAY INTO SAYING, HERE'S WHAT IT ACTUALLY REALLY IS GONNA LOOK LIKE.
WE'RE GONNA, WE'RE GONNA BUILD UP, UM, WHERE ON THE WEST SIDE IT'S GONNA BE, UM, ABOUT SIX INCHES ABOVE GRADE WHERE WE WOULD BE ABLE TO HIDE THAT WITH RENDERING OR WITH, WITH, UH, WITH PLANT MATERIAL.
UM, AND THEN IT'S GONNA HAVE A 30 INCH DROP INTO THE POND.
UM, SO THAT WAY, UM, IT WOULD BE OR LESS THAN 30 INCHES.
SO THAT WAY WE WOULD ALLOW, UH, NO HANDRAILS TO HAPPEN THERE.
WE'LL PUT A BARRIER AROUND THAT AS WELL WHERE WE CAN, UH, FOR WITH PLANT MATERIALS.
AND THEN ON THE, UM, THE EAST SIDE, UM, THE WALL WOULD THEN BE UP AGAINST THE TRAIL SITUATION, AND WE WOULD WANT THAT TO ACT AS KIND OF A CURB BARRIER, IF YOU WILL.
AND SO IT WOULD BE GENERALLY ABOUT, UM, 12 INCHES HIGH, HIGHER THAN THE TRAIL UP AGAINST THE, THAT THEN I GUESS GOES UP AGAINST THE PROPERTY LINE WHERE THAT, THAT 12 INCHES THEN WOULD, WOULD BE THE HEIGHT ON THE TRAIL SIDE AND THEN DROP DOWN INTO ANOTHER, YOU KNOW, NO MORE THAN 24 INCHES BELOW OR DROP INTO THE, UH, INTO THE POND ITSELF.
CAN I ASK A QUICK QUESTION ABOUT THE, THE RENDERING THAT'S ON THE SCREEN? SO THE, THE, THE EDGE OF THE WALL THAT THIS IS WE ATCH, RIGHT? YES.
THIS IS, WE SATCH THE EDGE OF THE WALL THAT IS ON THE PLAN THAT, UH, IS ALONG THE EDGE OF THE PROPERTY LINE PARALLELING SATCH IN THIS IMAGE.
IT'S COVERED UP WITH THE PLANTS? YES.
[01:35:01]
OKAY.WHAT IS THE CHANGE OF GRADE FROM THE CURB TO THE TOP OF THE WALL? THAT'S GONNA BE ABOUT, UM, ON THE FAR WEST SIDE, IT OUGHT TO BE ABOUT SIX INCHES IS WHERE WE'RE TRYING TO TRANSITION ON FAR WEST SIDE.
AND THEN ON THE EAST SIDE, IT'S GONNA BE ABOUT 12 INCHES HIGHER, UM, BETWEEN SIX INCHES AND 12 INCHES HIGHER THAN TOP OF CURB.
I THINK THE GENTLEMAN BEFORE HAD A, A GOOD POINT.
UM, I THINK THE FIRST PART OF YOUR SPEECH, I DON'T KNOW ABOUT CODE, I'M NOT LEGAL, BUT I DON'T KNOW ABOUT, UM, CHALLENGE IN THE U D C
THE SECOND PART IS WHAT'S IMPORTANT.
AND I THINK THAT'S WHAT I'VE BEEN, UM, KIND OF, UM, MY OPINION HAS BEEN THAT, UM, THE APPLICANT IS NOT ONLY ABOUT, I MEAN, WHATEVER WE DECIDE TODAY ON DESIGN ON A FINAL DETENTION POND, WHICH I DON'T AGREE WITH US BEING THE DESIGNERS OF IT, IT WILL DEPEND ON ULTIMATELY BY T C I OR WHATEVER DEPARTMENT GIVES OUT THE PERMITS.
THEY'RE GONNA ANALYZE THIS, WHAT IS THE NEED, WHAT IS THAT POND GONNA BE THE SIZE AND WHAT'S GONNA LOOK LIKE IF THERE'S ANY DESIGN OR REQUIRED DESIGN OR CHANGES, IT WOULD HAVE TO COME BACK TO US, CORRECT.
THEY'RE THE ENGINEERS, BUT WE'RE OBVIOUSLY GONNA WORK TOGETHER AND MAKE SURE THE, UM, RECOMMENDATIONS OF THIS COMMISSION AS WELL AS THE U D C INTENTIONS ARE MET.
SO I'M MORE, UM, SO IF WE TODAY APPROVE THIS AND THIS LOCATION OF THE DETENTION POND AND THE WALL DESIGN AND THAT IS APPROVED BY TS I MEAN, IF THAT COMPLIES WITH THE, UM, THE FLOW AND THE RULES AND EVERYTHING, THEN THAT'S HOW IT WOULD BE.
BUT CAN WE MAYBE SAY WE DON'T APPROVE THE FINAL DESIGN UNTIL THEY ACTUALLY GET, UM, A PERMIT TO SEE WHAT SIZE THAT DETENTION POND WOULD BE A FINAL NUMBER FOR IT.
I MEAN, YOUR REVIEW AUTHORITY IS REALLY, UM, ARTICLE SIX OF THE U D C, AND SO THAT INCLUDES RIO AND HISTORIC DISTRICTS IN THIS CASE.
UM, AND SO WE CAN ENSURE THAT THE PROVISIONS IN THIS AT THIS COMMISSION LEVEL, UM, AT ARTICLE SIX AS IT RELATES TO STORM WATER, WHICH INCLUDES A LITTLE BIT, OBVIOUSLY THE SECTION ABOUT NOT DRAINING INTO THE ASAKIA OR DESIGNING A STORM WATER SYSTEM THAT USES THE ASAKIA IS IN THERE.
UM, AND SO WE CAN MAKE SURE THAT THAT'S MET IN THE PERMITTING PROCESS, BUT REALLY IT'S SEPARATE.
UM, IF, IF THROUGH THE PERMIT REVIEW PROCESS WITH STORM WATER, UM, THERE ARE CHANGES TO THE SITE PLAN THAT HAS RECEIVED APPROVAL, THEN YES, THEY, THEY WILL HAVE TO RETURN FOR FURTHER REVIEW.
SO I THINK MY QUESTION JUST GOES BACK TO, UM, I I JUST WANTED TO CLARIFY WHAT IT IS THAT'S BEING PRESENTED TODAY.
SO I THINK FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND, WE'RE PRESENTING A WALL THAT IS SIX INCHES TALL AT, AT THE WEST END, THAT TAPERS DOWN TO A 12 INCH HEIGHT WALL THAT THEN DROPS DOWN TO NO MORE THAN 30 INCHES IN DEPTH.
AND THEN THE ENGINEERING FOR THE SURFACE AREA, OR THE, I GUESS THE, THE BOTTOM FOOTPRINT OF THAT POND WILL BE DETERMINED BASED ON ENGINEERING AND THE, THE PERMITTING PROCESS THAT YOU GUYS HAVE.
SO TO ME, WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT IS HOW THAT WALL IS BEING TREATED AND WHAT'S BEING PRESENTED.
THE ONLY CLARIFICATION I WANNA MAKE IS THAT THE RETAINING WALL THAT WAS SHOWN IN THAT ENGINEERING DRAWING THAT'S FIVE, SIX FEET IS NOT, UM, WHAT'S BEING PROPOSED BECAUSE IT IS PART OF THE PACKAGE AND IT WAS PRESENTED TODAY.
AND TO ME, THAT IS NOT WHAT WE'RE, THAT CANNOT BE APPROVED TODAY, IN MY OPINION.
AND THAT'S OUR UNDERSTANDING AS WELL, THAT THE, YOU'RE NOT GONNA HAVE A, UH, A WALL THAT'S GONNA BE EXPOSED, UH, YOU KNOW, TWO FEET UP OR, OR, OR HIGHER, UM, AS IT'S SHOWN ON THAT ELEVATION THERE.
UM, WE'LL BE WORKING WITH THE ENGINEER.
ESSENTIALLY WHAT HE'S LOOKING AT IS THE CAPACITY THAT'S, THAT'S HOLDING WITHIN THAT POND, UM, IS, IS MAIN PRIORITY AND NOT NECESSARILY THE, UH, THE HEIGHT.
IT'S, UH, THAT'S BEING EXPOSED ESPECIALLY, UH, LIKE ON THAT FIRST EXHIBIT A.
UM, AND B I KNOW THERE IS A GRADE TRANSITION WHERE, UH, THE, THE SITE IS SITTING UP HIGHER.
WE DO HAVE TO STAIR STEP DOWN, UM, AND UP AGAINST THE TRAIL THERE, THERE WILL BE, UM, OH, I, I GUESS, UH, SOMEWHAT OF A RETAINING WALL, UM, FOR THAT, UH, POND.
BUT AGAIN, WE'RE LOOKING AND WORKING WITH THE ENGINEER TO MAKING SURE THAT THAT'S, UH, CONTAINED TO ABOUT THAT 18 INCHES OR 12 INCHES.
UM, I, I JUST WANT TO KIND OF RECAP OF WHERE MY CONCERNS LIE AND KIND OF HOW I'M TRYING
[01:40:01]
TO UNDERSTAND THIS.WHEN THIS FIRST CAME FOR FINAL APPROVAL MEETING BEFORE LAST, UM, THE PRIMARY MECHANISM FOR DEALING WITH ALL THE STORM DRAINAGE WAS PERVIOUS COVER.
AND THE CONCERN, UH, WAS RAISED THAT IT DOESN'T SEEM PLAUSIBLE THAT THE STORM WATER, UH, ISSUES COULD BE RESOLVED WITH PERVIOUS COVER ALONE, NOR DID IT SEEM PLAUSIBLE THAT, UH, STORM WATER RUNOFF WOULDN'T BE DRAINING INTO THE ASAKIA.
SO WE ASKED YOU TO TAKE ANOTHER LOOK.
I THINK WE CONTINUED THE CASE, IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY, UH, TO SEE, UH, WHAT ADDITIONAL SITE FEATURES MAY BE REQUIRED TO DEAL WITH THE STORMWATER ISSUE.
SO THE LA IN THE LAST HEARING, WE, WE'VE GOT WHAT'S ON THE SCREEN, THE TWO, THE TWO DETENTION PONDS.
AND, AND I MEAN, MY PERCEPTION OF, OF, OR MY REACTION TO THOSE WERE KIND OF, AT LEAST IN TERMS OF THE SITE PLAN, SITE PLAN ELEMENTS, ELEMENTS THAT ARE SEEN FROM THE STREET AND THE CONTEXT OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND, UH, FROM THE ASAKIA, UH, REPRESENTED A WORST CASE SCENARIO FOR ME.
IT WAS, IT WAS RELATIVELY ALARMING.
YOU PRESENTED IT AS SUCH AS A WORST CASE SCENARIO.
THIS IS AS BIG AS THESE THINGS CAN GET.
UH, I ASKED A LOT OF QUESTIONS, I THINK OTHER COMMISSIONERS DID TOO, ABOUT THE RELATIONSHIP TO THE HEIGHT OF THESE FEATURES AS IT RELATES TO GRADE THAT WAS DIFFICULT TO UNDERSTAND.
AND, UM, THERE WERE SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT DOES THIS REALLY REPRESENT THE WORST CASE SCENARIO IN DETAIN? DOES IS THIS ACCOUNTING FOR, UM, WATER, WATER DETENTION THAT'S ASSOCIATED WITH THE IMPROVEMENTS MADE TO THE SIDE? IS IT PASSING THROUGH, UM, THE STORM WATER THAT IS COMING FROM ADJACENT PROPERTIES ONTO THE SITE? KIND OF WHAT ARE THESE REALLY SIZED FOR? AND I THINK THE CIVIL ENGINEER, IF I RECALL CORRECTLY, SAID, WELL, IT'S SIZED, UH, IN A WAY THAT MOSTLY ACCOMMODATES THE ADDITIONAL RUNOFF THAT WOULD BE CONTRIBUTED BY THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE SITE.
IT'S NOT DEALING WITH THE WATER, WHICH WOULD BE THE NORTHWEST CORNER ALONG SATCH.
I BELIEVE THERE'S A COUPLE OF PARCELS THERE THAT DRAIN ONTO THE SITE.
UM, AND THEN THERE WAS, BUT IT DOESN'T QUITE DO THAT.
THERE'S IMPERVIOUS COVER SOMEWHERE.
I SU I SUSPECT IT WAS AROUND, AROUND THE POOL AREA IN THAT, THAT WHERE SOME PERVIOUS, UH, SOME PERVIOUS SYSTEMS WERE BEING USED TO REDUCE THE SIZE OF THE HEIGHT OR THE FOOTPRINT OF THE PONDS.
IS THAT CORRECT? AND I THINK WE'D BE TREATING THOSE IN BETWEEN THE BUILDINGS AS LIKE, ALMOST AS A BIO RETENTION AS WELL, THAT, UM, PARTICULARLY ON THAT BOTTOM POND, UM, IT WOULD BE GOING WEST WHERE IT WOULD ALSO BE ACTING AS PART OF THAT POND AND RETAINING, UH, WATER AS WELL AS IT, WHILE IT'S SLOWING IT DOWN AND CAPTURING IT AND RELEASING IT WITHIN THAT 48 HOUR, YOU CHANGED TO SLIDE 13, JUST SO WE CAN KINDA SEE THIS ON THE WHOLE, MAYBE IT'S 13 OF THE LATE SUBMISSION AND ZOOM IN ON THE LOWER DRAWING.
SO, SO THE AREA OSS ONE IS DRAINING ON TO THE PARCEL, CORRECT.
OSS ONE AND OSS TWO STORM WATER IS BEING INTRODUCED ONTO THE PARCEL IN THE NORTHWEST CORNER.
UM, THIS, UH, ZONE LABELED P THREE IS THAT, THAT'S DRAINING ON TRAIL, CORRECT.
AND THAT WATER FLOWS EAST AND THEN WHAT HAPPENS TO IT? I, I'M, I'M NOT, SINCE WE DIDN'T BRING OUR CIVIL ENGINEER TODAY, I DON'T WANNA, I REALLY, IT, IT'S OKAY.
I MEAN, I, I WENT AND AFTER THE LAST HEARING WALKED THE SITE AFTER WE HAD A RECENT RAIN, JUST SO I COULD MAKE SURE IT, IT FLOWS DOWN EAST.
I THINK EVERYTHING GOES TOWARD THE RIVER EAST.
THAT'S WHAT ALL THE FLOW DIRECTIONS ARE SHOWING ON YOUR MAP.
SO THAT SMALL ZONE THAT YOU HAVE PLOTTED KIND OF IN THE FRONT THIRD OF THE BUILDING MASSES THERE, BUT ALL THE WAY TO THE STREET, MY ASSUMPTION IS THAT GOES TO THE GUTTER IN THE STREET, WHICH I DON'T THINK EXISTS AS A GUTTER.
I THINK IT'S JUST AN ASPHALT EDGE, BUT IT RUNS IMMEDIATELY INTO THE ASSIA RIGHT AT THE SOUTHEAST CORNER OF TRAIL.
AND, AND I SEE SOMETHING ON THE PLAN HERE THAT I COULDN'T QUITE UNDERSTAND.
UM, THERE'S THAT KIND OF, THAT GRAY PIECE THAT'S SHOWING THERE.
IS THAT DIVERTING THAT AWAY FROM THE ASAKI? IS THAT BEING DEALT WITH IN THE, THE DETENTION POND LABELED NUMBER TWO? WHAT'S HAPPENING THERE? ANY IDEAS? I I, I'M JUST NOT QUALIFIED ENOUGH TO ANSWER THAT QUESTION, BUT THE CIVIL ENGINEER HAS, UM, I THINK IN THE LAST PRESENTATION MENTIONED THAT WE ARE REDUCING THE EXISTING FLOW TO TRAIL STREET.
UM, SO WE'RE ACTUALLY TAKING, WE'RE ACTUALLY
[01:45:01]
IMPROVING ANY OF THE WATER FLOW ONTO TRAIL STREET.JUST IF THAT WAS THE CASE, JUST TO STAFF, IF THAT WAS THE CASE AND THAT WATER FROM TRAIL GOES DIRECTLY TO THE ASA AND NOT TOUCH ANY DETENTION POND, IT WOULDN'T GET ANY APPROVAL FROM BILL FROM T C I.
WE WOULD NOT ISSUE THE PERMIT.
SO HERE'S WHERE I DISAGREE WITH MY FELLOW COMMISSIONER, AT LEAST IN TERMS OF SITE FEATURES.
UM, I THINK THE FOOTPRINT AND THE PROXIMITY OF DETENTION POND ONE TO THE STREET IS CONCERNING.
WE WOULDN'T LET ANY DEVELOPER PUT A 30 INCH HOLE IN WHAT WOULD OTHERWISE BE THE FRONT YARD, RIGHT? OR, OR A WALL THAT EXTENDS UP TO THE HEIGHT OF A FRONT PORCH.
I DON'T THINK AS A SITE ELEMENT WE WOULD CONSIDER THAT APPROPRIATE IN A HISTORIC DISTRICT.
SO WHAT I'VE BEEN REALLY TRYING TO DIAL IN ON IS WHAT REALLY IS THE IMPACT ON THE SITE THERE? HOW IS IT PERCEIVED AND TRYING TO UNDERSTAND THE GRADE CHANGES.
SO IT SEEMS LIKE LAST TIME WE WERE DISCUSSING A POTENTIAL TWO FOOT GRADE CHANGE IN VERY CLOSE PROXIMITY TO THE STREET.
AND NOW YOU'RE TELLING US, BECAUSE, UH, THE TOPOGRAPHY RISES THERE, THAT LEVEL, I THINK IT WAS 6 75, IT'S ONLY ABOUT A FOOT ABOVE.
AND THAT'S ABOUT, IT'S A FOOT ABOVE FIVE FEET AWAY FROM ATCH.
LIKE HOW FAR IS THE DISTANCE FROM THE PROPERTY LINE TO THE CURB? UM, I BELIEVE IT'S, I BELIEVE IT'S PROBABLY AROUND 10 FEET FROM THE CURB.
WE'LL HAVE A LANDSCAPE BUFFER ABOUT FIVE FEET INTO OUR SOD AREA, AND THEN WE'LL HAVE A PLANTING THAT ABOUT FOUR TO FIVE FEET, AND THEN IT'LL BE THAT SIX INCHES TO ONE FOOT HIGH, UH, TO, TO BE A LEVEL CAP ON THE, UH, ON THE WALL OF THE DETENTION POND.
SO THEN IT'LL BE SUNK IN ON THE INSIDE THAT 30 INCHES LESS THAN THAN 30 INCHES.
WHAT IS THE RELATIONSHIP OF THE, THE TOP OF THE DETENTION POND TO THE FINISHED FLOOR ELEVATION ON THE, THAT BUILDING THAT FACES ATCH? I'M, I'M NOT SURE.
I THINK I DO AGREE WITH YOU COMMISSIONER FISH.
I DON'T, UM, I WOULDN'T APPROVE THOSE DETENTION PONDS AS SUBMITTED TODAY, BUT THAT DOES NOT MEAN THAT WE NOT APPROVE THE, THE PROJECT, UM, BECAUSE AT THE END OF THE DAY, THEY'RE GONNA HAVE TO FIND A SOLUTION.
THEY'RE GONNA HAVE TO COME BACK IF THEY WANNA DO SOME KIND OF ATTENTION POND.
BUT WITH THE PERMITS, UH, NOT BEING ISSUED, THEY'RE PROBABLY, I MEAN, CHANCES ARE THAT THEY'RE GONNA HAVE TO DO CHANGES TO THEIR DESIGN AND COME BACK HERE.
YEAH, I, BUT I WOULD BE CAREFUL IN APPROVING THOSE ATTENTION PONDS TODAY AS SUBMITTED.
I MEAN, THAT, THAT'S THE CONUNDRUM THAT I'M FACING.
AN APPROVAL HERE WOULD BE THE APPROVAL OF WHAT IS SUBMITTED HERE OR, UH, IN LIEU OF THAT, A STIPULATION THAT WOULD CURTAIL, UH, WHAT IS, UH, PRESENTED HERE TO THE EXTENT WE WOULD FIND IT APPROPRIATE AS A SITE FEATURE.
SO WHAT I FIND IS WHAT I, WHAT I WALK AWAY FROM THIS IS BOTH DEPEN, THE DETENTION POND ONE AND TWO ARE NOT APPROPRIATE SITE FIT, UH, SITE FEATURES AS, AS PRESENTED BECAUSE ON DETENTION POND ONE, IT'S PROXIMITY TO THE STREET, UH, HAS A BIG VISUAL IMPACT.
AND ON DETENTION POND TWO, ITS PROXIMITY TO THE ASAKIA, UM, REALLY DISREGARDS THE BUFFER THAT WE WERE TRYING TO BUILD, TRYING TO BUILD IN THERE AND REDUCED GROUND DISTURBING, UH, ACTIVITY WHILE IT WAS DISCUSSED THAT THAT RETAINING WALL IS HAPPENING MORE OR LESS ON GRADE.
AND THE FOOTING WOULD PROBABLY BE GOING DOWN, I, I DON'T KNOW, PROBABLY TWO FEET INTO GRADE, BUT VERY IN VERY CLOSE PROXIMITY TO THE ASEC.
UM, THAT FROM A SITE FEATURE STANDPOINT, UH, CAUSES ME ALARM AND AN APPROVAL, AN APPROVAL TODAY OF THE PROJECT MINUS THE PROPOSED SITE FEATURES THAT ARE REQUIRED TO DEAL WITH THE STORM WATER DRAINAGE IS A LITTLE BIT OF A PUZZLE.
WELL, BECAUSE THE CITY WILL ENFORCE THAT, THAT SOME KIND OF A RETENTION HAS TO BE DESIGNED AT SOME POINT.
UH, I I, I WANT TO AGREE WITH A FELLOW COMMISSIONER OVER HERE, BUT, BUT, BUT NOT JUST THAT, I, I THINK THAT THERE'S A LOT OF ISSUES WITH THE PROJECT.
I THINK IT HAS A, IT HAS MERIT AND IT'S GOING, AT LEAST IT BEGINS ON A FOUNDATION LEVEL IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION.
BUT EVEN IF YOU, EVEN IF, UM, I MEAN YOU REDUCE IT TO A ONE STORY BUILDING, YOU'RE STILL GONNA HAVE THE SAME RUNOFF ISSUES, RIGHT? SO THERE'S A LOT OF REASONS WHY THIS BECOMES SO IMPORTANT.
AND I THINK PART OF IT IS THAT, UM, SOMETHING LIKE DETENTION, YOU REALLY BEGIN YOUR PROJECT DEALING WITH DETENTION.
AND IF YOU END UP WITH DETENTION AT THE END OF YOUR PROJECT, THEN YOU KIND OF PUT YOURSELF IN A CORNER.
[01:50:01]
UH, WHEN, WHEN YOU SHOW UP AND YOU JUST DIDN'T REALIZE YOU HAD TO DO DETENTION.SO, UM, YOU KNOW, RIGHT NOW THERE'S MASSES OF WATER THAT ARE, UH, SHOWING UP IN THE ASAKIA RIGHT? FROM ALL OVER.
SO EVERYBODY IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD HAS WATER RUNOFF FROM THEIR HOUSES, AND IT'S ALL GOING INTO ASAKIA, AND NOBODY HAS A PROBLEM WITH IT, RIGHT? IT'S, BUT NOW THERE'S SOMEONE'S NEW WATER THAT'S GONNA GO INTO THE ASAKIA.
SO THERE'S CONTRADICTIONS ALL AROUND.
THERE'S CONTRADICTIONS FROM NOT ONLY THE PROJECT ITSELF, BUT THERE'S ALSO CONTRADICTIONS IN SOME OF THE VERY INTELLIGENT THINGS THAT ARE COMING FROM THE COMMUNITY.
BUT, UH, YOU KNOW, IT DEPENDS ON WHAT SIDE YOU PUT YOURSELF ON, RIGHT? IF YOU PUT YOURSELF ON THE PRO SIDE, ONE SIDE'S, ONE, ONE WAY TO LOOK AT IT'S GONNA MAKE SENSE IF YOU LOOK AT IT FROM THE DEVELOPER SIDE, ANOTHER WAY TO LOOK AT IT'S GONNA MAKE SENSE, BUT IT, TO ME, IT'S, IT'S THE, THE, THE MULTITUDE OF, OF ISSUES.
UH, IT, IT, IT, IT, IT DOES SEEM VERY OUTTA CONTEXT IN ITS MASSING, UM, WHICH I THINK IS WHAT CREATES ALL THE PROBLEMS. UM, IT'S, UM, YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW, I, I CAN APPRECIATE THAT, THAT THE TERM, UH, MANSARD, BUT THEY'RE REALLY MASSIVE FLAT ROOFS.
SO, SO, YOU KNOW, I'VE BEEN LOOKING AT THIS FOR A COUPLE OF, COUPLE OF DAYS NOW, YOU KNOW, AND I'M LOOKING AT IT NOW, LOOKING AT JUST THE SITE PLAN FROM AERIAL AND LOOKING FOR RELATIONSHIPS, LOOKING FOR KIND OF A DIALOGUE OF HOW THE DESIGN IS WORKING ITSELF INTO THE URBAN FABRIC.
AND IT'S A STRETCH, YOU KNOW, SO, YOU KNOW, I, I HATE GETTING IN, IN, IN THE, YOU KNOW, ENTERING INTO A DIALOGUE OR HAVING COMMENTS THAT, THAT TRY TO, UH, FORMULATE SOLUTIONS FOR, FOR THE, THE, THE, UM, THE DEVELOPER OR THE ARCHITECTS, BECAUSE IT'S MY OPINION THAT, THAT Y'ALL SHOULD BE THE BEST AT WHAT YOU DO, RIGHT? UM, BUT, BUT EVEN WHEN YOU LOOK AT, YOU KNOW, POTENTIAL SOLUTIONS FOR, FOR, UM, WELL DONE DETENTION, IT'S ALMOST AS IF YOU WANNA GET YOUR WATER TO GO AWAY FROM AGAINST, UH, THE NATURAL FLOW.
BUT YOU'D HAVE TO DO THAT FROM THE BEGINNING OR, OR, OR YOU PUT YOURSELF INTO A SITUATION WHERE, HOW DO YOU DO IT NOW, RIGHT? WHEN EVERYTHING IS ALREADY FLOWING TOWARD, UH, THIS
UH, YOU HAVE TO BEGIN DESIGNING FOR THAT, YOU KNOW, UM, YOU CAN TAKE SIMILAR PROPERTIES OVER IN THE MISSION AREA, UH, WHERE A LOT OF DEVELOPMENT HASN'T HAPPENED THERE, AND I'M SURE IT HASN'T HAPPENED FOR THE VERY SAME REASONS THAT THEY, THEY GO INTO THESE ASAKIA.
UM, SO, UM, JUST, JUST, YOU KNOW, ON THE, ON THE DETENTION SIDE, I, I, I, I CAN SYMPATHIZE WITH, WITH BOTH MY COMMISSIONER, UH, COLLEAGUES HERE, BUT I THINK THE ISSUES ARE MUCH GREATER THAN THAT.
UM, I, I, I, I DON'T SEE IT IN THE CONTEXT OF, OF THIS ENCLAVE.
IT, IT, IT DOESN'T POUR OFF INTO THE, THE URBAN FABRIC.
IT'S LIKE LOCKED IN AND THERE'S KIND OF THIS FORCE, UM, OF THIS INTO THIS COMMUNITY.
IT'S NOT A TRANSITION INTO THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
UM, I'M, I'M NOT SURE THAT I'M TOTALLY, UH, INFORMED OR EDUCATED ON THE DIALOGUE THAT Y'ALL HAVE HAD IN THE, IN THE PAST.
I MEAN, I WOULD HAVE TO REALLY FEEL LIKE I HAVE TO MAINTAIN A, UH, A, UM, UH, NOT NOT TAKING A POSITION ON IT, BUT I JUST, UH, THINK MY COMMENTS, UH, IF, IF THERE'S ANY POSSIBILITY OF GOING BACK TO THE DRAWING BOARD AND FINDING OUT EXACTLY WHAT, WHAT WORKS HERE, UH, IT, IT'S A BEAUTIFUL SITE.
UH, YOU KNOW, WE'RE OFF TO A GOOD START, BUT I, WITH ALL THE TIMES THAT Y'ALL HAVE BEEN HERE AND THE DIALOGUES FOCUSED ON THIS IS ON THE, ON THE DETENTION PONDS, UM, I'M NOT SURE THAT THIS IS THE BEST ROUTE FOR Y'ALL TO TAKE JUST FOR COMMISSIONER'S INFORMATION.
UM, THERE'S A DEADLINE AND WE HAVE TO TAKE ACTION TODAY, CORRECT? THAT IS CORRECT.
COULD I, UM, ASK THE COMMISSION IF I COULD PLEASE BE ALLOWED TO SHOW SOME, SOME PHOTOGRAPHS? I JUST WE'RE TRYING TO, WITH THESE DETENTION PONDS, SORT OF, YOU KNOW, WE'RE NOT, WE CAN'T REPLICATE ANY LOOK AND FEEL OF INSEC OR ANYTHING THAT WAS, WAS, WAS BUILT IN THE AREA, BUT WE'RE TRYING TO MAKE SURE IT FITS IN AS, AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE.
THE ORIGINAL PROPOSAL FOR THE, FOR DEALING WITH THE STORMWATER SITE DRAINAGE WAS A GREAT, UH, DEAL OF PERVIOUS COVER.
AND THERE WAS, THAT REQUIRES, I BELIEVE, EXCAVATION.
AND, UH, SO OUR, OUR CIVIL ENGINEER SAID THAT WE, WE WOULDN'T HAVE TO DO ANY EXCAVATION FOR THOSE.
I I THINK SHE, SHE SAID THAT IN THE LAST HEARING.
THAT, THAT'S AS A, AS AN ADDED
[01:55:01]
FEATURE TO THE, THE DETENTION PONDS.IT'S A MINOR ELEMENT, BUT WHEN THE, I THINK WE TALKED THE FIRST TIME AROUND ABOUT, UM, THE PREVIOUS COVER DEALING WITH THE STORM WATER ON THE DRIVEWAY THAT WOULD'VE REQUIRED IN, IN LIEU OF THE DEPEN DETENTION PONDS WOULD'VE REQUIRED A CONSIDERABLE AMOUNT OF DEPTH.
AND I, AND I BELIEVE THAT, UH, YOUR ENGINEER MENTIONED THAT THAT EXCAVATION DEPTH, IF THE STORMWATER WERE TO BE DEALT WITH PRIMARILY THAT WAY, WOULD EXCEED FOUR FEET.
SO, BUT THAT WOULD BE, THAT WOULD BE ABOUT PROBABLY 25 TO 30 THAT WOULD BE PRETTY FAR AWAY FROM THE AZEA, AND IT WOULDN'T HAVE TO, UH, TAKE UP THE WHOLE DRIVEWAY.
SO KIND OF WHAT, WHAT WE SHOWED IN THESE PLANS WAS, UM, WE'RE STILL SHOWING THAT WORST CASE SCENARIO THAT WE SHOWED LAST TIME, BUT WE'RE JUST SHOWING HOW IT WOULD LOOK.
BUT WE'RE STILL, UH, WORKING WITH STORMWATER TO COME UP WITH THE APPROPRIATE SOLUTION, WHICH COULD BE, YOU KNOW, WHERE THE IMPERVIOUS PAVEMENT, UM, IN THE DRIVEWAY, A PORTION OF THE DRIVEWAY COULD BE CONVERTED TO STORMWATER DETENTION.
AND, AND THAT WOULD SHRINK THE POND ON, ON ATCH WITH THE POND ON, UM, NEAR THE AEIA.
THERE WOULD NO, THERE WOULD BE NO EXCAVATION.
AND WE'RE TRYING TO KIND OF DESIGN IT TO, TO, TO WHERE YOU WOULDN'T REALLY EVEN BE ABLE TO TELL, AND IT WOULD REALLY ONLY BE VISIBLE TO OUR RESIDENCE.
JUST, I JUST WANTED TO SHOW KIND OF HOW WE'RE TRYING TO TIE, THIS IS THE EXISTING AIA, AND SO YOU CAN SEE OUR STONE LINED, KIND OF OUR DETENTION PONDS THAT WE'RE COMING UP WITH.
WE'RE TRYING TO KIND OF REPLICATE A LITTLE BIT OF THAT LOOK AND FEEL.
IS THAT A RING GUTTER GOING INTO THE ASEC? I'M, I'M NOT A HUNDRED PERCENT SURE.
AND AS YOU CAN SEE, THE, THE, UH, THE AEC ITSELF IS, IS, UM, IT LOOKS, IT LOOKS TO ME, I DIDN'T GO OUT AND MEASURE IT, BUT IT LOOKS TO ME LIKE IT MIGHT BE ABOUT 24 INCHES, MAYBE, MAYBE 36 INCHES IN HEIGHT.
SO OUR PROPERTY LINE IS THE WESTERN PROPERTY LINE, AND THAT'S WHERE THE ASEC RUNS IN BLUE.
AND WE'RE REALLY TRYING TO, YOU KNOW, WE, WE THINK THE ASEC IS A REALLY COOL ELEMENT, AND WE THINK IT'S SOMETHING TO BE CELEBRATED, AND WE KIND OF WANT TO OPEN IT UP WITH OUR, OUR PROPOSED WALKING TRAIL THAT WE, UM, SHOWED YOU A RENDERING OF BEFORE.
AND THIS IS OUR 15 FOOT, UH, DISTANCE FROM THE AEIA.
THE, THE WALL OF THAT DETENTION POND, WHICH WE'RE GONNA TRY TO MAKE, LOOK AS CLOSE TO THE EXISTING AEIA AS POSSIBLE, WOULD ACTUALLY STILL BE A LITTLE BIT FARTHER AWAY.
UH, WOULD STILL BE ABOUT SIX FEET FROM THE AEIA.
AND THAT DOESN'T REQUIRE ANY EXCAVATION ALONG YOUR, UH, EAST PROPERTY LINE ON THE SITE PLAN, UH, IMAGE 23 OF 27, THERE'S A NOTE NUMBER 17 THAT SAYS A HORIZONTAL SLAT, UH, FENCE ALONG YOUR ENTIRE PERIMETER.
HOW TALL ARE YOU PROPOSING THAT TO BE AND HOW DOES THAT, UH, ACTUALLY HELP WITH INTERFACING WITH THE, UH, ASAKIA AND, AND LIKE YOU'RE SEPARATING YOUR WALKING TRAIL FROM THE ASAKIA WITH YOUR FENCE? THAT'S, THAT'S, WE AREN'T REALLY PLANNING TO DO ANY KIND OF PERIMETER FENCE.
UM, I THINK MARK CAN SPEAK TO IT MORE 'CAUSE HE PUT THE PLANS.
UM, YOU KNOW, ORIGINALLY WE HAD DESIGNED IT TO HAVE A PERIMETER FENCE, UM, WITHIN THE BOUNDARY.
UM, BUT, UH, BUT WE WERE LOOKING AT, SINCE WE'VE BEEN IN DISCUSSIONS WITH, UH, THE NEW PONDS AND HOW WE'RE TREATING THE ASA, THAT WE WOULD NOT DO A FENCE ON THAT SIDE TO, TO, UH, TO MAINTAIN KIND OF THE VISUAL ASPECT OF IT.
UM, OF COURSE YOU'VE SEEN SOME OF THE, UH, THE PHOTOS OF SOME OF THAT, YOU KNOW, EXISTING, UH, ASA WE MAY, YOU KNOW, LOOK AT ADVISING THE CLIENT TO MAYBE PUT SOME KIND OF A, A POLE IN A, IN A, IN AND MAYBE A, LIKE A FOUR FOOT, UM, BIND GROWING ALONG THE PERIMETER THERE, AGAIN, JUST TO KIND
[02:00:01]
OF BEAUTIFY IT IN CERTAIN AREAS, UM, BUT NOT NECESSARILY JUST TO TOTALLY, UH, PUT UP A SIX FOOT WALL OR, OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.SO THAT'S KIND OF AN IMPORTANT POINT.
YOU CAN'T JUST SAY, WE MAY OR WE MAY IN THE FUTURE, OR WE ARE THINKING OR WE'RE ADVISING THIS WALL HAS NEVER BEEN SHOWN BEFORE.
I'VE NEVER SEEN THIS WALL BEFORE.
IT, IT COULD BE THAT THIS IS CORRECT.
YEAH, I, SO THE CLIENT WOULD ADVISE THAT WE, WE DON'T NECESSARILY NEED IT.
I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT THIS IS NOT A NEW, UH, ELEMENT THAT WE'RE INTRODUCING TO THIS SITE PLAN THAT WE HAVEN'T SEEN BEFORE.
SO ALL OF THE, ALL OF THE DRAWINGS, UM, I THINK WERE PROBABLY THE LAST TIME WE MET WAS, WAS, UH, I THINK SIX WEEKS AGO OR SO, OR THE FIRST TIME WE SUBMITTED ALL THOSE, ALL OF THE PLANS CONTAIN ALL OF THESE ELEMENTS.
UH, I I'M NOT SURE IF THE, IF NUMBER 17 IS LIKE A, A SLIP UP OR, UM, FROM AN OLD, UH, OLD LANDSCAPE SITE PLAN THAT WE JUST FORGOT TO DELETE, BUT IT, IT'S ALL IN THE CONSTRUCTION DOCUMENTS THAT WERE SUBMITTED.
AND I, I PERSONALLY, I'M NOT PLANNING ON, WE AREN'T REALLY PLANNING ON PUTTING A FENCE THERE.
I KIND OF THINK IT'S REALLY NEAT TO HAVE THE WALKING TRAIL TO, TO CELEBRATE THE ASSIA THAT HELPED ME WITH THIS ONE.
I MEAN, I GUESS IT WAS THERE BEFORE.
I MEAN, IF IT WAS THE APPLICANT STATED ON A RECORD THAT HE DOESN'T INTEND, DOESN'T INTEND TO PURSUE IT.
SO LIKE WE CAN, WE CAN WORK WITH FROM THAT.
THE, UH, DETAILS YOU'RE SHOWING US TODAY OF THE DETENTION FEATURES, ESPECIALLY THE SECTIONS, UH, WITH THE WALLS UP TO TWO AND A HALF FEET, I FOUND FINE TO BE VERY INAPPROPRIATE AND UNATTRACTIVE.
UM, AS LONG AS Y'ALL HAVE BEEN WORKING ON THIS PROJECT, I, I CANNOT UNDERSTAND WHY YOU HAVEN'T BEEN ABLE TO GET A STORMWATER PLAN APPROVED BY THE CITY BEFORE COMING TO US.
AND I DON'T FEEL COMFORTABLE APPROVING THIS PROJECT UNTIL THAT HAPPENS.
WELL, IF, IF YOU WOULD ALLOW, ALLOW US TO, IF, IF YOU, YOU KNOW, COULD EMPATHIZE WITH US, WE, IT'S A LITTLE BIT OF A CHICKEN OR THE EGG SITUATION.
IF WE WERE TO GET A STORMWATER PLAN APPROVED BY THE CITY BEFORE A HISTORIC DESIGN AND REVIEW, UM, WE WOULD BE MAYBE LOCKED INTO THE FULL SIZE WORST CASE SCENARIO DETENTION POND OPTION.
AND THEN I'D HAVE TO COME BACK HERE AND, AND PRESENT IT TO YOU ONLY TO HAVE IT REDUCED OR WHATEVER YOU DECIDE AND THEN GO BACK TO THE CITY.
SO IT'S, IT'S, YOU KNOW, WE, WE CAME IN WITH, WITH TWO OPTIONS TO SHOW YOU GUYS WHAT WE'RE WORKING THROUGH.
AND THAT'S, THAT'S JUST KIND OF HOW THE, THE PROCESS IN OUR, IN OUR EXPERIENCE HAS BEEN.
IT, IT'S A VERY, I MEAN, WE'RE, WE'RE KIND OF, IT'S, IT'S, IT'S, IT'S A, IT'S A REALLY TOUGH CHICKEN OR THE EGG KIND OF SITUATION.
UM, AND I'LL ADD TO THAT, AND THIS KIND OF TIES INTO YOUR QUESTION EARLIER, COMMISSIONER GRUE, UM, THE ROLE OF THE A C R C IS RECOMMENDING TO CITY STAFF THROUGH, THROUGH THEIR PROCESS.
AND SO, UM, IT'S VERY DIFFICULT TO COME BACK TO A RECOMMENDING BODY WITH A PERMIT THAT'S BEEN APPROVED AND THEN ASK FOR A RECOMMENDATION.
SO ESSENTIALLY THE, THE COMMISSION HAS MORE POWER AT THIS STAGE IN THE, IN THE REVIEW PROCESS THAN THEY WOULD FOLLOWING PERMITTING.
I, I THINK THE, THE ISSUE IS THAT WE CAN'T APPROVE WHAT ISN'T REAL.
AND SO UNDERSTAND YOU NEED A DESIGN.
SO WE, WE NEED A, A, A DESIGN THAT WOULD ACTUALLY WORK, UM, AND, AND IS SOMETHING THAT IS, UM, THAT HAS BEEN APPROVED BECAUSE AT THIS POINT WE'RE, YOU KNOW, WE CAN APPROVE, I MEAN, THEORETICALLY WE CAN APPROVE THIS, UH, STORM WATER DESIGN AND IT COULD AMOUNT TO A HILL OF BEANS, YOU KNOW, THAT'S, OR WE CAN APPROVE AS IT WAS SUBMITTED PREVIOUSLY WITHOUT ANY DRAINAGE PONDS WITH THE PREVIOUS AREA.
AND THEN IF THERE'S A NEED FOR DRAINAGE POND AND REDESIGNED, THEY WOULD HAVE TO COME TO US BECAUSE THERE'S A STIPULATION, STIPULATION, I GUESS IT'S SIX FIVE AND, NO, JUST SIX.
SO, UM, JUST A REMINDER, STAFF IS NOT RECOMMENDING APPROVAL, UM, BUT ANTICIPATING THAT IT MIGHT BE APPROVED BY THE COMMISSION, WE HAVE PROVIDED RECOMMENDED, RECOMMENDED, RECOMMENDED STIPULATIONS, UM, TO CONSIDER.
UM, AND SO THOSE ALL RELATE TO, UM,
[02:05:01]
ARCHEOLOGY REQUIREMENTS, UM, SOME BUILDING REQUIREMENTS, BUT THEN ALSO, UM, WHAT WOULD KIND OF HAPPEN AND WHAT WE WOULD, UM, DO IN THE PERMIT REVIEW PROCESS AS IT RELATES TO STORM WATER.WELL, I AGREE WITH MY FILLER COMMISSIONERS ABOUT THE CONCERNS ABOUT THE SIZE AND DEPTH AND LOCATIONS OF THESE DETENTION PONDS, AND I CAN APPRECIATE THE, THE APPLICANT'S DILEMMA.
UH, DON'T, CAN'T GET TOO FAR WITHOUT H D R C APPROVAL, UM, AND THEN GETTING SOMETHING APPROVED FROM ANOTHER DEPARTMENT AND COMING BACK HERE.
SO IT IS, LIKE YOU SAID, A CHICKEN AND AN EGG.
BUT, UM, THE, THE, BUT I'M STILL CONCERNED ABOUT THE DRAINAGE AND THE, UM, EFFECT ON THE ASAKIA AND THE, THE, UH, PROXIMITY OF THE DETENTION PONDI TO THE ASAKIA ESPECIALLY.
UM, BUT THEN I ALSO HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT THE, ESPECIALLY THE THREE STORY UNITS ON TRAIL, UM, HOW THAT IS MORPHED FROM A, UH, SMALLER THREE STORY BUILDING WITH A LARGER TWO STORY BUILDING.
AND THEN ONCE THE, UH, TURNAROUND LOOK WAS RELOCATED, THEN THE THREE STORY BUILDING GOT LONG, UH, LARGER MORE UNITS AND THE TWO STORY BUILDING GOT, UH, FEWER UNITS.
SO I HAVE SOME REAL CONCERNS ABOUT, UH, NOT JUST THE, UH, THE DRAINAGE AND THE SITE PLAN, BUT ALSO THE, UH, THE MASSING, ESPECIALLY ON TRAIL.
MR. CHAIR, I, I, I WOULD AGREE WITH, UH, THE CHAIRMAN, UM, PARTICULARLY WITH RESPECT TO BUILDING ONE, TWO, AND FIVE, IT SEEMS LIKE THOSE SHOULD RELATE IN TERMS OF A BUILDUP OF SCALE TO THE CENTER OF THE SITE.
UM, AS FAR AS THE, THE DETENTION, WHAT, WHAT I'M HEARING IN, IN, IN ALL OF THE, THE EFFORTS FOR, TO, TO, TO GIVE INPUT FROM THE COMMISSION IS THAT IF Y'ALL WEREN'T ABLE TO COME UP WITH A SOLUTION THAT THAT, UM, JUST GAVE EVERYBODY THE ASSURANCE THAT, THAT THERE WAS A PLAN, UM, THEN I, I WOULDN'T HAVE ANY OB OBJECTION.
I, I JUST DO DO FEEL THAT THE, THAT THE MASSING, I MEAN, I KNOW THAT Y'ALL WOULD HAVE YOUR OWN KIND OF NINE NON-DESIGN REASONS FOR WHY YOU HAVE TO HAVE THAT, THAT, THAT MUCH MASSING, WHETHER IT'S HOW MANY UNITS YOU NEED OR, OR, OR WHATEVER THE SITUATION IS.
BUT IT'S ALSO CREATED A, A NEW DEFINITION OF A MAN CERT THAT YOU'RE IN, IN THIS NEIGHBORHOOD.
AND IT REALLY, TO ME LOOK LIKE FLAT ROOFS, THIS MASSING IS BEING FORCED.
UM, SO MY, MY CONCERNS MR. CHAIR ARE, ARE REALLY FOCUSED ON, UH, THE, THE ENCLAVE, THIS CLOSED OFF NEIGHBORHOOD AND, AND THE, THIS ALMOST THIS 99%, UH, CHARACTER.
AND MOST DEFINITELY, YOU KNOW, MAKING, MAKING A, A PLACE FOR MULTIFAMILY OR FOR THERE TO BE, UM, APARTMENTS OF THIS CHARACTER IS A GOOD IDEA, PARTICULARLY, AND I'LL JUST TELL YOU THAT BEING ABLE TO COME IN OFF OF, OF, UH, ATCH AND TRAIL FROM, UH, THE HIGHWAY OR FROM ST.
MARY'S, TO ME IS A BENEFIT BECAUSE, UH, ONE OF THE CONCERNS THE NEIGHBORHOOD HAS IS INCREASED TRAFFIC DOESN'T SEEM THAT YOU WOULD NECESSARILY BE CREATING A LOT OF TRAFFIC INTO RIVER ROAD AND ALL OF THAT, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, UM, SO THERE, THERE'S SOME POSITIVES, BUT, BUT THERE, I THINK THERE HAS TO BE SOME ULTIMATE GIVING THAT IF Y'ALL HAVE COME BACK SO MANY TIMES, I, I THINK THERE'S SOME OTHER ISSUES THAT JUST HAVE BEEN IGNORED AND, AND WE'RE FOCUSING IN ON THE, ON THE STORMWATER RUNOFF.
BUT, BUT TO ME, I THINK IF YOU DEALT WITH THE MASSING THAT EVERYTHING ELSE WOULD FALL INTO PLACE, BUT IT MIGHT MEAN GIVING UP SOME SQUARE FOOTAGE.
UM, BUT THE SOLUTIONS ARE UP, YOU KNOW, DIRECTIONS THAT Y'ALL WANT TO GO IN ARE UP TO Y'ALL.
I, I REALLY DON'T WANNA RETURN TO THE QUESTIONS, BUT I HAVE ONE MORE QUESTION.
IF WE COULD TAKE THE SIDE TO SITE 13, THAT, AND ZOOM IN ON THE LOWER DRAWING.
THE, UH, THE ASAKIA, THE PREVIOUSLY RESTORED SECTION OF THE SEIA TURNS, IT BENDS AND DRIFTS OFF TO THE EAST THERE AND DROPS UNDER ALLISON DRIVE.
CORRECT? RIGHT THERE ON THE SCREEN WE'VE GOT THE THREE ARROWS.
WE TALKED ABOUT THIS LAST TIME AS WELL, WHERE THE DISCHARGE AND OUTFLOW WOULD
[02:10:01]
BE AND WHETHER OR NOT IT WAS DISCHARGING INTO THE ASAKIA.AND THE, THE, THE RESPONSE TO THAT WAS, WELL, IT CAN DISCHARGE WHERE WHEREVER WE NEED IT TO.
BUT I MEAN, THE REALITY IS IT'S DISCHARGING AT THE LOWEST POINT, RIGHT? AND IT'S, THIS IS WHERE, UH, ALTHOUGH I, I GUESS IT WAS ILLUSTRATED THIS WAY LAST TIME, THIS IS WHERE IT WAS ILLUSTRATED.
WHERE, WHERE DOES THAT WATER IMMEDIATELY GO FROM THE DETENTION POND? IS THERE ANY UNDERSTANDING OF WHERE THAT DISCHARGE IS? IS TO, I WOULD HAVE TO DEFER THAT TO OUR, OUR CIVIL ENGINEER.
WHAT I, WHAT I KNOW IS THAT THE, UM, EXISTING FLOW THAT IF YOU TOOK, IF YOU AS, AS THE CURRENT SITE STANDS, THE EXISTING FLOW IS GOING FROM OSS ONE STRAIGHT INTO THE AEIA.
UM, SO WE ARE BUILDING A DETENTION POND THAT WILL NOT INCREASE, UH, ANY FLOW INTO THE ASEC.
AND THAT INCREASES THE CALCULATION OF INCREASED RUNOFF AS ATTRIBUTED TO YOUR ROOFS AND HARDSCAPE, CORRECT? I BELIEVE SO.
AND JUST TO CLARIFY, UH, COMMISSIONER FISH, UM, THE ENGINEER DID SAY THAT, UH, IT WOULD BE RUNNING OFF INTO THE ASAKIA, BUT IT WOULD BE JUST, YOU KNOW, DETAINED FOR A PERIOD OF TIME AND, AND LET OFF IN A SLOW PERIOD.
BUT SHE DID IN THE LAST MEETING, SAY THAT IT WAS GOING TO BE RETAINED, I MEAN, DUMPED INTO THE ASI FLOW THAT IT IS NOW NOT MORE, RIGHT? I THINK IT WAS.
NO, UH, I THINK THE, AND THAT'S ANOTHER, ANOTHER POINT TO THIS, IS THAT THE DESIGN OF THIS CURRENTLY REDUCES THE FLOW INTO THE ASAKI AS SIGNIFICANTLY.
UH, IF ONE, AND THIS IS A POINT THAT COMMISSIONER FISH IS BRINGING UP, IF THE CALCULATION IS BASED OFF OF NEW HARDSCAPE AND, AND, AND ROOFS, THEN YOU'RE NOT DEALING WITH THE CURRENT PROBLEM.
IF IT DEALS WITH THE CURRENT PROBLEM PLUS YOUR DEVELOPMENT, THEN THAT'S A DIFFERENT STORY.
AND SO I THINK THAT THAT'S THE CALCULATION CLARIFICATION THAT NEEDS TO BE MADE.
IS ARE WE DEALING WITH WHAT'S EXISTING PLUS WHAT'S NEW, OR ARE WE JUST DEALING WITH THE, THE STUFF THAT WE'RE DOING AND EVERYTHING ELSE IS JUST GONNA, YOU KNOW, EVERYTHING FROM OSS ONE AND OSS TWO IS JUST GONNA RUN OVER US AND WE'RE NOT DEALING WITH THAT AT ALL.
I THINK THAT'S, THAT'S AN ANOTHER QUESTION.
UM, I'M GONNA TRUST THE SYSTEM.
THERE'S A SYSTEM BY THE CITY, WHICH, UM, IS MENTIONED IN STIPULATION TWO AND STIPULATION SIX.
AND I ALSO FEEL FOR THE REST OF THE APPLICANTS THAT ARE HERE TO BE HEARD TODAY.
I'M GONNA GO FOR A MOTION, A MOTION TO APPROVE AS NOT AS SUBMITTED TODAY AS, UH, WE HAVE IN THE AS D STAFF HAS SEEN WITH THE STAFFS ALL OF STAFF STIPULA RELATIONS.
AND THAT PLAN, WHICH IS ON PAGE DOES NOT SHOW ANY DETENTION POND.
I WILL NOT APPROVE, I WILL NOT INCLUDE ANY DESIGN OF ANY DETENTION POND OR LOCATION OF ANY DETENTION POND.
IF UM, THERE WERE THE CASE THAT THEY HAVE TO DO DETENTION POND, THEY WOULD HAVE TO COME BACK HERE FOLLOWING REVIEW WITH D C I AND O H P IF IT'S DETERMINED, THESE ACTS IF NEEDED.
IF IT NEEDS TO COME IN HERE, YEAH.
THEN THE FINAL DESIGN WOULD RETURN TO H D R C.
DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND MOTION.
SO JUST TO CLARIFY, UM, WITH THE DENIAL, THE, UM, APPLICANT CAN GO THROUGH, UH, A LITTLE BIT MORE RIGOROUS DESIGN PROCESS WITH THE CITY AND T C I AND THEN, UH, BRING THIS BACK TO US AFTER, UH, A MORE CLARIFIED DESIGN HAS BEEN APPROVED.
[02:15:01]
WE WOULD LOOK FOR CHANGES IN THE PROPOSAL, UM, TO BE RECONSIDERED.THEY COULDN'T PRESENT THE SAME THING THAT HAD BEEN DENIED TODAY.
AND ALSO THEY COULD ONLY GO TO T SS I AS A CONSULTING, NOT AS A REQUEST FOR BUILDING PERMITS.
AND GO THROUGH THE WHOLE, YOU WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO ISSUE PERMITS WITHOUT A CERTIFICATE.
THEY'RE CERTAINLY WELCOME TO BE, BUT WILL T C I DO THE ENOUGH RESEARCH? YES.
UM, TO THE, TO THE PROJECT? IF THEY SUBMIT FOR PLAN REVIEW, THEN THE DIFFERENT DISCIPLINES RELATED TO PLAN REVIEW CAN BEGIN THE REVIEWS AND PROVIDE COMMENTS, BUT NO PERMITS WOULD BE ISSUED WITHOUT A CERTIFICATE.
AND JUST TO CONFIRM TO THE APPLICANT, YOU HAVE SUBMITTED ALREADY TO THE CITY? YES.
WE'RE, WE'RE TRYING TO WORK THROUGH THIS PROCESS AND, AND THE CHICKEN OR THE EGG SITUATION THAT WE'VE BEEN, YOU HAVE A MOTION IN A SECOND? YOU WAIT A SECOND.
VELAZQUEZ, YOU HAVE A MOTION? A SECOND.
BUT WE, WE WISH YOU LUCK THROUGH THE CITY DEPARTMENTS AND WE LOOK FORWARD TO YOUR FINAL DESIGNS AND THANK THE NEIGHBORHOOD FOR THEIR, UH, COMING OUT AND SHOWING THEIR COMMENTS.
[B-22 19-7388 Address/Description: 415 N MESQUITE ST/105, 107, 109, 111 and 113 BROWN STREET HDRC Case No.: 2019-480 Historic District Name: Dignowity Hill Applicant: MICHAEL PEREZ/MP2 URBAN DEVELOPMENT LLC Request: Construction of a multi-structure, multi-family residential development City Council Dist.: 2]
AGENDA ITEM B 22 H D R C, CASE NUMBER 20 19 4 81 0 5 THROUGH ONE 13 BROWN AND FOUR 15 NORTH MESQUITE.THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT FIVE MULTI-STORY RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURES ON THE VACANT LOTS ADDRESSED AS 1 0 5 THROUGH ONE 13 BROWN AND FOUR 15 NORTH MESQUITE LOCATED WITHIN THE DIGNITY HILL HISTORIC DISTRICT.
THE LOTS ARE BOUNDED BY BROWN STREET TO THE NORTH, EXCUSE ME, BROWN TO THE SOUTH, NORTH MESQUITE TO THE EAST BROWN ALLEY TO THE NORTH.
EACH OF THE PROPOSED STRUCTURES WILL FEATURE BETWEEN APPROXIMATELY 29 AND 32 FEET IN HEIGHT.
THE APPLICANT IS ALSO PROPOSED THE CONSTRUCTION, THE CONSTRUCTION OF AN OPEN AIR CARPORT, UH, TO THE NORTH OF BROWN ALLEY.
STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL BASED ON FINDINGS.
A THROUGH W STAFF FINDS THAT THE APPLICANT HAS NOT YET ADDRESSED ALL STIPULATIONS OF CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL AND THAT THE PROPOSED SCALE AND CHARACTER AND CONSISTENT WITH THE GUIDELINES STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT THE APPLICANT ADDRESS ITEMS NOTED BELOW.
APPLICANT, COME FORWARD PLEASE.
UH, I GUESS SINCE OUR LAST MEETING HERE WAS NUMBER NINTH, I CAN'T REMEMBER, BUT, UM, I'M BACK HERE AGAIN WITH, UH, A FEW CHANGES THAT, UM, THAT, UM, AND, AND DIRECTION THAT YOU GUYS HAVE GIVEN ME SO WE CAN JUST JUMP RIGHT IN.
UM, AS YOU KNOW, BROWN STREET, UH, IS KIND OF IN THIS TRANSITIONAL AREA, WHICH TO ME, PERSONAL, REALLY EXCITING.
YOU GOT SOME INDUSTRIAL COMMERCIAL AND, AND ADAPTIVE REUSE GOING ON AT MERCHANTS AND, AND REALLY THIS TRANSITIONAL AREA WITH DOWNTOWN BEING RIGHT THERE FROM THE RESIDENTIAL DOWN TO CHERRY STREET WHERE THERE'S A LOT OF, UH, ACTIVITY GOING ON.
SO, UM, JUST A PERSPECTIVE OVER OF, UH, THE LOCATION AND AGAIN, JUST SOME GENERAL COMMENTS.
UM, UH, AND WE CAN JUST KIND OF JUMP INTO THE MAIN ONE THAT WE WERE TALKING ABOUT LAST TIME WAS NOLA HOUSE.
AND THAT WAS THE ONE SHOTGUN HOME, UH, THE NARROW HOME, UH, ON MESQUITE STREET.
SO, UH, AGAIN, UH, WE TALKED ABOUT A LANDSCAPING PLAN AND SITES.
UH, ON THE SITE PLAN, WE'VE EXPANDED THE LANDSCAPE LEGEND, UH, AT THE BOTTOM RIGHT AND, UH, WHICH INCLUDES A LITTLE, THOSE CUTOUTS SHOWING THE SHRUB, UH, THE PLANTS, THE, YOU KNOW, SHRUB THE TREES ALL AROUND.
UH, WE EXPANDED ON THAT ON, ON THE WHOLE PLAN, SO YOU CAN KIND OF TAKE A LOOK, UM, WHERE WE ADDED, ADDED, UH, TO THE LANDSCAPING THERE.
SO WHAT WE DID IS WE REDUCED, YOU CAN SEE ON THE TOP, REALLY THE TOP, UH, RENDERING.
WE REDUCED MESQUITE, THE MESQUITE STREET HOME FROM THREE STORIES.
WE'RE NOW DOWN TO TWO STORIES FROM A THREE, YOU KNOW, A THREE BEDROOM, TWO AND A HALF.
IT'S, IT'S IMPORTANT THAT THAT MESQUITE HOUSE, UM, COME DOWN IN SIZE AND YOU CAN KIND OF SEE A BREAKAWAY HERE.
UM, AGAIN, WE'RE FOCUSING ON THE NOLA HOUSE.
UH, NEXT TO THAT, UH, EXISTING STRUCTURE.
HAS STAFF RECOM IDEA RECOMMENDATION BASED ON THE LATEST SUBMITTAL? YES, STAFF HAS UPDATED COMMENTS IN REGARDS TO THE HEIGHT OF THE STRUCTURE ON NORTH MESQUITE
[02:20:01]
AS WELL AS WINDOW PROPORTIONS.UM, THOSE ARE NOTED IN FINDINGS, UM, I THROUGH J AND, UM, IT LOOKS LIKE R N S OVERALL, THE RECOMMENDATION REMAINS THE SAME 'CAUSE THERE ARE OTHER, UM, ELK ON THAT HAVEN'T BEEN ADDRESSED.
UH, BUT I'LL LET THE APPLICANT CONTINUE.
SO, UH, JUST GOING BACK, WE REDUCED, UH, THE NOLA HOUSE DOWN TO TWO STORIES.
AND LET'S GO BACK TO WHEN WE LAST MET HERE ON NINE FOUR.
YOU CAN SEE WHERE WE WERE AT WITH THAT CAMELBACK IN THE REAR.
AND AGAIN, UM, THIS WAS AT 32 FEET, SO WE'RE NOW DOWN TO 25 FEET.
BUT IF YOU CAN TOGGLE, IF I'LL TOGGLE BACK AND FORTH PREVIOUS NOW, SO WE'RE AGAIN, HERE WE ARE TODAY.
SO THAT JUST, YOU KNOW, IT DID TAKE US A MONTH TO GET TO, TO WHERE WE ARE TO REDUCE THIS, BUT, UM, LIKE I SAID, REDUCE FROM, UH, THREE TO TWO STORY HOME RIF, UH, RIDGE ROOF REDUCED FROM 32 4 THERE.
AND OF COURSE THE SET MAT, UH, SETBACKS MATCH THE ADJACENT HOUSE, UH, TO THE RIGHT OF IT, A WINDOW PROPORTIONS.
UM, HE SENT YOU ED THE LITTLE P D F ON THAT.
UM, BUT, UM, NO, NO, NO WORRIES.
AND I THINK, UH, I THINK WE MET, WE WERE, WE DISCUSSED THE RATIO SIZES, MODIFIED STYLES, UM, BRONZE, UM, TRADITIONAL.
AND THEN, UH, THIS IS JUST GOING BACK WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT THESE MANY MONTHS, ABOUT THREE STORY TOWN, UH, HOMES IN, IN HISTORIC DISTRICTS.
WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, UH, GARAGES ENTERED FROM THE REAR.
AND I THINK, UM, WE WERE TALKING ABOUT MIRRORING, BUT JUST TO QUICKLY GO, YOU KNOW, EXAMPLES IN LA VACA, YOU CAN SEE THREE STORY HOMES THAT ARE BEING BUILT RIGHT NEXT TO A SINGLE STORY, A FAMILY HOME TO THE, TO THE LEFT OF IT, RIGHT THERE.
BIG DIFFERENCE HERE IS, I'M NOT MIRRORING, I'M HAVING SPACES IN BETWEEN 'EM.
THEY'RE, YOU KNOW, SINGLE FAMILY HOMES, THE ONE IN THE MIDDLE'S, THE DUPLEX.
SO A LITTLE CLOSER TO HOME INDIGNITY RIGHT DOWN THE STREET.
THEY'RE ATTACHED THREE STORIES.
ANOTHER ONE IN KING WILLIAM, SAME THING.
WE DO HAVE A SYSTEM TO BE HEARD.
UH, VIRGINIA VAN CLEVE, 91 18 FAIRLAND, SAN ANTONIO, TEXAS.
I HAVE A STATEMENT FROM THE PRESIDENT OF THE CONSERVATION SOCIETY.
WHILE THE SOCIETY IS NOT OPPOSED TO APPROPRIATE INFILL INDIGNITY HILL, WE CONTINUE TO HAVE SERIOUS CONCERNS ABOUT THIS PROJECT.
THE SCALE OF THESE UNITS IS NOT COMPATIBLE WITH THE SURROUNDING RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURES.
THIS IS ESPECIALLY EVIDENT AT BROWN AND MESQUITE, WHERE TWO PROPOSED MULTI-STORY UNITS SEEM TO SURROUND AND DOMINATE THE EXISTING HISTORIC SINGLE-STORY HOUSE.
WE ALSO QUESTION THE USE OF FLAT ROOF MODERNISTIC ARCHITECTURE THAT IS ILLUSTRATED IN ONE OF THE UNITS.
THIS TYPE OF DESIGN IS NOT COMPATIBLE WITH THE HISTORIC NEIGHBORHOOD RESIDENTIAL DESIGN VOCABULARY AND IS INCONSISTENT IN DESIGN WITH THE OTHER PROPOSED UNITS PRESENTED IN THIS PROJECT.
WE CONCUR WITH THE STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS THAT THE APPLICANT HAS NOT YET ADDRESSED ALL STIPULATIONS OF THE CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL AS THEY RELATE TO SCALE AND CHARACTER.
WE DO NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THIS PROJECT AS PRESENTED.
RESPECTFULLY SUBMIT, THE CONSERVATION SOCIETY OF SAN ANTONIO, PRESIDENT PATTY ZZZ.
CAN WE HAVE THE APPLICANT RUN THROUGH EACH ONE OF THE, UM, RECOMMENDATIONS AND THEIR OPINION OF EACH? YOU'VE ADDRESSED THE GARAGE.
CAN YOU SKIP DOWN TO, UH, NUMBER TWO? NUMBER TWO? SO THAT'S A DUPLEX.
WHICH ONE ARE WE LOOKING AT? NUMBER THE SECOND RECOMMENDATION.
RECOMMENDATION NUMBER TWO, THAT THE APPLICANT EITHER SEPARATE THE MIDDLE STRUCTURE OR PROPOSE ADDITIONAL ARCHITECTURAL ELEMENTS THAT WILL REDUCE ITS
[02:25:01]
PERCEIVED WIDTH AS NOTED IN FINDING J.SO I, I GUESS WHAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR IS THAT'S OUR, THAT'S OUR RECOMMENDATION FROM STAFF.
SO THAT'S WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT.
SO WHAT IS YOUR RESPONSE TO THAT AND, AND DEFENSE OF WHAT YOU ARE PROPOSING? I THINK THAT THERE, THAT I HAVE SINGLE FAMILY, YOU KNOW, ON INDIVI, SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED, UH, THIS IS A DUPLEX, WHICH IS SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED.
AND JUST GOING BACK, AND I GUESS I'M GOING BACK AGAIN, COMMISSIONER BOWMAN, TO EXPLAIN PREVIOUSLY IS THAT, YOU KNOW, WHEN WE GOT TO THIS, YOU KNOW, ATTACHED WHAT, WHAT'S GOING ON IN OTHER HISTORIC AREAS, NOT, NOT ONLY DITY, BUT ARE THERE, IS THERE PRECEDENCE? IS THERE, WHAT, WHAT'S THE GENESIS? HOW CAN WE, UH, UH, DESIGN THIS WITH, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S, WHAT ELSE IS GOING ON IN HISTORIC DISTRICTS? AND WE SEE THAT THEY'RE ATTACHED.
THERE'S SOME OTHER, UM, PROJECTS THAT ARE ATTACHED HOUSING.
SO, AND THEY'RE MORE THAN TWO.
UM, SO I, I PERSONALLY THINK IT'S FINE, UH, IN, IN THIS DEVELOPMENT.
AND IT'S REALLY ONE OF THESE DEVELOPMENTS, THESE, THIS, THIS FORGOTTEN STRETCH, UH, SMALL LOTS, DOING THE BEST WE CAN WHERE WE CAN, UM, UM, MAKE A, A CREATIVE DESIGN WHILE FOLLOWING THE GUIDELINES AND FOLLOWING, UM, UM, THE EXAMPLE OF OTHER FOLKS, UM, IN HISTORIC DISTRICT.
SO THAT'S, THAT'S REALLY HOW I CAME UP WITH FOR, UM, A LITTLE CLARIFICATION.
UM, STAFF'S PRIMARY CONCERN WAS THAT A, WITH AS PROPOSED ISN'T FOUND HISTORICALLY WITHIN THE DISTRICT.
UM, THE EXAMPLE THAT'S PROVIDED HERE IS ACTUALLY OUTSIDE OF THE LAVACCA HISTORIC DISTRICT.
UM, THIS PROJECT WAS REVIEWED BY THE COMMISSION, UM, DUE TO, UM, IT RECEIVING CITY INCENTIVES.
UM, THEN, UH, THIS EXAMPLE, UM, IS MORE IN A COMMERCIAL CONTEXT, UM, HENCE THE, THE ROW HOUSES AND MORE OF A, UM, MORE OF A MULTI-FAMILY, UH, CONTEXT AS THE NEXT, UM, STAFF'S PRIMARY THINKING BEHIND THIS IS THAT IF THE BUILDINGS, UH, FEATURED THEIR OWN MASS, UM, NOT SAYING THAT THEY NEEDED TO BE SEPARATED AT ALL, BUT FEATURED THEIR OWN MASSING, UM, AND APPEAR AS TO STANDALONE STRUCTURES THAT MAY BE MORE APPROPRIATE FOR THE DISTRICT.
UM, I, I, UM, I, I WAS JUST TRY MAKE A, AGAIN, OBSERVATION STAFF.
I THINK AT, AT SOME POINT, STAFF CAN RING THE DESIGN OUT OF THE DESIGN.
UM, MY, MY FEAR IS THAT, THAT, THAT WE'RE, WE'RE PUSHING WHAT, WHAT BEGINS IS GOOD DESIGN INTO A DIRECTION THAT IS LESS THAN GOOD DESIGN, JUST BECAUSE IT'S INTERPRETED A CERTAIN WAY.
BECAUSE THE PIECES THAT YOU SHOWED, THEY CAME BEFORE THE H D R C FOR DIFFERENT REASONS, BUT THEY'RE STILL VALID.
AND, YOU KNOW, IN TERMS OF, UM, YOU KNOW, WHAT, WHAT WE WOULD BE RESPONSIBLE FOR IN, IN THE, IN THE BUILT ENVIRONMENT, WE HAVE TO BE SENSITIVE AS WELL.
I, I, I THINK, UM, I, I JUST, YOU KNOW, LOOKING AT THE, AT THE THREE STORY BUILDING THAT JUST BECAME A TWO STORY BUILDING, I'M NOT SURE IT BECAME A BETTER BUILDING, BUT I CAN UNDERSTAND IN TERMS OF THE COMMENTS THAT WE'VE MADE, UH, FOR, FOR THE SIZE OF THE SINGLE FAMILY DWELLING, WORKING ITS WAY UP WITHIN THE CONTEXT OF THIS ENVIRONMENT.
BUT IT, IT SEEMS AS IF NO ONE'S LOOKING AT THE SITE PLAN OF THE ENTIRE AREA.
SO MANY, SO MUCH OF THE COMMENTS THAT I'M READING ARE A DIRECT CONTRADICTION TO WHAT, WHAT THE SITE LOOKS LIKE.
UM, I, I, I MEAN, IS, IS STAFF TAKING INTO CONSIDERATION THAT THE BUS STATIONS THAT ARE RIGHT NEXT TO THIS IS, AND EVEN THE COMMENTS THAT WERE MADE A SECOND AGO FROM, FROM, FROM THE, UH, FROM THE, YOU KNOW, THE SPEAKER SIDE, UM, IT'S NOT IN THE CENTER OF A NEIGHBORHOOD.
I MEAN, I MEAN, YOU KNOW, THERE, THERE'S JUST TOO, TOO MANY CONTRADICTIONS TO THE COMMENTS THAT ARE BEING MADE.
AND, UM, THERE'S VERY FEW OPPORTUNITIES FOR THERE TO BE, UM, TRANSITIONS, ARCHITECTURAL TRANSITIONS THAT WE HAVE TO LEAD TO THE, THE, TO THE, TO THE DESIGNER WORLD TO, TO KIND OF LEAD THE WAY.
UH, I, UM, I REALLY DO APPRECIATE THE REDUCTION IN THE, IN THE THIRD FLOOR.
I'M NOT NECESSARILY, UH, SURE THAT THAT WAS THE ONLY SOLUTION, BUT, BUT I MEAN THAT'S A, THAT THAT IS A, A, A MAJOR GIVING, UH, IN TERMS OF LISTENING TO THE, TO THE, TO THE, UH, RE REQUEST OF STAFF.
BUT LOOKING AT THE, UM, THE COMMENTS STAFF, I, I THINK THAT AT SOME POINT IT, IT, IT'S REMOVING, UM, MAYBE AN, UH, UH, A MORE
[02:30:01]
CREATIVE VOCABULARY THAT, THAT, UM, IS PROBABLY JUST AS IMPORTANT AS EXISTING IN THESE VERY RARE OPPORTUNITIES.UM, I, I'D JUST LIKE STAFF TO TELL ME HOW, HOW DO YOU, HOW DO WE SEE THIS OUT OF THE CONTEXT OF AN AREA THAT, UH, OF A PIECE OF PROPERTY THAT IS MOST DEFINITELY SURROUNDED BY THREE BUS STATIONS, AND THEN ON THE OTHER SIDE, NOTHING BUT INDUSTRIAL BUILDINGS.
I MEAN, THE GUIDELINES, SPECIFICALLY DIRECT STAFF TO RELATE OR DIRECT AN APPLICANT TO RELATE NEW CONSTRUCTION TO HISTORIC STRUCTURES LOCATED IN THE DISTRICT.
UM, SO IN THE CONTEXT OF THIS, STAFF RELATES WHAT'S PROPOSED TO SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURES THAT HAVE HISTORIC CHARACTER, UM, NOT WAREHOUSES OR, OR OTHER STRUCTURES THAT WOULD BE CONSIDERED EITHER NON-CONTRIBUTING OR THAT AREN'T SIGNIFICANT TO THE, THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE OF THE DISTRICT.
UM, SO WE'RE SPECIFICALLY LOOKING AT HISTORIC STRUCTURES BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TASKED TO RELATE OR TO DIRECT APPLICANTS TO RELATE NEW CONSTRUCTION TO.
WELL, I, I WOULD JUST ASK MY COMMISSIONERS, IF YOU, IF YOU CAN LOG ON AND MAP THE AREA.
I'M JUST GONNA SAY SOMETHING I'M WANNA SAY, THIS IS NOT STAFF'S PERSONAL OPINION.
IT IS, IT IS, IT DOES GET INTO, THEY HAVE TO MAKE A CALL, THEY HAVE TO, SO THERE'S A LOT OF FINDINGS THAT HAVE LETTERS AND EACH FINDING, EACH STIPULATION IS BASED ON THE FINDINGS.
AND THE FINDINGS COME DIRECTLY FROM THE GUIDELINES.
WE ARE ALREADY TAKING CONSIDERATION THE SURROUNDING.
YEAH, I WAS GONNA SAY WE'RE HERE TO SEE WHAT YOU THINK.
SO IT'S FINE TO DISAGREE WITH STAFF.
UM, IT'S THE PURVIEW OF THE COMMISSION TO REVIEW THE CASE AND ALL OF THE, THE FACTORS AND, AND MAKE A RECOMMENDATION.
WELL, NO, NO, AND I UNDERSTAND, BUT I, I, I MEAN THERE, THERE IS, UM, A CONTEXT AND, AND I'M NOT NECESSARILY SURE THAT IT'S JUST THEIR RESIDENTIAL STOCK.
UM, I MEAN, THE FACTORY ACROSS THE STREET HAS A LOT OF HISTORIC SIGNIFICANCE.
UM, YOU KNOW, WHETHER OR NOT YOUR, YOU, YOUR COMMENTS ARE LIMITED TO, UM, THE WORDS THAT YOU USE THERE.
I THINK, I MEAN, I THINK THEY HAVE AN EFFECT ON THE BUILT ENVIRONMENT AND IF, AND IF I HAVE TO LOOK AT THINGS FROM THE STANDPOINT OF THE, THE URBAN FABRIC, RIGHT? UH, UM, I THINK THAT, UM, WE CAN DRIVE PEOPLE CRAZY WITH THEM TRYING TO UNDERSTAND, UM, SOMETHING THAT'S NOT AS SENSIBLE AS LOOKING AT IT.
IT'S, I MEAN, THIS IS A VISUAL ART, RIGHT? I MEAN, WE HISTORIC, UH, ARCHITECTURE, WE'RE LOOKING AT IT, AND WHEN SOMETHING FITS, WE CAN SEE THAT IT FITS TOO.
IT'S NOT JUST, YOU KNOW, A THOUGHT PROCESS.
I, I JUST, UH, UH, WOULD HATE TO SEE THIS PROJECT BECOME ANY LESS THAN IT ALREADY IS BECAUSE, UH, YOU ALL WE HAVE IS THIS OPPORTUNITY TO SEE, SEE THESE DRAWINGS, AND THEY'RE CHANGING AND THEY'RE NOT NECESSARILY GETTING BETTER.
UM, UH, SO I, I JUST, UH, UM, REALLY QUESTIONED THAT, UH, THE WISDOM OF LOOKING AT THIS URBAN SITE AND NOT, NOT NOT BEING ABLE TO SEE WHAT'S REALLY AROUND IT.
WELL, I APPRECIATE THAT, UH, MR. PARIS GOING BACK AND LOOKING AT THE MESQUITE RESIDENCE AND SCALING IT DOWN TO BE MORE APPROPRIATE TO THE, UH, ADJACENT, UH, SMALLER SCALE RESIDENTIAL.
AND I WOULD AGREE WITH MY FELLOW COMMISSIONER THAT, UH, AND WHAT THE APPLICANT HAS DONE HERE IS THIS TRANSITION TO MORE OF AN INDUSTRIAL, UH, AESTHETIC AT THE WEST END OF THE SITE.
UM, AND A LOT OF THE DISCUSSION, UH, WE'VE LOOKED AT A BROWN ALLEY ELEVATION, UH, BUT IF WE LOOK AT BROWN STREET ELEVATION, UH, THE DUPLEX ACTUALLY HAS A GREATER SEPARATION AND THEY, UH, IN MY OPINION, READ MORE LIKE SEPARATE UNITS RATHER THAN A, A BIG BROAD, UH, DUPLEX.
UH, MR. CHAIRMAN, I CHAIR SOME OF THOSE OBSERVATIONS.
I, I, WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THIS BEFORE.
THESE ARE, THIS IS A VERY SHALLOW LOT ON A SUBSTANDARD STREET AND A SUBSTANDARD ALLEY.
AND, UH, AS FAR AS STIPULATION ONE ABOUT THE GARAGES GO, I SUPPORT THE PROJECT AS PROPOSED.
I DON'T THINK IT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE TO TREAT THOSE AND, UH, AND A A, A WAY THAT WOULD DISRUPT THE POTENTIAL PATTERN ON, UH, THE NARROW, THE NARROW BLOCK.
UM, ON ITEM TWO, I THINK THAT THE SEPARATION THAT'S VISIBLE FROM BROWN CRE IS, UM, ADEQUATE.
AND I CONSIDER, CONSIDER THAT STIPULATION MET AND I WOULD MOVE FOR APPROVAL WITH STIPULATIONS 3, 4, 5,
[02:35:01]
AND SEVEN SECOND.DID YOU INCLUDE STIPULATION THREE? YES, IT WAS 3, 4, 5, AND SEVEN, RIGHT? 3, 4, 5, AND SEVEN THROUGH, JUST TO ELABORATE, THREE, THREE WAS THE CONTINUE TO EXPLORE WAYS THAT ADDITIONAL FENESTRATION CAN BE ADDED TO THE OUTWARD FACING ELEVATIONS? WELL, THIS IS FINAL NOT CONCEPTUAL.
SO IS STAFF'S DISCRETION TO, I'M JUST THINKING, AND ACTUALLY MY COMMISSIONER NEXT TO ME JUST MADE ME REALIZE, I THINK IT STAFF IS, IS BECAUSE ON THE SOUTH ELEVATION, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT FENESTRATIONS ON THE PROPERTY ALL THE WAY TO THE RIGHT, WHERE IT'S ACTUALLY COVERED BY ANOTHER PROPERTY.
IS THAT WHAT YOU, MEANING ON THE FENESTRATION OR JUST IN GENERAL? ALL OF THE PROPERTIES, THE APPLICANT'S INCREASED THE AMOUNT OF FENESTRATION SIGNIFICANTLY.
THAT WAS JUST TO CONTINUE TO, IF THERE IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR MORE FENESTRATION TO EXPLORE THAT, GENERALLY I FIND THE PROJECT HAS MET THE STIPULATION THAT WAS PREVIOUSLY OUTLINED.
AND, UH, IF, UH, WHOMEVER SECONDED MY MOTION WOULD ENTERTAIN AN AMENDMENT, I WILL STRIKE STIPULATION FROM THE MOTION.
YEAH, IF WE CAN MOVE ON TO THE NEXT CASE.
[B-23 19-7404 Address/Description: 1012 DAWSON ST HDRC Case No.: 2019-526 Historic District Name: Dignowity Hill Applicant: Troy Withers/7one Property Group LLC Request: Construction of a rear addition, exterior modifications and construction of a rear accessory structure City Council Dist.: 2]
ITEM B 23 H D R C, CASE NUMBER 20 19 5 26, 10 12 DAWSON, THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO ONE, CONSTRUCT, A REAR ADDITION IN THE LOCATION OF AN EXISTING REAR ADDITION, TWO TO INSTALL PORCH RAILINGS, AND THREE, TO PERFORM EXTERIOR MODIFICATIONS TO THE REAR ACCESSORY STRUCTURE.STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF ITEM ONE, THE CONSTRUCTION OF A REAR ADDITION.
STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF ITEM TWO WITH THE INSTALLATION OF PORCH RAILINGS.
UH, BOTH ITEMS ONE AND TWO ARE WITH STIPULATIONS AND STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF ITEM THREE MODIFICATIONS TO THE EXISTING REAR ACCESSORY STRUCTURE.
AND AT THIS TIME, THE APPLICANT'S GONNA PRESENT ON, UH, ACCESSORY STRUCTURE MODIFICATIONS.
ROY WITHERS WAS SEVERAL IN PROPERTY GROUP.
UM, I ACCEPT ALL THE STIPULATIONS, UH, THAT THE STAFF HAD.
I'VE ALREADY CHANGED THE PLANS AND SUBMITTED 'EM TO STAFF.
I ALSO WANNA RECOGNIZE THE LADY'S COMMENTS ON THE FIXED WINDOW ON THE BACK OF THE PROPERTY ON THE ADDITION, AND WE'LL AGREE TO CHANGE THAT OUT TO A S SLIDING WINDOW.
SO JUST TO CONFIRM, THAT'S ALL STIPULATIONS, EVEN THE REAR ACCESSORY STRUCTURE, UH, CORRECT.
WE'VE DONE A FOUR FOUR INCH INSERT FROM THE HISTORICAL STRUCTURE TO THE INITIATIVE.
SO, UH, I WOULD MOVE TO APPROVE WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS.
THE, THE EXTERNAL STRUCTURE IN THE BACK OF THE PROPERTY ACCESSORY STRUCTURE.
THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE, UH, THAT STRUCTURE IS CURRENTLY A SHED AND WE WANT TO TURN IT INTO A CASITA.
UH, IF YOU WANNA PULL UP SLIDE.
SO I, I'M SORRY, STEPH, CAN YOU CLARIFY THAT? WE JUST DISCUSSED STIPULATION THREE? YEAH, I THINK THERE'S CONFUSION.
UM, BECAUSE MY, I BELIEVE THE MOTION INCLUDED ALL ITEMS. ALL ITEMS. YEAH, I, I DIDN'T HEAR A DISTINCTION IN THE MOTION, WHICH WAS, UH, NO MODIFICATIONS TO THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE.
SO, UM, I AGREED TO THE STIPULATIONS OF THE APPROVALS, BUT I WOULD LIKE TO LOOK AT THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE, UM, THAT IS CURRENTLY IS SHED AND TURN INTO A STUDIO STYLE, UH, CASITA, WHICH SITS IN THE BACK OF THE PROPERTY WE NEED TO MOTION TO CHANGE.
THE FIRST ONE IS, IS HE TALKING ABOUT THE USE OR THE DESIGN? THE DESIGN? I, I BELIEVE THERE'S ALREADY BEEN TAKEN THE, THERE'S BEEN ACTION TAKEN ON THE ITEM FOR APPROVAL WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS.
[02:40:01]
SO THERE'S THREE ITEMS FOR THE PROPERTY.THE FIRST TWO INCLUDE, IS IT RECOMMENDATION FOR APPROVAL OF STIPULATIONS? WE WERE NOT RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF THE PROPOSED MODIFICATIONS TO THE ACCESSORY.
AND SO I BELIEVE THAT WAS THE CONFUSION BECAUSE THE APPLICANT SAYS HE WAS IN AGREEMENT WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS.
THERE WAS A MOTION FOR EVERYTHING THINKING THAT THERE WAS AGREEMENT.
AND THE APPLICANT DOES NOT AGREE TO THE RECOMMENDATION FOR ITEM THREE, BUT DOES THAT MEAN THAT HE CAN'T COME BACK AGAIN? MAYBE WITH SOME REVISIONS ON ITEM NUMBER THREE? 'CAUSE IT WASN'T REALLY DENIED, WAS IT? ONE SECOND.
UM, WE THINK WE CAN DISCUSS THE THIRD ITEM BECAUSE WE WERE NOT RECOMMENDING APPROVAL WITH STIPULATIONS, AND SO THEREFORE THE MOTION TO APPROVE WITH STIPULATIONS DOESN'T REALLY MAKE SENSE.
SO WE CAN TALK ABOUT ITEM THREE.
SO, UH, WE'RE GONNA GO TO SLIDE FIVE, WHICH IS THE, UH, EXISTING STRUCTURE THAT IS IN THE BACK OF THE PROPERTY.
UM, IT'S CURRENTLY AT 236 SQUARE FEET.
UH, THIS IS CURRENTLY USED AS A SHED.
UH, WHAT WE'RE RECOMMENDING IS ACTUALLY LIFT IT, PUT A APPEAR BEAM UNDERNEATH IT EXPANDED BY 11 SQUARE FEET, KEEPING IN ITS ORIGINAL PLACE IN THE BACK OF THE PROPERTY AND TURNING IT INTO A STUDIO STYLE CASITA, WHICH HAS A SMALL KITCHEN, SMALL BATHROOM AND LIVING SPACE.
THE 11 SQUARE FEET OR WHERE, UH, THAT'S COMING OFF THE PLANS HERE.
SO WE'LL BE ADDING ONTO THE SIDE OF IT, WHICH IS ON THE SIDE OF THE DRIVEWAY, WHICH IS THE WEST SIDE.
BUT YOU'RE NOT REPOSITIONING IN ANOTHER SIDE, ON ANOTHER PLACE ON THE LOT? NO, MA'AM.
THERE ARE CURRENTLY TWO STRUCTURES IN BACK.
THE OTHER ONE WE WOULD LIKE TO CONVERT INTO A LIVING SPACE.
STAFF'S COMMENT REGARDING THE REPOSITIONING.
UM, IF YOU, UH, NOTICE THE SITE PLAN THAT'S, UM, HERE NOW YOU CAN SEE A LIGHTER OUTLINE ON BOTH THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE AND THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE OF, UM, CURRENT FOOTPRINT.
AND THEN, UM, YOU SEE A DARKER, UM, OR A HEAVIER WIND LINE WEIGHT FOR WHAT'S PROPOSED OR NEW, UH, STAFF WAS REACTING TO, UM, SEEING THE, A SHIFT OR A TURN, UM, IN THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE.
UM, AS THE GUIDELINES NOTE THAT ACCESSORY STRUCTURE SHOULD REMAIN AS THEY ARE HISTORICALLY EXIST.
UM, HOWEVER, IF THE APPLICANT'S NOTING THAT THAT'S NOT GONNA BE THE CASE, THEN UM, WE CAN IGNORE THAT PREVIOUS COMMENT.
WELL, MR. CHAIR, SO THE PLAN WOULD BE THAT RIGHT NOW THE SHED IS COCKED A LITTLE BIT FROM WHERE ON THE SITE.
SO YOU'D LEAVE IT COCKED LIKE IT IS.
WE WOULD LEAVE IT AS A STRUCTURE, IS WE WOULD JUST LIFT IT, PUT THE PURE AND BEAM FOUNDATION UNDERNEATH IT? THAT'S CORRECT.
AND BASED, BASED ON STAFF'S LAST COMMENT, MR. CHAIR, I HAD MOTION TO APPROVE, UH, THE APPLICANT'S REQUEST, WHICH IS, I GUESS CONTRARY TO THE COMMENTS OF STAFF, YOU CAN JUST ADD, JUST ADD A STIPULATION THAT THE SHED DOES NOT, IS NOT BEING REPOSITIONED WANT TO YOUR MOTION.
THAT, THAT WITH THE STIPULATION THAT THAT, THAT THE SHED IS NOT REPOSITIONED AND THAT IT'S IN THE SAME CHARACTER THAT IT IS IN TODAY.
DO I HAVE A SECOND? DON'T HAVE A SECOND.
DO I HAVE ANOTHER MOTION? SO I'D LIKE TO MOTION THAT, UH, MOVE FOR APPROVAL OF ITEMS NUMBER ONE AND TWO WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS, UM, WITH APPROVAL OF ITEM NUMBER THREE.
'CAUSE WE'VE ALREADY APPROVED ITEM NUMBER ONE AND TWO, WE'VE THAT'S RIGHT.
WE JUST NEED A MOTION FOR ITEM THREE.
I DIDN'T KNOW IF WE WERE JUST GETTING RID OF IT 'CAUSE IT DIDN'T MAKE SENSE.
SO JUST ITEM NUMBER THREE THEN.
SO, UM, MOVE TO APPROVE ITEM NUMBER THREE, UM, WITH THE, UH, CAVEAT THAT IT IS JUST LIFTED AND, UH, PLACED ON PI IN PLACE AS POSITIONED CURRENTLY.
I THINK THAT WAS WHAT THE PREVIOUS, IS THAT WITHOUT THE 11 SQUARE FEET? NO, I WAS, I I, THE, THE PREVIOUS, UH, MOTION HONESTLY JUST DIDN'T MAKE SENSE TO ME.
UH, THERE WAS A COUPLE OF THINGS THAT I DIDN'T GET OUT OF IT, SO I, I WAS TRYING TO CLARIFY IT, BUT THAT'S,
[02:45:01]
SO JUST FOR THE CLARIFICATION OF STAFF, WHAT WE SEE ON THE SCREEN, THE COMMISSION IS FINDING APPROPRIATE, BUT WITH THE 11 SQUARE FEET, THAT'S WHAT I DON'T REALLY, UM, SO WHAT'S ON THIS STAFF IS RECOMMENDING AGAINST WHAT'S ON THE SCREEN CURRENTLY BECAUSE IT ALTERS THE APPEARANCE IN THE OVERALL FORM OF THE REAR ACCESSORY STRUCTURE.UM, SO IT, IT CHANGED IN MODIF, SORRY.
IF THE APPLICANT WANTS TO SPEAK ON WHAT'S BEING MODIFIED, UH, YEAH, SO THE, IT HAS THE ORIGINAL SIDING ON THE, ON THE STRUCTURE WHICH WOULD BE RESTORED.
WE WOULD LOOK TO RESTORE THE ROOF.
UM, AND THEN WE WOULD, UH, WE WOULD KEEP IT ALL AS IS THAT THAT ELEVATION DRAWING SHOWS THAT IT HAS A HIGHER PEAK ON IT.
WE WOULD NOT CHANGE THE, THE PEAK STRUCTURE OF IT AND JUST DO A RESTORATION ALONG WITH THE ROOF ON THE HOME AND THEN TIE IN THE NEW ROOF ON THE ADDITION WITH THE EXISTING, WELL, THAT'S WHAT I'M WEARING.
WHERE'S THE ROOF PLAN OF THE ADDITION OF THOSE 11 FEET? HOW ARE YOU TYING THAT IN AN EXISTING 11 SQUARE FEET THAT THE APPLICANT WOULD EXTEND THE CURRENT STRUCTURE OUT? OH, IT'S WHERE THE PITCH IS.
IT'S ON THE SIDE OF THE PITCH.
UM, STAFF FUNDS IT TO BE APPROPRIATE IF THE APPLICANT'S MAINTAINING THE EXISTING ROOF PITCH.
UM, AND THE EXISTING RIDGE LINE, UM, STAFF'S PRIMARY CONCERNS WOULD BE, UM, AS SHOWN IN THE ELEVATIONS, UH, IT APPEARS THAT THE EVE DEPTH, UH, HAS INCREASED.
UM, AND THEN OF COURSE THE ADDITION OF THE FRONT FACING GABLE, UM, THAT'S NOT AN ORIGINAL FEATURE FOR THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE.
UM, THE INCORPORATION OF WINDOWS, IT MAY NOT BE AS SEVERE.
I'M TRYING TO FOLLOW ALL THESE CHANGES BY THE APPLICANT TODAY.
SO THAT'S, THIS IS KIND OF WHERE I AM.
I'D LOVE TO JUMP ON AND SUPPORT ONE OF THESE MOTIONS, BUT I'M HAVING DIFFICULTY PRECISELY UNDERSTANDING THE MODIFICATIONS OF WHAT'S THERE.
AND I'M JUST GONNA RECAP, SO THE DRAWING IS NOT SHOWING THE ROOF CORRECTLY.
YOU'RE NOT GOING TO BE PURSUING THE ADDITIONAL, UH, GABLE PORCH ELEMENT? THAT'S CORRECT.
UM, WE ARE ADDING A CERTAIN NUMBER OF FEET ONTO ONE OF THE, THE LONG SIDES.
AND I, I CAN'T TELL WHICH ONE THE WEST SIDE THAT HE SIDE, IT WOULD, ON THE WEST SIDE SIDE IT WOULD BE ON THE WEST SIDE.
SO IF I'M LOOKING AT DRAWING FIVE, WHICH IS UP ON THE SCREEN, UH, UH, WELL, WHICHEVER, WHICHEVER ELEVATION MAKES SENSE TO LOOK LIKE, LOOK AT, UH, WHICH, WHICH END? LET'S LOOK AT DRAWING SIX.
WHICH END ARE WE ADDING ONTO? WE ARE GOING TO BE DRAWING SEVEN WEST.
CAN YOU GO TO THE NEXT SLIDE? UH, YOU CAN GO BACK TO THE PICTURE.
I CAN EXPLAIN IT BETTER WITHIN THE PICTURE ITSELF.
AND HOW MANY FEET ARE WE ADDING ONTO IT? IT'LL BE 11 SQUARE FEET.
SO COMING AT ABOUT A FOOT AND A HALF.
AND THIS IS TO ACCOMMODATE LITTLE, A LITTLE MORE SQUARE FOOTAGE INSIDE FOR THE LIVING SPACE.
IT'S A LOT OF WORK FOR A LITTLE SQUARE FOOTAGE THERE, HUH? IT IS.
AND THE FENESTRATION CHANGES, I ASSUME THE FENESTRATION THAT'S FACING THE HOUSE, UH, ON THE PLAN, IT LOOKS, FORGIVE ME, I'M JUST HAVING TROUBLE PUTTING THIS TOGETHER.
THE NUMBER FIVE, THE NORTH FACING WOULD BE FACING THE HOUSE.
NO, BUT Q AND A, IT LOOKS LIKE THE FENESTRATION IS CENTERED AND ON THE PLAN IT WOULD BE MOVED A LITTLE BIT TO THE LEFT, IS THAT CORRECT? OKAY.
OVERALL FOOTPRINT, I WOULD APPROVE, BUT I WOULD ASK THE APPLICANT TO COME BACK WITH CORRECT.
JUST CONFIRMING THAT WE NEVER HAD A SECOND FOR COMMISSIONER BOWMAN'S MOTION.
SO CAN WE HAVE A NEW MOTION THAT YES, WE MAY DEALS WITH ALL THESE ELEMENTS WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THE ROOF PITCH, THE I'LL MAKE A MOTION.
BECAUSE, BECAUSE I THINK IT'S, IT'S A SPIRIT OF MOTION.
COMMISSIONER GRUE JUST MADE ONE.
YOU WANNA RESTATE YOUR, YOUR MOTION COMMISSIONER GRUBE MOTION TO APPROVE THE ADDITION, BUT WITH THE STIPULATION THAT THE APPLICANT SUBMITS, UH, UPDATED DRAWINGS AND DETAILS, UH, WITH TO STAFF AND WITH STAFF.
[02:50:02]
MOTION AND A SECOND.[B-24 19-7332 Address/Description: 319 BURLESON ST HDRC Case No.: 2019-550 Historic District Name: Dignowity Hill Applicant: FELIX ZIGA/ZIGA ARCHITECTURE STUDIO, PLLC Request: Construction of a 1.5-story, single-family residential structure with a rear carport City Council Dist.: 2]
B 24 H D R C CASE NUMBER 20 19 5 53 19 BURLESON, THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT A 1.5 STORY SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURE WITH THE REAR CARPORT ON THE VACANT LOT.AT THREE 19, BURLESON STAFF IS RECOMMENDING APPROVAL WITH STIPULATIONS.
UM, AT THIS TIME, THE ONLY STIPULATION THAT THE APPLICANT WOULD LIKE TO ADDRESS HAVE SPECIFICATION FOR WINDOW WINDOWS THE APPLICANT.
GOOD AFTERNOON, COMMISSIONERS.
I'M THE ARCHITECT ON THE PROJECT.
UM, AS STAFF HAS CLARIFIED, WE AGREE WITH ALL STIPULATIONS EXCEPT, UH, THE WINDOW, UM, I GUESS THE WINDOW SPECIFICATIONS THAT STAFF IS PUSHING.
SO THEY WANT EITHER WOOD WINDOWS OR UM, ALUMINUM CLAD WOOD WINDOWS.
UM, THAT'S THEIR PREFERENCE FOR NEW CONSTRUCTION.
WE'VE, YOU KNOW, PROFESSIONALLY, WE DON'T THINK THAT IT SHOULD BE MANDATED OR, UM, REQUIRED TO USE THOSE SPECS, ESPECIALLY WHEN IT'S A BUILDING BEING CONSTRUCTED IN 2019.
UM, WE ARE GETTING HARDY SIDING APPROVED AS A COMPOSITE MATERIAL.
WE BELIEVE A VINYL WINDOW SHOULD BE ADEQUATE.
UM, WE DO HAVE, UH, PHOTOS OF A VINYL WINDOW THAT WE WERE, UH, GRANTED PERMISSION BY THE, BY THE H D R C TO INSTALL AT ANOTHER PROJECT.
UM, I THINK THEY'RE FURTHER DOWN IN OUR PACKET.
SO THIS WAS, WE, WE GOT VINYL, VINYL BLOCK FRAME WINDOWS FROM JELLED WIND, SO IT'S A MID-RANGE SPECIFICATION, AND WE WERE ALLOWED TO INSTALL THESE AT TWO HOMES ON CROCKETT STREET IN THE SAME NUITY HILL HISTORIC DISTRICT.
UM, WHAT WE DID, WE HAVE A HISTORICALLY APPROPRIATE SILL DETAIL.
WE DOUBLED UP THE ONE BY SIX TRIM AND, UM, WE HAVE ARTISAN SIDING, UH, IN A PORTION OF THE BUILDING, WHICH, UH, CREATES DEEPER SHADOW LINES, UM, AND ALLOWS FOR, UH, HISTORICALLY APPROPRIATE OR ACCURATE, UM, WINDOW DETAIL IN TERMS OF RECESS.
UH, WE ALSO TOOK SOME DEMEN FIELD DIMENSIONS ON SITE, UH, FOR THE WINDOWS IN TERMS OF THE RAILS AND STYLES AND THOSE DIMENSIONS.
AND, UH, STAFF FOUND THAT WE ARE IN COMPLIANCE WITH THOSE.
UM, WE ASKED FOR CLARIFICATION AS TO WHY WINDOW THE WHITE MANUFACTURER COLOR IS NOT ALLOWED.
UM, THEY SAID TO US TO NOT DRAW ATTENTION TO THE WINDOWS, EVEN THOUGH HISTORICALLY, UM, 95% OF WINDOWS IN HISTORIC DISTRICTS ARE WHITE, UH, WITH WHITE TRIM.
SO THAT'S, THAT'S KIND OF OUR STANCE ON THIS.
UM, CAN, COULD YOU PULL UP THE, THE SKETCH THAT HAD THE DIMENSIONS? IF YOU DON'T HAVE IT, I HAVE IT RIGHT HERE.
SO THE, YEAH, THAT, THAT ITEM SHOWS KIND OF THE DIMENSIONS THAT WERE REQUESTED FROM STAFF AND, UM, WE WERE FOUND TO BE IN COMPLIANCE WITH THAT PORTION OF THAT STIPULATION.
SO WE, WE, WE IMPLORE YOU TO, YOU KNOW, CONSIDER THIS, UM, BRAND NEW CONSTRUCTION BUILD AND LET US USE VINYL WINDOWS THAT WE HAVE DONE IN THE PAST WITH A HISTORICALLY APPROPRIATE DETAIL.
CAN STAFF SPEAK TO THE, UH, DRAWING THAT'S ON THE SCREEN? THE APPLICANT'S ACTUALLY REFERRING TO A SITE VISIT THAT STAFF PERFORMED A YEAR AND A HALF, MAYBE A YEAR AGO, UM, ON SITE FOR TWO PROPERTIES THAT ARE ON CROCKETT STREET WHEN STAFF WAS REVIEWING THOSE WINDOWS ON A POST INSTALLATION INSPECTION TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY MET THE SPECIFICATION.
UM, IN REGARDS TO THE DETAIL THAT THE APPLICANT SUBMITTED, UM, OUR SPECIFICATIONS ALSO COMMENT FOR APPROPRIATE SEAL AND TRIM DETAILS.
UM, THE APPLICANT'S NOTED A TWO BY SIX TRIM AROUND TRIM AROUND ALL OPENINGS.
UM, THAT'S NOT NECESSARILY TYPICAL WITH WHAT WE WOULD RECOMMEND.
[02:55:01]
UM, THE APPLICANT HAS NOTED AN INSTALLATION DEPTH THAT IS APPROPRIATE.UM, HOWEVER, THERE A COUPLE OF THINGS THAT STAFF WOULD LIKE THE APPLICANT TO SPEAK TO.
UM, AND ONE OF THOSE IS THE, THE TWO BY SIX TRIM THAT SURROUNDS THE WINDOW.
I THINK THE APPLICANT HAS BEEN HERE MANY, MANY, MANY TIMES, AND I'M SORRY TO SEE THE APPLICANT COME HERE AND USE A, A COMPLIANCE CASE OR SOMETHING PREVIOUSLY ACTUALLY TO HIS, UH, UM, BENEFIT KNOWING THAT, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE OPTIONS AND OUR WINDOWS SPECIFICATIONS HAVE BEEN IN PLACE FOR MANY YEARS AND HAVE ACTUALLY BEEN IMPROVED WITH TIME AGAIN, PREFERENCE DOES NOT MEAN MANDATED THOUGH.
WELL, THERE ARE GUIDELINES FOR THAT AND I THINK THAT YOU CAN OBTAIN WHAT YOU WANT WITH THE ALUMINUM WOOD CLAT WINDOWS, ALUMINUM WOOD CLAT WINDOWS ARE APPROXIMATELY TWICE THE COST OF VINYL WINDOWS.
AND IF YOU WANT TO PREVENT GENTRIFICATION, THIS IS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT ADDS TO IT.
ANY SAVVY BUILDER OR DEVELOPER IS GONNA PASS THAT COST ONTO A CONSUMER.
I WILL NOTE THAT, UM, OUR RECOMMENDATION IS ONLY FOR A WOOD OR ALUMINUM CLAD WOOD WINDOW BECAUSE WE FIND THAT THOSE ARE TYPICALLY THE PRODUCTS THAT ALLOW FOR THE DIMENSIONS THAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR.
THAT'S NOT TO SAY THAT A VINYL WINDOW COULDN'T ACHIEVE THAT.
UM, THERE ARE JUST A COUPLE OF THINGS THAT STAFF IS STILL WANTING THE APPLICANT TO, UM, ADDRESS, AND THAT'S THE TWO BY SIX TRIM.
UM, THAT IS ATYPICAL FOR WHAT'S REQUESTED BY STAFF.
UM, AND THEN ALSO THE COLOR OF THE WINDOWS, UM, WITH AN APPROPRIATE TRIM THAT'S NOT A TWO BY SIX AND A DARKER COLORED WINDOW.
THIS WINDOW MAY VERY WELL BE, UM, SOMETHING THAT'S COMPARABLE TO A WOOD OR AN ALUMINUM PLAID WOOD WINDOW THAT WOULD BE APPROVED ON CONSENT AT ANOTHER PROJECT.
SO WHAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR AS APPLICANTS IS CONSISTENCY, RIGHT? SO WE GOT A WHITE VINYL WINDOW APPROVED ON ANOTHER NEW CONSTRUCTION PROJECT, AND IT WAS INSTALLED PER THE DETAIL THAT WAS SUBMITTED, AND THERE WAS EVEN A POST INSPECTION THAT WE WEREN'T AWARE OF WAS GONNA HAPPEN.
WE STILL HAD THE INSPECTION AND SHOWED THAT WE INSTALLED PER OUR DETAILS.
AND IT WAS FOUND, I MEAN, STAFF, I MEAN, CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, BUT YOU KNOW, WE WERE TOLD THAT THAT WINDOW AND THAT SIDING WAS GONNA BE USED AS A PRECEDENT FOR, UH, NEW CONSTRUCTION.
I THINK THE PROBLEM IS THAT A LOT OF TIMES DEVELOPERS OR ARCHITECTS MIGHT COME IN HERE WITH THIS DETAIL AND HAVE ALL INTENTS AND PURPOSES OF BUILDING IT THIS WAY, BUT IN REAL LIFE, YOU KNOW, THE WINDOWS GET ED, UH, PLY PLY JAM WINDOW GOES IN AND IT DOESN'T LOOK ANYTHING LIKE WHAT WAS APPROVED.
UM, TO CLARIFY ON THE TWO BY SIX STAFF'S OWN STIPULATION ACTUALLY STATES THERE SHOULD BE A MINIMUM OF TWO INCHES IN DEPTH BETWEEN THE FRONT FACE OF THE WINDOW TRIM AND THE FRONT FACE OF THE TOP WINDOW SASH.
THIS MUST BE ACCOMPLISHED BY RECESSING THE WINDOW SUFFICIENTLY WITHIN THE OPENING OR WITH THE INSTALLATION OF ADDITIONAL WINDOW TRIM TO ADD THICKNESS SO THAT WE'RE LITERALLY DOING THAT, BUT NOW THEY'RE TELLING US THEY DON'T LIKE IT.
WELL, NOW WITH THE TWO BY SIXES, I GET IT.
ONE THING WE DID IN THE FIELD ON THE CROCKETT HOMES WAS WE DID DOUBLE ONE BY SIXES.
WOULD THAT BE A LITTLE BIT MORE PALATABLE, I GUESS? UM, THERE, THE MR. CHAIR, I, I, UM, I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW.
YOU KNOW, I HAVEN'T BEEN ON THIS COMMISSION FOR LONG, SO I I DON'T KNOW WHEN, WHEN AN EMOTION'S APPROPRIATE, BUT I MEAN, I WOULD, UH, WONDER IF, IF, IF, IF I MIGHT BE ABLE TO MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE.
UM, NOW, UM, I THINK THAT THAT THE, UM, UH, THE PRESENTATION THAT'S GIVEN TO US IS, UH, REASONABLE.
I THINK THAT THERE'S GONNA BE A LOT OF WAYS TO LOOK AT DOUBLING UP A TWO BY, UH, YOU KNOW, A A A ONE BY SIX OR A A TWO BY SIX.
I MEAN, WE COULD EVEN GET INTO WHETHER IT SHOULD BE A CHAMFORD EDGE OR A A SQUARED EDGE.
UH, I THINK THAT THEY'VE MET THOSE REQUIREMENTS.
UH, AND AND SURELY THERE'S GOTTA BE A PLACE FOR, FOR AN ARCHITECTURAL VINYL WINDOW, IF NOT IN NEW CONSTRUCTION, THEN WHERE, THEN WHERE? AND, AND I THINK THAT THAT, UM, IN TERMS OF THE COLOR, I MEAN, I MEAN, YOU KNOW WHY WHITE IS APPROPRIATE FOR SO MANY DIFFERENT REASONS, BUT IT'S CLEARLY NOT A HISTORIC STRUCTURE.
IT'S CLEARLY STRADDLING A HISTORIC CHARACTER, BUT THERE ARE ELEMENTS OF IT THAT MAKE IT A 2000 AND AND, AND 20, UH, UH, URBAN STATEMENT IN, IN TERMS OF WHAT PEOPLE ARE DOING WITH NEW CONSTRUCTION.
IT, IT, IT WELL BALANCED, UM, AND,
[03:00:01]
AND A PROBABLY A, A A A GOOD PRODUCT BECAUSE, BECAUSE IF IT'S NOT GONNA BE THEN, THEN THERE SHOULD BE SOME, SOME ORDINANCE THAT SAYS THAT, THAT VINYL WINDOWS ARE NOT, UH, ALLOWED, WHICH THERE'S NOT.UM, SO I, I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO, TO, TO, TO, UM, APPROVE AS PRESENTED MOTION FOR APPROVAL.
DO I HAVE A SECOND? I, I WOULD LIKE FOR STAFF TO FINISH THEIR THOUGHT, UM, JUST REAL BRIEFLY, IF POSSIBLE.
UM, I DON'T WANNA GET INTO AN ARGUMENT WITH THE APPLICANT.
THAT'S NOT REALLY WHY WE'RE HERE.
UM, BUT I WILL SAY IN GENERAL, UM, THE REASON THAT WE ARE CONSISTENT WITH THIS RECOMMENDATION IS WE FIND IT IS THE, THE BEST AND, UM, HIGHEST QUALITY PRODUCT.
AND ULTIMATELY WE BELIEVE THAT THE QUALITY OF NEW CONSTRUCTION SHOULD MATCH THE QUALITY OF WHAT'S EXISTING IN OUR HISTORIC DISTRICTS.
AND, AND, AND I, AND I DON'T DISAGREE WITH THAT, BUT THE POINT THAT HE MAKES ABOUT THE PRICE POINT AND GENTRIFICATION IS VERY, I IMPORTANT DIALOGUE IN TERMS OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING, PARTICULARLY WITH RESPECT TO THE FACT THAT THE POOREST NEIGHBORHOODS HAVE THE HIGHEST LEVEL OF HISTORIC STOCK.
SO THEY'RE, THEY'RE, THEY'RE BALANCING SOMETHING AND THEY'RE CLEARLY EDUCATED AND AWARE OF WHAT THEY HAVE TO ACHIEVE, THEY'RE ACHIEVING IT.
UM, AND, AND, AND, UM, THE, THE POINT OF, UH, UH, US BEING A MECHANISM AS A COMMISSION TO PRICE PEOPLE OUT OF THEIR NEIGHBORHOODS HAS A DIRECT CORRELATION BETWEEN WHAT WE ACCEPT AND DON'T ACCEPT.
SO WE'VE HAD, WE'VE HAD, UH, SITUATIONS THAT WE'VE LOOKED AT WHERE THERE'S A HISTORIC BUILDING, THERE'S A SPARE, NO EXPENSE, UH, UH, RESTORATION USING TAX CREDITS AND A WOOD WINDOW AND A METAL CLAD WINDOW AND, AND ALL THOSE ARGUMENTS THAT GO TOGETHER TO SAY WHEN SOMETHING IS APPROPRIATE, WHEN SOMETHING'S NOT APPROPRIATE, WHEN WE HAVE A, UH, A NEW CONSTRUCTION, AND I MEAN THAT, THAT CHANGES THE GAME JUST A LITTLE BIT.
AND IF NOT, UH, WITH, WITH THE ELEMENTS LIKE THE WINDOWS OR THE DOORS, UH, PARTICULARLY WITH RESPECT TO SOMEONE USING AS A POINT IN THEIR CRITERIA, UH, PRICE POINT AND GENTRIFICATION.
WELL, WE, WE, WE HAVE TO TAKE SOME THINGS INTO CONSIDERATION AS WELL.
WE HAVE A MOTION FOR APPROVAL.
DO I HAVE A SECOND? HEY, DO I HAVE ANOTHER MOTION? I WOULD STILL LIKE PER STAFF TO FINISH THEIR THOUGHT JUST IN, IN REGARDS TO, I DON'T WANNA START AN ARGUMENT WITH FELIX.
NO, I THINK IT WAS THE BLOCKING RIGHT OR THE, EXACTLY.
WE WERE TALKING ABOUT THE TRIM AND WE WERE TRYING TO GO THROUGH THE, THE DEPTH QUESTION AND UM, I THINK WE HAD YOU, YOU'D ADDRESSED, UM, THE, THE MATERIAL QUESTION.
UM, SO I THINK THAT'S THE ONLY, YEAH, ESSENTIALLY, UM, AS THE APPLICANT NOTED, UM, THE HARDY PRODUCT THAT'S GONNA BE USED AS IS ARTISAN, WHICH IS SOMETHING THAT STAFF RECOMMENDS APPLICANT'S SHOES.
IT PROVIDES A THICKER PROFILE.
UM, THE, THE METHOD THAT THE APPLICANT'S USING THE FRAME ALONG WITH THAT HARDY ARTISAN, UM, IS GONNA PROVIDE A SUBSTANTIAL INSET.
AND AS WE CAN SEE IN THE APPLICANT'S SECTION, THERE'S FOUR AND A HALF INCHES APPROXIMATELY FROM THE FRONT FACE OF THE TWO BY SIX.
UM, I THINK ALL WE'RE SAYING IS THE TWO BY SIX UM, MAY PRESENT A SIDE PROFILE THAT'S A BIT THICKER THAN NORMAL.
UM, AND IT APPEARS THAT YOU MAY HAVE A LITTLE EXTRA SPACE TO WORK WITH.
SO, UM, ONE BY SIX MAY BE A LITTLE MORE APPROPRIATE OR, OR DOUBLE ONE BY SIX, FOR EXAMPLE.
JUST, JUST MAYBE NOT THE TWO BY SIX.
AND APPEAR THAT YOU NEED TO DOUBLE IT.
IT LOOKS LIKE YOU'RE ACHIEVING YOUR DIMENSION BECAUSE OF THE EXTRA THICKNESS OF THE CLADDING.
IT ACTUALLY, ARTISAN MANUFACTURER INSTRUCTIONS RECOMMEND YOU USE TWO BY TRIM AROUND OUR OPENINGS BECAUSE OF HOW MUCH THICKER THAT MATERIAL IS.
UM, I THINK ONE THING THAT, UM, IS VERY DIFFERENT IN NEW CONSTRUCTION TO HISTORIC PROPERTIES IS WALL THICKNESS, RIGHT? SO IF YOU LOOK AT THE WALL THICKNESS AND PROFILE OF A HISTORIC STRUCTURE, YOU HAVE YOUR TRUE TWO BY FOUR STUDS, NOT THREE AND A HALFS, AND THEN YOU HAVE ONE INCH, UH, SHIPLAP ON BOTH SIDES, FOLLOWED BY SIDING AND DRYWALL.
SO YOU GOTTA, YOU HAVE A MUCH THICKER WALL THICKNESS OR PROFILE THAN WHAT YOU DO IN A STANDARD OR TYPICAL NEW CONSTRUCTION SETTING.
SO WE'RE TRYING TO MITIGATE THAT AND ACHIEVE THAT LITERALLY WITH THE RECOMMENDATIONS FROM STAFF.
NOW, IF THEY DON'T WANT ADDITIONAL TRIM TO BE TWO BY SIX, WE CAN USE DOUBLE ONE BY SIX WHERE NEEDED.
AND I, I WOULD SAY THAT'S USUALLY PER OUR DETAILS, IT'S ONLY GONNA BE NEEDED AT THE ARTISAN SIGHTING BECAUSE THE ARTISAN SIGHTING IS MUCH THICKER WHERE WE'RE DOING THE, UH, HARDY BOARD AND BATTEN, WE SHOULD BE ABLE TO GET AWAY WITH ONLY A SINGLE ONE BY SIX AND STILL GET OUR DEPTH
[03:05:01]
AND OR ACTUALLY WHERE THE BOARD AND BATTEN'S AT, WE DID DOUBLE IT UP, UM, TO GET THE TWO INCHES.SO THAT THE LOWER PICTURE SHOWS THE, THE DOUBLED ONE BY SIX.
UM, BUT AGAIN, IS THAT, IS THE DOUBLE ONE BY SIX A LITTLE BIT BETTER PERCEIVED THAN A ONE SINGLE TWO, TWO BY SIX PIECE OF TRIM? I'M NOT READY TO MAKE AN EXEMPTION ON THESE GUIDELINES.
THIS IS AN EXEMPTION YOU'VE APPROVED TO BEFORE WITH ALL DUE RESPECT IN THIS CASE.
SO I'M GONNA MOVE FOR APPROVAL WITH STAFF STIPULATIONS MOTION.
[B-25 19-7396 Address/Description: 105 HERMINE BLVD HDRC Case No.: 2019-530 Historic District Name: Olmos Park Terrace Applicant: Norma Rogers Request: Construction of an ADA Ramp City Council Dist.: 1]
ITEM B 25 H T R C CASE NUMBER 2019 DASH FIVE 30 ADDRESS, 1 0 5 HER MINE BOULEVARD.THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO ONE INSTALL COMPOSITE DECKING OVER THE EXISTING CONCRETE PORCH AND STAIRCASE AND INSTALL A TEMPORARY AND REMOVABLE A D A RAMP WITH RAILINGS.
ITEM ONE STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THE COMPOSITE DECKING INSTALLATION OVER THE CONCRETE PORCH AND STAIRS BASED ON FINDING B STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT THE EXISTING CONCRETE PORCH BE REPAIRED TO ADDRESS THE SETTLING ISSUES IN LIEU THE INSTALLATION OF COMPOSITE DECKING TO CONCEAL DETERIORATION.
ITEM TWO STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF THE A A D A RAMP AND RAILING INSTALLATION BASED ON FINDING C.
SO THE ONLY ITEM WE'LL BE DISCUSSING TODAY IS THE COMPOSITE DECKING OVER THE FORGE.
THANK YOU FOR GIVING ME THE OPPORTUNITY TO PRESENT HOW I WOULD LIKE TO IMPROVE MY PORCH WITH, UH, A D A TEMPORARY, A D A RAMP.
FIRST OF ALL, LET ME STATE THE PROPOSED, PROPOSED REVISIONS TO MY PORCH BECAUSE I HAD AN ILLNESS WHICH NOW REQUIRES ME TO USE STEPS WITH RAILS AND A TEMPORARY RAMP.
ONCE I'M ABLE TO USE ONLY THE RAMPS PROVIDED, I WILL HAVE THE RAMP, THE RAILS PROVIDED, I WILL HAVE THE RAMP REMOVED.
THIS NEED GAVE ME A CHANCE TO REDO MY PORCH, AS YOU CAN SEE FROM ITEM NUMBER ONE, MY PORCH NEEDS TO BE REFINISHED, PLEASE.
UH, ITEM NUMBER ONE IS THE NEXT, SECOND ONE.
I, THAT'S, THAT'S A PICTURE OF MY FRONT PORCH.
AND AS YOU CAN SEE, THE CEMENT IS CRACKED AND THIS COMES FROM, UH, FROM, UM, THE HOUSE SHIFTING AND, UH, HAVING TO HAVE, UH, IT, UH, LEVELED.
THIS IS SOMETHING THAT MANY OF US EXPERIENCE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD ALMOST PARKED TERRACE.
I GOT QUOTES ABOUT REDOING THE CEMENT ON THE PORCH, WHICH WERE IN THE 10 THOUSANDS OF WHICH PEOPLE COULD NOT REC GUARANTEE OR RECOMMEND THAT I DO THAT BECAUSE THE PORCH WOULD ONLY CRACK AGAIN, WHICH IS THE CEMENT WOULD ONLY CRACK AGAIN, THE RECOMMENDED REVISION OF MY PORCH IS SHOWN IN ITEM NUMBER TWO.
CAN YOU SHOW THE GRAPH? WHICH IS THAT ONE? THAT WOULD BE, AND IT WOULD BE WITH COMPOSITE.
I WANT TO TELL YOU THAT I WANT TO LET THE PANEL KNOW THAT THOUGH I LIVE IN A HISTORIC DISTRICT, MY HOUSE IS A NON-CONTRIBUTORY STRUCTURE BECAUSE I'M NOT IN A THURMAN ROCK HOUSE, THOUGH I LIVE IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.
AS A MATTER OF FACT, I WAS ONE OF THE PEOPLE WHO PROMOTED OUR NEIGHBORHOOD TO BECOME A HISTORIC DISTRICT.
THAT IS THE TEMPORARY RAMP THAT I HAVE RIGHT NOW.
THE NEXT SLIDE, WHICH IS THE GRAY.
THE GRAY, WHICH IS THIS, THAT IS THE COLOR OF THE COMPOSITE GRAN OF THE COMPOSITE STRUCTURE THAT WE BUILT.
I WANT THE PANEL TO KNOW THAT OTHERS IN MY N NEIGHBORHOOD HAVE DONE THIS TYPE OF REVISION ON THEIR PORCHES.
THEY NEVER ASKED FOR PERMISSION TO DO A COMPOSITE ON THEIR PORCH.
I DID REPORT IT, BUT BY THE TIME IF ANYBODY CAME, THEY HAD ALREADY DONE THE REVISION.
[03:10:01]
THOSE, UH, ARE, THAT IS TWO HOU, TWO BLOCKS FROM MY HOUSE.THEY HAVE DONE THEIR WHOLE PORCH AND COMPOSITE NEXT.
THAT HAS ALSO BEEN DONE IN COMPOSITE.
NEXT THAT HAS BEEN DONE IN COMPOSITE.
AND THOSE ARE HOUSES THAT ARE IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD THAT DON'T LOOK UP TO PAR.
I'M TRYING TO IMPROVE THE QUALITY OF MY HOUSE.
I'M TRYING TO NOT SPEND TENS, THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS, WHICH WOULD JUST BREAK THE CONCRETE ANYWAY, BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT I'VE BEEN TOLD.
SO I WOULD LIKE, I WOULD SEEK APPROVAL OF ME BUILDING THIS PORCH, WHICH HAS ALREADY BEEN DONE IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD BY MANY PEOPLE.
AND I ASK FOR THE COMMISSION TO PLEASE APPROVE THIS.
CAN OUR LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT, UH, HE HAS A GOOD, UM, REASON FOR WHY WE DON'T ALLOW FOR COMPOSITE.
UH, TYPICALLY COMPOSITE MATERIAL IS NOT HISTORIC AND IT ALSO CREATES RETENTION OF WATER IN BETWEEN THE CONCRETE AND THE, BECAUSE IT REALLY IS A, IT'S, IT, IT COULD, DEPENDING ON BASE IF THERE'S AIRSPACE IN BETWEEN THE CONCRETE AND THE, AND THE
WELL, I'VE TALKED TO NEIGHBORS THAT HAVE THIS AND THEY DON'T HAVE THAT PROBLEM.
AND SO, WELL YOU ALREADY HAVE THE CONCRETE.
I'M NOT SURE IF THAT'S THE SAME CASE AS YOUR NEIGHBOR'S.
UM, I DO UNDERSTAND, UH, THE APPLICANT'S CONCERN AND THE NEED FOR A RAILING AND, UM, AND THE RAMP AND THE PORCH.
SO WHAT YOU'RE TELLING ME IS THAT IN ORDER TO IMPROVE MY PORCH, I NEED TO SPEND TENS OF THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS, WHICH TWO YEARS DOWN FROM NOW IT'LL BE CRACKED AGAIN AND I'LL HAVE TO REDO THE SITUATION AGAIN.
I DON'T THINK THE COMPOSITE'S GONNA HELP YOU WITH THAT EITHER.
I THINK IT'S ONLY GONNA GET WORSE.
WELL, YOU DON'T KNOW THAT BECAUSE OTHER PEOPLE IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD HAVE IT AND NOT ONE OF THEM HAVE COMPLAINED ABOUT IT.
HAVE ALL THOSE HOUSES THAT I SHOWED YOU HAVE HAD COMPOSITE AND NONE OF THEM HAVE COMPLAINED ABOUT THAT ISSUE.
DO YOU HAPPEN TO HAVE ANY OF THE REPORTS FROM THE CONCRETE GUYS THAT YOU'VE TALKED TO ANY OF THE I DO NOT BECAUSE I DID THAT BEFORE I GOT SICK AND I WAS SICK IN THE HOSPITAL FOR OVER A MONTH, AND I DO NOT, I'M INCLINED TO, UM, SUPPORT THE APPLICATION AS PROPOSED.
NOT MOSTLY FOR SOME OF THE REASONS THAT YOU'VE PRESENTED, UH, BUT TO, TO HELP DEAL WITH THE ISSUE OF ACCESSIBILITY, PARTICULARLY ON THIS FRONT PORCH AS IT RELATES TO THE RAMP AND A STAIR, UH, THAT CONNECTS TO A PORCH IN A MORE LEVEL WAY WITH THE FRONT DOOR.
UM, REPAIRING THE CONCRETE IN KIND IN ITS CURRENT PLACE WOULD CREATE AN ISSUE ON THE FRONT PORCH WITH THIS DOOR AND WOULDN'T SOLVE THE PRINCIPAL ISSUE.
IT IT ALSO LEAVES YOU A STEP IN FRONT OF THE DOOR, WHICH MAKES THE RAMP SOMEWHAT MOOT.
UM, AN APPLICATION OF A DECK SO LONG AS IT'S DONE SO IN A WAY THAT IS NON-DESTRUCTIVE TO THE CONCRETE UNDERNEATH IS EXCEEDINGLY REVERSIBLE.
WHETHER OR NOT THE INSTALLATION IS TEMPORARY OR PERMANENTLY EASILY BE REVERSED WITH A STIPULATION THAT REQUIRED THE APPLICANT NOT DESTROY THE CONCRETE PORCH UNDERNEATH IT OR THE STAIRS AND PROCESS.
AND WE SUBMITTED THAT TO THE HISTORIC DISTRICT STAFF SAYING THAT THE EXISTING CONCRETE PAD WILL NOT BE DESTROYED.
AND SO JUST TO CONFIRM, I MIGHT'VE MISSED THIS.
THE PROPOSAL AS PROPOSED IS TO BRING IT UP TO THE LEVEL OF THE DOOR PROBABLY WITHIN A HALF AN INCH AND THEN SLOPE DOWN SLIGHTLY TOWARDS THE FRONT AND THEN BE BUILT UP ENTIRELY OVER THE CONCRETE.
AND THEN YOU'RE STEPPING DOWN ON STEPS, OR WOULD YOU BE BUILDING A RAMP? I WILL BE, I WILL HAVE THE TEMPORARY RAMP UNTIL I'M ABLE TO GO DOWN THE STEPS, WHICH I WILL KNOW WHEN PULMONARY REHAB TELLS ME.
BUT MA'AM, JUST CLARIFY BECAUSE I THINK COMMISSIONER FISH HAD A POINT WITH THAT STEP ON THE DOOR.
I DON'T THINK SHE'S TRYING TO ELIMINATE THAT.
THE COMPOSITE WON'T ELIMINATE THAT LAST STEP BEFORE THE
[03:15:01]
DOOR.IT SAYS IT'S FLUSH WITH THE CONCRETE.
NO, IT'S, IT'LL BE FLUSHED WITH THE DOOR, WHICH, WHICH WILL, WILL REQUIRE NEW STAIRS GOING OVER THE TOP OF THE EXISTING STAIRS.
THE THREE CONS CONTINUOUS, THE, THE THREE CONTIGUOUS STEPS CONNECTING TO THE SIDEWALK, UH, IT WOULD, THE NEW STAIRS WOULD GO OVER THE TOP TO ACCOUNT FOR THE ADDITIONAL HEIGHT AND POSITION ON THE TOP OF THOSE STAIRS WOULD BE A TEMPORARY ALUMINUM RAMP, CORRECT? CORRECT.
I, I WOULD MOVE TO APPROVE, UH, WITH THE ADDED STIPULATION THAT ANY WORK ON, ON THE DECK BE, UH, DONE.
SO IN A WAY THAT'S NOT, NOT DESTRUCTIVE TO THE CONCRETE PORCH OR THE STEPS, CONCRETE PORCH OR THE STEPS, WHICH IS WHAT WE PROPOSED.
I'LL SECOND AND I WOULD JUST A QUICK COMMENT.
I WOULD, UH, THERE WAYS TO MAKE THIS DESIGN, UH, FIT YOUR TEMPORARY RAMP IN THE BEST WAY POSSIBLE SO THAT YOU CAN MAKE SURE THAT YOUR CONTRACTOR IS AWARE OF THAT AND THAT IT IT GETS BUILT INTO IT.
YEAH, HE IS, HE'S COME TO SEE THAT.
DO YOU HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND? ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE.
THANK YOU FOR A MUCH LONG EVENING.
[B-26 19-7440 Address/Description: 1818 SAN PEDRO AVE HDRC Case No.: 2019-524 Historic District Name: Monte Vista Applicant: Sonia Lopez Maximilion Ramirez Request: Door replacement City Council Dist.: 1]
ITEM B 26 H D R C, CASE NUMBER 2019 DASH 5 24 ADDRESS, 1818 SAN PEDRO AVENUE.THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR APPROVAL TO REPLACE TWO EXISTING VICTORIAN STYLE WOOD DOORS ON THE FRONT FACADE OF THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE WITH NEW STEEL DOORS.
STAFF DOES NOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL.
STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL THAT THE DOORS BE REPAIRED AND RETAINED IF A DOOR IS DEEMED IRREPARABLE BY THE H D R C STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT THE APPLICANT INSTALLS TWO NEW F WOOD DOORS IN A SIMILAR STYLE THAT ARE COMPATIBLE WITH A HISTORIC STRUCTURE AS SPECIFICATION IS REQUIRED TO BE SUBMITTED PRIOR TO THE ISSUANCE OF A C O A CASE COMMENT, THE APPLICANT ORIGINALLY SUBMITTED A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS REQUEST FOR THE REPLACEMENT OF ONE OF THE TWO DOORS.
UPON REVIEW OF THE DOCUMENTATION, STAFF DISCOVERED THAT A SECOND ONE FRONT DOOR HAD ALREADY BEEN REPLACED WITH A NEW STEEL DOOR.
GOOD EVENING, UH, COMMISSIONERS.
UH, I AM WITH GUARDIAN HOUSE, WHICH IS A 5 0 1 C THREE NONPROFIT AGENCY, UH, THAT HAS SERVED THE SAN ANTONIO COMMUNITY FOR 22 YEARS.
UH, WE PROVIDE SERVICES TO CHILDREN WHO ARE AT HIGH RISK OF, UH, FAMILY VIOLENCE AND CHILD ABUSE.
HE IS ACTUALLY AN EAGLE SCOUT CANDIDATE.
AND, UH, MAX ACTUALLY CAME TO US WITH A PROPOSED PROJECT THAT INCLUDED, UH, AMONG OTHER THINGS, RENOVATION OF A REMOVAL AND REPLACEMENT OF, UH, DOOR NUMBER TWO, WHICH IS WHAT'S CITED IN THE HANDOUT THAT I, THAT WE DISTRIBUTED, UM, UPON OUR APPLICATION TO H D R C, TO, UM, PROPOSE REPLACEMENT OF DOOR NUMBER TWO.
WE DISCOVERED THAT, UH, WE DOOR NUMBER ONE WAS ACTUALLY, UH, REPLACED, UH, WITHOUT FOLLOWING THE PROCESS THAT WE ARE ACTUALLY UNFAMILIAR WITH.
SO, UM, I'LL HAVE TO SAY THIS IS A LEARNING EXPERIENCE FOR ME AND IT'S A LEARNING EXPERIENCE FOR MAX AS WELL.
UH, SO PLEASE FORGIVE OUR, UM, OUR IGNORANCE AS WE'RE STILL LEARNING.
UM, I WILL SAY THAT, UM, OUR, ANY TYPE OF CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PROJECT FOR OUR NON-PROFIT AGENCY CREATES A LITTLE BIT OF A HARD, UH, FINANCIAL HARDSHIP IF WE DO NOT HAVE A A FUNDER FOR IT.
UH, IT FALLS OUTSIDE OF OUR GENERAL OPERATING SCOPE.
AND SO ANY IMPROVEMENTS, UH, OR ANY CAPITAL REPAIRS THAT WE NEED TO MAKE TO THE HOUSE ARE ACTUALLY EITHER, UM, CONTINGENT ON RECEIVING FUNDING FROM, UM, FROM A FUNDER OR, UM, GETTING, UM, TO PULLING THOSE FUNDS FROM GENERAL OPERATING FUNDS, WHICH ARE USUALLY RESERVED FOR PROVIDING DIRECT SERVICES TO OUR CLIENTS.
UM, WE ACTUALLY, IN APRIL OF, UM, 2018, DOOR NUMBER ONE WAS ACTUALLY, UH, VANDALIZED AND THE DOOR WAS KICKED IN.
WE DIDN'T HAVE THE FUNDS TO REPAIR THE DOOR, AND SO WE HAD TO JUST PATCH IT UP INTERNALLY, UH, TO, TO TRY TO REDUCE THE RISK, UH, ASSOCIATED WITH HAVING A BROKEN DOOR, UM, UNTIL WE WERE ABLE TO RECEIVE FUNDING.
UH, WE RECEIVED FUNDING ACTUALLY IN DECEMBER, I BELIEVE, OF LAST YEAR.
AND THEN WE WERE JUST, UH, TRYING TO FIND THE MOST COST EFFECTIVE WAY TO REPLACE THE DOOR.
SO THE RESULT IS THE PHOTO IN FRONT OF YOU, WHICH IS DOOR NUMBER ONE.
[03:20:01]
THAT DOOR WE WERE ABLE TO PURCHASE, UM, WE WE'RE TRYING TO BE AS COST EFFECTIVE AS POSSIBLE, SO THAT WAS A DOOR THAT WE, THAT OUR, UM, ONE OF OUR VOLUNTEERS WHO'S ALSO A BEXAR COUNTY, UH, DEPUTY REPLACED FOR US.HE DONATED THE LABOR, UM, AND WE WERE ABLE TO FIND A COST EFFECTIVE WAY TO REPLACE THAT DOOR.
UM, THAT DOOR HAS ACTUALLY SINCE BEEN, UM, IT, IT'S, IT'S BEEN DISPOSED OF.
UM, THE, THE WOOD, IT'S A FIBERGLASS DOOR, ACTUALLY NOT A STEEL DOOR.
UH, AND THE WOOD WAS, WAS ROTTING ESSENTIALLY, WHICH IS WHY IT WAS SO EASY TO KICK IN PROBABLY.
BUT, UM, THE DEPUTY HAS ACTUALLY CREATED, HE PROVIDED A STATEMENT, WHICH IS INCLUDED, UM, IN THE, YOUR PACKET.
UM, JUST REALLY KIND OF STIPULATING THE DETAILS OF THAT EVENT AND WHAT LED TO REPLACEMENT OF THAT DOOR.
UM, SINCE THEN, DOOR NUMBER TWO, WE'LL BOTH ACTUALLY HAVE ALLOWED US THE OPPORTUNITY TO RESEARCH, UM, DOORS THAT WOULD, UM, FOLLOW THE GUIDELINES THAT STAFF HAS RECOMMENDED.
AND REALLY, RIGHT NOW, WE'RE AT THE POINT TO WHERE WE, IT IS NOT IT'S COST PROHIBITIVE FOR US TO BE ABLE TO FULLY RESTORE THAT DOOR.
WE REACHED OUT TO A, UH, PROFESSIONAL, UM, A CARPENTER WHO ADVISED US THAT HE WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO, UH, RESTORE THE DOOR AS IT EXISTS BECAUSE IT'S JUST TOO ROTTED THROUGH.
I'VE INCLUDED, UH, PICTURES ON THE LAST PAGE OF, UH, THAT'S THE CLOSEUP OF DOOR NUMBER TWO, AND UH, IT JUST SHOWS JUST HOW DETERIORATED THE, THE CONDITION OF THE DOOR IS.
SO WE ARE ACTUALLY PHYSIC NOT PHYSICALLY ABLE TO RESTORE THAT DOOR AS IT EXISTS WITHOUT SPENDING A LOT OF FUNDS ON IT.
I DON'T EVEN KNOW IF IT'S POSSIBLE OR CARPENTER TOLD US THAT IT WASN'T.
UH, AN ALTERNATIVE IS TO REPLACE IT WITH A WOODEN DOOR, BUT ALL OF OUR RESEARCH THAT WE'VE DONE REALLY JUST KIND OF HIKES UP THE PRICES OF THE DOORS TO, UM, I THINK THE LOWEST WAS, UH, $500.
THAT WAS THE LOW END, AND THE HIGH END ONE WAS ABOUT $2,000.
UM, AND THAT'S THE, EVEN THE LOW END IS DOUBLE THE PRICE OF WHAT WE WERE ABLE TO, UH, RESTORE OUR ORIGINAL DOOR WIDTH OR REPLACE OUR ORIGINAL DOOR WIDTH.
WE, UM, WE ARE PROPOSING, UM, KEEPING THE DOOR DOOR NUMBER ONE IS WHAT EXISTS, REPLACING DOOR NUMBER TWO TO MATCH DOOR NUMBER ONE, AND THEN ALSO POSSIBLY PROVIDING SOME TYPE OF, UM, MODIFICATIONS TO BOTH DOORS SO THAT THEY ARE THE SAME COLOR AS THE ORIGINAL DOOR.
AND THEN ALSO POSSIBLY PROVIDING SOME TYPE OF LIKE SCROLLING, UH, WOODWORK DETAIL TO BOTH DOORS SO THAT THEY REPRESENT OR AT LEAST, UM, MAINTAIN LIKE THE AESTHETIC APPEAL THAT WE, UH, ORIGINALLY HAD.
DOES ANYBODY, UH, AT THIS FACILITY DURING THE NIGHT OR IS IT A DAY LIKE PEOPLE LIVE THERE? NO, MA'AM.
WE ARE, UM, WE, WE PROVIDE, UM, SERVICES TO CHILDREN WHO ARE IN HIGH CONFLICT DIVORCE.
AND SO BECAUSE OF THAT, WE PROVIDE SERVICES TO THEM WHEN THEY'RE AVAILABLE.
SO THAT'S USUALLY AFTER SCHOOL IN THE EVENINGS AND ON WEEKENDS.
SO FOR THAT REASON, WE'RE ESSENTIALLY OPEN FROM EIGHT O'CLOCK IN THE MORNING UNTIL EIGHT O'CLOCK IN THE EVENING, MONDAY THROUGH SUNDAY.
I FEEL LIKE THE APPLICANT'S COMPELLED A GOOD CASE OF BOTH.
UM, I THINK THERE'S AN ECONOMIC ASPECT THAT WAS VERY IMPORTANT TO THIS CASE.
THIS, THE RED DOOR IS DOOR NUMBER TWO, IF YOU WANNA CALL IT.
UM, I MEAN IT MAY BE, BUT NOT, NOT I WOULDN'T CONSIDER REPAIRABLE.
UM, WE CAN DISCUSS THAT, BUT I WOULD ACTUALLY, UM, APPROVE, UH, THE INSTALLATION AS PRESENTED TODAY OR AS THE APPLICANT WOULD PRESENT TODAY.
WELL, I, I'VE GOT A QUICK COMMENT.
UM, I HAVE THREE EAGLE SCALP BROTHERS.
UM, SO I'M COMPELLED, JUST COMPELLED TO LIKE HELP IN THIS.
UM, AND I THINK THAT IT'S IMPORTANT THAT IF THE COMMISSION FINDS THAT WE, UM, NEED TO RESTORE THESE DOORS, THAT MY, IF I CAN DO THIS, I DON'T KNOW IF I CAN DO THIS, BUT MY COMPANY WOULD PAY FOR IT IF THAT'S POSSIBLE.
CAN I DO THAT AND RECUSE MYSELF? A CUSAL WOULDN'T HURT, BUT DO YOU REALLY FIND THIS DOOR REPAIRABLE OR WOULD YOU ACTUALLY SPONSOR A NEW WOOD DOOR THAT'S UP, THAT'S UP TO YOU GUYS, BUT WOULD YOU SPONSOR A NEW DOOR DOOR? HMM.
I, I JUST IN THE, IN THE INTEREST OF, UH, FINDING A SOLUTION THAT, THAT THAT CAN BE, UM, THAT, THAT ANYONE WHO, WHO, WHO WOULD LIKE TO, TO VOLUNTEER TO, TO UH,
[03:25:01]
UM, SPONSOR NEW DOORS THAT MAYBE WE CAN PASS A MOTION THAT ENABLES THEM TO PUT THE DOORS, UH, PUT A DOOR THAT REPLACES IT, PROVIDED THAT THEY RETAIN THE EXISTING DOOR FOR MATCHING SO THAT THERE'S TIME TO REPLICATE IT FOR ANYONE THAT WOULD WANNA REMIND THAT ACTUALLY THAT WAS A MOTION WHAT I DID.SO I DON'T KNOW IF TO CONTINUE THE DISCUSSION.
WELL, I DON'T THINK YOU SAID THAT IT WAS A MOTION.
I THINK YOU JUST SAID THAT YOU WOULD APPROVE IT, BUT, BUT THE, MY MOTION, MY POINT BEING THAT SOMEONE KICKED IN THE OTHER DOOR.
SO I IMAGINE THAT THIS OTHER DOOR IS A SIGNIFICANT SITUATION.
MAYBE THERE ARE KIDS THAT, THAT, THAT ARE BEING, YOU KNOW, THAT ARE UNDER UH, CIRCUMSTANCES THAT THAT WARRANT THEM GETTING THE REPLACEMENT DOOR AS QUICKLY AS POSSIBLE.
AND THAT DOOR CAN BE REMOVED, UH, WITH A STIPULATION THAT IT'S THAT, THAT THEY'RE TO BE REPLACED AT, AT A TIME THAT THAT IS, IT'S FEASIBLE, RIGHT? SO ANYBODY IS POSSIBLE.
MY MOTION IS FOR THE APPLICANT TO PROCEED WITH WHAT SHE PRESENTED TODAY.
SO HERE THE APPLICANT CAN ACTUALLY GO ALL AND DECIDE WHAT DOOR REPLACEMENT.
IF SHE WANTS TO GO WITH A MORE EXPENSIVE DOOR, SHE CAN TALK TO THE OTHER COMMISSIONER.
AND THE, THE ONLY, THE ONLY YOU KNOW PIECE THAT, THAT I WAS HOPING THAT, THAT WE MIGHT BE ABLE TO ENSURE IS THAT THE DOOR BE REMOVED AND THAT IT'S KEPT, THAT, THAT IT DOESN'T GET THROWN AWAY BECAUSE SOMEBODY COULD ACCIDENTALLY THROW IT AWAY.
RIGHT? WHAT'S THIS OLD DOOR DOING HERE? THAT WAY IF YOU REPLACE IT, THAT'S A STIPULATION.
ISN'T A STIPULATION, BUT NOT A STIPULATION.
I'M SURE THE APPLICANT'S WILLING TO STORE THE DOOR OR THE TILL THE NEW ONE CAN BE INSTALLED AND, UH, POSSIBLY MATCH THE PAINT COLOR STYLE, THE WHOLE THING.
AND I WONDER WE MIGHT BE ABLE TO, UM, TO UM, UM, TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THE COMMISSIONER'S GRACIOUS OFFER TO MAYBE GUIDE US THROUGH MAKING IT AESTHETICALLY, UM, OKAY.
YOU HAVE SOME MEETING MINUTES? ONE MORE ITEM, RIGHT? THAT WAS THE LAST WE, THE, THE OTHER ITEM WAS APPROVED EARLIER.
THE LAST ONE? YEAH, THE OTHER ONE WAS MOVED UP AFTER CONSENT.
AND THEN THE LAST ONE WAS POSTPONED APPROVAL OF SEPTEMBER 8TH.
ACTUALLY, WE ACTUALLY SHOULD SAY THAT.
[B-28 19-7316 Address/Description: 507 CEDAR ST HDRC Case No.: 2019-555 Historic District Name: King William Applicant: Mary Anne Snyder Request: Construction of a front yard fence City Council Dist.: 1]
UM, ITEM B 28, 5 0 7 CEDAR WAS POSTPONED AT THE REQUEST OF THE APPLICANT AND WILL BE HEARD TONIGHT.[Approval of September 18, 2019, HDRC Meeting Minutes]
APPROVAL OF MINUTES.UM, THANK YOU TO OUR LAST APPLICANT FOR, FOR STICKING IT OUT,